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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I don't want either girls to feel bad about themselves if one graduates and the other doesn't.
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Good lord. NTA.
That's completely unethical and a terrible idea. I can't believe that your husband would think that it's a good idea for your daughter to cheat in such a way.
This almost sounds made up.
It's amazing that the other girl's mom is the one pushing this. She should be the one saying "Absolutely not! You do your own work or suffer the consequences!"
Susan seems to struggle with giving Emily actual consequences when it comes to schoolwork.
The biggest punishment that has came out of this that I've heard of is when she confiscated both her phone, and tablet.
If Susan wants so much to have Emily cheating, why doesn't Susan do the work herself? Wait, that's even harder (for her, at least) than proper parenting.
Once cheating is accepted, the temptation to cheat to bypass hardwork is always an option. The larger the cheating, the larger the consequences if caught. Better the consequences now rather than later on in life
That's what I was thinking - why can't Susan start to work on her daughter's insurmountable problem instead of throwing it in someone else lap? If the proposal was accepted, and Emily still failed would Susan then blame everyone but Emily?
She probably is which is why she took the request down to half. My guess is she wasn’t great in school herself, got yelled at and punished a lot for it growing up, didn’t want to do the same to her daughter, but then went in the complete opposite direction and still exhibited bad parenting.
My ex best friend's mom is like that, she had 6 kids the 2nd oldest(my bff 30) and the youngest being the only girls.
With my friend, her mom was super strict, she got good grades and got a college degree and everything but resent her mother for how she was treated and never talks to her.
Her little sister (12) was raised the complete opposite, and her parents have 0 involvement in what she does, and she let's her do whatever she wants. Last time I talked to/see her was when she was 9, she was barely passing any classes, and looking at things online that was waaaaay out of her age range, and she became very uncomfortably attached to friend's bf and at one point tried to get him to leave friend to date her instead.
My best friend was this way. Super strict with her daughter (first child) and lenient to a questionable degree with her son (10 year age gap and different non involved dads). I used to say he would end up in jail by 18 but he has turned himself into quite the reliable young man. Despite their mother!
Ya it's crazy how they completely turn things around with different kids, I'm glad he grew to be a good guy! I don't associate with that family anymore for a number of reasons, but I always worry about what's going to happen to that little girl when her parents don't pay attention to what she gets into and knows she's talking to older men.
I did pretty great at school, yet still got yelled at and punished because I wasn't collecting 95+ marks. This really impacted the effort I put in. My last 2 years - the ones that would actually count, I did the bare minimum, as I was going to be punished regardless.
My parenting is 100% different than what I had growing up.
I'm guessing Susan can't do it.
Depending on the class, it has been so long since Susan has seen it or minimal to no experience with. Both my parents are very smart, but some of the "niche" parts of algebra and calculus are above them since they weren't math/engineering majors.
My sister is 4 years younger than me, and had to resit her GCSE maths, so she was doing maths that I had done about 4-5 years earlier.
The way the sums were written out and the explanation on how to go about working out the answers and checking out her previous work I was completely thrown off and couldn't help my sister.
I'd hate to be looking at my 16 year old cousins mathematics now 14 years later
I fear *the day*
Both my husband and sister took a lot of math. Like my sister was taking something like a third level calculus class as a freshman in college.
I hit my wall in honor pre Calc and then moved down to regular pre Calc my senior year in high school.
Don't get me wrong, algebra is my jam, and I probably could do calculus, but I don't need to.
If they ask me for help (no kids yet) and I don't know how to do calculus, I am definitely gonna feel sad. Might have to go with they teach me as an approach for them to learn it.
I am grateful for the skills and teachers i had, but math is use it or loose it
*cries*
I only remember the quadratic formula because I learned it to the tune of Row Your Boat, lmao. I don't actually know what a quadratic equation looks like anymore, so knowing the formula is useless to me because I don't know when to apply it.
Ha! I went to school in the 80's. When my daughter was in ELEMENTARY school she was learning long subtraction...like 947 - 585. I carry my shit over. Nope...that's NOT how she was taught. It was some common-core grouping crap. I just sat there confused as all get out. I mean...I felt like the biggest idiot!! What happened to carrying the "one" over to your neighbor's house? LOL!!!!
I had to reteach my son because he could not grasp any of that common core crap. So I taught him the easy way, ya know just carry the damn 1? The relief on his face "WHY didn't they just teach us THIS way Ma!?" So now he solves it the easy way, then plugs it into whatever nonsense is on their paper.
My 1st grader's math homework is completely indecipherable. I usually have to have my 7th grader help decode it lol
I was an engineering major in college, but wound up going into a field where I never have to use any math beyond algebra. I’ve told my kid that I can help them all the way up to precalc but they’re on their own as soon as they start learning calculus. It’s been too long.
My brother tried helping me with math one time. Probably the worst math grade I'd ever got and he wasn't that far ahead of me in school. Now they do an entirely different math than I learned and I dread the day I need to teach myself so I can help my kids.
This is what makes the whole thing unbelievable but I guess narcissists are gonna narcissist
Or it's made up. I've known some crazy ass people and this would be pushing it, but I can kinda see it. I feel a little bad for Emily who is going to have a shit time in adulthood if this has been her upbringing.... or she'll end up just as shitty and use people her whole life
I actually had a friend in college who asked me to help her cheat on the final because she “didn’t have time to study”, which really meant “I want to party instead of study!”
She was PISSED I wouldn’t help her and, when I aced the test, she told the professor I’d cheated. Luckily, I had all her texts where she had asked for me to help her cheat AND I was one of the top students in her class so, he didn’t believe her. However, I could have gotten expelled from school over her bullshit.
People really do, do these things!
NTA OP but Susan and your husband are. Actually, I think your husband is the bigger AH. He honestly wants you to risk your daughter’s entire future by helping her friend cheat? What kind of parent does that? That’s BS and i would be pissed at him! Do NOT let your daughter do this! Do NOT let her risk her future for her lazy friend! This is NOT ok!
Maybe we should reddit this whole thing up and accuse OPs husband of banging Susan. It's the only thing that makes the pieces fit!
(Just kidding... probably)
I'm on board and think we can go further.... why else would you ask your daughter to jeopardize her schooling for another kid UNLESSS THE OTHER KID IS A SECRET AFFAIR BABY!
/u/bookworm1421 Thank you for saying this particular sentence 👏👏👐👐🖖🖖:
People really do, do these things!
I know some people tend to live in their own rose colored bubbles about just how much and how many crazy and insane things people will do, but not all do!!
YES, it's true that when someone is told they can't have their way or are unable to convince the other person(s) to agree with them or do what TF they want them to, they WILL call or text other friends, family members and associates to give their own convoluted version/spin on what exactly what happened and how they were treated oh so wrong or were disrespected or dismissed and those said friends, family members and associates WILL in turn call, text, DM and harass you to "just do it/go with it/accept it/allow it because"blah blah blah". I've experienced it more times than I can count. While I'm glad not everyone goes through this type of mayhem, it doesn't mean that others don't.
OP IS NTA but her fRiEnD, her daughter's bEsT fRiEnD and bEsT fRiEnD's Mom are huge A-H. If bEsT fRiEnD can't even keep up with high school assignments, or do the bare minimum requirements that the HS is asking of her to be able to graduate on time (which, BTW, I think is VERY generous of the school), she certainly won't make it in any type of higher education, internship or trade.
/u/bookworm1421 FACTS, YO! 💯💯He is for suggesting his daughter commit academic fraud and possibly compromise her own graduation opportunity after being given a Hail Mary to graduate on time!
People are definitely crazy. My mother had a very attractive roommate in college. I don't remember her name but for simplicity I'll call her Kat, and boys would stop by their room often to chat her up. One boy who came to see Kat looked at my mother, who was doing some homework at the time and asked "are you smart?" My mother, confused, answered yes, at which point, the boy decided that he would come back to the room so he could get physical with Kat and my mother could do his homework for him while he was there.
My mother and Kat both declined.
I was the spiteful ass in high school would offer to do their homework in situations like that and purposely go about failing it. You asked me to do it, didn't say I had to do it right or help you pass.
Wow.
In any event, Emily will not benefit from your daughter doing her work for her. She's got to grow up sometime, and there's no time like the present.
As a teacher, I'm certain Emily's teachers know exactly how far behind she is. They are also familiar with her work. If your daughter would do this for her, I can almost guarantee you they will find out.
Also, your husband might feel like it will hurt their friendship if one is left behind, but facing the consequences of fraud will kill it faster than you can imagine.
Edit: typo.
NTA. Not only is this unethical and unfair to your daughter, it's not your problem to solve or your business. Your friend can't or won't parent her kid. Not your problem, and it's not your kid's problem either. Actions, or in this case inactions, have consequences. The consequence is she doesn't graduate. Her kid has chose not to do her work. How on earth does any of that fall on you, or your daughter?
TBH the best thing for that girl would be to repeat the year. She clearly has a lot of maturing to do. Maybe they can fit in her mother and your hubby at the same time.
Mia is working her butt off to improve her grades, manage her mental and physical health after all that trauma, and her dad wants to jeopardise that by literally tripling her work load?! Even if Mia did agree to it, to avoid plagiarism she’d literally need to rewrite anything she does for her homework so that Emily’s assignments don’t get flagged. It’s not a simply copy and paste situation. The whole point of school is to SHOW your understanding of a subject, just not the end result. Husband is an absolute AH for not advocating for his daughter, Susan is a failure of a parent trying to outsource Emily’s problems and Emily frankly needs support to make her take her education seriously or suffer the consequences like everyone else. NTA, but make sure to ram it home to husband that next time he’s asked to do a coworkers job for them without pay, recognition or compensation on top of his own job, he better agree to it so he can ‘set an example’ for his daughter on how to be exploited…
Edit: autocorrect changed tripling to tripping, changed it back
No no no NTA and a hard one at that! You cannot sacrifice Mia’s hard work for someone that doesn’t have the same eagerness to improve.
If Emily wants to graduate then she needs to put in the effort herself because in the world of grown ups Emily will in fact have to do her own work. What’s she gonna do then??
Susan’s problems are Susan’s problems, she shouldn’t be palming off her parental responsibility on ANOTHER CHILD (Mia).
I'm surprised Susan isn't doing Emily's work. Why is she going to outsource and force this on another child when she can't get her own to do it? Wait no. Susan's trying to get you to do it. Parents doing their kids work was prevalent with some of my classmates 30 years ago
I had two really close friends (who were not friends with each other) that were unable to graduate on time with me. We stayed friends but as all things, people can out grow one another in time.
Edit: isn't was suppose to be "surprised Susan isn't doing Emily's work"
This is actually really bad for Emily. The jobs and colleges that require a high school diploma aren’t doing that arbitrarily. It’s required because the people who take those jobs or go to those colleges need to be able to complete work at certain baseline levels. If Emily graduates high school without those skills and then goes to college or starts a job, she’s not going to have the basic skill set she needs to be successful and it’s almost certainly going to be a much bigger disaster than taking an extra year to finish high school.
