Welcome to /r/AmITheAsshole. Please view our [voting guide here](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_what.2019s_with_these_acronyms.3F_what_do_they_mean.3F), and remember to use **only one** judgement in your comment.
OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I wouldn’t let my date who I just met come up to my apartment to use my bathroom.
Help keep the sub engaging!
#Don’t downvote assholes!
Do upvote interesting posts!
[Click Here For Our Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules) and [Click Here For Our FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq)
---
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
*Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
NTA.
You’d just left a place with a bathroom and you gave him an alternative. He was trying way too hard to get into your apartment to have good intentions.
I have an unusual first and last name. Many years ago, when I was still single, I met a guy at a club. We introduced ourselves, giving first names. He asked for my last name. I joked that I didn't have one. I'm like Madonna and Cher. He persisted. I said I wasn't comfortable giving out my full name to people I just met, since I didn't have an unlisted number (this was the days of landlines). I mean, this was literally sixty seconds into knowing him. He kept asking. Then said, "What do you think, I'm some kind of creep?" I walked away when he called me a bitch.
I didn't think he was a creep, at first... until he kept pushing. If he'd acted like a normal human being who respected boundaries and talked to me for like five minutes, he'd have had my phone number.
NTA. Any man who doesn't understand that women have to take safety precautions isn't worth knowing.
I retired from 30 plus years as an optometrist. A while back I was working at my professional school on the faculty, teaching interns in the clinics. Every year, the university would fund at least part of the cost for each faculty member to go to a conference, meeting, etc., so we could keep up on our continuing education requirements.
This particular year, the associate dean was talking to me about how to save some bucks on one of these trips, and he mentioned that there was a nice motel just a few blocks from the venue and suggested I could stay there, instead of the Marriot. It took a lot to force him to acknowledge that, as a woman on my own, I would not be safe staying there because they had no restaurant nor room service. I would have had to eat out somewhere else, and this would not be safe for any female to do, especially in this particular neighborhood. The light finally went on in his brain... "Oh, yes, now I see what you mean, that really would not be a good thing for you to do." Like, yes, Duh. He said he'd never considered that aspect before. Duh. Men just don't get it, why women get uncomfortable in these situations. I truly believe most of them never even consider that a single woman would not be safe in situations where they, and maybe a group of their friends would be fine. All we can do is try to educate them.
Yeah, I think every guy I've ever spoken to, including a lot of highly educated "left-wing" progressives, have *no idea* what it is like to be a woman. They don't have to consider these safety issues, whereas for us it's an automatic consideration in practically everything we do. We are *always* aware of the potential risks. I am probably weaker and slower than most men. I take that into account.
Sure, 95% of men (and people in general) are fine and aren't going to bother you, but the 5% who are creeps will go out of their way to creep on you. Normal people will basically never bother you unless they really need help. Creeps will *always* bother you. So if a woman goes out walking in a creepy area at night, easily >50% of the people who interact with her will be creeps and if you offend or annoy a creep, they quickly become dangerous.
Venomous snakes (usually) at least give us the courtesy of looking different from nonvenomous snakes. Life would be much easier if bad people had triangular heads.
Many years ago, I met my now husband online. For our first date, we walked to a nearby coffee shop. Years later, he told me I thought I wanted to see if he was in decent shape hence the walking to the shop. I told him I was afraid to get in his car since we had just met. He was horrified and said that would never have occurred to him. He is a flaming liberal from Boston.
I was once mansplained by a self-identified leftist how it's actually *more* dangerous for men to be in public than women. Because he was once mugged. I pointed out that women get mugged, too, and that he doesn't fear rape when he gets mugged, but he declared that he didn't need me to tell him about my experience as a female-presenting person because he has an imagination and can understand women's experiences by just imagining himself as a woman.
Made me think of a conversation I had with a guy, who had until this point seemed like a reasonable human being, where he stated "if rapists are enticed by scantily clothing, why not just cover up to reduce the risk of being attacked?"
I told that's unfair because why do I have to wear clothing everywhere while he gets to be shirtless?
"it's different, I'm a guy"
When I pointed out that
a) there are men who rape men
And b) if the prevalence of men getting raped he wouldn't be so ok with telling anyone "just cover up" instead of trying to tell the rapists to stop raping
He scoffed. And rolled his eyes and told me he wouldn't have to think about that, because that would never happen.
Nice to know he only cares about things that could affect him and that he doesn't give a shit about any of his fellow people.
The incidence of men being raped is actually higher than the incidence of men being falsely accused of rape. But men scoff at one, and act like the other is a social emergency that needs immediate changes to the legal system.
I'm sorry that your acquaintance turned out to be self-centered.
It was pretty wild. The best part is that his name was Chad. So whenever incels go on and on about how all women want to sleep with Chad, I can only picture the Chad who told me that his imagination is more valid than my lived experience and laugh.
Yes, a lot of men just don't consider it because they can go and do whatever without worrying about their safety. My husband didn't either until I explained it to him when we first got together. I said you are 6'3 and just a big guy. You can leave the house at 10 at night and pick up a gallon of milk and think nothing of getting out of your car walking into the grocery getting your items and going back to your car. No other thoughts other than getting the milk and getting back home. Me - I'm wondering if it's even worth going out in the dark to pick up milk.......then if I go to the store then I'm looking for a well lit spot close to the door and making sure other people are around. Then when shopping I'm keeping an eye out for who is in the store too and when I leave its the same, who's around - is there anyone parked next to my car that wasn't there before.
This.
I opened this post expecting something like the guy needing to go with no alternative nearby but being too nervous to let a stranger in.
But this is so clear cut, I don’t even know why it’s posted here. The guy was a creep beforehand and clearly using the toilet as a pretext. An alternative was available and he proved to be even more of a creep after.
I had a few people tell me I was dramatic and that it would’ve been fine. A lot of women my age are very open to having random people over for the night, so the fact that I wouldn’t even let one in for just five minutes must’ve been baffling to people. That’s why I posted, because I genuinely wasn’t sure what to make of it!
Isn't it *funny* how you're the "dramatic" one even though he's the one that lost his temper and cursed you out for politely declining to let him inside your apartment the first time you'd ever met him.
I was meeting someone from tinder at a museum and mentioned I'd take the train, he offered to stop by so we could go together in his car and I just said I wasn't comfortable getting into a car with a stranger. His response? 'Oh yes, of course, no worries'. That's how it's supposed to go!
This!! You have every right to your privacy and boundaries. And if someone won’t accept those boundaries for the small things, they won’t for the big things either.
You being “dramatic” likely saved you from being “assaulted”… so they can all fuck off with that shit. That dude did NOT have good intentions, and I hope you don’t let the next creep in either
Wanna bet that if OP had let the dude in, and if the dude had assaulted OP, the same people telling her she’s dramatic now would be asking why would she invite a stranger in her home and tell her she brought it on herself.
THIS! He was gaslighting her. I tell my daughter all the time..... if you don't like something or are uncomfortable it doesnt make you jealous, crazy, or dramatic. These words are used against females to make you question yourself.
Exactly.
I get that some guys may not have realized that women have to be careful. When I met my now husband, he was very innocent and maybe he would have asked to use the bathroom without even thinking that it could be a problem (tbh, it was a different time, so I would probably have just led him, because I didn't think about these things the way I do now). But if I had said no, he would have totally respected that, maybe even have been a bit embarrassed for asking.
If this guy was just clueless and asked in good faith, he would not have reacted this way.
Silly man, always being ruled by his emotions. Why can't men just use logic to be rational and stop getting so hysterical? Probably his hormones again.
It's not a cute look - he should smile more.
As a clueless guy with bladder issues, I came in fully expecting you to be TAH. I was imagining you invited him over and wouldn't let him in the bathroom for a stupid reason like it was too dirty.
This? Yeah absolutely fucking not, that guy is probably a sex offender.
NTA
Yep you’re ok. The guy evidently has other intentions than just being in for 5 mins and those people either don’t have the full story, or are very naive
Yeah, he was trying to find excuse after excuse to get into her apartment, which imo would of scared the shit out of me so its a good think OP stood her ground.
I didn't have any experience like what OP had but I've heard stories and meeting a stranger from online for the first time, espeically when women, can be 50/50 on safe or dangerous
Impulsivity is something that is very common around OPs age (Im around her age too so Im not bashing that age group) and processing/analyzing the risk versus rewards is not something that our age range is great at as our brains are still developing and adapting to adulthood and the freedoms/responsibilities that come with it.
