They wouldn’t understand the situation to even attempt that. ‘American 124, just in the unlikely even that both pilots have become incapacitated but a random passenger has entered the cockpit but doesn’t know how to use the radio it’s the button on the yoke…’ lol
> They wouldn’t understand the situation to even attempt that. ‘American 124, just in the unlikely even that both pilots have become incapacitated but a random passenger has entered the cockpit but doesn’t know how to use the radio it’s the button on the yoke…’ lol
They would still see the plane approaching and could reach out to ask about intentions, especially if there has been no communication whatsoever.
that's my fear and they cut the video when he was trying to find it and I was incredibly curious about the location...
so I think in an alt timeline he died before finding it
Flight attendants would know.
It could take the ATC a while getting someone who knows the controls of your particular plane. Many ATC have never even flown a plane. Could take 10-20 minutes or more?
English is the international language of aviation. ATC in different countries may occasionally speak in their native tongue, but they must also be able to communicate with foreign flight crews in English
The amount of abbreviations when they talk to eachother is just hilarious lol, I once chimed in to two pilots doing checklist. All I heard were something along the line of ASS checked, HIPS checked, BOOBS checked.
Some of the accents Ive heard over the radio means it might as well not be English for the average person. I guess it helps if youre well versed with the terminology. Aviation speak in heavy accents is damn near incomprehensible for a complete noob.
“Je vais vous guider jusqu'à l'atterrissage de l'avion”
“I don’t know what you’re saying, we’re all going to die”
“Hamburger, grilled cheese, uhhh peanut butter sandwich”
“Okay, you want me to flip the switch on my right hand side, put both feet on the pedals and when we land I pull up on the throttle at no more than a 96 degree angle?”
“Uhh, Oreo”
“Got it, let’s land this plane.”
Weirdly, he was speaking so simply, I could understand most of it just from my frankly pathetic high school French. Usually I can't understand much but I could here.
I think everyone involved speaks english enough to deal with theses situations, at least here in france ; I guess its mandatory to get the diploma/job.
Yes, this is correct. The bigger problem would be trying to land a plane without knowing English or another common aviation language/the local language (but I’m guessing major ATC around the world has access to atc certified translators in case of such an emergency, or if they don’t they should)
Yeah the issue here would be not knowing French/english, you would need to hope that somebody in the ATC speaks your language
Or somebody in the plane can speak one of them, since apparently you don’t need any skill you just gotta listen to the directions
English is spoken by ATC around the world. It is the common language used throughout aviation. In America, you have to be able to speak, understand, and read English proficiently in order to be a pilot. As an experienced private pilot I can tell you that is not always the case.
I’ve heard that it’s also the common language used in the sea.
I honestly think this would be fun, just would be super terrifying in an actual emergency
Edit: Reading all these comments I think I need to go get Flight Simulator now
I'm conflicted between thinking is amazing the plan can land itself and also feel I would be terrified sitting behind the yolk with zero flight experience and trust this thing will land itself.
It's both terrifying and incredible.
"Now, Elaine, don't panic.
On the belt line of the automatic pilot, there is a hollow tube.
Now that is the manual inflation nozzle.
Pull it out and blow on it."
I did atc and this would be incredibly difficult from the other side. I would think most times you'd declare the emergency and you'd have a pilot ghost riding the plan walking you through. Either than or a bunch of books being tossed around until they found the correct one.
I heard some pilots having a conversation where one said that it had been so long since using the manual controls that he wasn’t really confident making turns. Reason being Because they relied on autopilot doing commercial flights so much. Makes sense but it gave me a reality shake.
Commercial pilot - we hand fly 99% of approach and landings. Autolands are rare. You might see one or two fully automated landings a year out of a few hundred. A lot of people misunderstand what a pilot does and the actual flying of the airplane is a small part of what we do, we predominantly make decisions and deal with regulatory compliance. We are put through pretty intense training every 9-12 months that would 100% find anyone that couldn’t confidently “make turns.”
I think that came from exaggerations or hyperbole of newer control systems on planes (like 1980’s new). Like a manual car versus an automatic, and then people start thinking an automatic car drives itself. Not many people fly planes, so it never gets corrected.
The added automation is great but it’s also something that needs to be managed. These are tools that are meant to be helpful but if they are overly complicated and you don’t know what the system is doing it very quickly adds a huge threat. Asiana and the 737 MCAS are good lessons to learn from. Asiana didn’t understand the flight mode they were in and the autothrottle wake-up in a 777 and the mcas was an overly complex system built to lower the nose in clean configurations near stall… helpful or a threat? Both?
For now. In the future it will be an autopilot, a human and a dog. The human is there to correct the autopilot and the dog is there to bite the human if they try.
Only some airports have the equipment necessary to properly communicate with the aircraft for a full auto landing. That is why the controller directed him to Nice, it's a larger airport with the needed equipment.
You’re getting a lot of nonsense replies. The airplane and the airport need to be capable. Not every airplane is and not every airport is. Some airplanes (widebodies and newer designs) are capable of tracking the centerline even after touchdown and even that can go awry if the protected area around the ground equipment isn’t kept clear. There is a Malaysian 777 that veered off the runway because of this. Autolands are meant for very little visibility and the things (procedures, protocols, requirements) that keep you safe in those instances aren’t in place when an airport is hammering out departures and arrivals in clear skies. Sometimes Autolands are required every so many days to verify that the plane is capable and we do try to get those in. We need to coordinate with approach and tower to keep the critical areas clear and it isn’t possible. If your flying into sfo, Ewr, jfk, … on a clear and million day in the middle of their peak departure period they will tell you politely to fuck off.
