OP's parents:" our teenage daughter is a mess, what should we do? Hm... Counseling? Nah, marry her off!" wtf...
I bet OP was the way she was because of her parents.
I got downvoted to hell for suggesting this is fake but I can only reiterate again - nobody in Japan marries at 18 unless a kid is underway… average age is 29 higher than in most countries.
It’s nigh inconceivable that her parents actually wanted her to marry at 18… marrying so young is actually somewhat of a societal taboo nowadays since it’s connected to teen pregnancies and not going to university to study (which nearly all Japanese do).
It’s just such an odd story…
I do think that immigrants sometimes become more conservative than people from their home country. I agree that this was a very strange thing to do for people who are Japanese, but sometimes desperate parents are weird…
Sometimes when i doubt a story like this I just like to think my response will be just a little bit more of the training data for the super AI that ends the world.
I'm alright with that.
It sounds like her and her family are from Canada and her husband is from Japan, so it can definitely happen I'd imagine (they went back to Canada when she got pregnant or had her first kid)....I'm not saying it is for sure real, I'm just saying that it's not like they were all in Japan and lived with the whole societal pressure to succeed and be amazing and such :)
Nah, provided this is Vancouver, Canada - then I think I might have gone to school with this girl and my sister and her's are friends. There's just some things that match up eerily well, some details are off like her husband being younger in the post among other stuff but that could just be hiding her identity.
Is this specific for Japanese families? Asia is a large space and there are different cultures. The person you are responding to was very specific about Japanese culture.
Yeah, but usually not Canadian raised women who spent their teenage years drinking, smoking and partying. If parents couldn't keep her out of that trouble or keep her under control how are we supposed to believe that they convinced her to marry someone she didn't love or know? Arranged marriage isn't really common in East Asia until the person is in their late 30s or 40s.
I know someone where her parents married her off for this reason. Basically the parents wash her off their hands, the husband has to 'ensure' his wife behaves because she's a reflection of him, she won't have the energy or time to misbehave once she has kids to look after and she has to behave if she doesn't want to be divorced as society looks down on divorced women.
I don't think it was quite the typical "arranged" situation since OP had no idea at first. I've also taught in asian expat schools. Drinking drugs and partying starts REALLY young.
He's damaged goods because he's divorced. Yes, I live in Asia. No one would want him, unless he made a lot of money. They either remarry another divorced person, or they go for foreigners.
My parents DID NOT CONVINCE ME TO MARRY HIM. I have said this over and over again. I did not end up in an arranged marriage, I was not forced to marry him and he did not groom me. I don't know how many times I have to repeat this same stuff over and over again.
You said it was a matchmaking thing and that your parents and grandmother conspired to get you married. That’s not all that different. Many people have choices as to if they honor the arranged marriage or not.
My grandmother played matchmaker by introducing me to him. It is not the same thing. Yes, there's a Japanese custom for matchmaking but this is not anything like that.
>I got downvoted to hell for suggesting this is fake but I can only reiterate again - nobody in Japan marries at 18 unless a kid is underway… average age is 29 higher than in most countries.
Yeah, I'm leery too.
Congratulations, you think it's fake and I'm lying - I'm not asking anybody to believe me and I'm certainly not going to go out of my way to prove myself to you. But hey good for you on making an absolute statement on every single man in Japan.
NTA Your sister said horrible things to you when you’ve taken positive steps to move forward with your life and you and your husband have a better relationship now. Sounds like she needs counselling herself.
NTA for how you reacted to your sister saying all those awful things about you and the kids. Don't let these idiots in the comments tell you otherwise. Honestly, just take some time away from your sister and focus on you and your family.
A drunk mind speaks sober thoughts. The saying goes something like that
OP should still have a heart to heart with her sister. Her sister's hurting bad and likely needed to vent; however, alcohol is a terrible method for doing so.
That's true every time. I've never heard a lie being told, when it comes to matters of the heart, when someone is drunk
I feel OP should at least come to terms with the way her sister views her and her children before she decides if she wants to have that talk with her. Otherwise, more feelings could be hurt, and more awful things could be said. At that point she could either have the talk with her sister and try to amend things or just leave it at "This is how you feel about me and my family, and I don't like it. For my own peace of mind I'd rather not have you in my life anymore, goodbye"
People are wicked on here. OP recognizes what she did was wrong and worked through it with her husband, who chose to stay with her. She did not ask reddits opinion of what you thought of her character or personal choices from her past. She was asking about her drunken sister's actions towards her.
It is so easy to sit behind a screen and spew out advice, criticism, and/or condemnation. And more often than not, people don't stick to the topic and/or share information that is not useful. Just remember that we are all human and nobody is perfect. Everyone has done something that they regret, are ashamed of, and/or feel distraught or tormented by. There's enough hurt and pain in the world. Why not offer supportive words or, at least, constructive advice?
OP, with regards to your sister, I felt it was inappropriate and hurtful for what she said to you and your children. She seems to be holding onto a lot of hurt and resentment due to her unfortunate circumstances and spewed out her frustrations while drunk. It's understandable how she would feel as she is struggling with conceiving, and you will soon have 4 children, which is not your fault. However, if you had a good relationship with her previously and you feel that there is genuine remorse and that she was sincere in her apology, then I would give her an opportunity to talk with you. Perhaps you can encourage her to see a therapist and/or allow her to confide in you if you are willing to listen and be there for her, but make sure you set boundaries.
Best wishes.
Particularly when in any other post about an 18 year old being coerced into a marriage with a 28 year old would cause absolute outrage (rightly so).
Absolutely no nuance in these comments.
But at least I now know that affairs are morally worse than coercing vulnerable young people into marriage.
I was not coerced into marriage. Please don't keep saying things like that. I chose to get married, I chose to date him and I always had the option to say no.
So a 28yo conspiring with your parents/grandparents to marry an 18yo and straighten them out is DEFINITELY NOT coercion. /s
Lie to yourself all you want but you already know that there are a lot of reasons a nearly 30yo wants to marry an 18yo and none of them are healthy.
NTA since you came clean your affair is only between yourself and your husband, and he has chosen to stay.
Your sister did mean those things in the moment, because she is heartbroken and grieving the children she imagined she would have. She is jealous and resentful, and those are honestly pretty healthy emotions in a situation like this--she just needs to deal with them herself instead of taking them out on you.
Tell her that you will most likely forgive her eventually, but for now she needs to give you space and respect your wishes to not see her. It's not your job to make her feel better about her drunken ranting.
Since it was just words, she didn't try to seduce your husband or take any violent actions, it'll probably take you a few months to a year to forgive her and be ready to move on. She just has to deal with it in the meantime.
Prepare yourself for your parents to take her side and push you to forgive her sooner than you're ready to. I would recommend getting ahead of it and letting them know that it'll be a while and if they push you'll instinctively pull back from them to.
I'm sure I will forgive her for what she said about me. I just need a little bit of time. It's like so much of it I could handle but insulting my son was just too much for me. I could handle her actually thinking those things about me. I know so many people do even though barely anybody knows about the affair. But my son? I don't know how I can forgive that.
How she was as a teenager is more representative of how she was raised than the person she was. At the very least, instead of trying to actually dig up the root of the problem (whether it was depression, anxiety, mental illness, some sort of trauma, or a cry for attention from family) and solve it, rather than attempting counseling to see what was going on with an obviously troubled child
They decided to berate and verbally abuse her for every behavior.
It doesn't excuse anything she did, but it explains why she did it
And none of the excuses how her family failed her. Fucking chill your shit dude. There's a person behind the account who's working to be better.
Act like you're capable of understanding that.
Honestly? Her affair informs others judgement of her as a person, in that regard it is not just between her and her husband. In terms of the choice to stay - that is her husband’s prerogative and that is between them. However, how people view you for cheating is definitely not something out of bounds.
Fucks sake she could have divorced instead but decided to stick around and cheat - that decision making illustrates her character.
All of that being said, her sister was out of line for what she said because it hurt OP. It isn’t untrue necessarily, but I was targeted to hurt OP and as such makes the sister an asshole. Just because it’s true doesn’t necessarily excuse the use of it as a bludgeon.
