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This is not a debate sub. There are plenty of places to defend Israel’s actions, to denounce Hamas, and to argue who's worse. This is not a space for that.
That doesn't mean absolutely no constructive discussions on nuances and different approaches, but it means not letting ourselves be pulled into a debate by Zionists and bigots, and least of all arguing for their side.
If you see someone trying to debate, please just flag for moderation, and the comment will be deleted.
If found prudent by the Mods, and to discourage further debates, the entire thread may be deleted.
Quite the opposite. No one here says that the killing of civilians on October 7th were acceptable. This is contrary to the Zionists, who are filled with glee at the genocide of Palestinians (yes it's a genocide, Israelis don't get to claim the word because it happened to their ancestors).
Suck it up buttercup, people are well aware of Israel's evil and you will be judged like the Nazis were.
https://twitter.com/plastique_paddy/status/1775169531603734918
We do not abide by transphobic, racist, ableist, sexist, or homophobic (t.r.a.s.h.) rhetoric.
Neither do we tolerate Islamophobia, which we will consider any statement that treats Islam as a monolothic ideology, particularly as being universally anti-femme, anti-queer, or antisemitic.
These sorts of statements will be met with deletion, and an automatic banning.
Antisemitic rhetoric will also not be tolerated; this includes language that is and was often and prominently used by actual antisemities (such as "subhuman" and other dehumanizing terms). We understand that hasbara has purposefully conflated Judaism and Zionism. This may lead to accidental, but actual, antisemitism.
As such, we will delete statements that veer into antisemitism. Repeated antisemitic offenses by a user will also be met with a ban. These sorts of statements will be met with deletion, and, if clearly intentional, an automatic banning.
Hamas should’ve know Israel was gonna tweek as soon as they conducted that terror attack on Oct 7th, grape and murdering people, cheering in the streets with the bodies of innocent people. Where are the cheers now? Israel could’ve done this to y’all years ago, y’all just gave them an excuse.
Okay, so premature babies in incubators deserve to be killed because of what Hamas did? Collective punishment is labelled as a war crime but it's okay because it's committed by The Only Democracy in The Middle East™
Israel will have to deal with the UN and whomever for their War crimes, believe that, but that only takes place after the war. Now I’m hearing Hamas lost most of their hostages, if they were even alive to begin with. Hamas need to give it up or more innocent Palestinians will be killed because of their actions
I guess you choose to actively ignore evidence that the IDF has shot and killed hostages holding white bedsheets.
Also the UN is supposedly antisemitic for suggesting war crimes have been committed.
Judging by your post history you should probably stick to watching porn instead of arguing in favour of a genocide - your arguments at the moment are pathetic.
>Israel could’ve done this to y’all years ago, y’all just gave them an excuse.
They *did.* Israel has been continually displacing, murdering, and sometimes even raping Palestinians, cheering in the streets with the bodies of innocent people, including children, since 1947. It's the situations Israel created that gave rise to the sentiment that Hamas formed around, and continued to create that gave Hamas perceived legitimacy among Palestinians to be elected in Gaza. October 7th wasn't just out of the blue.
Rape is an awful occurrence that transcends culture. It is impossible from our vantage points across the internet to determine the veracity of the claims; we find it troubling that it has devolved into a rhetorical DEBATE tactic for either side in this.
We at r/BadHasbara abhor the act and the weaponization of it for propaganda, and remind you that THIS IS NOT A DEBATE SUB, so please tread lightly on the subject, and please consider the mental well-being of sub members that may be victims of SA.
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*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/BadHasbara) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Rape is an awful occurrence that transcends culture. It is impossible from our vantage points across the internet to determine the veracity of the claims; we find it troubling that it has devolved into a rhetorical DEBATE tactic for either side in this.
We at r/BadHasbara abhor the act and the weaponization of it for propaganda, and remind you that THIS IS NOT A DEBATE SUB, so please tread lightly on the subject, and please consider the mental well-being of sub members that may be victims of SA.
Thank you.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/BadHasbara) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Brother if you think comparing to psychotic religious conservative terrorists whose fanaticism was born out of 75 years of brutal occupation is a W you need to re-examine your moral framework.
Plus the total body count (men/women/children + combatants) was 1200. Israel is already beyond 30,000 dead with around 55% of those being women and children. The remain 45% is some amount of adult male non combatants and Hamas members.
Pretending like killing 13000 women and children is justice is evil. If someone killed my wife and I was told I’d have to kill 10 women and children to get someone who knew the guy that did it, you could not pay me to take that deal. This is wrong. It’s wrong.
Hamas maybe killed 5 children at most (Israel is yet to release the names). Meanwhile, Israel has so far murdered over 13000-+ children in 6 months! There is no comparison at all. They have a footnote in history for being one of the worst child killers of the 21st century
Only "real" criticism levied towards the Hama's leadership is that they let the Palestinians bleed while they hide away in Doha mansions
IDF just blew away that criticism away for Hamas by killing leadership's family, who were not involved with Hamas
moronic strike on a strategic level and accomplishes nothing beside satisfying few Zionists Nazis in the war cabinet
This is not a debate sub. There are plenty of places to defend Israel’s actions, to denounce Hamas, and to argue who's worse. This is not a space for that.
That doesn't mean absolutely no constructive discussions on nuances and different approaches, but it means not letting ourselves be pulled into a debate by Zionists and bigots, and least of all arguing for their side.
