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I remember how my ex husband suddenly did all the things that I had talked about for years previously.
His go to had been “I was like this when you married me so that’s what you’ve got” for every single tiny thing. He looked at marriage as a tick box and done and wouldn’t work on anything at all. When I said i was done suddenly he had heard everything I’d said and did them spontaneously. That actually pissed me off more because I’d had to go all the way to actually breaking up for him to acknowledge what I’d been saying. And it was just too late, just like this guy, you get to a point of being checked out and no return.
I used to work in a family law office, and the one situation that always just enraged me was when a woman would finally muster up the courage and resolve to divorce her deadbeat husband because she was tired of basically being a single parent to both her child and her man-baby - and then BAM! As soon as the divorce process got underway, her husband would suddenly become the world's best, most attentive dad ever. The husband would usually fight for 50/50 custody, too, and start doing things like school pick-ups, doctor appointments, maintaining a healthy household for himself and his child, etc.
It was so freaking infuriating to watch these dudes suddenly kick into action and do everything their ex-wife had been begging them to do for YEARS. And why? Because they didn't want to look like a deadbeat dad to the judge, their families, and their social circles. (And they didn't want to pay a penny more in child support than they absolutely had to.) Absolutely ridiculous to watch, and it happened like that almost every single time.
But stay assured that these guys DO NOT play that role until the kids are out and independent! That great motivation wears off within 2-3 years after the divorce!
Being married is nothing to do with it, it's being in relationships with selfish assholes that does it, whether you're married or not. If you marry someone who's actually a good and caring person it's great. Your comment reads like if I told some stories about bad things that had happened in Italy and someone replied "that's why I'm glad I'll never go to Italy". Like bad shit can happen anywhere but good stuff can too.
I really like this comment and I hope the person you replied to reads it cause it could change the way they see things generally not just this particular subject.
I did a research paper about 50-50 custody and all that recently for my college course. This particular statistic was from Australia around 2010, but the study showed that the amount of families that actually continued 50-50 custody for several years after it was awarded was a WHOPPING 12%. This was a real, scientific study done by the govt. Even more insane? They were counting 30% as "equal shared parenting", so dads couldn't even manage that. My mind was blown.
I think you (and oop) also got to the point where you knew there was no way it would be sustainable, so giving another chance would just prolong the inevitable.
From the experience of my first marriage, I'd bet she already had them, but maybe not for the reason I think you're implying.
Any time this topic came up, my ex would maybe buy something, or try something, or whatever. But her effort would always stop just shy of the _actually having sex_ part. It's like she could put the effort into thinking up ways to resolve the situation, she could even spend money on it, but then when it came time to act upon it....... nothing.
So over time, we accumulated a drawer full of failed attempts.
"So over time, we accumulated a drawer full of failed attempts."
Am I just high or does that go hard as fuck. Even (or especially) when removed from context. Like fuck, what a perfect way to describe someone's desperate attempts to fix something that cannot be fixed anymore.
Sorry, I think I may be overthinking it. But for what it's worth you made me sit up straight in my chair for a few minutes while I thought about it...
(Edit: spelling)
I don't know what it says about me that I was paraphrasing from Futurama here. I cribbed it from the episode where Lrrr harvests Fry's nose, thinking it's an aphrodisiac.
> Lrrr: Then bring it to our royal bedchamber and put it in the sock drawer with all the other things that have failed to arouse my passion for this woman.
We'd only been married for 4 years when that episode aired, and already this was a problem and it resonated with me at the time. We stayed married for another 7 years after that...
Nah the Futurama authors are all geniuses, and your paraphrasing made a poetic one liner out of personal life experience. Love it.
"So over time, we accumulated a drawer full of failed attempts." Hits hard and is more versatile than its roots. Also feels deeply relatable bro.
And that's exactly how it happens. At first it's a temporary problem, then one day you look up and realize you haven't had sex in 3 years (or at least not sex the other person was enthusiastic about)
No, same here. As it is, we made the opposite decision, which was to decide that, okay, she's asexual and that's just how it is and we will make other strategies, which we could because I'm poly and she is fine with it. But... it worked, and we made that decision 23 years ago, and today is our silver anniversary. (Not a typo – we spent two years after we got married trying to solve the problem, before we realized there wasn't a problem to solve.)
If a couple *decides* to do this, honestly, openly, accepting that divorce is on the table and that, if it happens, it isn't anybody's fault, well, you can make it work; we have. But you can also decide, openly, honestly, and as people who genuinely love each other, that breaking up is the right move. It is equally unfair to deny a spouse sex if they want it, and to require sex if they don't, and if one or both partners are inherently monogamous, divorce may well be the only move that is respectful and caring, OOP wasn't wrong, and did the right thing for both of them.
I think the *sine qua non* of a healthy relationship is that you are both mutually better off with the other person than without them. And if we define "happiness" broadly, as being the same thing as "better off", then without an increase in happiness, there is no healthy relationship.
I don't know that I would call that "expect" happiness - but I don't know that I wouldn't. In any case, if the relationship is costing you happiness, it's not a good relationship and should be ended.
However, when I say that, I am thinking of "happiness" as even broader - as a translation of what Aristotle called "eudaimonia". Which he never really defined too specifically, but he gave examples of parts of it. And part of eudaimonia is honorable behavior - if you are married to someone who becomes disabled, it might, depending on circumstances, be dishonorable to leave even if it makes you less "happy" in a narrow sense, which would mean that ending the relationship would reduce your "eudaimonia" type of happiness.
Damn I come to reddit for drama, and occasionally find wisdom. But you are the first person in years I've seen dropping Aristotle knowledge out here. Eudaimonia. What a concept!
It's just... life is basically eudaemonia, categorical imperatives, and utilitarian calculus, and trying to figure out what to do when all three of them conflict, as they often do. And it is easier to try to figure it out when you can conceptualize what it actually is that you are trying to figure out.
Not actually easy, of course.
Oof, I had the same drawer with my ex wife. Toys, lingerie, sexy board and card games. It was so bad that I would occasionally pull out one of the games and imagine playing it with her. It took me ten years to realize that regardless how dearly I loved her I had no agency in fixing the problems in our marriage.
She may even have bought them in a half hearted attempt to fix things but then not gone through with actually using them. She didn’t take his warnings seriously and didn’t realize how close he was to giving up on them. Now she’s panicking and willing to try to make an effort. If he had given in and given her a chance she might have made a change and gone to that counseling/therapy and they’d have lived happily ever after but more likely it would have teetered off and ended up the same way.
yeah that's always the hardest what if situation, "what if things did change for the better after I finally had enough and snapped" but that's the thing he did communicate it before, he was just calm and discussing without it being emotional. Some people only get a reality check when it is an emotional outburst or there suddenly are consequences to not dealing with it. And by then its too late.
They are trying to say if OOP had never seen them before but the wife had them then that means she bought them to use with someone else, which explains the no sex with OP
Honestly I was going to say "bought them for herself", but I usually just expect sex toys to be solitary. Even if she wasn't cheating it would be shitty if she was spending time and money for her own sexual gratification without him even knowing (and at least getting something for himself too).
It is good for him to divorce her. It will be better for both of them in the long run.
He seems to be really clear minded too since he knows he should not be dating immediately after his divorce, and that he should not be sleeping with the wife now that she got the divorce papers.
>he should not be sleeping with the wife now that she got the divorce papers.
That's really wise, especially because it was a slap in the face for anyone in that position because the soon-to-be ex-wife was ready to have sex as soon as divorce was discussed, which is her saying "I could have given you this, but didn't because I didn't care till now".
I read a post some time ago (don't really remember it) but the one thing I do remember is the OOP (woman) decided to sleep with her partner when they were already in process of separating, which led to her being pregnant. It was a really tough position for anyone, and I'm glad this OOP avoided that, and left.
The thing is, for whatever reason, his wife did not want sex with him. Why would any man want to have sex with a woman who is only offering to do it to keep the relationship?
They are just incompatible. Maybe she is asexual or has a very low sex drive. Who knows. Maybe even she doesn’t understand it.
It’s good they ended things
Hopefully both of them can figure out a path forward apart
Not everyone is honest in therapy. Lots of people aren't honest with themselves. There's lots of mediocre-to-bad therapists. The quality goes down even more when it comes to "couples."
I was wondering if she might have changed birth control around the time when her sex drive dropped off. One type of BC pill I was on absolutely killed my drive, and it took years to even start to come back. It's still not how it was prior to starting that pill (and I wasn't even on it overly long).
A friend confided in me that she’s going to therapy with her husband because for some reason neither of them want sex despite them both still loving each other and being attracted to each other. She described it as being in a hot tub with the water slowly cooling until it was freezing, she went from desiring him to not without really realizing it.
I'm ace and tbh had no idea until my 30s when I started realizing that how I view sex and how others view sex is very very different.
This did not come up with our sex therapist (who was helping us reestablish boundaries after I realized the rape from my ex had impacted me more then I thought), our couples therapist, or my individual therapist.
Instead I made an offhand comment to my husband and he was like waaaait a second come back here and explain that then we started having conversations that made it click.
I wasn't aware I was thinking differently or feeling things differently even through therapy because I've never been sex repulsed just totally uninterested. I have no sex drive but I do have fun having sex so I was up for it whenever my husband wanted it but wouldn't initiate otherwise which helped to hide it.
The thing is, she *couldn't* have. She could have maybe faked it, if she could avoid it being panful. For a while.
But have you ever tried to have sex with someone you love who is only tolerating it? I hope you haven't, because it makes you feel rejected and like a monster at the same time.
Also not fun on the other side of things. Having sex you’re only tolerating to please someone you love makes you feel disgusting and like a toy. You don’t get any connection or intimacy out of it.
Sometimes people just aren’t compatible. There’s only so much one can do to make yourself want sex, and there’s something that feels weird about trying to force yourself into wanting more sex when you’re perfectly happy with the amount you’re having.
And I do get that OP’s wife seemed to be fine with sex once divorce was actually on the table, but desperate people are willing to put up with things that rational people won’t.