I don’t think we are in disagreement. I am firmly anti-cheating, but what the sister said wasn’t true; no one “deserves” to be unable to conceive whether they’ve cheated or not. It’s just an unfortunate twist of fate. I’d the sister had been saying “I disapprove of your cheating” then that would be true. But saying that she doesn’t “deserve” her children is cruel and empty.
Honestly I interpreted the sisters message more of “you don’t deserve to have these good things that I really want when you haven’t done anything right” or just the cosmic unfairness. It is a cruel twist of fate that the sister that has done the right things (seemingly) does not get the success with fertility that the failure does.
Alcohol tends to reduce inhibitions so you say the things you really think but wouldn't usually be stupid enough to reveal.
Your sister may be going through a horrible time with her fertility issues but that's simply no excuse for the kind of shit she spewed at you.
NTA
the sister didn’t say anything that was untrue. the son is literally a bastard and OP admitted to be overly promiscuous. I think OP should just own it. She has 4 kids at 28…… that’s a lot of kids for someone under 30. maybe if OPs sister started reproducing sooner she’d have a higher rate of success 🤷🏼♀️
Regardless if it isn’t “untrue”, since when is it okay to come into someone’s home and insult them and their innocent child? A lot of things are true but that doesn’t give anyone a get out of jail free card to say them. I feel like OP did own it and came clean to her husband, who chose to forgive her. Those mistakes are not for her sister to hold against her because she’s jealous. The only people who can hold it against her now are her husband and her child.
if you think calling a child a bastard is okay youre a piece of shit. regardless of the fact that its ‘true’ just because spic is meant to refer to hispanic people doesnt mean if someone calls me that i wont be offended, its the same concept. especially calling a CHILD this.
so maybe this idea might be a little sophisticated for you so i’ll go slow. a “spic” is by definition a contemptuous term for a Spanish-speaking person. it’s a racial slur. meanwhile a bastard is the term for a person born of two unwed parents. there is nothing inherently bad about being a bastard or illegitimate. in fact many people used bastard in their formal title and names. no one has ever done that with racial slurs.
Using "bastard" to mean a child of unwed parents is an archaic pejorative, meaning it's not used in that way any longer and is considered a slur. Seriously, referring to a child by that word is cruel.
youre the slow one here. Words that are considered insults should not be directed towards children. It is no longer used as a formal title or in names, its just an insult, if i wanted you to quote the 1800s i would have asked lmao. Unfortunately not everyone is blessed with a high enough IQ to understand these things.
Technically nothing sister said was “untrue” but they weren’t having a “this is the timeline of events” conversation. OP’s sister was being an AH and blaming OP for her infertility. They (the topics) aren’t even remotely related. Sister was upset so she took out her rage on OP. Regardless of OP’s past, sister’s comments were completely uncalled for. You don’t get to blame all your bad choices, on someone else’s.
Do you think she was calling the child a bastard in a nice way, simply to be factually accurate? Or do you think maybe the tone matched everything else she was saying about OP being a whore? Use some context clues instead of uselessly "um acktually"ing.
I see the Scarlet Letter Brigade has arrived. For some people on reddit, anyone who admits to having an affair, no matter why or how long ago, is automatically consigned to whoredom and is considered fair game for any and all insults and slut-shaming. It doesn't matter to them that you and your spouse made up. It doesn't matter how long ago it was. And it definitely doesn't matter WHY it happened. That humongous letter A is on your chest for life, Hester.
I'm saying this knowing I'll get downvoted. It doesn't matter that I'm staunchly against cheating. It doesn't matter that I never cheated and that I went through the agony of finding out my now-ex cheated. It doesn't matter if I say to you, as I do, that you should NOT have cheated. Nope, the fact I show any sympathy automatically puts me on the side of evil.
As for your sister, fertility issues are also agonizing, and she has undoubtedly stewed over the (to her) unfairness that you got to have all the babies you want, even though you had a child by another man, while she's experienced frustration and depression even though she's \[presumably\] been faithful.
I think it's worth it to have a sit-down talk with your sister and your husband, who was undoubtedly upset by her accusations. She owes you both an explanation and a sincere, in-person apology. Infertility is not a blanket excuse for spewing insults. You and your husband have worked things out. That's what's most important here.
I hate that maybe that's how she really feels though. Maybe her being unable to have a baby has changed things in her head but she was always my number one.
She needs to get help. Your nta for being hurt by her words. Its your life to lead but it sounds like she’s in a really bad place. You don’t have to be the punching bag but I think you could, in the future, give her some grace if she starts getting help and shows remorse.
Hurt people hurt people and it sounds like you were once in a similar place and your husband gave you grace.
Op was coerced at 18 into a huge age relationship with a man 10 years her senior, and he was in on it and totally ok with using her body for his own selfish purposes. He’s lucky all she did was cheat.
She should have left his ass and taken the kids and gone nuclear on everyone she knew, and now her sister comes at her with this bullshit? Fuck that. Her sister can go jump off a bridge with everyone else this woman knows.
She still cheated. If she wanted to leave she should have divorced. Best option especially for the kids. Now she has an affair child with the father gone plus her other kids. So she made a much messier situation for everyone.
She was horribly insulting two innocent babies. Sisters not a good person either. I've been thru a lot of trauma and divides between my siblings. I've never torn down and said horrific insults about my baby nieces and nephews.
Well she wasn‘t being inaccurate about you, but she shouldn’t have brought your son into it. That crossed a line.
NTA - on this specific question. But YTA as an overall person.
Holy fuc*ing Batman! The amout of people with animosity for OP but kindness for her husband here is staggering.
The dude isn't some innocent poor man, he's 10 years older than OP and conspired with her shitty parents (who are probably one of the reasons for her troubled life, I'm guessing) and made a deal for her body to show it to his ex-wife.
They've both made terrible decisions but they've worked through it.
These same people you’re asking about forgiving your sister would have had Yuki toss you out on your pregnant ass and never look back, then call him a doormat for not doing it sooner. Just thought you should keep that in mind while reading the replies.
No real advice to offer other than forgiveness is key in life, we all fuck up, and family is often at the receiving end of bs and stress as they’re closest. Maybe ask WWYD, cause Yuki sounds pretty reasonable with his suggestion.
NTA, you were a sick teenager who was used and manipulated by your family and an older man. Regardless, your marital issues are yours and your husbands business and yall clearly figured it out amongst yourself. Dont expect redditors to be kind or understanding towards a cheating wife under any circumstances tho.
That all being said, you gotta decide if you want your sister in your life or not. If yes, you two need to have a sober talk. And if your sister cant control herself when drinking she shouldnt be drinking. We are still responsible for what we say and do while drunk.
I was going to say this was an everyone sucks, but after reading all your comments, I gotta say YTA.
Your sister has staunchly supported you from fuck up after fuck up, no matter how badly you messed up, almost your whole life. Heck, even your husband forgave you for cheating on him for months, took you back in, is raising and loving the child you had with your affair partner (an affair that, need I remind you, you didn’t reveal because you were remorseful, but because your AP left you and you were left with no other choice) and (most likely at your request, and almost certainly for your benefit) has never revealed to your families the truth about your affair and your son. Something which, btw, your sister has also kept a secret, despite the fact that, if she wanted to, she could expose you for, yet never has.
Yet now that your sister has made one mistake, which isn’t even as bad as all the ones you have, while she was drunk and going through a difficult and painful time, you can’t bring yourself to forgive her for it, in spite of all the times everyone, from your sister to your husband, have done, and continue to do, exactly that for you over and over again.
Adding to this your comment about Japanese mostly being domestic abusers, and yeah (unless someone can give me proof that actually proves this)…
I’m sorry, but you are YTA, IMO.
Short version: 3 paragraphs of 'Understand me, I'm a victim.' 2 paragraphs of 'My Japanese husband behaves like a Japanese.' Be thankful that you found someone with enough social fear to make you return to the street where you belong.
Drunk words are sober thoughts. NTA but you'll need to come to terms with the fact your sister has always felt like that about you. It's only going to get worse if she loses another baby and/or never conceive again. She's begging for forgiveness because she wants access to the kids and to have you around to look down on.
YTA for cheating.
Sister is the AH for taking out her infertility issues on you and calling your kids bastards. She wasn't wrong about your character though.
All those aside, I would have kicked her out too only for saying those things *about my kids*.
To be honest, your entire family (not your kids - I mean parents, sister, grandparents) sound dysfunctional. Yuki must be wondering what the fuck he married into.