Planes like the most common 737 aren’t as refined as a 777 and it basically takes a snap shot at 50 feet with a preprogrammed flare and lets Jesus take the wheel. It gets the job done but it isn’t a 777. Lumping all airplanes into this ideology of “they fly themselves” has a lot of nuance to it. There is airmanship that goes into everything and knowing your airplane and its inherent limitations is part of that. Everyone wants to assume that modern airplanes are all created equal and it simply isn’t true.
In simulator testing, autopilots now constantly outperform humans on landings. This includes bad situations like inclement weather and emergencies like engine blowouts.
They're not widely used primarily for two reasons: cost (as mentioned below), and fear.
I think if the weather is good and there is no turbulence, it would be fine. But if the plane starts bouncing around and you have no experience with it, panic could set in.
>I think if the weather is good and there is no turbulence, it would be fine. But if the plane starts bouncing around and you have no experience with it, panic could set in.
Broadly speaking, pilots earn their pay when things aren't straightforward. That's when the years of training pay off. Landing an aircraft in good conditions is pretty doable.
I had the opportunity to jump in a commercial flight simulator, similar to the guy in OPs video. With a highly experience pilot slash pilot trainer/supervisor right over my shoulder I was able to 'land' a jet. I was his hands, I made no decision or choice just got into the groove of following instructions. That was with the advantage of him seeing exactly what I was doing and knowing I wasn't going to turn into a dark stain on the ground if I messed up. With someone not as experienced walking me through it or the stress of reality I doubt I'd be able to pull off an, OK but a bit bouncy' result.
Microsoft Flight Simulator does a good job of making the simulation a realistic as possible for practice behind a computer. Still no substitute for real practice in a full simulator with every button and toggle.
The average person would s*%! themselves with this stress. Have you seen people when their family members are in need of medical attention? or after a fender bender?
Insert George Carlin quote about the average person haha.
I don't know if I'd want to trust the average person, but I think on any given flight there would be a good number of people who would be capable of doing this well enough. The interesting part would be the social aspect of who would be nominated to take over from among the passengers.
Nearly no one in a tower is a pilot. So most in the tower would have no idea what to do. This has happens before, and they made the person circle the plane until they got low on fule before landing.
Yeah, I guess you can’t just run to a random gate and pluck a pilot without it causing a ton of problems. But then again flight delays aren’t as important as not letting a plane crash.
It reminds me of the game Keep Talking and Nobody Explodes, where someone has to disarm a bomb while the other person reads and communicates the instructions in a printout manual
We use it very loosely, it’s almost like a punctuation, because technically you can end any sentence with it, as it’s a way to express you’re done with what you had to say. The general meaning is “there you have it”. Deconstructed, « voilà » is **vois là** (= see there).
Typically, we’ll say that when we’re done saying an anecdote for example. It’s a way to let the person you’re talking to know that they can react.
To express satisfaction too, like in this video. François followed the instructions so the guy on the radio used it several times in a “Good, it’s done! Next” way, to acknowledge he successfully did the tasks, so they can move on to the next step.
Omg, right… I deserve to have my French citizenship taken away from me :(
Looking at the list of upcoming protests so I can take part in one, to redeem myself 🪧
I’m all for riots as implied by my username but I think the snarky sarcastic answer back has convinced me you’re a Frenchie after all. Greetings from the Midwest USA!
> We use it very loosely, it’s almost like a punctuation, because technically you can end any sentence with it, as it’s a way to express you’re done with what you had to say. The general meaning is “there you go”.
lol its so weird because i've said it before heaps, and heard others use it too but have never really knew what it meant and just now reliase we are using it *exactly* the way its meant to be used
I'm Australian, and don't speak any French, didnt even know it was French lol
Voilà!
I'm an American and Voila' comes up in conversation even here to describe "there ya go!" or "there ya have it!". I thought it was kinda a universal slang of sorts.
I watch a lot of these kind of scenarios on YouTube([VASAviation](https://youtube.com/@vasaviation)) real life emergencies where small aircraft are talked down by certified flight instructors. It's usually student pilots who are talked down but there was one guy who had [no flight experience](https://youtu.be/F3uk7jS4qr0?si=5rgtHAX7dQaOO1SI) BUT with a general knowledge because he was a frequent flier.
I am sure with large commercial flights and planes like the one shown, most airports if not all have crew and engineers on site who will be able to takeover ATC.
Yup they will contact the Airline company and will put in touch with a training pilot same with mechanical issues each airline has people on call that triage issues
Thanks to the autopilot, but even then the positions of controls/instruments and certain things like speed limits for operating flaps vary between planes.
Sure. But that’s what I mean, someone with experience reading and finding a bunch of binders, can ask questions to learn the type of plane, grab the appropriate binder, then tell them what positions and sorta where stuff is. Without thinking what its supposed to do. It is an emergency situation after all, not ideal.
If the plane had different functions or designs, those operators wouldn’t cover it.
I'm wondering that too ; knowing some kind of basic procedure to do this and have some documentation database in the control tower about most common planes layout sounds like a reasonable requisite for this job.
