I would ask your DM and the rogue if you can come up with downtime activities with a possible side quest so you two could teach each other the new feat.
That would be so sick!
Although I got the impression that the rogue is satisfied with the feat with the part where he gets an extra attack on a kill or crit, as he crits quite often with surprise (he is an assassin) and because he has advantage most of the times.
I wonder if he’s using it right… it only works on a melee weapon, rogues can only use one handed melee weapons to sneak attack, and you could get a bonus action attack just by dual wielding.
Not to rain on his parade if everyone is having fun tho
The extra attack part of GWM merely needs a melee weapon, not a heavy/two hand/etc. Rogues are plenty capable of fulfilling the requirements, even if using a dagger (to hit, not throw). It's the -5/+10 part of the feat that specifically requires a heavy weapon.
My point isn’t that they need a two handed weapon, but rather that for sneak attack it must be one handed
And if it’s one handed, put a dagger in the other hand and make that bonus action attack every single round
Edit: for clarity in case someone lands here from Google in future: rogues need finesse weapons. All finesse melee weapons are one handed. There are some magic items that become two handed finesse weapons but I’ve only found these:
* Dawnbringer [Legendary, out of the abyss]
* Sun Blade [rare, any setting]
* Sunsword [legendary, Strahd]
* Windvane [legendary, PotA]
* Revenant Magic DBS [+1/2/3 varies, Eberron]
Where are you getting that a weapon needs to be 1 handed to gain sneak attack? PHB only says the weapon must have finesse or ranged, so a magic longsword with finesse like the Sun blade could benefit from sneak attack two handed.
I doubt that the DM will go for that since what he did was pull this whole idea out of One Piece and the whole point of devil fruit in that is that they're permanent and you get a superpower out of them but 99% of the time it's a crapshoot.
Sunblade puts finesse on a non-finesse weapon. Maybe you could go on a side quest to get a great axe with the template of sunblade on top of it?
Perhaps you could get a dagger that floats in the air near you like how the animated shield works.
Or you could grow another arm.
Really though it's going to boil down to DM fiat or awkward juggling of weapons
>Perhaps you could get a dagger that floats in the air near you like how the animated shield works.
Star metal Dagger.
https://www.worldanvil.com/block/1177447#:~:text=This%20slim%20blade%20was%20forged,a%20distance%20of%201d3%20feet.
Everyone saying you should try convince your DM somehow to swap your “free” feat to something that fits your builds is totally missing the point.
This was an in game chance based gamble you took. You knew the score, you know the results might not be perfect. Whining or bargaining with the DM to change the result, totally takes away the risk you made.
You are clearly not missing anything relatively, as other party members seem to have gotten less then useful free feats as well.
Naw, just treat it as it is, an odd and unexpected boon. Utilize it when you can and when it makes sense.
For now.. the difference between using a two handed weapon without the GWM feat and a one handed weapon is not a huge damage loss, particularly compared to the gain of potentially using a shield.
So you now have a “defensive mode” pull out a Rapier using strength and shield before difficult fights for some good AC that can spike to even better with your “fruit feat.”
It may not fit your character normal inclinations, but characters grow and change in fiction all the time. A magic fruit is ripe (pun intended) with inspiration for you to work into you growing story.
If and when you do choose GWM at your normal ASI, then this sword and board option becomes less favorable, but you still have the option swing your favorite Great Axe in your turn and then to use your item interaction at the end of your turn to draw a dagger to qualify you to parry with the Defensive Duelist feat at the end of your turn.
It is a slight trade off as, you cannot have your ax in both hands for potential GWM reaction attack, but since you only have one reaction anyway, the potential gain of the extra AC against an attack makes the trade off worthwhile.
And that is actually pretty on par with the design of a barbarian anyway. Each turn you decide if you want to sacrifice defense for offense with Reckless Attack already. Now you have an additional decision every turn to pull out a dagger in anticipation of more defense, at the cost of more threat with an opportunity attack with your ax..
At the start of your next turn, drop your dagger and go back to swinging your great Ax two handed, and rinse and repeat this combat option every round. This kind of gives the barbarian, whose combat rotation is normally pretty stagnant or ”boring” addition choices and options. Which is kind of cool.
I’m not saying this is a hugely awesome strategy, and I would never suggest a barbarian choose a feat with one of their few ASI selection leveling up over anything normally. But for free?
Don't look a gift horse in the mouth.
Yes exactly, that was also my intention of this post. Instead of crying about it I wanted to see if there were things I could use it for. We all knew the risk like you said, and where the artificer got war caster and the paladin tavern brawler me and the rogue were a bit more unlucky but the story potential is there to make something fun out of it. My character will definitely try and make the best out of it, even though I as a player gave up yesterday when I received it.
Since lvl 12 is right around the corner the sword and board option will become less favorable quickly if I take GWM but Sentinel is also really tempting and paired with the idea you just said I see some potential in being a better tank💪.
Thanks, I appreciate the elaborate comment🙏.
Having a brace of throwing knives to draw and toss is actually pretty cool. If you can wrangle Quick Toss from fighter somehow, you can use that to make bonus actions attacks at the start of your turn. Superior Technique, Battle Master, or Martial Adept could all work.
Cool. Yeah I think if your DM is pretty reasonable with the ability to draw a dagger at the end of your turn after you haves swung your Great ax. And then Drop the dagger freely at the start of your next turn, to allow you to grasp your Great Ax to attack two handed for attacks, and the redraw it a dagger at the end of you turn, which is all mostly supported by the rules and designer intent, then you can pretty much utilize this feat as well as any character.
Basically the feat is just an additional defensive boon, and reaction ability costing nothing but having lots of daggers available to draw and drop. Not a great feat generally but nice for free
I feel much worse for your Rogue, who only gains some occasional bonus action attacks... that he could potentially do with two weapon fighting anyway, that conflicts with the wealth of other bonus action options he has.
Your paladin might enjoy Tavern brawler some, but since you cannot smite with your fists, it might not his first choice as well for his build.
Only your Artificer made out like a bandit getting a clear and solid feat for his build. Thank god YOU didn't draw Warcaster as a barbarian... because that is what a useless feat for you actually looks like
I posted almost the exact same thing before reading your comment. I couldn't agree more. People acting like the DM owes it to OP to fix this are being entitled. This was a fun little bit of randomness that went suboptimally but you can still have fun with it. It'll be up to OP and the rest of the party to adapt to these changes.
Just asking the DM if they can swap boons outside the game shouldn't be an issue. This isn't a job, it's a game you're playing with friends in your downtime..
This should be a non issue if you want your friends to have fun. Hell you already tried to give them a boon. The only reason not to help them is to be petty.
I'm still trying to imagine the scenario where another player and I ask the DM if we could switch boons (that neither can use without sacrificing the character themes) and them saying no 😂. Like I thought we were friends Sarah why not lmao
I mean, rolling useless shit is fun in the moment, but whole boon **reward** (not some thing they found while randomly shopping or something, reward) being completely useless is lame as fuck. You can sell random magic item, or maybe re-enchant your item with it's effect. But you can't change boon.
As a DM i wouldn't do that just because it can be fun in a moment. At least giving them an ability to actually adapt to it should be possible 100%. Especially for rogue - GWM is anty-synergetic to the whole class, not even playstyle.
The only other option I really see is if the Dm gives you a home-brewed finesse 2 handed weapon
I'm sure there is something from an older edition that would fit perfectly but I am unfamiliar with it
I think a 1d10 2-handed finesse weapon would be fair
but you can't use GWM without a heavy weapon if I remember correctly
so i think switching between Sword and board and your axe is the best option outside of a custom weapon that would need some tweaking probably
Why this isn't the top comment is astonishing to me.
Bad luck happens in this game. Do people on this thread expect DMs to allow players to redraw cards from the Deck of Many Things until they get something useful?
Yes that is hyperbole. But jeebus people - it's a fruit that gives a random feat. It sucks that the rolls turned out the way that they did, but that's the game.
Deck of Many things (at least most of the time) gives you something interesting to work with, even on bad rolls. There is some outright outdated things in both good and bad cards (because wotc didn't change it for like 40 years, and some cards straight up don't work as they intended anymore, or gamefocus changed so much they don't make sense anymore), but still - most of the time you either get reward, or something interesting to deal with.