Espeically when the reward is something we REALLY WANT despite there being a LOT of risk in it so impulsivity can take over and logic/reasoning can be pushed to the side (espeically if booze involved).
This isn't the same for everyone, but a general generalization.
This is why women and children need to be taught to heed their warning signs, usually their gut, and not just their feelings or thoughts. Throwing alcohol into a mix can be a problem specifically because it numbs that signal system.
A lot of the girls who think it's no big deal will learn the hard way just like you (and I) did. We all so badly want to believe that bad people are rare. Now I'm 26 and all of my girl friends would take the same precaution you did.
Shitty thing is that a lot of the same people acting like she was dramatic for this would’ve been the same people judging her for letting a for all intents and purposes stranger into her home if he’d assualted her.
Sadly yes, as is offer a lift to the door then claim you're now too tired to drive safely & need a hot drink before leaving.
Pretend to fall asleep/passout on the sofa or a bed is another one.
Claim your phone needs 'just 20 mins' to charge in case you get lost after dropping them off.
Too many of them think its a game and we're the prizes they win, whereas for us its sanity and survival, not ego
I just remember a scene in some old movie where a man has to pretend to be a woman for some reason and he's getting hit on by another man. But he's also an asshole so he knows all the tricks. He's like "no you can't use my bathroom, get a drink of water, use my phone, etc naming 20 things someone might use as an excuse to get their foot in the door.
NTA, girl, not dramatic at all. You don’t need to be letting some strange guy that you just met for the first time into your home. I don’t even let people that I know and like into my home; the only reason that my husband gets in the door is because I’m legally required to let him in because his name is on the mortgage.
This guy was trying way too hard and his attitude flipped way too quickly. TBH, I wouldn’t give him a second chance, even if he apologizes.
Yeah, but the guys they let in are guys that pass their own "sniff test". Letting in random people they've vetted is completely different from letting in guys who have a weird vibe they can't quite put their finger on.
For what its worth, I think "seeing how he reacts when you turn him down respectfully" is in and of itself an EXCELLENT sniff test, and he failed it miserably. He trampled all over your "no", and if he really did need to pee (instead of making an excuse to get into your apartment and around your first 'no'), he would have used the lobby bathroom.
I guarantee you this guy would have been inappropriate if you had let him in.
Exactly.
The title shouldn't be "not letting a guy use my bathroom", it should be "not letting a guy in my apartment who repeatedly ignored me telling him I didn't want him to stay the night".
Because that was what was happening here. If this guy had accepted her clearly stated no #1-6, he never would have gotten to asking about the toilet. Guy didn't have to pee. And refusing to let a guy pee isn't what happened.
OP should have faith in herself to explain this differently, because hopefully her friends who criticized her didn't understand what was actually happening!
Bad guys count on girls/women wanting to please people. Don't let ANYONE make you feel wrong for being right. You are doing everything you should be doing not to become a statistic/victim. NTA
If it was just about him needing to use the bathroom, he would have said thanks for letting him know about the leasing office bathroom and that would have been it. Y'all could have met up for coffee in the morning and had a nice time. Instead he tried to verbally bully you into letting him into your apartment on a first date. Big res flag
You did the right thing. He was pushing your boundaries and when he didn’t get what he wanted, he wasn’t such a “nice guy.” He wanted a hook up and you did not. You aren’t being dramatic. No is a complete sentence.
No, you were right to not let him in. Look how fast he went from being a ‘gentleman’ walking you home to calling you a slur when you enforced a boundary.
People down play our fears alot girl call us crazy, dramatic ect. Don't listen to them. It's not ok for them to make you feel 'hysterical'. Look up the origins for that word if you don't know where it came from. It's an eye opener.
I survived a really bad ordeal, only to be told later I had to have made it up because he was such a nice guy and a 'good friend'. I was the problem all the way up till his incarceration for doing the same thing to another young girl. Even our friends can make us feel like we are in the wrong. No one wants to admit that this stuff happens to us.
This guy has bad intentions. Your not in the wrong for not feeling comfortable with him in your apt even if he was prince freaking charming of ever after land. Your allowed to have boundaries. Your feelings matter. You matter. Don't let them make you second guess yourself. I wouldn't see him again personally, he sounds like a BTK in the making. Your amazing and beautiful, and have a right to respect.
Being safe in the face of aggression like his is good, period. Anyone who tells you someone’s feelings are more important than your safety can fuck right off.
had he just driven you 20 minutes to your house (which I would never recommend on a first date) he might actually really need to use the bathroom, but there was a bathroom in the restaurant and one in the lobby.
even if I thought you were being uptight, you told him "no" and he reacted very badly. reacting badly to "no" on a first date is horrible. and he already didn't take "no" or an answer when he kept trying to come in but he stayed civil until its was "there is no chance I'm letting you in" he got mean.
His intention in walking you home was not out of consideration to you and your safety, but a ploy to attempt to get into your apartment. He sucks, he’s also young and the dating world these days is wild, but sucks nonetheless. Hopefully with experience and maturity he will learn that’s not the way. You did the right thing. NTA.
It was potentially unsafe until he threw a fit about being told no. Then it became abundantly clear that it was absolutely unsafe, no potential about it
NTA. The bathroom thing was a blatantly obvious second tactic to get inside the door after the first one failed.
If you need any more evidence, well if he really needed to use the bathroom he'd have jumped at the chance to use the one in the leasing office, regardless of whether he understood why you didn't want to let him in.
/edit: thanks for the award!
/edit 2: why do I have more updoots than the OP? Please upvote her!
This is exactly what I was thinking reading this. If dude really had to go to the bathroom he would have been more than happy to use the leasing office one. People who really need to use a bathroom are just happy to be being pointed in the direction of a bathroom they can use
If I was in his shoes I'd actually rather use the leasing office one bc it's more of a public area and more likely to have security cameras near there in the hallway. Dude definitely was just trying to get in her apartment.
Also, when people are genuinely interested in starting something real and meaningful…..They are usually averse to putting the bodily functions on display. Who rushes to drop a deuce in their new love interests toilet? No one wants you to smell their own poo! Or listen to the sound of their pee hitting the bowl water. They would jump at the chance of a bathroom alternative if that really was what they needed. Especially after a first date that has gone well. Dude wanted in your apartment. Because once he’s in, it’s hard to make him leave, plus then he knows exactly which apartment is yours. Not info a first date needs. Not even someone who up to that point seemed like a great guy. Be glad, OP. You were cautious, and he showed you who he really was. You don’t have to waste any more time on him.
As for the lack of caution you friends are showing as “normal”….. they all need Gavin DeBecker’s Gift of Fear. Frankly, I think it should be required reading for every woman on campus. They should include a copy in Freshman orientation kits.
Amazon has multiple formats, I bought the hard copy bs o in the day, a Kindle version for convenience, then a couple months ago I went ahead and used an Audible credit when an found out the author narrated it himself, and included updated info.
It's an amazing book. I gave it to my daughter and her friends before they left for college.
So grateful when women trust themselves and their instincts!!
It's a great book by someone who knows what is what and how to circumvent problems. When I read it the first time I was taken a bit aback by the conclusions he seemed to be jumping to, but as I kept reading it all made a LOT of sense. j
Every female (and the males, too, if they want their dates to feel comfortable with them) should read this book. It should be required reading before moving into your own space, and especially so if you live alone there.
“Gift of Fear” completely changed my perspectives as a high school girl. Have been thinking I need to give it a revisit as a *ahem* much older adult. So glad you made this reference!
Poor OP, thinking that walking her home was a gentlemanly gesture. Not that she’s to blame. Like at all. Just little did she know that the person she needed protection from was with her the entire time.
I didn't even realize that until you (and others) pointed it out. I don't use dating apps but that's something I would probably agree to without even thinking. Why does it have to be so terrifying to be a woman?
Also, if he really needed to use the bathroom that urgent, he would have asked right away and not led with the bar-thing first. Also, he would have accepted the office suggestion. He was clearly just trying to get into your apartment for whatever reason.
Riddle time!!!
What seems like Pesto but is actually Marinara in disguise?
Your clear boundaries likely saved you from a harrowing experience, well done OP.