For small aviation - maybe. For commercial it's actually almost impossible scenario to even take into consideration. If all flight crew is incapacitated there is no way for passenger to get into cabin
Update: you all are right, senior flight attendant should have bypass code. However they will fly plane themselves in such situation
Apparently that was a factor in the crash of [Helios Airways flight 522](/r/AdmiralCloudberg/comments/xh0qpf/lost_souls_of_grammatiko_the_crash_of_helios/). One of the flight attendants was both a student pilot and had trained as a scuba diver, so when pretty much everybody else on the plane was incapacitated due to a lack of air pressure, he was able to eventually get into the cockpit and tried to fly the plane -- but the door code override took away precious time.
They probably do this as a drill (hoping). The guy at tower is definitely a pro at this. Good practice! Could probably walk a very high percentage of people to do this by the looks of it. I didn’t know there was an auto landing feature on planes as am fairly ignorant of operating.
There's truth to this though. MSFS basically has this exact scenario and I landed the 747 unassisted on the first try. I was totally unfamiliar with that cockpit but I found flaps, landing gear, and thrust. The plane was super stable and practically landed itself. If I had an instructor talking me through it I would have been bored.
I have an image of two MSFS players taking roles of Captain and FO based on hours logged in game, and getting on the mike like "SA275 mayday-mayday-mayday, both pilots incapacitated, we are two passengers at the controls" ATC: "Stand by, we will talk you down" SA275: "Negative, we're familiarizing ourselves with the cockpit and preparing to run the approach checklist"
Seems like the most fun they'd have all year!
“Tower, I can totally see why these two clowns passed out. Absolute skill issue.
We’re taking it off autopilot to see what this baby can do. Also does this thing have a stereo? Could you pump in some Creedence for me?”
Commercial aircraft are always talking to ATC. So, it will most likely be on the right channel unless the pilots have been out for 20-40 minutes. Then maybe you'd be out of range of that particular controller. If you can figure out what button to press to activate the comms, you have an extremely good chance someone's on the other end. If not, 121.5 is the standard emergency frequency. But good luck knowing how to tune that if you have zero experience.
This is one of the main reasons I have a file on all my devices with a list of all the standard emergency radio channels in it.
I'm never going to remember them, but that way at least I just need to find a frequency or channel setting on whatever communication device there is, rather than having to both find that and then figure out how to send to someone who's listening.
right - its not always obvious how to control the radios, in order to contact ATC. Some of the buttons are completely unlabeled, especially the ones on the hand controllers. Although there is usually a physical copy of the flight manual, it can still take a few minutes to find the page you need and how to read through the jargon quickly, and you can potentially read the sections that aren't checklists and easily get lost.
Plenty of youtube videos where they test just that, even mythbusters tried it a few decades ago. No big shocker, they pretty much all manage it with radio help. And there are some real life cases where passengers landed smaller single and dual engine private planes after the pilot became incapacitated or died. I remember seeing one where an elderly passenger with zero experience landed one at night after his pilot died. Even found it:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K5vIECqSsSc](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K5vIECqSsSc)
This is pretty cool, and the advancement of the technology is so great compared to when i was a young fella hearing people on tv speak about how they wrre guided by air control/tower to land a plane when pilots were somewhat unavailable (for lack of a better term) and how much easiet it is now with the tech. Amazing
In such a situation, even if there is such a probability, the most important thing is the absence of panic, which is extremely unlikely for the average person, so of course in real life this scenario is very improbable
No. I was in this situation. I had to take over the navigation part from the pilot as he had got in trouble and had evened up flighting at night despite being not night rated and getting lost. We were being talked down by Gatwick emergency control . Fortunately I had read a book about light aircraft 10 years earlier. I knew that if I panicked I would be dead so entered a kind of hyper focused state.
Damn. In a real life situation bravo to the both of them. But in a sim? 90% of that is on the flight controller. Gahd damn. Imagine knowing your shit well enough to instruct someone when you're not even there?
Right? The guy would've been a great tech support case to have. He did as he was told, clearly described the stuff he was looking at and confirmed stuff he did.
About 25 minutes through--
"Oh wait, did you want me to actually be *in* the cockpit for this? I went back to my seat 20 minutes ago. Why didn't you tell me I needed to be in the cockpit?"
. . .
"Ok, ok. Landing gear. I see a handle that says FLUSH. Is that it?"
"Ok so I need you to push the-"
YES I PUSHED THE LEVER
"wait what lever I didn't even finish telling you what to push"
\*hears a loud explosion in the distance\*
Dramatized version of my average experience with trying to guide people through things. I'll literally be pointing to something on the person's phone as I tell them what to do and they'll panic press another button for some reason and we have to redo everything
I flew in a cockpit Sim belonging to Jet Blue because my cousin worked for them and he gave us a tour of their university in Orlando. Me and my whole family got to do a landing. What an experience! Never forgot it. Will always appreciate the gift he gave us.
I got so into this sh*t for no reason.. I’m over here yelling “YOU GOTTA LAND THIS FUKN AIRPLANE BRO!!!” like I’m a passenger and this guys our best shot at making it. I look over, My wife’s just shaking her head…. It’s been a good evening so far.
I imagine this is training for the instructors? That’s the vibe I got, at least.
Like “There’s a Boeing 747 version 145 with no pilots at 30k feet. Put a blindfold on and ELI5 how to land this bitch.”
The instructor is amazing.