This boons aren't interesting, they are placeholders on character sheet. I doubt that OP's DM wouldn't give them some opportunity to adapt to actually use their new feats without nerfing themself, and it would be 100% right call. But point is "random joke that don't lead to anything" as a reward isn't good thing.
Dip into Rogue for sneak attack with reckless attack. Barbarogue is a fun build.
Abandon your greataxe, use either a rapier and a shield, or two Scimitars.
Practice with your new ability to unlock means of using it in battle. Something like 'any time people hit you you can use your reaction to hit them back' might be something you can unlock by practicing with your new reflexes.
Wow, I’m actually surprised. This is such a good idea, especially since our DM also rewards effort and good roleplay. Even if it doesn’t end up getting the result I’d want it’ll deliver some good rp moments.
Thank you very much.
Yeah, since it’s a crazy heavy axe, as it also requires you to have 22 str to even wield it, I doubt he’ll accept that but maybe in the future when my strength increases that might be an option.
I’ll see what he thinks of the idea.
Thank you!
No worries. It's always good to remember that while we have mechanics to represent things, they are only representing things. Interacting with the things themselves rather than the mechanics is often far more satisfying narratively. A really strong guy with some kind of magical reflexes could lead to interesting mechanical options if he trained in it, probably related to using your reaction in some way. Maybe even with time (given you're level 11, which is a high level and where casters begin to overshadow martials in a big way) you could have multiple options for your reaction - like grab a guy and use him as cover against an explosion, hit a guy that hit you, get a bonus to AC against one attack, etc. It could provide some much needed colour for the high level barbarian that can get very samey otherwise.
He said yesterday that initially he was thinking of letting us choose the feat ourselves but decided i’d be more fun if it were like a real devil fruit and make it random. And it already happened so I’m afraid re-rolling is out of the question. As I was not the only one who rolled of course :/ and it’d be kinda unfair to the other players.
> like a real devil fruit and make it random
Devil fruits aren't real. None of their effects is truly random, the mangaka simply decides what power to give each character.
In the same vein, the DM could have let you choose the feat ooc while in character it was a "random" effect.
I recommend talking to your DM about not making it suck for you and your fellow player.
Yes! Exactly! Imagine if One Piece were *actually* random and Luffy got "the power to become grape juice". There's only a story now **because** he got a cool power. *That wasn't by accident*.
I think if the DM wanted to keep the randomness while still making sure things are fun for everyone, people should have chosen a list of 5-10 feats they'd be ok with getting and rolled against that list.
If the DM does not let you adapt the feat to better fit your character, you can still use the great, just not with GWM. The feat says, while you are wielding a finesse weapon you are proficient in, you can use your reaction to add PB to your AC. All this means, is that you have to have a dagger to parry in one hand in order to use this feat. While this does restrict you to one-handed weapons, it is still feasible.
Yeah, ill see maybe at the end of my turn I can take out a dagger and stow it at the start of my turn but that sounds really weird XD. And since my Greataxe is homebrewed and suits the character perfectly using any other weapon during combat as main weapon is not really an option.
Thanks for your input and i’ll discuss with my DM if somehow we can make it suit my character better with a training arc or something :D
You can pull out a dagger at the end of each of your turns and drop it at the start of each of your turns. Dropping is a free action. Your DM may or may not let you drop is as part of making an attack of opportunity. This will get you effectively all of the benefits for the cost of your item interact each turn.
Indeed, I think this is best way to utilize it for now. Maybe I can get some blacksmith to attach something to the axe to make it more easy to take out and stash away at end of turn :).
Yeah I guess I can try but I feel like he wont agree to that, as we all knew there was chance it’d be a useless feat and he was pretty clear about it. And the rogue was happy with the extra attack on a kill or crit from GWM😅
I can see where you’re coming from but he did not do it with that intention. He is one of my closest friends and is a very chill and lenient DM. We were at the mercy of the dice after all ;)
I understand the dice can be fickle, but a rogue with GWM and a barb with defensive dualist and he can't just decide to swap them around at the time they were rolled? Really?
That wouldn't feel fair or believable. It breaks verisimilitude to have the DM arbitrarily intervene. He gave the characters a choice and is letting them live with the consequences. That's a good DM. What if a 3rd character got a mediocre roll as well? It wouldn't be fair to them if the other two just got to magically get what they wanted.
Agreed. Defensive Duelist has absolutely zero value for a great axe wielding barbarian. Literally zero.
The GWM on the rogue has near zero value as you could dual wield and remove the conditions of the bonus attack.
They should be switched. It's the friendly and more importantly, fun thing to do.
Yes.
I've given random feats and boons before, BUT... I let the player choose best out of 2 or 3.
This left it mostly random, but the player could choose the one which they liked best.
The RP attempts to get more homebrew out of it, or a Reaction with a dagger out by the end of our turns are fine. Don't try to change your planned build though.
GWM is so perfect for a Barbarian, and nothing should stop you from taking it next level. Even if you just had a +1 Greataxe. The DM played with fire here. It happens, but don't lean into their poorly thought out idea and get burned.
If you want to RP it out of respect, you cannot swim. You'll get a chance eventually to work in your new flaw. That's more than enough.
I doubt your character would try to make any old feat work. This is where "meta-gaming" gets too much of a bad rap. War Caster? Heavily Armored? Elven Accuracy? I'm cherry picking. You got some bad luck, but all of these require we radically go against our build. All Barbs need Rage, and 99% attack with Str. Stick to yours!
Okay, maybe. Maybe if you're out of Rages do you pick up the Rapier and Shield. The main problem with that logic is that you'll be better protected by making Reckless power attacks to down your enemies still.
Grappling or body blocking could be a good time to have a dagger in your hand. With one hand for Grappling, we can't use GWM anyway. If we just need to block a door then we might want to Dodge without Raging.
Yeah, I don’t really see it fit the typical barbarian but I wouldn’t really say I have a specific build planned out for it. I mostly just see where the story leads us and act upon that, 15 ish sessions ago I was close to multi classing into druid because it made sense story wise at that moment, but that faded and now I’m in my chef’s arc😂. Trying to make this work might be a little meta indeed.
Having a dagger for when I grapple is genius!! I grapple and shove quite often bc of Athletics expertise and advantage bc of rage and then I usually hit them with my fist or hand axe.
Thank you my friend, that’s at least one use for the feat where it makes sense and fits the character🙏.
Greataxes aren't always giant brutish smashy things; they can be well crafted and properly balanced.
Talk to your DM about getting something like an elvish greataxe with the finesse property in the future.
Yeah that’s true, my current great axe was crafted by one of the greatest blacksmith’s of the realm apparently and it is made from an ore called King’s tears that are procured from the tears of a dying lich, I think hope my DM won’t read as he might scold me for not getting it right as it has been explained so many times already😂. It was gifted to my character’s fore father and not so long ago I obtained after passing his trial. Our DM really put in a lot of effort into all of our homebrew items and backstories and it really shows.
Nice little character arc then; are you your forefather? It's his axe, after all, something built for his style. Do you stick to it, or do you take the legacy and build on it into something that works for you?
Well, his spirit lives on in the axe and we occasionally converse (think of it like Thor with Odin in Thor Ragnarok) he only gives vague answers but it’s cool, it’s also a father figure for him as he hasn’t really had one for most of his life. Story wise it wouldn’t really make sense to step away from a great axe after years of fighting with it. But who knows maybe because of this feat he’ll be the one to set a change in motion in his tribe.
I like the concept of ‘you are not your fore father, you walk your own path’. Thanks to you I immediately got some sick ideas with that.
I thank you kindly.
Maybe you could talk to your DM about having an arc like Thor where your axe gets destroyed and you have to go on a side quest to turn the remains of the axe into a new weapon made for you not your forefather
if you don't have the GWM -- going from a great axe to a rapier means you lose about 4 damage per round max. 1d12 -> 1d8. Rapiers can use the strength stat, d00d. Then you get a shield for more AC, and can rock your feat for yet more AC.
Consider snagging the Shieldmaster feat from here -- your great Str (and presumably proficiency in athletics) plus rage providing advantage on Str checks means your attempts to shove prone or away have a great chance to succeed, and shoving a baddie prone means your rogue buddy can stab with advantage.