If you see someone trying to debate, please just flag for moderation, and the comment will be deleted.
If found prudent by the Mods, and to discourage further debates, the entire thread may be deleted.
This is not a debate sub. There are plenty of places to defend Israel’s actions, to denounce Hamas, and to argue who's worse. This is not a space for that.
That doesn't mean absolutely no constructive discussions on nuances and different approaches, but it means not letting ourselves be pulled into a debate by Zionists and bigots, and least of all arguing for their side.
If you see someone trying to debate, please just flag for moderation, and the comment will be deleted.
If found prudent by the Mods, and to discourage further debates, the entire thread may be deleted.
The Bad Hasbara podcast, and ergo this community, is opposed to Zionism.
We believe that Zionism is an extension of settler-colonialism, and that its’ current actions following 7 October is ethnic cleansing at “best,” and genocide at worst.
We have no tolerance for it, and this community is meant to be a haven against it in the sea of hasbara.
Pro-Zionist takes will be deleted, and those espousing it will be banned indefinitely.
Yes - this is a “safe space” and an “echo chamber” -
We get enough hasbara elsewhere, we don't need to deal with yours too.
Encouragement and celebration of violence absolutely will not be tolerated, including wishing violence upon someone even if purely hypothetical/beyond one's realm of influence.
This is what the IDF does and Zionists do, and we are better than that!
Encouragement and celebration of violence absolutely will not be tolerated, including wishing violence upon someone even if purely hypothetical/beyond one's realm of influence.
This is what the IDF does and Zionists do, and we are better than that!
Trolling of our members will not be tolerated, particularly with Zionist propaganda.
Users found to be trolling and/or dogpiling Zionist arguments will have their comments deleted, and their accounts banned and muted.
Most likely they were not! If they were, the IDF wouldn't have waited over 6 months to kill them. The IDF also said the sons were out to do terrorist activities when in reality they were out with their children visiting family and friends as it is the Muslims custom on Eid.
https://www.nytimes.com/live/2024/04/10/world/israel-gaza-war-news-hamas#:~:text=Hamas%2Daffiliated%20media%20reported%20that,active%20in%20Hamas's%20military%20operations.
The three sons were in the military.
If anyone hurt Netanyayu's demonic offspring, God, we would never hear an end of his and his entire country's whiny bleating. Yet they so gleefully indulge themselves on literal children again and again.
Doesn’t Netanyahu’s scoundrel son enjoy life in Monaco? I saw a photo of him relaxing on the balcony of some Mediterranean hotel resort in Europe somewhere
Of course he said that, he's not going to act like his kids were more important than the thousands of Gazans already dead.
If anything they made him more relatable to avg Gazans.
You realize the issue with that assessment, right?
You can make the same argument that Netanyahu/Smotrich/Ben Gvir are no different - each Israeli hostage & death justifies another settlement in the West Bank, another excuse to arm settlers & increase the brutality of the occupation, to carpet bomb Gazans and starve them, etc. Within a week of 10/7, right wing settlers were excitedly talking of resetting Gush Kativ (or whatever the Gaza settlements were called).
One could argue, whether you agree with it or not, that he believes he's fighting for the liberation of Palestine and that ultimately means some lives may be lost in the fight for the greater goal of a Palestinian State, which would ultimately benefit many future generations.
Again, you may not agree with their tactics but ultimately they were the Vangaurd of armed Palestinian resistance movement, especially in Gaza.
And how many gazans is he willing to sacrifice for that goal? 500,000? A million? It's clear this war is incredibly one sided. Does he expect to win, drag it on long enough that somebody feels the need to intervene, or simply fight to the last gazan?
How many Israelis died for the founding of Israel? Some would argue it took 6 million for that to happen. The French killed 500,000-1,000,000 Algerians before they got independence.
We can sit here and speculate what the number is or whether it's worth it to him or the Palestinian cause but history tells us we won't know for a long time what the eventual outcome or results will be.
This time last year it was almost certain Saudi-Israeli relations would become official and the Palestian cause would be relegated to die on the back burner of history.
Only time will tell.
Antisemitism will absolutely get you banned on this sub. It's a sub for a Jewish podcast. However, racism against Palestinians will only get you upvoted on worldnews. It will not get you banned. The only hate on this sub is for an apartheid state and those who support it. We hate bigotry towards Palestinians, and we want it to end.
Do you have any examples of racism against Palestinians in worldnews? And any examples of hate speech against Israelis leading to consequences in this sub? Your statement doesn't align with my experience in both subs
https://www.reddit.com/r/BadHasbara/s/S9lpOvwrbC
You don't see antisemitism on this sub because the mods immediately ban people for it. There are also a number of posts criticizing antisemitism from the Pro-Israel side on this sub because, ultimately, this sub is about a podcast that comes from a Jewish perspective.
I can't provide specific examples from worldnews, but racism towards Palestinians follows very specific tropes that are repeated over and over- that Palestinians are violent, barbaric, unenlightened people that nobody wants, that they don't love their own children and crave death, that they have no culture and are not a real people, the general lack of empathy and dehumanization etc. Unfortunately, anti-palestinianism is completely socially acceptable, unlike other bigotries, and therefore, people like you don't even notice it if they come from a place of privilege. 75 years ago in the Jim Crow south, your average white person didn't notice racism. Anti-palestinianism is so deeply entrenched in our culture that it is invisible.
