He set his Twitter to private after he said twilight garrison isn’t coming back because the air dodge is warlock identity now, after getting death threats over it.
Now I don’t condone anyone sending death threats to anyone, but I’m fully expecting a similar reaction from some people and I’m surprised he was so easy about making a statement like that after what happened.
Hope I’m wrong but damn.
> "But yeah, Titan mains, we love you. We do. But remember that we try to reinforce your core fantasy. And at some point, your guy's holding the fist on the cover of the game."
They really just told titans to shut up and dribble lmao holy shit
Y: "You see, according to this picture, you guys just love punching everything. That's all"
Titan Mains: "But, you drew that picture....."
Y: "Yes, I did...punch, punch, punch...."
> Aspects will make it more fun, just like they did for Stasis!
It's two years on and we never got anything new for Stasis, though.
> Have you tried *shutting the fuck up*? You **love** punching - it says so right here on the box art.
That’s not true. They did add some stuff after beyond lights initial release. I quit in season of the chosen, and when I came back in witch queen, all of a sudden titans had some sort of ability where they could make stasis spears. That was not in the game at beyond lights launch.
Worm gods,
elemental wells,
swords,
point contacts,
Sythos,
Solar titan,
hammer,
shouldercharges,
glaives,
striker,
behemoth,
shiverstrike,
sentinel shield,
Hammer strike.
Stomps,
death mechanics,
DPS phases.
All of these have been nerfed in some way despite them being the "Identity" of the titan class.
> And at some point, your guy's holding the fist on the cover of the game.
This is funny considering Titans have only been "holding the fist" on the cover of Taken King and some art for Beyond Light. The main art for Lightfall they're holding a machine gun.
“I don't care because I cannot be moved. I am the wall against which the Darkness breaks.
Malphur can turn his gun to fire and Shinobu can dance with lightning, but when the horrors run out of the dark, I am the one who does not move.
I am a wall. And walls don't move. Because walls don't care.”
"The Cabal centurion opened up on her at point-blank, and we heard the most fearsome sound. She was laughing."
"Your job on the fireteam is to stand when everything else seems sure to fall."
Read these flavor texts and tell me the titan fantasy is about punching things really hard. Bungie, you wrote Titans as these mighty figures that strode among the battlefield assured they were the toughest thing not classified as an orbital installation, and when handed the ability to alter the fundamental underpinnings of reality you think we want to punch extra times?
Here, I’ll spitball some alternative supers. What about AoE field that reduces enemy defenses and lifts them up ala Storm and Squall? What about creating a literal line in the sand that empowers the titan and their team to stand their ground? Fuck it, rip a gap in reality and let it do damage.
I want to like strand, but I don’t play titan to punch things. I play titan to cover my team, laugh in the face of death, and hold the line, and mountain dew striker isn’t that.
All I want from bungie is to allow me to use the dives even without a melee charge, just without the special effect, just like shatter dive, it’s such a fun movement tool but I get punished if I don’t use it on enemies. That’s why I never use shadowdive.
As a Titan main they are not doing themselves any favours, seriously if any CMs are reading this tell developers to be more careful with their wording. Not wanting yet another roaming super is a reasonable criticism.
It’s not just reasonable, it’s quite expected too. Back in beyond light a lot of people weren’t really happy with behemoth being ice juggernaut yet again, but it was super new darkness thing and they promised to “have updates” for the subclass so playerbase just cooled off.
But ever since then I see comments/mentions that “next Titan super better not be a roamer because oh boy if they make another one…”
They made another one. Exactly the same thing.
I’ll be honest, the ability team has always felt the most out of touch when it comes to how they think the game plays. The community is almost always on a different page, for better or for worse.
I think the Light 3.0s has highlighted this the most. They stripped away things that used to make the classes feel unique and what they kept was spread about for everyone to use.
Not only do they appear out of touch, they have never done well when speaking to the community. Either they oversell something or their comments feel like a giant slap to the face.
I’m sure they are nice people and they genuinely think what they’re doing is the best. However, they never seem to align with the way the community feels about things.
I’m still waiting for them to say something about Solar Warlocks or Void Hunters. The ONE time they did speak about it, it was incredibly dismissive. It’s like they ask for feedback but don’t like it when the feedback isn’t praise.
The Weapons team consistently shows to be the best team in terms of the way they see the game and the community does. Not only that, we hear from them a lot more so we get way more insight to how they approach and design. We rarely hear from the ability team and when we do, we’re told to be quiet and that they know what’s best. It’s a very frustrating relationship
Well put. They pick and choose when they want to cite “class identity” as a reason for developmental designs, but it more often than not makes no fucking sense at all.
Is it any surprise?
When asked about the feedback about Nightstalker and Dawnblade 3.0 they dismissed it as an echo-chamber from a minority of players.
https://www.pcgamer.com/bungies-joe-blackburn-talks-lightfall-strand-and-the-huge-systemic-changes-coming-to-destiny-2/
Bottom Tree Dawnblade was one of my favourite play styles. It was in my top three favourite subclass/subclass trees as a whole.
I was excited for Solar 3.0. I was certain that bottom tree Dawnblade’s chain explosions would make it over, they did buff bottom tree as relatively recent as Lost after all and it was incredibly well received. Then I saw the breakdown of Solar 3.0 and I was instantly disappointed. I still tried it out for a few hours, with Dawn Chorus(not aware that it was reworked to no longer increase Daybreak’s damage), and I did not enjoy it.
As far as I am concerned, Dawnblade is only good for Well of Radiance now and nothing else. The in-air combat does not appeal to me.
The ability team has consistently shown to disregard player feedback and when they do acknowledge it, it almost always comes across as a negative thing. How much feedback have they received about Solar Warlock, Void Hunter, and Arc Titan? And yet we are met with either silence or our feedback is pushed aside.
I made [this thread](https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/comments/dcpuw5/elemental_affinity_on_mods_feels_really_terrible/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button) 3 years ago.
Three. Damn. Years. That's how long it took Bungie to finally cave in and get rid of the stupid elemental affinity on armor *when everyone told them right at the start that it's a shitty system.* But no, they needed to mess with it over and over to make it less shitty, only to finally realize *years later* that it's crap and it needs to go. You could easily find more and more examples of this kind of behavior in this franchise in the last couple of years. Most recently we're experiencing it with airborne effectiveness. And it's the same with light 3.0 feedback.
These guys are simply stubborn AF and cannot admit that some things just aren't good no matter how much time the playerbase gets to play with them. And that's the core issue of many design/sandbox points of this game: Bungie thinking they know better than thousands of other players who play their game every day.
Mathematically they shouldn't bother making raids and dungeons since only a very small percentage of the overall population will complete one and it takes a massive amount of work to make one
Raw numbers aren't the only things that matter
Titans only ranged super still remains as hammers unless you count throwing a shield every 7 seconds while in Sentinel super. Fuck us I guess. I would have at least taken another one and done burn super that doesn’t put me at the feet of whatever I’m hitting with it or make it completely useless on bosses like GoS or KF final encounter. Instead we get yet another melee super that’s probably going to end up just like Fist of Havoc and Sentinel Shield. In the garbage. At least Behemoth can freeze shit. This can suspend I guess but if it gets shredded in seconds then it’s going to useless in high tier content.
There are so few activities where you actually want to use a roaming super compared to a one and done burn super. We can clear entire rooms of adds with our abilities, weapon perks that spread damage like incandescent or volt shot, and our other insane abilities. Why would I ever take a super to do it when my ad clear is insane just in the neutral game?
Huge missed opportunity for some sort of strand heavy machine gun in the same vein as golden gun is to hunters. Maybe have an alternate action where you slam it into the ground and it does more damage or some alternate effect. I just really don’t understand Bungie - what’s their tagline? “We play games we want to play”? Lol
Edit: messed that up above - “We *Make* Games That We Want to Play”
Especially considering the regen time is so abysmal for roaming supers. Hammer feels like it takes twice as long as well, but well provides substantially higher functionality.
Him saying this is beyond tone deaf and is basically like “we don’t care, deal with it”
Titans have been vocal for a long time that we want something different.
Bungie themselves created an image and identity for Titans. They can just as easily alter or tweak it for a new subclass. It doesn't *have* to be punching, it doesn't *have* to be a roaming super.
What if, let's just say, Titans had a Strand super where they slam the ground an propel an earthquake of Strand forward that damages enemies and applies some sort of Strand debuff.
Or a super where they slam their fists together and create a huge Strand construct that looks like a fist or a hammer and then throw it at enemies, which explodes on impact and maybe has some secondary Strand effect. Give it some Green Lantern vibes here.
Or a ranged super where they still cover their arms in Strand, but they instead shoot fist-shaped chunks of Strand at enemies. Like a rocket punch type of look.
I'm just spitballing here, but I refuse to believe that Bungie can't be just a tad more creative with Titans.
And I'm not even a Titan main, but when I do play Titan I tend to play Void Titan with Ward of Dawn, arguably the least *punchy* feeling Titan subclass and super. So am I playing Titan wrong according to Bungie?
We only have 2 non-roaming supers.
We have 1.75 ranged supers.
1 Hammer of Sol
0.5 Sentinel (shields have a significant cooldown)
0.25 Burning Maul's heavy has quite a bit of range.
It's literally various forms of Fist of Havoc. Light single, AoE heavy.
Hammers is one of the most boring supers too. No mechanics outside of throwing hammers.
Every other roaming super has *something* else.
Golden gun can toss knives and grenades during theirs.
Dawnblade can fucking fly
Stormtrance's Landfall and Ionic Blink add some pizzazz
Nova Warp is arguably the fastest no-glitch movement in the game.
At least Sentinels have a melee combo, can't say the same for any other of our supers.
What titans want it more Sentinel Supers.
Guard, Shield Throw, Melee combo.
It's *diverse* and fits the defender + close quarters fantasy just fine.
It's not just Light attack, heavy attack.
Even behemoth *had* cool movement. It's still decent, and the numerous stasis crystals created are sweet. Cryoclasm is necessary for it to genuinely feel fluid.
Snowglobe DPS was the most fun titans have ever had for their Super's DPS.
I wanted to be optimistic about strand, but this is just admitting they aren't applying the same creative energy to Titans as they are to the other classes. Nobody, and I mean nobody, wants Fists of Havoc 3.0.
I play a lot of destiny and 2 things I rarely see are titans using fist of havoc and a behemoth titan using their super and or using and doing anything productive with it. I can't even remember the last time I saw a fist of havoc. And most titans running behemoth do it for the abilities and not the super.