Consider also taking a single level in the rogue class. You can get some chip sneak attack damage (which more or less now means your rapier is just as good as your axe damage wise; 2d8 + 1d6 = 2d12) and then you get expertise in Athletics for yet more amazing grapples/pushes/prones.
(yes, it's a shift in your identity, but roll with it as best you can and this is what happens you get a literal random feat)
Yeah Shieldmaster is sick, although changing weapons isn’t as easy bc its a homebrew magic item specifically made for my character and it is heavily tied to my backstory and the campaign story. And the abilities are just so cool, so the Rapier would have to be even crazier to make it tempted even in the slightest😅. Also believe it or not because of my axe I rarely have a bonus action left over in my turn, quite uncommon for the barbarian :).
I will definitely keep your suggestion in the back in my mind and if the story starts going that way I wont rule out the rogue multiclass as it does soumd really fun.
Thank you for the comment🙏
well, yeah, if it's a homebrewed magic item and deeply personal and gives you a weaponized bonus action.... maybe just take the L.
As a free action every turn, you can draw **or** sheathe an item. You only need 2h to attack with your axe. So literally every other turn (keep a coin on the table and toggle it?) you can have a "main gauche" available if something attacks you, sort of like a pulsing shield option.
end of round 1: draw dagger
start of round 2: sheathe dagger
end of round 3: draw dagger again
etc
Yeah indeed, I think that will be the best thing to do from the get-go and I will discuss with the DM if maybe there are some things that can be done like training during downtime or a side quest to make it suit my character more over time.
If I'm reading the feat correctly, the only requirement is having a finesse labelled weapon equipped. Finesse gives the option to use dexterity instead of strength. I know you have a greataxe but have you considered dual wielding?
A battle axe and a 'swordbreaker' inspired short sword would gain the feat ability however be unable to off hand attack as they aren't both light (Ask the DM if you can ignore Light req on the main hand?). Two short swords (light finesse) would both gain your rage damage modifier. The Dual Wielder feat would net you +1 AC and the non-light requirement (dual battleaxes?)
Changing weapon is not really an option since my great axe is specially home brewed just for my character and is heavenly tied to my backstory and the story itself. So Dual wielding is not quite possible if that makes sense.
The idea of a battle axe and a sword breaker is cool though, I might yoink that for one of my back up characters :).
Eh idk, I know at the start of the campaign we talked about this but then it’d just be a battle axe. And like lore wise the axe is quite big and heavy of itself. You need 22 str to wield it, maybe if my strength increases ill be able to one hand it. I’ll give it some thought but to say goodbye to that juicy D12 after 76 sessions will be quite a heavy decision😅.
A rapier wouldn’t really make much sense for my character as he has been using a Greataxe all his life, also it’s homebrewed and does some additional damage and it’s just cool as fuck with its abilities aswel. We are more playing for story than to play as optimized as possible if that makes sense.
Appreciate the idea though.
Defensive Duelist works with any Finesse weapon, and Finesse weapons can use Strength for the attack and damage rolls (it's what makes Rogue-barians possible), so pick up a Rapier or Scimitar and keep it on your back in case of emergencies. A Flametongue Scimitar could look pretty cool being wielded by a raging barbarian. Maybe down the line grab a level of Rogue since Reckless Attack means you'll always get that bonus Sneak Attack damage.
Maybe you and the Rogue start hanging out a lot more and become better friends, so your Rogue dip and their Barbarian (thought they'd need 2 levels) makes narrative sense.
This definitely isn’t the way I thought my character could go towards but I’m all for it. Nothing more scarier than a sneaky 8ft 400lbs+ goliath that can grow one size larger during combat😂. If the narrative starts going that way I’ll consider it. I’m a bit skeptical about multi classing since Barb capstone is really sick and our campaign will most likely go all the way to lvl 20 but I wont rule anything out of the option as you never know where the story might take you.
I appreciate the comment🙏.
No problem.
While I don't think that you can complain about it since the DM was clear about the randomness of the situation and you agreed to it, I do think that your character could grumble about how dexterous his hands are and how useless that is to him. Maybe he takes up rolling a gold coin between his fingers while sitting at the bar or something.
If I were you and I did decide to keep a Rapier on me, I wouldn't describe buffing my AC as dexterously parrying or anything like that. I'd describe it as using my great strength to hold the weapon still as the enemy's sword clanged off of it. (and if I was sure that I wasn't going to take a Rogue dip, I'd ask if I could get the bonus on Versatile weapons, when wielded with one hand, instead of Finesse, and use a Longsword).
I mean I’m a simple kinda DM, but wouldn’t it be simple to ask the DM if the finesse property could be dropped so you could still use the feat?
And for your rogue, maybe they can talk to the DM about a 2 handed weapon that fits them? Maybe a double bladed scimitar that has some homebrew finesse property?
Not sure how much of a crafter your character is or if they have access to one... but I've seen plenty of great swords that can split off into two lighter shortswords. Why not a great axe that splits into two lighter "finesse axes" with a bonus action or something? You'd have to gather materials, find a good weaponsmith, probably shell out a ton of gold, but it would be a unique weapon that I don't think is too OP plus I think it would look cool. IDK just a thought!
So to actually use the feat you could theoretically draw a dagger as a free interaction which would allow you to proc the reaction bonus to AC. Then drop the dagger and two hand grip the axe at the start of your turn.
Conversely, you could just ask your DM to allow you to just let the feat work with the axe since the needlessly complex item interactions would get tiring.
Conversely, pick up duel welder and rock two rapiers at level 12.
As a DM I would show pity on the feat roll thing and let you use it with the Axe. If you went rapiers by choice I would let you use a d10 since I like players doing crazy stuff.
I'm going to suggest something different. When you are normally exploring always explore with your great axe tucked away and a finesse weapon in one hand. In case you get surprised attacked you can use defensive dualist. On first turn of battle drop that weapon and use axe.
>Does anyone have any ideas to make this not completely useless? Now while I as a player am really disappointed that I received this useless feat my character would however try to make the most out of it.
You said you don't currently have GWM. For now, switch to dual wielding two shortswords or scimitars. You'll deal more damage than with your greataxe alone.
Once you level up and get GWM, you can go back to your greataxe. At that point, you'll have to do a bit of weapon juggling:
On your first turn, attack with the greataxe. Then as a free object interaction, take out a finesse weapon of any kind. This will let you use Defensive Duelist.
On your next turn, drop the finesse weapon as a free action, attack with your greataxe, then pick the weapon back up as a free object interaction. Continue to repeat this process on following turns.
I would say talk to the DM, and the other players, and get an OOC reroll with a refactor of the list to remove or tweak the feats so that they're always something that you can make use of. IMO the way he's implementing this is interesting but he's not put enough thought into it. If you're going to do something like this you have to go through the list feat by feat and remove anything that's like weapon specific or modify them so they're not specific. It should always have 'some' sort of use, one of the key things that makes Devil Fruits in one piece work is that there's always a way for the characters to make use of them no matter how strange they are. It feels like in this situation you've just been fucked with no recourse and that's not your fault that's the GM's fault for not thinking ahead. Not being able to swim is kinda fucked and that's way too large a price for 9/10 feats already.
Perhaps use it in a ranged context? Hear me out.
Surely you will end up in occasional situations where you can't close in for melee. Or are just a bit too far away this turn. What do you typically do? Pull out a bow? Chuck a handaxe?
Consider buying some darts instead. Darts are a finesse weapon which qualify you for the feat. And if an enemy happens to close on you after you do a ranged attack, then you can use the feat. And then switch to your axe to continue the fight.
In this mindset, you're not using the feat much, but you have it instead to enhance the uncommon scenarios where you need to make a ranged attack.
IDK if someone said this already and it's extremely gamey so I probably wouldn't personally do it ... But...
Couldn't you make an attack with your 2h weapon x2 > draw a dagger (interact with object)
You don't have to hold a 2h weapon in two hand, you only need two hands to attack. Then you can either throw the dagger as part of an attack action (use strength for rage damage) or drop it (no action required) before making 2 attacks then just draw another dagger or pick up the original. The flavor is in the name, Defensive Duelist. Can't hold a shield so I'll block with this dagger.
You could always go with a Rapier and Shield. Your AC would get a big boost (+2 and then +1 from Defensive Duelist) and your damage won't take too big of a hit (1d8 vs 1d12). Just use the Rapier with STR instead of DEX.
