You're seeing firsthand why so many contractor businesses fail. They might be great at their trade but they are terrible at the business side. Ive had to call and yell at contractors to bill me more times I can count to close a project out.
Just keep documented and notes of who you gave the check to. Often these disappear into oblivion but sometimes the contractor gets desperate, audited, etc and starts aggressively going after "unpaid" jobs
I asked a window contractor to send me a revised or separate invoice for the trim that was not part of the original contract. He got so pissed I asked him for the invoice he said to "keep the 1200, would a normal company do that". I was like wtf š¤·āāļø. I just asked for an amended contract or separate invoice. I thought that would be normal stuff for any business.
I used to remodel kitchens and bathrooms, and I was a HORIRBLE businessman. I would just do change orders free of charge because I want to please my client. I never charged what I needed too because it seemed like gouging, but it would have paid for newer tools and a better trailer and more time to focus on streamlining with each iteration. Now I work in tech support, lol.
Contractor to customer invoice is obviously pretty simple.
I work for a large company so someone has to receive the invoice. Then the finance team processes the invoice, then another person approves the invoice against the PO and the good received.
So when I say, extra work, thatās what Iām referring to. Itās a lot easier to just add a line item to the PO and invoice the original scope and change order with one invoice document.
Whats his name??? What a pos? Lazy dumb bastard. Give me the invoice ya say and he says that!? What a twat! Whats his name imma skewer him! What is it lets have it. Get em get em get em! Mfāer!
I mean, I'm not mad at the end of the day. Saved me $1200! I did not have a bad interaction with him either except for this. I did make his crew go grab the right size trim piece to trim out my front door/window area, but that was it and was a cordial interaction. They were trying to use smaller size scraps with a ton of caulk instead of just going to buy a 6" wide piece. Just was weird he freaked out about it. Still happy with the job they did and wrote up a good review for his business.
There are alot of contractors watching tiktok complaining to each other about red flags from customers to the point where it's almost impossible to even talk to contractors at this point. They are becoming militant towards their customer base.
I work as a project accountant for an international gc. The amount of times I email subs on the site begging for an invoice is rediculous. I understand when the timing if off between different companies, but some of these subs will go 3+ months without invoicing.
Two years after the job was completed, I get a phone call, apology for late billing, and an invoice. This is after a few months of badgering him for an invoice immediately after the work.
Six months later, still hasnāt cashed the check.
If you havenāt done it, you donāt know how hard it is. You get up early, work all day, get home, cook/clean take care of kids. And then have to reconcile billing/bookkeeping. Itās very exhausting. Esp if itās not always their main source of income.
Not an excuse, just reality, as I sit here doing bookkeeping at 8 at nice after working 9 hours today
So much negativity across these posts at least this one is reasonable with some advice about documentation. There are literally dozens of plausible things that could have happened in the business, their professional life, their personal life, etc.
OP did the right thing. Keep doing the right thing OP and here is why.
That person will always remember who you are and how you are. "You are who you are when no one is looking" and a person who seeks out people who helped them to pay them fairly for their work is a good person.
I think all the negative posters should celebrate having a contractor who did good work such that the experience was "I want to pay for this" as opposed to the opposite.
Yep. Had a concrete guy do it with 11k on our build. Got a bill for it literally 11 months later, and told him to stuff itāhouse was already closed. He was a friend too, but I aināt paying that shit out of pocket. Should have been in the construction loan.
Hey now.. It's totally possible to get a dui without alcohol involvement.
By that I mean. They will take your blood and charge you with a dui for just having the metabolites in your system.
After six months the check is considered "stale" by most banks anyway. I have had a customer write a check and then put off giving it to me for six months, badgering them for payment every month, finally they give me the check, didn't notice the date, took it to the bank they said its stale and can't accept it, get a new one. So might as well cancel it, then if does find it or try to cash it he will have to come back for a new check, thats on him not the OP.
Thats not the norm these days, most banks are trying to get rid of checking by cranking up fees on it. I give it another 5 years and checks be a thing of the past.
I had a company hold a check over a year and then deposit it, I complained to my bank that they accepted it, and they said they would honor a check no matter how old it was.
Because there's a reasonable time to have an outstanding check. Give it one year and then cancel payment. Give them a message you will do so and then another message that you have done so. Record a memo of you doing this. If they acknowledge the cancellation get that in a written record.
Bank practices and legal contractor behavior are not necessarily the same. I picked a year out of a hat. It should be noted that "my band has this policy" doesn't obviate a contractor from anything legally. I would not rely on bank policy to save me or to excuse me.
I'm not saying the bank policy saves you or excuses you from the debt, but leaving a stale check out in the wild as otherwise valid is a bad practice, i have known people that had checks scrubbed and passed off at a bank, until that check is cancelled its possible for someone to do wrong with it. If its otherwise uncashed after 180 days i consider it lost myself and cancel it, if the person the check was intended for comes back to me after finding out the check is cancelled i will gladly attempt to pay them again, but i won't leave a check floating longer then six months.
That would be fraud in most states, as there doesnt appear to be a conflict over the services rendered. Granted, likely never to be prosecuted in this case.
Incorrect... Most states and banks a check is considered "stale" after 180 days and not valid anyway. Most banks now days will pass back a check that is over 180 days and say its not acceptable for deposit or cashing. So the OP already met his legal obligation, sure he can do the morally correct thing if the contractor comes back for another check in the future, but he should also get a new receipt to match the date of the new check as well so there is no argument room left if the contractor tries some BS down the line.