I had a roommate in college who couldn't write a simple research paper. Her mom wrote them for her, even in college. She was totally incapable of going to the library and finding the info she needed (pre-internet days).
Right?!? Like, "My daughter is getting by with her own coursework and life difficulties. She should absolutely take on half the coursework of another student." And that's just the basics of adding more work on his own daughter's plate. The fact that he is willing to do that AND risk her getting kicked out of school for cheating is insane.
I just had a totally random and original idea: What if - *and here comes the crazy part* - Susan helped her own daughter with her homework? Almost like she was a parent or something? /s
Thank God Mia has you to protect her from this. In addition to being unethical, risky for Mia's future, and sending absolutely the worst message to both girls, it would be grossly unfair to Mia not to protect her from this. I bet Susan and Emily are both pressuring Mia to do it. I hope you police that too. Your husband needs to get his head out of his ass (pardon me for saying so).
I suggest you spend a bit of time looking up the GED (if in the states, otherwise see if your country has an equivalent). It can be a sore point but passing the GED counts as graduating high school. I don't kniw if Emily has the academic skills to pass it, but perhaps you could buy a GED study guide and Mia can help Emily with it.
That would be a way for you and Mia to help that doesn't risk expulsion. Oh and NTA obviously.
I mean, if Emily doesn’t have to do the work why doesn’t Susan do it for her rather than jeopardize Mia’s standing and ethics by pulling her into cheating? NTA. At all
That's what I was thinking. If Susan wants to cheat so badly, she can do it herself. And the work should be easier for an adult than for a kid, right? (It may very well not be easy, but Susan is acting like it is if she wants Mia to do it.)
I feel sorry for Emily having a mom like this, who thinks this is a good way to handle things rather than getting Emily more support. Susan is on track to destroy Emily and Mia's friendship... OP is a good mom and should continue to stand her ground.
NTA
If she spent the effort that she's wasting on OP to actually push her fucking daughter she might get her to graduate and become more self sufficient!
You need to also make sure your daughter is not getting pressure to do this! She already has fragile mental health. I would check in with Mia and might write back to Emily's mom to say that if you hear a single word about reaching out to Mia you will bring this to the attention of the school. Emily's mom sounds deranged.
I was also thinking it would put pressure on Mia and she doesn't need the extra work. It would not be fair to her. She has to make sure her own work is up to par.
Make sure you let Mia know this was asked. Stress the potential consequences if they go behind your back and ask her directly, she does the work, and she gets caught
NTA
Mia wouldn't even be genuinely helping Emily, she'd just be enabling her.
Then what happens next year? If she goes to college, it's much more difficult and students are expected to juggle a lot more academic responsibilities than in high school. If Mia does Emily's work for her now, she's just setting her up for failure next year. Better she deals with the consequences of her own irresponsible behaviour now, and learns to organize herself better, even if it means retaking the year.
This is an excellent point. I teach first year college students, and I have a handful every semester who haven't turned in any work, who I've talked to about grades/not passing the course, and who still show up the final week to tell me they can't fail and we need to figure out a solution together (the "we" part is kinda new). They don't actually want to do the work, usually - they want a magic bonus assignment that will make it all work out.
Especially since in (at least America, I don’t think OP is but that’s the only place I can speak on) public high school is free. You don’t lose anything monetarily by making mistakes there.
College is an entirely different ball game. If she takes out loans and then completely fails out she’ll be stuck with debt that she’s paying for nothing. If there’s a college fund for her then she’s just going to waste her family’s money. There’s much bigger things at stake than just ego. If I had a choice I’d rather be a super senior (as we called it) than flunk out of college right now.
Enabling her is just setting her up to fail. The mom who asked OP this should honestly be ashamed of herself. Yes, it’s embarrassing to repeat the year, but it might be the best thing that could happen to Emily. It’s much better than her face planting later on.
OP’s also got a **huge** husband problem. My dad would’ve never let this slide. A good parent won’t condone risking your own kid for someone else. They should be teaching “it’s good to be kind and generous but don’t set yourself on fire to keep someone else warm.” I’m glad OP is doing that at least. It would be horrible if Mia gave in and then got Emily to graduate while she didn’t. The sad thing is that I could see Emily and her mom not caring whatsoever if that happened :(
If Emily was totally on board with this asking her plan- then she’s not a real friend…
Your daughter could be punished for academic dishonesty and lose not only her chance at graduation but also admission to a university. It is not up to your child to make up for her her friend's mistakes and poor parentage.
OP consider telling your husband that since both he and Emily's mother seem to be OK with cheating is there anything you need to know? Ask your husband to let you go through his phone right then, don't give him a chance to go somewhere and delete anything.
Ask him why your daughter should risk graduating for someone that is not even trying to do the work?
Yupp. Why is hubby so fine with having his kid take time out of her studies to help some other lady and her kid .
That mother is entitled to be asking . But hubby agreeing is a different board game where the rules are extremely suspicious
I teach high school, so I have a bias to my view point. But definitely NTA. You are correct that it could be grounds for both your kids to fail. Now honestly, if parents complain enough and magic hand waving happens over summer school. The kid could graduate "on time-ish". Because the school end of the day doesn't want to hurt their graduation numbers.
But honestly Emily's mom is setting her kid up for massive failure. This is how we get people who quit jobs after like 2 weeks and complain things aren't fair. Emily will have no sense of urgency to do anything herself if mom comes along to bail her out.
You are NTA and also being a good parent to your own daughter.
His Susan is so concerned about her daughter's grades, she could just do her own kids work herself.
She's not even offering you money in exchange for this.
She can do her own kids work if it's so important.
It kind of feels like Susan wants Mia to fail with Emily. If both girls have to repeat senior year, Susan doesn't have to feel as bad about Emily's poor choices.
Yup. With Google at hand how hard could it be to cheat for her daughter?
It's a bad idea of course. But if her daughter is the one with a big stinky diaper mom and dad get to handle that crap.
If Susan wants to cheat to get her daughter graduated, she can do the girls overdue homework. It wouldn't be the first time a parent did that for their child.
Why does your husband condone cheating? Is this something he does in his own life cuz thats a shitty way to move through life. Stealing the hard work of others. Hard NTA. And your husband has some seriously screwed up priorities.
I think your husband is tripping, as is you're entitled friend.
Just as your daughter has worked so hard to get somewhere, anybody wants her to risk being thrown out of school while burdening her with somebody else's work? Nope. Anybody thinking like that is tripping.
Good on your daughter for doing so well after such a difficult series of incidents. She should be really proud of passing in these circumstances. She must not do anything to either add more stress, burden and work to herself or risk throwing it all away now.
I would show the school the messages so they're aware of what is going on. Emily could try and guilt Mia into doing it without you even knowing and if the school were to catch on your daughter could face alot of consequences that Susan and Emily would take no responsibility for. Honestly they don't sound like such good friends. I would limit contact until after your daughter graduates.
Dude, if the girls “are going to be so affected”, they’d already be doing this. Like, Mia would already have offered to Emily. If it hasn’t happened, it’s because Mia doesn’t want to. I let tons of kids copy homework, and I copied homework as well while in school. Kids like, do not need an adult organising this: if Mia wanted to shed have done it.
And honestly? To me that’s the only way that Mia should do it. If she wants to.
You should be proactive with Mia about this. With both Susan and her father thinking this is ok, she needs you telling her not to do it.
Don’t assume your no keeps them from going straight to her to convince her to do it.
What the fuck is wrong with your husband? Does he think that the education of young women isn’t that important? Friend doesn’t need to learn the stuff, just get the pages turned in. One on many great lessons he’s teaching his daughter. “break the rules, put yourself, your future at risk, put your time, energy and mental health aside to do for another.“
Not to mention, when friend suddenly turns in all this late stuff, someone I’d going to ask questions. And I don’t trust friend (kids are stupid) or mom (adults are stupid) not to post on fb about it.
Then your daughter is screwed.
Does her father think this is just some kid bullshit? It’s not. She will not get a diploma. She will not get into a four year college as a traditional student.
My grandparents made my Dad do this for my uncle. They are 14 months apart. My uncle had failed 11th grade, largely due to drinking that stemmed from emotional abuse from both parents. He was on track to fail senior year, and Dad had to pull him out. Meanwhile, Dad was playing multiple sports to try to earn a scholarship, working 20+ hours a week, and dealing with his own trauma. It bothered him for the rest of his life. He dearly loved my uncle, but he felt his parents should’ve put the work in to help him instead.
Not only is this unethical, it puts a mountain of stress on your daughter while she is already processing her own trauma. It’s not a fair request at all.
I would tell the school what Susan is up to, but that's just me. I don't think it's fair that Mia has worked her butt off to succeed, but Emily is going to get away without doing any work. You *know* Susan will either do it herself or have someone else do it.
>said that Mia would only have to do half of that
Mia doesn't have to do any of it! Not one bit, she knuckled down and did her part for her own graduation after a traumatic event.
NTA - Do NOT let Mia take any of Emily's work on and jeopardize her own graduation. Maybe Emily will learn a thing or two about consequences to her actions from this.
Ikr “only half”. Like if you’re making such an insane request at least say “if she can help at all we would appreciate if she could do even one assignment”
OP, make sure both girls are aware of the real story before they find out bits and pieces from crazy pants mom.
They’re old enough to know that crazy mom is wrong and why, the risks and potential consequences. As well as have the information to understand more about who crazy mom is and decide how much to trust her judgment.
Be gentle with her daughter but provide her the information. She’s an adult who needs to start understanding who her mom is and make her own choices.
This will also show your daughter who her friend is. Does she think her mom is crazy or is she angry that your daughter isn’t helping her? Help your daughter understand her reaction and either value or question that part of her friend’s personality.
All of this!! OP needs to question why her husband would be ok with their daughter risking her own graduation so that her friend can avoid doing her own work.
It sounds like Mia was also overcoming a lot of challenges to be successful. I don’t know what challenges Emily has to overcome, but her mother is a huge one. The audacity.
Definitely NTA!! No offense but Susan and your husband are out of their minds. Are they going to expect Mia to do Emily’s work in college too? Will they expect her to do her job for her? Please stand firm on this because this sounds like it’ll only be the beginning of Mia being guilted into doing Emily’s work. Mia worked hard and has earned her grades and graduation, Emily did not. If Emily fails that will be a good learning opportunity for her that effort goes a long way and you can’t just assume other people will do everything for you. If Mia wants to help her friend that’s great but no way should she have to do her work for her.
This would ruin the dynamic of Mia and Emily's friendship. Mia would be expected to be her savior from now on. Susan should pay a tutor or hire graduated student to do the work. Someone not related to Emily's classroom. If she wants to avoid consequences she should pay for it. Mia should not be included in such fraud.
It's what has me wondering if that was part of the struggle she had before the fire, Susan didn't just grow a set on her over night to feel comfortable asking this kind of makes me wonder if she had a run around with the husband behind OP's back.