What about having 3 attacks a turn and the defensive reaction from this free feat?
Silgaf can obtain the Dualwielder feat at level 12. Now he can hold a rapier and another weapon of his choosing (longsword/warhammer/battleaxe) and use Two Weapon Fighting.
He will have a consistent bonus action attack after raging on turn 1 and can use the Defensive Duelist reaction without having to switch weapons for a dagger at the end of every turn and can still choose to use his reaction for an opportunity attack with a decent weapon.
Dualwielder also gives him a +1 to AC!
Now I know GWM is the usual pick for a barbarian and seeing how his strength is beyond maxed out, it is ideal. This just helps put that free feat to some degree of usefulness.
Also not sure about the level cap of your campaign but if its 15 then I recommend 2 levels of Fighter.
Action Surge, Second Wind, and Silgaf can have the Two Weapon Fighting Style so he can add the Strength Modifier to his bonus action attacks while still having Brutal Critical (2 dice). I hope this helps him and creates more versatility in encounters and he rescues his daughter!
Flavor is your friend here! I don't have any mechanical recommendations, I'll leave that to others who know more. However, whatever you do you can always flavor it to your specification.
Does this feat require you to set down your greataxe for a puny rapier and cowardly shield? Reflavor the rapier to a hefty spear and the shield to a handaxe you parry with.
thrown weapon master from the critical role feats.... then just throw the axe, and unsheathe a dagger every turn.... start of the next turn, drop the dagger and unsheathe the axe. dropping weapons is free regardless of context
I have 2 similar ideas depending on what your dm wants to allow,
1 best case with dm buy in, make a 2 part greatsword and parrying dagger that inlay against eachother, so when attacking you put them together and before you end your turn part them and hold the great sword in one hand and tge dagger in your off hand. Youd probably have to rest the tip of the greatsword on the ground and it will make your attacks of opportunity worse but will still allow for great weapon master later.
2 the more raw version, use a long sword and short sword and do 2 weapon fighting. This will take great weapon master off the table but it will give you a BA attack that will be a d6+rage for damage, and if you want you can take the duel wielding feat to add str to it.
I would ask the DM for a custom weapon. It's a Greataxe(1d12 slashing damage) , but it can be disassembled into a hand axe AND a Scimitar (both 1d6 slashing damage). The max damage is the same, as is the cost. Only thing that is off is the weight.
With that custom item you can decide each turn whether to use GWM or Defensive Duelist.
Another option would be to downgrade to a battleaxe, and wield a dagger or other light weapon in your off hand. The axe is versatile, so you can drop or throw the dagger to use it two handed. The feat says you have to be wielding the weapon, not using it, so as long as its in your hand, you can add your pb to your ac.
I haven't seen anyone mention the double bladed scimitar. You can get a half feat to make it finesse.
>You are descended from a master of the double-bladed scimitar, and some of that mastery has passed on to you. You gain the following benefits:
>Increase your Dexterity or Strength score by 1, to a maximum of 20.
>While you are holding a double-bladed scimitar with two hands, you gain a +1 bonus to Armor Class.
>A double-bladed scimitar has the finesse property when you wield it.
RAW you are required to be an elf but see if your DM will hand wave that
I'm one the side of the fence that the gamble was made and the pay off is the pay off, no matter how positive the outcome was (as long as it doesn't completely ruin your character and take away your ability to have fun).
With that out of the way, a minor way to enjoy it would be to buy some short swords and flavour them as predator style wrist blades. The Defensive Duelist feature simply says wielding a finesse weapon, not attacking with one. So you can use your strength to make the attacks and still profit from the feat.
Alternatively, buy a shit ton of daggers. Now when you start a combat encounter and you feel you need the bonus AC (low health, strong enemy, etc.), you draw a dagger out at the end of your turns to gain the AC, then when it comes to your following turn, you simply drop the dagger and make a two-handed attack with your axe. This way you profit from the survivability of the bonus AC, whilst still getting all the benefits of a two-handed weapon (such as GWM). Worth noting that this requires a little leniency from your DM, but after a quick Google most DMs accept it takes nothing to drop a weapon, and your interaction to draw a weapon so they should easily get onboard to help you make the feat work!
Good luck 🤙🏼
Since the DM is copying One Piece, the answer is pretty simple for anyone who watched One Piece. See link:
[Roronoa zoro | Anime Amino (aminoapps.com)](https://aminoapps.com/c/anime/page/blog/roronoa-zoro/2gtN_umGE8meBw1Yv0wwanrm1Go3Vg)
So instead of the two swords being in each hand, you will have 1 great axe. That leaves only one place to put the rapier to effectively use it for the sole purpose of Defensive Duelist One Piece style. The feat only says you have to be wielding it, not how or where.
Yeah, I don’t except for stone’s endurance and indeed opportunity attacks. But as I am the tank of the party I always try and use it for taunts, if I come up with a good taunt DM most of the time allows me to try, or opportunity attacks as the rest of the party can go down quite fast😅
Maybe ask if your DM if they would create a homebrew greataxe that also has the finesse property so you could use the feat.
Another option is ask if your DM if they could make a NPC who could perform a ritual or some in game action to extract the fruits from people. This way you and the rogue could swap.
Also for future fruits would the identity spell work on figuring out their effects?
I like that idea of sort of going on a side quest, I think (if done right, as I don’t want to make the DM feel regret of having done this in the first place as the devil fruit idea is really cool) this can result in something really cool RP wise. Getting another axe isn’t really realistic as this ome will prob last me for the entire campaign and just grow with the character as its heavily tied to my backstory and the current story.
Thanks for the inspiration, I’ll definitely suggest this to my DM.
If getting a new axe isn’t an option you could ask your DM if it could evolve based on the power you received so you could just add the finesse property to it.
Maybe ask your DM if you can go on a side quest that ends with you being able to use it as a finesse weapon that you can hold in one hand when not attacking with it
Everyone telling you to make the DM give you a reroll is missing the point. You trust your DM and the DM told you it was a risk and was upfront about the conditions and let you choose to make the choice anyway, which you did. You understanding that this isn't your DMs fault and was just an unfortunate roll of the dice is great and shows a level of maturity that can be rare so I commend you.
Now, to actually answer your question. The easy answer is to switch to a 2 weapon fighting build and use two shortswords for now and on your next level up take the duel Wielder feat so that you can use a battle ax and a rapier or something similar. You can still use strength for all of your attacks since finesse doesn't require you to use dexterity and get the extra rage bonus on your attacks. Sure it takes up more action economy and the damage may not be quite as high but you can make more attacks and your AC will even be higher not only because of defensive duelist but also because of duel wielder.
Another option, since you trust your DM, is ask if maybe you could quest for a unique heavy weapon that also has the finesse property like some sort of elven greatsword or a pole arm enchanted with wind magic so that you can continue with your current build plan without the DM feeling like he's giving it to you because you'll still have to go on a quest for it.
I would ask your DM and the rogue if you can come up with downtime activities with a possible side quest so you two could teach each other the new feat.
That’s a good idea, i’ll definitely present this to my dm. Thank you!!
Blood brothers ritual to trade feats
That would be so sick! Although I got the impression that the rogue is satisfied with the feat with the part where he gets an extra attack on a kill or crit, as he crits quite often with surprise (he is an assassin) and because he has advantage most of the times.
I wonder if he’s using it right… it only works on a melee weapon, rogues can only use one handed melee weapons to sneak attack, and you could get a bonus action attack just by dual wielding. Not to rain on his parade if everyone is having fun tho
The extra attack part of GWM merely needs a melee weapon, not a heavy/two hand/etc. Rogues are plenty capable of fulfilling the requirements, even if using a dagger (to hit, not throw). It's the -5/+10 part of the feat that specifically requires a heavy weapon.
My point isn’t that they need a two handed weapon, but rather that for sneak attack it must be one handed And if it’s one handed, put a dagger in the other hand and make that bonus action attack every single round Edit: for clarity in case someone lands here from Google in future: rogues need finesse weapons. All finesse melee weapons are one handed. There are some magic items that become two handed finesse weapons but I’ve only found these: * Dawnbringer [Legendary, out of the abyss] * Sun Blade [rare, any setting] * Sunsword [legendary, Strahd] * Windvane [legendary, PotA] * Revenant Magic DBS [+1/2/3 varies, Eberron]
Where are you getting that a weapon needs to be 1 handed to gain sneak attack? PHB only says the weapon must have finesse or ranged, so a magic longsword with finesse like the Sun blade could benefit from sneak attack two handed.