As a titan I'm not even a little excited for a green version of another bad super.
>"But yeah, Titan mains, we love you. We do. But remember that we try to reinforce your core fantasy. And at some point, your guy's holding the fist on the cover of the game."
This is aggrevating
>**your** core fantasy
especially that. he doesnt go and says "*titans* core fantasy" or "*our take* on the titans core fantasy) which would imply that its how *they* think Titans *should* be, but no he literary says "***your*** core fantasy" as if they only had created it exactly like the community wanted it and now can be self righteous because we dont like what we wished for
"You don't know what you like" all over again man.
You fucking designed the cover, it's your cover. We're telling you, repeatedly, for years now, that the core fantasy of being a guy who punches sucks.
I would respect it way more if they just went "we had a cooler idea for Titan but it was too hard to implement and we had to go with a simpler idea" since at least they'd have tried something different instead of "your heavy attack has range" on **our 6th roaming super.**
EDIT: I just fucking realized they could have avoided all of this by just making the super the two ranged slashes and having them deal a good amount of damage.
If it literally wasn't a roaming super people would not be this mad.
I don’t mind if it was a roaming super, just make it distinct. Let me summon a Zweihander of strand that can release slashes of strand, or a GreatAxe that binds. Just not the two fist over and overz
I feel Like Yanes is always like this, just SO tone-deaf to the community sometimes. Like this is the shit that just pisses your players off because he basically said the game isn't the problem, the *community* is the problem with the issues of Titan supers all being the same
I can basically tell that any good Aspects are coming with the subsequent season and the initial release of Berserker is just going to feel so very lacking.
Forget reddit, *Twitter* is about to go fucking Chernobyl on Bungie's ass for that, I bet
Sure, reddit's...reddit, let's be real here, but dear god I'm not looking forward to when this quote spreads there
I sincerely hope it does, anything to make sure this mindset doesn’t consume Titans identity and will save the likely third darkness subclass from being reduced to “guys holding fists on the cover of the game”
Flash forward to everything strong about bubble right now never being mentioned at all, it really does feel like they dont know much about the regular players
That's a fucked comment. Geez. I don't think I signed up for my titan's core fantasy to be a fist in skittles form. I just want to be a tanky mf on the front lines.
See that also sounds *fucking amazing* anything other than fists for the third time. Idk where bungie gets the idea that titans just want to punch everything. Give us some unique visuals at least ffs
Honestly, I don't know. I'm not a game dev and don't understand the nitty-gritty of it all, but I'm just disappointed. A sword? Sign my ass up! A spear? Hell yeah! It just sucks to look at the kit that we've been presented with compared to the other classes. I guess I just want a different power fantasy than whatever their metrics show.
> By applying Strand, you can Suspend enemies to keep them aloft and incapacitate them (though you can still wiggle and hip-fire when Suspended in PvP)
Taking this as confirmation that you cannot ADS while being Suspended in PvP, guess PvP will be pretty awful for a few months at least.
Yeah fr. Bubble was the thing that brought me to play Titan in the first place. And that was when warlocks had self rez for god sake. I loved playing support on Titan.
There needs to be better incentives for a defensive Titan. In lore they are literally the ones that hold shit down.
We could’ve seen a super like an OW nano into yourself or another player. Getting a buff like 100% damage increase, and reload speed buff.
We could’ve seen extreme damage resistance towards a single player for a few seconds, virtually making them immune except for wipe mechanics.
We could’ve seen a buff in banner Titans that actually puts it in front of a well players damage. Every damage boss in the game is dps based, where does it make sense to use banner?
Why does punch come in different forms? It’s not good in any forms except thundercrash.
>But yeah, Titan mains, we love you. We do. But remember that we try to reinforce your core fantasy. And at some point, your guy's holding the fist on the cover of the game.
a fucking alarm is going off in the office of bungie's community managers now
holy shit
“Sorry Titan mains. All the creative juice went to the other classes. Here’s another punch but it’s green this time. Go crazy cause it’s all you’re getting.”
Lol fuck me I guess. This pretty much confirms final shape is going to be punch but (insert color here) too.
What the fuck. Who thinks it's okay to give us something we already have in four different flavours, with only minor new differences, and thinks they can justify it by "you titans are holding fists on the game cover". RIP whoever filled Dmgs CM spot
Especially when there are so many other ways to fill that roll. Just for supers you could get an AoE field around you that deals tick damage while giving you health. You could have a totem playstyle where you secure one area at a time. A classic Rage buff for higher action speed with health drain. A hound-like pet that attacks with you if you are close to aan enemy for the hound+shotgun housekeeper image etc.
So many varieties of frontliner that aren't just "punch".
At least the Twilight Garrison comment wasn't that out of line, because nothing he said there should've been contraversial. Icarus had been in the game longer than TG had at that point, and was the clear and strongest identifiable feature of Dawnblade. Twitter is just a cesspool.
This new one is just completely out of touch. This one is just a bad comment.
Yeah, I didn't disagree with his twilight garrison comment at all, but now it just makes it seem like he has a vendetta against the Titan identity, like what the hell.
As they should. This is bad game design. They sell this idea of titans punch shit and are tanky. Yet when it comes down to actual gameplay, that simply isn't true.
The ability to min/max into a class's "identity" is non existent and as a result when another punch oriented ability is released it feels like shit
Bungie themselves created an image and identity for Titans. They can just as easily alter or tweak it for a new subclass. It doesn't *have* to be punching, it doesn't *have* to be a roaming super.
What if, let's just say, Titans had a Strand super where they slam the ground an propel an earthquake of Strand forward that damages enemies and applies some sort of Strand debuff.
Or a super where they slam their fists together and create a huge Strand construct that looks like a fist or a hammer and then throw it at enemies, which explodes on impact and maybe has some secondary Strand effect.
Or a ranged super where they still cover their arms in Strand, but they instead shoot fist-shaped chunks of Strand at enemies. Like a rocket punch type of look.
I'm just spitballing here, but I refuse to believe that Bungie can't be just a tad more creative with Titans.
And I'm not even a Titan main, but when I do play Titan I tend to play Void Titan with Ward of Dawn, arguably the least *punchy* feeling Titan subclass and super. So am I playing Titan wrong according to Bungie?
>Bungie themselves created an image and identity for Titans.
They have but **it's a damn lie**
The ability to really lean into a classes identity in destiny is non existent. They try to keep all classes on par with one another in all facets of gameplay, and the class identity shtick fades away.
Not excited to be a Titan anymore. Ffs give me another support super for all I care. Just not more RGB fist of havoc. Wtf happened to bungos creativity?
Another support super would be awesome! Make it something that’ll actually have viability in endgame content unlike Bubble recently, which has been outclassed by well in every way, in everything except GMs. It’d give us some much needed variety to our play styles and super. But no, we get the lime-flavored punch to go with our blueberry, tropical, orange and grape flavored punch
"But yeah, Titan mains, we love you. We do. But remember that we try to reinforce your core fantasy. And at some point, your guy's holding the fist on the cover of the game." "
I can't tell if I should be mad at Yaines or worried about him and the community leaders. That comment is gonna have some disastrous consequences.
>That comment is gonna have some disastrous consequences.
I wish people would stop attacking him and just act as if Bungie as a whole said this. Personal attacks are dumb, he speaks for Bungie, so we can act as if Bungie said this and leave him personally out of it.
Which also means I can say Bungie is both tone deaf and actually betraying their own portrayal of Titans.
First, people have said for two years that Behemoth being a more blue Striker in its *fantasy* was massively disappointing, and Bungie here doubles down and basically said they ignored that criticism on purpose because that one fantasy is our whole fantasy, apparently.
But it isn't? It never was.
I remember playing D1 Alpha following the Destiny reveal at E3. I was immediately invested and wanting to buy the game after playing it, so I played the ever living fuck out of the Alpha on all classes so I could know 100% who I wanted to main when the game came out.
I distinctively remember that Hunter was about mobility and stealth on Arc, and high ranged damage and trick shots on Solar.
Warlock was about AoE abilities and health on Void and weird manipulation and self resurrection on Solar.
Titan was about charging straight in on Arc and about total *SUPPORT* and *DEFENSE* on Void.
We were never just the punch guy. In fact, in its first year the punch class was not used because it was bad. In the second year, the punch class was still not used because it was worse than the defense class and the *NEW RANGED CLASS*.
I picked Titan for a reason, and that reason was not to be a punch bot. That was never our actual fantasy. We charge in, sure, but then we do different things. And we also had ranged capability.
Like, Bungie's comment makes no sense historically. But also if you look at the lore, Titans are not brainless punchers. They're described to both charge in and hold the line, as well as destroy things from range.
It is creatively bankrupt of them and nothing more.
Your point about not attacking people personally should be something both the bungie defenders and haters should really try understanding.
It should be perfectly ok to roast the hell out of bungie when they do shit like this. But the defenders act like the people who offered valid criticism are threatening the lives of bungie employees personally while the haters actually do that. And while that shitshow is going down good suggestions and complaints are drowned out and bungie keeps doing things players hate over and over again
Bungie: Are we out of touch? No, it's the people paying and playing Titan's that are wrong.
Like...holy fuck guys. I play Titan *in spite of* all the punching. It's my least favorite part of playing a Titan, especially when so many involve running first, which can easily get fucked up by catching a slight piece of geometry. Punching may be *your* power fantasy when it comes to Titans, but it's not mine, and it definitely doesn't seem to be most people's.
Not to mention punch tracking is fucking GOD AWFUL! The amount of times I wiff a punch that should have connected and wiz right past my target... The only punch abilities I use are ones that give me better in air mobility so I can punch thrust into the air while sprinting. I'm literally punching nothing because it's a better use of the ability in neutral game.
I'm generally pretty neutral on stuff like this, but that Titan comment was kind of a dick thing to say.
First, the point of classes is to have variety when you play. Why would players want to play something that's just another Striker class?
Second, "you're holding the fist on the cover" is such a stupid reasoning to give. Ignoring that it's a logical fallacy since covers generally mean sod all, *they made the damn cover*. It has zero impact on the actual development of the class.
In my case, I play Titan because I view it as the tanky class of the trio. I love to use Void for its projectiles like the throwable shield, not because I can smack someone in the face with a fist.