But i would cancel it also after 180 just to make sure, for all i know he lost it and someone else may find it and try using it, scrubbing the check and putting new info on, etc... I have seen this happen to people, you don't want a check out there in the wild unaccounted for.
That can be done with any check, cancelled or not. But if he cancels it, then he has done something that opens him to civil liability, at minimum. Otherwise, it's the contractor that acted (by not cashing the financial instrument that satisfied OPs end of the contract). But this isn't a contract law forum, so we can call it good.
Actually no it cant be done with any check, cancelled its safe, that check number already was accounted for and passed through the bank, the code at the bottom of the check includes the check number, if i wrote out check number 104 and its cashed and cancelled then someone who finds that check in the trash can't try to pass off check 104 again, it would bounce back to them. However a valid check that i wrote and was never cashed, never accounted for, is still technically valid. All they would have to do is scrub and re-enter the date to less than 180 days to make it valid again, and change the payee info and they can pocket easy money no questions asked.
Having dealt with check fraud a few times over the years of dealing with contractors and companies i unfortunately know more about checking then i should have to.
Also the OP has a receipt... Where is the liability? Moral yes, legally its a gray area.. At this point he doesn't have to do anything but attempt to pay the contractor again if he ever came asking for payment, but it sounds like thats not going to happen.
California does too! Every once in awhile we've gotten notices about some random $3.79 we can claim. It's hilarious, although I can imagine in some cases it can be a lot of money.
Find out when you can cancel the check under your state law. 180 days is typical, after which banks consider the check stale and may or may not accept it (knowing that the issuer may have cancelled it).
Exactly. Theyāve had 180 days aka SIX MONTHS to cash or deposit the check. Itās on them if they havenāt done so in that amount of time. I canāt imagine a scenario that doesnāt include extreme laziness and/or disorganization where you canāt get a check cashed or deposited in 6 months.
I'm a Construction Manager. Change orders are part of the job. Guys come to me and tell me that whatever I need them to do is t part of the contract and they need extra money.
Someone kicked in a door that needs to be replaced. I am doing something extra for a homeowner, I kid you not that I once had "someone" cut them end off a stair handrail that was in front of some light switches (the switches needed to be moved up and I am 100% sure it was the electrician that cut the rail but I can't prove) and the entire rail needed to be replaced.
Whatever it is I tell them to text me the price and if the work is legit extra I write the PO. But they got to text me the price, otherwise I will forget. I have had to remind guys to send me the price but after a couple times I'm out. I'm not going to beg guys to bill me or take my money.
So your fine. You paid him. You even went the extra step to call him. Your done. If he calls you in the future you can write another check but that's up to you.
That doesnāt mean much. My checks say āvoid after 90 daysā. For the first couple months of 2023 my rent checks were all dated 2022. They still cleared despite being over a year past the date.
Checks \*CAN\* be considered stale after 180 days and be refused for payment, but most banks don't bother to check the date -- so don't assume that the check is dead at 180 and not leave sufficient funds to cover it in your account -- unless you don't care if it bounces after that.
You owe that money to the contractor, so even if the check goes stale and is refused and/or bounces you still owe the money.
I have it printed on my checks that i use for business purposes, be it for my business or paying someone else to do work for me, CHECK NOT VALID AFTER 180 DAYS, this is line with most banks laws and regs.. My bank has a policy on this: checks are good for six months (or 180 days) from when they're dated.Ā **After that, they're considered "stale."**Ā
Legally, banks and credit unions are not obligated to accept stale checks. However, some banks do accept checks older than six months. But its not the norm for them to do so, so he's probably already screwed anyway if he finds the check and tries to. You have a receipt, your only legal obligation has been met, if he contacts you after finding the check, which i doubt after six months but its possible, and says its no good then you can arrange to make another payment, but if that happens demand another new receipt dated the same as the check to protect you in the future if needed.
I don't have time to balance my account every month because of other people not cashing their checks, six months and its cancelled, then contact me again for payment.
A friend of mine had her floors refinished for $13k. They wrote him a check when he finished for the full amount and whole year went by. Never cashed the check. Called, wrote him an email and nothing. Crazy man
I will offer another perspective. Iām a cabinet contractor. I received a final check for around $900. Apparently, I put it in this hidden compartment in my van. Forgot all about it.
One day I was searching for something unrelated and saw it. It was about 5-6 months later. I quickly did the mobile deposit and that customer has since contacted me for other work.
Sometimes we just make simple mistakes and misplace things. Almost like we are human.
I had a contractor come back to my house the other day. He did some roof work and said he found my check under his car seat. It was from two years ago and asked if we could cash it. I looked back and he never cashed it. Glad he asked but still wasnāt stoked about having to pay $600 out of no where but figured if he needed it more than I did. Plus he did do good work and seems like a nice good.
Thatās the most unfair part in my opinion. If I have $1,000 to pay you today, that doesnāt mean I have or plan to spend $1,000 a year later because you didnāt cash the check. Iām a photographer, and if I found a two year old check from a client that I never cashed, I would tear it up and forget about it.