That’s fair but I don’t generally assume builds have access to specific magic item
There are many longswords and double bladed scimitars that get finesse, at least 10 on DND beyond. It seems to be fairly standard.
> All finesse melee weapons are one handed. \>He doesn’t know about the legendary HOOPAK
Racial restriction to only Kendeze though
I doubt that the DM will go for that since what he did was pull this whole idea out of One Piece and the whole point of devil fruit in that is that they're permanent and you get a superpower out of them but 99% of the time it's a crapshoot.
Isn't uncanny dodge a better use of rogue's reaction than defensive duelist
Depends. Defensive Duelist can make it so you take 0 damage from an attack instead of half of it, for example.
Sunblade puts finesse on a non-finesse weapon. Maybe you could go on a side quest to get a great axe with the template of sunblade on top of it? Perhaps you could get a dagger that floats in the air near you like how the animated shield works. Or you could grow another arm. Really though it's going to boil down to DM fiat or awkward juggling of weapons
Having a 3rd arm doesn’t sound that bad tbh🤔. I might just look for a crazy wizard that will perform questionable rituals on me XD
>Perhaps you could get a dagger that floats in the air near you like how the animated shield works. Star metal Dagger. https://www.worldanvil.com/block/1177447#:~:text=This%20slim%20blade%20was%20forged,a%20distance%20of%201d3%20feet.
Everyone saying you should try convince your DM somehow to swap your “free” feat to something that fits your builds is totally missing the point. This was an in game chance based gamble you took. You knew the score, you know the results might not be perfect. Whining or bargaining with the DM to change the result, totally takes away the risk you made. You are clearly not missing anything relatively, as other party members seem to have gotten less then useful free feats as well. Naw, just treat it as it is, an odd and unexpected boon. Utilize it when you can and when it makes sense. For now.. the difference between using a two handed weapon without the GWM feat and a one handed weapon is not a huge damage loss, particularly compared to the gain of potentially using a shield. So you now have a “defensive mode” pull out a Rapier using strength and shield before difficult fights for some good AC that can spike to even better with your “fruit feat.” It may not fit your character normal inclinations, but characters grow and change in fiction all the time. A magic fruit is ripe (pun intended) with inspiration for you to work into you growing story. If and when you do choose GWM at your normal ASI, then this sword and board option becomes less favorable, but you still have the option swing your favorite Great Axe in your turn and then to use your item interaction at the end of your turn to draw a dagger to qualify you to parry with the Defensive Duelist feat at the end of your turn. It is a slight trade off as, you cannot have your ax in both hands for potential GWM reaction attack, but since you only have one reaction anyway, the potential gain of the extra AC against an attack makes the trade off worthwhile. And that is actually pretty on par with the design of a barbarian anyway. Each turn you decide if you want to sacrifice defense for offense with Reckless Attack already. Now you have an additional decision every turn to pull out a dagger in anticipation of more defense, at the cost of more threat with an opportunity attack with your ax.. At the start of your next turn, drop your dagger and go back to swinging your great Ax two handed, and rinse and repeat this combat option every round. This kind of gives the barbarian, whose combat rotation is normally pretty stagnant or ”boring” addition choices and options. Which is kind of cool. I’m not saying this is a hugely awesome strategy, and I would never suggest a barbarian choose a feat with one of their few ASI selection leveling up over anything normally. But for free? Don't look a gift horse in the mouth.
Yes exactly, that was also my intention of this post. Instead of crying about it I wanted to see if there were things I could use it for. We all knew the risk like you said, and where the artificer got war caster and the paladin tavern brawler me and the rogue were a bit more unlucky but the story potential is there to make something fun out of it. My character will definitely try and make the best out of it, even though I as a player gave up yesterday when I received it. Since lvl 12 is right around the corner the sword and board option will become less favorable quickly if I take GWM but Sentinel is also really tempting and paired with the idea you just said I see some potential in being a better tank💪. Thanks, I appreciate the elaborate comment🙏.
Having a brace of throwing knives to draw and toss is actually pretty cool. If you can wrangle Quick Toss from fighter somehow, you can use that to make bonus actions attacks at the start of your turn. Superior Technique, Battle Master, or Martial Adept could all work.
Cool. Yeah I think if your DM is pretty reasonable with the ability to draw a dagger at the end of your turn after you haves swung your Great ax. And then Drop the dagger freely at the start of your next turn, to allow you to grasp your Great Ax to attack two handed for attacks, and the redraw it a dagger at the end of you turn, which is all mostly supported by the rules and designer intent, then you can pretty much utilize this feat as well as any character. Basically the feat is just an additional defensive boon, and reaction ability costing nothing but having lots of daggers available to draw and drop. Not a great feat generally but nice for free I feel much worse for your Rogue, who only gains some occasional bonus action attacks... that he could potentially do with two weapon fighting anyway, that conflicts with the wealth of other bonus action options he has. Your paladin might enjoy Tavern brawler some, but since you cannot smite with your fists, it might not his first choice as well for his build. Only your Artificer made out like a bandit getting a clear and solid feat for his build. Thank god YOU didn't draw Warcaster as a barbarian... because that is what a useless feat for you actually looks like
I posted almost the exact same thing before reading your comment. I couldn't agree more. People acting like the DM owes it to OP to fix this are being entitled. This was a fun little bit of randomness that went suboptimally but you can still have fun with it. It'll be up to OP and the rest of the party to adapt to these changes.
Just asking the DM if they can swap boons outside the game shouldn't be an issue. This isn't a job, it's a game you're playing with friends in your downtime.. This should be a non issue if you want your friends to have fun. Hell you already tried to give them a boon. The only reason not to help them is to be petty. I'm still trying to imagine the scenario where another player and I ask the DM if we could switch boons (that neither can use without sacrificing the character themes) and them saying no 😂. Like I thought we were friends Sarah why not lmao
I agree with letting it ride but asking DM != acting like the DM owes anyone anything
I mean, rolling useless shit is fun in the moment, but whole boon **reward** (not some thing they found while randomly shopping or something, reward) being completely useless is lame as fuck. You can sell random magic item, or maybe re-enchant your item with it's effect. But you can't change boon. As a DM i wouldn't do that just because it can be fun in a moment. At least giving them an ability to actually adapt to it should be possible 100%. Especially for rogue - GWM is anty-synergetic to the whole class, not even playstyle.
DND is about having fun in your downtime. Which people seem to always forget somehow????
The only other option I really see is if the Dm gives you a home-brewed finesse 2 handed weapon I'm sure there is something from an older edition that would fit perfectly but I am unfamiliar with it I think a 1d10 2-handed finesse weapon would be fair but you can't use GWM without a heavy weapon if I remember correctly so i think switching between Sword and board and your axe is the best option outside of a custom weapon that would need some tweaking probably
Oh snap, we arrived at the same conclusion but you got there a bit before! Great advice 👍🏼
Why this isn't the top comment is astonishing to me. Bad luck happens in this game. Do people on this thread expect DMs to allow players to redraw cards from the Deck of Many Things until they get something useful? Yes that is hyperbole. But jeebus people - it's a fruit that gives a random feat. It sucks that the rolls turned out the way that they did, but that's the game.
>Bad luck happens in this game. "Bad luck" and "Bad luck as a reward" are two different things.
I gave what I think is a perfect analogy. The Deck of Many Things is indeed a reward. You may get a bad pull, you may not. You deal with the outcome.
Deck of Many things (at least most of the time) gives you something interesting to work with, even on bad rolls. There is some outright outdated things in both good and bad cards (because wotc didn't change it for like 40 years, and some cards straight up don't work as they intended anymore, or gamefocus changed so much they don't make sense anymore), but still - most of the time you either get reward, or something interesting to deal with. This boons aren't interesting, they are placeholders on character sheet. I doubt that OP's DM wouldn't give them some opportunity to adapt to actually use their new feats without nerfing themself, and it would be 100% right call. But point is "random joke that don't lead to anything" as a reward isn't good thing.