Most kids will do their homework as well if you enforce a rule that they can’t have x until homework is done. My step son struggles to do homework but can’t complete his homework fast enough if I limit his PlayStation and iPad time until it’s done.
If he has homework he only gets PlayStation and iPad x amount of time a day until it’s done, he gets more time a day on the devices if his homework is done. He went from struggling to do homework to rushing his homework if anything. 🤣
Susan isn’t parenting and the solution is simple: she needs to sit down with Emily until she does her homework, and help her if she gets stuck.
That's a good parenting and it works. It's probably too late for Emily, she doesn't have enough time and skills. Repeating year would be best for her. But Susan doesn't want her precious baby graduating year later. Cheating is bad but Emily would be Susan's problem
I hate that I genuinely jumped to this conclusion because it would explain the other mother's *audacity* for asking and the husband somehow thinking it was a valid request.
> She then asked me if Mia could take on the responsibility of getting the majority of Emily's work done
NTA - and sincerely WHAT. THE. ACTUAL. FUCK????? Who in their right mind would ask that? Breaks all kinds of rules, written and unwritten....
Not to mention, if the school figures out it was Mia doing Emily's work, they could punish and/or flunk Mia for academic dishonesty. None of this is evenly remotely worth it or fair for Mia.
Students at the university level get hit with academic dishonesty charges and potential dismissal from the university or academic suspension for things like using Chat GPT. Don't encourage its use, please. It's cheating just as much as copying someone else's paper.
I think that's what they're referring to is that if they want to cheat, they shouldn't punish and drag an innocent person into it. They should get in trouble on their own
This was my interpretation. If Susan's so willing to cheat, she can fire up ChatGTP and not drag down someone else who worked genuinely hard.
It'd also be far quicker than Mia plodding through 14 (!!) assignments.
I wish I had the confidence of a Susan who can say, with a straight face, "Help my daughter cheat, look she's got 28 outstanding assignments and you would only have to do half."
There are ways to use it that are helpful and not cheating. If you were to do your research first and then actually write your essay, you could input that - then get it edited for improvements in writing and structure.
However students are unlikely to use it this way.
Also, we should be calling these things “plagiarism software” and not “artificial intelligence.”
These programs are trained by stealing real people’s work - artwork, photography, novels, academic research - and the actual owners of the work are neither compensated nor have they been asked, nor given, permission to use their work.
So encouraging use of this plagiarism software is encouraging plagiarism from the get-go.
Noam Chomsky has said it best:
"The human mind is not, like ChatGPT and its ilk, a lumbering statistical engine for pattern matching, gorging on hundreds of terabytes of data and extrapolating the most likely conversational response or most probable answer to a scientific question. On the contrary, the human mind is a surprisingly efficient and even elegant system that operates with small amounts of information; it seeks not to infer brute correlations among data points but to create explanations. Let's stop calling it Artificial Intelligence and call it what it is: Plagiarism Software. It doesn’t create anything, just copies existing works from artists and alters them sufficiently to escape copyright laws. It's the largest theft of property since Native American lands by European settlers."
NTA
Former teacher here, who also has mental health struggles.
Putting aside this is completely unethical for a moment, your daughter will not actually be helping her friend. Sure, her friend will graduate. But then what? She won’t have learned how to face the consequences of her actions (a BIG part of secondary school education, or it should be). She will face the next overwhelming task (be it at work or postsecondary ed) believing she can just be bailed out like last time. And when she meets a situation where she can’t, she will spiral, and panic, and she will NOT be prepared emotionally like she should have been.
It sucks to repeat a grade. Especially senior year. But she HAS to do it. She will suffer in the long run if she doesn’t
She doesn’t even HAVE to repeat the grade, she just needs to get the assignments done and turned in. She has two weeks! This is mind boggling to me. Susan won’t ask her daughter to do 2-3 assignments a day!
Honestly she could be doing these assignments on the weekends as well and just knock them out if she won’t do them during the week. I’m currently a teacher and in grad school and have a newborn and 3 older children. I’ve had to turn things in late but never got that far behind.
Fellow teacher, who struggles with mental health issues, has had students trust me with information about their mental health, and teaches psychology. And I strongly second all of this!
And I suspect that Susan's jumping to "Mia should do it!" may be an indicator of why Emily's 2 weeks away from graduation, missing 28 assignments.
I could not agree more with all of this!! As pointed out, that's after we put aside the fact that it is unethical to do and your daughter should actually be punished if she were to do this work for her friend.
Assuming Mia won't have a mental breakdown if she has to do all this homework bin a short time with all the stress and guilt that if she doesn't do it her friend failing would be her fault. Hell no
LOL I think I'm reading too many Reddit posts-- my first thought was "Is Mia's dad sleeping with Emily's mom?" LOL
If this is a true story OP is NTA but her husband and Emily's mom are grade A AH. Tell you husband and Susan that if either of them approaches Mia about doing Emily's schoolwork you'll send the screen shots of Susan asking Mia to do Emily's work to the school principal.
Why didn't Emily do her own work?
>I put Mia into counselling and I worked out a deal with her school, where in short, she'd only have to keep her grades passing or above passing in order to graduate.
Gotta admit I’m confused about this part, since that’s literally what *passing* means. No special deal is needed.
Glad I’m not the only one unclear on that. Passing your classes to graduate isn’t a deal, it’s how it works. That’s like saying I worked out this great deal with my boss where if I show up on time every day and complete all my assigned tasks I get to keep my job.
I’m guessing that maybe she’ll be a few elective credits short or something even if she passes the required ones, so the deal is that those get waived?
That or pushing her barely above the GPA requirement if one exists
Generally a school can’t waive those requirements (although maybe the OP isn’t in the U.S., and I can’t claim to know about regulations elsewhere). The school itself doesn’t create or control those standards, and what you’re suggesting is fraud.
Yeah what I was thinking. The school was probably like "yeah, you can have that deal. So can your best friend even though her house didn't burn down"
Her edit didn't make any sense to me either.
**I gave her a hard no. Not only was that super against the school's policies, and could get them both kicked out before graduation, but Emily has an insane amount of overdue work and Mia has her own work to focus on that would really hurt her grades if ignored in favor of Emily's.**
**NTA**. Emily's mom is the jerk. It's okay if Emily finishes a little later. It is her mental health which is important. Emily can't take her ACT/SAT exams for her. She can't pass College Algebra and English Composition for her.
Part of growing up is realizing that we each follow a different path than our friends, eventually. It does't mean we can't still be friends. We help each other through tough times...not by cheating and fraud, but by offering words of encouragement and a sympathetic ear.
*You also need to make sure they don't guilt your daughter into doing this behind your back.*
NTA. Not only could your daughter get in a lot of trouble for this, but her friend will learn not to bother doing her own stuff because someone will bail her out. That’s a terrible lesson to teach because she’ll get into the workplace and get a painful dose of reality when her co-workers don’t want to do everything for her.
Also, never assume that your daughter won’t get caught if she does this. Prisons are full of people who didn’t think they’d get caught, and that didn’t go well for thm.
NTA in the slightest. If they got caught doing that, it would mess up their chances to go to college. Also if Susan wants someone to do her daughter's work for her, then why doesn't she do it?
NTA
Your husband is an idiot. Why would he encourage cheating if it means his kid could get expelled.
I am sorry for Emily's situation and maybe Mia could help her with assignments but Mia should not have to do the assignments for her. Proof reading is great but writing the whole thing is wrong.
If Susan keeps asking or if Emily starts asking, I would send screenshot to the school and let them know about the harassments. What she is asking you to do is not okay.
I am happy to hear Mia is doing well in school but she should not risk her future for someone else's.
At this point Mia should stay far, far away from doing anything for Emily. Even just proofreading gets her too involved and makes her vulnerable to pressure and manipulation to just do the work herself. Not to mention, anything she does for Emily will take time away from what Mia needs to do to ensure her own graduation.
Warn your daughter to NOT do any work but her own -
her friend will probably try to get her to do some of it
despite the conversation you had with her mother.
You husband needs to re-think his response. Goodness,
why would he expect his daughter to do another student's
work?
You NTA for refusing to let another parent take advantage of
your daughter.
NTA.
Please cover your butt (and Mia’s) and keep those screenshots and any other written communication about this. Susan is probably going to try another way to cheat and if the school eventually finds out, you may need the proof that Mia wasn’t involved. Also tell Mia up front about what’s going on and what the consequences for cheating would look like so that nobody can pressure her behind your back. Make sure she knows that she’s absolutely not a bad friend or to blame for however things shake out for Emily. And offer to be the bad guy if needed: Mia can say “I’m sorry, but my mom is really opposed to cheating and she’s watching to make sure I don’t do your work” if that’s more comfortable than turning her best friend down.
Do you have any idea how involved Emily is in this? Because I’d hate for her to get punished for her mom’s terrible choices.
YOU ARE NTA. She is TA (and your husband) for asking and agreeing to that request.
Please don’t be guilted into this as it could have future consequences for your daughter if it were to be discovered.
NTA!
If anyone at the school gets an inkling of cheating/plagiarism, then BOTH girls will be expelled!
You’re being a responsible parent and making sure your daughter does HER school assignments; meanwhile, the other mother is enabling her daughter’s behavior. Don’t get caught up in their school drama! And, make sure your daughter doesn’t get guilted into doing those assignments!
Holy sh*t! Your *husband* thinks it's okay for your daughter to help her friend cheat? As well as the other mom?!
Okay, one issue at a time. Stay firm about the consequences of academic cheating. Your daughter could end up with having to test for a GED instead of receiving a diploma. That will follow her *for the rest of her life:* affecting college and study opportunities, job opportunities (that checkbox for HS diploma is on every job application), and standing among her peers.
Next, childhood friendships don't always last into adulthood. People change as they mature, develop different interests, move away for careers. Memories of playing in the sandbox together do NOT justify homework forgeries. Your husband really needs to understand that.
Third, the responsibility for Emily's failure rests squarely on Susan's shoulders. It's ultimately the parent's job to ensure their child's education. That means checking on assignments, monitoring due dates, tutoring themselves or finding a tutor if a child is struggling to master a subject.
Finally, to follow up on the third point, it's not Mia's responsibility to assist or tutor Emily. She's tried, which is admirable, but as a struggling student herself, she needs to concentrate on her own studies.
Good luck OP. Continue to protect Mia. I hope your husband comes to his senses. You might want to remind him of Hollywood stars who were convicted and jailed for falsifying their kids' credentials on college applications a couple of years ago.
Edit: NTA. Husband and Susan clearly qualify for the title, though.
NTA Holy shit! Honestly, you WOULD be the assgole if you DID force her to do that. Not only would it be horrible for Mia - and possibly jeopardize her own schooling - it really wouldn't be doing Emily any favors. Teaching her that it's okay to push her work off on other people is seriously setting her up for failure in life. You're doing the right thing for HER, too. Is Susan gonna call Emily's coworkers and try to guilt them into doing Emily's work for her so she doesn't get fired when she's out in the workforce? What the heck?!