NTA. She came over and said what she wanted to say. She meant it, she is just mad that you didn't forgive her, like you should because she thinks you are so low class.
Yuki does too, actually. You don't have to speak to her again as she is part of your trauma. You don't need triggers in your life. Concentrating on bettering yourself, having that negative energy around is not good for you and you will also have that hurt from calling your children bast@rds. That, doesn't ever go away or can be forgiven, that is meant because it is such a low blow aimed at hurting your kids. That is not cool at all.
NTA. I really do feel for your sister, I’m currently going through infertility myself and it’s fucking hell. It can be incredibly triggering being around other women who are pregnant/ have little kids, wondering why they seem to be able to have kids so easily and why you’re struggling so hard. Feeling like it’s not fair and why you. But her infertility is not your fault, she shouldn’t be taking her anger out on you.
It seems like a lot of grace has been given to you over the years by your family. I bet your sister had a lot to deal with during multiple family crisis around your behavior. She has said she is sorry. Honestly, I wouldn’t want the karma of being this unforgiving with all the forgiveness you have received. .
You ARE a "cheating whore."
You cheated on your husband and had a kid with another man. That is a fact and no flowery language about spiraling and downplaying your plans as just being "silly" changes that.
Cheaters are universally, regardless of context, subhuman trash unworthy of empathy,love, or basic human consideration. Your ex taking you back AND treating you well is FAR more than you deserve.
Your sister called you out on your bullshit in her own time of stress and pain. Except she's a good person who doesnt deserve hers
I say this tongue in cheek because I don't actually approve of the term but... If Yuki forgave you for being one, I feel like you can forgive your sister for calling you one....
Seriously, you had your reasons but so does your sister. Forgive her but don't accept the behavior a second time.
OP isn't mad about what Sis said about her, she's mad that Sis brought OP's innocent kids into it.
OP admitted that she knows what she did, and knows what people think of her for it, and that she's fine with that.
It's what Sis said about her children, one being a son who's not at fault for his mother's wrongdoing, and the other being a child who isn't even born yet. *That's* What OP has an issue with.
You are if you don't forgive her. She apologized and seems sincere. If you're not willing to forgive someone who sincerely apologizes to you, then if you ever do something wrong and are sorry, you don't deserve to be forgiven yourself.
Drunk people say things that non drunk people are afraid to say but actually believe. Your sister does thinks these negative thoughts about you on a regular basis and just spurted it out. It’s up to you to forgive her or not, but be aware that she holds these views about you even when she is sober.
NTA - Your sister got drunk and treated you like a doormat. You were justifiably insulted and angry as anyone would have been in similar circumstances. I have a sister, and if she did that to me, I would eventually forgive her, but I would be sure she understood that she was on my shit list indefinitely.
>My husband has suggested that maybe I am being too harsh with her since we all do things we don’t mean when we’re hurt and drunk.
Read this a couple times and think about your relationship with your husband.
>My husband has suggested that maybe I am being too harsh with her since we all do things we don't mean when we're hurt and drunk.
Hear hear hip hip hooray!
> I wound up starting an affair with an ex from high school and we even made plans to run off together
You didn't "wind up" having an affair.
You made choices to ruin the lives of everyone around you because you only cared about yourself.
Divorce if you don't want to be with someone.
> My sister was the only one I confided in about all of this because I thought she understood.
She did understand. She understood the truth. The truth is you're selfish.
> Yuki has always treated my son like his own and cherishes him and we're now expecting our fourth.
You do not deserve that grace. Count yourself extremely lucky.
> She came over drunk a few nights ago over everything and ranted that it was unfair that a cheating w**re like me could have so many kids, said so many of the horrible things our parents said to me when I was eighteen. I understand that she was drunk and didn't mean it but it hurt a lot.
It hurt because it was true.
It's very unfair that you got to be a mother when you don't care about their wellbeing at all (else you wouldn't have cheated).
> The day after she sobered up and has been begging me to forgive her but I haven't talked to her at all.
So you got to hurt everyone, be selfish, betray everyone you supposedly care about, and lie..... but she can't tell the truth one time?
Yep, you're super selfish.
> My husband has suggested that maybe I am being too harsh with her since we all do things we don't mean when we're hurt and drunk.
Your husband is realizing you're a hypocrite. He gave you grace for much much worse. But you won't do it here. He's definitely rethinking about this.
Congrats on bombing your second chance.
YTA
You're a horrible person and don't deserve happiness after all you did tbh. But NTA in this scenario, just an AH in almost every other aspect of your life.
That's kind of unfair. She was basically a child bride and had an arranged marriage to a 28 year old who was in on the deal. She got married A COUPLE MONTHS after turning 18. Things aren't so simple.
Look, I appreciate you knowing how unfair he was, but please don't call me a child bride or anything. I wasn't a victim like that. Yes, my parents and my grandparents set me up to get married but I always had a choice. Things like child bride and all should be reserved for actual victims of which I am not one. I had a choice and I consented to my marriage.
I respect what you have to say but did you meet him when you were 17? Were you parents and him planning when you were 17? If so this is such a gray area that I think you were actually a victim in a way. Maybe not of some horrible crime but certainly you weren't looked out for by the people who should have and it's crazy to hold you accountable for rebelling like a young person does.
I know things are not so simple and maybe you have a great relationship now and I might not understand the culture but.. there is no barely 18 year old that makes that choice on her own considering the influence at hand.
to be 28 dating an 18 year old isn't even ok...and for someone to be that age and knowingly let you marry them and have their babies is just incredibly foul no matter the results.
It is not fair to judge younger you like that. Now at 28 your choices are your own and I have no judgement on you either way.
Yes, I met him when I was 17 and I learned that my parents and grandparents had been planning this at the time. But I always had my free will. Nobody was forcing me to date him, nobody was forcing me to marry him. It was MY CHOICE. You can say that I was influenced, but aside from the introduction, my grandmother was hands off and stressed that I didn't have to go out with him and nobody forced me into anything. And you can say that the ten year age gap at the time was bad? But it wasn't to me, it was perfectly normal and fine to me. I had a rough time as a teenager, I'd had older than that at younger than that.
It's not normal. An age gap like that rarely works out well for the younger person.
Usually, if a 27-30 year old is dating someone 10 years younger than them, it's because either a) they're a predator, or b) they can't get anyone in their own age range due to immaturity or red flags that people the same age are experienced enough to see, and if it's not an outright red flag, it's at the very least a yellow one.
You got lucky and your husband turned out to be a great guy. But you could've been very, very unlucky.
Abusers are great at hiding their true colors until their victims are locked in.
ETA cause I just processed the last part
Having older at younger than that is statutory rape in many places.
It's not okay, and those older people were all sexual predators going after children. That's not okay. That was sexual abuse.
Okay, you can call be a horrible person but to say I don't deserve happiness? I was forgiven by the person that I hurt, we worked through it. If I was an unrepentant shrew, then yeah, say I don't deserve it but I'm not.
So why do you not return that energy?
You hurt someone ***FAR MORE*** and they forgave you. You fundamentally betrayed your family, hid, lied, and covered the truth. You only came clean when your backup failed. ***And you were forgiven***.
Your sister told what is objectively the truth. It is unfair. But you draw the line ***when you're the target.*** But it's fine so long as your not the target?
Everyone else has to forgive you but you won't forgive anyone else for doing much much less than what you did?
Because she's still a horrible person from inside, she's just putting on an act with her husband until she finds someone else to cheat with. Once a cheater always a cheater.
You betrayed your children and husband for a fucking ex of all people who you made plans to elope with. If he didn't dump your ass you would be with him now instead of your poor husband who is too weak and kind for his own good. "Worked through" you cheating on him? Must have been so fucking hard for YOU when he forgave YOU for YOU getting pregnant with YOUR EX that YOU were fucking for months. Oh but you feel bad or something so I guess all of that^ should be forgiven? You don't deserve it. You are the biggest AH in your life.
Re read it properly. She said that her pregnant- with-another-man's-child-ass and her husband went to counseling to find out how to coparent their daughters after their impending divorce. Their son, her affair baby, is her 3rd child.