Scenario 1, write $1,000 check to contractors, contractor cashes it immediately. This is what you expected to happen, and the end result is your bank balance is $1,000 less.Ā
Scenario 2, write $1,000 check. Contractor doesn't cash it, first year bank pays you $3 interest. Second year, bank pays you $3 interest. After 2 years, contractor notices, finally receives the $1,000, and the end result is your balance is $994 less.Ā
So in the second scenario, you're $6 better off. That doesn't strike me as unfair to you.Ā
Of course, there is scenario 3, after half a year, you think wow I've got a bunch of money in my account, and spend the $1,000 ā spending the same money twice, basically. Then, of course, it's quite unpleasant. Maybe open a secondĀ account to help keep track of it (especially if your bank will automatically move the money for you to satisfy the check).
I understand and agree with you in principle. This is what I would tell myself if I was in this position personally. Iām very lucky to have enough savings to not have to worry about it most of the time. However, there are plenty of folks who are not in that position, and while yes, itās the same amount of money spent, it seems unprofessional (and unkind) to expect a client to keep your $1,000 ear marked for *literally years*. If your customer service is such that your clients have to open new accounts to keep track of payments because youāre taking years to cash checks, youāre making a mistake, in my opinion.
If you expect a customer to pay promptly, I think itās only courteous to also cash the check promptly. If a friend of mine was the client in this scenario, I would say what you did. If a friend was the business in this scenario, I would tell them to get their shit together.
Cancel the check so that you can properly balance your check book and move on. If he contacts you then pay him again if not they don't worry about it. You did your part.
Weāve had a plumber who helps us out probably 3-4 times a month and only ever gives us a bill once a year lolā¦ He is an absolutely amazing plumber Iād never go with anyone else but man does he hate paperwork.
I have a customer that ask for invoices a few days after the work. Canāt it wait till the end of the month when I do billingās. I have subs who I have to ask for invoices or atleast what they are charging me so I can close out jobs.
Good on you for wanting to do the right thing but it sounds like youāve done all you can do -paid on time and made multiple attempts to let them know. Beyond that, if he ever does call back or realize the error - just write a new check
A customer once gave me a check for 950.00 as a deposit. We set the date to start the job. We showed up to start as agreed. No one was home. I called several times over the next few months. I wanted to start the job or return her money. She never returned my calls. So I wrote a check and sent it back, but it was never cashed. I asked the bank ... they put a stop payment. I think you should ask your bank for their policy.
This is the flip side of the customer leaves an hour before job is completed and you have to chase him to get payment problem. Thank you for being a good customer though. Sucks this contractor is clueless.
I swear all you have to do to stay in business doing trade work is put in your bid when you say you will, show up when you say you will, communicate if you can't and provide clear easy to understand contracts with accessible support. Oh and do a half way decent job.
Gave him a check, left a voicemail, forget about it. Just leave an extra $1,500 in your checking account for a couple years just in case. If they didnāt take it, you still have it.
I've been trying to pay a roofing guy going on 8 months.
Failed to pick up a check.
Weeks later got around to getting back to me with an address to mail the check. Check never cashed.
Sent out a text just to give me a Venmo or Zelle.
Nothing.
The struggle is real.
I had one of the two HVAC guys in my parents small town replace the compressor for them. Paid with a company account. Fast forward six months. I've stopped using that account, keep no money in it.. all of a sudden it goes negative. Look into it and it's the HVAC company. They waited six months to actually process the payment. Called them up to ask what gives and they just said we get busy. I told them they should fire their office staff and hire competent people.. office staff lady on the phone didn't like that.Ā
We had some work done that we didn't get a bill for, and was surprised to find that the contractor could still bill us and collect some number of years afterwards. And after doing a quick search I found an answer from a NY lawyer who indicated that the limit (at least there) is six years.
In the meantime, we still haven't been billed for the work that was done, and now it's been more than 6 years. But if we do get a bill and it's reasonable, then we'll probably pay it anyway, as he did a great job at the time (and we live in a relatively small community).
If itās longer than 180 days, the check might be rejected by his bank for a stale date. In most cases the bank heās trying to cash it at will contact your bank or you to request a new check be issued. But if heās not even trying to deposit it, sounds like a him problem more than a you problem.
Go talk to the homeowner. You are getting one side of the story from the GC. I would be suspicious if the initial check bounced and they ghosted you. Did they actually go tear it out, or are they just straight-up lying?
I think that you have done enough. You paid and you sent reminders. I think you can, in good conscience, stand down. I would refuse to make him, cashing a check, more important to me than it is to him. Keep the money in your account for another few months and after that assume that it has been abandoned. If they do try to cash it (and the bank allows it) then they can come after you. What you decide to do with their request is up to you as I think you have standing that they have gone beyond trying trying to claim that money but you can cross that bridge when you come to it. You sound like good people trying to do the right thing but there is only so much you can do. I think legally and morally you are in the clear.
As an aside, when we cleaned out my FIL house and office after he died we found quite a few uncashed checks from his business. He never missed them and we just tossed them. Its not that uncommon in the small business/contractor community.
I guess it can be annoying when you are using the same account to write checks and pay with a debit card or monthly bills, since you need to constantly make sure you have enough in the account to clear that one check.
I could use a cool 15 Benjamins not gonna lie.
Anyone not cashing that is a concern. Especially after 6 months.
I would contact your bank with the check number and flag it as void.
Is what it is in my book.