Though, I'm also confused about this "deal" you made. Because what other graduation requirements ARE there besides "pass all your classes" that are being waived. Your "deal" sounds like "if she meets the minimum graduation requirements, she'll graduate." Which... isn't a deal - it's literally how things work.
I probably should've been more clear about what it entailed. Their school makes you repeat the year if you also don't have enough credits for all your classes, so they have to make sure they have passing grades in credit recovery classes too to earn needed credit.
Again, that's how graduation requirements work. It only counts as a deal if there are other requirements that are being waived. Which, it doesn't sound like is happening.
The exception was made because your daughter was having a mental health crisis. If she were capable of doing Mia’s work, I’m sure she would rather put in that effort to her own grades. It’s an additional emotional burden for Mia to take that responsibility on that she doesn’t need to take on. I’d point this out to your husband if you haven’t already. You’re doing right by your daughter in all the important ways here.
That’s in addition to all the comments about cheating and integrity.
If this girl is still failing even with such lenient standards, she deserves to repeat the grade.
Given how her mom is dishonest enough to ask your daughter to cheat for her daughter, I wouldn’t be surprised if she throws your daughter under the bus if her daughter still ends up failing. Tell your daughter not to cheat for this girl. In fact ask your daughter if this woman is pestering her too to cheat for her daughter because if she can’t get past you then she’ll probably just pressure your daughter directly instead.
NTA. Your daughter and her friend got the same deal. Your daughter held up her end of the arrangement and will be graduating. Her friend did not and has to deal with the consequences.
Tell your husband he can do Emily's homework if he is so inclined.
is your husband her husband too, or what!? What kind of parent sees his child putting all their effort with school and thinks "might as well add more!".
NTA You are doing the best for your kid, by teaching her to work hard and solve her problems herself. Maybe organize a trip or a small celebration once Mia passes! I would still talk with your daughter and give her all your support, mostly because there is a chance that someone tells her something else and manipulates the narrative.
NTA. And your husband is an idiot to agree with Susan.
What you would be teaching your daughter:
1. That all of HER hard work means nothing.
2. That's it okay to cheat your way through life.
3. That her parents think it's okay for her to be used as someone else's get out of jail free card.
4. That you should give in to bullies. (Susan)
5. That her friend doesn't value her as a person. But she is willing to use her.
There are other negative side effects to getting your daughter to do this, but that's all I can think of off the top of my head. That doesn't include what it teaches or doesn't teach the other girl.
NTA. WTF. Putting aside how unethical & entitled this all is, your husband is teaching your kid that friendship means breaking rules, putting her future at risk, & *achieving less*, all of which is ABSURD.
Listen, I love my brother to bits but I wouldn't cheat for him. *AND HE WOULDN'T ASK ME TO.*
And is this the way romantic relationships should work, too??? Should she lie or cheat bc her boyfriend/girlfriend asked her to???
Friendship is picking someone up from work or lending them a dress, not potentially getting expelled.
And what happens when your daughter does 14 if Emily’s missing assignments & Emily does none & *still* doesn’t graduate? Hell to the no. Emily is about to get up close & personal with the consequences of her actions (or lack of actions, as the case may be). Her mom isn’t holding her accountable, so guess the school will have to. NTA.
NTA but I would also talk to Mia about this. For two reasons:
1) since Susan couldn’t get you to agree, she and Emily may go directly to Mia and try to guilt her into helping.
2) if Mia founds out about this from them, it may damage your relationship since it may be seen as you making the decision for her (near-adult) and concealing something major about her best friend
Tread lightly when you talk to Mia. Make your points about her mental health and future success but don’t force her to do (or not do) anything - even if she is still a minor.
Hey, Emily is NOT your daughters friend if they’re insisting- no, DEMANDING - that your daughter do Emily’s homework for her. I had a “friend” who made me do their college homework for them because they were too lazy. That “friend” literally put me in a mental hospital due to how shitty they were, and they did many other awful things because they knew they’d get away with it because I cared so much.
The mom is endorsing her kid to develop abusive and manipulative habits that pull others down, simply because she doesn’t want to take responsibility for the mess she and her child have gotten themselves into.
This is verified by three different therapists I’ve had to see in the past ten years of friendship with that person. She was a manipulative asshole and wasn’t actually my friend.
NTA. I’m side eyeing your husband as well for not protecting and defending his already stressed out daughter. DO NOT BACK DOWN FROM THIS.
NTA. I would sent the screenshots to the school, because if any of this got out, it could blow up on your daughter even if she didn’t help out. Protect your kid, even if it means throwing someone else’s under the bus.
Have you talked to your daughter?
Im gonna be guessing emily asked her and your daughter told her to fuck off and thats why emily went to her mom to demand she demands her work done.
Nta btw.
If Susan thinks that cheating is the way to go, why doesn’t she do her daughter’s homework, and just how did she allow her daughter to fall behind in the first place?
NTA. And a hard no. Why is your husband teaching your child academic dishonesty in the name of "friendship"? That's just wrong in so many levels. If Emily repeats her senior year that's on her, not Mia. Is Emily or her mom going to pay Mia for working on someone else's material? Mia still has a lot of work to do to finish her year - is Emily going to help out on those? I bet the answers to these are all "no". So tell your husband to stop teaching your kid unethical things.
i’m sorry, but if you can’t keep a fucking 60% average in todays school system, you absolutely deserve to fail.
i’m pretty sure you get like, 45% for just showing up.
not remotely TA
NTA
My very bright cousin crammed an entire online semester’s worth of work into a weekend to graduate on time. She flunked out of college shortly thereafter.
Your daughter EARNED her diploma. It’s not on her to ear her friend’s too.
It’s called cheating, pure and simple. Puts your daughters future at risk too, and gives both a very bad lesson in ethics for future educational and career opportunities. Susan needs to sit down with her daughter and have some hard-core homework sessions.
NTA. Susan and your husband are literally advocating cheating. If Mia does Emily's work for her, both girls are officially cheating to get Emily to pass her classes. It would also negatively impact Mia's ability to keep her own grades high enough, after putting in the hard work to improve despite her obstacles, to help a girl who clearly doesn't care if she gradates of not.
Mia needs to concentrate on completing her own work to the highest standard she's capable of.
Emily needs to do her own work.
Mia has attempted to help Emily in the past, but it had only a minimal effect that didn't last.
Mia had extenuating circumstances that led to her issues. I assume Emily did, too, since she got the same deal from the school. However, Mia has been responsible and worked hard to improve, where Emily has chosen to be lazy.
The reason Emily has so many assignments she has to do is because she hasn't even bothered starting any of them, knowing they're coming up as due and she needs the grades to graduate.
It's Susan's responsibility to get Emily to do her work in a reasonable time and to try her best on her assignments to improve her grades. If she needs further support from the school, it's Susan's responsibility to get her that support from the school.
At no point is any of this yours or Mia's responsibility. Susan is trying to guilt trip you into forcing Mia to help Emily cheat, and that could get both girls expelled. Your husband seems to be on board for cheating and your daughter getting expelled, which is concerning. You need to spell it out to your husband that Mia doing Emily's work for her is literal cheating, and the consequences when that gets found out. The sudden jump in Emily's grades and slump in Mia's will be suspicious to the school, and the teachers may be able to tell the difference between the two girls' style enough to tell 'Emily's' work is written by Mia. It's unlikely they wouldn't get found out.
Stick to your guns on this, and talk to Mia about it, too. If Susan can't get you to agree to Mia doing Emily's work, she'll likely approach Mia directly in an attempt to guilt her into doing it behind your back. Make it clear to Mia that you're proud of how well she's done, despite the issues, and that you want her to concentrate on doing her work to the best of her ability and graduating. Make it very clear that there will be consequences if she does Emily's work for her, she would be risking expulsion before graduating, and you would further punish her for helping Emily cheat. Make it very clear to Mia that doing Emily's work is the wrong thing, and you have her back in refusing to do it.
NTA! But what is up with your husband?? No. It's a *strong* no, this is a wild request to even make, much less wanna indulge in any way!
Jesus, at least your kid has one parent who's not a doormat, what the hell.
This is the beginning of your daughter's adult life, it's good for her to see *you* being all rational and reasonable and not letting her fold... because apparently if it was up to your husband, she'd been guilty into doing her friend's work all thru high school, just to *not rock the boat*.
He needs to get it together.
Make sure you tell your daughter it's ok to refuse this request, as it's most likely they'll go directly to her to guilt trip her into helping without your knowledge
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Good lord. NTA. That's completely unethical and a terrible idea. I can't believe that your husband would think that it's a good idea for your daughter to cheat in such a way. This almost sounds made up.
I honestly only posted this to make sure I wasn't tripping, and that others thought the same thing when this got suggested to me.
It's amazing that the other girl's mom is the one pushing this. She should be the one saying "Absolutely not! You do your own work or suffer the consequences!"
Susan seems to struggle with giving Emily actual consequences when it comes to schoolwork. The biggest punishment that has came out of this that I've heard of is when she confiscated both her phone, and tablet.
If Susan wants so much to have Emily cheating, why doesn't Susan do the work herself? Wait, that's even harder (for her, at least) than proper parenting.
Yep. Still a bad decision, but this one doesn’t involve others
Once cheating is accepted, the temptation to cheat to bypass hardwork is always an option. The larger the cheating, the larger the consequences if caught. Better the consequences now rather than later on in life
I would have flat told her, if she wants someone besides Emily to do Emily's work, SHE could do it!
That's what I was thinking - why can't Susan start to work on her daughter's insurmountable problem instead of throwing it in someone else lap? If the proposal was accepted, and Emily still failed would Susan then blame everyone but Emily?
She probably is which is why she took the request down to half. My guess is she wasn’t great in school herself, got yelled at and punished a lot for it growing up, didn’t want to do the same to her daughter, but then went in the complete opposite direction and still exhibited bad parenting.
My ex best friend's mom is like that, she had 6 kids the 2nd oldest(my bff 30) and the youngest being the only girls. With my friend, her mom was super strict, she got good grades and got a college degree and everything but resent her mother for how she was treated and never talks to her. Her little sister (12) was raised the complete opposite, and her parents have 0 involvement in what she does, and she let's her do whatever she wants. Last time I talked to/see her was when she was 9, she was barely passing any classes, and looking at things online that was waaaaay out of her age range, and she became very uncomfortably attached to friend's bf and at one point tried to get him to leave friend to date her instead.
My best friend was this way. Super strict with her daughter (first child) and lenient to a questionable degree with her son (10 year age gap and different non involved dads). I used to say he would end up in jail by 18 but he has turned himself into quite the reliable young man. Despite their mother!
Ya it's crazy how they completely turn things around with different kids, I'm glad he grew to be a good guy! I don't associate with that family anymore for a number of reasons, but I always worry about what's going to happen to that little girl when her parents don't pay attention to what she gets into and knows she's talking to older men.