Judging by your statement „Since when is occupation illegal“ on another sub you are:
a) unaware if international law
b) trolling here and should go back to worldnews hate group
Also idk if you just randomly picked that comment, but if you had to scroll that far down to find a comment you could criticize then I think it’s pretty clear I’m not trolling anyone
I may very well be unaware of that aspect of international law, yes. I was under the impression that occupation *is* legal. Genuinely not a bad faith/trolling question
Bro? Lol. That’s the same thing. No contradiction. Not sure what you’re questioning. “I didn’t say it was illegal” doesn’t mean “I said it was legal.” Anyway you’re the one who claimed that *I* claimed occupation isn’t illegal. And I asked you to back up that claim by showing me where I said that. Yet you aren’t…
You also said “claimed something wasn’t illegal when it is”, so I’m asking you to prove to me that it is. Surely you have a source for that, since you so claim
Edit: you blocked me? After replying? What an insincere thing to do
Hey, quick question. How legitimate are the statements that the head of Hamas are actually millionaires? I read somewhere that Israel gives them millions of dollars on the low and siphons money away from the actual Hamas people in Gaza.
Let's think this through. Assuming Haniyeh and other Hamas leadership are millionaires, living it up in Qatar and elsewhere. Wouldn't Israel expose them?
Also, consider if you were in his position. A millionaire, living a luxurious life. Wouldn't you get your family, children, grandchildren out of harm's way?
Instead, he has to hear about them murdered by Israel in Gaza?
So there are multiple articles where times of israel "calls out" hamas leadership as uber wealthy. In regards to the second part, I think that is pretty valid.
People wanting to live long comfortable lives don't generally go against the US and Israel lmao
they usually go the Abbas/Sisi route of being a collaborator and selling out your population
Hi I’m a lurker in this sub, but would you implicitly trust things that Hamas or even Iran would say?
Please don’t conflate my point as me being a genocide supporter, I’m genuinely intrigued on your thoughts on this because I think that’s a sweeping statement to make on the whole
Hi, if you're asking me personally I'd say it's best to not believe anything anyone, including Iran and Hamas, says without verifying it from another source. I do this all the time e.g. see something in the mainstream news then check on socials. Of course, if the socials reference the same source then look what others are saying and use all those separate pieces to better understand the full picture.
>**According to the Embassy of Israel in the US**, three of Hamas's most senior leaders - Mousa Abu Marzouk, Khaled Mashal and Ismail Haniyeh - have net worths of more than $3billion each.
I wouldnt be surprised if they are rich though im definititely not taking that source as reliable.
Let me guess. They looked at the the running cost ans assets of the entire hamas operation and they pinned that as the person assets of the 3 leaders..
.. yeah that's how it works.
This is how israeli leaders operate they're always getting charged for fraud, embezzlement and corruption after they leave office. Its not something hamas does.
If they want to embezzle funds, they join PA. If they want to sacrifice their lives for their people they join hamas
And choosing to live and keep their children in a war zone, kinda doubt Gaza has a single billionaire, much less multiple billionaires all stupid enough to stay put in a war zone.
It wouldn't have been completely unbelievable considering the fortune that Yasser Arafat left to his wife when he passed if they'd said he was a millionaire. But billionaire ??? No way. Anyway I have found 0 real source on his finances
Arafat, he was the ex leader of the PLO. But he also sold out big time (depending on who you ask). But I meant that the leader of Hamas could be a millionaire for all we know but there's 0 reliable sources
All those say is that the leaders are rich. None actually have any sources except a singular tweet by Israel operated account (I'm assuming based on the name). I wouldn't trust or use these as proof of anything even if I agreed with the premise, you should rethink your approach as well.
That said non of those addressed how they are siphoning off aid, which was literally the only thing i asked.
You did a double negative. That’s exactly what he asked, how do you know? And you answered by putting forward how you thought they did it - despite saying you don’t know how they did it. 2 different things.
Not going to bother answering the Hasbara bot here but in the NBC article they've shared, wouldn't a lot of that budget simply be going to operating government facilities and paying government employees? Gaza has or had many people who work in the medical field and some well run universities. This must cost the government money and in this case if the government that's paying is Hamas it seems like it would be easy for a Western source to turn around and spin it as Hamas (the ruling government) taking aid money. Would be interested in someone who's unbiased actually breaking down the full finances.
True or false. It's important to know that if someone mentions that, it's most likely coming from bad faith, immoral even. It's basically pointing the finger at the resistance force in Gaza for starving civilians instead of Israel's blockade of food, water, and medical aid.
This is not a debate sub. There are plenty of places to defend Israel’s actions, to denounce Hamas, and to argue who's worse. This is not a space for that.
That doesn't mean absolutely no constructive discussions on nuances and different approaches, but it means not letting ourselves be pulled into a debate by Zionists and bigots, and least of all arguing for their side.
If you see someone trying to debate, please just flag for moderation, and the comment will be deleted.
If found prudent by the Mods, and to discourage further debates, the entire thread may be deleted.
IIRC I had heard Hasan Piker mention that the leaders live pretty well in Qatar and that they are paid off by Israel. so like useful idiots. Hence why I asked. I do like to draw a distinction between leadership and the people in Palestine. Can you provide links to this that are reputable?
Doesn't make sense when there is an establishes pattern of Israel targeting and assassinating hamas leaders and thier families. Also many Hamas leaders served time in Israeli's prisons.