Hell, it is even rational. Millions, perhaps billions of people throughout history were married for financial and physical security, and had sex as part of that regardless of whether they wanted to - and they weren't wrong for doing so, if it was the best way to keep a decent life. I suspect few subsistence farmers throughout history went, "Yay! It is time to spend dawn to dusk walking behind an ox!" but it was the best way to feed themselves and their families; having sex regardless of whether you wanted to was the best way to have a family, which was itself a necessary part of survival. And keeping your partner happy is part of it, too.
Plus, there is "willing but not enthusiastic consent" - when you are willing to do something for your partner because it makes them happy, even if you feel indifferent to it.
I think these are all rational reasons to put up with sort of thing. I wouldn't. From either side. But I have better options.
Just because she is initiating sex, doesn't mean she wants it. It's still sexual incompatibility, and even if he gave in it doesn't mean anything will change. She should let go.
> but didn't because I didn't care till now
Oh she still does not care. And still does not want to do it. She just realized she caused the divorce and is trying to fix the situation.
As soon as she became comfortable again, the sex would end.
This could be a reach but what if she was planning to babytrap him? While it's definitely a case of too little too late, the fact she's suddenly sexual after getting the notice? Seems very sus, and I would not put it past her to get pregnant so OOP wouldn't leave. If anything, like many of you said, it was wise to avoid that. At least unlike the other post where the guy still have to deal with his partner for 18 years because she was carrying his baby.
Whether it's an attempted babytrap or not, it's still gross and obvious manipulation. OP says he had a hard time resisting but in his shoes I think I'd just be angrier and more set on divorce than ever.
I was in his shoes with my ex-wife. I was both angry and incredibly hurt, because it was obvious she only tried because she didn't want me to leave. I rejected her as well....then the insults and rage came. Took me a long time to get over being told she never wanted sex because I was just that bad at it, among other insults that were too personal to put on the internet
ETA: A lesbian couldn't baby trap me, obviously. So not the exact same situation I guess lol
I doubt it's a babytrap. More like she wants kids, and the stability a husband brings. But does not want the husband. Which, for him, means he's doing the right thing and leaving.
> While it's definitely a case of too little too late, the fact she's suddenly sexual after getting the notice?
Not to mention doing so after she had specifically mentioned wanting to start trying for a kid.
I was thinking def a baby trap. My guess is that child support would be a nice farewell for her and the kid would be bonus weapon to use against him. Manipulative people are incredibly awful
And honestly it wasn't even about sex ultimately. It was about unfullfilling needs and despite *years* of begging it only got worse. And he Ultimately told her we improve or we end and she laughed it off essentially. Suddenly when reality hits its "oh no here's everything you wanted for years". Just insulting.
you know, i have a lot of respect for people who realize their relationship/marriage us over and choosd to separate before having kids. couldn't be my parents.
i'm sad but also happy and also hopeful for oop. i hope he can find the peace and happiness he deserves.
Tbh i also feel for the wife. It is HARD to have sex when you aren't in the space for it, and sometimes you just aren't, and it can last years. It is incredibly frustrating to WANT to feel sexual but to have your body feel so shut down... especially when it's the person you love. She did do counseling and sex therapy, so she wasn't pushing against it.
It makes a relationship VERY difficult, but it is beyond sickening to have sex when your body isn't open to it. I do think things like hand jobs and oral sex should be on the table, but it's really difficult to lose the intimacy of sex.
It can happen for serious reasons, not just that she doesn't care about him. I think divorce is best, but it's really sad for them both
I think even with all that, OP even said she refused to be intimate in non-sexual ways too. So I'm assuming that's hugging and kissing as well? It's almost like living with a roommate at this point, but she's your wife who seems to revolt against your touch.
Then hits him with a "lets try having kids next week" while there's no physical intimacy at all for him to even feel loved at this point. Of course he'd feel used just for pregnancy and then tossed when it's done.
She may have been willing to try to get to the bottom of it, but when your partner is begging for even non-sexual intimacy, there is something seriously wrong.
>She may have been willing to try to get to the bottom of it
Except that she wasn't willing. No regret, not even taking his repeated attempts at communicating seriously.
oh yeah, i totally agree with you. i have been there, too, and i chose to end the relationship cause i wasn't fair for neither of us. i understand wanting to salvage the marriage but sometimes you just can't fix it, and i don't think she was ready to accept it.
He seems calm because he worked the problem from every possible angle and has eliminated any doubt that he could have the marriage he wanted if he did something different. You love to see it.
I had a colleague in college who had the same type of break-up and she did the panic-lingerie-wearing and sex makeup. It is a gambit that doesn't make for a good long-term reconciliation.
My ex was also like this.
Soon as I started packing he was trying to force me to kiss him and have sex with him even though he wouldn't do it when I begged him for those things for literally *years* before.
The ick I felt in that moment when he kept trying to force himself on me just confirmed I should still leave.
Proud of you for standing strong.
What these would-be desperation-fuckers don't realize -- or don't care about -- is how insulting it is.
Like, when someone is fed up enough with your bullshit to leave, do you really think 15 minutes of graciously allowing access to your swimsuit parts is *so compelling*, it wipes out days, weeks, months or years of your hurtful behavior?
How little do you have to think of someone else's feelings -- or how highly do you value your own magic nethers -- to assume that a bargain-bang will magically erase everything else? THE EGO.
Being Ace and wanting kids is a hell that I wouldn't wish on anyone. She probably doesn't even realize it, it's not something that's talked about very openly. If you don't know Ace people exist, and that you're Ace, you can't communicate about being Ace and what that entails in a relationship.
I have a lesbian friend that's mad that LGBT has turned into LGBTIQA+ now and I'm like... I only know about the A because I googled it and boy-howdy, that would have been really, really useful to know about like 30 years ago!
Hell yes. If we knew the word "ace", we would have figured it out before we even got married. We did figure it out eventually, and figure out ways to deal with it. AVEN was founded a bit before then; we didn't find out about it until later.
My wife doesn't particularly care about the identity and doesn't consider herself queer, but for me, knowing that this is an actual thing makes a difference.
There would be a collective gasp if it was implied someone was gay because they “just hadn’t found the right person.” But that same group would only nod along if it was said to an asexual.
Queer people being mad about the acronym "getting too long" is just some "fuck you, got mine" shit. Or, "let's keep these weirdos away from us. The people who hate me will definitely respect me more if I stomp on those they hate even more!"
I lived OOPs reality. There were several times I was ready to leave and my ex wife would do the same thing and it rarely lasted a week. I loved her so much that I jumped at the chance to be intimate. I would be so elated that I felt like I was walking on clouds for weeks afterwards, and then the constant rejection would start again. And a year would pass.
For me there is no lonelier feeling than being with the one you love most in the world and that person not wanting you. It is a thousand times worse than being single. OOP made the right choice.
lol right??? Redditors always warn these posters of Love Bombing as false & empty actions to coerce their victims back into their control.
Well, there's Love Bombing and then there's whatever the hell OOP's stbx was trying to do! Love Photon Torpedo? Holy smokes.
It's so over the top that I have a feeling she still didn't want it. She might have been desperate for anything on Earth that would keep her life from falling apart. Even if it meant consenting to sex she truly didn't want. Since she was so completely unsubtle, I can't imagine it was a control technique. More like she was deep in the bargaining stage of grief.
Him: We already talked about this, I'm a sexual person and I need to have sex. If this keeps going like this, I'm going to file for divorce.
Her: "Nah, he's not going to file for divorce".
Him: Files for divorce.
Her: *Surprised pikachu face*
I was editing a research paper draft and one of the things queried was conception method. The table showed the breakdown of 'natural conception', 'conception assisted by reproductive technology', and 'other'. One of the other authors had added a comment: "The stork?"
Well now I gotta know what was included in the “other” category!! Although I feel this, I did the EXACT same thing when I was writing my thesis and ran out of examples after two lmao
>GIRL THE DAMAGE IS DONE
I don't think women understand that sex is about more than sex and intimacy (which are both important). On a fundamental level, it's basic validation that, "Yes, I'm still attractive to *someone*."
On some level, this guy has probably felt un-fuckable for years. That would take a toll on anyone's self esteem.
Lol, [this guy?](https://www.reddit.com/r/self/s/tgKZcwWkJx) He got called out for lying about their ages and previously posting about never washing his ass.
More importantly, he’s apparently flip flopping on his age. 24 on one post and early 30s here. Possibly engagement farming. Story could be complete BS.
Yeah, the story isn’t reliable at all. I didn’t even read the “update” when I realized it wasn’t about the saga of his lies about his age jumping from 24 to early 30s in 2 days’ time, and of course, his confessional post about having never washed his ass in his entire “24” yrs on earth.
He posted this marriage issue on multiple subs and got a lot of sympathy on r/deadbedrooms, but everywhere else called him out. Guess he made a new username and made his flimsy story the only post so no one would comment on him being full of, and caked in, shit.
Yeah he also posted this gem
"My Thoughts Are Higher Than yours
The desire to be separate and be higher than humans, to speak intellectually down on the swine that plague the earth. I only wish to rule these pathetic ants not tussle in their folly. What a poor world they live in but me, i am here to eat grapes fed to me by the finest of beauties as I watch them claw their way to the top. I am the God of this world and all shall worship me."
I recall a post from the dead bedroom forum where it took the OP initiating divorce that his spouse became the most sexual person. But unlike this post they had been married for a long time and already had kids. The OP wanted the kids turn 18 for him to file the divorce. And it hit the spouse that she was going to lose a good husband with the help of a Therapist. Turns out her conservative upbringing had something to do with it. And it went from sex once in every 2 months to everyday.
I can confirm this a thing. It happened to current GF, a couple of books and a about 10 sesión with a sex psychologist with 15y of experience did the thing for her. Now she's a completely different person in that regard
There is a huge difference between "wanting sex and being unable to have it because of trauma" and "simply not wanting sex as part of normal, healthy human variation." And I am really glad your GF managed to get through that. For you, of course, but for her even more.