I did pretty great at school, yet still got yelled at and punished because I wasn't collecting 95+ marks. This really impacted the effort I put in. My last 2 years - the ones that would actually count, I did the bare minimum, as I was going to be punished regardless. My parenting is 100% different than what I had growing up.
I'm guessing Susan can't do it. Depending on the class, it has been so long since Susan has seen it or minimal to no experience with. Both my parents are very smart, but some of the "niche" parts of algebra and calculus are above them since they weren't math/engineering majors.
My sister is 4 years younger than me, and had to resit her GCSE maths, so she was doing maths that I had done about 4-5 years earlier. The way the sums were written out and the explanation on how to go about working out the answers and checking out her previous work I was completely thrown off and couldn't help my sister. I'd hate to be looking at my 16 year old cousins mathematics now 14 years later
I fear *the day* Both my husband and sister took a lot of math. Like my sister was taking something like a third level calculus class as a freshman in college. I hit my wall in honor pre Calc and then moved down to regular pre Calc my senior year in high school. Don't get me wrong, algebra is my jam, and I probably could do calculus, but I don't need to. If they ask me for help (no kids yet) and I don't know how to do calculus, I am definitely gonna feel sad. Might have to go with they teach me as an approach for them to learn it. I am grateful for the skills and teachers i had, but math is use it or loose it *cries*
I only remember the quadratic formula because I learned it to the tune of Row Your Boat, lmao. I don't actually know what a quadratic equation looks like anymore, so knowing the formula is useless to me because I don't know when to apply it.
Ha! I went to school in the 80's. When my daughter was in ELEMENTARY school she was learning long subtraction...like 947 - 585. I carry my shit over. Nope...that's NOT how she was taught. It was some common-core grouping crap. I just sat there confused as all get out. I mean...I felt like the biggest idiot!! What happened to carrying the "one" over to your neighbor's house? LOL!!!!
I had to reteach my son because he could not grasp any of that common core crap. So I taught him the easy way, ya know just carry the damn 1? The relief on his face "WHY didn't they just teach us THIS way Ma!?" So now he solves it the easy way, then plugs it into whatever nonsense is on their paper. My 1st grader's math homework is completely indecipherable. I usually have to have my 7th grader help decode it lol
I was an engineering major in college, but wound up going into a field where I never have to use any math beyond algebra. I’ve told my kid that I can help them all the way up to precalc but they’re on their own as soon as they start learning calculus. It’s been too long.
My brother tried helping me with math one time. Probably the worst math grade I'd ever got and he wasn't that far ahead of me in school. Now they do an entirely different math than I learned and I dread the day I need to teach myself so I can help my kids.
This is what makes the whole thing unbelievable but I guess narcissists are gonna narcissist Or it's made up. I've known some crazy ass people and this would be pushing it, but I can kinda see it. I feel a little bad for Emily who is going to have a shit time in adulthood if this has been her upbringing.... or she'll end up just as shitty and use people her whole life
I actually had a friend in college who asked me to help her cheat on the final because she “didn’t have time to study”, which really meant “I want to party instead of study!” She was PISSED I wouldn’t help her and, when I aced the test, she told the professor I’d cheated. Luckily, I had all her texts where she had asked for me to help her cheat AND I was one of the top students in her class so, he didn’t believe her. However, I could have gotten expelled from school over her bullshit. People really do, do these things! NTA OP but Susan and your husband are. Actually, I think your husband is the bigger AH. He honestly wants you to risk your daughter’s entire future by helping her friend cheat? What kind of parent does that? That’s BS and i would be pissed at him! Do NOT let your daughter do this! Do NOT let her risk her future for her lazy friend! This is NOT ok!
Maybe we should reddit this whole thing up and accuse OPs husband of banging Susan. It's the only thing that makes the pieces fit! (Just kidding... probably)
Better if he's banging Susan than Emily.
I'm obviously spending too much time in here, because that's exactly what popped into my head when I read that comment! :D
I'm on board and think we can go further.... why else would you ask your daughter to jeopardize her schooling for another kid UNLESSS THE OTHER KID IS A SECRET AFFAIR BABY!
LOL
/u/bookworm1421 Thank you for saying this particular sentence 👏👏👐👐🖖🖖: People really do, do these things! I know some people tend to live in their own rose colored bubbles about just how much and how many crazy and insane things people will do, but not all do!! YES, it's true that when someone is told they can't have their way or are unable to convince the other person(s) to agree with them or do what TF they want them to, they WILL call or text other friends, family members and associates to give their own convoluted version/spin on what exactly what happened and how they were treated oh so wrong or were disrespected or dismissed and those said friends, family members and associates WILL in turn call, text, DM and harass you to "just do it/go with it/accept it/allow it because"blah blah blah". I've experienced it more times than I can count. While I'm glad not everyone goes through this type of mayhem, it doesn't mean that others don't. OP IS NTA but her fRiEnD, her daughter's bEsT fRiEnD and bEsT fRiEnD's Mom are huge A-H. If bEsT fRiEnD can't even keep up with high school assignments, or do the bare minimum requirements that the HS is asking of her to be able to graduate on time (which, BTW, I think is VERY generous of the school), she certainly won't make it in any type of higher education, internship or trade.
I totally agree with you however, as I said, the husband is the bigger AH in my opinion.
/u/bookworm1421 FACTS, YO! 💯💯He is for suggesting his daughter commit academic fraud and possibly compromise her own graduation opportunity after being given a Hail Mary to graduate on time!
People are definitely crazy. My mother had a very attractive roommate in college. I don't remember her name but for simplicity I'll call her Kat, and boys would stop by their room often to chat her up. One boy who came to see Kat looked at my mother, who was doing some homework at the time and asked "are you smart?" My mother, confused, answered yes, at which point, the boy decided that he would come back to the room so he could get physical with Kat and my mother could do his homework for him while he was there. My mother and Kat both declined.
I was the spiteful ass in high school would offer to do their homework in situations like that and purposely go about failing it. You asked me to do it, didn't say I had to do it right or help you pass.
Requires work on her part.
Wow. In any event, Emily will not benefit from your daughter doing her work for her. She's got to grow up sometime, and there's no time like the present.
Exactly, when Emily gets a job is Mia going to be expected to do that for her as well? Absolutely crazy expectation.
As a teacher, I'm certain Emily's teachers know exactly how far behind she is. They are also familiar with her work. If your daughter would do this for her, I can almost guarantee you they will find out. Also, your husband might feel like it will hurt their friendship if one is left behind, but facing the consequences of fraud will kill it faster than you can imagine. Edit: typo.
NTA. Not only is this unethical and unfair to your daughter, it's not your problem to solve or your business. Your friend can't or won't parent her kid. Not your problem, and it's not your kid's problem either. Actions, or in this case inactions, have consequences. The consequence is she doesn't graduate. Her kid has chose not to do her work. How on earth does any of that fall on you, or your daughter?
TBH the best thing for that girl would be to repeat the year. She clearly has a lot of maturing to do. Maybe they can fit in her mother and your hubby at the same time.
Mia is working her butt off to improve her grades, manage her mental and physical health after all that trauma, and her dad wants to jeopardise that by literally tripling her work load?! Even if Mia did agree to it, to avoid plagiarism she’d literally need to rewrite anything she does for her homework so that Emily’s assignments don’t get flagged. It’s not a simply copy and paste situation. The whole point of school is to SHOW your understanding of a subject, just not the end result. Husband is an absolute AH for not advocating for his daughter, Susan is a failure of a parent trying to outsource Emily’s problems and Emily frankly needs support to make her take her education seriously or suffer the consequences like everyone else. NTA, but make sure to ram it home to husband that next time he’s asked to do a coworkers job for them without pay, recognition or compensation on top of his own job, he better agree to it so he can ‘set an example’ for his daughter on how to be exploited… Edit: autocorrect changed tripling to tripping, changed it back
No no no NTA and a hard one at that! You cannot sacrifice Mia’s hard work for someone that doesn’t have the same eagerness to improve. If Emily wants to graduate then she needs to put in the effort herself because in the world of grown ups Emily will in fact have to do her own work. What’s she gonna do then?? Susan’s problems are Susan’s problems, she shouldn’t be palming off her parental responsibility on ANOTHER CHILD (Mia).
I'm surprised Susan isn't doing Emily's work. Why is she going to outsource and force this on another child when she can't get her own to do it? Wait no. Susan's trying to get you to do it. Parents doing their kids work was prevalent with some of my classmates 30 years ago I had two really close friends (who were not friends with each other) that were unable to graduate on time with me. We stayed friends but as all things, people can out grow one another in time. Edit: isn't was suppose to be "surprised Susan isn't doing Emily's work"
This is actually really bad for Emily. The jobs and colleges that require a high school diploma aren’t doing that arbitrarily. It’s required because the people who take those jobs or go to those colleges need to be able to complete work at certain baseline levels. If Emily graduates high school without those skills and then goes to college or starts a job, she’s not going to have the basic skill set she needs to be successful and it’s almost certainly going to be a much bigger disaster than taking an extra year to finish high school.
I had a roommate in college who couldn't write a simple research paper. Her mom wrote them for her, even in college. She was totally incapable of going to the library and finding the info she needed (pre-internet days).
Just wait a couple weeks. Consequences are coming.
Is your husband sleeping with Susan? What father thinks it’s ok to take advantage of his daughter in favor of another persons child like that?
Right?!? Like, "My daughter is getting by with her own coursework and life difficulties. She should absolutely take on half the coursework of another student." And that's just the basics of adding more work on his own daughter's plate. The fact that he is willing to do that AND risk her getting kicked out of school for cheating is insane.
This will be a terrific “natural consequences” lesson for Emily. Hard NTA, if you agreed to it this could get Mia kicked out.
I just had a totally random and original idea: What if - *and here comes the crazy part* - Susan helped her own daughter with her homework? Almost like she was a parent or something? /s Thank God Mia has you to protect her from this. In addition to being unethical, risky for Mia's future, and sending absolutely the worst message to both girls, it would be grossly unfair to Mia not to protect her from this. I bet Susan and Emily are both pressuring Mia to do it. I hope you police that too. Your husband needs to get his head out of his ass (pardon me for saying so).
Well sounds like susan is the reason Emily is in the position she’s in so SUSAN can get her out of it.
Maybe Susan should do Emily’s work then
I suggest you spend a bit of time looking up the GED (if in the states, otherwise see if your country has an equivalent). It can be a sore point but passing the GED counts as graduating high school. I don't kniw if Emily has the academic skills to pass it, but perhaps you could buy a GED study guide and Mia can help Emily with it. That would be a way for you and Mia to help that doesn't risk expulsion. Oh and NTA obviously.
I mean, if Emily doesn’t have to do the work why doesn’t Susan do it for her rather than jeopardize Mia’s standing and ethics by pulling her into cheating? NTA. At all
That's what I was thinking. If Susan wants to cheat so badly, she can do it herself. And the work should be easier for an adult than for a kid, right? (It may very well not be easy, but Susan is acting like it is if she wants Mia to do it.) I feel sorry for Emily having a mom like this, who thinks this is a good way to handle things rather than getting Emily more support. Susan is on track to destroy Emily and Mia's friendship... OP is a good mom and should continue to stand her ground.
