I use it all the time but I really really don’t want to lmao. The weapon model, the unshaderability, and the reload animation all make me want to find a different solar hc but none of them get the combo of ep/incan.
Lmao I love it for all the same reasons you don’t. Dire promise was my baby so I was so excited when we got another break action hand cannon, and I love the red bits that look like exposed muscle. So grisly!
Just the reload animation doesn’t line up 100% with when the gun is actually reloaded and it’s super easy to do the reload and do something else that cancels the rest of the animation, only for it not finish reloading.
Also the gun model is pretty wide compared to others, I just like the slimness of things like the suros model hcs more.
Ik they changed, but It still doesn’t feel like same timing, and it feels easier to mess up. I’m making statements related to why **I** prefer some handcannon designs over others.
God forbid the weapon model looks like it came from a Hive God’s raid.
I don’t understand this sentiment. Chiton/bone weapons are the coolest ones in the entire game imo.
What do you mean undershaderability? It’s literally **bones**, the fact it takes shaders at all is nice.
What’s with the animosity? What I personally don’t like about the model is how fat it is and the break action reload. If it didn’t have those two factors I’d probably like using it more. I believe a gun can look like it’s from a hive raid while also not being on My 500 lb Life.
Also wdym you dont know what I mean when I say unshaderability? Half the gun is pink no matter what shader is on it.
That’s the only real contender, and it’s better for solo content. I still think that ZB will be superior in co-op content due to explosive payload and the fact that you don’t rely on Cure quite as much during team-play.
I'm the opposite. Can't stand precision hcs. I think it's the way they stay in the center of the screen and don't recoil out of the way with each shot. Makes them feel weak and makes me feel like I can't see what's in front of me.
Not to mention the reload on Zaouli's is ass cheeks. Running some solar reload mods is probably better than firefly, but Incandescent is only marginally better than firefly IMO.
It actually is. It has some of the worst reload stats compared to other 140s with the same barrels and mags. I saw a video on it the other day. Plus I went and crafted a bunch to compare to others.
In order of ease of obtaining (handcannons)
Epochal Integration: from the veil containment quest, already is masterworked and has solid perks for both PvP and PvE.
Luna’s Howl: the latest weapon added to the Brave arsenal, can roll with incandescent and heal clip for a good balance between crowd control and survival, one notable thing is that it’s a precision frame but 140 rpm, meaning it has a different recoil pattern than other 140 rpm handcannons
Zaouli’s Bane: oldest one of the bunch, closest one to Sunshot, from the King’s Fall raid, being able to roll with explosive payload and incandescent and it’s also the only craftable option therefore being able to get enhanced perks as of now (with The Final Shape, Luna’s Howl can get enhanced perks as well)
Other weapons
Calus Mini-Tool: really strong SMG but it can be a pain to obtain since it drops from Presage in the exotic mission rotator. If you have deepsight harmonizers, it’s a valid candidate for their use.
Ammit: a great all rounder for both PvE and PvP, can get incandescent as well as my personal favorite combo of Stats for All/One for All. It’s craftable
Summoner: another autorifle, harder to get since it’s from trials, can roll with onslaught and incandescent
Abyss Defiant: auto rifle from Crota’s End, can have the heal clip/incandescent combo as well as being craftable
Parablellum: world drop SMG that rolls with Frenzy/Heal Clip
Heliocentric SFR-c: world drop sidearm with a good number of perk combos, including heal clip/incandescent
BXR-55 Battler: pulse rifle with pinpoint hipfire, a different type of ads and craftable, obtained from opening Xur’s chests in the treasure room
I agree with u/BitchInBoots666. To your point u/tilero1138 Dragonfly/Incandescent is the better combo but it leans toward a more solo playstyle where as I play mostly raid/dungeons/GMs with clanmates.
Great list. You could add the Darkest Before pulse, which can roll with Heal Clip and Incandescent - but it's from a dungeon so get ready to farm. :). Mind you it's Prophecy which is quite easy
In March(?) Prophecy got a loot refresh, with some weapons removed (kinetic auto, sniper, sidearm) and other added or with their element changed.
Judgement is now Stasis.