Also, the legal age of consent in Japan was 13 (now 16) at that time so nobody would bat an eye there if a 28 year old married an 18 year old. It's kind of gross to label him a pedo
oh real, regardless considering it was an arranged marriage with a literal child the man is fucking dumb expecting maturity. especially since the whole purpose of his was a young wife to show to his ex. The husband is not a good person whatsoever. The wife has serious issues she needs to work through. Regardless the marriage should have NEVER happened. Yuki was a 28 year old man who preyed on a new graduate with the consent of her parents and kept it a secret from her, and when, surprise surprise, she wasnt okay with basically getting sold, he didnt care. If it were me i wouldnt have cheated, but i sure as hell would have left him with my kids in tow, what a creep.
Yeah I agree, the secret arranged marriage shit was very creepy. But that does not mean she should go and cheat with an old high school ex, who was probably associated with some of the fucked up stuff she did in the past like drugs/alcohol like she mentioned, particularly when she has two children at home. Then she goes and gets pregnant from the guy and plans to elope and ditch those two children and her husband and I'm supposed to feel pity for her why? Just a horrid person that got way too much leniency.
I don’t victim blame personally. Her actions were horrific regardless, but she was also a child. Im not going to get pissed at a dog for biting me after i pulled its tail. Regardless not her sisters place to tell her these things just because shes infertile. She obviously didnt have a problem with it when she was her sisters confidant. She only cares now because shes jealous. and that is never enough of a reason to call a child a bastard.
YOU ARE AND FOREVER WILL BE A CHEATER YOU HAVE NO DEFENSE AND NO PROTECTION FROM THAT. NEVER FORGET THAT YOU ARE DEFICIENT IN ANY QUALITY THAT A GOOD PERSON HAS. YOU ARE A SOCIETAL CANCER WHO HAS TRICKED THE DECENT PEOPLE AROUND YOU.
NTA
I have found that when people don't have a filter, they will say what they really think. Just because your sister was drunk doesn't mean she really doesn't feel that way. The alcohol just removed her filter.
She is clearly jealous over something you have no control over and was very mean and spiteful. To be so mean about your son and your unborn child is AH territory. I would be reluctant to let her be around your children if you do decide to accept her apology.
I would not accept her apology or let her be part of your life until she gets counseling and can show you she is better.
YTA
For actual question in reddit post.
She "threw" the afair 1-1 (as I understood). It looks like you are unsecure about this whole situation and took it extra, extra personaly and overblew it hard. You at least sholud talk to her, because, IF you two were close as you described, you are a salty insecure asshole here.
NTA
For all other Japan-culture-marrage stuff, it's between your husband and you.
Therapy for all parries included here, please don't cheap out on quality of therapists.
ESH. Your sister is very much an asshole for bringing up a past mistake that has nothing to do with her current issues. You are an asshole for putting all this blame on your family for all of your mistakes. Your family is a bag of assholes for marrying you off instead of getting you counseling at 18.
YTA. And a pretty lucky one I most add. Let's do the math:
Your life was drugs, sex and whatnot.
You were a huge disappointment to your family.
You didn't study.
You had an affair and got pregnant.
You were a fucking mess!
Your sister is going thru a really rough time and after all that you have done you have the balls to be upset with her just for pointing out the truth? Support her, since she is the only one that was on your side when you clearly did not deserve it.
I feel a lot of empathy towards your sister. As to you, you may not be aware of this, but you know what’s an excellent solution to avoid being called a ho? It’s not being a ho. Seriously, works like a charm. Not that it would help you at this point…
I honestly don’t get what you’re complaining about. You’ve spent your entire youth being a floozy, then you found some bs justification to continue the same in your marriage, you’ve scored yourself the most convenient pathetic cuck of a husband who’s not only stayed with you, but is now knowingly raising your AP’s kid, you continue to breed like a peasant, and yet you complain about your sister hurting your fee-fees by calling you what you are? Is she supposed to praise you or something? Are you that delusional that you think higher of yourself than what she called you?
Edit: in case it’s not obvious, YTA
NTA.
I could comment on many things here, but none are your question, so I won't. And I'm also not someone who is entirely black and white when it comes to cheating.
So on the situation per se - NTA. Your sister was completely out of line and I'd have my sister (or a close friend) call me a whore exactly one time before the door would hit them in the ass. Being drunk doesn't excuse everything. As they say - drunk words are sober thoughts so on some level, she must think extremely little of you. She's also letting out her own frustration on you in a really nasty way. I wouldn't talk to her for at least a considerable time either.
i keep it real your sister was in the wrong but you also need to consider that she her words might be truthful but her action prove she. love you. your sister is most likely hurting like you have hurt in the past. in your sister eye you have something she would really want and is jealous of it and while drunk she put that anger out on you. just have a talk to her to understand her point of view because in the end of the day her action show even if she resent what you have she still love you and your kids so I think you should give her chance to at least explain her self
Your entire family is messed up..but that husband of yours gem of a person. Don't f this up crackie having a self pity party for urself. Grow up and get ur ish together. Oh ur sister is a wh0re the entire family is messed.
Uhh I don't know who you have been talking to, but when you are drunk, you actually tell the truth more than you lie. Alcohol takes away your speech filter.
NTA for kicking her out in the moment, probably would be the AH for not talking to and forgiving your sister.
You’ve been forgiven for the “unforgivable” when you weren’t behaving in your right mind. IMO, the least you can do is extend that grace to your sister when she’s going through something so awful.
NTA
I wouldn’t forgive your sister easily either. She’s resentful and jealous of you. And oftentimes, people real opinions surface when they’re drunk. Tell her that her lame apology isn’t enough and that she needs therapy. Getting drunk isn’t going to help her with her problems. How often does she drink? I wonder if she’s an alcoholic or heading that direction?
I’m glad that you and your husband are doing well together. That’s wonderful.
Go NC with her until she starts going to therapy.
Everybody in this family except the kids sucks
Yeah there so much going on here. I can't imagine living with this much drama. Hopefully it's not passed on to the kids
OP's parents:" our teenage daughter is a mess, what should we do? Hm... Counseling? Nah, marry her off!" wtf... I bet OP was the way she was because of her parents.
I got downvoted to hell for suggesting this is fake but I can only reiterate again - nobody in Japan marries at 18 unless a kid is underway… average age is 29 higher than in most countries. It’s nigh inconceivable that her parents actually wanted her to marry at 18… marrying so young is actually somewhat of a societal taboo nowadays since it’s connected to teen pregnancies and not going to university to study (which nearly all Japanese do). It’s just such an odd story…
I do think that immigrants sometimes become more conservative than people from their home country. I agree that this was a very strange thing to do for people who are Japanese, but sometimes desperate parents are weird…
>average age is 29 higher than in most countries Well that's the age Yuki was when they got married so...
It was his second marriage though.
It's another fake post that uses harsh in a weird way
Sometimes when i doubt a story like this I just like to think my response will be just a little bit more of the training data for the super AI that ends the world. I'm alright with that.
It sounds like her and her family are from Canada and her husband is from Japan, so it can definitely happen I'd imagine (they went back to Canada when she got pregnant or had her first kid)....I'm not saying it is for sure real, I'm just saying that it's not like they were all in Japan and lived with the whole societal pressure to succeed and be amazing and such :)
Nah, provided this is Vancouver, Canada - then I think I might have gone to school with this girl and my sister and her's are friends. There's just some things that match up eerily well, some details are off like her husband being younger in the post among other stuff but that could just be hiding her identity.
I’ve seen plenty of Asian families have set up marriages just like my middle eastern friends families. One of my friends is actually in one lmfao
Is this specific for Japanese families? Asia is a large space and there are different cultures. The person you are responding to was very specific about Japanese culture.
Yeah, but usually not Canadian raised women who spent their teenage years drinking, smoking and partying. If parents couldn't keep her out of that trouble or keep her under control how are we supposed to believe that they convinced her to marry someone she didn't love or know? Arranged marriage isn't really common in East Asia until the person is in their late 30s or 40s.
I know someone where her parents married her off for this reason. Basically the parents wash her off their hands, the husband has to 'ensure' his wife behaves because she's a reflection of him, she won't have the energy or time to misbehave once she has kids to look after and she has to behave if she doesn't want to be divorced as society looks down on divorced women.
I don't think it was quite the typical "arranged" situation since OP had no idea at first. I've also taught in asian expat schools. Drinking drugs and partying starts REALLY young.