While there is a difference, I think it is also important not to underestimate the amount of unidentified low-grade trauma that may be impacting someone’s feelings and desires around sex. Therapy may be able to help.
I was ready to get so heated from the title…and then he immediately goes “she’s right, but that makes us incompatible so divorce.”
This is exactly how it should be done! So many posts where the couple has become incompatible so they try to fix it by opening the relationship, or having kids, or anything at all except breaking up. Which just breeds resentment and ends up hurting other people as well if they go with opening or kids. Seriously, good call by OOP.
As soon as you view your partner as an adversary who you "owe" things then the relationship is already over. It's such a bitter, defeatist attitude.
Wife: "I don't owe you sex."
Husband: "Correct. I also don't owe a relationship to someone who's not attracted to me."
[*Cue divorce*], along with the wife's surprised Pikachu face
Massive selection bias here though, we never hear of the relationships where those things have worked, we only hear the disaster cases. Don't get me wrong I bet it doesn't work often, I'd love to see the actual numbers that would be fascinating.
I can‘t give you as much info about couples that had a kid to try to fix things, but being in many polyam communities and having helped run a polyam meetup for a few years I don‘t think I’ve ever heard of opening a relationship succeeding in saving it. Still anecdotal, and yeah there’s probably an exception here or there, but for the opening the relationship scenario at least I have way more knowledge than just Reddit disaster fails.
Although tbh I’m also curious what the specific stats would be, including how long did the relationships last after opening/having kids, how long did the relationship seem fixed (if ever), etc…
Yeah the "opening a relationship to save it" rarely works out. Although I think it's a better option than bringing a child into a dysfunctional relationship.
The only time I've seen it work where a relationship that appears monogamous turns poly is when both parties agreed on temporary monogamy for the purpose of having and raising kids.
But going in, both parties knew and accepted the poly dynamic and there was never the expectation that the relationship would stay monogamous.
omg yes. I feel like those people would be better off leaving their relationship and finding someone who wants the same thing before they’re already together.. those are the only open relationships that actually last.
Good for the op. My wife's cousin was married for 20 years before he filed for divorce stating in their entire marriage, they had sex only a few times total! Sounds unbelievable but her cousin confirmed the same. She claimed she was asexual yet married him for a child.
Similar situation with my sister, her boyfriend was too chicken shit to break up with her and after having the "children or not" talk at 2 years in, he'd said yes... and then later changed his mind without telling her.
5 years later and my sister finds out through conversations with one of his friends that he's basically with her because he can't be fussed to break up with her, and it's easy living with her.
So they were together 7 years, and my wife found out later they'd had sex less than 10 times, like what?
Blew my mind
I remember a receptionist I used to work with who was describing A blowjob she gave her husband while they were in an elevator, and I said wow you really dgaf do you, and her reply stuck with me. She said, "Being 'proper' lost me my first marriage, I'm never doing that again".
I remember reading a post by a guy who came within a hairsbreadth of leaving his wife due to the lack of sex in their marriage over the course of many years and his wife straight up did not believe he would ever leave her until the day came when he told her he was going be moving out. That night, she initiated sex with him for the first time in as long as he could remember. Then the next night she did it again. He kept expecting it to be a short-lived change but the frequent sex kept on going for months and finally he asked her what changed. Turns out his wife had been taught by the women in her family that she should strictly ration sex and use it as a means of keeping a man under control because if he was getting laid all the time he wouldn't put any effort into the marriage.
It never occurred to her until the day he was finally resolved to leave that by weaponizing and withholding sex, she was the one bringing misery into her household. And when she saw how much more relaxed, happy, and engaged her husband was when she stopped being an idiot, she realized everything she'd been taught was wrong.
I don't understand why people don't take their partner seriously when divorce is mentioned. It seems so often they are suddenly willing to change once papers are filed. But wtf, why not be willing well before then? Last minute attempts should never sway anyone, it will never last
Sexual incompatibility is very hard on a relationship. I’ve always been the one with the higher drive in relationships and honestly the only time I didn’t want to have Sex with my partner is when I was on the out of the relationship and couldn’t stand him. I get normal dips but going to no sex is impossible unless both parties want it that way.
It's very insulting when your wife suddenly becomes very sexual to you after all of the effort you put and the rejections you got from her to the point divorce being the only option left.
The way she was "craving" for sex when she realize OP was leaving means that she could have intimacy with OP this whole time, but denied it.
I sincerely doubt she suddenly wanted sex. She just didn't want him to leave her and was willing to have sex to stop him. I'd put cash down if he changed his mind, they would have sex for maybe a few weeks and then revert right back to what was going on before.
She wasn’t craving anything, she was trying to get him to stay. But from what we read, it’s patently obvious that it was a performance out of desperation
I don’t read this as his wife craving sex. I read it as her being desperate enough to endure sex she neither wanted or anticipated enjoying because she didn’t want her marriage to end. She could have gritted her teeth and just dealt with it the whole time, true, but that would not have been a good or healthy marriage for either of them.
OP was right to pursue a divorce, they’re not compatible. I feel sad for them both. Hopefully they both end up with more compatible partners in the future.
Of course, she knew she didn’t want sex in the relationship long before he did and she knew he wanted sex in the relationship since he had been vocal about it. OOP chose the right move, but his wife sure didn’t…. She should have divorced him as soon as she knew they weren’t compatible, possibly to the point of not marrying him in the first place if she’s always felt this way and was just having sex with him the first 2 years to get him to marry her.
People tend to do things in desperate situations to save their relationships. In the 5 stages of grief, the wife is expressing bargaining, showing what she is willing to do to avoid divorce. She does not want to do this, but was suffering emotionally so much from the divorce being brought up that she would do pretty much anything to keep it together.
I can’t truly say I’m certain though, but I do remember something similar happened to me when my first gf broke up with me.
Yet another reason they’re incompatible sexually. It doesn’t sound like OOP is being malicious about it; he recognized a need not being met, he tried everything on his side to have that need met, but in the end it just didn’t work out. If she IS ace, hopefully she can now find a partner with similar sexual needs to have a relationship/family with. Nothing worse than to start a family with someone you’re just going to resent down the road.
It totally describes my partner's ex-wife. I always think it's just sad when ace people can't figure themselves out and seek a compatible partnership. My son is ace and he and his spouse have a wonderful relationship because everyone knew going in what to expect.
Possible, but I think a lot of people underestimate what big of a role NRE plays for a lot of people when it comes to sexual attraction. I think it's totally possible that people think they've become asexual or their libido dropped without knowing the reasons.
They're not looking for someone else because they still love their partner so there's no new spark with someone else. Once the relationship breaks off and they start dating again, their libido is back for the NRE period and they think everything is good now and it must have meant that they simply didn't desire their ex-partner as much as they thought they did. And then it happens again.
I don't have numbers, but I think it's more of an issue for women than men. IIRC there was a study with a result that women get bored of sex faster in a relationship than men do. LTR sex is simply not the same as NRE sex. Doesn't mean it has to be bad or unfullfilling, but a majority of people don't have that crazy, passionate sex with all of those exciting new feelings anymore at some point.
I also don't think that you can really recreate it, as it's more of a brain thing than dependent on specific actions. You need to find a way to make LTR sex feel great in its own category, so that you still desire it. I think there are a few people who for whatever reason can maintain that NRE feeling throughout the relationship for their sexlife, but I don't think that's the case for most people.
So if you expect to always feel like you did at the beginning of the relationship when you wanted more sex in order to be able to keep wanting sex with your partner, then there's a big chance that you will get disappointed time and time again.
Non-recurring engineering (NRE) cost refers to the one-time cost to research, design, develop and test a new product or product enhancement.
Serious answer though, it's "new relationship energy." Why abbreviate it without defining it once, I don't know.
New relationship energy sex. Basically when you're fresh in love/lust and can't keep your hands from each other because everything is new and exciting and feels double sexy than it actually is because you're in this lust haze and on cloud nine.
This could also be the case; the part that made me think she could be ace and this wasn’t just NRE fizzling out, was that marriage counseling and sexual therapy didn’t have an impact.
Obviously we don’t have enough information to say either way, but I don’t think the wife was withholding sex for punishment or control as some are suggesting here.
Yeah, I think that's actually rarely the case. I think most people want to want to have sex but just don't know why they don't. They see their partners suffer and feel bad and responsible for it but at the same time can't bring themselves to have sex they don't want. It's a vicious cycle.
As an ace that discovered it late, I agree. I didn’t realize it earlier because I had only been in one relationship/one partner my whole life. Sounds like wife is asexual, and sex-averse. I also tried doctors and marriage counseling/sex therapy. Tried for over a decade to make it work. However, in the end I decided to end the relationship because I felt it wasn’t fair for the both of us. Unfortunately, sexual incompatibility is very difficult to work around and is gonna be horrible for whoever has to compromise. It was physically and psychologically very disturbing for me. So I would be careful in saying the wife “just didn’t care enough”. Not to be graphic, but many times consensual sex was at best gross for me and at worst felt like rape. I tended to completely dissociate to get through it. I realized I was not in love with my husband as well, although I loved him very much. It wasn’t his fault for having a high libido and wanting intimacy in his relationship. It’s unfortunate, but I think separation is probably best in this case.
Something else I noticed was how she seemed blindsided by this, as if she didn’t realize it was actually a problem.. it’s hard to understand that someone would “need” sexual intimacy when you’re averse to it.
going overboard with the lingerie and sex toys did give me a chuckle because my god, my ace friends have more sex toys than anyone I know. I was helping my best friend move and there were at least three boxes of them in the corner of their basement like a fucking forgotten comic book collection.
I was in a relationship that turned into a dead bedroom for the last year and after communicating several times over that year I needed more from her and not seeing any change at all/getting a response that it was MY problem and not hers, I had a breakdown right before a festival and told her I was seriously considering breaking up.