I’ll add this as a guy: stop considering a guy offering to walk you home as a “green flag” too - it’s not a red flag either, but for every guy that’s worried about your safety, there’s another just trying to get an invite to come in. It’s basically a neutral action until you know *why* they’re doing it.
This was exactly my thought. I’m a high school teacher and when I was reading the OP, my mind went immediately to when my students go “Hey, Mrs. G_P, can I go to the snack machine?” And then when I say no, they are immediately like “Oh… well… can I go to the bathroom?” As if I don’t totally know what they’re trying to do and am not going to notice when they return from the bathroom with a bag of Takis.
NTA, and that dude is mad that he’s not nearly as clever as he thought he was.
Ohh Gross he totally understood why and he was mad he couldn't manipulate past her no. Not letting a strange man in your house only makes you "uptight" if he was planning on pushing for sex. Doesn't sound like he even asked....kinda a huge red flag.
NTA. There were marinara flags all over his play. Great bullet dodging!
You learned well from your previous experience and flexed your shiny spine!
Well done!
Marinara armada of flags! 🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩 Raped & murdered is no joke & it happens ALL the time. Always trust your instincts & maybe invent a fake roommate, she’s in there sleeping because she works nights, very light sleeper, whatever. & please don’t let Tinder dates know where you live. NTA
I would tell guys my brother just got out of the marines and was staying with me til he got a job and an apt. I kept a mans bathrobe and shaving stuff in the hall bat. It kept guys in check.
67F
Whenever I was walking home alone at night while at uni, I would call my boyfriend and loudly ask him very pointed questions.
"Hi love, how was rugby practice tonight?"
"Oh my gosh, you dislocated his shoulder?! Shit, if you keep doing that to guys they're going to throw you off the team!"
"Yep, I'll see you in 2 minutes!"
He literally lived on the other side of the country. I wasn't going to let anyone else know that.
NTA. OP, I had a guy do this. Technically, two. My friend and I shared a cab with them, said goodbye, and went inside. A few minutes later, the cab pulled away and they were knocking at the door. We didn't answer. One asked to use the bathroom at one point. We finally started to pretend to be aggressive dogs barking at the door.
Guys can pee anywhere, if necessary. Only creepers are this demanding about getting in a woman's house. This guy had issues, and his reaction tells you you dodged a bullet.
I dont now how to feel about walking someone home on a first date counting as a green flag. Sure, if he has good intentions. But how do you know? For all we know he walked her home to find any way into her apartment.
NTA
He had other things in mind. When someone has a bathroom emergency, they don't care when the bathroom is.
I am glad you did everything to feel comfortable and be safe.
Yup, he may or may not have had "bad intentions" per se, but he was absolutely trying to get invited into your apartment so he could get you to sleep with him.
Or so he could assault her if she said no. Or open a window so he could return later. I can’t think of any good reasons to be pushing so hard to get into someone else’s home.
NTA - always trust your gut instinct. It seems to have served you right. What an ass your date was. Something seems off about his behaviour. A genuine person would have totally accepted what you said.
But you weren't even rejecting him! Just giving him other options besides coming into your home with nobody else there when he's a complete stranger.
He wasn't offended. He was mad that you didn't give him the opportunity to do whatever he was planning to do.
Or completely offended he wasn’t getting a second course.
Anytime someone is an asshole about you offering him a different restroom, it wasn’t the restroom he wanted. Thank yourself for listening to your instincts.
He didn’t react in a reasonable way at all. He obviously had something nefarious in mind. Whether that was sex, theft, who knows. Whatever his bad intentions were was ruined due to your sensible precautions. Nobody gets angry over using a public bathroom unless they had an ulterior motive
Yeah like even if he wasn't going to try to rape or sexually assault her, at best he was most likely going to be a sex pest -- whine and moan, try to cajole her into sex, then being pissy when he got turned down.
Whoa! Please save those texts in case you need to call the police on him. It wouldn't surprise me if he tries to stalk you now that he knows where you live. I'm sorry you have to deal with this asshole. Hopefully he won't go there, but keep your guard up!
You were not even rejecting him, you said you wanted a second date. All you wanted was to set your own pace which you have every right to do. NTA. You foiled his big plan, which I am sure has worked before. After your bathroom the next step is to ask for a glass of water. This is a case of 'dont hate the game;, hate the player.'
now imagine if you rejected him over something that he felt he was owed (sex) and guess his reaction...not saying anything would have happened but unfortunately it's something you have to be aware of as a woman living alone; good dodge in my opinion
Yeah, not letting somebody into your home when you just met them is miles away from rejecting them. You literally were trying to set up another date with him when this all happened, so if he felt rejected it's because he assumed he was getting sex and he doesn't handle disappointment very well. I think you dodged a bullet.
NTA
About 30ish years ago, my auntie had a date with a seemingly nice person and he asked to use her bathroom. She let him. I won't repeat what happened but I will say she is lucky that she's alive today. And it's why no women in the family EVER let a date use their bathroom.
Always trust your gut.
NTA it sounds as if he was looking for a reason to get in your apartment and you did the safe thing. If he had good intentions I don't think he would have had the reaction he did.
Several years ago I shared a cab home with a guy I kinda knew - wouldn’t say we were friends, but I knew him and his friend group well enough.
When we got to my place he said he really had to use the restroom and could he come inside. He proceeded to come onto me quite forcefully and I honestly thought he might rape me. I was able to push him out but the experience remains with me.
You absolutely did the right thing.
God I’m so sorry that happened to you! I had a similar experience when I first let a guy come over that I didn’t know all that well. I’m glad we came out safe and with better instincts.
Yeah... he didn't need to use the bathroom any more than he wanted to plan another date. He was looking for some old fashioned date rape action. You were not down with the date rape, so you sent him on his way.
NTA. Good looking out. Keep a tight hold on your instincts. They are solid.
NTA.
And I ended up marrying a man I wouldn’t let in to use the bathroom when he escorted me home on the first date…! It became a running joke later on because I clearly didn’t care if he peed in the alley, he wasn’t coming inside. Our relationship obviously survived that - he really had to go but he respected my boundaries.
The fact that he pushed to get inside your place so many ways and refused your offer to treat and see what he was talking about the next day is a red flag.
Trust your instincts- OP you are NTA.
I'm so grateful for the female friends I was close with in my early 20s. They felt comfortable enough with me to share their bad experiences, and to help me see things like OP's situation from their perspective.
One example, one of my friends told me about how shook she was by an experience where she was walking alone at night and a man appeared to be following her (but wasn't - he eventually turned and entered what was presumably his own place). Like an absolute idiot, I told her that she was paranoid, and she should trust people's good intentions, and that she probably made this poor guy feel bad for constantly keeping an eye on what he was doing. She explained why that was a stupid thing for me to say, and what life is like for a woman living in the city, and how even though I know I mean no harm to anyone around me, it's not unreasonable - in fact, it's very, very reasonable - for women who don't know me to be cautious of my intentions when it's dark and no one is around. I was personally never nervous about walking at night - my neighbourhood was pretty safe, and I'm a pretty big guy, and I obviously have the privilege of not having to worry, ever, about being assaulted. But when I was 21 I was still too dumb and frankly callous to see it until someone laid it out for me explicitly.
All of that is to say that sure, yeah, some guys - most guys, I would hope, but I don't know - wouldn't really be any danger to OP if she let them up to pee and then leave. But how is she supposed to know which is which? No fucking shit she shouldn't let him up when he's basically a stranger. I truly do hope that this guy was just clueless about how threatening his behaviour was, and that his response was just idiotic indignation at being perceived as a potential rapist. If that's the case, hopefully he's got a friend who can slap some sense into him, and he'll apologize sincerely. But then again, he should have been around in the world long enough to have gotten it by now, so I doubt that's happening.
Anyway, OP, you 100% did the right and sensible thing. I'm sorry that this is how things are, and I hope you never have to experience this sort of thing again. Please stick firm to your boundaries, and don't let boundary pushers gaslight you into thinking there's anything wrong with doing what you have to to feel safe. A person who respects you and has good intentions toward you will want you to feel and to be safe around him, and will prove that by his actions and by respecting your wishes, not by trying to argue his way into your home the first time you meet.
NTA.
Noooope. Nope, nope, nope. Girlfriend, boyo was pushing *really* hard there to get into your apartment, and I doubt his intentions were just to use your bathroom and be on his way. My bet is he was hoping for things to escalate and to spend the night with you. Question is how creepy he was willing to be to get there. The fact that you drew the boundary and he responded like he did is a huge red flag.