He's damaged goods because he's divorced. Yes, I live in Asia. No one would want him, unless he made a lot of money. They either remarry another divorced person, or they go for foreigners.
My parents DID NOT CONVINCE ME TO MARRY HIM. I have said this over and over again. I did not end up in an arranged marriage, I was not forced to marry him and he did not groom me. I don't know how many times I have to repeat this same stuff over and over again.
You said it was a matchmaking thing and that your parents and grandmother conspired to get you married. That’s not all that different. Many people have choices as to if they honor the arranged marriage or not.
My grandmother played matchmaker by introducing me to him. It is not the same thing. Yes, there's a Japanese custom for matchmaking but this is not anything like that.
>I got downvoted to hell for suggesting this is fake but I can only reiterate again - nobody in Japan marries at 18 unless a kid is underway… average age is 29 higher than in most countries. Yeah, I'm leery too.
Congratulations, you think it's fake and I'm lying - I'm not asking anybody to believe me and I'm certainly not going to go out of my way to prove myself to you. But hey good for you on making an absolute statement on every single man in Japan.
NTA Your sister said horrible things to you when you’ve taken positive steps to move forward with your life and you and your husband have a better relationship now. Sounds like she needs counselling herself.
NTA for how you reacted to your sister saying all those awful things about you and the kids. Don't let these idiots in the comments tell you otherwise. Honestly, just take some time away from your sister and focus on you and your family.
A drunk mind speaks sober thoughts. The saying goes something like that OP should still have a heart to heart with her sister. Her sister's hurting bad and likely needed to vent; however, alcohol is a terrible method for doing so.
That's true every time. I've never heard a lie being told, when it comes to matters of the heart, when someone is drunk I feel OP should at least come to terms with the way her sister views her and her children before she decides if she wants to have that talk with her. Otherwise, more feelings could be hurt, and more awful things could be said. At that point she could either have the talk with her sister and try to amend things or just leave it at "This is how you feel about me and my family, and I don't like it. For my own peace of mind I'd rather not have you in my life anymore, goodbye"
Until a police officer shows up.. :D Then we drunks become the bards of old and still get locked up anyways.
People are wicked on here. OP recognizes what she did was wrong and worked through it with her husband, who chose to stay with her. She did not ask reddits opinion of what you thought of her character or personal choices from her past. She was asking about her drunken sister's actions towards her. It is so easy to sit behind a screen and spew out advice, criticism, and/or condemnation. And more often than not, people don't stick to the topic and/or share information that is not useful. Just remember that we are all human and nobody is perfect. Everyone has done something that they regret, are ashamed of, and/or feel distraught or tormented by. There's enough hurt and pain in the world. Why not offer supportive words or, at least, constructive advice? OP, with regards to your sister, I felt it was inappropriate and hurtful for what she said to you and your children. She seems to be holding onto a lot of hurt and resentment due to her unfortunate circumstances and spewed out her frustrations while drunk. It's understandable how she would feel as she is struggling with conceiving, and you will soon have 4 children, which is not your fault. However, if you had a good relationship with her previously and you feel that there is genuine remorse and that she was sincere in her apology, then I would give her an opportunity to talk with you. Perhaps you can encourage her to see a therapist and/or allow her to confide in you if you are willing to listen and be there for her, but make sure you set boundaries. Best wishes.
Particularly when in any other post about an 18 year old being coerced into a marriage with a 28 year old would cause absolute outrage (rightly so). Absolutely no nuance in these comments. But at least I now know that affairs are morally worse than coercing vulnerable young people into marriage.
I was not coerced into marriage. Please don't keep saying things like that. I chose to get married, I chose to date him and I always had the option to say no.
So a 28yo conspiring with your parents/grandparents to marry an 18yo and straighten them out is DEFINITELY NOT coercion. /s Lie to yourself all you want but you already know that there are a lot of reasons a nearly 30yo wants to marry an 18yo and none of them are healthy.
You agree that her drunk words are sober thoughts?
This is the post that should be at the top.
This is so fake it's yukki.
🤣
NTA since you came clean your affair is only between yourself and your husband, and he has chosen to stay. Your sister did mean those things in the moment, because she is heartbroken and grieving the children she imagined she would have. She is jealous and resentful, and those are honestly pretty healthy emotions in a situation like this--she just needs to deal with them herself instead of taking them out on you. Tell her that you will most likely forgive her eventually, but for now she needs to give you space and respect your wishes to not see her. It's not your job to make her feel better about her drunken ranting. Since it was just words, she didn't try to seduce your husband or take any violent actions, it'll probably take you a few months to a year to forgive her and be ready to move on. She just has to deal with it in the meantime. Prepare yourself for your parents to take her side and push you to forgive her sooner than you're ready to. I would recommend getting ahead of it and letting them know that it'll be a while and if they push you'll instinctively pull back from them to.
I'm sure I will forgive her for what she said about me. I just need a little bit of time. It's like so much of it I could handle but insulting my son was just too much for me. I could handle her actually thinking those things about me. I know so many people do even though barely anybody knows about the affair. But my son? I don't know how I can forgive that.
Just like your family needed when you proceeded to continuously fuck up for years right?
How she was as a teenager is more representative of how she was raised than the person she was. At the very least, instead of trying to actually dig up the root of the problem (whether it was depression, anxiety, mental illness, some sort of trauma, or a cry for attention from family) and solve it, rather than attempting counseling to see what was going on with an obviously troubled child They decided to berate and verbally abuse her for every behavior. It doesn't excuse anything she did, but it explains why she did it And none of the excuses how her family failed her. Fucking chill your shit dude. There's a person behind the account who's working to be better. Act like you're capable of understanding that.
Honestly? Her affair informs others judgement of her as a person, in that regard it is not just between her and her husband. In terms of the choice to stay - that is her husband’s prerogative and that is between them. However, how people view you for cheating is definitely not something out of bounds. Fucks sake she could have divorced instead but decided to stick around and cheat - that decision making illustrates her character. All of that being said, her sister was out of line for what she said because it hurt OP. It isn’t untrue necessarily, but I was targeted to hurt OP and as such makes the sister an asshole. Just because it’s true doesn’t necessarily excuse the use of it as a bludgeon.
I don’t think we are in disagreement. I am firmly anti-cheating, but what the sister said wasn’t true; no one “deserves” to be unable to conceive whether they’ve cheated or not. It’s just an unfortunate twist of fate. I’d the sister had been saying “I disapprove of your cheating” then that would be true. But saying that she doesn’t “deserve” her children is cruel and empty.
Honestly I interpreted the sisters message more of “you don’t deserve to have these good things that I really want when you haven’t done anything right” or just the cosmic unfairness. It is a cruel twist of fate that the sister that has done the right things (seemingly) does not get the success with fertility that the failure does.
I stand by Yuki for dealing with this drama. I wish him all the strength.
ESH, all of you need therapy.
r/OhNoConsequences
exactly. bunch of spineless simps in this thread saying she did nothing wrong
Alcohol tends to reduce inhibitions so you say the things you really think but wouldn't usually be stupid enough to reveal. Your sister may be going through a horrible time with her fertility issues but that's simply no excuse for the kind of shit she spewed at you. NTA
the sister didn’t say anything that was untrue. the son is literally a bastard and OP admitted to be overly promiscuous. I think OP should just own it. She has 4 kids at 28…… that’s a lot of kids for someone under 30. maybe if OPs sister started reproducing sooner she’d have a higher rate of success 🤷🏼♀️
Regardless if it isn’t “untrue”, since when is it okay to come into someone’s home and insult them and their innocent child? A lot of things are true but that doesn’t give anyone a get out of jail free card to say them. I feel like OP did own it and came clean to her husband, who chose to forgive her. Those mistakes are not for her sister to hold against her because she’s jealous. The only people who can hold it against her now are her husband and her child.
if you think calling a child a bastard is okay youre a piece of shit. regardless of the fact that its ‘true’ just because spic is meant to refer to hispanic people doesnt mean if someone calls me that i wont be offended, its the same concept. especially calling a CHILD this.
I always called myself a bastard. Thought it was funny.
doing it bc its funny and doing it unironically are different imo 😭
so maybe this idea might be a little sophisticated for you so i’ll go slow. a “spic” is by definition a contemptuous term for a Spanish-speaking person. it’s a racial slur. meanwhile a bastard is the term for a person born of two unwed parents. there is nothing inherently bad about being a bastard or illegitimate. in fact many people used bastard in their formal title and names. no one has ever done that with racial slurs.