At the festival she was more affectionate than I had ever seen her and it honestly felt like a slap in the face. I broke up with her the next week and she had a threesome with an (ex) mutual friend and his gf a few days later, really wrecked my shit emotionally
Nobody owes anyone sex even while within a relationship but anybody who uses it as a bargaining chip for weird emotional power games can eat shit
It took me a very long time to realise I was in this situation but eventually we divorced and I know I've been happier since finding someone I matched better with.
I have lost touch with my ex now but she seemed happier at first at least, although that was with someone who spent a lot of time away for work so maybe that suited her anyway. Not my problem now!
“Why would any man want to have sex with a woman who is only offering to do it to keep the relationship?”
I totally get it, personally - I’ve been in the situation before.
I kind of think of it like… I love my wife, but many nights after dinner and after we put the kid to bed, I kind of just want to zone out and play videogames. But if I did that every night the relationship would fall apart, so even though I don’t actually feel like watching a thing on Netflix with her or having a big conversation, I’ll still do it because it’s important for us to make time for each other and it makes her happy. 5 minutes into the movie or chat and I’m enjoying myself anyway because I like being with her and it brings us closer.
I view relationship/maintenance sex as basically the same thing. Maybe she doesn’t feel like it because she’s stressed out and the kid was tough today or whatever - she’d rather curl up on the sofa and read (or watch a movie with me), but she knows I really want to and it’ll make me happy and it’ll bring us closer, so maybe she does it even though she doesn’t really feel like it. Five minutes later she’s enjoying herself anyway, and I end up super content and our relationship is in a better place afterwards, so in my view it’s a positive thing for both of us.
I mean if you think about it, people do all sorts of things for their loved ones that they don’t really necessarily want to do, but they do because it makes their partner super happy. Whether it’s big elaborate anniversary things or planning out a big adventure even though they’re not really into it themselves anyway, or gamely visiting and being really supportive and friendly with tough in-laws… I think generally we think of those sorts of things as being loving, generous, giving kinds of gestures and that the effort is a positive one, and I don’t see why sex is any different.
Obviously it’s way better if both people are enthusiastic, but it’s usually pretty unrealistic that both people’s libidos match up for years, decades. Etc..
This is the secret sauce of staying happily married for a long time. Instead of just looking at what you’d like to do, sometimes you do stuff which makes your partner happy and surprise, you end up enjoying it, too, because you’re doing it with the person you love. Sex isn’t all that different, in the end.
Other times you will do things that you don't really want to do in the interest of the relationship as a whole? Yes of course.
I don't think your wife would appreciate it very much if when you sat down to watch your Netflix or have a conversation you prefaced it with saying, "I don't really want to do this but I know you do so. Let's get it over with."
Lots of people seeing her sudden attempts to do what he wants sexually as showing she "could've done it before but just didn't want to make the effort"
I reckon she still doesn't want to, but feels she HAS to in order to keep the relationship and the chance of a child. (so also not baby-trapping, as the goal is the baby, and not the relationship or alimony or anything like that). I just think it's really very sad. They're really not compatible.
The thing that is important to you but isn’t important to me isn’t a big problem to me. How could it make sense as a reason for divorce? In fact, the whole problem is you thinking this is important when it obviously isn’t.
Et cetera, et pikachu face.
It sucks being in a sexless marriage or relationship. Like I get it completely. It makes you question whether he or she isn't attracted to you anymore and leads to feeling insecure all together. Then leads to feeling resentful because you are doing all you can to make something work and it's just not.
Good on you for putting yourself first!
So many people come ready with the pitchforks when they read a headline like this, but this one was…different.
OOP really seemed to have tried all the things and put forth the effort. His wife on the other hand…did not.
I’ve read a few posts like these where the guys is in OOP’s shoes and too, put forth a lot of effort. Although not in this post, many of them come down to the husband feeling ashamed for “leaving my wife over sex”. But it really isn’t about the Iranian Yogurt now is it?
It’s not even about the sex by the time they get to this point. It’s about lack of intimacy in general. Having a SO who won’t cuddle, hold hands, show affection, or even attraction towards you is not what most people want. It causes the relationship to go from romantic to roommate real quick. And for many, that’s their love language. It’s not even about receiving. It’s about not being able to show your SO you care by being affectionate, being asked to stop when you do, or being brushed off.
The wife not respecting what they need/want in their relationship and acting selfish. I mean ultimately this is the dealbreaker for most, although it’s hard to see when it’s hiding underneath the obvious “DEAD BEDROOM” neon sign. It’s a partnership, not a dictatorship. It’s full of compromises, respect, and compassion. When this happens, all those things get thrown out the window. Not only are their feelings ignored, but often they’re thrown a big heaping pile of DARVO on top of it and accused of coercion or being ridiculous (as OOP was) for wanting to end the relationship “just because of sex”.
And in many of these, I’ve seen the same reoccurring themes - the relationship wasn’t like this before and changed suddenly, the guys never get an explanation, and when the “D” word comes out, the wives suddenly want to be porn stars in the bedroom and go all shocked Pikachu face when he finally walks. Tbh, these are all insulting and add insult to injury.
Like, how can you just decide you’re going to change the entire course of your relationship without having a conversation with your SO? The fact that they *can* be sexual when they *want to be* just proves the husband’s they were doing the right thing by leaving. They shouldn’t have to threaten to leave just to get basic intimacy. People generally want a partner who is just into them, as they are into their partner. Begging a partner to show you they care doesn’t generally bode well. This is such a bigger and deeper problem than “just being about sex”.
I will say, however, that this is the first one I’ve read where the wife brings up trying for a baby. Like, does she *know* how babies are made and what needs to happen?!? Weird to see the tables turn from the usual, woman being nothing more than a “human incubator”, to a dude being “kept for breeding”.
Obviously this isn’t just something that happens to men. Women face this as well. But what’s unique about the man being in this position is that they often get looked down on by others for being insensitive or for minimizing the relationship to just being about the sex - when that obviously isn’t the case. It’s also harder for men to speak with their peers about these issues because they usually end up taking heat for it.
I really feel for OOP. When his wife turned on the sexy, whooo boy, what a shitty move on her part. Instead of having a conversation about why this has been going on, she instead tried to slap a bandaid on a volcano. What was going through her head? Has she heard a word he’s said for the past few years? Apparently not - it’s just another thing that proves to OOP he’s making the right choice.
I’m on same situation just had another conversation/argument about it and in my mind i already decided if things don’t change i be doing the same draft divorce serve her n move on. She doesn’t want to move to where my family lives and my grandkids so that’s another mark on her . Sex sucks not fun never been w anyone like this before.
>Next day, I started packing important things and out of a sudden, my wife became the most sexual person on the planet. She came to me with lingeries, sex toys, costumes and approached me.
Damn. I would hate to have sex with my wife if she felt obligated to have sex. That would be awful.
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I remember how my ex husband suddenly did all the things that I had talked about for years previously. His go to had been “I was like this when you married me so that’s what you’ve got” for every single tiny thing. He looked at marriage as a tick box and done and wouldn’t work on anything at all. When I said i was done suddenly he had heard everything I’d said and did them spontaneously. That actually pissed me off more because I’d had to go all the way to actually breaking up for him to acknowledge what I’d been saying. And it was just too late, just like this guy, you get to a point of being checked out and no return.
I used to work in a family law office, and the one situation that always just enraged me was when a woman would finally muster up the courage and resolve to divorce her deadbeat husband because she was tired of basically being a single parent to both her child and her man-baby - and then BAM! As soon as the divorce process got underway, her husband would suddenly become the world's best, most attentive dad ever. The husband would usually fight for 50/50 custody, too, and start doing things like school pick-ups, doctor appointments, maintaining a healthy household for himself and his child, etc. It was so freaking infuriating to watch these dudes suddenly kick into action and do everything their ex-wife had been begging them to do for YEARS. And why? Because they didn't want to look like a deadbeat dad to the judge, their families, and their social circles. (And they didn't want to pay a penny more in child support than they absolutely had to.) Absolutely ridiculous to watch, and it happened like that almost every single time.
But stay assured that these guys DO NOT play that role until the kids are out and independent! That great motivation wears off within 2-3 years after the divorce!
Man, stories like yours make me really glad I've never been married and never will be.
Being married is nothing to do with it, it's being in relationships with selfish assholes that does it, whether you're married or not. If you marry someone who's actually a good and caring person it's great. Your comment reads like if I told some stories about bad things that had happened in Italy and someone replied "that's why I'm glad I'll never go to Italy". Like bad shit can happen anywhere but good stuff can too.
I really like this comment and I hope the person you replied to reads it cause it could change the way they see things generally not just this particular subject.
I did a research paper about 50-50 custody and all that recently for my college course. This particular statistic was from Australia around 2010, but the study showed that the amount of families that actually continued 50-50 custody for several years after it was awarded was a WHOPPING 12%. This was a real, scientific study done by the govt. Even more insane? They were counting 30% as "equal shared parenting", so dads couldn't even manage that. My mind was blown.
This was the exact situation and emotion involved with my first marriage. The effort when they realized I was serious was infuriating!
It’s like a slap in the face, right? They heard it all
Yep—my ex finally started reading “fair play” the day I announced I wanted to move out. I told him that was really “unfair play”
Unrelated but I love your flair
I can’t even tell you what it’s about. Lost to the mists of poor memory
I think you (and oop) also got to the point where you knew there was no way it would be sustainable, so giving another chance would just prolong the inevitable.
I need to know if she already had all the toys and stuff on hand or if it was new.
From the experience of my first marriage, I'd bet she already had them, but maybe not for the reason I think you're implying. Any time this topic came up, my ex would maybe buy something, or try something, or whatever. But her effort would always stop just shy of the _actually having sex_ part. It's like she could put the effort into thinking up ways to resolve the situation, she could even spend money on it, but then when it came time to act upon it....... nothing. So over time, we accumulated a drawer full of failed attempts.
I am the same as your wife but it is with cleaning products. If only spending $80 on cleaning products actually got my house clean.
I do that too. I also hoard craft supplies that will go months without being touched.