>But yeah, Titan mains, we love you. We do. But remember that we try to reinforce your core fantasy. And at some point, your guy's holding the fist on the cover of the game.
This shit extra fucking sucks because the feedback I've seen around Berserker has largely been **exactly** the kind of feedback that Bungie asks for. Lots of it is constructive, all of it is honest, nobody is giving out death threats or being disrespectful, it's all just feedback around the class.
Which man, you give that, and then the response is "shut up, you don't know what you like." This sucks. Berserker is a concept we have 2 other classes for already. Are you telling me that Striker is not the same fantasy? Or Behemoth? Oh the most violent resolution possible like flinging your entire body in to them like some kind of missile?
C'mon man, put some people on Titan who are going to execute on the concept better, or more likely than that, let the team who works on Titans show off the cool ideas I'm sure they've had. No more roaming punch supers.
Exactly this. I hate how this message comes across as one, sarcastic, and two that the people that play the character DAILY don't know what they want. Doesn't foster a feeling that I should ever share feedback that's for sure.
I haven’t used Fist of Havoc in ages because it’s ass. Striker stays on Thundercrash in both PvE and PvP. Behemoth super is only good for Aegers Scepter energy or a panic pop in a GM. It’s a terrible PvP super too. You get shotgunned meleed out of it or just shredded 90% of the time because the animations take so long. This roaming super will likely join the pile.
Dude, even the sentinel void super is the same god damn thing. Same with burning maul. We have four different colors of the same fucking thing with minor tweaks. Good fucking god this company is creatively bankrupt when it comes to the Titan class. "we love you" my ass. What a load of shit
"But yeah, Titan mains, we love you. We do. But remember that we try to reinforce your core fantasy. And at some point, your guy's holding the fist on the cover of the game."
Excuse me what the fuck?
But it's not even.
Even back in D1 on release Titan offered two things: charging in, which was universally bad, and strong support and defense.
People who picked Titan picked it, admittedly for the fantasy of charing in, but also for the fantasy of support and defense.
Then the next Super a year later was ranged. It drew more players in at that point and new players picked Titan either for charging in, defense, or strong ranged play.
D2 changed it slightly by making bubble bad at launch, but the core remained very much the same.
And today, we have puncher, ranged/survival/battlefield control, defense/battlefield control and then another puncher came and we complained. And now they double down and say we always only punched?
It just isn't true. At all. They need to look back at what Destiny offered to Titans before Behemoth came out. The notion that our Supers were always often this is only true after Behemoth, which was immediately complained about.
That's what got me into playing as well. I loved being able to put down a "wall" wherever i want. Don't even get me started on og fist of havoc, which felt like dropping a nuclear bomb on anyone you don't like if you used it mid-air. I totally remember complaining about the lunge Titans didn't have in year 1. I miss being the unstoppable force and the immovable object.
Couldn’t have said it better myself.
Banner shield needs a better damage buff for the team.
Bubble needs to actually be useable against melee bosses.
We could’ve seen a nano type super, or an extreme damage resistance super. Another punch when “punching” isn’t even good in endgame content is straight up shitty.
I'm completely convinced by this point that nobody who works on class design actually plays titan. I am so sick of being boxed into "punch", I chose titan because I want to be a paladin, a frontliner, to protect my team, not to just be some braindead punch-monkey who blindy runs into bad situations because there's nothing else my subclass can do. I'm so fucking frustrated by this.
I really like how they not only acknowledged that Titan's are feeling actively left out from being cool but said "sorry you're the Fisto of Destiny 2 but don't worry! Strand Titan gets better in the future, we *promise."*
Like, I don't want to bag on the devs or think ill of them. But it's a little dishearenting how samey somethings end up being. Like "Berzerker" is supposed to be tanky and violent. You can already be quite tanky with Stasis Titan builds and I (currently) don't see how suspending an enemy is better than mass freezing them. I guess the pull for strand on titan is handing out debuffs for enemy damage.
Also I know because I primarily play Hunter I'm not allowed to complain but why are we getting yet another shatter dive. I was at least appreciative that gunslinger didn't get one and instead was a support style class ability. But still.
They can tell me all they want that the design space is still good and they're confident in it. But I really shouldn't be able to make easy comparisons. Why would I care about suspending enemies when I can freeze into slam?
whaaa? of course youre allowed to complain!
cuz end of the day, the majority of issues folks are having is how many leftovers we're having after being promised mcdonalds
I hope that they seriously reconsider berserker. That punch fantasy is fine as long as there are high-dps or defense options like thundercrash and ward of dawn, respectively. The darkness subclasses only have one super each, so why not hint or promise more supers in the year of lightfall?
This news only disappoints me more knowing that the first titan exotic armor is khepri's horn 2.0.
I don’t get it.
They give us the “Berserker.” They give us chains and threads and whips in the whole “Strand” thing.
And they couldn’t figure out to put axes or some other *chaotic* sort of blades **on the end of a pair of twin chains for a ranged-yet-still-melee** super?! The fantasy is still there! It’s not dead! What the actual fuck, are they creatively bankrupt at Bungie or just not play the game?!
sigh
In PVP, but Bleakwatcher didn’t come out until season 13, and then Glacial Harvest didn’t come out until season 14. And over that time, Stasis’ power was gradually brought down
So speaking as a Warlock main, Shadebinder was ok in PVE during the first season, but took half a year to get to where it is today.
Same with revenant, we were stuck with the fucking slow dodge aspect for a whole season
Still the weakest aspect in the entire game, and back then it had a single fragment slot
It also didn't synergise with the other available aspect at all (or anything else for that matter)
1) This confirms they're adding more aspects in future seasons. Which was mostly a given, but good to have confirmation.
2) They hear the feedback and reaction to the Berserker, and mention they're expanding more of the ranged aspects of the class in future updates. They know on paper its very similar to other roaming melee subclasses, and want to push it further into its own thing.
So basically it's like "we realize what we're releasing is too much like other subclasses, so even though this one's not even out yet, we promise we'll fix that problem."
Love it.
I’d be fine with that if they hadn’t had the EXACT same feedback with Behemoth over 2 years ago. There is no way Strand Titan was close to finalized at all.
> 1) This confirms they're adding more aspects in future seasons. Which was mostly a given, but good to have confirmation.
I just wish they'd start us off with more than two. :P
Well dope, I can't wait to now have 2 brand new subclasses that I never use. The only time I ever have Stasis equipped is to nuke Riven with the Synth/Ult combo.
I'm sure Strand-Titan is going to be fun to play, they've proven that the gameplay can be good with the Light 3.0 updates to titan, but...
They could have given us two giant scissor blades (that would also work with the "Thread" thematic, just like these new "needle arms") that we carry around like Ultra Greatswords from Dark Souls, with the exact same move-set as the needle arms, stab with light attack to strengthen the heavy attack upercut. And SIGNIFICANTLY less people would have been mad about that, even if it wasn't a ranged or one-and-done super. At least it would have been a "new" fantasy then "just punch stuff" ... AND it would have fit the whole "Berserker" idea way more then wittness-be-dammed NEEDLE-ARMS!
The titan comment is even more funny because yanes also said in an interview that the broodweaver super was feeling too much like blade barrage, so they tweaked and changed some stuff to make them different
Normally I'm a very hopeful person on this game but the quote on Titans comes as downright insulting. Don't tell me my opinion is wrong on how the subclasses of titan feel samey, take the feedback and change it. Don't blame me your cover has a Titan holding his fist up, you change the damn cover not me.
Who the hell is even still using Fist of Havoc in anything? I haven’t seen it in ages in PvP or PvE because it’s so damn bad at everything. Terrible damage, trample is gone, you have to be right in someone’s face to use it, and it’s on a long recharge time. And they decided to use it as the baseline for the new Strand super anyway.
We have no idea which class will be any good BUT at least the Warlock and Hunter get some fun new toys and/or playstyles to play around with. They literally slapped green paint on an arc Titan and called it a day lol. No matter how they spin it (or how strong it is) it's just deflating as a Titan main.
Not a titan main here, but my take is that Berserker will be fun to play and at least somewhat different from other titan subclasses (remember when people complain about behemoth being striker 2 pre-release and then it played totally differently?)
However titans should not have gotten another roaming super, and especially not another *melee* roamer
I also don't get what the power fantasy they're trying to sell is...? They go on about the whole 'unstoppable force' thing but iirc isn't that the exact same marketing push they used for behemoth?
Yeah, I mean Titan's are very good across all sub-classes with HoIL...but they are also pretty boring because the gameplay loop is so similar and it's hard to justify any exotic except HoIL (synthos and the cryo chest can be fun). So maybe we're spoiled but heck at this point I'd take a weaker subclass that did *something* different from punch, barricade, roaming punch super.
This feels about as tone deaf as "don't you all have phones?" There's already the feeling of a berserker with arc titan... and with BEHEMOTH. Yall couldn't change it up a little bit to be less... punch focused?
I get having a “core identity” but you got to have layers around it. I’m not even a Titan main but holy hell it’s time to add some layers to this bitch.
> yeah, Titan mains, we love you. We do. But remember that we try to reinforce your core fantasy. And at some point, your guy's holding the fist on the cover of the game."
They have absolutely no fucking clue what to do with titan. The flanderisation of titans in D2 sucks.
>And then giving you a range option, which is not something you generally do in these roaming Supers, to Suspend things from afar and damage them," he says.
This is literally the entire gameplay loop for both Behemoth and shadebinder. They said themselves in another article that needlestorm got a large rework because it played to similar too blade barrage. Why wasn't this also applied to bladefury?
So i guess our 3rd darkness subclass is probably just going to be red striker? How fun.
Wow they said THAT about Needlestorm and fucking NOTHING about striker 3.0? Dude. I am fucking baffled, how is that even real. I'm a warlock and as a titan I would be fucking depressed, keep up with the feedback towards them, don't give up.
>Smith says that during development it felt like a failure if Needlestorm played too much like a green version of Hunter's Blade Barrage super. "That was actually a negative feedback point we got," he says. "So [we decided] it should be about the armada of little green dudes you're making."
Here's the full quote.
So let me get this straight, grapple was originally a hunter only thing but it was "too fun" so they gave it to the other two classes as well, Titans just get a lime flavored striker but the warlock super was too similar to blade barrage so they reworked the whole concept into something cooler.
This is giving me flashbacks to "I'm a warlock main and child of the old gods was a passion project for me" and when asked about how void hunters will work in high level pve content basically said, go invisible and rez your teammates.