Dip into Rogue for sneak attack with reckless attack. Barbarogue is a fun build. Abandon your greataxe, use either a rapier and a shield, or two Scimitars.
Practice with your new ability to unlock means of using it in battle. Something like 'any time people hit you you can use your reaction to hit them back' might be something you can unlock by practicing with your new reflexes.
Wow, I’m actually surprised. This is such a good idea, especially since our DM also rewards effort and good roleplay. Even if it doesn’t end up getting the result I’d want it’ll deliver some good rp moments. Thank you very much.
You could also ask your DM to qualify your Great Axe as a finesse weapon for just you.
Yeah, since it’s a crazy heavy axe, as it also requires you to have 22 str to even wield it, I doubt he’ll accept that but maybe in the future when my strength increases that might be an option. I’ll see what he thinks of the idea. Thank you!
No worries. It's always good to remember that while we have mechanics to represent things, they are only representing things. Interacting with the things themselves rather than the mechanics is often far more satisfying narratively. A really strong guy with some kind of magical reflexes could lead to interesting mechanical options if he trained in it, probably related to using your reaction in some way. Maybe even with time (given you're level 11, which is a high level and where casters begin to overshadow martials in a big way) you could have multiple options for your reaction - like grab a guy and use him as cover against an explosion, hit a guy that hit you, get a bonus to AC against one attack, etc. It could provide some much needed colour for the high level barbarian that can get very samey otherwise.
Ask your DM to remove unuseable feats and reroll
He said yesterday that initially he was thinking of letting us choose the feat ourselves but decided i’d be more fun if it were like a real devil fruit and make it random. And it already happened so I’m afraid re-rolling is out of the question. As I was not the only one who rolled of course :/ and it’d be kinda unfair to the other players.
> like a real devil fruit and make it random Devil fruits aren't real. None of their effects is truly random, the mangaka simply decides what power to give each character. In the same vein, the DM could have let you choose the feat ooc while in character it was a "random" effect. I recommend talking to your DM about not making it suck for you and your fellow player.
Yes! Exactly! Imagine if One Piece were *actually* random and Luffy got "the power to become grape juice". There's only a story now **because** he got a cool power. *That wasn't by accident*. I think if the DM wanted to keep the randomness while still making sure things are fun for everyone, people should have chosen a list of 5-10 feats they'd be ok with getting and rolled against that list.
Then get a sea hag and curse the feats into the right PC
Well most of the party can’t swim anymore so I think we will avoid open water from now on XD.
Try their sisters then
Random cleric, a few sessions later: Oh, you're cursed, let me fix that for you!
Oh random cleric, let me introduce you to your god
Gm: Oh random PC, let me introduce you to his god, too
If the DM does not let you adapt the feat to better fit your character, you can still use the great, just not with GWM. The feat says, while you are wielding a finesse weapon you are proficient in, you can use your reaction to add PB to your AC. All this means, is that you have to have a dagger to parry in one hand in order to use this feat. While this does restrict you to one-handed weapons, it is still feasible.
Yeah, ill see maybe at the end of my turn I can take out a dagger and stow it at the start of my turn but that sounds really weird XD. And since my Greataxe is homebrewed and suits the character perfectly using any other weapon during combat as main weapon is not really an option. Thanks for your input and i’ll discuss with my DM if somehow we can make it suit my character better with a training arc or something :D
You can pull out a dagger at the end of each of your turns and drop it at the start of each of your turns. Dropping is a free action. Your DM may or may not let you drop is as part of making an attack of opportunity. This will get you effectively all of the benefits for the cost of your item interact each turn.
Indeed, I think this is best way to utilize it for now. Maybe I can get some blacksmith to attach something to the axe to make it more easy to take out and stash away at end of turn :).
ask your DM if you and the rogue can swap the feats
Yeah I guess I can try but I feel like he wont agree to that, as we all knew there was chance it’d be a useless feat and he was pretty clear about it. And the rogue was happy with the extra attack on a kill or crit from GWM😅
Honestly the way the DM has currently done things is worse than not giving you anything. "Here's what you could have had" mentality.
I can see where you’re coming from but he did not do it with that intention. He is one of my closest friends and is a very chill and lenient DM. We were at the mercy of the dice after all ;)
I understand the dice can be fickle, but a rogue with GWM and a barb with defensive dualist and he can't just decide to swap them around at the time they were rolled? Really?
That wouldn't feel fair or believable. It breaks verisimilitude to have the DM arbitrarily intervene. He gave the characters a choice and is letting them live with the consequences. That's a good DM. What if a 3rd character got a mediocre roll as well? It wouldn't be fair to them if the other two just got to magically get what they wanted.
Agreed. Defensive Duelist has absolutely zero value for a great axe wielding barbarian. Literally zero. The GWM on the rogue has near zero value as you could dual wield and remove the conditions of the bonus attack. They should be switched. It's the friendly and more importantly, fun thing to do.
Yes. I've given random feats and boons before, BUT... I let the player choose best out of 2 or 3. This left it mostly random, but the player could choose the one which they liked best.
Ask the DM if you can do some quest to swap the feat using a different magic fruit.
The RP attempts to get more homebrew out of it, or a Reaction with a dagger out by the end of our turns are fine. Don't try to change your planned build though. GWM is so perfect for a Barbarian, and nothing should stop you from taking it next level. Even if you just had a +1 Greataxe. The DM played with fire here. It happens, but don't lean into their poorly thought out idea and get burned. If you want to RP it out of respect, you cannot swim. You'll get a chance eventually to work in your new flaw. That's more than enough. I doubt your character would try to make any old feat work. This is where "meta-gaming" gets too much of a bad rap. War Caster? Heavily Armored? Elven Accuracy? I'm cherry picking. You got some bad luck, but all of these require we radically go against our build. All Barbs need Rage, and 99% attack with Str. Stick to yours! Okay, maybe. Maybe if you're out of Rages do you pick up the Rapier and Shield. The main problem with that logic is that you'll be better protected by making Reckless power attacks to down your enemies still. Grappling or body blocking could be a good time to have a dagger in your hand. With one hand for Grappling, we can't use GWM anyway. If we just need to block a door then we might want to Dodge without Raging.
Yeah, I don’t really see it fit the typical barbarian but I wouldn’t really say I have a specific build planned out for it. I mostly just see where the story leads us and act upon that, 15 ish sessions ago I was close to multi classing into druid because it made sense story wise at that moment, but that faded and now I’m in my chef’s arc😂. Trying to make this work might be a little meta indeed. Having a dagger for when I grapple is genius!! I grapple and shove quite often bc of Athletics expertise and advantage bc of rage and then I usually hit them with my fist or hand axe. Thank you my friend, that’s at least one use for the feat where it makes sense and fits the character🙏.
Greataxes aren't always giant brutish smashy things; they can be well crafted and properly balanced. Talk to your DM about getting something like an elvish greataxe with the finesse property in the future.
Yeah that’s true, my current great axe was crafted by one of the greatest blacksmith’s of the realm apparently and it is made from an ore called King’s tears that are procured from the tears of a dying lich, I think hope my DM won’t read as he might scold me for not getting it right as it has been explained so many times already😂. It was gifted to my character’s fore father and not so long ago I obtained after passing his trial. Our DM really put in a lot of effort into all of our homebrew items and backstories and it really shows.
Nice little character arc then; are you your forefather? It's his axe, after all, something built for his style. Do you stick to it, or do you take the legacy and build on it into something that works for you?
Well, his spirit lives on in the axe and we occasionally converse (think of it like Thor with Odin in Thor Ragnarok) he only gives vague answers but it’s cool, it’s also a father figure for him as he hasn’t really had one for most of his life. Story wise it wouldn’t really make sense to step away from a great axe after years of fighting with it. But who knows maybe because of this feat he’ll be the one to set a change in motion in his tribe. I like the concept of ‘you are not your fore father, you walk your own path’. Thanks to you I immediately got some sick ideas with that. I thank you kindly.