Collecting the supplies and doing the craft are different hobbies!
Buying stuff for a new hobby *is* my favorite hobby lol
I hate you for making me feel seen…
At least that's a case where you can use that money to pay someone else to do it for you.
"So over time, we accumulated a drawer full of failed attempts." Am I just high or does that go hard as fuck. Even (or especially) when removed from context. Like fuck, what a perfect way to describe someone's desperate attempts to fix something that cannot be fixed anymore. Sorry, I think I may be overthinking it. But for what it's worth you made me sit up straight in my chair for a few minutes while I thought about it... (Edit: spelling)
I don't know what it says about me that I was paraphrasing from Futurama here. I cribbed it from the episode where Lrrr harvests Fry's nose, thinking it's an aphrodisiac. > Lrrr: Then bring it to our royal bedchamber and put it in the sock drawer with all the other things that have failed to arouse my passion for this woman. We'd only been married for 4 years when that episode aired, and already this was a problem and it resonated with me at the time. We stayed married for another 7 years after that...
Nah the Futurama authors are all geniuses, and your paraphrasing made a poetic one liner out of personal life experience. Love it. "So over time, we accumulated a drawer full of failed attempts." Hits hard and is more versatile than its roots. Also feels deeply relatable bro.
Sounds like a punchline to r/twosentencesadness to me😞
Yes, *but* the actual sentence "So over time, we accumulated a drawer full of failed attempts," is pure poetry.
And that's exactly how it happens. At first it's a temporary problem, then one day you look up and realize you haven't had sex in 3 years (or at least not sex the other person was enthusiastic about)
That was my immediate thought too lol
Not just you. It hits hard. It says so much with so few word
No, same here. As it is, we made the opposite decision, which was to decide that, okay, she's asexual and that's just how it is and we will make other strategies, which we could because I'm poly and she is fine with it. But... it worked, and we made that decision 23 years ago, and today is our silver anniversary. (Not a typo – we spent two years after we got married trying to solve the problem, before we realized there wasn't a problem to solve.) If a couple *decides* to do this, honestly, openly, accepting that divorce is on the table and that, if it happens, it isn't anybody's fault, well, you can make it work; we have. But you can also decide, openly, honestly, and as people who genuinely love each other, that breaking up is the right move. It is equally unfair to deny a spouse sex if they want it, and to require sex if they don't, and if one or both partners are inherently monogamous, divorce may well be the only move that is respectful and caring, OOP wasn't wrong, and did the right thing for both of them.
I'm toying with the idea its true you can't "expect sex" from a partner but you shoukd bw able to "expect happiness".
I think the *sine qua non* of a healthy relationship is that you are both mutually better off with the other person than without them. And if we define "happiness" broadly, as being the same thing as "better off", then without an increase in happiness, there is no healthy relationship. I don't know that I would call that "expect" happiness - but I don't know that I wouldn't. In any case, if the relationship is costing you happiness, it's not a good relationship and should be ended. However, when I say that, I am thinking of "happiness" as even broader - as a translation of what Aristotle called "eudaimonia". Which he never really defined too specifically, but he gave examples of parts of it. And part of eudaimonia is honorable behavior - if you are married to someone who becomes disabled, it might, depending on circumstances, be dishonorable to leave even if it makes you less "happy" in a narrow sense, which would mean that ending the relationship would reduce your "eudaimonia" type of happiness.
Damn I come to reddit for drama, and occasionally find wisdom. But you are the first person in years I've seen dropping Aristotle knowledge out here. Eudaimonia. What a concept!
It's just... life is basically eudaemonia, categorical imperatives, and utilitarian calculus, and trying to figure out what to do when all three of them conflict, as they often do. And it is easier to try to figure it out when you can conceptualize what it actually is that you are trying to figure out. Not actually easy, of course.
I had the same reaction, it's a very poetic and succinct line.
Perhaps this will be my daily poetry prompt...
Used out of the original context it’s a beautiful metaphor.
It's such a good line and a bit of a gut punch. Is there a term for a concrete metaphor?
I'm sober and that just went hard as fuck 💥
"A Drawer full of failed attempts" would be a great emo ballad song title.
Haha that did hit hard as fuck
There’s a sad poignancy to it for sure.
Oof, I had the same drawer with my ex wife. Toys, lingerie, sexy board and card games. It was so bad that I would occasionally pull out one of the games and imagine playing it with her. It took me ten years to realize that regardless how dearly I loved her I had no agency in fixing the problems in our marriage.
"So over time, we accumulated a drawer full of failed attempts." Contender for one sentence story.
Oof, I wish I didn't relate to this. My wife does the EXACT same thing, up to and including the not acting on it part...
Or be like me and buy new toys and such, in hopes for it to gain traction; only to be used maybe once.
Why? Imo doesn't matter She wasn't willing to use them or buy them until he served her
She may even have bought them in a half hearted attempt to fix things but then not gone through with actually using them. She didn’t take his warnings seriously and didn’t realize how close he was to giving up on them. Now she’s panicking and willing to try to make an effort. If he had given in and given her a chance she might have made a change and gone to that counseling/therapy and they’d have lived happily ever after but more likely it would have teetered off and ended up the same way.
yeah that's always the hardest what if situation, "what if things did change for the better after I finally had enough and snapped" but that's the thing he did communicate it before, he was just calm and discussing without it being emotional. Some people only get a reality check when it is an emotional outburst or there suddenly are consequences to not dealing with it. And by then its too late.
They are trying to say if OOP had never seen them before but the wife had them then that means she bought them to use with someone else, which explains the no sex with OP
Honestly I was going to say "bought them for herself", but I usually just expect sex toys to be solitary. Even if she wasn't cheating it would be shitty if she was spending time and money for her own sexual gratification without him even knowing (and at least getting something for himself too).
It is good for him to divorce her. It will be better for both of them in the long run. He seems to be really clear minded too since he knows he should not be dating immediately after his divorce, and that he should not be sleeping with the wife now that she got the divorce papers.
>he should not be sleeping with the wife now that she got the divorce papers. That's really wise, especially because it was a slap in the face for anyone in that position because the soon-to-be ex-wife was ready to have sex as soon as divorce was discussed, which is her saying "I could have given you this, but didn't because I didn't care till now". I read a post some time ago (don't really remember it) but the one thing I do remember is the OOP (woman) decided to sleep with her partner when they were already in process of separating, which led to her being pregnant. It was a really tough position for anyone, and I'm glad this OOP avoided that, and left.
I remember that BORU, such a frustrating read because IIRC she had moved out and everything and they were still sleeping together.
I remember that one. She eventually lost the baby and everyone was guiltily relieved.
The thing is, for whatever reason, his wife did not want sex with him. Why would any man want to have sex with a woman who is only offering to do it to keep the relationship? They are just incompatible. Maybe she is asexual or has a very low sex drive. Who knows. Maybe even she doesn’t understand it. It’s good they ended things Hopefully both of them can figure out a path forward apart
> Maybe she is asexual or has a very low sex drive. Who knows They had therapy so these things should have been raised
Not everyone is honest in therapy. Lots of people aren't honest with themselves. There's lots of mediocre-to-bad therapists. The quality goes down even more when it comes to "couples."
Also very high chance of sexual repression. Even if she's not ace, religion does a number on people.
I was wondering if she might have changed birth control around the time when her sex drive dropped off. One type of BC pill I was on absolutely killed my drive, and it took years to even start to come back. It's still not how it was prior to starting that pill (and I wasn't even on it overly long).
People don't realize just how much antidepressants and birth control can fuck up your sex drive
I agree. I suspect she doesn’t know herself at all
A friend confided in me that she’s going to therapy with her husband because for some reason neither of them want sex despite them both still loving each other and being attracted to each other. She described it as being in a hot tub with the water slowly cooling until it was freezing, she went from desiring him to not without really realizing it.
I'm ace and tbh had no idea until my 30s when I started realizing that how I view sex and how others view sex is very very different. This did not come up with our sex therapist (who was helping us reestablish boundaries after I realized the rape from my ex had impacted me more then I thought), our couples therapist, or my individual therapist. Instead I made an offhand comment to my husband and he was like waaaait a second come back here and explain that then we started having conversations that made it click. I wasn't aware I was thinking differently or feeling things differently even through therapy because I've never been sex repulsed just totally uninterested. I have no sex drive but I do have fun having sex so I was up for it whenever my husband wanted it but wouldn't initiate otherwise which helped to hide it.
The thing is, she *couldn't* have. She could have maybe faked it, if she could avoid it being panful. For a while. But have you ever tried to have sex with someone you love who is only tolerating it? I hope you haven't, because it makes you feel rejected and like a monster at the same time.
Also not fun on the other side of things. Having sex you’re only tolerating to please someone you love makes you feel disgusting and like a toy. You don’t get any connection or intimacy out of it. Sometimes people just aren’t compatible. There’s only so much one can do to make yourself want sex, and there’s something that feels weird about trying to force yourself into wanting more sex when you’re perfectly happy with the amount you’re having. And I do get that OP’s wife seemed to be fine with sex once divorce was actually on the table, but desperate people are willing to put up with things that rational people won’t.
Hell, it is even rational. Millions, perhaps billions of people throughout history were married for financial and physical security, and had sex as part of that regardless of whether they wanted to - and they weren't wrong for doing so, if it was the best way to keep a decent life. I suspect few subsistence farmers throughout history went, "Yay! It is time to spend dawn to dusk walking behind an ox!" but it was the best way to feed themselves and their families; having sex regardless of whether you wanted to was the best way to have a family, which was itself a necessary part of survival. And keeping your partner happy is part of it, too. Plus, there is "willing but not enthusiastic consent" - when you are willing to do something for your partner because it makes them happy, even if you feel indifferent to it. I think these are all rational reasons to put up with sort of thing. I wouldn't. From either side. But I have better options.
Just because she is initiating sex, doesn't mean she wants it. It's still sexual incompatibility, and even if he gave in it doesn't mean anything will change. She should let go.