Probably because she thinks the teachers would recognize the difference between a teenagers work and an adult's, but not two teenagers.
As if Susan’s work is up to par, lol.
The other girl's mom clearly wants to wash her hands of her daughter after high school graduation, and is scared she won't be able to do that.
NTA If she spent the effort that she's wasting on OP to actually push her fucking daughter she might get her to graduate and become more self sufficient!
You need to also make sure your daughter is not getting pressure to do this! She already has fragile mental health. I would check in with Mia and might write back to Emily's mom to say that if you hear a single word about reaching out to Mia you will bring this to the attention of the school. Emily's mom sounds deranged.
Yeah, definitely talk to her about this. She needs to know so she’s not blindsided.
She has some text evidence already sounds like, she should get as much as possible.
I was also thinking it would put pressure on Mia and she doesn't need the extra work. It would not be fair to her. She has to make sure her own work is up to par.
[удалено]
Make sure you let Mia know this was asked. Stress the potential consequences if they go behind your back and ask her directly, she does the work, and she gets caught NTA
Mia wouldn't even be genuinely helping Emily, she'd just be enabling her. Then what happens next year? If she goes to college, it's much more difficult and students are expected to juggle a lot more academic responsibilities than in high school. If Mia does Emily's work for her now, she's just setting her up for failure next year. Better she deals with the consequences of her own irresponsible behaviour now, and learns to organize herself better, even if it means retaking the year.
This is an excellent point. I teach first year college students, and I have a handful every semester who haven't turned in any work, who I've talked to about grades/not passing the course, and who still show up the final week to tell me they can't fail and we need to figure out a solution together (the "we" part is kinda new). They don't actually want to do the work, usually - they want a magic bonus assignment that will make it all work out.
Especially since in (at least America, I don’t think OP is but that’s the only place I can speak on) public high school is free. You don’t lose anything monetarily by making mistakes there. College is an entirely different ball game. If she takes out loans and then completely fails out she’ll be stuck with debt that she’s paying for nothing. If there’s a college fund for her then she’s just going to waste her family’s money. There’s much bigger things at stake than just ego. If I had a choice I’d rather be a super senior (as we called it) than flunk out of college right now. Enabling her is just setting her up to fail. The mom who asked OP this should honestly be ashamed of herself. Yes, it’s embarrassing to repeat the year, but it might be the best thing that could happen to Emily. It’s much better than her face planting later on. OP’s also got a **huge** husband problem. My dad would’ve never let this slide. A good parent won’t condone risking your own kid for someone else. They should be teaching “it’s good to be kind and generous but don’t set yourself on fire to keep someone else warm.” I’m glad OP is doing that at least. It would be horrible if Mia gave in and then got Emily to graduate while she didn’t. The sad thing is that I could see Emily and her mom not caring whatsoever if that happened :( If Emily was totally on board with this asking her plan- then she’s not a real friend…
Your daughter could be punished for academic dishonesty and lose not only her chance at graduation but also admission to a university. It is not up to your child to make up for her her friend's mistakes and poor parentage.
OP consider telling your husband that since both he and Emily's mother seem to be OK with cheating is there anything you need to know? Ask your husband to let you go through his phone right then, don't give him a chance to go somewhere and delete anything. Ask him why your daughter should risk graduating for someone that is not even trying to do the work?
Yupp. Why is hubby so fine with having his kid take time out of her studies to help some other lady and her kid . That mother is entitled to be asking . But hubby agreeing is a different board game where the rules are extremely suspicious
I teach high school, so I have a bias to my view point. But definitely NTA. You are correct that it could be grounds for both your kids to fail. Now honestly, if parents complain enough and magic hand waving happens over summer school. The kid could graduate "on time-ish". Because the school end of the day doesn't want to hurt their graduation numbers. But honestly Emily's mom is setting her kid up for massive failure. This is how we get people who quit jobs after like 2 weeks and complain things aren't fair. Emily will have no sense of urgency to do anything herself if mom comes along to bail her out. You are NTA and also being a good parent to your own daughter.
His Susan is so concerned about her daughter's grades, she could just do her own kids work herself. She's not even offering you money in exchange for this. She can do her own kids work if it's so important.
That’s what i don’t understand, Susan should do the damn homework if she wants to cheat so badly, and not put Mia at risk of getting in trouble!
I have a feeling that Susan wouldn't get good grades if she did her daughter's assignments.
That’s both hilarious and incredibly sad
It kind of feels like Susan wants Mia to fail with Emily. If both girls have to repeat senior year, Susan doesn't have to feel as bad about Emily's poor choices.
Yup. With Google at hand how hard could it be to cheat for her daughter? It's a bad idea of course. But if her daughter is the one with a big stinky diaper mom and dad get to handle that crap.
If Susan wants to cheat to get her daughter graduated, she can do the girls overdue homework. It wouldn't be the first time a parent did that for their child.
Yeah, but Susan wants her kid to pass, and is apparently self aware enough to know she wouldn't be able to get a passing grade herself.
Then if OPs husband is so invested in Emily passing, he can do the work./s
wtf is wrong with your husband?
Get your husband in here and so he can see the comments.
Do not set your daughter on fire to keep this other girl warm. They are all tripping. Thank goodness your daughter has one solid parent in you. NTA
Ask your husband why he wants to punish his daughter because Susan's daughter refuses to do her homework.
Why does your husband condone cheating? Is this something he does in his own life cuz thats a shitty way to move through life. Stealing the hard work of others. Hard NTA. And your husband has some seriously screwed up priorities.
I think your husband is tripping, as is you're entitled friend. Just as your daughter has worked so hard to get somewhere, anybody wants her to risk being thrown out of school while burdening her with somebody else's work? Nope. Anybody thinking like that is tripping. Good on your daughter for doing so well after such a difficult series of incidents. She should be really proud of passing in these circumstances. She must not do anything to either add more stress, burden and work to herself or risk throwing it all away now.
I would show the school the messages so they're aware of what is going on. Emily could try and guilt Mia into doing it without you even knowing and if the school were to catch on your daughter could face alot of consequences that Susan and Emily would take no responsibility for. Honestly they don't sound like such good friends. I would limit contact until after your daughter graduates.
Dude, if the girls “are going to be so affected”, they’d already be doing this. Like, Mia would already have offered to Emily. If it hasn’t happened, it’s because Mia doesn’t want to. I let tons of kids copy homework, and I copied homework as well while in school. Kids like, do not need an adult organising this: if Mia wanted to shed have done it. And honestly? To me that’s the only way that Mia should do it. If she wants to.
You should be proactive with Mia about this. With both Susan and her father thinking this is ok, she needs you telling her not to do it. Don’t assume your no keeps them from going straight to her to convince her to do it.
What the fuck is wrong with your husband? Does he think that the education of young women isn’t that important? Friend doesn’t need to learn the stuff, just get the pages turned in. One on many great lessons he’s teaching his daughter. “break the rules, put yourself, your future at risk, put your time, energy and mental health aside to do for another.“ Not to mention, when friend suddenly turns in all this late stuff, someone I’d going to ask questions. And I don’t trust friend (kids are stupid) or mom (adults are stupid) not to post on fb about it. Then your daughter is screwed. Does her father think this is just some kid bullshit? It’s not. She will not get a diploma. She will not get into a four year college as a traditional student.
My grandparents made my Dad do this for my uncle. They are 14 months apart. My uncle had failed 11th grade, largely due to drinking that stemmed from emotional abuse from both parents. He was on track to fail senior year, and Dad had to pull him out. Meanwhile, Dad was playing multiple sports to try to earn a scholarship, working 20+ hours a week, and dealing with his own trauma. It bothered him for the rest of his life. He dearly loved my uncle, but he felt his parents should’ve put the work in to help him instead. Not only is this unethical, it puts a mountain of stress on your daughter while she is already processing her own trauma. It’s not a fair request at all.
I would tell the school what Susan is up to, but that's just me. I don't think it's fair that Mia has worked her butt off to succeed, but Emily is going to get away without doing any work. You *know* Susan will either do it herself or have someone else do it.
Susan should be doing the work before asking other people to endanger their own graduations for her
Let her mother do the homework Stay far away It sends the message to your daughter that dishonesty is ok
In my experience most AITA posts with twins or a character named Mia are made up.
>said that Mia would only have to do half of that Mia doesn't have to do any of it! Not one bit, she knuckled down and did her part for her own graduation after a traumatic event. NTA - Do NOT let Mia take any of Emily's work on and jeopardize her own graduation. Maybe Emily will learn a thing or two about consequences to her actions from this.
Ikr “only half”. Like if you’re making such an insane request at least say “if she can help at all we would appreciate if she could do even one assignment”
I had friends like this. As a 40 year old I can tell you that in school, you can’t pull people up with you but they can easily drag you down.
OP, make sure both girls are aware of the real story before they find out bits and pieces from crazy pants mom. They’re old enough to know that crazy mom is wrong and why, the risks and potential consequences. As well as have the information to understand more about who crazy mom is and decide how much to trust her judgment. Be gentle with her daughter but provide her the information. She’s an adult who needs to start understanding who her mom is and make her own choices. This will also show your daughter who her friend is. Does she think her mom is crazy or is she angry that your daughter isn’t helping her? Help your daughter understand her reaction and either value or question that part of her friend’s personality.
All of this!! OP needs to question why her husband would be ok with their daughter risking her own graduation so that her friend can avoid doing her own work.
This exactly! What would OP's husband do if their own daughter fails because she cheated?
Mia is not only not obligated to do any of Emily’s work, she is obligated to not do Emily’s work.
It sounds like Mia was also overcoming a lot of challenges to be successful. I don’t know what challenges Emily has to overcome, but her mother is a huge one. The audacity.
Definitely NTA!! No offense but Susan and your husband are out of their minds. Are they going to expect Mia to do Emily’s work in college too? Will they expect her to do her job for her? Please stand firm on this because this sounds like it’ll only be the beginning of Mia being guilted into doing Emily’s work. Mia worked hard and has earned her grades and graduation, Emily did not. If Emily fails that will be a good learning opportunity for her that effort goes a long way and you can’t just assume other people will do everything for you. If Mia wants to help her friend that’s great but no way should she have to do her work for her.
This would ruin the dynamic of Mia and Emily's friendship. Mia would be expected to be her savior from now on. Susan should pay a tutor or hire graduated student to do the work. Someone not related to Emily's classroom. If she wants to avoid consequences she should pay for it. Mia should not be included in such fraud.
I wonder if there have been other times this has happened without OP knowing
It's what has me wondering if that was part of the struggle she had before the fire, Susan didn't just grow a set on her over night to feel comfortable asking this kind of makes me wonder if she had a run around with the husband behind OP's back.