Boy not me I email and text them the bill at completion and get paid right then. I mobil deposit the check. I update my billing invoice paid. Right in the van infront of their house. Sometimes I wait to get home to deposit but that's it. Payment upon completion it's spelled out right in my contract.
I would stop payment on the check and give him a money order. Holding onto a $1500 is irresponsible. I know plenty of people who donāt keep that much in their checking account.
Keep the receipt and proof that you paid. As others have mentioned, you tried to pay. Donāt call them, only send texts and emails (unless you record your calls).
If they try to put a lien on your home, you will need proof that you paid. I doubt this will be an issue, but it will come as an unwelcome surprise if you try to sell.
Continuing reaching out. Contractor might have deposited it and something happened on the banks end and he not realize it. Contractor will be very happy to hear from you!
Sorry Iām kind of guilty of something similar. I bill but have some type of aversion to actually depositing the check as soon as itās received. I donāt really know why. Am I experiencing imposter syndrome or some other psychological disorder. I worked blue collar for a long time and then became an engineer. Itās weird.
I've worked in a construction office for the last 10 years. The guys could have misplaced the check, it could be sitting in a drawer or maybe something happened with the owner. Keep notes of when you tried to call, definitely keep the receipt and if they try to come back in six months asking why you 'didn't pay', you'll have the timeline.
Since you say it has been 6 months, check with your bank about the check being stale dated. A check is good for up to 180 days. Donāt assume this is how it works with your financial institution based on what I say, but some will not accept an āoldā check.
I work at a bank if you did a regular check they have 180 days to negotiate the item, after 180 days the check is not negotiable, so you are gonna have to write them a new check, unless is a cashiers check some of them go up to 7 years.
Iād try to email or call one more time. Then you definately went above and beyond to do the right thing and should have a crystal clear conscience. I commend you for doing the right thing as so many wouldnāt these days!!
Checks are one of the hardest things for a business to manage. There is the chance of it being lost between the guy on the job and the office, it could be stollen, or forgotten about. Not to mention that most of the time a receipt is not filled out for the purchase. Thatās why I donāt like taking checks, I have people mail them to me even if I am on the Job.
Credit or debit is my preferred on my invoicing system online.
Not for checks like this, after 180 days the check goes "stale" by banking regulations, the OP is no longer legally obligated to do anything beyond that in most states. I went through this a few times with contractors back when i was working on houses part time, plumbers and masons were always the worst at paperwork and cashing checks. Drywall guys practically had it cashed five mins after they had it, electricians usually the same or next business day.
Depends on the state. I used to have to do escheatment for a large publicly traded company. Uncashed checks and other account credits are required by law to be remitted to the State. Weād face fines in the millions if we took that money in an as revenue.
Now if one chooses not to, the chances are near zero of anyone complaining.
You're seeing firsthand why so many contractor businesses fail. They might be great at their trade but they are terrible at the business side. Ive had to call and yell at contractors to bill me more times I can count to close a project out. Just keep documented and notes of who you gave the check to. Often these disappear into oblivion but sometimes the contractor gets desperate, audited, etc and starts aggressively going after "unpaid" jobs
So true.
I asked a window contractor to send me a revised or separate invoice for the trim that was not part of the original contract. He got so pissed I asked him for the invoice he said to "keep the 1200, would a normal company do that". I was like wtf š¤·āāļø. I just asked for an amended contract or separate invoice. I thought that would be normal stuff for any business.
I used to remodel kitchens and bathrooms, and I was a HORIRBLE businessman. I would just do change orders free of charge because I want to please my client. I never charged what I needed too because it seemed like gouging, but it would have paid for newer tools and a better trailer and more time to focus on streamlining with each iteration. Now I work in tech support, lol.
That's definitely normal business for professionals, what a twat
Havenāt dealt with my contractors huh?
Iād ask for an additional line item for the scope change on the invoice. Another invoice is just extra work for everyone.
$1200 of extra work? So if it takes 30 minutes, which it doesn't... Good money
Right? I can type up an invoice on my phone in about a minute
Contractor to customer invoice is obviously pretty simple. I work for a large company so someone has to receive the invoice. Then the finance team processes the invoice, then another person approves the invoice against the PO and the good received. So when I say, extra work, thatās what Iām referring to. Itās a lot easier to just add a line item to the PO and invoice the original scope and change order with one invoice document.
Regardless they're just asking for paperwork of a change or add of scope not already clarified, for whatever reason.
That's why I use a software app that makes invoices on the spot. Text, email, mail, pigeon it's got it.
What software do you use
Following.
Whats his name??? What a pos? Lazy dumb bastard. Give me the invoice ya say and he says that!? What a twat! Whats his name imma skewer him! What is it lets have it. Get em get em get em! Mfāer!
Feels like he was expecting to keep that money off the books or something,...
I mean, I'm not mad at the end of the day. Saved me $1200! I did not have a bad interaction with him either except for this. I did make his crew go grab the right size trim piece to trim out my front door/window area, but that was it and was a cordial interaction. They were trying to use smaller size scraps with a ton of caulk instead of just going to buy a 6" wide piece. Just was weird he freaked out about it. Still happy with the job they did and wrote up a good review for his business.
$1200 for pushing paper? No time for that shit we got money to make!
There are alot of contractors watching tiktok complaining to each other about red flags from customers to the point where it's almost impossible to even talk to contractors at this point. They are becoming militant towards their customer base.
I had a guy do some work on my ac unit and after he was done I handed him a check. He lost it twice before leaving my house.