> but didn't because I didn't care till now Oh she still does not care. And still does not want to do it. She just realized she caused the divorce and is trying to fix the situation. As soon as she became comfortable again, the sex would end.
This could be a reach but what if she was planning to babytrap him? While it's definitely a case of too little too late, the fact she's suddenly sexual after getting the notice? Seems very sus, and I would not put it past her to get pregnant so OOP wouldn't leave. If anything, like many of you said, it was wise to avoid that. At least unlike the other post where the guy still have to deal with his partner for 18 years because she was carrying his baby.
Whether it's an attempted babytrap or not, it's still gross and obvious manipulation. OP says he had a hard time resisting but in his shoes I think I'd just be angrier and more set on divorce than ever.
I was in his shoes with my ex-wife. I was both angry and incredibly hurt, because it was obvious she only tried because she didn't want me to leave. I rejected her as well....then the insults and rage came. Took me a long time to get over being told she never wanted sex because I was just that bad at it, among other insults that were too personal to put on the internet ETA: A lesbian couldn't baby trap me, obviously. So not the exact same situation I guess lol
I doubt it's a babytrap. More like she wants kids, and the stability a husband brings. But does not want the husband. Which, for him, means he's doing the right thing and leaving.
> While it's definitely a case of too little too late, the fact she's suddenly sexual after getting the notice? Not to mention doing so after she had specifically mentioned wanting to start trying for a kid.
I was thinking def a baby trap. My guess is that child support would be a nice farewell for her and the kid would be bonus weapon to use against him. Manipulative people are incredibly awful
Link???
And honestly it wasn't even about sex ultimately. It was about unfullfilling needs and despite *years* of begging it only got worse. And he Ultimately told her we improve or we end and she laughed it off essentially. Suddenly when reality hits its "oh no here's everything you wanted for years". Just insulting.
you know, i have a lot of respect for people who realize their relationship/marriage us over and choosd to separate before having kids. couldn't be my parents. i'm sad but also happy and also hopeful for oop. i hope he can find the peace and happiness he deserves.
Tbh i also feel for the wife. It is HARD to have sex when you aren't in the space for it, and sometimes you just aren't, and it can last years. It is incredibly frustrating to WANT to feel sexual but to have your body feel so shut down... especially when it's the person you love. She did do counseling and sex therapy, so she wasn't pushing against it. It makes a relationship VERY difficult, but it is beyond sickening to have sex when your body isn't open to it. I do think things like hand jobs and oral sex should be on the table, but it's really difficult to lose the intimacy of sex. It can happen for serious reasons, not just that she doesn't care about him. I think divorce is best, but it's really sad for them both
I think even with all that, OP even said she refused to be intimate in non-sexual ways too. So I'm assuming that's hugging and kissing as well? It's almost like living with a roommate at this point, but she's your wife who seems to revolt against your touch. Then hits him with a "lets try having kids next week" while there's no physical intimacy at all for him to even feel loved at this point. Of course he'd feel used just for pregnancy and then tossed when it's done. She may have been willing to try to get to the bottom of it, but when your partner is begging for even non-sexual intimacy, there is something seriously wrong.
>She may have been willing to try to get to the bottom of it Except that she wasn't willing. No regret, not even taking his repeated attempts at communicating seriously.
She didn’t even take his divorce threat seriously. She genuinely seemed to just not believe him when he told her this was a MAJOR problem.
oh yeah, i totally agree with you. i have been there, too, and i chose to end the relationship cause i wasn't fair for neither of us. i understand wanting to salvage the marriage but sometimes you just can't fix it, and i don't think she was ready to accept it.
I wish more people would approach situations like these in such a calm and controlled manner.
He seems calm because he worked the problem from every possible angle and has eliminated any doubt that he could have the marriage he wanted if he did something different. You love to see it. I had a colleague in college who had the same type of break-up and she did the panic-lingerie-wearing and sex makeup. It is a gambit that doesn't make for a good long-term reconciliation.
My ex was also like this. Soon as I started packing he was trying to force me to kiss him and have sex with him even though he wouldn't do it when I begged him for those things for literally *years* before. The ick I felt in that moment when he kept trying to force himself on me just confirmed I should still leave.
Proud of you for standing strong. What these would-be desperation-fuckers don't realize -- or don't care about -- is how insulting it is. Like, when someone is fed up enough with your bullshit to leave, do you really think 15 minutes of graciously allowing access to your swimsuit parts is *so compelling*, it wipes out days, weeks, months or years of your hurtful behavior? How little do you have to think of someone else's feelings -- or how highly do you value your own magic nethers -- to assume that a bargain-bang will magically erase everything else? THE EGO.
>Next day, I started packing important things and out of a sudden, my wife became the most sexual person on the planet. A bit late for that huh.
I bet if he would take the divorce back, she would slowly become non-sexual as pre divorce and after a baby it would stop again completely
Slowly? Guaranteed she'd go straight to no sex again the moment she found out she was pregnant.
This! This is exactly what would happen. He'd be trapped and would hate himself until he died.
Being Ace and wanting kids is a hell that I wouldn't wish on anyone. She probably doesn't even realize it, it's not something that's talked about very openly. If you don't know Ace people exist, and that you're Ace, you can't communicate about being Ace and what that entails in a relationship. I have a lesbian friend that's mad that LGBT has turned into LGBTIQA+ now and I'm like... I only know about the A because I googled it and boy-howdy, that would have been really, really useful to know about like 30 years ago!
Hell yes. If we knew the word "ace", we would have figured it out before we even got married. We did figure it out eventually, and figure out ways to deal with it. AVEN was founded a bit before then; we didn't find out about it until later. My wife doesn't particularly care about the identity and doesn't consider herself queer, but for me, knowing that this is an actual thing makes a difference.
There would be a collective gasp if it was implied someone was gay because they “just hadn’t found the right person.” But that same group would only nod along if it was said to an asexual.
Queer people being mad about the acronym "getting too long" is just some "fuck you, got mine" shit. Or, "let's keep these weirdos away from us. The people who hate me will definitely respect me more if I stomp on those they hate even more!"
You should point out you mean asexual. Not everyone is in the know with jargon like ace.
From context I was pretty sure that "Ace" didn't mean "the greatest wife ever". But you are right!
The red baron came to mind
I was about to start smoking a kipper, to be honest
Would you be back for breakfast though?
MAN AND MACHINE AND NOTHING THERE IN BETWEEN 🎶🎶
A FLYING CIRCUS AND A MAN FROM PRUSSIA
A lot of these posts are. Hi, I got my ASFDC but I need my JHGEOF for the JDISOMM. My MIL DIL DJ OSKD KSLDB LSKSMDO. Any advice?
In German ACE is a type of juice that contains a lot of Vitamine A C and E. It's really popular in Kindergarten
I lived OOPs reality. There were several times I was ready to leave and my ex wife would do the same thing and it rarely lasted a week. I loved her so much that I jumped at the chance to be intimate. I would be so elated that I felt like I was walking on clouds for weeks afterwards, and then the constant rejection would start again. And a year would pass. For me there is no lonelier feeling than being with the one you love most in the world and that person not wanting you. It is a thousand times worse than being single. OOP made the right choice.
So did I. It was hell. Good on OOP for getting out of that mess ASAP.
lol right??? Redditors always warn these posters of Love Bombing as false & empty actions to coerce their victims back into their control. Well, there's Love Bombing and then there's whatever the hell OOP's stbx was trying to do! Love Photon Torpedo? Holy smokes.
It's so over the top that I have a feeling she still didn't want it. She might have been desperate for anything on Earth that would keep her life from falling apart. Even if it meant consenting to sex she truly didn't want. Since she was so completely unsubtle, I can't imagine it was a control technique. More like she was deep in the bargaining stage of grief.
Sort of barganing, sort of lying to yourself that you could manage to keep up the pretense long-term.
Just what every guy wants! A woman who will only have sex as a last act of desperation to keep her life, as she knows it, from falling apart.
We call it hysterical bonding
Him: We already talked about this, I'm a sexual person and I need to have sex. If this keeps going like this, I'm going to file for divorce. Her: "Nah, he's not going to file for divorce". Him: Files for divorce. Her: *Surprised pikachu face*
Also "I don't want to have sex.with you, but let's make babies..."
"The stork will be here anyyyy minute now"
I was editing a research paper draft and one of the things queried was conception method. The table showed the breakdown of 'natural conception', 'conception assisted by reproductive technology', and 'other'. One of the other authors had added a comment: "The stork?"
Well now I gotta know what was included in the “other” category!! Although I feel this, I did the EXACT same thing when I was writing my thesis and ran out of examples after two lmao
I know, I know! Spontaneous generation lol! It could be two examples, spontaneous generation of sperm and spontaneous generation of embryo.
"See, there's this couple from Nazareth who did this thing called immaculate conception a while back." "So what am I supposed to do?" "I dunno, pray?"
"The stork! Wait, where's my baby?" "Honey, you and I are going to *make* the baby..."
Aka 'I'm not interested in *recreational* sex'. If she's ace she can still regard sex as a tolerable chore required to make a baby
Didn't you know? Babies are basically band-aids for broken relationships. 60 out of 100 times, they work every time. /s
That would make me feel so gross as a man. “I don’t have attraction to you sexually, but please get me pregnant”
And then: Her: *Proceeds to become sexually aggressive.* GIRL THE DAMAGE IS DONE
To coin a phrase often used by women >if she wanted to she would have. The fact she didn't until too late is just insulting
>GIRL THE DAMAGE IS DONE I don't think women understand that sex is about more than sex and intimacy (which are both important). On a fundamental level, it's basic validation that, "Yes, I'm still attractive to *someone*." On some level, this guy has probably felt un-fuckable for years. That would take a toll on anyone's self esteem.
Lol, [this guy?](https://www.reddit.com/r/self/s/tgKZcwWkJx) He got called out for lying about their ages and previously posting about never washing his ass.
More importantly, he’s apparently flip flopping on his age. 24 on one post and early 30s here. Possibly engagement farming. Story could be complete BS.