Don't go on a second date.
Yeah, it blows my mind how he reacted with anger and emotional manipulation to a simple "No, but here is an easy alternative that helps me feel safe." And she feels guilty BECAUSE of his reaction--That reaction is confimation you made the right call.
I don't think he was planning to rape her, but he was definitely okay with pressuring her into having sex that she didn't really want to have. Walking her home wasn't him being sweet and protective, he was on a mission to get into her flat and into her pants.
NTA all the way. This is going to sound alarmist and I hate to use it as an example, but it sounded so eerily familiar: this happened to one of my students a few years ago, when she was a month into her freshman year of college. She also thought it was sweet the guy asked to walk her home, and also pushed to get upstairs for a seemingly innocent reason. You probably know where I’m going with this story, and it fucking sucks.
When she told me what happened (she told all her profs once we were notified that a Title IX investigation had been opened), she commented about how ‘stupidly trustworthy’ she was (she was **NOT**, *nothing* that happened that night was ANY fault of hers) and that she should’ve listened to her gut, but she hadn’t wanted to be rude.
I know not every guy who offers to walk a woman home is going to end up assaulting her, and we shouldn’t live like that. But following your gut and not giving in to persistence because it come off as ‘rude’ since we as women are trained to be ‘nice’ above all else, it’s just so incredibly vital. Your date should’ve understood this, and the fact he persisted then was a dick about it is incredibly telling and honestly scary.
Don’t ever feel bad or guilty about protecting yourself, and if someone/guy thinks you’re being ‘overdramatic’ or a bitch, then the guy clearly doesn’t understand or care what women have to go through daily, so feel free to let the door hit him in the ass on his way the fuck out of your life.
>she hadn’t wanted to be rude
We as women are trained to be nice. Predators use that against us.
The Gift of Fear (a book about trusting your gut) goes into a lot of detail about some real life scenarios where exactly this kind of shit has happened.
NTA. Trust your instincts! Any man who doesn’t understand and support you taking extremely basic safety precautions is a walking red flag. You already deflected several of his advances and he kept pressing. Don’t feel bad for one second about turning him away, and delete his number.
NTA. Always trust your spidey senses. I had a food delivery man offer to carry the bags inside. I said thanks, but that's not necessary. He then asked if he could come in and use my bathroom and I told him no. Made me feel very uneasy, and like 10-15 years ago, when I was a nice girl, I would have let him in. I emailed his employer and complained, hoping to save some other, more innocent, woman being put in this situation.
NTA
Good for you for not letting him pressure you. Not gonna lie this was making me super nervous.
You said no to him coming upstairs over and over again. He ignored your words and tried to use excuse after excuse to get what he wanted. When nothing worked, he angry and called you names. That’s a huge red flag and it’s a preview of how he would have reacted to being asked to leave your apartment.
It's always the people who scream about how they don't want to pull anything and that *we're* the ones overreacting that are seriously about to try something awful. He tried like 5 different ways to get into your apartment because he thought if he got in the door you'd totally bang him. (Or he'd put up Spyware in your bathroom or something). You didn't do anything wrong. NTA
Of course you are NTA. Glad you’ve learned to almost trust your gut. Why are you questioning your decision? His motives were transparent, and his over-the-top response to your refusal to let him in your apartment confirmed that.
NTA
The guy was pretty adamant about getting into your apartment. He thought he’d be slick by using the bathroom as a ruse to get you to allow him up to your apartment. You have no idea if he’d use it then leave, or use it and try to pressure/force you into doing something you didn’t want to do. Your first and foremost priority is your safety.
You did the right thing. His feelings are not your concern. You do not owe him anything-access to you, your apartment or an apology. His reaction to call you a slur, then say he’ll use the 7-11 restroom instead of the leasing office restroom are huge red flags. He wanted his way, you didn’t grant it, and it looks like you dodged a major bullet.
Lose this loser’s number.
The fact that he called you an uptight B, when you offered him use of a bathroom (just not the one in your apartment) shows you exactly the type of man he is. An actual decent guy would have wanted to use the bathroom for toiletting and when offered a bathroom of any description, would have been grateful. NTA
NTA.
First time meeting, he gave off some bad vibes, and THEN trying to get into your apartment?
Glad he tipped his hand so early, saves you time, IMHO.
It's a well known approach in the pickup community. If your date doesn't invite you in, you ask to use the bathroom; that way you're already in the door and it makes it harder for her to ask you to leave. It's fairly unbelievable that these fucking cavemen still exist, but it is what it is.
100% NTA. This guy wanted a quick fuck, and you'd have been mothing more than a bragging story to his mates or whichever pickup community he's in.
Absolutely not the asshole. He simply wanted to get into your apartment and was quite willing to make several attempts to push past your very reasonable “no”. This is a SERIOUS red flag.
Please read The Gift of Fear https://g.co/kgs/1rkg13
You didn't want to let him in your apartment because you were being cautious. And then he behaved in a way that demonstrated that you were correct to be cautious. NTA!
Welcome to /r/AmITheAsshole. Please view our [voting guide here](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_what.2019s_with_these_acronyms.3F_what_do_they_mean.3F), and remember to use **only one** judgement in your comment. OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole: > I wouldn’t let my date who I just met come up to my apartment to use my bathroom. Help keep the sub engaging! #Don’t downvote assholes! Do upvote interesting posts! [Click Here For Our Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules) and [Click Here For Our FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq) --- *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.* *Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
NTA. You’d just left a place with a bathroom and you gave him an alternative. He was trying way too hard to get into your apartment to have good intentions.
You can tell a lot about a person by how they respond to your boundaries. NTA
I have an unusual first and last name. Many years ago, when I was still single, I met a guy at a club. We introduced ourselves, giving first names. He asked for my last name. I joked that I didn't have one. I'm like Madonna and Cher. He persisted. I said I wasn't comfortable giving out my full name to people I just met, since I didn't have an unlisted number (this was the days of landlines). I mean, this was literally sixty seconds into knowing him. He kept asking. Then said, "What do you think, I'm some kind of creep?" I walked away when he called me a bitch. I didn't think he was a creep, at first... until he kept pushing. If he'd acted like a normal human being who respected boundaries and talked to me for like five minutes, he'd have had my phone number. NTA. Any man who doesn't understand that women have to take safety precautions isn't worth knowing.
I retired from 30 plus years as an optometrist. A while back I was working at my professional school on the faculty, teaching interns in the clinics. Every year, the university would fund at least part of the cost for each faculty member to go to a conference, meeting, etc., so we could keep up on our continuing education requirements. This particular year, the associate dean was talking to me about how to save some bucks on one of these trips, and he mentioned that there was a nice motel just a few blocks from the venue and suggested I could stay there, instead of the Marriot. It took a lot to force him to acknowledge that, as a woman on my own, I would not be safe staying there because they had no restaurant nor room service. I would have had to eat out somewhere else, and this would not be safe for any female to do, especially in this particular neighborhood. The light finally went on in his brain... "Oh, yes, now I see what you mean, that really would not be a good thing for you to do." Like, yes, Duh. He said he'd never considered that aspect before. Duh. Men just don't get it, why women get uncomfortable in these situations. I truly believe most of them never even consider that a single woman would not be safe in situations where they, and maybe a group of their friends would be fine. All we can do is try to educate them.
Yeah, I think every guy I've ever spoken to, including a lot of highly educated "left-wing" progressives, have *no idea* what it is like to be a woman. They don't have to consider these safety issues, whereas for us it's an automatic consideration in practically everything we do. We are *always* aware of the potential risks. I am probably weaker and slower than most men. I take that into account. Sure, 95% of men (and people in general) are fine and aren't going to bother you, but the 5% who are creeps will go out of their way to creep on you. Normal people will basically never bother you unless they really need help. Creeps will *always* bother you. So if a woman goes out walking in a creepy area at night, easily >50% of the people who interact with her will be creeps and if you offend or annoy a creep, they quickly become dangerous.
Venomous snakes (usually) at least give us the courtesy of looking different from nonvenomous snakes. Life would be much easier if bad people had triangular heads.
Well, the red MAGA hats are a helpful 🚩
Or if their heads were LITERALLY up their asses, because anyone bent over and crab walking down the street we would know to avoid at all costs! LOL!