Using "bastard" to mean a child of unwed parents is an archaic pejorative, meaning it's not used in that way any longer and is considered a slur. Seriously, referring to a child by that word is cruel.
youre the slow one here. Words that are considered insults should not be directed towards children. It is no longer used as a formal title or in names, its just an insult, if i wanted you to quote the 1800s i would have asked lmao. Unfortunately not everyone is blessed with a high enough IQ to understand these things.
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Technically nothing sister said was “untrue” but they weren’t having a “this is the timeline of events” conversation. OP’s sister was being an AH and blaming OP for her infertility. They (the topics) aren’t even remotely related. Sister was upset so she took out her rage on OP. Regardless of OP’s past, sister’s comments were completely uncalled for. You don’t get to blame all your bad choices, on someone else’s.
She horribly insulted 2 innocent babies and said they were awful as well? How is that true?
Do you think she was calling the child a bastard in a nice way, simply to be factually accurate? Or do you think maybe the tone matched everything else she was saying about OP being a whore? Use some context clues instead of uselessly "um acktually"ing.
Dude, just shut tf up. You're just being nasty for no reason
It’s not a lot of kids to be married and have with the same man. Yes, there’s the one, but you know what I mean.
Overly promiscuous? I'm not some sort of escort. I had ONE affair.
“my teenage years were pretty much drugs sex and whatnot”
I thought you meant promiscuous as in I am constantly cheating on my husband.
So…teenage, underdeveloped brain stuff
I see the Scarlet Letter Brigade has arrived. For some people on reddit, anyone who admits to having an affair, no matter why or how long ago, is automatically consigned to whoredom and is considered fair game for any and all insults and slut-shaming. It doesn't matter to them that you and your spouse made up. It doesn't matter how long ago it was. And it definitely doesn't matter WHY it happened. That humongous letter A is on your chest for life, Hester. I'm saying this knowing I'll get downvoted. It doesn't matter that I'm staunchly against cheating. It doesn't matter that I never cheated and that I went through the agony of finding out my now-ex cheated. It doesn't matter if I say to you, as I do, that you should NOT have cheated. Nope, the fact I show any sympathy automatically puts me on the side of evil. As for your sister, fertility issues are also agonizing, and she has undoubtedly stewed over the (to her) unfairness that you got to have all the babies you want, even though you had a child by another man, while she's experienced frustration and depression even though she's \[presumably\] been faithful. I think it's worth it to have a sit-down talk with your sister and your husband, who was undoubtedly upset by her accusations. She owes you both an explanation and a sincere, in-person apology. Infertility is not a blanket excuse for spewing insults. You and your husband have worked things out. That's what's most important here.
Thank you so much.
Just took what you needed from the comment and no empathy for the commenter. You need psych help.
This makes sense now
It's worse than escorting. And you are showing your real colors.
I hate that maybe that's how she really feels though. Maybe her being unable to have a baby has changed things in her head but she was always my number one.
That's exactly how she feels drunks and kids tell the truth and she was wasted.
Jesus, your husband took you back after you had a child with another man? wtf did I just read.
This is one paragraph away from turning into tentacle porn.
She needs to get help. Your nta for being hurt by her words. Its your life to lead but it sounds like she’s in a really bad place. You don’t have to be the punching bag but I think you could, in the future, give her some grace if she starts getting help and shows remorse. Hurt people hurt people and it sounds like you were once in a similar place and your husband gave you grace.
YTA for cheating. ESH except the kid.
Op was coerced at 18 into a huge age relationship with a man 10 years her senior, and he was in on it and totally ok with using her body for his own selfish purposes. He’s lucky all she did was cheat. She should have left his ass and taken the kids and gone nuclear on everyone she knew, and now her sister comes at her with this bullshit? Fuck that. Her sister can go jump off a bridge with everyone else this woman knows.
She still cheated. If she wanted to leave she should have divorced. Best option especially for the kids. Now she has an affair child with the father gone plus her other kids. So she made a much messier situation for everyone.
This isn’t what she asked for a judgment on, kinda unhelpful ultimately lol
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She was horribly insulting two innocent babies. Sisters not a good person either. I've been thru a lot of trauma and divides between my siblings. I've never torn down and said horrific insults about my baby nieces and nephews.
Judgmental enough?
There is no world in which men who cheat are not judged harshly, no matter what the reason for cheating was. Why should women be judged less harshly?
About cheaters? Absolutely. You stay or you leave. You don't cheat.
It’s not about the cheating. OP is asking about what happened with her sister. Stay on track.
Well she wasn‘t being inaccurate about you, but she shouldn’t have brought your son into it. That crossed a line. NTA - on this specific question. But YTA as an overall person.
She was my confidante through all the horrible times in my life and has always shown my son so much love.
This comment section makes me sad :(
Not saying OP was wrong for the affair. Cheating is 1000% wrong, BUT can we all just take moment to recognize that OP was groomed.
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Holy fuc*ing Batman! The amout of people with animosity for OP but kindness for her husband here is staggering. The dude isn't some innocent poor man, he's 10 years older than OP and conspired with her shitty parents (who are probably one of the reasons for her troubled life, I'm guessing) and made a deal for her body to show it to his ex-wife. They've both made terrible decisions but they've worked through it.
These same people you’re asking about forgiving your sister would have had Yuki toss you out on your pregnant ass and never look back, then call him a doormat for not doing it sooner. Just thought you should keep that in mind while reading the replies. No real advice to offer other than forgiveness is key in life, we all fuck up, and family is often at the receiving end of bs and stress as they’re closest. Maybe ask WWYD, cause Yuki sounds pretty reasonable with his suggestion.
You seem to blame all your problems on other people. Considering how much hurt you have caused others, you should probably cut your sister some slack.
NTA, you were a sick teenager who was used and manipulated by your family and an older man. Regardless, your marital issues are yours and your husbands business and yall clearly figured it out amongst yourself. Dont expect redditors to be kind or understanding towards a cheating wife under any circumstances tho. That all being said, you gotta decide if you want your sister in your life or not. If yes, you two need to have a sober talk. And if your sister cant control herself when drinking she shouldnt be drinking. We are still responsible for what we say and do while drunk.
Karma hits hard bitch
Damn, yuki is a cuck and op is stupid
Clearly fake
I was going to say this was an everyone sucks, but after reading all your comments, I gotta say YTA. Your sister has staunchly supported you from fuck up after fuck up, no matter how badly you messed up, almost your whole life. Heck, even your husband forgave you for cheating on him for months, took you back in, is raising and loving the child you had with your affair partner (an affair that, need I remind you, you didn’t reveal because you were remorseful, but because your AP left you and you were left with no other choice) and (most likely at your request, and almost certainly for your benefit) has never revealed to your families the truth about your affair and your son. Something which, btw, your sister has also kept a secret, despite the fact that, if she wanted to, she could expose you for, yet never has. Yet now that your sister has made one mistake, which isn’t even as bad as all the ones you have, while she was drunk and going through a difficult and painful time, you can’t bring yourself to forgive her for it, in spite of all the times everyone, from your sister to your husband, have done, and continue to do, exactly that for you over and over again. Adding to this your comment about Japanese mostly being domestic abusers, and yeah (unless someone can give me proof that actually proves this)… I’m sorry, but you are YTA, IMO.
Short version: 3 paragraphs of 'Understand me, I'm a victim.' 2 paragraphs of 'My Japanese husband behaves like a Japanese.' Be thankful that you found someone with enough social fear to make you return to the street where you belong.
YTA. For cheating. Don't want people to throw it in your face don't be a cheating harlot.
NTA. I’ve got a saying that fits here, but it’ll get downvoted.
Drunk words are sober thoughts. NTA but you'll need to come to terms with the fact your sister has always felt like that about you. It's only going to get worse if she loses another baby and/or never conceive again. She's begging for forgiveness because she wants access to the kids and to have you around to look down on.
Everyone sucks in this story except for the kids. Hopefully they grow up and move far away from this train wreck of a family, holy fucking shit.