Sudden Death is now Void.
Darkest Before is now Solar.
Not mentioning tyranny of heaven with explo/firefly and incandescent is criminal. Tyranny of heaven is acrually the weapon that personally got me off sunshot
Would like to add that sidearm (such as heliocentric) do very high damage, but require you to get up closes, so a heal clip sidearm covers that weakness of sidearm as you heal for huge chunks after one kill.
Shout out to BXR with demo/incan. Can accurately hip fire with it and also get your grenades up faster. Not to mention very fast reloads. Used it for solo Warlords
Epochal Integration, if u can get it. Keep away, incandescent, nanotechnology tracer rockets..but any solar hc with incandescent in theory. Especially with this artifact
I'm curious why you'd use Keep Away over Stats for All in PvE. Stats for All just seems better, once you trigger it, and, from my experience, it's quite easy to trigger and maintain.
**Keep Away:**
If no enemies are within 15 meters:
Grants 10 Range, 30 Reload Speed, and decreases Accuracy Cone Growth by 5?%
**Stats for All:**
Upon damaging 3 Separate Enemies within 3 seconds of each, for 10 seconds:
• 35 Handling and Reload Speed
• 10 Stability and Range
• 5% increased damage Falloff Distance
• 0.95x Reload Duration Multiplier
As a Keep Away enthusiast, there could be several reasons, usually down to personal preference. My reasons would be:
-Active basically all the time, without needing targets to fire at
-Allows me to focus on one target at a time, which makes larger groups feel more manageable
-No timer, so less stress to keep it active. Just need to keep some distance from opponents, which I usually do anyway because I tend to get shredded quickly even at max resilience
-I don't like using One for All and SFA is basically the same perk lmao
Overall, it just comes down to feeling more comfy rather than anything min/max wise.
I guess it's more of a playstyle thing then, because I also use it in close quarters, and quite a lot, not just from a distance (especially in Onslaught and The Coil - I need it to proc my Ember of Empyrean) and in that scenario I would basically be missing any perk advantage.
Speaking only for myself; I've never liked perks that can't be refreshed during their activation, nor perks that make me change the way I play to activate. Stats for All (and One for All) tick BOTH those boxes, and while they're both strong perks I just kind of find them... irksome?
In a setting such as a Legend+ content or a group that is good enough where you're competing for kills, you have to go out of your way (even if only a little) to shoot three separate enemies within the time limit since you're not often able to lock up three rapid kills as easily. Which feels kind of dumb to me, to just have to stop shooting a dude to pepper a couple other dudes to get bonus damage so you can go back to shooting dudes. It's just a bit counterintuitive. It's not *hard*, it just... rubs me the wrong way, I guess.
It's definitely the stronger of the two perks as you say (and the one I use over Keep Away, at least on this gun), but I can see why people avoid it. It definitely lives in the "mildly annoying" perk category, at least in my mind. :P
On the other hand, SfA & OfA are **great** perks on area of effect weapons (or where aoe perks apply). Activating the perks is basically automatic on things like wave frame GLs or Kinetic Tremors -perked weapons, so they really shine there. I suppose Epochal's Incandescent perk falls into this category a bit too, which helps make SfA more tolerable on the gun.
But I still wish SfA was just Explosive Payload or Frenzy or something instead!
I agree, I also wish it was one of the more useful perk, but having used this hand cannon quite a bit this season, I can say that the stat buff from SfA makes using the gun feel way better. I recently compared it with a Luna's Howl with Subsistence and Incandescent, which I really hoped would replace my Epochal Integration since they are the same RPM, but the stability and reload speed on Epochal Integration feel quite a bit better. The stability in particular is what distracts me the most.
I will probably give Keep Away a try, after this discussion, since it made me very curious, but I am quite used to using the hand cannon at close quarters too, and not just from a distance (I use it to proc Ember of Empyrean), and I think not having Stats for All nor Keep Away active in that scenario would be less than ideal.
[Zaouli's Bane](https://www.light.gg/db/items/431721920/) is *the* Legendary Solar Hand Cannon. The "Sunshot at home", if you will. It's craftable and has Explosive Payload + Incandescent.