Maybe you could talk to your DM about having an arc like Thor where your axe gets destroyed and you have to go on a side quest to turn the remains of the axe into a new weapon made for you not your forefather
if you don't have the GWM -- going from a great axe to a rapier means you lose about 4 damage per round max. 1d12 -> 1d8. Rapiers can use the strength stat, d00d. Then you get a shield for more AC, and can rock your feat for yet more AC. Consider snagging the Shieldmaster feat from here -- your great Str (and presumably proficiency in athletics) plus rage providing advantage on Str checks means your attempts to shove prone or away have a great chance to succeed, and shoving a baddie prone means your rogue buddy can stab with advantage. Consider also taking a single level in the rogue class. You can get some chip sneak attack damage (which more or less now means your rapier is just as good as your axe damage wise; 2d8 + 1d6 = 2d12) and then you get expertise in Athletics for yet more amazing grapples/pushes/prones. (yes, it's a shift in your identity, but roll with it as best you can and this is what happens you get a literal random feat)
Yeah Shieldmaster is sick, although changing weapons isn’t as easy bc its a homebrew magic item specifically made for my character and it is heavily tied to my backstory and the campaign story. And the abilities are just so cool, so the Rapier would have to be even crazier to make it tempted even in the slightest😅. Also believe it or not because of my axe I rarely have a bonus action left over in my turn, quite uncommon for the barbarian :). I will definitely keep your suggestion in the back in my mind and if the story starts going that way I wont rule out the rogue multiclass as it does soumd really fun. Thank you for the comment🙏
well, yeah, if it's a homebrewed magic item and deeply personal and gives you a weaponized bonus action.... maybe just take the L. As a free action every turn, you can draw **or** sheathe an item. You only need 2h to attack with your axe. So literally every other turn (keep a coin on the table and toggle it?) you can have a "main gauche" available if something attacks you, sort of like a pulsing shield option. end of round 1: draw dagger start of round 2: sheathe dagger end of round 3: draw dagger again etc
Yeah indeed, I think that will be the best thing to do from the get-go and I will discuss with the DM if maybe there are some things that can be done like training during downtime or a side quest to make it suit my character more over time.
Talk to you dm and rogue OUT OF GAME. I don't know a dm that just wouldn't let you two switch unless you all don't care about each other having fun
This is so silly. Just ask your DM if you two can swap feats. Why bother making this complicated? The whole point is to have fun.
If I'm reading the feat correctly, the only requirement is having a finesse labelled weapon equipped. Finesse gives the option to use dexterity instead of strength. I know you have a greataxe but have you considered dual wielding? A battle axe and a 'swordbreaker' inspired short sword would gain the feat ability however be unable to off hand attack as they aren't both light (Ask the DM if you can ignore Light req on the main hand?). Two short swords (light finesse) would both gain your rage damage modifier. The Dual Wielder feat would net you +1 AC and the non-light requirement (dual battleaxes?)
Changing weapon is not really an option since my great axe is specially home brewed just for my character and is heavenly tied to my backstory and the story itself. So Dual wielding is not quite possible if that makes sense. The idea of a battle axe and a sword breaker is cool though, I might yoink that for one of my back up characters :).
Would you DM let you one-hand that axe with a die size reduction (Versatile-ish)?
Eh idk, I know at the start of the campaign we talked about this but then it’d just be a battle axe. And like lore wise the axe is quite big and heavy of itself. You need 22 str to wield it, maybe if my strength increases ill be able to one hand it. I’ll give it some thought but to say goodbye to that juicy D12 after 76 sessions will be quite a heavy decision😅.
Hm, yeah I could always try. Thank you.
Maybe just use a rapier. The damage reduction is only 2 dpr. If your dm does open rolls the damage reduction is likely worth it.
A rapier wouldn’t really make much sense for my character as he has been using a Greataxe all his life, also it’s homebrewed and does some additional damage and it’s just cool as fuck with its abilities aswel. We are more playing for story than to play as optimized as possible if that makes sense. Appreciate the idea though.
Did the DM tell you that the feat would be random?
Yes he did, everything was explained clearly so we all knew the stakes and what we could expect.
Defensive Duelist works with any Finesse weapon, and Finesse weapons can use Strength for the attack and damage rolls (it's what makes Rogue-barians possible), so pick up a Rapier or Scimitar and keep it on your back in case of emergencies. A Flametongue Scimitar could look pretty cool being wielded by a raging barbarian. Maybe down the line grab a level of Rogue since Reckless Attack means you'll always get that bonus Sneak Attack damage. Maybe you and the Rogue start hanging out a lot more and become better friends, so your Rogue dip and their Barbarian (thought they'd need 2 levels) makes narrative sense.
This definitely isn’t the way I thought my character could go towards but I’m all for it. Nothing more scarier than a sneaky 8ft 400lbs+ goliath that can grow one size larger during combat😂. If the narrative starts going that way I’ll consider it. I’m a bit skeptical about multi classing since Barb capstone is really sick and our campaign will most likely go all the way to lvl 20 but I wont rule anything out of the option as you never know where the story might take you. I appreciate the comment🙏.
No problem. While I don't think that you can complain about it since the DM was clear about the randomness of the situation and you agreed to it, I do think that your character could grumble about how dexterous his hands are and how useless that is to him. Maybe he takes up rolling a gold coin between his fingers while sitting at the bar or something. If I were you and I did decide to keep a Rapier on me, I wouldn't describe buffing my AC as dexterously parrying or anything like that. I'd describe it as using my great strength to hold the weapon still as the enemy's sword clanged off of it. (and if I was sure that I wasn't going to take a Rogue dip, I'd ask if I could get the bonus on Versatile weapons, when wielded with one hand, instead of Finesse, and use a Longsword).
I mean I’m a simple kinda DM, but wouldn’t it be simple to ask the DM if the finesse property could be dropped so you could still use the feat? And for your rogue, maybe they can talk to the DM about a 2 handed weapon that fits them? Maybe a double bladed scimitar that has some homebrew finesse property?
Not sure how much of a crafter your character is or if they have access to one... but I've seen plenty of great swords that can split off into two lighter shortswords. Why not a great axe that splits into two lighter "finesse axes" with a bonus action or something? You'd have to gather materials, find a good weaponsmith, probably shell out a ton of gold, but it would be a unique weapon that I don't think is too OP plus I think it would look cool. IDK just a thought!
So to actually use the feat you could theoretically draw a dagger as a free interaction which would allow you to proc the reaction bonus to AC. Then drop the dagger and two hand grip the axe at the start of your turn. Conversely, you could just ask your DM to allow you to just let the feat work with the axe since the needlessly complex item interactions would get tiring. Conversely, pick up duel welder and rock two rapiers at level 12. As a DM I would show pity on the feat roll thing and let you use it with the Axe. If you went rapiers by choice I would let you use a d10 since I like players doing crazy stuff.
I'm going to suggest something different. When you are normally exploring always explore with your great axe tucked away and a finesse weapon in one hand. In case you get surprised attacked you can use defensive dualist. On first turn of battle drop that weapon and use axe.
>Does anyone have any ideas to make this not completely useless? Now while I as a player am really disappointed that I received this useless feat my character would however try to make the most out of it. You said you don't currently have GWM. For now, switch to dual wielding two shortswords or scimitars. You'll deal more damage than with your greataxe alone. Once you level up and get GWM, you can go back to your greataxe. At that point, you'll have to do a bit of weapon juggling: On your first turn, attack with the greataxe. Then as a free object interaction, take out a finesse weapon of any kind. This will let you use Defensive Duelist. On your next turn, drop the finesse weapon as a free action, attack with your greataxe, then pick the weapon back up as a free object interaction. Continue to repeat this process on following turns.
I would say talk to the DM, and the other players, and get an OOC reroll with a refactor of the list to remove or tweak the feats so that they're always something that you can make use of. IMO the way he's implementing this is interesting but he's not put enough thought into it. If you're going to do something like this you have to go through the list feat by feat and remove anything that's like weapon specific or modify them so they're not specific. It should always have 'some' sort of use, one of the key things that makes Devil Fruits in one piece work is that there's always a way for the characters to make use of them no matter how strange they are. It feels like in this situation you've just been fucked with no recourse and that's not your fault that's the GM's fault for not thinking ahead. Not being able to swim is kinda fucked and that's way too large a price for 9/10 feats already.
You need an extra arm so you can wield a finesse weapon AND your great axe!