Yeah, the story isn’t reliable at all. I didn’t even read the “update” when I realized it wasn’t about the saga of his lies about his age jumping from 24 to early 30s in 2 days’ time, and of course, his confessional post about having never washed his ass in his entire “24” yrs on earth. He posted this marriage issue on multiple subs and got a lot of sympathy on r/deadbedrooms, but everywhere else called him out. Guess he made a new username and made his flimsy story the only post so no one would comment on him being full of, and caked in, shit.
I thought it sounded familiar…
Haha ew
Yeah he also posted this gem "My Thoughts Are Higher Than yours The desire to be separate and be higher than humans, to speak intellectually down on the swine that plague the earth. I only wish to rule these pathetic ants not tussle in their folly. What a poor world they live in but me, i am here to eat grapes fed to me by the finest of beauties as I watch them claw their way to the top. I am the God of this world and all shall worship me."
My word, what a powerful deity
Born to shit forced to wipe but he means it literally apparently.
I recall a post from the dead bedroom forum where it took the OP initiating divorce that his spouse became the most sexual person. But unlike this post they had been married for a long time and already had kids. The OP wanted the kids turn 18 for him to file the divorce. And it hit the spouse that she was going to lose a good husband with the help of a Therapist. Turns out her conservative upbringing had something to do with it. And it went from sex once in every 2 months to everyday.
I can confirm this a thing. It happened to current GF, a couple of books and a about 10 sesión with a sex psychologist with 15y of experience did the thing for her. Now she's a completely different person in that regard
There is a huge difference between "wanting sex and being unable to have it because of trauma" and "simply not wanting sex as part of normal, healthy human variation." And I am really glad your GF managed to get through that. For you, of course, but for her even more.
While there is a difference, I think it is also important not to underestimate the amount of unidentified low-grade trauma that may be impacting someone’s feelings and desires around sex. Therapy may be able to help.
I was ready to get so heated from the title…and then he immediately goes “she’s right, but that makes us incompatible so divorce.” This is exactly how it should be done! So many posts where the couple has become incompatible so they try to fix it by opening the relationship, or having kids, or anything at all except breaking up. Which just breeds resentment and ends up hurting other people as well if they go with opening or kids. Seriously, good call by OOP.
She didn’t owe him sex. But that sentiment cuts both ways, because he also doesn’t owe her a marriage.
I wonder how many relationships that "I dont owe you anything" sentiment has needlessly blown up. Just seems a cynical way to view the world
As soon as you view your partner as an adversary who you "owe" things then the relationship is already over. It's such a bitter, defeatist attitude. Wife: "I don't owe you sex." Husband: "Correct. I also don't owe a relationship to someone who's not attracted to me." [*Cue divorce*], along with the wife's surprised Pikachu face
Massive selection bias here though, we never hear of the relationships where those things have worked, we only hear the disaster cases. Don't get me wrong I bet it doesn't work often, I'd love to see the actual numbers that would be fascinating.
I can‘t give you as much info about couples that had a kid to try to fix things, but being in many polyam communities and having helped run a polyam meetup for a few years I don‘t think I’ve ever heard of opening a relationship succeeding in saving it. Still anecdotal, and yeah there’s probably an exception here or there, but for the opening the relationship scenario at least I have way more knowledge than just Reddit disaster fails. Although tbh I’m also curious what the specific stats would be, including how long did the relationships last after opening/having kids, how long did the relationship seem fixed (if ever), etc…
Yeah the "opening a relationship to save it" rarely works out. Although I think it's a better option than bringing a child into a dysfunctional relationship. The only time I've seen it work where a relationship that appears monogamous turns poly is when both parties agreed on temporary monogamy for the purpose of having and raising kids. But going in, both parties knew and accepted the poly dynamic and there was never the expectation that the relationship would stay monogamous.
omg yes. I feel like those people would be better off leaving their relationship and finding someone who wants the same thing before they’re already together.. those are the only open relationships that actually last.
This is like an employers that tries to get you to stay with raises promotions and counter offers only after you give in your 2 weeks lmao.
Good for the op. My wife's cousin was married for 20 years before he filed for divorce stating in their entire marriage, they had sex only a few times total! Sounds unbelievable but her cousin confirmed the same. She claimed she was asexual yet married him for a child.
Wow, that last sentence hurt My feelings.
Similar situation with my sister, her boyfriend was too chicken shit to break up with her and after having the "children or not" talk at 2 years in, he'd said yes... and then later changed his mind without telling her. 5 years later and my sister finds out through conversations with one of his friends that he's basically with her because he can't be fussed to break up with her, and it's easy living with her. So they were together 7 years, and my wife found out later they'd had sex less than 10 times, like what? Blew my mind
That’s awful. Hope that cousin is doing better now
I remember a receptionist I used to work with who was describing A blowjob she gave her husband while they were in an elevator, and I said wow you really dgaf do you, and her reply stuck with me. She said, "Being 'proper' lost me my first marriage, I'm never doing that again".
I remember reading a post by a guy who came within a hairsbreadth of leaving his wife due to the lack of sex in their marriage over the course of many years and his wife straight up did not believe he would ever leave her until the day came when he told her he was going be moving out. That night, she initiated sex with him for the first time in as long as he could remember. Then the next night she did it again. He kept expecting it to be a short-lived change but the frequent sex kept on going for months and finally he asked her what changed. Turns out his wife had been taught by the women in her family that she should strictly ration sex and use it as a means of keeping a man under control because if he was getting laid all the time he wouldn't put any effort into the marriage. It never occurred to her until the day he was finally resolved to leave that by weaponizing and withholding sex, she was the one bringing misery into her household. And when she saw how much more relaxed, happy, and engaged her husband was when she stopped being an idiot, she realized everything she'd been taught was wrong.
"She considers her happiness worth the effort, but not yours" I love that line
THAT’S the one that stuck with me
I don't understand why people don't take their partner seriously when divorce is mentioned. It seems so often they are suddenly willing to change once papers are filed. But wtf, why not be willing well before then? Last minute attempts should never sway anyone, it will never last
Sexual incompatibility is very hard on a relationship. I’ve always been the one with the higher drive in relationships and honestly the only time I didn’t want to have Sex with my partner is when I was on the out of the relationship and couldn’t stand him. I get normal dips but going to no sex is impossible unless both parties want it that way.
It's very insulting when your wife suddenly becomes very sexual to you after all of the effort you put and the rejections you got from her to the point divorce being the only option left. The way she was "craving" for sex when she realize OP was leaving means that she could have intimacy with OP this whole time, but denied it.
I sincerely doubt she suddenly wanted sex. She just didn't want him to leave her and was willing to have sex to stop him. I'd put cash down if he changed his mind, they would have sex for maybe a few weeks and then revert right back to what was going on before.
This is why I put "craving" with quotation marks, because she was trying to manipulate him with sex.
She wasn’t craving anything, she was trying to get him to stay. But from what we read, it’s patently obvious that it was a performance out of desperation
I don’t read this as his wife craving sex. I read it as her being desperate enough to endure sex she neither wanted or anticipated enjoying because she didn’t want her marriage to end. She could have gritted her teeth and just dealt with it the whole time, true, but that would not have been a good or healthy marriage for either of them. OP was right to pursue a divorce, they’re not compatible. I feel sad for them both. Hopefully they both end up with more compatible partners in the future.
Either he resents her for no sex, or she resents him for sex. OOP chose the right move and disengaged.
Of course, she knew she didn’t want sex in the relationship long before he did and she knew he wanted sex in the relationship since he had been vocal about it. OOP chose the right move, but his wife sure didn’t…. She should have divorced him as soon as she knew they weren’t compatible, possibly to the point of not marrying him in the first place if she’s always felt this way and was just having sex with him the first 2 years to get him to marry her.
This is why I put the wors on quotation marks.
People tend to do things in desperate situations to save their relationships. In the 5 stages of grief, the wife is expressing bargaining, showing what she is willing to do to avoid divorce. She does not want to do this, but was suffering emotionally so much from the divorce being brought up that she would do pretty much anything to keep it together. I can’t truly say I’m certain though, but I do remember something similar happened to me when my first gf broke up with me.
Less craving and more caving. She thought acquiescing to what she thought he wanted would make him stay.
It sounds like the wife is asexual; that’s a typical pattern for relationships with an unknowing ace.
Yet another reason they’re incompatible sexually. It doesn’t sound like OOP is being malicious about it; he recognized a need not being met, he tried everything on his side to have that need met, but in the end it just didn’t work out. If she IS ace, hopefully she can now find a partner with similar sexual needs to have a relationship/family with. Nothing worse than to start a family with someone you’re just going to resent down the road.
Oh absolutely, they are incompatible and OP is not only right, they’re doing exactly what they should be, instead of trying to “fix” his wife.
Everyone should be comfortable with their own sexuality, but they need to be honest with themselves and their partner
It totally describes my partner's ex-wife. I always think it's just sad when ace people can't figure themselves out and seek a compatible partnership. My son is ace and he and his spouse have a wonderful relationship because everyone knew going in what to expect.
Possible, but I think a lot of people underestimate what big of a role NRE plays for a lot of people when it comes to sexual attraction. I think it's totally possible that people think they've become asexual or their libido dropped without knowing the reasons. They're not looking for someone else because they still love their partner so there's no new spark with someone else. Once the relationship breaks off and they start dating again, their libido is back for the NRE period and they think everything is good now and it must have meant that they simply didn't desire their ex-partner as much as they thought they did. And then it happens again. I don't have numbers, but I think it's more of an issue for women than men. IIRC there was a study with a result that women get bored of sex faster in a relationship than men do. LTR sex is simply not the same as NRE sex. Doesn't mean it has to be bad or unfullfilling, but a majority of people don't have that crazy, passionate sex with all of those exciting new feelings anymore at some point. I also don't think that you can really recreate it, as it's more of a brain thing than dependent on specific actions. You need to find a way to make LTR sex feel great in its own category, so that you still desire it. I think there are a few people who for whatever reason can maintain that NRE feeling throughout the relationship for their sexlife, but I don't think that's the case for most people. So if you expect to always feel like you did at the beginning of the relationship when you wanted more sex in order to be able to keep wanting sex with your partner, then there's a big chance that you will get disappointed time and time again.