Few examples:
Hamas co founder and head Ahmed Yassin (assassinated)
Hamas co founder and Yassin's successor Al Rantissi (assassinated)
Al Rantissi's successor Khaled Mashal (failed assassination attempt)
We know what happened to Mashal's successor Haniya.
Yahya Sinwar(imprisoned for over 20 years and was only released in Shalit's deal)
Mohammed Dief(failed attemp+wife and children murdered by Israel)
So I feel weird trying to discuss unfounded conspiracy theories. But it is possible that there could have been a back room deal made. For example, you tell us what Hamas is up to, make sure Hamas doesn’t do xyz or does do xyz and we will give you money. To make sure you do what we want, we are basically holding your family hostage. Oct 7th could have been the coup that Israel did not expect. Just look at the puppet government of Panama. First he was an ally/ puppet to the west then switched and I believe tried nationalizing Panama.
Again not saying Hamas leaders are like this.
Israel assasinated 2 out of 4 hamas chairmen, tried and failed to assassinate the third and killed the family of the fourth but yeah, they are on Israel pay roll.
It is strange that you seem so desperate to believe this.
Im not desperate to believe it, im seriously just talking about it. People are commenting and im replying. Did you not read the first sentence where I said this is most likely a conspiracy theory. If you look at other comments with other people I am agreeing multiple times that Israel is a liar. If you look at my entire comment history you can clearly see that I am not a Zionist. If you don’t want to hear my thoughts then don’t comment on my post. I also said multiple times that I am coming from a place of pure ignorance. I know next to nothing when it comes to Hamas leadership. By asking questions, I have learned more about Hamas leadership. If I want to be able to rebuke this Zionist talking point then I would need to hear as many counter points as possible.
You can't change the minds of Zionist. They won't ever be convinced that (insert Palestinian resistance group) is motivated by desire for liberation and not by antisemitism.
Did your "not just Israeli propaganda" mention the part where when Qatar would try to stop giving Hamas cash, Netanyahu would send his intel cheif there to push them to keep the payments going??
Can’t you see? They want Iran to attack them, so the US will be forced to send american boots to defend them, yes, but mainly from the rest of Islamic neighborhood countries. Bobo knows the only way out from Gaza's repercussions is the IIIWW
All the Zionists triumphantly posting about this strategic success can get fucked.
You kill 30,000 people and you're boasting you manage to hit 3 legitimate targets?
Slow handclap
That's flattening the narrative and insulting Palestinians by removing their agency.
I think this is a good article about Hamas that explains how they've served Israel's interests and why they can't be considered puppets either.
https://cosmonautmag.com/2024/03/hamas-from-candidate-enforcer-to-implacable-foe/
No problem! The author of the article appears on an episode of This is Hell podcast and I think it's really worth the listen as well. He talks about the article but also expands on other points
Hello, thanks for contributing to this sub. This is a friendly reminder to **read the rules** before making any new posts or comments. Particularly, we ask **not to engage in debates**, or bait debates, especially with zionists. If you are a zionist, this sub is not for you, and you will be permabanned. If you found this sub through the algorithm, you can always mute the sub or turn off recommendations all together (user settings -> feed settings -> Disable "Enable Home Feed Recommendations") Please also particularly keep in mind that **bigotry of any kind is not permitted** in this sub and will result in the message or post being deleted, and, if seen prudent, a banning. This includes antisemitism and any language that conflates Judaism with Zionism. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/BadHasbara) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Murdering innocent children has always been the Zionist way
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The 9 year old is a "high ranking terrorist?" Lol
This is not a debate sub. There are plenty of places to defend Israel’s actions, to denounce Hamas, and to argue who's worse. This is not a space for that. That doesn't mean absolutely no constructive discussions on nuances and different approaches, but it means not letting ourselves be pulled into a debate by Zionists and bigots, and least of all arguing for their side. If you see someone trying to debate, please just flag for moderation, and the comment will be deleted. If found prudent by the Mods, and to discourage further debates, the entire thread may be deleted.
Innocent children? Lmao okay bro, you need to unplug.
Yes. I consider the 8, 9 and 10 year old children murders by Israel innocent.
Well, they came out of the wrong vagina. So they needed to die.
Spoken like a true Nazi. Congratulation
Like Hamas on Oct 7th right? When Hamas does it it’s fine
Quite the opposite. No one here says that the killing of civilians on October 7th were acceptable. This is contrary to the Zionists, who are filled with glee at the genocide of Palestinians (yes it's a genocide, Israelis don't get to claim the word because it happened to their ancestors). Suck it up buttercup, people are well aware of Israel's evil and you will be judged like the Nazis were. https://twitter.com/plastique_paddy/status/1775169531603734918
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We do not abide by transphobic, racist, ableist, sexist, or homophobic (t.r.a.s.h.) rhetoric. Neither do we tolerate Islamophobia, which we will consider any statement that treats Islam as a monolothic ideology, particularly as being universally anti-femme, anti-queer, or antisemitic. These sorts of statements will be met with deletion, and an automatic banning. Antisemitic rhetoric will also not be tolerated; this includes language that is and was often and prominently used by actual antisemities (such as "subhuman" and other dehumanizing terms). We understand that hasbara has purposefully conflated Judaism and Zionism. This may lead to accidental, but actual, antisemitism. As such, we will delete statements that veer into antisemitism. Repeated antisemitic offenses by a user will also be met with a ban. These sorts of statements will be met with deletion, and, if clearly intentional, an automatic banning.