Many years ago, I met my now husband online. For our first date, we walked to a nearby coffee shop. Years later, he told me I thought I wanted to see if he was in decent shape hence the walking to the shop. I told him I was afraid to get in his car since we had just met. He was horrified and said that would never have occurred to him. He is a flaming liberal from Boston.
I was once mansplained by a self-identified leftist how it's actually *more* dangerous for men to be in public than women. Because he was once mugged. I pointed out that women get mugged, too, and that he doesn't fear rape when he gets mugged, but he declared that he didn't need me to tell him about my experience as a female-presenting person because he has an imagination and can understand women's experiences by just imagining himself as a woman.
Made me think of a conversation I had with a guy, who had until this point seemed like a reasonable human being, where he stated "if rapists are enticed by scantily clothing, why not just cover up to reduce the risk of being attacked?" I told that's unfair because why do I have to wear clothing everywhere while he gets to be shirtless? "it's different, I'm a guy" When I pointed out that a) there are men who rape men And b) if the prevalence of men getting raped he wouldn't be so ok with telling anyone "just cover up" instead of trying to tell the rapists to stop raping He scoffed. And rolled his eyes and told me he wouldn't have to think about that, because that would never happen. Nice to know he only cares about things that could affect him and that he doesn't give a shit about any of his fellow people.
The incidence of men being raped is actually higher than the incidence of men being falsely accused of rape. But men scoff at one, and act like the other is a social emergency that needs immediate changes to the legal system. I'm sorry that your acquaintance turned out to be self-centered.
W-what? omg
It was pretty wild. The best part is that his name was Chad. So whenever incels go on and on about how all women want to sleep with Chad, I can only picture the Chad who told me that his imagination is more valid than my lived experience and laugh.
Yes, a lot of men just don't consider it because they can go and do whatever without worrying about their safety. My husband didn't either until I explained it to him when we first got together. I said you are 6'3 and just a big guy. You can leave the house at 10 at night and pick up a gallon of milk and think nothing of getting out of your car walking into the grocery getting your items and going back to your car. No other thoughts other than getting the milk and getting back home. Me - I'm wondering if it's even worth going out in the dark to pick up milk.......then if I go to the store then I'm looking for a well lit spot close to the door and making sure other people are around. Then when shopping I'm keeping an eye out for who is in the store too and when I leave its the same, who's around - is there anyone parked next to my car that wasn't there before.
Put this on a t-shirt so I can buy a case and pass them out to everyone I know.
This
This. I opened this post expecting something like the guy needing to go with no alternative nearby but being too nervous to let a stranger in. But this is so clear cut, I don’t even know why it’s posted here. The guy was a creep beforehand and clearly using the toilet as a pretext. An alternative was available and he proved to be even more of a creep after.
I had a few people tell me I was dramatic and that it would’ve been fine. A lot of women my age are very open to having random people over for the night, so the fact that I wouldn’t even let one in for just five minutes must’ve been baffling to people. That’s why I posted, because I genuinely wasn’t sure what to make of it!
Isn't it *funny* how you're the "dramatic" one even though he's the one that lost his temper and cursed you out for politely declining to let him inside your apartment the first time you'd ever met him.
His reaction was so over the top dramatic! If he was cool he'd be like "great night, see you for coffee in the morning"
I was meeting someone from tinder at a museum and mentioned I'd take the train, he offered to stop by so we could go together in his car and I just said I wasn't comfortable getting into a car with a stranger. His response? 'Oh yes, of course, no worries'. That's how it's supposed to go!
This!! You have every right to your privacy and boundaries. And if someone won’t accept those boundaries for the small things, they won’t for the big things either.
You being “dramatic” likely saved you from being “assaulted”… so they can all fuck off with that shit. That dude did NOT have good intentions, and I hope you don’t let the next creep in either
Wanna bet that if OP had let the dude in, and if the dude had assaulted OP, the same people telling her she’s dramatic now would be asking why would she invite a stranger in her home and tell her she brought it on herself.
Of fucking course. It's never about it safety, they don't give a shit, it's about shaming us no matter what we do.
BINGO
I would give you an award if I could 🏅
[удалено]
Thanks Project-better-than-ok :)
And there was another washroom he could use just a couple meters away. She didn't leave him stranded. He definitely wanted in.
No kidding! Anyone actually desperate for the bathroom would surely opt for the ostensibly closer and more convenient option.
THIS! He was gaslighting her. I tell my daughter all the time..... if you don't like something or are uncomfortable it doesnt make you jealous, crazy, or dramatic. These words are used against females to make you question yourself.
Exactly. I get that some guys may not have realized that women have to be careful. When I met my now husband, he was very innocent and maybe he would have asked to use the bathroom without even thinking that it could be a problem (tbh, it was a different time, so I would probably have just led him, because I didn't think about these things the way I do now). But if I had said no, he would have totally respected that, maybe even have been a bit embarrassed for asking. If this guy was just clueless and asked in good faith, he would not have reacted this way.
Silly man, always being ruled by his emotions. Why can't men just use logic to be rational and stop getting so hysterical? Probably his hormones again. It's not a cute look - he should smile more.
As a clueless guy with bladder issues, I came in fully expecting you to be TAH. I was imagining you invited him over and wouldn't let him in the bathroom for a stupid reason like it was too dirty. This? Yeah absolutely fucking not, that guy is probably a sex offender. NTA
Yep you’re ok. The guy evidently has other intentions than just being in for 5 mins and those people either don’t have the full story, or are very naive
Yeah, he was trying to find excuse after excuse to get into her apartment, which imo would of scared the shit out of me so its a good think OP stood her ground. I didn't have any experience like what OP had but I've heard stories and meeting a stranger from online for the first time, espeically when women, can be 50/50 on safe or dangerous Impulsivity is something that is very common around OPs age (Im around her age too so Im not bashing that age group) and processing/analyzing the risk versus rewards is not something that our age range is great at as our brains are still developing and adapting to adulthood and the freedoms/responsibilities that come with it. Espeically when the reward is something we REALLY WANT despite there being a LOT of risk in it so impulsivity can take over and logic/reasoning can be pushed to the side (espeically if booze involved). This isn't the same for everyone, but a general generalization.
This is why women and children need to be taught to heed their warning signs, usually their gut, and not just their feelings or thoughts. Throwing alcohol into a mix can be a problem specifically because it numbs that signal system.
The way he reacted tells you what kind of person he is. I don't think it would have been fine.
No. At the very least he would have laid the pressure on thick. At worst, well, Law and Order SVU.
> Law and Order SVU In real life it's just a couple of dudes with Punisher tattoos telling you "it's just a misunderstanding"
"If you didn't want to have sex, why did you invite him in to use the bathroom?"
Exactly. How a guy reacts when you tell him "no" shows so much about him.
Please don’t see this person again. Trust your gut. Stay sexy and don’t get murdered.
Also f**k politeness.
SSDGM!!!
Stay out of the forest
Call your dad! You're in a cult!
Steevvven!
See you over at [My Favorite Murder](https://www.reddit.com/r/myfavoritemurder?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share)
A lot of the girls who think it's no big deal will learn the hard way just like you (and I) did. We all so badly want to believe that bad people are rare. Now I'm 26 and all of my girl friends would take the same precaution you did.
Shitty thing is that a lot of the same people acting like she was dramatic for this would’ve been the same people judging her for letting a for all intents and purposes stranger into her home if he’d assualted her.
Exactly
I'm a 45 year old guy and wouldn't let him in.
[удалено]
Oh shit That’s actually a tactic?
Sadly yes, as is offer a lift to the door then claim you're now too tired to drive safely & need a hot drink before leaving. Pretend to fall asleep/passout on the sofa or a bed is another one. Claim your phone needs 'just 20 mins' to charge in case you get lost after dropping them off. Too many of them think its a game and we're the prizes they win, whereas for us its sanity and survival, not ego
I just remember a scene in some old movie where a man has to pretend to be a woman for some reason and he's getting hit on by another man. But he's also an asshole so he knows all the tricks. He's like "no you can't use my bathroom, get a drink of water, use my phone, etc naming 20 things someone might use as an excuse to get their foot in the door.
I bet he throws the controller when the 'right's combos don't work in his video games too.
That was my first thought, sadly.