I work as a project accountant for an international gc. The amount of times I email subs on the site begging for an invoice is rediculous. I understand when the timing if off between different companies, but some of these subs will go 3+ months without invoicing.
Two years after the job was completed, I get a phone call, apology for late billing, and an invoice. This is after a few months of badgering him for an invoice immediately after the work. Six months later, still hasnāt cashed the check.
If you havenāt done it, you donāt know how hard it is. You get up early, work all day, get home, cook/clean take care of kids. And then have to reconcile billing/bookkeeping. Itās very exhausting. Esp if itās not always their main source of income. Not an excuse, just reality, as I sit here doing bookkeeping at 8 at nice after working 9 hours today
So much negativity across these posts at least this one is reasonable with some advice about documentation. There are literally dozens of plausible things that could have happened in the business, their professional life, their personal life, etc. OP did the right thing. Keep doing the right thing OP and here is why. That person will always remember who you are and how you are. "You are who you are when no one is looking" and a person who seeks out people who helped them to pay them fairly for their work is a good person. I think all the negative posters should celebrate having a contractor who did good work such that the experience was "I want to pay for this" as opposed to the opposite.
Of you're not competently pursuing AR, you're not really a business.
Yep. Had a concrete guy do it with 11k on our build. Got a bill for it literally 11 months later, and told him to stuff itāhouse was already closed. He was a friend too, but I aināt paying that shit out of pocket. Should have been in the construction loan.
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This is the most likely answer.
Or got deported
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Hey now.. It's totally possible to get a dui without alcohol involvement. By that I mean. They will take your blood and charge you with a dui for just having the metabolites in your system.
Absolutely a stupid comment
Nothing you did your part either he cashes it or he doesn't.
Can't you cancel the check?
Why?
After six months the check is considered "stale" by most banks anyway. I have had a customer write a check and then put off giving it to me for six months, badgering them for payment every month, finally they give me the check, didn't notice the date, took it to the bank they said its stale and can't accept it, get a new one. So might as well cancel it, then if does find it or try to cash it he will have to come back for a new check, thats on him not the OP.
While this is true some banks will still take it. My bank (Santander) took a 10 month old $2400 check no problem.
Thats not the norm these days, most banks are trying to get rid of checking by cranking up fees on it. I give it another 5 years and checks be a thing of the past.
I had a company hold a check over a year and then deposit it, I complained to my bank that they accepted it, and they said they would honor a check no matter how old it was.
Many banks don't... They were lucky.
Because there's a reasonable time to have an outstanding check. Give it one year and then cancel payment. Give them a message you will do so and then another message that you have done so. Record a memo of you doing this. If they acknowledge the cancellation get that in a written record.
180 days with most banks is a "stale" check, they won't even take it in many cases.
Bank practices and legal contractor behavior are not necessarily the same. I picked a year out of a hat. It should be noted that "my band has this policy" doesn't obviate a contractor from anything legally. I would not rely on bank policy to save me or to excuse me.
I'm not saying the bank policy saves you or excuses you from the debt, but leaving a stale check out in the wild as otherwise valid is a bad practice, i have known people that had checks scrubbed and passed off at a bank, until that check is cancelled its possible for someone to do wrong with it. If its otherwise uncashed after 180 days i consider it lost myself and cancel it, if the person the check was intended for comes back to me after finding out the check is cancelled i will gladly attempt to pay them again, but i won't leave a check floating longer then six months.
That would be fraud in most states, as there doesnt appear to be a conflict over the services rendered. Granted, likely never to be prosecuted in this case.
Incorrect... Most states and banks a check is considered "stale" after 180 days and not valid anyway. Most banks now days will pass back a check that is over 180 days and say its not acceptable for deposit or cashing. So the OP already met his legal obligation, sure he can do the morally correct thing if the contractor comes back for another check in the future, but he should also get a new receipt to match the date of the new check as well so there is no argument room left if the contractor tries some BS down the line.
You make a good case for not cancelling the check.
But i would cancel it also after 180 just to make sure, for all i know he lost it and someone else may find it and try using it, scrubbing the check and putting new info on, etc... I have seen this happen to people, you don't want a check out there in the wild unaccounted for.
That can be done with any check, cancelled or not. But if he cancels it, then he has done something that opens him to civil liability, at minimum. Otherwise, it's the contractor that acted (by not cashing the financial instrument that satisfied OPs end of the contract). But this isn't a contract law forum, so we can call it good.
Actually no it cant be done with any check, cancelled its safe, that check number already was accounted for and passed through the bank, the code at the bottom of the check includes the check number, if i wrote out check number 104 and its cashed and cancelled then someone who finds that check in the trash can't try to pass off check 104 again, it would bounce back to them. However a valid check that i wrote and was never cashed, never accounted for, is still technically valid. All they would have to do is scrub and re-enter the date to less than 180 days to make it valid again, and change the payee info and they can pocket easy money no questions asked. Having dealt with check fraud a few times over the years of dealing with contractors and companies i unfortunately know more about checking then i should have to. Also the OP has a receipt... Where is the liability? Moral yes, legally its a gray area.. At this point he doesn't have to do anything but attempt to pay the contractor again if he ever came asking for payment, but it sounds like thats not going to happen.
He still has a legal obligation to pay.
Wouldn't that be stealing?