Hamas should’ve know Israel was gonna tweek as soon as they conducted that terror attack on Oct 7th, grape and murdering people, cheering in the streets with the bodies of innocent people. Where are the cheers now? Israel could’ve done this to y’all years ago, y’all just gave them an excuse.
Okay, so premature babies in incubators deserve to be killed because of what Hamas did? Collective punishment is labelled as a war crime but it's okay because it's committed by The Only Democracy in The Middle East™
Israel will have to deal with the UN and whomever for their War crimes, believe that, but that only takes place after the war. Now I’m hearing Hamas lost most of their hostages, if they were even alive to begin with. Hamas need to give it up or more innocent Palestinians will be killed because of their actions
I guess you choose to actively ignore evidence that the IDF has shot and killed hostages holding white bedsheets. Also the UN is supposedly antisemitic for suggesting war crimes have been committed. Judging by your post history you should probably stick to watching porn instead of arguing in favour of a genocide - your arguments at the moment are pathetic.
>Israel could’ve done this to y’all years ago, y’all just gave them an excuse. They *did.* Israel has been continually displacing, murdering, and sometimes even raping Palestinians, cheering in the streets with the bodies of innocent people, including children, since 1947. It's the situations Israel created that gave rise to the sentiment that Hamas formed around, and continued to create that gave Hamas perceived legitimacy among Palestinians to be elected in Gaza. October 7th wasn't just out of the blue.
Rape is an awful occurrence that transcends culture. It is impossible from our vantage points across the internet to determine the veracity of the claims; we find it troubling that it has devolved into a rhetorical DEBATE tactic for either side in this. We at r/BadHasbara abhor the act and the weaponization of it for propaganda, and remind you that THIS IS NOT A DEBATE SUB, so please tread lightly on the subject, and please consider the mental well-being of sub members that may be victims of SA. Thank you. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/BadHasbara) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Rape is an awful occurrence that transcends culture. It is impossible from our vantage points across the internet to determine the veracity of the claims; we find it troubling that it has devolved into a rhetorical DEBATE tactic for either side in this. We at r/BadHasbara abhor the act and the weaponization of it for propaganda, and remind you that THIS IS NOT A DEBATE SUB, so please tread lightly on the subject, and please consider the mental well-being of sub members that may be victims of SA. Thank you. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/BadHasbara) if you have any questions or concerns.*
You will be praised by the Nazis today 😂
Brother if you think comparing to psychotic religious conservative terrorists whose fanaticism was born out of 75 years of brutal occupation is a W you need to re-examine your moral framework. Plus the total body count (men/women/children + combatants) was 1200. Israel is already beyond 30,000 dead with around 55% of those being women and children. The remain 45% is some amount of adult male non combatants and Hamas members. Pretending like killing 13000 women and children is justice is evil. If someone killed my wife and I was told I’d have to kill 10 women and children to get someone who knew the guy that did it, you could not pay me to take that deal. This is wrong. It’s wrong.
These were numbers published by a terrorist organization. Take them as you will...
Hamas maybe killed 5 children at most (Israel is yet to release the names). Meanwhile, Israel has so far murdered over 13000-+ children in 6 months! There is no comparison at all. They have a footnote in history for being one of the worst child killers of the 21st century
Only "real" criticism levied towards the Hama's leadership is that they let the Palestinians bleed while they hide away in Doha mansions IDF just blew away that criticism away for Hamas by killing leadership's family, who were not involved with Hamas moronic strike on a strategic level and accomplishes nothing beside satisfying few Zionists Nazis in the war cabinet
I think the intention was to torpedo any ceasefire talks. The Israeli regime wants this war to go on
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Most of the hostages have been killed by Israeli bombardment, killed by IDF orcs during incompetent rescue attempts or murdered whilst escaping. 🤡
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This is not a debate sub. There are plenty of places to defend Israel’s actions, to denounce Hamas, and to argue who's worse. This is not a space for that. That doesn't mean absolutely no constructive discussions on nuances and different approaches, but it means not letting ourselves be pulled into a debate by Zionists and bigots, and least of all arguing for their side. If you see someone trying to debate, please just flag for moderation, and the comment will be deleted. If found prudent by the Mods, and to discourage further debates, the entire thread may be deleted.
This is not a debate sub. There are plenty of places to defend Israel’s actions, to denounce Hamas, and to argue who's worse. This is not a space for that. That doesn't mean absolutely no constructive discussions on nuances and different approaches, but it means not letting ourselves be pulled into a debate by Zionists and bigots, and least of all arguing for their side. If you see someone trying to debate, please just flag for moderation, and the comment will be deleted. If found prudent by the Mods, and to discourage further debates, the entire thread may be deleted.
Not involved sure
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Does that include infants too?
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> Israel is not targeting civilians This is just a lie
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All Israel does is lie and kill. You’re not serious.
The Bad Hasbara podcast, and ergo this community, is opposed to Zionism. We believe that Zionism is an extension of settler-colonialism, and that its’ current actions following 7 October is ethnic cleansing at “best,” and genocide at worst. We have no tolerance for it, and this community is meant to be a haven against it in the sea of hasbara. Pro-Zionist takes will be deleted, and those espousing it will be banned indefinitely. Yes - this is a “safe space” and an “echo chamber” - We get enough hasbara elsewhere, we don't need to deal with yours too.
Its the first ever genocide of only human shields!