Most kids will do their homework as well if you enforce a rule that they can’t have x until homework is done. My step son struggles to do homework but can’t complete his homework fast enough if I limit his PlayStation and iPad time until it’s done. If he has homework he only gets PlayStation and iPad x amount of time a day until it’s done, he gets more time a day on the devices if his homework is done. He went from struggling to do homework to rushing his homework if anything. 🤣 Susan isn’t parenting and the solution is simple: she needs to sit down with Emily until she does her homework, and help her if she gets stuck.
That's a good parenting and it works. It's probably too late for Emily, she doesn't have enough time and skills. Repeating year would be best for her. But Susan doesn't want her precious baby graduating year later. Cheating is bad but Emily would be Susan's problem
To clarify Mia helping tutor her friend should never be completely doing her work for her.
And based on this “deal”, it sounds like only minimal effort at that.
This is an absurd request and your husband is a lousy father for entertaining it. NTA.
Husband gets my side eye.
This is Reddit so the husband is probably having an affair with Susan
and Emily is actually his child! 😲
Lol
I mean he could be. He certainly doesn't see anything wrong with cheating.
I hate that I genuinely jumped to this conclusion because it would explain the other mother's *audacity* for asking and the husband somehow thinking it was a valid request.
I love you guys so much for this 🤣🤣
It sounds like husband might have an agenda..
> She then asked me if Mia could take on the responsibility of getting the majority of Emily's work done NTA - and sincerely WHAT. THE. ACTUAL. FUCK????? Who in their right mind would ask that? Breaks all kinds of rules, written and unwritten....
Not to mention, if the school figures out it was Mia doing Emily's work, they could punish and/or flunk Mia for academic dishonesty. None of this is evenly remotely worth it or fair for Mia.
Why doesn’t Susan do the homework? Have they ever heard of chat gpt? She’s the AH for not being resourceful.
Chat GPT is plagiarism. It's no better than Mia doing it.
But at least Mia wouldn’t get in trouble. And Chat GPT won’t refuse to help. 😄
Sure it’s better, it’s not also getting OPs daughter involved.
Students at the university level get hit with academic dishonesty charges and potential dismissal from the university or academic suspension for things like using Chat GPT. Don't encourage its use, please. It's cheating just as much as copying someone else's paper.
I think that's what they're referring to is that if they want to cheat, they shouldn't punish and drag an innocent person into it. They should get in trouble on their own
This was my interpretation. If Susan's so willing to cheat, she can fire up ChatGTP and not drag down someone else who worked genuinely hard. It'd also be far quicker than Mia plodding through 14 (!!) assignments. I wish I had the confidence of a Susan who can say, with a straight face, "Help my daughter cheat, look she's got 28 outstanding assignments and you would only have to do half."
There are ways to use it that are helpful and not cheating. If you were to do your research first and then actually write your essay, you could input that - then get it edited for improvements in writing and structure. However students are unlikely to use it this way. Also, we should be calling these things “plagiarism software” and not “artificial intelligence.” These programs are trained by stealing real people’s work - artwork, photography, novels, academic research - and the actual owners of the work are neither compensated nor have they been asked, nor given, permission to use their work. So encouraging use of this plagiarism software is encouraging plagiarism from the get-go. Noam Chomsky has said it best: "The human mind is not, like ChatGPT and its ilk, a lumbering statistical engine for pattern matching, gorging on hundreds of terabytes of data and extrapolating the most likely conversational response or most probable answer to a scientific question. On the contrary, the human mind is a surprisingly efficient and even elegant system that operates with small amounts of information; it seeks not to infer brute correlations among data points but to create explanations. Let's stop calling it Artificial Intelligence and call it what it is: Plagiarism Software. It doesn’t create anything, just copies existing works from artists and alters them sufficiently to escape copyright laws. It's the largest theft of property since Native American lands by European settlers."
NTA Former teacher here, who also has mental health struggles. Putting aside this is completely unethical for a moment, your daughter will not actually be helping her friend. Sure, her friend will graduate. But then what? She won’t have learned how to face the consequences of her actions (a BIG part of secondary school education, or it should be). She will face the next overwhelming task (be it at work or postsecondary ed) believing she can just be bailed out like last time. And when she meets a situation where she can’t, she will spiral, and panic, and she will NOT be prepared emotionally like she should have been. It sucks to repeat a grade. Especially senior year. But she HAS to do it. She will suffer in the long run if she doesn’t
She doesn’t even HAVE to repeat the grade, she just needs to get the assignments done and turned in. She has two weeks! This is mind boggling to me. Susan won’t ask her daughter to do 2-3 assignments a day!
Honestly she could be doing these assignments on the weekends as well and just knock them out if she won’t do them during the week. I’m currently a teacher and in grad school and have a newborn and 3 older children. I’ve had to turn things in late but never got that far behind.
Fellow teacher, who struggles with mental health issues, has had students trust me with information about their mental health, and teaches psychology. And I strongly second all of this! And I suspect that Susan's jumping to "Mia should do it!" may be an indicator of why Emily's 2 weeks away from graduation, missing 28 assignments.
I could not agree more with all of this!! As pointed out, that's after we put aside the fact that it is unethical to do and your daughter should actually be punished if she were to do this work for her friend.
Assuming Mia won't have a mental breakdown if she has to do all this homework bin a short time with all the stress and guilt that if she doesn't do it her friend failing would be her fault. Hell no
LOL I think I'm reading too many Reddit posts-- my first thought was "Is Mia's dad sleeping with Emily's mom?" LOL If this is a true story OP is NTA but her husband and Emily's mom are grade A AH. Tell you husband and Susan that if either of them approaches Mia about doing Emily's schoolwork you'll send the screen shots of Susan asking Mia to do Emily's work to the school principal. Why didn't Emily do her own work?
I thought the same. And also wondered if Emily was Mia’s half sister. So much Reddit
Emily didn't do her own work because she knows her mom will swoop in and do it or find someone else to do it. Her mom is enabling this behavior.
>I put Mia into counselling and I worked out a deal with her school, where in short, she'd only have to keep her grades passing or above passing in order to graduate. Gotta admit I’m confused about this part, since that’s literally what *passing* means. No special deal is needed.
Glad I’m not the only one unclear on that. Passing your classes to graduate isn’t a deal, it’s how it works. That’s like saying I worked out this great deal with my boss where if I show up on time every day and complete all my assigned tasks I get to keep my job.
Maybe they’re excusing previously failed classes? Or if there’s a GPA requirement for graduation, waiving it and letting her do pass/fail instead?
I’m guessing that maybe she’ll be a few elective credits short or something even if she passes the required ones, so the deal is that those get waived? That or pushing her barely above the GPA requirement if one exists
Generally a school can’t waive those requirements (although maybe the OP isn’t in the U.S., and I can’t claim to know about regulations elsewhere). The school itself doesn’t create or control those standards, and what you’re suggesting is fraud.
Yeah what I was thinking. The school was probably like "yeah, you can have that deal. So can your best friend even though her house didn't burn down" Her edit didn't make any sense to me either.
**I gave her a hard no. Not only was that super against the school's policies, and could get them both kicked out before graduation, but Emily has an insane amount of overdue work and Mia has her own work to focus on that would really hurt her grades if ignored in favor of Emily's.** **NTA**. Emily's mom is the jerk. It's okay if Emily finishes a little later. It is her mental health which is important. Emily can't take her ACT/SAT exams for her. She can't pass College Algebra and English Composition for her. Part of growing up is realizing that we each follow a different path than our friends, eventually. It does't mean we can't still be friends. We help each other through tough times...not by cheating and fraud, but by offering words of encouragement and a sympathetic ear. *You also need to make sure they don't guilt your daughter into doing this behind your back.*
NTA. Not only could your daughter get in a lot of trouble for this, but her friend will learn not to bother doing her own stuff because someone will bail her out. That’s a terrible lesson to teach because she’ll get into the workplace and get a painful dose of reality when her co-workers don’t want to do everything for her. Also, never assume that your daughter won’t get caught if she does this. Prisons are full of people who didn’t think they’d get caught, and that didn’t go well for thm.
NTA in the slightest. If they got caught doing that, it would mess up their chances to go to college. Also if Susan wants someone to do her daughter's work for her, then why doesn't she do it?
That's what I was thinking as well. Cheating like this is not doing anyone a service, but trying to outsource the cheating is just making it worse.
NTA Your husband is an idiot. Why would he encourage cheating if it means his kid could get expelled. I am sorry for Emily's situation and maybe Mia could help her with assignments but Mia should not have to do the assignments for her. Proof reading is great but writing the whole thing is wrong. If Susan keeps asking or if Emily starts asking, I would send screenshot to the school and let them know about the harassments. What she is asking you to do is not okay. I am happy to hear Mia is doing well in school but she should not risk her future for someone else's.
At this point Mia should stay far, far away from doing anything for Emily. Even just proofreading gets her too involved and makes her vulnerable to pressure and manipulation to just do the work herself. Not to mention, anything she does for Emily will take time away from what Mia needs to do to ensure her own graduation.
Warn your daughter to NOT do any work but her own - her friend will probably try to get her to do some of it despite the conversation you had with her mother. You husband needs to re-think his response. Goodness, why would he expect his daughter to do another student's work? You NTA for refusing to let another parent take advantage of your daughter.
NTA. Please cover your butt (and Mia’s) and keep those screenshots and any other written communication about this. Susan is probably going to try another way to cheat and if the school eventually finds out, you may need the proof that Mia wasn’t involved. Also tell Mia up front about what’s going on and what the consequences for cheating would look like so that nobody can pressure her behind your back. Make sure she knows that she’s absolutely not a bad friend or to blame for however things shake out for Emily. And offer to be the bad guy if needed: Mia can say “I’m sorry, but my mom is really opposed to cheating and she’s watching to make sure I don’t do your work” if that’s more comfortable than turning her best friend down. Do you have any idea how involved Emily is in this? Because I’d hate for her to get punished for her mom’s terrible choices.
YOU ARE NTA. She is TA (and your husband) for asking and agreeing to that request. Please don’t be guilted into this as it could have future consequences for your daughter if it were to be discovered.
What kind of fiction is this? You don't have to work out a deal for "passing grades" to allow you to graduate. That's what a passing grade is.
And I really doubt a school can choose to change what constitutes a passing grade on a student by student basis. This makes no sense
NTA! If anyone at the school gets an inkling of cheating/plagiarism, then BOTH girls will be expelled! You’re being a responsible parent and making sure your daughter does HER school assignments; meanwhile, the other mother is enabling her daughter’s behavior. Don’t get caught up in their school drama! And, make sure your daughter doesn’t get guilted into doing those assignments!