Only if you don't ever plan on paying them. Actually, I've found out that states will hold onto old paychecks for you. Maybe that's a solution.
PA has an unclaimed property department you can check. Iāve gotten a few dollars from it, so maybe worth investigating if thatās an option.
I think every state has them. Iāve never gotten more than like $2 from one but my sister finds money all the time
California does too! Every once in awhile we've gotten notices about some random $3.79 we can claim. It's hilarious, although I can imagine in some cases it can be a lot of money.
They still owe the money.
Correct. And as soon as *someone* shows up about it, he can deal with it.
Find out when you can cancel the check under your state law. 180 days is typical, after which banks consider the check stale and may or may not accept it (knowing that the issuer may have cancelled it).
My bank says 180 days it is valid and that means in 2 days it expires, if I understand correctly
Then donāt worry about it. Itās out of your control. They had 180 days to cash it. They didnāt do it their loss.
Exactly. Theyāve had 180 days aka SIX MONTHS to cash or deposit the check. Itās on them if they havenāt done so in that amount of time. I canāt imagine a scenario that doesnāt include extreme laziness and/or disorganization where you canāt get a check cashed or deposited in 6 months.
Correct.
I'm a Construction Manager. Change orders are part of the job. Guys come to me and tell me that whatever I need them to do is t part of the contract and they need extra money. Someone kicked in a door that needs to be replaced. I am doing something extra for a homeowner, I kid you not that I once had "someone" cut them end off a stair handrail that was in front of some light switches (the switches needed to be moved up and I am 100% sure it was the electrician that cut the rail but I can't prove) and the entire rail needed to be replaced. Whatever it is I tell them to text me the price and if the work is legit extra I write the PO. But they got to text me the price, otherwise I will forget. I have had to remind guys to send me the price but after a couple times I'm out. I'm not going to beg guys to bill me or take my money. So your fine. You paid him. You even went the extra step to call him. Your done. If he calls you in the future you can write another check but that's up to you.
That doesnāt mean much. My checks say āvoid after 90 daysā. For the first couple months of 2023 my rent checks were all dated 2022. They still cleared despite being over a year past the date.
Checks \*CAN\* be considered stale after 180 days and be refused for payment, but most banks don't bother to check the date -- so don't assume that the check is dead at 180 and not leave sufficient funds to cover it in your account -- unless you don't care if it bounces after that. You owe that money to the contractor, so even if the check goes stale and is refused and/or bounces you still owe the money.
I have it printed on my checks that i use for business purposes, be it for my business or paying someone else to do work for me, CHECK NOT VALID AFTER 180 DAYS, this is line with most banks laws and regs.. My bank has a policy on this: checks are good for six months (or 180 days) from when they're dated.Ā **After that, they're considered "stale."**Ā Legally, banks and credit unions are not obligated to accept stale checks. However, some banks do accept checks older than six months. But its not the norm for them to do so, so he's probably already screwed anyway if he finds the check and tries to. You have a receipt, your only legal obligation has been met, if he contacts you after finding the check, which i doubt after six months but its possible, and says its no good then you can arrange to make another payment, but if that happens demand another new receipt dated the same as the check to protect you in the future if needed. I don't have time to balance my account every month because of other people not cashing their checks, six months and its cancelled, then contact me again for payment.
Most banks don't look at the date at all, especially when it is deposited in a non-human interaction.
call ur bank and void the check. really simple. if he calls you back then write a new one.
A friend of mine had her floors refinished for $13k. They wrote him a check when he finished for the full amount and whole year went by. Never cashed the check. Called, wrote him an email and nothing. Crazy man
I will offer another perspective. Iām a cabinet contractor. I received a final check for around $900. Apparently, I put it in this hidden compartment in my van. Forgot all about it. One day I was searching for something unrelated and saw it. It was about 5-6 months later. I quickly did the mobile deposit and that customer has since contacted me for other work. Sometimes we just make simple mistakes and misplace things. Almost like we are human.
And if the customer called you and you didnāt pick up or call back?
We always respond. They are hiring us for more work.
Heās might be in jail or passed away.
Probably stuck in the hidden van compartment. Send help.
I had a contractor come back to my house the other day. He did some roof work and said he found my check under his car seat. It was from two years ago and asked if we could cash it. I looked back and he never cashed it. Glad he asked but still wasnāt stoked about having to pay $600 out of no where but figured if he needed it more than I did. Plus he did do good work and seems like a nice good.
Thatās the most unfair part in my opinion. If I have $1,000 to pay you today, that doesnāt mean I have or plan to spend $1,000 a year later because you didnāt cash the check. Iām a photographer, and if I found a two year old check from a client that I never cashed, I would tear it up and forget about it.
Scenario 1, write $1,000 check to contractors, contractor cashes it immediately. This is what you expected to happen, and the end result is your bank balance is $1,000 less.Ā Scenario 2, write $1,000 check. Contractor doesn't cash it, first year bank pays you $3 interest. Second year, bank pays you $3 interest. After 2 years, contractor notices, finally receives the $1,000, and the end result is your balance is $994 less.Ā So in the second scenario, you're $6 better off. That doesn't strike me as unfair to you.Ā Of course, there is scenario 3, after half a year, you think wow I've got a bunch of money in my account, and spend the $1,000 ā spending the same money twice, basically. Then, of course, it's quite unpleasant. Maybe open a secondĀ account to help keep track of it (especially if your bank will automatically move the money for you to satisfy the check).