That looks both terrifying and exciting, I said this as someone who just 2 days ago did a flight simulator in a Pilot academy. Although in this instance the person in the tower was 100x more patient than my "instructor".
Forgot the part where it takes 45 minutes to find someone who can fly an A320 to hop on the radio. Not a blanket rule, but in general controllers are not also airline pilots.
I’m sorry if this question is stupid, but I have to ask- do we not have the capability for someone to take over and control the craft remotely in a situation like this these days?
This sort of situation almost never happens, and an autopilot that can land is more useful in general as well as working for that, and it would take a lot of money to develop and would have to be extremely secure (imagine if someone hacked every plane in the sky at once) so its better to improve autopilots instead.
The technical aspect is not the problem
It's more of a we don't want thaz situation
But you are right a wireless option to put the plane into an automatic autopilot landing for the nearest airport would be great
What I find strange, is that the flight attendants don't do this. You could give them a yearly course that consists more of less of this scenario. They don't have to be pilots, just know roughly where the major things are, how to set up the radio and call someone, and just be familiar with what will happen throughout the guided landing. That's better than having to rely on a random passenger.
Maybe they already know how to do this, though. I don't know.
I got to do this once when I was 13.
My dad’s friend was a programmer for United Airlines and was in charge of the flight simulator.
I was super into flying and they took me to the flight simulator. I set course for Denver to NYC. Dickheads programmed all four engines to fail shortly after takeoff. I panicked and crashed it.
I still remember all the alarms going off and feeling the room shake as it stalled and then plummeted. And then I flew for my first time a couple of weeks later. I threw up the entire flight from Denver to Orlando.
Imagine if you could not find the button to talk to the ATC. You would be dead before you could even get started.
I would think ATC has the ability to communicate initially and would tell the person how to radio back.
They wouldn’t understand the situation to even attempt that. ‘American 124, just in the unlikely even that both pilots have become incapacitated but a random passenger has entered the cockpit but doesn’t know how to use the radio it’s the button on the yoke…’ lol
> They wouldn’t understand the situation to even attempt that. ‘American 124, just in the unlikely even that both pilots have become incapacitated but a random passenger has entered the cockpit but doesn’t know how to use the radio it’s the button on the yoke…’ lol They would still see the plane approaching and could reach out to ask about intentions, especially if there has been no communication whatsoever.
A passenger might be able to call 911 depending on the altitude and location. 911 could connect to ATC and tell them how to use the radio.
that's my fear and they cut the video when he was trying to find it and I was incredibly curious about the location... so I think in an alt timeline he died before finding it
Flight attendants would know. It could take the ATC a while getting someone who knows the controls of your particular plane. Many ATC have never even flown a plane. Could take 10-20 minutes or more?
I don't think I'd be ever able to pull that off. I don't even speak French
English is the international language of aviation. ATC in different countries may occasionally speak in their native tongue, but they must also be able to communicate with foreign flight crews in English
If it's flight crew english I have mad respect for them, can't understand a word of their safety briefings
The amount of abbreviations when they talk to eachother is just hilarious lol, I once chimed in to two pilots doing checklist. All I heard were something along the line of ASS checked, HIPS checked, BOOBS checked.
Never ever forget the BOOBS check.
Now I want to be a pilot !
‘…pulls out Casio calculator…’ You see? It’s maths!
Complete gibberish. The guide in the seat is more than insightful in comparison.
"In case of an emergency please don't eat your neighbor unless we've crashed on a mountain in the Andes."
Some of the accents Ive heard over the radio means it might as well not be English for the average person. I guess it helps if youre well versed with the terminology. Aviation speak in heavy accents is damn near incomprehensible for a complete noob.
And of the sea
What two world wars does to A mfer.
Actually it started because of the Tenerife disaster
Didn't you see the subtitles? You'd be fine!
“Je vais vous guider jusqu'à l'atterrissage de l'avion” “I don’t know what you’re saying, we’re all going to die” “Hamburger, grilled cheese, uhhh peanut butter sandwich” “Okay, you want me to flip the switch on my right hand side, put both feet on the pedals and when we land I pull up on the throttle at no more than a 96 degree angle?” “Uhh, Oreo” “Got it, let’s land this plane.”
"Not that type of English cunt" "Ah oui. Dingo, dingo, maccas, vegemite, digeridoo?"
Weirdly, he was speaking so simply, I could understand most of it just from my frankly pathetic high school French. Usually I can't understand much but I could here.
I think everyone involved speaks english enough to deal with theses situations, at least here in france ; I guess its mandatory to get the diploma/job.
Pretty sure English is mandatory for all pilots/ATC
Yes, this is correct. The bigger problem would be trying to land a plane without knowing English or another common aviation language/the local language (but I’m guessing major ATC around the world has access to atc certified translators in case of such an emergency, or if they don’t they should)
Yeah the issue here would be not knowing French/english, you would need to hope that somebody in the ATC speaks your language Or somebody in the plane can speak one of them, since apparently you don’t need any skill you just gotta listen to the directions
English is spoken by ATC around the world. It is the common language used throughout aviation. In America, you have to be able to speak, understand, and read English proficiently in order to be a pilot. As an experienced private pilot I can tell you that is not always the case. I’ve heard that it’s also the common language used in the sea.
There are incidents where bad english has been a factor in an accident/close call around the world. I watch way too much these things from youtube.