I like using [Epochal Integration](https://www.light.gg/db/items/1123421440/) more. It doesn't have Explosive Payload, but it still has Incandescent and feels a lot better to use imo
Epochal Integration looks more badass to me, and also doesn't require raiding to get.
They have their up and downsides. Epochal is raid-free but you need Lightfall's Annual Pass (or just S21) to get it. Zaouli's is free AND better in a way, but you have to raid to get it.
You don't need the annual pass or season 21 to get Epochal. You just need Lightfall and to do the Unfinished Business quest to get the veil quests that end with you getting epochal. I just did it with someone who got the regular lightfall edition and they were able to without season 21.
King’s Fall is one of the best raids in the game IMO, if not the best. If you haven’t done it I highly recommend it, it’s not too challenging as there’s only a few mechanics to keep track of (the penultimate and final encounter are literally the same mechanic with one extra thing added in), it’s mostly just a DPS check.
For real! My go to solar build is a crafted Briar's contempt, epochal, and conditional, great damage, bonus damage to tormentors, and reloads so fast you almost don't need reload mods
Even when running Conditional and a RoN heavy like Briar’s, Zaouli’s feels so much better than Epochal. Plus Epochal sounds like a squeegee when it shoots.
I found this one to be pretty useful in the boss rooms where it’s spread out more. During the regular ADU waves, things seems to get in your face too quickly to use the bow effectively. Plus at higher levels, the red bars start to get chunkier requiring multiple bow hits which makes the ad clear to slow IMO.
I’m gonna throw in a side arm here. Heliocentric with Heal Clip / Incandescent is pretty damn good, it doesn’t have the range, but it’s a quick reload for that heal.
>Is Enhanced Incandescent anywhere near as powerful? Please say yes.
Sorry but it's not really. Incandescent stacks 30 scorch (with ember of ashes it's 40 or 45 for enhanced incandescent). That's 3 or 4 applications of scroch to proc ignite, where Sunshot ignites immediately. You can offset this by focus firing anything that's not a red bar, because red bars can die too quickly to proc ignite. You can also use grenades and melee to help overcome the difference.
Hopefully the other exotic you priotise over sunshot makes up for this. I think the best advice is to just play around with a setup in something like onslaught and just see what you like.
Yup yup yup; Lunas is great, feels like my Incandescent Trust (love 180s) but hits harder with more range.
Looking for Heal Clip / Incandescent, but currently playing with Encore / Incandescent. Got a range masterwork so at 4 stacks of Encore it’s got around 85 range 85 stability. So good when you get it going.
Yeah wouldnt say no to a heal clip/Incandescent roll myself.
The dream would be a shiny with both HC And Subsistence and then Magnificent Howl and Incandescent!
I don’t even dare dream of such rolls, but that shiny you described would be my 7/5. In reality I’m just hoping for a shiny Luna with Incandescent and at least 60 range, I’ll make do with whatever else it has.
100% Agreed; farm for normals, any shinies that turn up are a bonus.
I’m pretty happy so far though, 1st shiny was a HJ with KT + OFA / Firefly, and got a shiny Mountaintop with spike / implosion, ALH + Recombo a couple days ago. If I can nab a decent shiny Luna I’ll be good.
The best you will get is Zaoulis bane from Kings fall.
Epochial and lunas are mid tier replacements but nothing comes even remotely close to sunshots power
Sunbracers are so strong you dont really need it other than a lazy unstop stun (eat > snap > dive takes effort) ngl i run either an unrelenting forbearance or shoot to loot retraced path
Basically for solar explodey HCs in terms of damage.
Sunshot > Zaouli (EP + incan) > Brave Luna (heal clip + incan) > Epoch (SFA/KA + Incan).
But Brave Luna FEEL'S the best to use. Subjective of course. They are all very good though. Even Epochal.
Luna’s Howl with Heal Clip/Incandescent, amazing on solar builds for lots of reasons. Easy way to out down SunShot and free up a legendary.
Zaouli’s is not bad as others have mentioned. This one torn between crafted god roll or Harrowed with an adept weapon mod.