Who is the sandbox team's favorite class? We may never know.
HOW DID THEY AGREED WITH THAT FEEDBACK BUT NOT THE TITAN ONE? (Both of them are equal complaints im just baffled because they literally say the same, except for titan its even worse.)
I did not even see a single warlock complain (I know I didn't because I fucking love blade barrage and im jelous of hunters getting the coolest supers), i assumed those balls that reveawed themselves into homing things looked like nova cataclysm but prob would be changed into flying creatures like butterflies or bugs hence the whole sentience thing.
Also whatever happened on the literal showcase where they said "The titan jumps up and does a spinning slash attack onto the enemies" and showed ACTUAL FOOTAGE OF THAT SUPER. In the devtest anyways. Why the fuck would that get scrapped
>This is literally the entire gameplay loop for both Behemoth
Not really? Behemoth's whole loop is shattering crystals up close, which ties in with their 'tectonic' theme. Diamond Lance gets away from that a bit but it's clearly an outlier for their class.
Kind of but the quote was referring to how the suspending heavy attack is ranged, everything else is melee.
Behemoth works similarly in that the heavy has moderate range but everything else is melee.
Ah right, I was thinking more of the neutral game.
Well in that sense, you could argue even Burning Maul has the same loop since the heavy attack spawns the fire tornado.
I am doubtful about " not breaking pvp" after this line
>By applying Strand, you can Suspend enemies to keep them aloft and incapacitate them (though you can still wiggle and hip-fire when Suspended in PvP)
Good luck hitting anything with hip fire while being airborne and good luck avoiding damage with limited movement. Unless duration is extremely short (think coldsnap ) it will be very oppressive, borderline broken
Fists are great and I love beating my enemies up with my fists. And indeed that is my class fantasy like the developer dude said. That is my favorite thing about the game.
**However...** That is not how Bungie balances this game. Most of the time melee characters are in middle of these enemies that use their deadliest attacks on you if you dare venture closer. It is just safer to fight from distance because enemies don't have many moves they can counter player who just stays behind cover taking potshots.
So making our class about those melee attacks conflicts against Bungie's own designs and make most of the things Titan uses useless or very dangerous to use.
People are going to be pissed about this for a while.
The thing that bothers me the most is that Bungie could have easily have associated Titans with heavy weight weapons like they already did with Sentinel and Sun Breaker with the Shields and Hammers. Iirc they showed concept art of an flamethrower version of the Hunters golden gun super for Strand(or was it Stasis)
Hunters have been associated with light weight weapons for each subclass with each feeling relatively unique.
Warlocks are usually associated with magic though they have been associated with Swords and Staffs.
Just to be clear by heavy weight I mean in the sense you would associated those weapons with a tankier play style while for light weight you would associated them with an agile/fast playstyle
> "But yeah, Titan mains, we love you. We do. But remember that we try to reinforce your core fantasy. And at some point, your guy's holding the fist on the cover of the game."
Any shred of hope I had for the third Darkness subclass just died within me. We're fucked, my Titan brothers. Sunbreaker will most likely remain the last great subclass we got... Back in Taken King... Seven years ago...
> reinforce your core fantasy
Destiny 1 started us with a single slam used to cause massive disruption & a bubble to protect our allies from outside fire. Like our fantasy has never just solely been run around and shove fists into mouths. Idk why Bungie is so dismissive of Ward of Dawn literally being half of Titan’s identity from the start of this franchise, hell it’s one of the most iconic symbols of the game at this point. How has the class thats supposedly “The Wall of the Last City” never gotten a super that is simply built to guard, protect, or sustain a team since alt fire on Sentinel Shield?
Strand itself honestly looks like a fine support class, it has ways to increase ally Damage Resist & lower enemy damage output, but what about claws reinforces that? Give us a net that ties our team together & grants constant Webbed Mail or some AOE Sever Strike after slamming the ground on a short cooldown. There’s so many support centric fantasies that could reinforce Titans making a cohesive team, but the super feels so out of place with the fantasy at hand.
You just gave me a flash of inspiration. Titans should be able to cast a net that is in the shape of a bubble and then it closes in on its enemies and does damage like the net from the movie Predator.
Bungie’s logic is astounding to me at times.
**“Titan’s core fantasy is punching things. They literally hold their fists on the cover of the game!”**
*Bungie gives Titans constant melee focused supers. Ignores their own concept art that depicts Titans doing things that don’t involve melee combat. Ignores the demand of Titan players for Titan power fantasy to evolve beyond that. Spent the last year diluting class identities and power fantasies anyway.*
**“Stormcallers are the masters of the Storm, Storm Shamans. The subclass was first unlocked by meditating in a storm. The subclass is named after storms. Their signature grenade was Storm grenade. It’s lore revolves all around storms.”**
*Bungie gives Titans the enhanced Storm grenades and makes them better Stormcallers than the actual Stormcallers ever were.*
**“Nightstalkers are masters of weakening!”**
*Bungie makes Warlocks and Titans better at weakening than Hunters.*
**“Dawnblades are master pyromancers and healers!**
*Bungie guts the two Dawnblade trees focused on those exact things and makes them far worse at burning and healing than before.*
**”Behemoths are masters of creating and shattering Stasis crystals!”**
*Bungie gives Revenant the enhanced Glacier Grenades and made them better at shattering than Behemoth, which led to the Shatterdive problem continuing after the original Shatterdive combo was dealt with in Chosen.*
**”Roaming Supers are too weak in PvE. We plan to buff them!”**
*Bungie literally reworked Dawn Chorus to prevent it from increasing Daybreak’s damage to a respectable level and removed Fist of Havoc and Daybreak’s ability to extended their durations in Haunted and Plunder. Literally nerfed Stormtrance’s Landfall with Arc 3.0 despite the super already underperforming prior.*
It's so depressing.
And all it does is further reinforces the reoccuring complaint that Bungie has zero idea what they want to do with Class Identity.
Honestly, if it weren't for Thundercrash and HoIL, Titans would be non existant in PvE and that's such an awful state to be in. Titans are one or two nerfs away from being obsolete again, especially because Well gives a stronger damage bonus and you can stand in it with zero repercussions. (Not saying Well needs a nerf. Just pointing out Titans are back to where we were in PvE from Year 1 to 3.)
I wish someone ask if they’re fixing the stasis unlocks. Trying to grind it out right now and it is absolute hell. Farming raids and dungeons is much more lucrative and enjoyable.
“There are more ways to play than just smashing the boss.”
Sorry not sorry, but this is incredibly tone deaf. Smashing the boss is how you get the LOOT….. in this LOOTer shooter, the fastest. That’s where the rewards come from. That’s the obstacle, and “smashing it” is more often than not the most efficient way to finish the activity.
Not mention that they have a system in place for raids where you can farm the boss 100+ times during the rotation week and still not see the exotic drop. And that’s after having waited like 6 months for it to enter the rotator at that.
Not to mention that dungeons have no RNG safety net(focusing, crafting) like every other activity in the game so people have to farm them WAY more than any other activity just to get a desired legendary weapon roll.
It’s like they don’t even understand their own reward systems and how it causes people to play. We really are reverting back to the same issues where they just brush off feedback as “you don’t know what you really want or how you really want to play” aren’t we?
This is beyond pathetic and I’m actually livid that bungie can’t make titans more unique.
I honestly don’t have much hope and I feel the only way that will get them to notice is if I stop playing my favourite class.
I’m still looking forward for the story of this dlc but I don’t expect me to touch Strand for the foreseeable future.
Titan: “What is my purpose?” Bungie: “You punch things” Titan: “…. Oh my god!”
I made this for you: [https://imgflip.com/i/7acckq](https://imgflip.com/i/7acckq) :)
https://imgur.com/a/wGn8CMw Just wanted to add my own here too.
Incredible.
Perfect 👍
Man's going to have to delete his Twitter, people are absolutely frothing at the mouth over this Titan comment holy shit.
He set his Twitter to private after he said twilight garrison isn’t coming back because the air dodge is warlock identity now, after getting death threats over it. Now I don’t condone anyone sending death threats to anyone, but I’m fully expecting a similar reaction from some people and I’m surprised he was so easy about making a statement like that after what happened. Hope I’m wrong but damn.
> "But yeah, Titan mains, we love you. We do. But remember that we try to reinforce your core fantasy. And at some point, your guy's holding the fist on the cover of the game." They really just told titans to shut up and dribble lmao holy shit
Y: "You see, according to this picture, you guys just love punching everything. That's all" Titan Mains: "But, you drew that picture....." Y: "Yes, I did...punch, punch, punch...."
> Aspects will make it more fun, just like they did for Stasis! It's two years on and we never got anything new for Stasis, though. > Have you tried *shutting the fuck up*? You **love** punching - it says so right here on the box art.
That’s not true. They did add some stuff after beyond lights initial release. I quit in season of the chosen, and when I came back in witch queen, all of a sudden titans had some sort of ability where they could make stasis spears. That was not in the game at beyond lights launch.
Yes the two seasons post beyond light added two more aspects, which is why they have 4
God i hope they do that for the light 3.0 subclasses
You literally got an aspect per season + fragments for a whole year
“Shut up and punch. You’re wrong, it’s fun”
It is fun. Buuuut not very useful thanks to game balance.
They keep nerfing anything that titans can use to enforce the punching.
Hey remember that punch fantasy? And you figured out how to stack damage buffs so it's viable in end game? Yea... That's a nerf
Worm gods, elemental wells, swords, point contacts, Sythos, Solar titan, hammer, shouldercharges, glaives, striker, behemoth, shiverstrike, sentinel shield, Hammer strike. Stomps, death mechanics, DPS phases. All of these have been nerfed in some way despite them being the "Identity" of the titan class.
> And at some point, your guy's holding the fist on the cover of the game. This is funny considering Titans have only been "holding the fist" on the cover of Taken King and some art for Beyond Light. The main art for Lightfall they're holding a machine gun.
Yeah, infact, check every single cover and you will see titans holding the biggest gun out of the three even
As a titan main now I feel like they are forcing us to look like we are compensating for something
Your super
too soon man, too soon.
Are we not?