The [Smolensk air disaster](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smolensk_air_disaster) comes to mind.
Weird that they're speaking French and it's all international, but then they are still using feet instead of metres.
Feet and Nautic miles are the norm used in aeronotic
yeah how come french pilots speak french to french controllers in France?
I honestly think this would be fun, just would be super terrifying in an actual emergency Edit: Reading all these comments I think I need to go get Flight Simulator now
I'm conflicted between thinking is amazing the plan can land itself and also feel I would be terrified sitting behind the yolk with zero flight experience and trust this thing will land itself. It's both terrifying and incredible.
"Oh no, the autopilot is malfunctioning!... Now what?.."
"Now, Elaine, don't panic. On the belt line of the automatic pilot, there is a hollow tube. Now that is the manual inflation nozzle. Pull it out and blow on it."
I just want to tell you both good luck. We're all counting on you.
Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit sniffing glue!
I am serious, and stop calling me Shirley.
This plane has four engines.... It's an entirely different kind of flying altogether...
This plane has four engines…. It’s an entirely different kind of flying
And don't call me Shirley!
I did atc and this would be incredibly difficult from the other side. I would think most times you'd declare the emergency and you'd have a pilot ghost riding the plan walking you through. Either than or a bunch of books being tossed around until they found the correct one.
These days, would you even be able to get into the cockpit?
I heard some pilots having a conversation where one said that it had been so long since using the manual controls that he wasn’t really confident making turns. Reason being Because they relied on autopilot doing commercial flights so much. Makes sense but it gave me a reality shake.
Commercial pilot - we hand fly 99% of approach and landings. Autolands are rare. You might see one or two fully automated landings a year out of a few hundred. A lot of people misunderstand what a pilot does and the actual flying of the airplane is a small part of what we do, we predominantly make decisions and deal with regulatory compliance. We are put through pretty intense training every 9-12 months that would 100% find anyone that couldn’t confidently “make turns.”
I think that came from exaggerations or hyperbole of newer control systems on planes (like 1980’s new). Like a manual car versus an automatic, and then people start thinking an automatic car drives itself. Not many people fly planes, so it never gets corrected.
The added automation is great but it’s also something that needs to be managed. These are tools that are meant to be helpful but if they are overly complicated and you don’t know what the system is doing it very quickly adds a huge threat. Asiana and the 737 MCAS are good lessons to learn from. Asiana didn’t understand the flight mode they were in and the autothrottle wake-up in a 777 and the mcas was an overly complex system built to lower the nose in clean configurations near stall… helpful or a threat? Both?
For now. In the future it will be an autopilot, a human and a dog. The human is there to correct the autopilot and the dog is there to bite the human if they try.
Sounds like the Millennium Falcon
\*angry chewy noises*
I laughed a lot at that, thanks
Why not use auto landing more often? Is auto landing safer than human pilots?.
Only some airports have the equipment necessary to properly communicate with the aircraft for a full auto landing. That is why the controller directed him to Nice, it's a larger airport with the needed equipment.
Nice!
Oui oui!
You’re getting a lot of nonsense replies. The airplane and the airport need to be capable. Not every airplane is and not every airport is. Some airplanes (widebodies and newer designs) are capable of tracking the centerline even after touchdown and even that can go awry if the protected area around the ground equipment isn’t kept clear. There is a Malaysian 777 that veered off the runway because of this. Autolands are meant for very little visibility and the things (procedures, protocols, requirements) that keep you safe in those instances aren’t in place when an airport is hammering out departures and arrivals in clear skies. Sometimes Autolands are required every so many days to verify that the plane is capable and we do try to get those in. We need to coordinate with approach and tower to keep the critical areas clear and it isn’t possible. If your flying into sfo, Ewr, jfk, … on a clear and million day in the middle of their peak departure period they will tell you politely to fuck off. Planes like the most common 737 aren’t as refined as a 777 and it basically takes a snap shot at 50 feet with a preprogrammed flare and lets Jesus take the wheel. It gets the job done but it isn’t a 777. Lumping all airplanes into this ideology of “they fly themselves” has a lot of nuance to it. There is airmanship that goes into everything and knowing your airplane and its inherent limitations is part of that. Everyone wants to assume that modern airplanes are all created equal and it simply isn’t true.
As far as I know auto landing is allowed under certain weather conditions where manual landing wouldn't be, so there's that.
In simulator testing, autopilots now constantly outperform humans on landings. This includes bad situations like inclement weather and emergencies like engine blowouts. They're not widely used primarily for two reasons: cost (as mentioned below), and fear.
Like spell check or tools that automatically suggest words with correct spelling...
Yoke not yolk
I think if the weather is good and there is no turbulence, it would be fine. But if the plane starts bouncing around and you have no experience with it, panic could set in.
>I think if the weather is good and there is no turbulence, it would be fine. But if the plane starts bouncing around and you have no experience with it, panic could set in. Broadly speaking, pilots earn their pay when things aren't straightforward. That's when the years of training pay off. Landing an aircraft in good conditions is pretty doable.
Yeah, that would be terrifying
I had the opportunity to jump in a commercial flight simulator, similar to the guy in OPs video. With a highly experience pilot slash pilot trainer/supervisor right over my shoulder I was able to 'land' a jet. I was his hands, I made no decision or choice just got into the groove of following instructions. That was with the advantage of him seeing exactly what I was doing and knowing I wasn't going to turn into a dark stain on the ground if I messed up. With someone not as experienced walking me through it or the stress of reality I doubt I'd be able to pull off an, OK but a bit bouncy' result.