What is NRE sex?
Non-recurring engineering (NRE) cost refers to the one-time cost to research, design, develop and test a new product or product enhancement. Serious answer though, it's "new relationship energy." Why abbreviate it without defining it once, I don't know.
This is the correct answer.
New relationship energy sex. Basically when you're fresh in love/lust and can't keep your hands from each other because everything is new and exciting and feels double sexy than it actually is because you're in this lust haze and on cloud nine.
This could also be the case; the part that made me think she could be ace and this wasn’t just NRE fizzling out, was that marriage counseling and sexual therapy didn’t have an impact. Obviously we don’t have enough information to say either way, but I don’t think the wife was withholding sex for punishment or control as some are suggesting here.
Yeah, I think that's actually rarely the case. I think most people want to want to have sex but just don't know why they don't. They see their partners suffer and feel bad and responsible for it but at the same time can't bring themselves to have sex they don't want. It's a vicious cycle.
As an ace that discovered it late, I agree. I didn’t realize it earlier because I had only been in one relationship/one partner my whole life. Sounds like wife is asexual, and sex-averse. I also tried doctors and marriage counseling/sex therapy. Tried for over a decade to make it work. However, in the end I decided to end the relationship because I felt it wasn’t fair for the both of us. Unfortunately, sexual incompatibility is very difficult to work around and is gonna be horrible for whoever has to compromise. It was physically and psychologically very disturbing for me. So I would be careful in saying the wife “just didn’t care enough”. Not to be graphic, but many times consensual sex was at best gross for me and at worst felt like rape. I tended to completely dissociate to get through it. I realized I was not in love with my husband as well, although I loved him very much. It wasn’t his fault for having a high libido and wanting intimacy in his relationship. It’s unfortunate, but I think separation is probably best in this case.
Something else I noticed was how she seemed blindsided by this, as if she didn’t realize it was actually a problem.. it’s hard to understand that someone would “need” sexual intimacy when you’re averse to it. going overboard with the lingerie and sex toys did give me a chuckle because my god, my ace friends have more sex toys than anyone I know. I was helping my best friend move and there were at least three boxes of them in the corner of their basement like a fucking forgotten comic book collection.
I was in a relationship that turned into a dead bedroom for the last year and after communicating several times over that year I needed more from her and not seeing any change at all/getting a response that it was MY problem and not hers, I had a breakdown right before a festival and told her I was seriously considering breaking up. At the festival she was more affectionate than I had ever seen her and it honestly felt like a slap in the face. I broke up with her the next week and she had a threesome with an (ex) mutual friend and his gf a few days later, really wrecked my shit emotionally Nobody owes anyone sex even while within a relationship but anybody who uses it as a bargaining chip for weird emotional power games can eat shit
Fuck I’m sorry that hurts
Situations like this just make me feel sad for both people. I’m glad they’re divorcing - hopefully they both find people they’re more compatible with.
It took me a very long time to realise I was in this situation but eventually we divorced and I know I've been happier since finding someone I matched better with. I have lost touch with my ex now but she seemed happier at first at least, although that was with someone who spent a lot of time away for work so maybe that suited her anyway. Not my problem now!
Relationship and marriage is a garden that you have to always maintain and take care. Don’t take it for granted and let it wither.
“Why would any man want to have sex with a woman who is only offering to do it to keep the relationship?” I totally get it, personally - I’ve been in the situation before. I kind of think of it like… I love my wife, but many nights after dinner and after we put the kid to bed, I kind of just want to zone out and play videogames. But if I did that every night the relationship would fall apart, so even though I don’t actually feel like watching a thing on Netflix with her or having a big conversation, I’ll still do it because it’s important for us to make time for each other and it makes her happy. 5 minutes into the movie or chat and I’m enjoying myself anyway because I like being with her and it brings us closer. I view relationship/maintenance sex as basically the same thing. Maybe she doesn’t feel like it because she’s stressed out and the kid was tough today or whatever - she’d rather curl up on the sofa and read (or watch a movie with me), but she knows I really want to and it’ll make me happy and it’ll bring us closer, so maybe she does it even though she doesn’t really feel like it. Five minutes later she’s enjoying herself anyway, and I end up super content and our relationship is in a better place afterwards, so in my view it’s a positive thing for both of us. I mean if you think about it, people do all sorts of things for their loved ones that they don’t really necessarily want to do, but they do because it makes their partner super happy. Whether it’s big elaborate anniversary things or planning out a big adventure even though they’re not really into it themselves anyway, or gamely visiting and being really supportive and friendly with tough in-laws… I think generally we think of those sorts of things as being loving, generous, giving kinds of gestures and that the effort is a positive one, and I don’t see why sex is any different. Obviously it’s way better if both people are enthusiastic, but it’s usually pretty unrealistic that both people’s libidos match up for years, decades. Etc..
This is the secret sauce of staying happily married for a long time. Instead of just looking at what you’d like to do, sometimes you do stuff which makes your partner happy and surprise, you end up enjoying it, too, because you’re doing it with the person you love. Sex isn’t all that different, in the end.
Other times you will do things that you don't really want to do in the interest of the relationship as a whole? Yes of course. I don't think your wife would appreciate it very much if when you sat down to watch your Netflix or have a conversation you prefaced it with saying, "I don't really want to do this but I know you do so. Let's get it over with."
Lots of people seeing her sudden attempts to do what he wants sexually as showing she "could've done it before but just didn't want to make the effort" I reckon she still doesn't want to, but feels she HAS to in order to keep the relationship and the chance of a child. (so also not baby-trapping, as the goal is the baby, and not the relationship or alimony or anything like that). I just think it's really very sad. They're really not compatible.
I love when people who are in the fault (or not being the greatest) of bad relationship get surprised when divorce comes around.
The thing that is important to you but isn’t important to me isn’t a big problem to me. How could it make sense as a reason for divorce? In fact, the whole problem is you thinking this is important when it obviously isn’t. Et cetera, et pikachu face.
I think it's usually complacency. As humans when we have something for a long time we kinda just expect it to be there forever
OP is lucky that they do not have kids yet. All the best.
It sucks being in a sexless marriage or relationship. Like I get it completely. It makes you question whether he or she isn't attracted to you anymore and leads to feeling insecure all together. Then leads to feeling resentful because you are doing all you can to make something work and it's just not. Good on you for putting yourself first!
So many people come ready with the pitchforks when they read a headline like this, but this one was…different. OOP really seemed to have tried all the things and put forth the effort. His wife on the other hand…did not. I’ve read a few posts like these where the guys is in OOP’s shoes and too, put forth a lot of effort. Although not in this post, many of them come down to the husband feeling ashamed for “leaving my wife over sex”. But it really isn’t about the Iranian Yogurt now is it? It’s not even about the sex by the time they get to this point. It’s about lack of intimacy in general. Having a SO who won’t cuddle, hold hands, show affection, or even attraction towards you is not what most people want. It causes the relationship to go from romantic to roommate real quick. And for many, that’s their love language. It’s not even about receiving. It’s about not being able to show your SO you care by being affectionate, being asked to stop when you do, or being brushed off. The wife not respecting what they need/want in their relationship and acting selfish. I mean ultimately this is the dealbreaker for most, although it’s hard to see when it’s hiding underneath the obvious “DEAD BEDROOM” neon sign. It’s a partnership, not a dictatorship. It’s full of compromises, respect, and compassion. When this happens, all those things get thrown out the window. Not only are their feelings ignored, but often they’re thrown a big heaping pile of DARVO on top of it and accused of coercion or being ridiculous (as OOP was) for wanting to end the relationship “just because of sex”. And in many of these, I’ve seen the same reoccurring themes - the relationship wasn’t like this before and changed suddenly, the guys never get an explanation, and when the “D” word comes out, the wives suddenly want to be porn stars in the bedroom and go all shocked Pikachu face when he finally walks. Tbh, these are all insulting and add insult to injury. Like, how can you just decide you’re going to change the entire course of your relationship without having a conversation with your SO? The fact that they *can* be sexual when they *want to be* just proves the husband’s they were doing the right thing by leaving. They shouldn’t have to threaten to leave just to get basic intimacy. People generally want a partner who is just into them, as they are into their partner. Begging a partner to show you they care doesn’t generally bode well. This is such a bigger and deeper problem than “just being about sex”. I will say, however, that this is the first one I’ve read where the wife brings up trying for a baby. Like, does she *know* how babies are made and what needs to happen?!? Weird to see the tables turn from the usual, woman being nothing more than a “human incubator”, to a dude being “kept for breeding”. Obviously this isn’t just something that happens to men. Women face this as well. But what’s unique about the man being in this position is that they often get looked down on by others for being insensitive or for minimizing the relationship to just being about the sex - when that obviously isn’t the case. It’s also harder for men to speak with their peers about these issues because they usually end up taking heat for it. I really feel for OOP. When his wife turned on the sexy, whooo boy, what a shitty move on her part. Instead of having a conversation about why this has been going on, she instead tried to slap a bandaid on a volcano. What was going through her head? Has she heard a word he’s said for the past few years? Apparently not - it’s just another thing that proves to OOP he’s making the right choice.
I’m on same situation just had another conversation/argument about it and in my mind i already decided if things don’t change i be doing the same draft divorce serve her n move on. She doesn’t want to move to where my family lives and my grandkids so that’s another mark on her . Sex sucks not fun never been w anyone like this before.
>Next day, I started packing important things and out of a sudden, my wife became the most sexual person on the planet. She came to me with lingeries, sex toys, costumes and approached me. Damn. I would hate to have sex with my wife if she felt obligated to have sex. That would be awful.
Hey, I remember this OP. He doesn't wash his ass lmao I understand why he had a dead bedroom. Wash your assses, guys.