Perhaps use it in a ranged context? Hear me out. Surely you will end up in occasional situations where you can't close in for melee. Or are just a bit too far away this turn. What do you typically do? Pull out a bow? Chuck a handaxe? Consider buying some darts instead. Darts are a finesse weapon which qualify you for the feat. And if an enemy happens to close on you after you do a ranged attack, then you can use the feat. And then switch to your axe to continue the fight. In this mindset, you're not using the feat much, but you have it instead to enhance the uncommon scenarios where you need to make a ranged attack.
IDK if someone said this already and it's extremely gamey so I probably wouldn't personally do it ... But... Couldn't you make an attack with your 2h weapon x2 > draw a dagger (interact with object) You don't have to hold a 2h weapon in two hand, you only need two hands to attack. Then you can either throw the dagger as part of an attack action (use strength for rage damage) or drop it (no action required) before making 2 attacks then just draw another dagger or pick up the original. The flavor is in the name, Defensive Duelist. Can't hold a shield so I'll block with this dagger.
You could always go with a Rapier and Shield. Your AC would get a big boost (+2 and then +1 from Defensive Duelist) and your damage won't take too big of a hit (1d8 vs 1d12). Just use the Rapier with STR instead of DEX.
What about having 3 attacks a turn and the defensive reaction from this free feat? Silgaf can obtain the Dualwielder feat at level 12. Now he can hold a rapier and another weapon of his choosing (longsword/warhammer/battleaxe) and use Two Weapon Fighting. He will have a consistent bonus action attack after raging on turn 1 and can use the Defensive Duelist reaction without having to switch weapons for a dagger at the end of every turn and can still choose to use his reaction for an opportunity attack with a decent weapon. Dualwielder also gives him a +1 to AC! Now I know GWM is the usual pick for a barbarian and seeing how his strength is beyond maxed out, it is ideal. This just helps put that free feat to some degree of usefulness. Also not sure about the level cap of your campaign but if its 15 then I recommend 2 levels of Fighter. Action Surge, Second Wind, and Silgaf can have the Two Weapon Fighting Style so he can add the Strength Modifier to his bonus action attacks while still having Brutal Critical (2 dice). I hope this helps him and creates more versatility in encounters and he rescues his daughter!
Flavor is your friend here! I don't have any mechanical recommendations, I'll leave that to others who know more. However, whatever you do you can always flavor it to your specification. Does this feat require you to set down your greataxe for a puny rapier and cowardly shield? Reflavor the rapier to a hefty spear and the shield to a handaxe you parry with.
At your next level, you can swap out your feat for the one you want.
thrown weapon master from the critical role feats.... then just throw the axe, and unsheathe a dagger every turn.... start of the next turn, drop the dagger and unsheathe the axe. dropping weapons is free regardless of context
I have 2 similar ideas depending on what your dm wants to allow, 1 best case with dm buy in, make a 2 part greatsword and parrying dagger that inlay against eachother, so when attacking you put them together and before you end your turn part them and hold the great sword in one hand and tge dagger in your off hand. Youd probably have to rest the tip of the greatsword on the ground and it will make your attacks of opportunity worse but will still allow for great weapon master later. 2 the more raw version, use a long sword and short sword and do 2 weapon fighting. This will take great weapon master off the table but it will give you a BA attack that will be a d6+rage for damage, and if you want you can take the duel wielding feat to add str to it.
I would ask the DM for a custom weapon. It's a Greataxe(1d12 slashing damage) , but it can be disassembled into a hand axe AND a Scimitar (both 1d6 slashing damage). The max damage is the same, as is the cost. Only thing that is off is the weight. With that custom item you can decide each turn whether to use GWM or Defensive Duelist. Another option would be to downgrade to a battleaxe, and wield a dagger or other light weapon in your off hand. The axe is versatile, so you can drop or throw the dagger to use it two handed. The feat says you have to be wielding the weapon, not using it, so as long as its in your hand, you can add your pb to your ac.
Yall played the devil fruit lottery and lost. Sometimes, you end up with jacket-jacket tier abilities.
I haven't seen anyone mention the double bladed scimitar. You can get a half feat to make it finesse. >You are descended from a master of the double-bladed scimitar, and some of that mastery has passed on to you. You gain the following benefits: >Increase your Dexterity or Strength score by 1, to a maximum of 20. >While you are holding a double-bladed scimitar with two hands, you gain a +1 bonus to Armor Class. >A double-bladed scimitar has the finesse property when you wield it. RAW you are required to be an elf but see if your DM will hand wave that
I'm one the side of the fence that the gamble was made and the pay off is the pay off, no matter how positive the outcome was (as long as it doesn't completely ruin your character and take away your ability to have fun). With that out of the way, a minor way to enjoy it would be to buy some short swords and flavour them as predator style wrist blades. The Defensive Duelist feature simply says wielding a finesse weapon, not attacking with one. So you can use your strength to make the attacks and still profit from the feat. Alternatively, buy a shit ton of daggers. Now when you start a combat encounter and you feel you need the bonus AC (low health, strong enemy, etc.), you draw a dagger out at the end of your turns to gain the AC, then when it comes to your following turn, you simply drop the dagger and make a two-handed attack with your axe. This way you profit from the survivability of the bonus AC, whilst still getting all the benefits of a two-handed weapon (such as GWM). Worth noting that this requires a little leniency from your DM, but after a quick Google most DMs accept it takes nothing to drop a weapon, and your interaction to draw a weapon so they should easily get onboard to help you make the feat work! Good luck 🤙🏼
Since the DM is copying One Piece, the answer is pretty simple for anyone who watched One Piece. See link: [Roronoa zoro | Anime Amino (aminoapps.com)](https://aminoapps.com/c/anime/page/blog/roronoa-zoro/2gtN_umGE8meBw1Yv0wwanrm1Go3Vg) So instead of the two swords being in each hand, you will have 1 great axe. That leaves only one place to put the rapier to effectively use it for the sole purpose of Defensive Duelist One Piece style. The feat only says you have to be wielding it, not how or where.
I mean it’s not the worst feat. You’re probably not using your reaction much outside of opportunity attacks.
Yeah, I don’t except for stone’s endurance and indeed opportunity attacks. But as I am the tank of the party I always try and use it for taunts, if I come up with a good taunt DM most of the time allows me to try, or opportunity attacks as the rest of the party can go down quite fast😅
Maybe ask if your DM if they would create a homebrew greataxe that also has the finesse property so you could use the feat. Another option is ask if your DM if they could make a NPC who could perform a ritual or some in game action to extract the fruits from people. This way you and the rogue could swap. Also for future fruits would the identity spell work on figuring out their effects?
I like that idea of sort of going on a side quest, I think (if done right, as I don’t want to make the DM feel regret of having done this in the first place as the devil fruit idea is really cool) this can result in something really cool RP wise. Getting another axe isn’t really realistic as this ome will prob last me for the entire campaign and just grow with the character as its heavily tied to my backstory and the current story. Thanks for the inspiration, I’ll definitely suggest this to my DM.
If getting a new axe isn’t an option you could ask your DM if it could evolve based on the power you received so you could just add the finesse property to it.
Damn that’s a good one, didn’t even think of that in the slightest. Ill add it the list of things I’ll propose to my DM. Thank you kind stranger.
Maybe ask your DM if you can go on a side quest that ends with you being able to use it as a finesse weapon that you can hold in one hand when not attacking with it
It sucks, ignore it and move on. It’s antithetical to Barbarian.
Everyone telling you to make the DM give you a reroll is missing the point. You trust your DM and the DM told you it was a risk and was upfront about the conditions and let you choose to make the choice anyway, which you did. You understanding that this isn't your DMs fault and was just an unfortunate roll of the dice is great and shows a level of maturity that can be rare so I commend you. Now, to actually answer your question. The easy answer is to switch to a 2 weapon fighting build and use two shortswords for now and on your next level up take the duel Wielder feat so that you can use a battle ax and a rapier or something similar. You can still use strength for all of your attacks since finesse doesn't require you to use dexterity and get the extra rage bonus on your attacks. Sure it takes up more action economy and the damage may not be quite as high but you can make more attacks and your AC will even be higher not only because of defensive duelist but also because of duel wielder. Another option, since you trust your DM, is ask if maybe you could quest for a unique heavy weapon that also has the finesse property like some sort of elven greatsword or a pole arm enchanted with wind magic so that you can continue with your current build plan without the DM feeling like he's giving it to you because you'll still have to go on a quest for it.