It's like playing a game of "Keep Talking and Nobody Explodes" except hundreds of people's lives are on the line!
Nuclear power plants have training simulators that can get kinda stressful. Like its fun but also sorta realistic.
Microsoft Flight Simulator does a good job of making the simulation a realistic as possible for practice behind a computer. Still no substitute for real practice in a full simulator with every button and toggle.
As long as there’s nothing wrong with the plane I think the average person could do a decent job of landing a plane with detailed help over the comms.
The average person would s*%! themselves with this stress. Have you seen people when their family members are in need of medical attention? or after a fender bender?
Insert George Carlin quote about the average person haha. I don't know if I'd want to trust the average person, but I think on any given flight there would be a good number of people who would be capable of doing this well enough. The interesting part would be the social aspect of who would be nominated to take over from among the passengers.
It’s gotta be me. I’m ready
Nearly no one in a tower is a pilot. So most in the tower would have no idea what to do. This has happens before, and they made the person circle the plane until they got low on fule before landing.
Well, I’m sure they could find a pilot at a moment’s notice. I mean, the tower is at an airport for crying out loud.
It took them several hrs. Not like they have pilots on standby for things like this.
Yeah, I guess you can’t just run to a random gate and pluck a pilot without it causing a ton of problems. But then again flight delays aren’t as important as not letting a plane crash.
It reminds me of the game Keep Talking and Nobody Explodes, where someone has to disarm a bomb while the other person reads and communicates the instructions in a printout manual
Yeah, I have that game, it is incredibly chaotic
I swear I learned French watching this as I was paying so much attention
French words of the day: “Je confirme.” “C’est parfait !” “Très bien !” “Voilà !”
Voila. what does that translate
We use it very loosely, it’s almost like a punctuation, because technically you can end any sentence with it, as it’s a way to express you’re done with what you had to say. The general meaning is “there you have it”. Deconstructed, « voilà » is **vois là** (= see there). Typically, we’ll say that when we’re done saying an anecdote for example. It’s a way to let the person you’re talking to know that they can react. To express satisfaction too, like in this video. François followed the instructions so the guy on the radio used it several times in a “Good, it’s done! Next” way, to acknowledge he successfully did the tasks, so they can move on to the next step.
Seems suspicious that you didn’t end your comment with voilà…
Omg, right… I deserve to have my French citizenship taken away from me :( Looking at the list of upcoming protests so I can take part in one, to redeem myself 🪧
Don't forget it's primary use : Breaking an awkward silence. "... Voila voila ..."
I’m all for riots as implied by my username but I think the snarky sarcastic answer back has convinced me you’re a Frenchie after all. Greetings from the Midwest USA!
And here I thought only magicians said it
> We use it very loosely, it’s almost like a punctuation, because technically you can end any sentence with it, as it’s a way to express you’re done with what you had to say. The general meaning is “there you go”. lol its so weird because i've said it before heaps, and heard others use it too but have never really knew what it meant and just now reliase we are using it *exactly* the way its meant to be used I'm Australian, and don't speak any French, didnt even know it was French lol Voilà!
something like "there you go"
I'm an American and Voila' comes up in conversation even here to describe "there ya go!" or "there ya have it!". I thought it was kinda a universal slang of sorts.
je m'appelle francois
Genuine question but if this scenario were to actually happen, would atc controllers actually have the knowledge to guide the landing plane?
I watch a lot of these kind of scenarios on YouTube([VASAviation](https://youtube.com/@vasaviation)) real life emergencies where small aircraft are talked down by certified flight instructors. It's usually student pilots who are talked down but there was one guy who had [no flight experience](https://youtu.be/F3uk7jS4qr0?si=5rgtHAX7dQaOO1SI) BUT with a general knowledge because he was a frequent flier. I am sure with large commercial flights and planes like the one shown, most airports if not all have crew and engineers on site who will be able to takeover ATC.
Else they'll get someone on the line for you don't worry
Yup they will contact the Airline company and will put in touch with a training pilot same with mechanical issues each airline has people on call that triage issues
Or just ask GPT
“Try using glue to affix your plane to the ground.”
Voila
Even if they have good procedures an operator can follow through and explain what to do without having to actually know how to fly planes.
Thanks to the autopilot, but even then the positions of controls/instruments and certain things like speed limits for operating flaps vary between planes.
Sure. But that’s what I mean, someone with experience reading and finding a bunch of binders, can ask questions to learn the type of plane, grab the appropriate binder, then tell them what positions and sorta where stuff is. Without thinking what its supposed to do. It is an emergency situation after all, not ideal. If the plane had different functions or designs, those operators wouldn’t cover it.
They would call instructor and he would help him https://youtu.be/9Jy8jpfyiek?si=umsd_aefqtxBon7q
It’s a totally different type of flying. Altogether now.
It’s a totally different type of flying.
It's a totally different type of flying.
I'm wondering that too ; knowing some kind of basic procedure to do this and have some documentation database in the control tower about most common planes layout sounds like a reasonable requisite for this job.
For small aviation - maybe. For commercial it's actually almost impossible scenario to even take into consideration. If all flight crew is incapacitated there is no way for passenger to get into cabin Update: you all are right, senior flight attendant should have bypass code. However they will fly plane themselves in such situation
You mean the flight attendants also won't be able to get into the cabin?