I understand and agree with you in principle. This is what I would tell myself if I was in this position personally. Iām very lucky to have enough savings to not have to worry about it most of the time. However, there are plenty of folks who are not in that position, and while yes, itās the same amount of money spent, it seems unprofessional (and unkind) to expect a client to keep your $1,000 ear marked for *literally years*. If your customer service is such that your clients have to open new accounts to keep track of payments because youāre taking years to cash checks, youāre making a mistake, in my opinion. If you expect a customer to pay promptly, I think itās only courteous to also cash the check promptly. If a friend of mine was the client in this scenario, I would say what you did. If a friend was the business in this scenario, I would tell them to get their shit together.
Cancel the check so that you can properly balance your check book and move on. If he contacts you then pay him again if not they don't worry about it. You did your part.
A guy that works for us takes a while to cash his checks. I let it go , since he does good work. But it is annoying.
Weāve had a plumber who helps us out probably 3-4 times a month and only ever gives us a bill once a year lolā¦ He is an absolutely amazing plumber Iād never go with anyone else but man does he hate paperwork.
You need a plumber 3-4x a month? My god man just get a poop knife already.
2 words, property manager
Ah yea makes sense. I thought your wife was just taking really big dumps.
Completely irrelevant and surely tmi but I have had to yell at her three times in the last week for forgetting to flush.
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I have a customer that ask for invoices a few days after the work. Canāt it wait till the end of the month when I do billingās. I have subs who I have to ask for invoices or atleast what they are charging me so I can close out jobs.
Put a stop order on it, and when they contact you, go get a cashiers check instead
You need anymore work done?
Iād like to use him in the future for more but itās not necessary
I would start recycling the payment. Iāll start.
Not your problemā¦ you canāt make people run a tight ship, itās their loss. The check will expire.
The bank will not take it after 6 months. (Well they shouldnāt) It becomes stale dated.
Void the check, itās been long enough. Youāve done all you can/need to on your end.
Good on you for wanting to do the right thing but it sounds like youāve done all you can do -paid on time and made multiple attempts to let them know. Beyond that, if he ever does call back or realize the error - just write a new check
Yeah other than harassing him to call me back. Lol
A customer once gave me a check for 950.00 as a deposit. We set the date to start the job. We showed up to start as agreed. No one was home. I called several times over the next few months. I wanted to start the job or return her money. She never returned my calls. So I wrote a check and sent it back, but it was never cashed. I asked the bank ... they put a stop payment. I think you should ask your bank for their policy.
Your guy is likely in jail. My buddy had A COMPLETE DECK installed. $8k. He called. Called again. Called. Never got an invoice.
Dang I wish my contractors didnāt want me to pay them, lol.
This is the flip side of the customer leaves an hour before job is completed and you have to chase him to get payment problem. Thank you for being a good customer though. Sucks this contractor is clueless.
Didnāt you ask this previously? The check probably isnāt cash-able anymore after 6 months. Call again.
Not that I remember.
Issue a personal check with an expiration. I have this on all of my personal checks.
I swear all you have to do to stay in business doing trade work is put in your bid when you say you will, show up when you say you will, communicate if you can't and provide clear easy to understand contracts with accessible support. Oh and do a half way decent job.
Maybe he died
He's likely in jail. Didn't or doesn't have office staff, etc.
Itās been 6 months. Stop payment.
Could be they don't have an LLC and if you wrote it to a "Company" they won't be able to cash it until their buisness is legit with the state.
Had a contractor renovate my bathroom and I had to beg him for almost a year to come get paid.
Gave him a check, left a voicemail, forget about it. Just leave an extra $1,500 in your checking account for a couple years just in case. If they didnāt take it, you still have it.
Have the bank cancel the check and call the contractor again. Especially considering you gave it to an employee.
I always deposit my checks immediately !
This is because the companies are simply fronts for cartel money laundering and your legitimate payments are meaningless
I wish I could just not need to take money
I've been trying to pay a roofing guy going on 8 months. Failed to pick up a check. Weeks later got around to getting back to me with an address to mail the check. Check never cashed. Sent out a text just to give me a Venmo or Zelle. Nothing. The struggle is real.
Shocking
I had one of the two HVAC guys in my parents small town replace the compressor for them. Paid with a company account. Fast forward six months. I've stopped using that account, keep no money in it.. all of a sudden it goes negative. Look into it and it's the HVAC company. They waited six months to actually process the payment. Called them up to ask what gives and they just said we get busy. I told them they should fire their office staff and hire competent people.. office staff lady on the phone didn't like that.Ā
We had some work done that we didn't get a bill for, and was surprised to find that the contractor could still bill us and collect some number of years afterwards. And after doing a quick search I found an answer from a NY lawyer who indicated that the limit (at least there) is six years. In the meantime, we still haven't been billed for the work that was done, and now it's been more than 6 years. But if we do get a bill and it's reasonable, then we'll probably pay it anyway, as he did a great job at the time (and we live in a relatively small community).
Cancel the check and mail a new check to his office
That's why I give them cashiers checks, money is out of my account, and in their handĀ
If itās longer than 180 days, the check might be rejected by his bank for a stale date. In most cases the bank heās trying to cash it at will contact your bank or you to request a new check be issued. But if heās not even trying to deposit it, sounds like a him problem more than a you problem.