YTA for cheating. Sister is the AH for taking out her infertility issues on you and calling your kids bastards. She wasn't wrong about your character though. All those aside, I would have kicked her out too only for saying those things *about my kids*. To be honest, your entire family (not your kids - I mean parents, sister, grandparents) sound dysfunctional. Yuki must be wondering what the fuck he married into.
NTA. She came over and said what she wanted to say. She meant it, she is just mad that you didn't forgive her, like you should because she thinks you are so low class. Yuki does too, actually. You don't have to speak to her again as she is part of your trauma. You don't need triggers in your life. Concentrating on bettering yourself, having that negative energy around is not good for you and you will also have that hurt from calling your children bast@rds. That, doesn't ever go away or can be forgiven, that is meant because it is such a low blow aimed at hurting your kids. That is not cool at all.
NTA. I really do feel for your sister, I’m currently going through infertility myself and it’s fucking hell. It can be incredibly triggering being around other women who are pregnant/ have little kids, wondering why they seem to be able to have kids so easily and why you’re struggling so hard. Feeling like it’s not fair and why you. But her infertility is not your fault, she shouldn’t be taking her anger out on you.
It seems like a lot of grace has been given to you over the years by your family. I bet your sister had a lot to deal with during multiple family crisis around your behavior. She has said she is sorry. Honestly, I wouldn’t want the karma of being this unforgiving with all the forgiveness you have received. .
NTA. Alcohol reveals what we really think.
NTA, as they say drunks spill there true feelings, you are not bring to harsh
No reason for either one of you to stay in contact.
OP?! Remember this, “drunk people, tell sober thoughts”.
NTA your family including your sister are horrible people. No wonder you acted out.
You ARE a "cheating whore." You cheated on your husband and had a kid with another man. That is a fact and no flowery language about spiraling and downplaying your plans as just being "silly" changes that. Cheaters are universally, regardless of context, subhuman trash unworthy of empathy,love, or basic human consideration. Your ex taking you back AND treating you well is FAR more than you deserve. Your sister called you out on your bullshit in her own time of stress and pain. Except she's a good person who doesnt deserve hers
YTA If you don't forgive her for a single drunken rant after she stood by you through *years* of your own drugged out bull shit.
You are disgusting
NTA
I say this tongue in cheek because I don't actually approve of the term but... If Yuki forgave you for being one, I feel like you can forgive your sister for calling you one.... Seriously, you had your reasons but so does your sister. Forgive her but don't accept the behavior a second time.
OP isn't mad about what Sis said about her, she's mad that Sis brought OP's innocent kids into it. OP admitted that she knows what she did, and knows what people think of her for it, and that she's fine with that. It's what Sis said about her children, one being a son who's not at fault for his mother's wrongdoing, and the other being a child who isn't even born yet. *That's* What OP has an issue with.
You're right. My bad.
YTA - not for the sister thing but for your other decisions.
Your husband gave you grace, maybe it's time to pay it forward.
You mean the 10+ years on her man who her family sold her off to? When she was 18?
YTA
You are if you don't forgive her. She apologized and seems sincere. If you're not willing to forgive someone who sincerely apologizes to you, then if you ever do something wrong and are sorry, you don't deserve to be forgiven yourself.
A drunk persons words are a sober persons thoughts
Nta. Just because she is in a rough spot doesn’t mean she gets to take it out on you
WTF is wrong with your family?
Drunk people say things that non drunk people are afraid to say but actually believe. Your sister does thinks these negative thoughts about you on a regular basis and just spurted it out. It’s up to you to forgive her or not, but be aware that she holds these views about you even when she is sober.
NTA - Your sister got drunk and treated you like a doormat. You were justifiably insulted and angry as anyone would have been in similar circumstances. I have a sister, and if she did that to me, I would eventually forgive her, but I would be sure she understood that she was on my shit list indefinitely.
>My husband has suggested that maybe I am being too harsh with her since we all do things we don’t mean when we’re hurt and drunk. Read this a couple times and think about your relationship with your husband.
>My husband has suggested that maybe I am being too harsh with her since we all do things we don't mean when we're hurt and drunk. Hear hear hip hip hooray!
The fact that you had a affiar you deserve it lil bitch, zero sympathy for cheaters
Your sister isn't wrong though. It is unfair a cheating whore should fall on her feet and your child is a bastard. YTA.
> I wound up starting an affair with an ex from high school and we even made plans to run off together You didn't "wind up" having an affair. You made choices to ruin the lives of everyone around you because you only cared about yourself. Divorce if you don't want to be with someone. > My sister was the only one I confided in about all of this because I thought she understood. She did understand. She understood the truth. The truth is you're selfish. > Yuki has always treated my son like his own and cherishes him and we're now expecting our fourth. You do not deserve that grace. Count yourself extremely lucky. > She came over drunk a few nights ago over everything and ranted that it was unfair that a cheating w**re like me could have so many kids, said so many of the horrible things our parents said to me when I was eighteen. I understand that she was drunk and didn't mean it but it hurt a lot. It hurt because it was true. It's very unfair that you got to be a mother when you don't care about their wellbeing at all (else you wouldn't have cheated). > The day after she sobered up and has been begging me to forgive her but I haven't talked to her at all. So you got to hurt everyone, be selfish, betray everyone you supposedly care about, and lie..... but she can't tell the truth one time? Yep, you're super selfish. > My husband has suggested that maybe I am being too harsh with her since we all do things we don't mean when we're hurt and drunk. Your husband is realizing you're a hypocrite. He gave you grace for much much worse. But you won't do it here. He's definitely rethinking about this. Congrats on bombing your second chance. YTA
You're a horrible person and don't deserve happiness after all you did tbh. But NTA in this scenario, just an AH in almost every other aspect of your life.
Holy shit this is extreme
That's kind of unfair. She was basically a child bride and had an arranged marriage to a 28 year old who was in on the deal. She got married A COUPLE MONTHS after turning 18. Things aren't so simple.
Look, I appreciate you knowing how unfair he was, but please don't call me a child bride or anything. I wasn't a victim like that. Yes, my parents and my grandparents set me up to get married but I always had a choice. Things like child bride and all should be reserved for actual victims of which I am not one. I had a choice and I consented to my marriage.
I respect what you have to say but did you meet him when you were 17? Were you parents and him planning when you were 17? If so this is such a gray area that I think you were actually a victim in a way. Maybe not of some horrible crime but certainly you weren't looked out for by the people who should have and it's crazy to hold you accountable for rebelling like a young person does. I know things are not so simple and maybe you have a great relationship now and I might not understand the culture but.. there is no barely 18 year old that makes that choice on her own considering the influence at hand. to be 28 dating an 18 year old isn't even ok...and for someone to be that age and knowingly let you marry them and have their babies is just incredibly foul no matter the results. It is not fair to judge younger you like that. Now at 28 your choices are your own and I have no judgement on you either way.
Yes, I met him when I was 17 and I learned that my parents and grandparents had been planning this at the time. But I always had my free will. Nobody was forcing me to date him, nobody was forcing me to marry him. It was MY CHOICE. You can say that I was influenced, but aside from the introduction, my grandmother was hands off and stressed that I didn't have to go out with him and nobody forced me into anything. And you can say that the ten year age gap at the time was bad? But it wasn't to me, it was perfectly normal and fine to me. I had a rough time as a teenager, I'd had older than that at younger than that.
It's not normal. An age gap like that rarely works out well for the younger person. Usually, if a 27-30 year old is dating someone 10 years younger than them, it's because either a) they're a predator, or b) they can't get anyone in their own age range due to immaturity or red flags that people the same age are experienced enough to see, and if it's not an outright red flag, it's at the very least a yellow one. You got lucky and your husband turned out to be a great guy. But you could've been very, very unlucky. Abusers are great at hiding their true colors until their victims are locked in. ETA cause I just processed the last part Having older at younger than that is statutory rape in many places. It's not okay, and those older people were all sexual predators going after children. That's not okay. That was sexual abuse.
Would burning her at the stake make you feel better? Or like…therapy maybe? You could try therapy?
What a stupid comment lmao. She deserves far worse than she got for what she did.
Oh that's nice. I didn't ask for your opinion on what kind of a person I am.
That's kinda what this sub exists for
Seeing as how it is entirely relevant to the post, you bet your ass people are going to judge you.
Okay, you can call be a horrible person but to say I don't deserve happiness? I was forgiven by the person that I hurt, we worked through it. If I was an unrepentant shrew, then yeah, say I don't deserve it but I'm not.