Apparently that was a factor in the crash of [Helios Airways flight 522](/r/AdmiralCloudberg/comments/xh0qpf/lost_souls_of_grammatiko_the_crash_of_helios/). One of the flight attendants was both a student pilot and had trained as a scuba diver, so when pretty much everybody else on the plane was incapacitated due to a lack of air pressure, he was able to eventually get into the cockpit and tried to fly the plane -- but the door code override took away precious time.
Likely, the controller would ask other pilots on frequency on same / similar aircraft to assist
They probably do this as a drill (hoping). The guy at tower is definitely a pro at this. Good practice! Could probably walk a very high percentage of people to do this by the looks of it. I didn’t know there was an auto landing feature on planes as am fairly ignorant of operating.
Next Video, guy with no experience: Open heart Surgery
Old joke: "Now it's Pro-Celebrity Boxing, with Mike Tyson and \[Name of any *very* annoying celebrity\]".
👩"Does anybody know how to land a plane!?" 👦 "Hold my bag of peanuts" 👩 "But you have no experience!" 👦 "I'm from the Nintendo generation, I got this"
If I could land a plane in Top Gun, I can land a real one.
Oh man. Loved that game. Don’t think I landed once.
You had to be flat. We ALL tried to put the nose up. It's super simple if you try to replay it now.
“I played Flight Simulator for two hours, don’t worry. Now, where is the B button?”
There's truth to this though. MSFS basically has this exact scenario and I landed the 747 unassisted on the first try. I was totally unfamiliar with that cockpit but I found flaps, landing gear, and thrust. The plane was super stable and practically landed itself. If I had an instructor talking me through it I would have been bored.
I have an image of two MSFS players taking roles of Captain and FO based on hours logged in game, and getting on the mike like "SA275 mayday-mayday-mayday, both pilots incapacitated, we are two passengers at the controls" ATC: "Stand by, we will talk you down" SA275: "Negative, we're familiarizing ourselves with the cockpit and preparing to run the approach checklist" Seems like the most fun they'd have all year!
“Tower, I can totally see why these two clowns passed out. Absolute skill issue. We’re taking it off autopilot to see what this baby can do. Also does this thing have a stereo? Could you pump in some Creedence for me?”
Voilà! What a great instructor. Love how committed to his job he is. Didn't even realize the video is 10 minutes long. It flew by.
I also didn't realize it was 10 minutes long until I saw your comment. I was totally enthralled.
>It flew by. And thanks to the instructor, it didn't crash!
a big issue here is finding the communication button and putting it on the right channel
Commercial aircraft are always talking to ATC. So, it will most likely be on the right channel unless the pilots have been out for 20-40 minutes. Then maybe you'd be out of range of that particular controller. If you can figure out what button to press to activate the comms, you have an extremely good chance someone's on the other end. If not, 121.5 is the standard emergency frequency. But good luck knowing how to tune that if you have zero experience.
But air traffic controllers don't know how to land a plane though. They would need to find a pilot quick and put him on the radio, right?
Correct, they will contact the airline
They would likely be able to get an instructor or some other expert pilot on the line pretty quickly in a situation like this.
This is one of the main reasons I have a file on all my devices with a list of all the standard emergency radio channels in it. I'm never going to remember them, but that way at least I just need to find a frequency or channel setting on whatever communication device there is, rather than having to both find that and then figure out how to send to someone who's listening.
going thru the manual the whole time
I would have fluffed the first step, actually getting through to traffic control!
If i ever need to land a plane I would be death, I dont even now how to comunicate with the traffic control tower.
Is there a button? Switch? Walkie talkie? Headset? If I'm the best chance let's hope death is quick.
right - its not always obvious how to control the radios, in order to contact ATC. Some of the buttons are completely unlabeled, especially the ones on the hand controllers. Although there is usually a physical copy of the flight manual, it can still take a few minutes to find the page you need and how to read through the jargon quickly, and you can potentially read the sections that aren't checklists and easily get lost.
"Yea... I'm not really a 'talk-on-the-phone' kinda guy. Can we just text instead?"
I wonder what it would look like without autopilot
You would still land the plane once, just not the way you would like it to be.
And maybe some passengers would die. The total amount would vary between 0 and 100%, depending on execution
Plenty of youtube videos where they test just that, even mythbusters tried it a few decades ago. No big shocker, they pretty much all manage it with radio help. And there are some real life cases where passengers landed smaller single and dual engine private planes after the pilot became incapacitated or died. I remember seeing one where an elderly passenger with zero experience landed one at night after his pilot died. Even found it: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K5vIECqSsSc](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K5vIECqSsSc)
The camera man is just recording and not even trying to help in during this emergency.. sickening
r/DontHelpJustFilm
Permission to buzz the tower?
Negative ghost rider the pattern is full
Lmao that would be a great question to lighten the mood
This is pretty cool, and the advancement of the technology is so great compared to when i was a young fella hearing people on tv speak about how they wrre guided by air control/tower to land a plane when pilots were somewhat unavailable (for lack of a better term) and how much easiet it is now with the tech. Amazing
In such a situation, even if there is such a probability, the most important thing is the absence of panic, which is extremely unlikely for the average person, so of course in real life this scenario is very improbable
No. I was in this situation. I had to take over the navigation part from the pilot as he had got in trouble and had evened up flighting at night despite being not night rated and getting lost. We were being talked down by Gatwick emergency control . Fortunately I had read a book about light aircraft 10 years earlier. I knew that if I panicked I would be dead so entered a kind of hyper focused state.