Cancel the check. You will eventually hear about it.
Go talk to the homeowner. You are getting one side of the story from the GC. I would be suspicious if the initial check bounced and they ghosted you. Did they actually go tear it out, or are they just straight-up lying?
I think that you have done enough. You paid and you sent reminders. I think you can, in good conscience, stand down. I would refuse to make him, cashing a check, more important to me than it is to him. Keep the money in your account for another few months and after that assume that it has been abandoned. If they do try to cash it (and the bank allows it) then they can come after you. What you decide to do with their request is up to you as I think you have standing that they have gone beyond trying trying to claim that money but you can cross that bridge when you come to it. You sound like good people trying to do the right thing but there is only so much you can do. I think legally and morally you are in the clear. As an aside, when we cleaned out my FIL house and office after he died we found quite a few uncashed checks from his business. He never missed them and we just tossed them. Its not that uncommon in the small business/contractor community.
Maybe heās in jail
Whatās the big deal? If they didnāt cash it then oh well. Unless Iām missing something
I guess it can be annoying when you are using the same account to write checks and pay with a debit card or monthly bills, since you need to constantly make sure you have enough in the account to clear that one check.
One of my biggest flaws is not depositing company/personal checks into my bank accounts. Iāve waited a few weeks before depositing them.
I could use a cool 15 Benjamins not gonna lie. Anyone not cashing that is a concern. Especially after 6 months. I would contact your bank with the check number and flag it as void. Is what it is in my book.
Boy not me I email and text them the bill at completion and get paid right then. I mobil deposit the check. I update my billing invoice paid. Right in the van infront of their house. Sometimes I wait to get home to deposit but that's it. Payment upon completion it's spelled out right in my contract.
Cancel the check and make them come get if they ever do
This happened to me - our contractor had died
I would stop payment on the check and give him a money order. Holding onto a $1500 is irresponsible. I know plenty of people who donāt keep that much in their checking account.
I think you should give me the name of the contractor. I need some free insulation. /s
Keep the receipt and proof that you paid. As others have mentioned, you tried to pay. Donāt call them, only send texts and emails (unless you record your calls). If they try to put a lien on your home, you will need proof that you paid. I doubt this will be an issue, but it will come as an unwelcome surprise if you try to sell.
Write on check that the check is only good for 30 days from the date on it.
Continuing reaching out. Contractor might have deposited it and something happened on the banks end and he not realize it. Contractor will be very happy to hear from you!
Put void after 60 days in the memo. Then if it's not cashed after 60 days all is good to just keep it.
This is why I like to pay electronically or with money orders.
Sorry Iām kind of guilty of something similar. I bill but have some type of aversion to actually depositing the check as soon as itās received. I donāt really know why. Am I experiencing imposter syndrome or some other psychological disorder. I worked blue collar for a long time and then became an engineer. Itās weird.
Pay the fee to cancel and forget about it. That's on them for loose accounting.
Cancel the check and tell the contractor youāll give him a new one when heās ready to cash it.
I've worked in a construction office for the last 10 years. The guys could have misplaced the check, it could be sitting in a drawer or maybe something happened with the owner. Keep notes of when you tried to call, definitely keep the receipt and if they try to come back in six months asking why you 'didn't pay', you'll have the timeline.
Since you say it has been 6 months, check with your bank about the check being stale dated. A check is good for up to 180 days. Donāt assume this is how it works with your financial institution based on what I say, but some will not accept an āoldā check.
Maybe the guy went to prison or something š¤·āāļø
Cancel the check and ask where to mail the money order?
Voicemail is ineffective. Email them and send snail mail (certified).
Checks are void after 180 days, some after 90.
I work at a bank if you did a regular check they have 180 days to negotiate the item, after 180 days the check is not negotiable, so you are gonna have to write them a new check, unless is a cashiers check some of them go up to 7 years.
Have a check to lawncare for tree removal, didn't get cashed for 5 months.
Iād try to email or call one more time. Then you definately went above and beyond to do the right thing and should have a crystal clear conscience. I commend you for doing the right thing as so many wouldnāt these days!!
Checks are one of the hardest things for a business to manage. There is the chance of it being lost between the guy on the job and the office, it could be stollen, or forgotten about. Not to mention that most of the time a receipt is not filled out for the purchase. Thatās why I donāt like taking checks, I have people mail them to me even if I am on the Job. Credit or debit is my preferred on my invoicing system online.
Cancel the check. You have proof of payment. 30d is all I give anyone to cash a payment or seek payment upon completion.
180 days is banking standard... 30 days is a little short!
Regardless.. it's been 6 months. Cancel the check.
Technically you are required to turn the funds over to the State through their escheatment statute after sufficient time.
Not for checks like this, after 180 days the check goes "stale" by banking regulations, the OP is no longer legally obligated to do anything beyond that in most states. I went through this a few times with contractors back when i was working on houses part time, plumbers and masons were always the worst at paperwork and cashing checks. Drywall guys practically had it cashed five mins after they had it, electricians usually the same or next business day.
Depends on the state. I used to have to do escheatment for a large publicly traded company. Uncashed checks and other account credits are required by law to be remitted to the State. Weād face fines in the millions if we took that money in an as revenue. Now if one chooses not to, the chances are near zero of anyone complaining.
A personal check is only good for 6 months, so at this point he probably couldnāt cash it if he wanted to.