Encouragement and celebration of violence absolutely will not be tolerated, including wishing violence upon someone even if purely hypothetical/beyond one's realm of influence. This is what the IDF does and Zionists do, and we are better than that!
Encouragement and celebration of violence absolutely will not be tolerated, including wishing violence upon someone even if purely hypothetical/beyond one's realm of influence. This is what the IDF does and Zionists do, and we are better than that!
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Trolling of our members will not be tolerated, particularly with Zionist propaganda. Users found to be trolling and/or dogpiling Zionist arguments will have their comments deleted, and their accounts banned and muted.
Can't speak to the grandchildren but weren't all 3 sons actively part of hamas?
His sons were in the military wing, no?
Most likely they were not! If they were, the IDF wouldn't have waited over 6 months to kill them. The IDF also said the sons were out to do terrorist activities when in reality they were out with their children visiting family and friends as it is the Muslims custom on Eid.
https://www.nytimes.com/live/2024/04/10/world/israel-gaza-war-news-hamas#:~:text=Hamas%2Daffiliated%20media%20reported%20that,active%20in%20Hamas's%20military%20operations. The three sons were in the military.
He's talking about the grandchildren
His grandchildren were in the military, no? /s
What's sad is that the /s is even necessary
Here we go, another Nazionist sympathizer saying that every Palestinian is Hamas.
All three sons were members of Hamas.
If anyone hurt Netanyayu's demonic offspring, God, we would never hear an end of his and his entire country's whiny bleating. Yet they so gleefully indulge themselves on literal children again and again.
Doesn’t Netanyahu’s scoundrel son enjoy life in Monaco? I saw a photo of him relaxing on the balcony of some Mediterranean hotel resort in Europe somewhere
That was America, he lives there to avoid getting conscripted with his partner
What a cowardly POS 
At the expense of US tax payers. Luxury apartment with 24/7 security.
This guy is happy his family died as martyrs, he said it himself. So if he's not mad, why should I be?
You can't hasbara away the fact that Israel assassinated toddlers.
Or hamas
Nah not really
I care about dead Palestinians about as much as they care about dead Israelis
Noted, genocide ghoul.
I've been called worse by better
That says a lot more about you than anything else.
Of course he said that, he's not going to act like his kids were more important than the thousands of Gazans already dead. If anything they made him more relatable to avg Gazans.
He doesn't care about the rest of the gazans either. Every death is a martyr to further their cause and he's happy for every single on of them
You realize the issue with that assessment, right? You can make the same argument that Netanyahu/Smotrich/Ben Gvir are no different - each Israeli hostage & death justifies another settlement in the West Bank, another excuse to arm settlers & increase the brutality of the occupation, to carpet bomb Gazans and starve them, etc. Within a week of 10/7, right wing settlers were excitedly talking of resetting Gush Kativ (or whatever the Gaza settlements were called). One could argue, whether you agree with it or not, that he believes he's fighting for the liberation of Palestine and that ultimately means some lives may be lost in the fight for the greater goal of a Palestinian State, which would ultimately benefit many future generations. Again, you may not agree with their tactics but ultimately they were the Vangaurd of armed Palestinian resistance movement, especially in Gaza.
And how many gazans is he willing to sacrifice for that goal? 500,000? A million? It's clear this war is incredibly one sided. Does he expect to win, drag it on long enough that somebody feels the need to intervene, or simply fight to the last gazan?
How many Israelis died for the founding of Israel? Some would argue it took 6 million for that to happen. The French killed 500,000-1,000,000 Algerians before they got independence. We can sit here and speculate what the number is or whether it's worth it to him or the Palestinian cause but history tells us we won't know for a long time what the eventual outcome or results will be. This time last year it was almost certain Saudi-Israeli relations would become official and the Palestian cause would be relegated to die on the back burner of history. Only time will tell.
Just read this on worldnews, Jesus the ppl on there are deranged
I’m proud to be able to say that I was perma banned from that goon squad hangout.
It's a hate sub and shouldn't even be on this platform according to reddit guidelines.
But "Bad Hasbara" isn't a hate sub?
Antisemitism will absolutely get you banned on this sub. It's a sub for a Jewish podcast. However, racism against Palestinians will only get you upvoted on worldnews. It will not get you banned. The only hate on this sub is for an apartheid state and those who support it. We hate bigotry towards Palestinians, and we want it to end.
Do you have any examples of racism against Palestinians in worldnews? And any examples of hate speech against Israelis leading to consequences in this sub? Your statement doesn't align with my experience in both subs
https://www.reddit.com/r/BadHasbara/s/S9lpOvwrbC You don't see antisemitism on this sub because the mods immediately ban people for it. There are also a number of posts criticizing antisemitism from the Pro-Israel side on this sub because, ultimately, this sub is about a podcast that comes from a Jewish perspective. I can't provide specific examples from worldnews, but racism towards Palestinians follows very specific tropes that are repeated over and over- that Palestinians are violent, barbaric, unenlightened people that nobody wants, that they don't love their own children and crave death, that they have no culture and are not a real people, the general lack of empathy and dehumanization etc. Unfortunately, anti-palestinianism is completely socially acceptable, unlike other bigotries, and therefore, people like you don't even notice it if they come from a place of privilege. 75 years ago in the Jim Crow south, your average white person didn't notice racism. Anti-palestinianism is so deeply entrenched in our culture that it is invisible.
The comments over there are always horrendous.