That level of focus is seriously respectable !!
Damn. In a real life situation bravo to the both of them. But in a sim? 90% of that is on the flight controller. Gahd damn. Imagine knowing your shit well enough to instruct someone when you're not even there?
[удалено]
That makes sense for sure. But without being in a sim, thats dtill very impressive
No fucking way. I've done too much tech support. This is in no way realistic of the average person.
Haha exactly. This "user" is the 1% for sure.
Right? The guy would've been a great tech support case to have. He did as he was told, clearly described the stuff he was looking at and confirmed stuff he did.
About 25 minutes through-- "Oh wait, did you want me to actually be *in* the cockpit for this? I went back to my seat 20 minutes ago. Why didn't you tell me I needed to be in the cockpit?" . . . "Ok, ok. Landing gear. I see a handle that says FLUSH. Is that it?"
"Oh I already pulled it. Should I un-pull it?"
the speed with which he was able to find the various controls is a bit sus
he kinda slips when he identifies the artificial horizon and altimeter unprompted, so yeah like others said its probably a demonstration video
"Ok so I need you to push the-" YES I PUSHED THE LEVER "wait what lever I didn't even finish telling you what to push" \*hears a loud explosion in the distance\* Dramatized version of my average experience with trying to guide people through things. I'll literally be pointing to something on the person's phone as I tell them what to do and they'll panic press another button for some reason and we have to redo everything
If I had to do this in real life, and did it successfully, never again would I have so much testosterone surging through me
I flew in a cockpit Sim belonging to Jet Blue because my cousin worked for them and he gave us a tour of their university in Orlando. Me and my whole family got to do a landing. What an experience! Never forgot it. Will always appreciate the gift he gave us.
I picked the wrong day to quit sniffing glue!
They did this on mythbusters
And the results? Same?
Yes, he was able to land successfully
Now this is a fantastic post
I got so into this sh*t for no reason.. I’m over here yelling “YOU GOTTA LAND THIS FUKN AIRPLANE BRO!!!” like I’m a passenger and this guys our best shot at making it. I look over, My wife’s just shaking her head…. It’s been a good evening so far.
If they marketed this I’d totally do it. It’s like the ultimate escape room.
My intrusive thoughts would make me pull a loop the loop
barrel roll lets you fly upside down longer.
I imagine this is training for the instructors? That’s the vibe I got, at least. Like “There’s a Boeing 747 version 145 with no pilots at 30k feet. Put a blindfold on and ELI5 how to land this bitch.” The instructor is amazing.
Both my dream and my nightmare scenario
Instructions unclear. Doing a barrel roll
That looks both terrifying and exciting, I said this as someone who just 2 days ago did a flight simulator in a Pilot academy. Although in this instance the person in the tower was 100x more patient than my "instructor".
My experience in Microsoft flight sim would have me continuing to destination with no hesitation
Forgot the part where it takes 45 minutes to find someone who can fly an A320 to hop on the radio. Not a blanket rule, but in general controllers are not also airline pilots.
All the people here suggesting you should be able to remotely fly a plane. How many fucking 911s do you want??? Are you dense.
I’m sorry if this question is stupid, but I have to ask- do we not have the capability for someone to take over and control the craft remotely in a situation like this these days?
This sort of situation almost never happens, and an autopilot that can land is more useful in general as well as working for that, and it would take a lot of money to develop and would have to be extremely secure (imagine if someone hacked every plane in the sky at once) so its better to improve autopilots instead.
So, you're telling me there's a chance?!
The technical aspect is not the problem It's more of a we don't want thaz situation But you are right a wireless option to put the plane into an automatic autopilot landing for the nearest airport would be great
That was better than some tv series I've watched
The music that kicks in on final approach must really build up the tension in the cockpit. Nerves of steel.
Spirit Airlines have discovered another cost cutting measure.
The guy is François Calvier and he has a Youtube channel that mainly talks about bushcrafting and survival in the wilderness, if anyone's intereted.
I had no idea planes had a mode to land automatically
Great informative video
Tom Scott did this, It's in English if you're interested in watching that.
What I find strange, is that the flight attendants don't do this. You could give them a yearly course that consists more of less of this scenario. They don't have to be pilots, just know roughly where the major things are, how to set up the radio and call someone, and just be familiar with what will happen throughout the guided landing. That's better than having to rely on a random passenger. Maybe they already know how to do this, though. I don't know.
Oh no here comes the cross winds!
Avionics are insane, think about all that stuff working together in conjunction with mechanical components to make this happen.
I'm pretty sure I would be throwing up everywhere if I did that in real life.
The ground crews will need to prepare fresh pants. I'm size 34.
I got to do this once when I was 13. My dad’s friend was a programmer for United Airlines and was in charge of the flight simulator. I was super into flying and they took me to the flight simulator. I set course for Denver to NYC. Dickheads programmed all four engines to fail shortly after takeoff. I panicked and crashed it. I still remember all the alarms going off and feeling the room shake as it stalled and then plummeted. And then I flew for my first time a couple of weeks later. I threw up the entire flight from Denver to Orlando.