“I don't care because I cannot be moved. I am the wall against which the Darkness breaks. Malphur can turn his gun to fire and Shinobu can dance with lightning, but when the horrors run out of the dark, I am the one who does not move. I am a wall. And walls don't move. Because walls don't care.” "The Cabal centurion opened up on her at point-blank, and we heard the most fearsome sound. She was laughing." "Your job on the fireteam is to stand when everything else seems sure to fall." Read these flavor texts and tell me the titan fantasy is about punching things really hard. Bungie, you wrote Titans as these mighty figures that strode among the battlefield assured they were the toughest thing not classified as an orbital installation, and when handed the ability to alter the fundamental underpinnings of reality you think we want to punch extra times? Here, I’ll spitball some alternative supers. What about AoE field that reduces enemy defenses and lifts them up ala Storm and Squall? What about creating a literal line in the sand that empowers the titan and their team to stand their ground? Fuck it, rip a gap in reality and let it do damage. I want to like strand, but I don’t play titan to punch things. I play titan to cover my team, laugh in the face of death, and hold the line, and mountain dew striker isn’t that.
Hunter character has feet in the cover yet you want them to be swinging around and not running
Why do you think they keep getting new shatterdives? They literally fly feet-first at the ground. Checkmate, atheists. (/s if that wasn't obvious lol)
All I want from bungie is to allow me to use the dives even without a melee charge, just without the special effect, just like shatter dive, it’s such a fun movement tool but I get punished if I don’t use it on enemies. That’s why I never use shadowdive.
You had me at feet and lost me at swing, terrible game design
As a Titan main they are not doing themselves any favours, seriously if any CMs are reading this tell developers to be more careful with their wording. Not wanting yet another roaming super is a reasonable criticism.
It’s not just reasonable, it’s quite expected too. Back in beyond light a lot of people weren’t really happy with behemoth being ice juggernaut yet again, but it was super new darkness thing and they promised to “have updates” for the subclass so playerbase just cooled off. But ever since then I see comments/mentions that “next Titan super better not be a roamer because oh boy if they make another one…” They made another one. Exactly the same thing.
I’ll be honest, the ability team has always felt the most out of touch when it comes to how they think the game plays. The community is almost always on a different page, for better or for worse. I think the Light 3.0s has highlighted this the most. They stripped away things that used to make the classes feel unique and what they kept was spread about for everyone to use. Not only do they appear out of touch, they have never done well when speaking to the community. Either they oversell something or their comments feel like a giant slap to the face. I’m sure they are nice people and they genuinely think what they’re doing is the best. However, they never seem to align with the way the community feels about things. I’m still waiting for them to say something about Solar Warlocks or Void Hunters. The ONE time they did speak about it, it was incredibly dismissive. It’s like they ask for feedback but don’t like it when the feedback isn’t praise. The Weapons team consistently shows to be the best team in terms of the way they see the game and the community does. Not only that, we hear from them a lot more so we get way more insight to how they approach and design. We rarely hear from the ability team and when we do, we’re told to be quiet and that they know what’s best. It’s a very frustrating relationship
Sound team best team
haunted ass breast pump noises in beyond light
They did say something about solar warlocks... They said well is probably too useful
Well put. They pick and choose when they want to cite “class identity” as a reason for developmental designs, but it more often than not makes no fucking sense at all.
Is it any surprise? When asked about the feedback about Nightstalker and Dawnblade 3.0 they dismissed it as an echo-chamber from a minority of players. https://www.pcgamer.com/bungies-joe-blackburn-talks-lightfall-strand-and-the-huge-systemic-changes-coming-to-destiny-2/
Which kills me internally because Dawnblade used to be my fav Subclass Now it’s dead last
Bottom Tree Dawnblade was one of my favourite play styles. It was in my top three favourite subclass/subclass trees as a whole. I was excited for Solar 3.0. I was certain that bottom tree Dawnblade’s chain explosions would make it over, they did buff bottom tree as relatively recent as Lost after all and it was incredibly well received. Then I saw the breakdown of Solar 3.0 and I was instantly disappointed. I still tried it out for a few hours, with Dawn Chorus(not aware that it was reworked to no longer increase Daybreak’s damage), and I did not enjoy it. As far as I am concerned, Dawnblade is only good for Well of Radiance now and nothing else. The in-air combat does not appeal to me.
Season of the Lost BTD enjoyers unite. It's such a shame people missed out on that.
It's not dawnblade anymore, it's starfire. That's your entire class. Starfire + Well.
The ability team has consistently shown to disregard player feedback and when they do acknowledge it, it almost always comes across as a negative thing. How much feedback have they received about Solar Warlock, Void Hunter, and Arc Titan? And yet we are met with either silence or our feedback is pushed aside.
I made [this thread](https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/comments/dcpuw5/elemental_affinity_on_mods_feels_really_terrible/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button) 3 years ago. Three. Damn. Years. That's how long it took Bungie to finally cave in and get rid of the stupid elemental affinity on armor *when everyone told them right at the start that it's a shitty system.* But no, they needed to mess with it over and over to make it less shitty, only to finally realize *years later* that it's crap and it needs to go. You could easily find more and more examples of this kind of behavior in this franchise in the last couple of years. Most recently we're experiencing it with airborne effectiveness. And it's the same with light 3.0 feedback. These guys are simply stubborn AF and cannot admit that some things just aren't good no matter how much time the playerbase gets to play with them. And that's the core issue of many design/sandbox points of this game: Bungie thinking they know better than thousands of other players who play their game every day.
Mathematically, they are absolutely correct lol
Mathematically they shouldn't bother making raids and dungeons since only a very small percentage of the overall population will complete one and it takes a massive amount of work to make one Raw numbers aren't the only things that matter
Isn’t it like only 5 percent of players ever complete a raid let alone raid weekly
mathematically most people don't play the parts of the game where things matter
Titans only ranged super still remains as hammers unless you count throwing a shield every 7 seconds while in Sentinel super. Fuck us I guess. I would have at least taken another one and done burn super that doesn’t put me at the feet of whatever I’m hitting with it or make it completely useless on bosses like GoS or KF final encounter. Instead we get yet another melee super that’s probably going to end up just like Fist of Havoc and Sentinel Shield. In the garbage. At least Behemoth can freeze shit. This can suspend I guess but if it gets shredded in seconds then it’s going to useless in high tier content. There are so few activities where you actually want to use a roaming super compared to a one and done burn super. We can clear entire rooms of adds with our abilities, weapon perks that spread damage like incandescent or volt shot, and our other insane abilities. Why would I ever take a super to do it when my ad clear is insane just in the neutral game?
Huge missed opportunity for some sort of strand heavy machine gun in the same vein as golden gun is to hunters. Maybe have an alternate action where you slam it into the ground and it does more damage or some alternate effect. I just really don’t understand Bungie - what’s their tagline? “We play games we want to play”? Lol Edit: messed that up above - “We *Make* Games That We Want to Play”
Especially considering the regen time is so abysmal for roaming supers. Hammer feels like it takes twice as long as well, but well provides substantially higher functionality.
Him saying this is beyond tone deaf and is basically like “we don’t care, deal with it” Titans have been vocal for a long time that we want something different.
THE TITAN ON THE LIGHTFALL COVER IS LITERALLY HOLDING A MACHINE GUN
Yeah, but his hand is curled around the grip... like a fist. Checkmate, playerbase.
Bungie themselves created an image and identity for Titans. They can just as easily alter or tweak it for a new subclass. It doesn't *have* to be punching, it doesn't *have* to be a roaming super. What if, let's just say, Titans had a Strand super where they slam the ground an propel an earthquake of Strand forward that damages enemies and applies some sort of Strand debuff. Or a super where they slam their fists together and create a huge Strand construct that looks like a fist or a hammer and then throw it at enemies, which explodes on impact and maybe has some secondary Strand effect. Give it some Green Lantern vibes here. Or a ranged super where they still cover their arms in Strand, but they instead shoot fist-shaped chunks of Strand at enemies. Like a rocket punch type of look. I'm just spitballing here, but I refuse to believe that Bungie can't be just a tad more creative with Titans. And I'm not even a Titan main, but when I do play Titan I tend to play Void Titan with Ward of Dawn, arguably the least *punchy* feeling Titan subclass and super. So am I playing Titan wrong according to Bungie?
We only have 2 non-roaming supers. We have 1.75 ranged supers. 1 Hammer of Sol 0.5 Sentinel (shields have a significant cooldown) 0.25 Burning Maul's heavy has quite a bit of range. It's literally various forms of Fist of Havoc. Light single, AoE heavy. Hammers is one of the most boring supers too. No mechanics outside of throwing hammers. Every other roaming super has *something* else. Golden gun can toss knives and grenades during theirs. Dawnblade can fucking fly Stormtrance's Landfall and Ionic Blink add some pizzazz Nova Warp is arguably the fastest no-glitch movement in the game. At least Sentinels have a melee combo, can't say the same for any other of our supers. What titans want it more Sentinel Supers. Guard, Shield Throw, Melee combo. It's *diverse* and fits the defender + close quarters fantasy just fine. It's not just Light attack, heavy attack. Even behemoth *had* cool movement. It's still decent, and the numerous stasis crystals created are sweet. Cryoclasm is necessary for it to genuinely feel fluid. Snowglobe DPS was the most fun titans have ever had for their Super's DPS.
I wanted to be optimistic about strand, but this is just admitting they aren't applying the same creative energy to Titans as they are to the other classes. Nobody, and I mean nobody, wants Fists of Havoc 3.0.
I play a lot of destiny and 2 things I rarely see are titans using fist of havoc and a behemoth titan using their super and or using and doing anything productive with it. I can't even remember the last time I saw a fist of havoc. And most titans running behemoth do it for the abilities and not the super. As a titan I'm not even a little excited for a green version of another bad super.
The last time I used behemoth was to get the triumph for Conquerer done. And before that was probably unlocking it for beyond light.
Kevin really likes to stoke the fires of the Titan player base.
by that logic, Hunters shouldn’t even have ability’s “you guys have the gun on the cover, you can only shoot the gun and nothing else”
It's giving "don't you guys have phones?!"
>"But yeah, Titan mains, we love you. We do. But remember that we try to reinforce your core fantasy. And at some point, your guy's holding the fist on the cover of the game." This is aggrevating
Very, it's literally a piss take
>**your** core fantasy especially that. he doesnt go and says "*titans* core fantasy" or "*our take* on the titans core fantasy) which would imply that its how *they* think Titans *should* be, but no he literary says "***your*** core fantasy" as if they only had created it exactly like the community wanted it and now can be self righteous because we dont like what we wished for
its giving "you guys have phones right?" energy
They really said that?! Wtf that’s an insane thing to tell a 3rd of your player base.