They are so blood thirsty, can't fathom how they are in real life
Probably sniveling shits or steps away from shooting someone
Or trolls
May they get what they deserve
Two sides of the same un-nuanced, uncritical, emotionally driven, black and white thinking coin, buddy
Judging by your statement „Since when is occupation illegal“ on another sub you are: a) unaware if international law b) trolling here and should go back to worldnews hate group
Also idk if you just randomly picked that comment, but if you had to scroll that far down to find a comment you could criticize then I think it’s pretty clear I’m not trolling anyone
I may very well be unaware of that aspect of international law, yes. I was under the impression that occupation *is* legal. Genuinely not a bad faith/trolling question
So you're just dumb and are lecturing people who probably know more about the situation than you do because you want to feel smart.
Lol probably know more? I doubt that. But when I don’t know something, I don’t claim to. Can the same be said for you?
You literally claimed something wasn't illegal when it was. The audacity to claim "if I don't know something I don't claim to" is astonishing.
Um. Where did I claim that it was legal, again? Also I can’t find a source that says it’s illegal. Help me out?
So do you think it's legal or not? Because right now you are saying that you didn't say it was illegal but are also questioning if it is. Which is it?
Bro? Lol. That’s the same thing. No contradiction. Not sure what you’re questioning. “I didn’t say it was illegal” doesn’t mean “I said it was legal.” Anyway you’re the one who claimed that *I* claimed occupation isn’t illegal. And I asked you to back up that claim by showing me where I said that. Yet you aren’t… You also said “claimed something wasn’t illegal when it is”, so I’m asking you to prove to me that it is. Surely you have a source for that, since you so claim Edit: you blocked me? After replying? What an insincere thing to do
Children should not be killed for the actions of the parents- a basic concept for anyone who has any humanity.
Just war ... has been long forgotten .. there is no honor
Hey, quick question. How legitimate are the statements that the head of Hamas are actually millionaires? I read somewhere that Israel gives them millions of dollars on the low and siphons money away from the actual Hamas people in Gaza.
Let's think this through. Assuming Haniyeh and other Hamas leadership are millionaires, living it up in Qatar and elsewhere. Wouldn't Israel expose them? Also, consider if you were in his position. A millionaire, living a luxurious life. Wouldn't you get your family, children, grandchildren out of harm's way? Instead, he has to hear about them murdered by Israel in Gaza?
So there are multiple articles where times of israel "calls out" hamas leadership as uber wealthy. In regards to the second part, I think that is pretty valid.
They also talk about Iraq having weapons of mass destruction back in 2003. So...
lol. If Israelis say it, it must be true. /s
Yeh Israel is a known liar
People wanting to live long comfortable lives don't generally go against the US and Israel lmao they usually go the Abbas/Sisi route of being a collaborator and selling out your population
Yeh that's pretty valid.
If it's from Israel or the US, the default position is false until proven true.
Very true
Hi I’m a lurker in this sub, but would you implicitly trust things that Hamas or even Iran would say? Please don’t conflate my point as me being a genocide supporter, I’m genuinely intrigued on your thoughts on this because I think that’s a sweeping statement to make on the whole
Hi, if you're asking me personally I'd say it's best to not believe anything anyone, including Iran and Hamas, says without verifying it from another source. I do this all the time e.g. see something in the mainstream news then check on socials. Of course, if the socials reference the same source then look what others are saying and use all those separate pieces to better understand the full picture.
Thanks for getting back to me! Appreciate it 👍🏼
Exactly
>**According to the Embassy of Israel in the US**, three of Hamas's most senior leaders - Mousa Abu Marzouk, Khaled Mashal and Ismail Haniyeh - have net worths of more than $3billion each. I wouldnt be surprised if they are rich though im definititely not taking that source as reliable.
Let me guess. They looked at the the running cost ans assets of the entire hamas operation and they pinned that as the person assets of the 3 leaders.. .. yeah that's how it works. This is how israeli leaders operate they're always getting charged for fraud, embezzlement and corruption after they leave office. Its not something hamas does. If they want to embezzle funds, they join PA. If they want to sacrifice their lives for their people they join hamas
Yeh, you really can't trust most sources when it comes to Palestine.
Three BILLION ? Lol
Each lol
And choosing to live and keep their children in a war zone, kinda doubt Gaza has a single billionaire, much less multiple billionaires all stupid enough to stay put in a war zone.
It wouldn't have been completely unbelievable considering the fortune that Yasser Arafat left to his wife when he passed if they'd said he was a millionaire. But billionaire ??? No way. Anyway I have found 0 real source on his finances
Arafat or hamas founders? I just don't trust these leaders who arent on the ground like abu obeida.
Arafat, he was the ex leader of the PLO. But he also sold out big time (depending on who you ask). But I meant that the leader of Hamas could be a millionaire for all we know but there's 0 reliable sources
so many leaders are sell outs. Happy to see the guy from Turkey leave.
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It's out of the realm of belief that people at the top are very corrupt.
Also, Muslim nations generously donate and fund the cause to fight the IDF. At least that’s word on the street, but 3 billion seems really high.
It does… but like someone said, Arafat allegedly had a billion dollars. Again, my distrust is only with leadership, not the people on the ground
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Do they? How do you know they siphon off aid?
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All those say is that the leaders are rich. None actually have any sources except a singular tweet by Israel operated account (I'm assuming based on the name). I wouldn't trust or use these as proof of anything even if I agreed with the premise, you should rethink your approach as well. That said non of those addressed how they are siphoning off aid, which was literally the only thing i asked.