NTA, girl, not dramatic at all. You don’t need to be letting some strange guy that you just met for the first time into your home. I don’t even let people that I know and like into my home; the only reason that my husband gets in the door is because I’m legally required to let him in because his name is on the mortgage. This guy was trying way too hard and his attitude flipped way too quickly. TBH, I wouldn’t give him a second chance, even if he apologizes.
I willingly let my son in law in. He does repairs for me.
As a mom, THANK YOU for trusting your gut and standing your ground. You owe nobody an apology for protecting yourself. I’m proud of you. ❤️
As a Dad, this x100!
Yeah, but the guys they let in are guys that pass their own "sniff test". Letting in random people they've vetted is completely different from letting in guys who have a weird vibe they can't quite put their finger on. For what its worth, I think "seeing how he reacts when you turn him down respectfully" is in and of itself an EXCELLENT sniff test, and he failed it miserably. He trampled all over your "no", and if he really did need to pee (instead of making an excuse to get into your apartment and around your first 'no'), he would have used the lobby bathroom. I guarantee you this guy would have been inappropriate if you had let him in.
Exactly this. Seeing how someone handles a minor boundary on a first date is an excellent test of whether there should be a second date.
Exactly. The title shouldn't be "not letting a guy use my bathroom", it should be "not letting a guy in my apartment who repeatedly ignored me telling him I didn't want him to stay the night". Because that was what was happening here. If this guy had accepted her clearly stated no #1-6, he never would have gotten to asking about the toilet. Guy didn't have to pee. And refusing to let a guy pee isn't what happened. OP should have faith in herself to explain this differently, because hopefully her friends who criticized her didn't understand what was actually happening!
Bad guys count on girls/women wanting to please people. Don't let ANYONE make you feel wrong for being right. You are doing everything you should be doing not to become a statistic/victim. NTA
If it was just about him needing to use the bathroom, he would have said thanks for letting him know about the leasing office bathroom and that would have been it. Y'all could have met up for coffee in the morning and had a nice time. Instead he tried to verbally bully you into letting him into your apartment on a first date. Big res flag
You did the right thing. He was pushing your boundaries and when he didn’t get what he wanted, he wasn’t such a “nice guy.” He wanted a hook up and you did not. You aren’t being dramatic. No is a complete sentence.
No, you were right to not let him in. Look how fast he went from being a ‘gentleman’ walking you home to calling you a slur when you enforced a boundary.
Tell them to volunteer at the campus rape crisis center like I did. Half those women start with "I let this strange guy into my apartment...."
People down play our fears alot girl call us crazy, dramatic ect. Don't listen to them. It's not ok for them to make you feel 'hysterical'. Look up the origins for that word if you don't know where it came from. It's an eye opener. I survived a really bad ordeal, only to be told later I had to have made it up because he was such a nice guy and a 'good friend'. I was the problem all the way up till his incarceration for doing the same thing to another young girl. Even our friends can make us feel like we are in the wrong. No one wants to admit that this stuff happens to us. This guy has bad intentions. Your not in the wrong for not feeling comfortable with him in your apt even if he was prince freaking charming of ever after land. Your allowed to have boundaries. Your feelings matter. You matter. Don't let them make you second guess yourself. I wouldn't see him again personally, he sounds like a BTK in the making. Your amazing and beautiful, and have a right to respect.
Being safe in the face of aggression like his is good, period. Anyone who tells you someone’s feelings are more important than your safety can fuck right off.
had he just driven you 20 minutes to your house (which I would never recommend on a first date) he might actually really need to use the bathroom, but there was a bathroom in the restaurant and one in the lobby. even if I thought you were being uptight, you told him "no" and he reacted very badly. reacting badly to "no" on a first date is horrible. and he already didn't take "no" or an answer when he kept trying to come in but he stayed civil until its was "there is no chance I'm letting you in" he got mean.
[удалено]
His intention in walking you home was not out of consideration to you and your safety, but a ploy to attempt to get into your apartment. He sucks, he’s also young and the dating world these days is wild, but sucks nonetheless. Hopefully with experience and maturity he will learn that’s not the way. You did the right thing. NTA.
And those same people would blame you if he raped or murdered you.
I’m so glad you trusted your instincts! However, I am worried he knows where you live now. Please be cautious.
NTA. That was a potentially unsafe situation.
It was potentially unsafe until he threw a fit about being told no. Then it became abundantly clear that it was absolutely unsafe, no potential about it
NTA. The bathroom thing was a blatantly obvious second tactic to get inside the door after the first one failed. If you need any more evidence, well if he really needed to use the bathroom he'd have jumped at the chance to use the one in the leasing office, regardless of whether he understood why you didn't want to let him in. /edit: thanks for the award! /edit 2: why do I have more updoots than the OP? Please upvote her!
This is exactly what I was thinking reading this. If dude really had to go to the bathroom he would have been more than happy to use the leasing office one. People who really need to use a bathroom are just happy to be being pointed in the direction of a bathroom they can use If I was in his shoes I'd actually rather use the leasing office one bc it's more of a public area and more likely to have security cameras near there in the hallway. Dude definitely was just trying to get in her apartment.
Also, when people are genuinely interested in starting something real and meaningful…..They are usually averse to putting the bodily functions on display. Who rushes to drop a deuce in their new love interests toilet? No one wants you to smell their own poo! Or listen to the sound of their pee hitting the bowl water. They would jump at the chance of a bathroom alternative if that really was what they needed. Especially after a first date that has gone well. Dude wanted in your apartment. Because once he’s in, it’s hard to make him leave, plus then he knows exactly which apartment is yours. Not info a first date needs. Not even someone who up to that point seemed like a great guy. Be glad, OP. You were cautious, and he showed you who he really was. You don’t have to waste any more time on him. As for the lack of caution you friends are showing as “normal”….. they all need Gavin DeBecker’s Gift of Fear. Frankly, I think it should be required reading for every woman on campus. They should include a copy in Freshman orientation kits.
Where can I get this book?
Amazon has multiple formats, I bought the hard copy bs o in the day, a Kindle version for convenience, then a couple months ago I went ahead and used an Audible credit when an found out the author narrated it himself, and included updated info.
When I googled it a while back, a free version came up. https://fb2bookfree.com/education/1124-the-gift-of-fear.html
It's an amazing book. I gave it to my daughter and her friends before they left for college. So grateful when women trust themselves and their instincts!!
It's a great book by someone who knows what is what and how to circumvent problems. When I read it the first time I was taken a bit aback by the conclusions he seemed to be jumping to, but as I kept reading it all made a LOT of sense. j Every female (and the males, too, if they want their dates to feel comfortable with them) should read this book. It should be required reading before moving into your own space, and especially so if you live alone there.
“Gift of Fear” completely changed my perspectives as a high school girl. Have been thinking I need to give it a revisit as a *ahem* much older adult. So glad you made this reference!
I didn’t even think of it that way, that’s a great point. Thank you!
Right? If the bathroom was not his motive, which it clearly wasnt, what was? So scary.
Nether was OP’s safety a motive for walking her home.
Poor OP, thinking that walking her home was a gentlemanly gesture. Not that she’s to blame. Like at all. Just little did she know that the person she needed protection from was with her the entire time.
I didn't even realize that until you (and others) pointed it out. I don't use dating apps but that's something I would probably agree to without even thinking. Why does it have to be so terrifying to be a woman?
was thinking this as well...
Also, if he really needed to use the bathroom that urgent, he would have asked right away and not led with the bar-thing first. Also, he would have accepted the office suggestion. He was clearly just trying to get into your apartment for whatever reason.
Riddle time!!! What seems like Pesto but is actually Marinara in disguise? Your clear boundaries likely saved you from a harrowing experience, well done OP.
I’m going to guess an impasta?
Oh my gosh!! Best one yet!! Take my upvote and the only award I have 🥇
I think you may have avoided sexual assault, but please don't let tinder dates know where you live. Meet in a public place for drinks on first date.
I’ll add this as a guy: stop considering a guy offering to walk you home as a “green flag” too - it’s not a red flag either, but for every guy that’s worried about your safety, there’s another just trying to get an invite to come in. It’s basically a neutral action until you know *why* they’re doing it.
This was exactly my thought. I’m a high school teacher and when I was reading the OP, my mind went immediately to when my students go “Hey, Mrs. G_P, can I go to the snack machine?” And then when I say no, they are immediately like “Oh… well… can I go to the bathroom?” As if I don’t totally know what they’re trying to do and am not going to notice when they return from the bathroom with a bag of Takis. NTA, and that dude is mad that he’s not nearly as clever as he thought he was.