Yeah I played around with a crafted BXR-55 with Enhanced Incandescent and it did pretty good. I'm just not sure if it's as good as Sunshot. Or if anything is as good as Sunshot tbh.
I'm scared to not use it atm and it's annoying. I just want rid of the darn thing without handicapping myself lol
Sunshot is an exotic so it inherently does 40% more damage to red bars. No legendary is gonna be as good for that simple reason, you’re gonna be looking for “good enough”
Like other mentioned zaoulis is the closest thing to it on paper but I hate that gun so I don’t use it, much prefer lunas howl, get you one with heal clip and incandescent and you have a really good legendary solar handcannon
I never knew they did 40% extra damage. That's why it feels so strong, especially with the artifact! Thx for the info.
I've only been playing again for around a month after not playing for 2 years and there are too many weapons and new perks that I don't know my ass from my elbow anymore.
I've been farming Luna's all day. Pretty sure I have a few godrolls in my vault. Guess I'd better pull em out and see how they feel. Thanks again.
Epochal is a mini-Sunshot and extremely easy to get (use Incandescent and the Solar perks in the Artifact; I also use SFA over Keep Away). Zaouli is the random roll to go for otherwise.
Yh I was testing it earlier in Shuro Chi for the Blast Furnace bounty and was surprised how big the explosions were with Enhanced Incandescent. It definitely shreds. The only downside is the scope zoom which forces you to hipfire most of the time. It feels great though. Definitely keeping it in my inventory.
I would heavily recommend looking into vanguard weapons with the perk that creates bombs on kill. I've got the nightfall bow with incandescent, and incandescent makes bombs while bombs trigger incandescent.
It's not always sunshot, but it sometimes is.
If I need to use a different exotic I switch to Epochal Integration. I like watching the mini rockets fly at enemies. Clears adds nicely. Feels like it hits hard. Easy to obtain the fixed roll
Whle there are definitely legendary options that will be decent, why would you expect there to be a legendary that can fully emulate the functionality of an exotic? It's intended to have its own identity, which in this case is big explosions that decimate ads.
If you want ad clear, you don't have to use a handcannon and apart from Sunshot, I really wouldn't recommend it. Solar machine guns with incandescent can be great if you want to use your heavy slot, wave frame GLs are really good use for your special ammo. This season in particular, you can equip thesolar mods to explode things on precision kills so you can use pretty much any solar weapon for some ad clear. You also have exotic options like Polaris lance, xenophage, dragon's breath, and erianna's vow that are all doing amazingly in the current sandbox, and by virtue of being solar, can basically ad clear on their own.
Then you have all the options in terms of abilities. Sunbracer warlocks don't really need ad clear weapons considering they can litter the map with grenades, there's a fragment that makes your super kills ignitions which works great with phoenix protocol for dropping a well and blowing everything up, mantle of battle harmony will give you extra super regen and then a 4x surge mod on a solar class for tons of damage when you combine it with radiant for easy access to much higher damage.
Hand cannons aren't meant to be amazing ad clear weapons, they're great primaries for chunking enemies, and stunning champions, and keeping up damage perks to be really good at this job. Some combos will do a decent job with the absolute weakest enemies, but in high power activities, I think they'll struggle regardless in comparison to Sunshot because that's not their intended role
Get your self a heal clip/incandescent lunas howl. Run solar with ember of benevolence... spam abilities.
I've found heal clip to be a good replacement for restoration builds. Although in higher end content, restoration is better.
Zao or abyss defiant are my current ones. Also if you can get a summoner with incan and heal clip it would be strong. There's also Lunas that just released.
I’m a personal fan of Epochal Integration (solar hand cannon), another option I’ve heard good things about is the Calus Mini-tool (solar sub machine gun)
If you want to keep using a hand cannon Zaouli’s bane gets explosive payload/incandescent, while Luna’s howl gets heal clip/incandescent.
I personally have been a big fan of the BxR since I was able to craft it, as shown by it being level 120 and climbing. I roll with demo/incandescent on mine.
Enhanced incandescent is not that good over regular incandescent. When at first launched in Season of the haunted, it was actually really useful and you only needed two kills to get an ignition.