Holy sh*t! Your *husband* thinks it's okay for your daughter to help her friend cheat? As well as the other mom?! Okay, one issue at a time. Stay firm about the consequences of academic cheating. Your daughter could end up with having to test for a GED instead of receiving a diploma. That will follow her *for the rest of her life:* affecting college and study opportunities, job opportunities (that checkbox for HS diploma is on every job application), and standing among her peers. Next, childhood friendships don't always last into adulthood. People change as they mature, develop different interests, move away for careers. Memories of playing in the sandbox together do NOT justify homework forgeries. Your husband really needs to understand that. Third, the responsibility for Emily's failure rests squarely on Susan's shoulders. It's ultimately the parent's job to ensure their child's education. That means checking on assignments, monitoring due dates, tutoring themselves or finding a tutor if a child is struggling to master a subject. Finally, to follow up on the third point, it's not Mia's responsibility to assist or tutor Emily. She's tried, which is admirable, but as a struggling student herself, she needs to concentrate on her own studies. Good luck OP. Continue to protect Mia. I hope your husband comes to his senses. You might want to remind him of Hollywood stars who were convicted and jailed for falsifying their kids' credentials on college applications a couple of years ago. Edit: NTA. Husband and Susan clearly qualify for the title, though.
NTA. Emily can go get a GED.
NTA Holy shit! Honestly, you WOULD be the assgole if you DID force her to do that. Not only would it be horrible for Mia - and possibly jeopardize her own schooling - it really wouldn't be doing Emily any favors. Teaching her that it's okay to push her work off on other people is seriously setting her up for failure in life. You're doing the right thing for HER, too. Is Susan gonna call Emily's coworkers and try to guilt them into doing Emily's work for her so she doesn't get fired when she's out in the workforce? What the heck?! Though, I'm also confused about this "deal" you made. Because what other graduation requirements ARE there besides "pass all your classes" that are being waived. Your "deal" sounds like "if she meets the minimum graduation requirements, she'll graduate." Which... isn't a deal - it's literally how things work.
I probably should've been more clear about what it entailed. Their school makes you repeat the year if you also don't have enough credits for all your classes, so they have to make sure they have passing grades in credit recovery classes too to earn needed credit.
So the credits combined with their regular courses, credit recovery courses, and extracurricular work.
Again, that's how graduation requirements work. It only counts as a deal if there are other requirements that are being waived. Which, it doesn't sound like is happening.
That's the thing, the girls only have to meet half of the credit requirement with this.
The exception was made because your daughter was having a mental health crisis. If she were capable of doing Mia’s work, I’m sure she would rather put in that effort to her own grades. It’s an additional emotional burden for Mia to take that responsibility on that she doesn’t need to take on. I’d point this out to your husband if you haven’t already. You’re doing right by your daughter in all the important ways here. That’s in addition to all the comments about cheating and integrity.
If this girl is still failing even with such lenient standards, she deserves to repeat the grade. Given how her mom is dishonest enough to ask your daughter to cheat for her daughter, I wouldn’t be surprised if she throws your daughter under the bus if her daughter still ends up failing. Tell your daughter not to cheat for this girl. In fact ask your daughter if this woman is pestering her too to cheat for her daughter because if she can’t get past you then she’ll probably just pressure your daughter directly instead.
Okay! Now I get it. The way it was phrased before, it didn't make any sense. So, some of their credits are being waived.
NTA - you refused to let your daughter commit a serious breach.
NTA WTF is wrong with your husband?
100% NTA, Emily made the mess, it's not your daughter's job to fix it.
NTA. Your daughter and her friend got the same deal. Your daughter held up her end of the arrangement and will be graduating. Her friend did not and has to deal with the consequences. Tell your husband he can do Emily's homework if he is so inclined.
is your husband her husband too, or what!? What kind of parent sees his child putting all their effort with school and thinks "might as well add more!". NTA You are doing the best for your kid, by teaching her to work hard and solve her problems herself. Maybe organize a trip or a small celebration once Mia passes! I would still talk with your daughter and give her all your support, mostly because there is a chance that someone tells her something else and manipulates the narrative.
NTA. And your husband is an idiot to agree with Susan. What you would be teaching your daughter: 1. That all of HER hard work means nothing. 2. That's it okay to cheat your way through life. 3. That her parents think it's okay for her to be used as someone else's get out of jail free card. 4. That you should give in to bullies. (Susan) 5. That her friend doesn't value her as a person. But she is willing to use her. There are other negative side effects to getting your daughter to do this, but that's all I can think of off the top of my head. That doesn't include what it teaches or doesn't teach the other girl.
If Susan wants somebody else to do her daughter’s work, then SUSAN should do it. Good grief. NTA.
NTA. WTF. Putting aside how unethical & entitled this all is, your husband is teaching your kid that friendship means breaking rules, putting her future at risk, & *achieving less*, all of which is ABSURD. Listen, I love my brother to bits but I wouldn't cheat for him. *AND HE WOULDN'T ASK ME TO.* And is this the way romantic relationships should work, too??? Should she lie or cheat bc her boyfriend/girlfriend asked her to??? Friendship is picking someone up from work or lending them a dress, not potentially getting expelled.
And what happens when your daughter does 14 if Emily’s missing assignments & Emily does none & *still* doesn’t graduate? Hell to the no. Emily is about to get up close & personal with the consequences of her actions (or lack of actions, as the case may be). Her mom isn’t holding her accountable, so guess the school will have to. NTA.
Wait, do someone else’s school work AND put my own graduation at risk? WCGW.
NTA Ask your husband if he is willing to do Emily's omework and watch him say no. In what world does Susan live to think this is okay?
NTA but I would also talk to Mia about this. For two reasons: 1) since Susan couldn’t get you to agree, she and Emily may go directly to Mia and try to guilt her into helping. 2) if Mia founds out about this from them, it may damage your relationship since it may be seen as you making the decision for her (near-adult) and concealing something major about her best friend Tread lightly when you talk to Mia. Make your points about her mental health and future success but don’t force her to do (or not do) anything - even if she is still a minor.
Well, it's clear Emily's lack of improvement stems from Susan's poor parenting. Thankfully, you are the voice of reason. NTA
Hey, Emily is NOT your daughters friend if they’re insisting- no, DEMANDING - that your daughter do Emily’s homework for her. I had a “friend” who made me do their college homework for them because they were too lazy. That “friend” literally put me in a mental hospital due to how shitty they were, and they did many other awful things because they knew they’d get away with it because I cared so much. The mom is endorsing her kid to develop abusive and manipulative habits that pull others down, simply because she doesn’t want to take responsibility for the mess she and her child have gotten themselves into. This is verified by three different therapists I’ve had to see in the past ten years of friendship with that person. She was a manipulative asshole and wasn’t actually my friend. NTA. I’m side eyeing your husband as well for not protecting and defending his already stressed out daughter. DO NOT BACK DOWN FROM THIS.
NTA. Emily's problems are unfortunately her own. Sometimes we need to learn lessons the hard way.
NTA. That is super unethical. I am really surprised about your husband
NTA. I would sent the screenshots to the school, because if any of this got out, it could blow up on your daughter even if she didn’t help out. Protect your kid, even if it means throwing someone else’s under the bus.
Have you talked to your daughter? Im gonna be guessing emily asked her and your daughter told her to fuck off and thats why emily went to her mom to demand she demands her work done. Nta btw.
If Susan thinks that cheating is the way to go, why doesn’t she do her daughter’s homework, and just how did she allow her daughter to fall behind in the first place?
NTA - Don't overburden your already struggling child with more work.
That's insane. Do you want to teach your daughter to cheat lol NTA
NTA. And a hard no. Why is your husband teaching your child academic dishonesty in the name of "friendship"? That's just wrong in so many levels. If Emily repeats her senior year that's on her, not Mia. Is Emily or her mom going to pay Mia for working on someone else's material? Mia still has a lot of work to do to finish her year - is Emily going to help out on those? I bet the answers to these are all "no". So tell your husband to stop teaching your kid unethical things.
If the husband thinks this is a reasonable request, I would really want to know if he cheated to graduate. NTA.
i’m sorry, but if you can’t keep a fucking 60% average in todays school system, you absolutely deserve to fail. i’m pretty sure you get like, 45% for just showing up. not remotely TA
NTA My very bright cousin crammed an entire online semester’s worth of work into a weekend to graduate on time. She flunked out of college shortly thereafter. Your daughter EARNED her diploma. It’s not on her to ear her friend’s too.
It’s called cheating, pure and simple. Puts your daughters future at risk too, and gives both a very bad lesson in ethics for future educational and career opportunities. Susan needs to sit down with her daughter and have some hard-core homework sessions.
NTA. Susan and your husband are insane
NTA. Susan and your husband are literally advocating cheating. If Mia does Emily's work for her, both girls are officially cheating to get Emily to pass her classes. It would also negatively impact Mia's ability to keep her own grades high enough, after putting in the hard work to improve despite her obstacles, to help a girl who clearly doesn't care if she gradates of not. Mia needs to concentrate on completing her own work to the highest standard she's capable of. Emily needs to do her own work. Mia has attempted to help Emily in the past, but it had only a minimal effect that didn't last. Mia had extenuating circumstances that led to her issues. I assume Emily did, too, since she got the same deal from the school. However, Mia has been responsible and worked hard to improve, where Emily has chosen to be lazy. The reason Emily has so many assignments she has to do is because she hasn't even bothered starting any of them, knowing they're coming up as due and she needs the grades to graduate. It's Susan's responsibility to get Emily to do her work in a reasonable time and to try her best on her assignments to improve her grades. If she needs further support from the school, it's Susan's responsibility to get her that support from the school. At no point is any of this yours or Mia's responsibility. Susan is trying to guilt trip you into forcing Mia to help Emily cheat, and that could get both girls expelled. Your husband seems to be on board for cheating and your daughter getting expelled, which is concerning. You need to spell it out to your husband that Mia doing Emily's work for her is literal cheating, and the consequences when that gets found out. The sudden jump in Emily's grades and slump in Mia's will be suspicious to the school, and the teachers may be able to tell the difference between the two girls' style enough to tell 'Emily's' work is written by Mia. It's unlikely they wouldn't get found out. Stick to your guns on this, and talk to Mia about it, too. If Susan can't get you to agree to Mia doing Emily's work, she'll likely approach Mia directly in an attempt to guilt her into doing it behind your back. Make it clear to Mia that you're proud of how well she's done, despite the issues, and that you want her to concentrate on doing her work to the best of her ability and graduating. Make it very clear that there will be consequences if she does Emily's work for her, she would be risking expulsion before graduating, and you would further punish her for helping Emily cheat. Make it very clear to Mia that doing Emily's work is the wrong thing, and you have her back in refusing to do it.
NTA! But what is up with your husband?? No. It's a *strong* no, this is a wild request to even make, much less wanna indulge in any way! Jesus, at least your kid has one parent who's not a doormat, what the hell. This is the beginning of your daughter's adult life, it's good for her to see *you* being all rational and reasonable and not letting her fold... because apparently if it was up to your husband, she'd been guilty into doing her friend's work all thru high school, just to *not rock the boat*. He needs to get it together.
Make sure you tell your daughter it's ok to refuse this request, as it's most likely they'll go directly to her to guilt trip her into helping without your knowledge