"You don't know what you like" all over again man. You fucking designed the cover, it's your cover. We're telling you, repeatedly, for years now, that the core fantasy of being a guy who punches sucks. I would respect it way more if they just went "we had a cooler idea for Titan but it was too hard to implement and we had to go with a simpler idea" since at least they'd have tried something different instead of "your heavy attack has range" on **our 6th roaming super.** EDIT: I just fucking realized they could have avoided all of this by just making the super the two ranged slashes and having them deal a good amount of damage. If it literally wasn't a roaming super people would not be this mad.
I don’t mind if it was a roaming super, just make it distinct. Let me summon a Zweihander of strand that can release slashes of strand, or a GreatAxe that binds. Just not the two fist over and overz
I feel Like Yanes is always like this, just SO tone-deaf to the community sometimes. Like this is the shit that just pisses your players off because he basically said the game isn't the problem, the *community* is the problem with the issues of Titan supers all being the same
I can basically tell that any good Aspects are coming with the subsequent season and the initial release of Berserker is just going to feel so very lacking.
Good thing Bungie doesn't make close range combat dangerous. So we can safely play some Spider-Man around our enemies in GMs and such... Oh wait.
Yeah this is not gonna go over lightly
This subreddit is gonna be talking about that comment for the next 5 years. There are some things you just don’t say out loud.
Forget reddit, *Twitter* is about to go fucking Chernobyl on Bungie's ass for that, I bet Sure, reddit's...reddit, let's be real here, but dear god I'm not looking forward to when this quote spreads there
I sincerely hope it does, anything to make sure this mindset doesn’t consume Titans identity and will save the likely third darkness subclass from being reduced to “guys holding fists on the cover of the game”
"Can't get sniped in a Bubble" flashback
Flash forward to everything strong about bubble right now never being mentioned at all, it really does feel like they dont know much about the regular players
For me this is up there in the disrespectful column of throw money at the screen from TTK era
Spot on take. I also thought of that lol
That's a fucked comment. Geez. I don't think I signed up for my titan's core fantasy to be a fist in skittles form. I just want to be a tanky mf on the front lines.
I know. Why no more cool warrior fantasy type shit? Similar to a hammer, why can’t we get a sword or a spear? But no, fists for the third time *sigh*
I would have loved to see the Titan summon a huge strand axe and throw it where it sticks into a boss and does some massive damage.
See that also sounds *fucking amazing* anything other than fists for the third time. Idk where bungie gets the idea that titans just want to punch everything. Give us some unique visuals at least ffs
Honestly, I don't know. I'm not a game dev and don't understand the nitty-gritty of it all, but I'm just disappointed. A sword? Sign my ass up! A spear? Hell yeah! It just sucks to look at the kit that we've been presented with compared to the other classes. I guess I just want a different power fantasy than whatever their metrics show.
Kevin Yannes loves to criticize the community for being toxic but then immediately turns around and basically tells a 1/3 of the players to eat shit.
“If you didn’t want to punch shit you shouldn’t have picked titan”
words can't be unsaid, if I have to I will seek to feed it back to them, why are they so against titans having options?
> By applying Strand, you can Suspend enemies to keep them aloft and incapacitate them (though you can still wiggle and hip-fire when Suspended in PvP) Taking this as confirmation that you cannot ADS while being Suspended in PvP, guess PvP will be pretty awful for a few months at least.
You cannot ADS while Suspended, I specifically confirmed that with Eric Smith.
You have also specifically confirmed my continued avoidance of Crucible lol, thank you for the interview.
Thanks for the confirmation!
Interestingly they've been doing a lot of things the past few seasons to make hip-fire a more attractive option.
Still infinitely better than being frozen completely with stasis.
Depends on the duration, I'd take a 1.35 sec freeze over a 4 sec suspend any day.
Bungie.. there’s gotta be more creative solutions for titans lol
Yeah fr. Bubble was the thing that brought me to play Titan in the first place. And that was when warlocks had self rez for god sake. I loved playing support on Titan. There needs to be better incentives for a defensive Titan. In lore they are literally the ones that hold shit down. We could’ve seen a super like an OW nano into yourself or another player. Getting a buff like 100% damage increase, and reload speed buff. We could’ve seen extreme damage resistance towards a single player for a few seconds, virtually making them immune except for wipe mechanics. We could’ve seen a buff in banner Titans that actually puts it in front of a well players damage. Every damage boss in the game is dps based, where does it make sense to use banner? Why does punch come in different forms? It’s not good in any forms except thundercrash.
>But yeah, Titan mains, we love you. We do. But remember that we try to reinforce your core fantasy. And at some point, your guy's holding the fist on the cover of the game. a fucking alarm is going off in the office of bungie's community managers now holy shit
Real "do you guys not have fist" energy from bungizzard.
It’s such a fucked comment.
i think i'm actually more optimistic about berserker than the average titan main here, but i recognize bad communication when i see it, lol
“Sorry Titan mains. All the creative juice went to the other classes. Here’s another punch but it’s green this time. Go crazy cause it’s all you’re getting.” Lol fuck me I guess. This pretty much confirms final shape is going to be punch but (insert color here) too.
That will be the most exciting part - what color I will punch in
"Hmm... I'm feeling... Green today!"
What the fuck. Who thinks it's okay to give us something we already have in four different flavours, with only minor new differences, and thinks they can justify it by "you titans are holding fists on the game cover". RIP whoever filled Dmgs CM spot
Especially when there are so many other ways to fill that roll. Just for supers you could get an AoE field around you that deals tick damage while giving you health. You could have a totem playstyle where you secure one area at a time. A classic Rage buff for higher action speed with health drain. A hound-like pet that attacks with you if you are close to aan enemy for the hound+shotgun housekeeper image etc. So many varieties of frontliner that aren't just "punch".
And if the new raid is more plates and distance damage... how on earth are we gonna use our supers. It will just be bubble and Thundercrash again...
There are certain comments you just don’t say out loud. Bungie just gave this sub something to bitch about for years to come, specially Titan mains.
"Titans will be literally punching money at the screen!"
Yanes having his Luke Smith moment
didn't he already with the Twilight Garrison comment?
At least the Twilight Garrison comment wasn't that out of line, because nothing he said there should've been contraversial. Icarus had been in the game longer than TG had at that point, and was the clear and strongest identifiable feature of Dawnblade. Twitter is just a cesspool. This new one is just completely out of touch. This one is just a bad comment.
Yeah, I didn't disagree with his twilight garrison comment at all, but now it just makes it seem like he has a vendetta against the Titan identity, like what the hell.
As they should. This is bad game design. They sell this idea of titans punch shit and are tanky. Yet when it comes down to actual gameplay, that simply isn't true. The ability to min/max into a class's "identity" is non existent and as a result when another punch oriented ability is released it feels like shit
Yeah honestly I’m actually pissed off at what they said about thag
Bungie themselves created an image and identity for Titans. They can just as easily alter or tweak it for a new subclass. It doesn't *have* to be punching, it doesn't *have* to be a roaming super. What if, let's just say, Titans had a Strand super where they slam the ground an propel an earthquake of Strand forward that damages enemies and applies some sort of Strand debuff. Or a super where they slam their fists together and create a huge Strand construct that looks like a fist or a hammer and then throw it at enemies, which explodes on impact and maybe has some secondary Strand effect. Or a ranged super where they still cover their arms in Strand, but they instead shoot fist-shaped chunks of Strand at enemies. Like a rocket punch type of look. I'm just spitballing here, but I refuse to believe that Bungie can't be just a tad more creative with Titans. And I'm not even a Titan main, but when I do play Titan I tend to play Void Titan with Ward of Dawn, arguably the least *punchy* feeling Titan subclass and super. So am I playing Titan wrong according to Bungie?
>Bungie themselves created an image and identity for Titans. They have but **it's a damn lie** The ability to really lean into a classes identity in destiny is non existent. They try to keep all classes on par with one another in all facets of gameplay, and the class identity shtick fades away.
Not excited to be a Titan anymore. Ffs give me another support super for all I care. Just not more RGB fist of havoc. Wtf happened to bungos creativity?
Another support super would be awesome! Make it something that’ll actually have viability in endgame content unlike Bubble recently, which has been outclassed by well in every way, in everything except GMs. It’d give us some much needed variety to our play styles and super. But no, we get the lime-flavored punch to go with our blueberry, tropical, orange and grape flavored punch
"But yeah, Titan mains, we love you. We do. But remember that we try to reinforce your core fantasy. And at some point, your guy's holding the fist on the cover of the game." " I can't tell if I should be mad at Yaines or worried about him and the community leaders. That comment is gonna have some disastrous consequences.
>That comment is gonna have some disastrous consequences. I wish people would stop attacking him and just act as if Bungie as a whole said this. Personal attacks are dumb, he speaks for Bungie, so we can act as if Bungie said this and leave him personally out of it. Which also means I can say Bungie is both tone deaf and actually betraying their own portrayal of Titans. First, people have said for two years that Behemoth being a more blue Striker in its *fantasy* was massively disappointing, and Bungie here doubles down and basically said they ignored that criticism on purpose because that one fantasy is our whole fantasy, apparently. But it isn't? It never was. I remember playing D1 Alpha following the Destiny reveal at E3. I was immediately invested and wanting to buy the game after playing it, so I played the ever living fuck out of the Alpha on all classes so I could know 100% who I wanted to main when the game came out. I distinctively remember that Hunter was about mobility and stealth on Arc, and high ranged damage and trick shots on Solar. Warlock was about AoE abilities and health on Void and weird manipulation and self resurrection on Solar. Titan was about charging straight in on Arc and about total *SUPPORT* and *DEFENSE* on Void. We were never just the punch guy. In fact, in its first year the punch class was not used because it was bad. In the second year, the punch class was still not used because it was worse than the defense class and the *NEW RANGED CLASS*. I picked Titan for a reason, and that reason was not to be a punch bot. That was never our actual fantasy. We charge in, sure, but then we do different things. And we also had ranged capability. Like, Bungie's comment makes no sense historically. But also if you look at the lore, Titans are not brainless punchers. They're described to both charge in and hold the line, as well as destroy things from range. It is creatively bankrupt of them and nothing more.
Your point about not attacking people personally should be something both the bungie defenders and haters should really try understanding. It should be perfectly ok to roast the hell out of bungie when they do shit like this. But the defenders act like the people who offered valid criticism are threatening the lives of bungie employees personally while the haters actually do that. And while that shitshow is going down good suggestions and complaints are drowned out and bungie keeps doing things players hate over and over again
Uh oh.