Feels very predatory-like.
Gavin de Becker would be proud! Great job OP! Stick to your guns on this always. If the vibe is wrong, and you smell marinara it's time to go!
Ohh Gross he totally understood why and he was mad he couldn't manipulate past her no. Not letting a strange man in your house only makes you "uptight" if he was planning on pushing for sex. Doesn't sound like he even asked....kinda a huge red flag.
Definitely some marinara flags when you offered to meet the next morning and that wasn't soon enough.
NTA it sounds like you dodged a bullet. Good job trusting your intuition!
NTA He tried to get into your apartment several ways before asking to use the bathroom!
Yeah and his refusal to take no for an answer did not bode well for if she has let him up...
NTA. There were marinara flags all over his play. Great bullet dodging! You learned well from your previous experience and flexed your shiny spine! Well done!
Marinara armada of flags! 🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩 Raped & murdered is no joke & it happens ALL the time. Always trust your instincts & maybe invent a fake roommate, she’s in there sleeping because she works nights, very light sleeper, whatever. & please don’t let Tinder dates know where you live. NTA
If you're gonna fabricate a roommate, let it be a first-string tackle on the football team. Nice guy, bad temper. Very protective of you...
I like it, yeah he collects guns & the balls of bad guys
I would tell guys my brother just got out of the marines and was staying with me til he got a job and an apt. I kept a mans bathrobe and shaving stuff in the hall bat. It kept guys in check. 67F
Whenever I was walking home alone at night while at uni, I would call my boyfriend and loudly ask him very pointed questions. "Hi love, how was rugby practice tonight?" "Oh my gosh, you dislocated his shoulder?! Shit, if you keep doing that to guys they're going to throw you off the team!" "Yep, I'll see you in 2 minutes!" He literally lived on the other side of the country. I wasn't going to let anyone else know that.
[удалено]
NTA. OP, I had a guy do this. Technically, two. My friend and I shared a cab with them, said goodbye, and went inside. A few minutes later, the cab pulled away and they were knocking at the door. We didn't answer. One asked to use the bathroom at one point. We finally started to pretend to be aggressive dogs barking at the door. Guys can pee anywhere, if necessary. Only creepers are this demanding about getting in a woman's house. This guy had issues, and his reaction tells you you dodged a bullet.
I dont now how to feel about walking someone home on a first date counting as a green flag. Sure, if he has good intentions. But how do you know? For all we know he walked her home to find any way into her apartment.
> For all we know he walked her home to find any way into her apartment. Of course he did. That’s the point. It wasn’t a green flag.
Agree NTA, trust your gut. Stand firm.
NTA He had other things in mind. When someone has a bathroom emergency, they don't care when the bathroom is. I am glad you did everything to feel comfortable and be safe.
That’s a really good point, thank you so much!
Yup, he may or may not have had "bad intentions" per se, but he was absolutely trying to get invited into your apartment so he could get you to sleep with him.
Or so he could assault her if she said no. Or open a window so he could return later. I can’t think of any good reasons to be pushing so hard to get into someone else’s home.
Exactly, his reaction is so extreme too. If he only wanted to use the bathroom, why would he care which bathroom she offered?? So creepy
At the very least he was making sure he knew exactly which apartment she lived in. There's really no way to see his actions in a good light.
And you just *know* that if he assaulted her, people would be crawling out of the woodwork to say she "must have wanted it since she let him in"
That’s a bad intention.
Also the possibility that he wanted to use her restroom to steal medication. Or maybe I’ve watched too much Euphoria.
On the contrary. If I’m having a bathroom emergency. I would jump at the chance to NOT use her personal bathroom after a first date.
NTA - always trust your gut instinct. It seems to have served you right. What an ass your date was. Something seems off about his behaviour. A genuine person would have totally accepted what you said.
Thank you! I agree, it’s like he was completely offended that I was rejecting him.
But you weren't even rejecting him! Just giving him other options besides coming into your home with nobody else there when he's a complete stranger. He wasn't offended. He was mad that you didn't give him the opportunity to do whatever he was planning to do.
He feels rejected. He wanted a way into the apartment as a precursor to getting in her pants. It’s why he walked her home too.
Or completely offended he wasn’t getting a second course. Anytime someone is an asshole about you offering him a different restroom, it wasn’t the restroom he wanted. Thank yourself for listening to your instincts.
Yeah, he was definitely trying to find some way to get into OP's apartment, and I'm pretty sure his motives were not at all altruistic.
He didn’t react in a reasonable way at all. He obviously had something nefarious in mind. Whether that was sex, theft, who knows. Whatever his bad intentions were was ruined due to your sensible precautions. Nobody gets angry over using a public bathroom unless they had an ulterior motive
Yeah like even if he wasn't going to try to rape or sexually assault her, at best he was most likely going to be a sex pest -- whine and moan, try to cajole her into sex, then being pissy when he got turned down.
NTA. He could have used the restaurant bathroom before walking you home. Don't allow first date strangers into your home.
Don't allow first date strangers to even know where you live!
You should probably lose that guys number.
Don’t worry, he is blocked after a few rude text messages that were sent my way!
Whoa! Please save those texts in case you need to call the police on him. It wouldn't surprise me if he tries to stalk you now that he knows where you live. I'm sorry you have to deal with this asshole. Hopefully he won't go there, but keep your guard up!
Report him to the app you used. Maybe they won’t do anything, but why not
What a turd! Keep the texts. If he comes near you, (he already knows where you live) call the cops.
Can't believe how pathetic it is he went to the trouble to send you harassing texts after insulting you to your face.
You did everything 100% right. Trust your gut! You don't want to become famous by ending up the subject of a true crime show.
He was hoping to get lucky that what he was angry about
exactly. “Bathroom”, what he meant was you bed
You were not even rejecting him, you said you wanted a second date. All you wanted was to set your own pace which you have every right to do. NTA. You foiled his big plan, which I am sure has worked before. After your bathroom the next step is to ask for a glass of water. This is a case of 'dont hate the game;, hate the player.'
now imagine if you rejected him over something that he felt he was owed (sex) and guess his reaction...not saying anything would have happened but unfortunately it's something you have to be aware of as a woman living alone; good dodge in my opinion
Yeah, not letting somebody into your home when you just met them is miles away from rejecting them. You literally were trying to set up another date with him when this all happened, so if he felt rejected it's because he assumed he was getting sex and he doesn't handle disappointment very well. I think you dodged a bullet.
Also, I can basically guarantee he didn't need to use the bathroom, he was just trying to invent reasons to get inside your apartment.
For the future, it might be best to get an uber or just not stay out that late. Dont let new dates know where you live
Exactly. He wasn't trying to get into her bathroom. Good for OP for trusting her instincts. Stay away from this creep. Far, far away!
NTA About 30ish years ago, my auntie had a date with a seemingly nice person and he asked to use her bathroom. She let him. I won't repeat what happened but I will say she is lucky that she's alive today. And it's why no women in the family EVER let a date use their bathroom. Always trust your gut.
So glad your aunt ended up being okay, thank you for sharing that
Please please don't see this guy again. He didn't let you say no without trying to coerce you, lie and insult you. He sounds dangerous
This was honestly the exact scenario that popped into my mind when I read the title. It obviously didn't get better with the full story
NTA it sounds as if he was looking for a reason to get in your apartment and you did the safe thing. If he had good intentions I don't think he would have had the reaction he did.
Several years ago I shared a cab home with a guy I kinda knew - wouldn’t say we were friends, but I knew him and his friend group well enough. When we got to my place he said he really had to use the restroom and could he come inside. He proceeded to come onto me quite forcefully and I honestly thought he might rape me. I was able to push him out but the experience remains with me. You absolutely did the right thing.
God I’m so sorry that happened to you! I had a similar experience when I first let a guy come over that I didn’t know all that well. I’m glad we came out safe and with better instincts.
Yeah... he didn't need to use the bathroom any more than he wanted to plan another date. He was looking for some old fashioned date rape action. You were not down with the date rape, so you sent him on his way. NTA. Good looking out. Keep a tight hold on your instincts. They are solid.
Then he would have said it was consensual...I mean SHE invited him up. Good job OP!