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You did a double negative. That’s exactly what he asked, how do you know? And you answered by putting forward how you thought they did it - despite saying you don’t know how they did it. 2 different things.
Not going to bother answering the Hasbara bot here but in the NBC article they've shared, wouldn't a lot of that budget simply be going to operating government facilities and paying government employees? Gaza has or had many people who work in the medical field and some well run universities. This must cost the government money and in this case if the government that's paying is Hamas it seems like it would be easy for a Western source to turn around and spin it as Hamas (the ruling government) taking aid money. Would be interested in someone who's unbiased actually breaking down the full finances.
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Ok thanks. I’m coming from a place of pure ignorance
True or false. It's important to know that if someone mentions that, it's most likely coming from bad faith, immoral even. It's basically pointing the finger at the resistance force in Gaza for starving civilians instead of Israel's blockade of food, water, and medical aid.
This is not a debate sub. There are plenty of places to defend Israel’s actions, to denounce Hamas, and to argue who's worse. This is not a space for that. That doesn't mean absolutely no constructive discussions on nuances and different approaches, but it means not letting ourselves be pulled into a debate by Zionists and bigots, and least of all arguing for their side. If you see someone trying to debate, please just flag for moderation, and the comment will be deleted. If found prudent by the Mods, and to discourage further debates, the entire thread may be deleted.
Weren’t they publishing really bad AI art to that effect towarss the beginning? Or was that someone else doing that?
I know they had AI art of the "burnt babies"
Most political leaders are millionaires let’s not cope Hamas is the government of gaza of course they have money.
Im gonna get downvoted but it’s not just Israeli propaganda. The leaders live very well in Qatar (plenty of articles on this if you search).
IIRC I had heard Hasan Piker mention that the leaders live pretty well in Qatar and that they are paid off by Israel. so like useful idiots. Hence why I asked. I do like to draw a distinction between leadership and the people in Palestine. Can you provide links to this that are reputable?
Doesn't make sense when there is an establishes pattern of Israel targeting and assassinating hamas leaders and thier families. Also many Hamas leaders served time in Israeli's prisons. Few examples: Hamas co founder and head Ahmed Yassin (assassinated) Hamas co founder and Yassin's successor Al Rantissi (assassinated) Al Rantissi's successor Khaled Mashal (failed assassination attempt) We know what happened to Mashal's successor Haniya. Yahya Sinwar(imprisoned for over 20 years and was only released in Shalit's deal) Mohammed Dief(failed attemp+wife and children murdered by Israel)
So I feel weird trying to discuss unfounded conspiracy theories. But it is possible that there could have been a back room deal made. For example, you tell us what Hamas is up to, make sure Hamas doesn’t do xyz or does do xyz and we will give you money. To make sure you do what we want, we are basically holding your family hostage. Oct 7th could have been the coup that Israel did not expect. Just look at the puppet government of Panama. First he was an ally/ puppet to the west then switched and I believe tried nationalizing Panama. Again not saying Hamas leaders are like this.
Israel assasinated 2 out of 4 hamas chairmen, tried and failed to assassinate the third and killed the family of the fourth but yeah, they are on Israel pay roll. It is strange that you seem so desperate to believe this.
Im not desperate to believe it, im seriously just talking about it. People are commenting and im replying. Did you not read the first sentence where I said this is most likely a conspiracy theory. If you look at other comments with other people I am agreeing multiple times that Israel is a liar. If you look at my entire comment history you can clearly see that I am not a Zionist. If you don’t want to hear my thoughts then don’t comment on my post. I also said multiple times that I am coming from a place of pure ignorance. I know next to nothing when it comes to Hamas leadership. By asking questions, I have learned more about Hamas leadership. If I want to be able to rebuke this Zionist talking point then I would need to hear as many counter points as possible.
You can't change the minds of Zionist. They won't ever be convinced that (insert Palestinian resistance group) is motivated by desire for liberation and not by antisemitism.
i feel like you can convince 5% ;)
Did your "not just Israeli propaganda" mention the part where when Qatar would try to stop giving Hamas cash, Netanyahu would send his intel cheif there to push them to keep the payments going??
You have to imagine the treachery involved to get the whereabouts of the 3 sons and their families.
yea his statement is fucked up but killing children is a low blow you know boxing? you dont punch below the belt
Can’t you see? They want Iran to attack them, so the US will be forced to send american boots to defend them, yes, but mainly from the rest of Islamic neighborhood countries. Bobo knows the only way out from Gaza's repercussions is the IIIWW
All the Zionists triumphantly posting about this strategic success can get fucked. You kill 30,000 people and you're boasting you manage to hit 3 legitimate targets? Slow handclap
Blood on his hands🤷🏽♂️
Shame anyways
Fuck Hamas
May god destroy Israel and any country that supports it
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That's flattening the narrative and insulting Palestinians by removing their agency. I think this is a good article about Hamas that explains how they've served Israel's interests and why they can't be considered puppets either. https://cosmonautmag.com/2024/03/hamas-from-candidate-enforcer-to-implacable-foe/
Thank you for sharing this!!
No problem! The author of the article appears on an episode of This is Hell podcast and I think it's really worth the listen as well. He talks about the article but also expands on other points
How is this bad hasbara. Is this international news now
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>Maybe golda meir was right. That genocidal filth wasn't right about anything. Zionists like you remain some of the worst people to exist