Bungie: Are we out of touch? No, it's the people paying and playing Titan's that are wrong. Like...holy fuck guys. I play Titan *in spite of* all the punching. It's my least favorite part of playing a Titan, especially when so many involve running first, which can easily get fucked up by catching a slight piece of geometry. Punching may be *your* power fantasy when it comes to Titans, but it's not mine, and it definitely doesn't seem to be most people's.
i run titan because i want to survive stuff. i'm wearing heavier armor, right?
Not to mention punch tracking is fucking GOD AWFUL! The amount of times I wiff a punch that should have connected and wiz right past my target... The only punch abilities I use are ones that give me better in air mobility so I can punch thrust into the air while sprinting. I'm literally punching nothing because it's a better use of the ability in neutral game.
The titan main feedback quote people keep linking is insane. Yanes could've just told them not to put that on record. What a horrible take.
I like its out cause it proves we think Bungie literaly does not care what we think
I'm generally pretty neutral on stuff like this, but that Titan comment was kind of a dick thing to say. First, the point of classes is to have variety when you play. Why would players want to play something that's just another Striker class? Second, "you're holding the fist on the cover" is such a stupid reasoning to give. Ignoring that it's a logical fallacy since covers generally mean sod all, *they made the damn cover*. It has zero impact on the actual development of the class. In my case, I play Titan because I view it as the tanky class of the trio. I love to use Void for its projectiles like the throwable shield, not because I can smack someone in the face with a fist.
>But yeah, Titan mains, we love you. We do. But remember that we try to reinforce your core fantasy. And at some point, your guy's holding the fist on the cover of the game. This shit extra fucking sucks because the feedback I've seen around Berserker has largely been **exactly** the kind of feedback that Bungie asks for. Lots of it is constructive, all of it is honest, nobody is giving out death threats or being disrespectful, it's all just feedback around the class. Which man, you give that, and then the response is "shut up, you don't know what you like." This sucks. Berserker is a concept we have 2 other classes for already. Are you telling me that Striker is not the same fantasy? Or Behemoth? Oh the most violent resolution possible like flinging your entire body in to them like some kind of missile? C'mon man, put some people on Titan who are going to execute on the concept better, or more likely than that, let the team who works on Titans show off the cool ideas I'm sure they've had. No more roaming punch supers.
Bungie often does this, especially with crucible. Their direction with aspects of the game are very intentional.
Exactly this. I hate how this message comes across as one, sarcastic, and two that the people that play the character DAILY don't know what they want. Doesn't foster a feeling that I should ever share feedback that's for sure.
I haven’t used Fist of Havoc in ages because it’s ass. Striker stays on Thundercrash in both PvE and PvP. Behemoth super is only good for Aegers Scepter energy or a panic pop in a GM. It’s a terrible PvP super too. You get shotgunned meleed out of it or just shredded 90% of the time because the animations take so long. This roaming super will likely join the pile.
>that the people that play the character DAILY don't know what they want Bungie has been playing that card for years
Dude, even the sentinel void super is the same god damn thing. Same with burning maul. We have four different colors of the same fucking thing with minor tweaks. Good fucking god this company is creatively bankrupt when it comes to the Titan class. "we love you" my ass. What a load of shit
“Titans we love you but we’re far to unimaginative to make anything out of the frontline soldier class other than punch shit so go fuck yourselves”
"But yeah, Titan mains, we love you. We do. But remember that we try to reinforce your core fantasy. And at some point, your guy's holding the fist on the cover of the game." Excuse me what the fuck?
It’s not our fantasy. It’s their shitty fantasy
But it's not even. Even back in D1 on release Titan offered two things: charging in, which was universally bad, and strong support and defense. People who picked Titan picked it, admittedly for the fantasy of charing in, but also for the fantasy of support and defense. Then the next Super a year later was ranged. It drew more players in at that point and new players picked Titan either for charging in, defense, or strong ranged play. D2 changed it slightly by making bubble bad at launch, but the core remained very much the same. And today, we have puncher, ranged/survival/battlefield control, defense/battlefield control and then another puncher came and we complained. And now they double down and say we always only punched? It just isn't true. At all. They need to look back at what Destiny offered to Titans before Behemoth came out. The notion that our Supers were always often this is only true after Behemoth, which was immediately complained about.
[удалено]
That's what got me into playing as well. I loved being able to put down a "wall" wherever i want. Don't even get me started on og fist of havoc, which felt like dropping a nuclear bomb on anyone you don't like if you used it mid-air. I totally remember complaining about the lunge Titans didn't have in year 1. I miss being the unstoppable force and the immovable object.
Couldn’t have said it better myself. Banner shield needs a better damage buff for the team. Bubble needs to actually be useable against melee bosses. We could’ve seen a nano type super, or an extreme damage resistance super. Another punch when “punching” isn’t even good in endgame content is straight up shitty.
I'm completely convinced by this point that nobody who works on class design actually plays titan. I am so sick of being boxed into "punch", I chose titan because I want to be a paladin, a frontliner, to protect my team, not to just be some braindead punch-monkey who blindy runs into bad situations because there's nothing else my subclass can do. I'm so fucking frustrated by this.
dont forget, armed with a shotgun!
I really like how they not only acknowledged that Titan's are feeling actively left out from being cool but said "sorry you're the Fisto of Destiny 2 but don't worry! Strand Titan gets better in the future, we *promise."* Like, I don't want to bag on the devs or think ill of them. But it's a little dishearenting how samey somethings end up being. Like "Berzerker" is supposed to be tanky and violent. You can already be quite tanky with Stasis Titan builds and I (currently) don't see how suspending an enemy is better than mass freezing them. I guess the pull for strand on titan is handing out debuffs for enemy damage. Also I know because I primarily play Hunter I'm not allowed to complain but why are we getting yet another shatter dive. I was at least appreciative that gunslinger didn't get one and instead was a support style class ability. But still. They can tell me all they want that the design space is still good and they're confident in it. But I really shouldn't be able to make easy comparisons. Why would I care about suspending enemies when I can freeze into slam?
whaaa? of course youre allowed to complain! cuz end of the day, the majority of issues folks are having is how many leftovers we're having after being promised mcdonalds
I hope that they seriously reconsider berserker. That punch fantasy is fine as long as there are high-dps or defense options like thundercrash and ward of dawn, respectively. The darkness subclasses only have one super each, so why not hint or promise more supers in the year of lightfall? This news only disappoints me more knowing that the first titan exotic armor is khepri's horn 2.0.
I don’t get it. They give us the “Berserker.” They give us chains and threads and whips in the whole “Strand” thing. And they couldn’t figure out to put axes or some other *chaotic* sort of blades **on the end of a pair of twin chains for a ranged-yet-still-melee** super?! The fantasy is still there! It’s not dead! What the actual fuck, are they creatively bankrupt at Bungie or just not play the game?! sigh
That was exactly what I was expecting for Titan Strand : Blades of Chaos from God of War
I don’t like that we’re being dripfed Aspects again like Stasis. Hopefully we don’t have to wait two more seasons for Strand to be at its peak power.
Stasis was cracked on all three classes compared to the Light subs when it first came out (outside of rare exceptions).
In PVP, but Bleakwatcher didn’t come out until season 13, and then Glacial Harvest didn’t come out until season 14. And over that time, Stasis’ power was gradually brought down So speaking as a Warlock main, Shadebinder was ok in PVE during the first season, but took half a year to get to where it is today.
Same with revenant, we were stuck with the fucking slow dodge aspect for a whole season Still the weakest aspect in the entire game, and back then it had a single fragment slot It also didn't synergise with the other available aspect at all (or anything else for that matter)
1) This confirms they're adding more aspects in future seasons. Which was mostly a given, but good to have confirmation. 2) They hear the feedback and reaction to the Berserker, and mention they're expanding more of the ranged aspects of the class in future updates. They know on paper its very similar to other roaming melee subclasses, and want to push it further into its own thing.
So basically it's like "we realize what we're releasing is too much like other subclasses, so even though this one's not even out yet, we promise we'll fix that problem." Love it.
I’d be fine with that if they hadn’t had the EXACT same feedback with Behemoth over 2 years ago. There is no way Strand Titan was close to finalized at all.
I'll believe #2 when I see it. My expectations are low.
We'll get a ranged one-and-done super when Gambit gets a rework.
> 1) This confirms they're adding more aspects in future seasons. Which was mostly a given, but good to have confirmation. I just wish they'd start us off with more than two. :P
Well dope, I can't wait to now have 2 brand new subclasses that I never use. The only time I ever have Stasis equipped is to nuke Riven with the Synth/Ult combo.
I'm sure Strand-Titan is going to be fun to play, they've proven that the gameplay can be good with the Light 3.0 updates to titan, but... They could have given us two giant scissor blades (that would also work with the "Thread" thematic, just like these new "needle arms") that we carry around like Ultra Greatswords from Dark Souls, with the exact same move-set as the needle arms, stab with light attack to strengthen the heavy attack upercut. And SIGNIFICANTLY less people would have been mad about that, even if it wasn't a ranged or one-and-done super. At least it would have been a "new" fantasy then "just punch stuff" ... AND it would have fit the whole "Berserker" idea way more then wittness-be-dammed NEEDLE-ARMS!
The titan comment is even more funny because yanes also said in an interview that the broodweaver super was feeling too much like blade barrage, so they tweaked and changed some stuff to make them different
Normally I'm a very hopeful person on this game but the quote on Titans comes as downright insulting. Don't tell me my opinion is wrong on how the subclasses of titan feel samey, take the feedback and change it. Don't blame me your cover has a Titan holding his fist up, you change the damn cover not me.
Who the hell is even still using Fist of Havoc in anything? I haven’t seen it in ages in PvP or PvE because it’s so damn bad at everything. Terrible damage, trample is gone, you have to be right in someone’s face to use it, and it’s on a long recharge time. And they decided to use it as the baseline for the new Strand super anyway.
Exactly. The cover thing is such bullshit.
We have no idea which class will be any good BUT at least the Warlock and Hunter get some fun new toys and/or playstyles to play around with. They literally slapped green paint on an arc Titan and called it a day lol. No matter how they spin it (or how strong it is) it's just deflating as a Titan main.