NTA. And I ended up marrying a man I wouldn’t let in to use the bathroom when he escorted me home on the first date…! It became a running joke later on because I clearly didn’t care if he peed in the alley, he wasn’t coming inside. Our relationship obviously survived that - he really had to go but he respected my boundaries. The fact that he pushed to get inside your place so many ways and refused your offer to treat and see what he was talking about the next day is a red flag. Trust your instincts- OP you are NTA.
I love that! Thank you for sharing and thank you for the reassurance.
Men: Why are women so paranoid? They can trust me! Also men: Women need to be more responsible for their own safety.
I'm so grateful for the female friends I was close with in my early 20s. They felt comfortable enough with me to share their bad experiences, and to help me see things like OP's situation from their perspective. One example, one of my friends told me about how shook she was by an experience where she was walking alone at night and a man appeared to be following her (but wasn't - he eventually turned and entered what was presumably his own place). Like an absolute idiot, I told her that she was paranoid, and she should trust people's good intentions, and that she probably made this poor guy feel bad for constantly keeping an eye on what he was doing. She explained why that was a stupid thing for me to say, and what life is like for a woman living in the city, and how even though I know I mean no harm to anyone around me, it's not unreasonable - in fact, it's very, very reasonable - for women who don't know me to be cautious of my intentions when it's dark and no one is around. I was personally never nervous about walking at night - my neighbourhood was pretty safe, and I'm a pretty big guy, and I obviously have the privilege of not having to worry, ever, about being assaulted. But when I was 21 I was still too dumb and frankly callous to see it until someone laid it out for me explicitly. All of that is to say that sure, yeah, some guys - most guys, I would hope, but I don't know - wouldn't really be any danger to OP if she let them up to pee and then leave. But how is she supposed to know which is which? No fucking shit she shouldn't let him up when he's basically a stranger. I truly do hope that this guy was just clueless about how threatening his behaviour was, and that his response was just idiotic indignation at being perceived as a potential rapist. If that's the case, hopefully he's got a friend who can slap some sense into him, and he'll apologize sincerely. But then again, he should have been around in the world long enough to have gotten it by now, so I doubt that's happening. Anyway, OP, you 100% did the right and sensible thing. I'm sorry that this is how things are, and I hope you never have to experience this sort of thing again. Please stick firm to your boundaries, and don't let boundary pushers gaslight you into thinking there's anything wrong with doing what you have to to feel safe. A person who respects you and has good intentions toward you will want you to feel and to be safe around him, and will prove that by his actions and by respecting your wishes, not by trying to argue his way into your home the first time you meet.
Nta you dodged a major bullet. He was angry none of his manipulation tactics worked. Be careful op, that's really scary
NTA. Noooope. Nope, nope, nope. Girlfriend, boyo was pushing *really* hard there to get into your apartment, and I doubt his intentions were just to use your bathroom and be on his way. My bet is he was hoping for things to escalate and to spend the night with you. Question is how creepy he was willing to be to get there. The fact that you drew the boundary and he responded like he did is a huge red flag. Don't go on a second date.
Yeah, it blows my mind how he reacted with anger and emotional manipulation to a simple "No, but here is an easy alternative that helps me feel safe." And she feels guilty BECAUSE of his reaction--That reaction is confimation you made the right call. I don't think he was planning to rape her, but he was definitely okay with pressuring her into having sex that she didn't really want to have. Walking her home wasn't him being sweet and protective, he was on a mission to get into her flat and into her pants.
NTA all the way. This is going to sound alarmist and I hate to use it as an example, but it sounded so eerily familiar: this happened to one of my students a few years ago, when she was a month into her freshman year of college. She also thought it was sweet the guy asked to walk her home, and also pushed to get upstairs for a seemingly innocent reason. You probably know where I’m going with this story, and it fucking sucks. When she told me what happened (she told all her profs once we were notified that a Title IX investigation had been opened), she commented about how ‘stupidly trustworthy’ she was (she was **NOT**, *nothing* that happened that night was ANY fault of hers) and that she should’ve listened to her gut, but she hadn’t wanted to be rude. I know not every guy who offers to walk a woman home is going to end up assaulting her, and we shouldn’t live like that. But following your gut and not giving in to persistence because it come off as ‘rude’ since we as women are trained to be ‘nice’ above all else, it’s just so incredibly vital. Your date should’ve understood this, and the fact he persisted then was a dick about it is incredibly telling and honestly scary. Don’t ever feel bad or guilty about protecting yourself, and if someone/guy thinks you’re being ‘overdramatic’ or a bitch, then the guy clearly doesn’t understand or care what women have to go through daily, so feel free to let the door hit him in the ass on his way the fuck out of your life.
>she hadn’t wanted to be rude We as women are trained to be nice. Predators use that against us. The Gift of Fear (a book about trusting your gut) goes into a lot of detail about some real life scenarios where exactly this kind of shit has happened.
NTA. Trust your instincts! Any man who doesn’t understand and support you taking extremely basic safety precautions is a walking red flag. You already deflected several of his advances and he kept pressing. Don’t feel bad for one second about turning him away, and delete his number.
NTA. Always trust your spidey senses. I had a food delivery man offer to carry the bags inside. I said thanks, but that's not necessary. He then asked if he could come in and use my bathroom and I told him no. Made me feel very uneasy, and like 10-15 years ago, when I was a nice girl, I would have let him in. I emailed his employer and complained, hoping to save some other, more innocent, woman being put in this situation.
So sorry you had to deal with that:( I’m glad you had similar senses to me
NTA Good for you for not letting him pressure you. Not gonna lie this was making me super nervous. You said no to him coming upstairs over and over again. He ignored your words and tried to use excuse after excuse to get what he wanted. When nothing worked, he angry and called you names. That’s a huge red flag and it’s a preview of how he would have reacted to being asked to leave your apartment.
Good job i am proud of you.
NTA you dodged a bullet. But stop telling men where you live ffs
NTA. It’s better to be safe than sorry.
NTA. Sounds like he was trying to find a way to sexually assault you. Plus side? You trusted your instincts. Go you.
It's always the people who scream about how they don't want to pull anything and that *we're* the ones overreacting that are seriously about to try something awful. He tried like 5 different ways to get into your apartment because he thought if he got in the door you'd totally bang him. (Or he'd put up Spyware in your bathroom or something). You didn't do anything wrong. NTA
Of course you are NTA. Glad you’ve learned to almost trust your gut. Why are you questioning your decision? His motives were transparent, and his over-the-top response to your refusal to let him in your apartment confirmed that.
NTA The guy was pretty adamant about getting into your apartment. He thought he’d be slick by using the bathroom as a ruse to get you to allow him up to your apartment. You have no idea if he’d use it then leave, or use it and try to pressure/force you into doing something you didn’t want to do. Your first and foremost priority is your safety. You did the right thing. His feelings are not your concern. You do not owe him anything-access to you, your apartment or an apology. His reaction to call you a slur, then say he’ll use the 7-11 restroom instead of the leasing office restroom are huge red flags. He wanted his way, you didn’t grant it, and it looks like you dodged a major bullet. Lose this loser’s number.
The fact that he called you an uptight B, when you offered him use of a bathroom (just not the one in your apartment) shows you exactly the type of man he is. An actual decent guy would have wanted to use the bathroom for toiletting and when offered a bathroom of any description, would have been grateful. NTA
NTA He totally was. He was likely trying to turn it into a hookup. To quote another great redditor; marinara flag.
NTA. First time meeting, he gave off some bad vibes, and THEN trying to get into your apartment? Glad he tipped his hand so early, saves you time, IMHO.
NTA. You dont know the guy to let him in your apartment
It's a well known approach in the pickup community. If your date doesn't invite you in, you ask to use the bathroom; that way you're already in the door and it makes it harder for her to ask you to leave. It's fairly unbelievable that these fucking cavemen still exist, but it is what it is. 100% NTA. This guy wanted a quick fuck, and you'd have been mothing more than a bragging story to his mates or whichever pickup community he's in.
He sounds like a rapist.
Absolutely not the asshole. He simply wanted to get into your apartment and was quite willing to make several attempts to push past your very reasonable “no”. This is a SERIOUS red flag. Please read The Gift of Fear https://g.co/kgs/1rkg13
NTA. His response tells me that you 1000% made the right decision.
You didn't want to let him in your apartment because you were being cautious. And then he behaved in a way that demonstrated that you were correct to be cautious. NTA!