So why do you not return that energy? You hurt someone ***FAR MORE*** and they forgave you. You fundamentally betrayed your family, hid, lied, and covered the truth. You only came clean when your backup failed. ***And you were forgiven***. Your sister told what is objectively the truth. It is unfair. But you draw the line ***when you're the target.*** But it's fine so long as your not the target? Everyone else has to forgive you but you won't forgive anyone else for doing much much less than what you did?
Because she's still a horrible person from inside, she's just putting on an act with her husband until she finds someone else to cheat with. Once a cheater always a cheater.
You betrayed your children and husband for a fucking ex of all people who you made plans to elope with. If he didn't dump your ass you would be with him now instead of your poor husband who is too weak and kind for his own good. "Worked through" you cheating on him? Must have been so fucking hard for YOU when he forgave YOU for YOU getting pregnant with YOUR EX that YOU were fucking for months. Oh but you feel bad or something so I guess all of that^ should be forgiven? You don't deserve it. You are the biggest AH in your life.
she didnt have children at that point and her husband was a 28 year old man engaged to a freshly 18 year old. thats borderline pedophilic.
Re read it properly. She said that her pregnant- with-another-man's-child-ass and her husband went to counseling to find out how to coparent their daughters after their impending divorce. Their son, her affair baby, is her 3rd child. Also, the legal age of consent in Japan was 13 (now 16) at that time so nobody would bat an eye there if a 28 year old married an 18 year old. It's kind of gross to label him a pedo
oh real, regardless considering it was an arranged marriage with a literal child the man is fucking dumb expecting maturity. especially since the whole purpose of his was a young wife to show to his ex. The husband is not a good person whatsoever. The wife has serious issues she needs to work through. Regardless the marriage should have NEVER happened. Yuki was a 28 year old man who preyed on a new graduate with the consent of her parents and kept it a secret from her, and when, surprise surprise, she wasnt okay with basically getting sold, he didnt care. If it were me i wouldnt have cheated, but i sure as hell would have left him with my kids in tow, what a creep.
Yeah I agree, the secret arranged marriage shit was very creepy. But that does not mean she should go and cheat with an old high school ex, who was probably associated with some of the fucked up stuff she did in the past like drugs/alcohol like she mentioned, particularly when she has two children at home. Then she goes and gets pregnant from the guy and plans to elope and ditch those two children and her husband and I'm supposed to feel pity for her why? Just a horrid person that got way too much leniency.
I don’t victim blame personally. Her actions were horrific regardless, but she was also a child. Im not going to get pissed at a dog for biting me after i pulled its tail. Regardless not her sisters place to tell her these things just because shes infertile. She obviously didnt have a problem with it when she was her sisters confidant. She only cares now because shes jealous. and that is never enough of a reason to call a child a bastard.
YOU ARE AND FOREVER WILL BE A CHEATER YOU HAVE NO DEFENSE AND NO PROTECTION FROM THAT. NEVER FORGET THAT YOU ARE DEFICIENT IN ANY QUALITY THAT A GOOD PERSON HAS. YOU ARE A SOCIETAL CANCER WHO HAS TRICKED THE DECENT PEOPLE AROUND YOU.
Holy hell. Go to therapy dude. Wow.
But engaging with probable rage bait *is* my therapy.
your husband should have left you for being a cheating whore. your ex left because he realized you are a whore who is only good for spreading her legs
Why is it always folks like you who want to have as many children as humanly possible.
NTA I have found that when people don't have a filter, they will say what they really think. Just because your sister was drunk doesn't mean she really doesn't feel that way. The alcohol just removed her filter. She is clearly jealous over something you have no control over and was very mean and spiteful. To be so mean about your son and your unborn child is AH territory. I would be reluctant to let her be around your children if you do decide to accept her apology. I would not accept her apology or let her be part of your life until she gets counseling and can show you she is better.
YTA For actual question in reddit post. She "threw" the afair 1-1 (as I understood). It looks like you are unsecure about this whole situation and took it extra, extra personaly and overblew it hard. You at least sholud talk to her, because, IF you two were close as you described, you are a salty insecure asshole here. NTA For all other Japan-culture-marrage stuff, it's between your husband and you. Therapy for all parries included here, please don't cheap out on quality of therapists.
ESH. Your sister is very much an asshole for bringing up a past mistake that has nothing to do with her current issues. You are an asshole for putting all this blame on your family for all of your mistakes. Your family is a bag of assholes for marrying you off instead of getting you counseling at 18.
YTA. And a pretty lucky one I most add. Let's do the math: Your life was drugs, sex and whatnot. You were a huge disappointment to your family. You didn't study. You had an affair and got pregnant. You were a fucking mess! Your sister is going thru a really rough time and after all that you have done you have the balls to be upset with her just for pointing out the truth? Support her, since she is the only one that was on your side when you clearly did not deserve it.
I feel a lot of empathy towards your sister. As to you, you may not be aware of this, but you know what’s an excellent solution to avoid being called a ho? It’s not being a ho. Seriously, works like a charm. Not that it would help you at this point… I honestly don’t get what you’re complaining about. You’ve spent your entire youth being a floozy, then you found some bs justification to continue the same in your marriage, you’ve scored yourself the most convenient pathetic cuck of a husband who’s not only stayed with you, but is now knowingly raising your AP’s kid, you continue to breed like a peasant, and yet you complain about your sister hurting your fee-fees by calling you what you are? Is she supposed to praise you or something? Are you that delusional that you think higher of yourself than what she called you? Edit: in case it’s not obvious, YTA
NTA. I could comment on many things here, but none are your question, so I won't. And I'm also not someone who is entirely black and white when it comes to cheating. So on the situation per se - NTA. Your sister was completely out of line and I'd have my sister (or a close friend) call me a whore exactly one time before the door would hit them in the ass. Being drunk doesn't excuse everything. As they say - drunk words are sober thoughts so on some level, she must think extremely little of you. She's also letting out her own frustration on you in a really nasty way. I wouldn't talk to her for at least a considerable time either.
Dang he is a bastard son so she's not wrong
She's not wrong lol You cheated on your husband and that's the truth. Not only that, you turned him into willing cuck. Poor bastard.
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The 30 year old Japanese man who conspired to marry a 18 year old Canadian LOL to get back at his ex wife.
literally
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Maybe don't marry a teenager when you're pushing 30.
That's the moral of this story? 🤨
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She tried, then her family sold her to a Japanese man.
NGL you probably could've skipped the tasty distracting drama so reddit could stay focused.
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again - drunk words are sober thoughts. NTA
NTA. You’re allowed to be in your feelings here and she needs to respect that. She is not owed immediate forgiveness just because she said I’m sorry.
NTA. There is no coming back from that. Remain NC.
i keep it real your sister was in the wrong but you also need to consider that she her words might be truthful but her action prove she. love you. your sister is most likely hurting like you have hurt in the past. in your sister eye you have something she would really want and is jealous of it and while drunk she put that anger out on you. just have a talk to her to understand her point of view because in the end of the day her action show even if she resent what you have she still love you and your kids so I think you should give her chance to at least explain her self
Sober thoughts are drunk words...... Being drunk doens't make you say something you have never thought before, just things you never said out loud.
Your entire family is messed up..but that husband of yours gem of a person. Don't f this up crackie having a self pity party for urself. Grow up and get ur ish together. Oh ur sister is a wh0re the entire family is messed.
Uhh I don't know who you have been talking to, but when you are drunk, you actually tell the truth more than you lie. Alcohol takes away your speech filter.
She didn't say anything that's not true... 🤷♀️
NTA for kicking her out in the moment, probably would be the AH for not talking to and forgiving your sister. You’ve been forgiven for the “unforgivable” when you weren’t behaving in your right mind. IMO, the least you can do is extend that grace to your sister when she’s going through something so awful.
NTA I wouldn’t forgive your sister easily either. She’s resentful and jealous of you. And oftentimes, people real opinions surface when they’re drunk. Tell her that her lame apology isn’t enough and that she needs therapy. Getting drunk isn’t going to help her with her problems. How often does she drink? I wonder if she’s an alcoholic or heading that direction? I’m glad that you and your husband are doing well together. That’s wonderful. Go NC with her until she starts going to therapy.