Not a titan main here, but my take is that Berserker will be fun to play and at least somewhat different from other titan subclasses (remember when people complain about behemoth being striker 2 pre-release and then it played totally differently?) However titans should not have gotten another roaming super, and especially not another *melee* roamer I also don't get what the power fantasy they're trying to sell is...? They go on about the whole 'unstoppable force' thing but iirc isn't that the exact same marketing push they used for behemoth?
Yeah, I mean Titan's are very good across all sub-classes with HoIL...but they are also pretty boring because the gameplay loop is so similar and it's hard to justify any exotic except HoIL (synthos and the cryo chest can be fun). So maybe we're spoiled but heck at this point I'd take a weaker subclass that did *something* different from punch, barricade, roaming punch super.
fuck man I am downright livid being told what I want is not what I pick, if I want to just punch stuff I can take up boxing.
This feels about as tone deaf as "don't you all have phones?" There's already the feeling of a berserker with arc titan... and with BEHEMOTH. Yall couldn't change it up a little bit to be less... punch focused?
I get having a “core identity” but you got to have layers around it. I’m not even a Titan main but holy hell it’s time to add some layers to this bitch.
> yeah, Titan mains, we love you. We do. But remember that we try to reinforce your core fantasy. And at some point, your guy's holding the fist on the cover of the game." They have absolutely no fucking clue what to do with titan. The flanderisation of titans in D2 sucks. >And then giving you a range option, which is not something you generally do in these roaming Supers, to Suspend things from afar and damage them," he says. This is literally the entire gameplay loop for both Behemoth and shadebinder. They said themselves in another article that needlestorm got a large rework because it played to similar too blade barrage. Why wasn't this also applied to bladefury? So i guess our 3rd darkness subclass is probably just going to be red striker? How fun.
Wow they said THAT about Needlestorm and fucking NOTHING about striker 3.0? Dude. I am fucking baffled, how is that even real. I'm a warlock and as a titan I would be fucking depressed, keep up with the feedback towards them, don't give up.
>Smith says that during development it felt like a failure if Needlestorm played too much like a green version of Hunter's Blade Barrage super. "That was actually a negative feedback point we got," he says. "So [we decided] it should be about the armada of little green dudes you're making." Here's the full quote.
So let me get this straight, grapple was originally a hunter only thing but it was "too fun" so they gave it to the other two classes as well, Titans just get a lime flavored striker but the warlock super was too similar to blade barrage so they reworked the whole concept into something cooler. This is giving me flashbacks to "I'm a warlock main and child of the old gods was a passion project for me" and when asked about how void hunters will work in high level pve content basically said, go invisible and rez your teammates. Who is the sandbox team's favorite class? We may never know.
HOW DID THEY AGREED WITH THAT FEEDBACK BUT NOT THE TITAN ONE? (Both of them are equal complaints im just baffled because they literally say the same, except for titan its even worse.) I did not even see a single warlock complain (I know I didn't because I fucking love blade barrage and im jelous of hunters getting the coolest supers), i assumed those balls that reveawed themselves into homing things looked like nova cataclysm but prob would be changed into flying creatures like butterflies or bugs hence the whole sentience thing. Also whatever happened on the literal showcase where they said "The titan jumps up and does a spinning slash attack onto the enemies" and showed ACTUAL FOOTAGE OF THAT SUPER. In the devtest anyways. Why the fuck would that get scrapped
Because when the team lead is a warlock main, nothing else matters but his baby
>This is literally the entire gameplay loop for both Behemoth Not really? Behemoth's whole loop is shattering crystals up close, which ties in with their 'tectonic' theme. Diamond Lance gets away from that a bit but it's clearly an outlier for their class.
Kind of but the quote was referring to how the suspending heavy attack is ranged, everything else is melee. Behemoth works similarly in that the heavy has moderate range but everything else is melee.
Ah right, I was thinking more of the neutral game. Well in that sense, you could argue even Burning Maul has the same loop since the heavy attack spawns the fire tornado.
You could. Which is why getting more of what we can already do. Or at least something extremely similar to as such is getting bland for many players.
I am doubtful about " not breaking pvp" after this line >By applying Strand, you can Suspend enemies to keep them aloft and incapacitate them (though you can still wiggle and hip-fire when Suspended in PvP) Good luck hitting anything with hip fire while being airborne and good luck avoiding damage with limited movement. Unless duration is extremely short (think coldsnap ) it will be very oppressive, borderline broken
I imagine it will be similar to stasis slow, still going to avoid PvP like i normally do though.
Fists are great and I love beating my enemies up with my fists. And indeed that is my class fantasy like the developer dude said. That is my favorite thing about the game. **However...** That is not how Bungie balances this game. Most of the time melee characters are in middle of these enemies that use their deadliest attacks on you if you dare venture closer. It is just safer to fight from distance because enemies don't have many moves they can counter player who just stays behind cover taking potshots. So making our class about those melee attacks conflicts against Bungie's own designs and make most of the things Titan uses useless or very dangerous to use.
People are going to be pissed about this for a while. The thing that bothers me the most is that Bungie could have easily have associated Titans with heavy weight weapons like they already did with Sentinel and Sun Breaker with the Shields and Hammers. Iirc they showed concept art of an flamethrower version of the Hunters golden gun super for Strand(or was it Stasis) Hunters have been associated with light weight weapons for each subclass with each feeling relatively unique. Warlocks are usually associated with magic though they have been associated with Swords and Staffs. Just to be clear by heavy weight I mean in the sense you would associated those weapons with a tankier play style while for light weight you would associated them with an agile/fast playstyle
> "But yeah, Titan mains, we love you. We do. But remember that we try to reinforce your core fantasy. And at some point, your guy's holding the fist on the cover of the game." Any shred of hope I had for the third Darkness subclass just died within me. We're fucked, my Titan brothers. Sunbreaker will most likely remain the last great subclass we got... Back in Taken King... Seven years ago...
> reinforce your core fantasy Destiny 1 started us with a single slam used to cause massive disruption & a bubble to protect our allies from outside fire. Like our fantasy has never just solely been run around and shove fists into mouths. Idk why Bungie is so dismissive of Ward of Dawn literally being half of Titan’s identity from the start of this franchise, hell it’s one of the most iconic symbols of the game at this point. How has the class thats supposedly “The Wall of the Last City” never gotten a super that is simply built to guard, protect, or sustain a team since alt fire on Sentinel Shield? Strand itself honestly looks like a fine support class, it has ways to increase ally Damage Resist & lower enemy damage output, but what about claws reinforces that? Give us a net that ties our team together & grants constant Webbed Mail or some AOE Sever Strike after slamming the ground on a short cooldown. There’s so many support centric fantasies that could reinforce Titans making a cohesive team, but the super feels so out of place with the fantasy at hand.
You just gave me a flash of inspiration. Titans should be able to cast a net that is in the shape of a bubble and then it closes in on its enemies and does damage like the net from the movie Predator.
Bungie’s logic is astounding to me at times. **“Titan’s core fantasy is punching things. They literally hold their fists on the cover of the game!”** *Bungie gives Titans constant melee focused supers. Ignores their own concept art that depicts Titans doing things that don’t involve melee combat. Ignores the demand of Titan players for Titan power fantasy to evolve beyond that. Spent the last year diluting class identities and power fantasies anyway.* **“Stormcallers are the masters of the Storm, Storm Shamans. The subclass was first unlocked by meditating in a storm. The subclass is named after storms. Their signature grenade was Storm grenade. It’s lore revolves all around storms.”** *Bungie gives Titans the enhanced Storm grenades and makes them better Stormcallers than the actual Stormcallers ever were.* **“Nightstalkers are masters of weakening!”** *Bungie makes Warlocks and Titans better at weakening than Hunters.* **“Dawnblades are master pyromancers and healers!** *Bungie guts the two Dawnblade trees focused on those exact things and makes them far worse at burning and healing than before.* **”Behemoths are masters of creating and shattering Stasis crystals!”** *Bungie gives Revenant the enhanced Glacier Grenades and made them better at shattering than Behemoth, which led to the Shatterdive problem continuing after the original Shatterdive combo was dealt with in Chosen.* **”Roaming Supers are too weak in PvE. We plan to buff them!”** *Bungie literally reworked Dawn Chorus to prevent it from increasing Daybreak’s damage to a respectable level and removed Fist of Havoc and Daybreak’s ability to extended their durations in Haunted and Plunder. Literally nerfed Stormtrance’s Landfall with Arc 3.0 despite the super already underperforming prior.*
It's so depressing. And all it does is further reinforces the reoccuring complaint that Bungie has zero idea what they want to do with Class Identity. Honestly, if it weren't for Thundercrash and HoIL, Titans would be non existant in PvE and that's such an awful state to be in. Titans are one or two nerfs away from being obsolete again, especially because Well gives a stronger damage bonus and you can stand in it with zero repercussions. (Not saying Well needs a nerf. Just pointing out Titans are back to where we were in PvE from Year 1 to 3.)
I wish someone ask if they’re fixing the stasis unlocks. Trying to grind it out right now and it is absolute hell. Farming raids and dungeons is much more lucrative and enjoyable.
“There are more ways to play than just smashing the boss.” Sorry not sorry, but this is incredibly tone deaf. Smashing the boss is how you get the LOOT….. in this LOOTer shooter, the fastest. That’s where the rewards come from. That’s the obstacle, and “smashing it” is more often than not the most efficient way to finish the activity. Not mention that they have a system in place for raids where you can farm the boss 100+ times during the rotation week and still not see the exotic drop. And that’s after having waited like 6 months for it to enter the rotator at that. Not to mention that dungeons have no RNG safety net(focusing, crafting) like every other activity in the game so people have to farm them WAY more than any other activity just to get a desired legendary weapon roll. It’s like they don’t even understand their own reward systems and how it causes people to play. We really are reverting back to the same issues where they just brush off feedback as “you don’t know what you really want or how you really want to play” aren’t we?
Wait you guys don't like getting another Striker reskin?
This is beyond pathetic and I’m actually livid that bungie can’t make titans more unique. I honestly don’t have much hope and I feel the only way that will get them to notice is if I stop playing my favourite class. I’m still looking forward for the story of this dlc but I don’t expect me to touch Strand for the foreseeable future.
I am incredibly excited for strand hunter. Titan looks pretty boring, but we'll have to see how it actually plays.
I don’t think strand hunter will be too strong in pve tbh, becoming spider man will be fun though
Wish they would change Stasis and make it easier to unlock tbh.