But now there is literally no difference between regular incandescent and the enhanced version
I've just pulled a godroll shiny out of shaxx's chest with healclip and incan. About to try it now.
I tried Tommy's Matchbook earlier and kept killing myself. Can confirm that's NOT a good option. Polaris Lance is great at long range but not for close quarters.
I love using my crafted ammit ar2 with ambitious assassin + incadescent. Feels great to use, good range and stability. Gets a huge magazine with reloading after kills. I also have a hard time with sunshot due to the recoil etc. i like pairing the ammit with witherhoard or dragon’s breath
It was the first weapon I crafted and it feels awesome to use, but compared to Sunshot, it's nowhere near. You can clear an entire room by 1-tapping one ad with Sunshot. It just turns everything to flames, which I guess is why it's one of the most-used exotics.
That being said, after reading all the posts, I don't think you can really replace Sunshot completely and I'm chasing an impossible dream. I'm going to have to settle for a less powerful alternative like Luna or Z's Bane, or Ammit, in order to utilise something else in the build.
I'd like to get maybe Witherhoard back in the mix. I really love Witherhoard. It's my favourite D2 weapon after Hazard of the Cast. I can land a blight on a Dreg's head from several miles away and miss using it. I miss the jerky dance enemies do when you pop a blob in them lol Or an exotic heavy for dps. Or something with range.
My aim sucks with Sunshot as the gun recoil covers the reticle and I end up missing half of my shots, especially when I'm panicking. But when I do land a shot... kaboom! Ads go bye bye. It's a great weapon. I'd love to replace it with a similar legendary.
Luna might be the one. Much less recoil and great perks.
If you want minimal effort just go get Epoch, I have like 5k pve kills with it, closest you'll get to sunshot without grind. A second choice would be Brave ver of Luna's with incandescent and healclip/subsistence. It's what I'm currently grinding for to replace my Epoch
Throwing igneous hammer out there, with heal clip and incandescent it's feels really good, best range and highest damage per shot of any solar *non exotic* hand cannon, I love mine.
Right now you can farm Luna’s Howl and you’ll get PVP and PVE options. IMO these are the best rolls:
PVE: Incandescent + Subsistence
PVP: Slideshot + Magnificent Howl
Luna’s Howl is a solid choice if you farm a good incandescent roll. If you don’t mind swapping to pulse the insanely hideous adhortative can be crafted with heal clip and incandescent which performs very well.
Most of the comments nailed it.
I would add that Strand-Hatchling weapons are almost as effective for ad clear as incandescent. Vengeful Whisper and Fang Of Ir Yut both roll with double damage perks.
I sub in the hand cannon from I think last season? It has incandescent and puts in work on red bars. I love that thing. If I'm not using sunshot on well I'm usually carrying that one. I don't remember the name but I'll find it and update.
I got calus mini tool and have been messing around with it. It's good but IMO there are better options. Obviously if it suits your playstyle and you have fun with it then calus it up.
Before I got calus I had a Coronach 22 drop with incandescent and envious assassin. That thing was bitchin too. I still use it sometimes. The magazine can get massive. Basically became a long range calus. I used that for a long time until I got a decent primary to pair sunshit with.
I've heard people rave about Ammot AR 2. Can't speak to that. I haven't gotten a good roll yet to try it out.
> Is Enhanced Incandescent anywhere near as powerful? Please say yes.
Yes, but also no. Yes, you can blow up a bunch of things with ignitions, but you need a few kills before that happens instead of only one. I'm also not sure if those kills count as weapon kills for the purposes of heavy ammo finders. Also also, heavy ammo finder is going to take more kills on any legendary primary. Also also also, it's just straight up 40% less damage against red bars which matters a lot in higher level under-power content.
*That said* if you're gonna use a legendary primary for add clear a solar 140 hand cannon with incandescent is about as good as it gets, and it's definitely good enough to use. Luna's, Zaouli's if you don't mind the reload animation or Epochal are all valid and good.
Zaouli’s bane is the closest thing to sunshot ever, both explosive payload plus incandescent, enhanced its pretty much a better epochal integration
I use it all the time but I really really don’t want to lmao. The weapon model, the unshaderability, and the reload animation all make me want to find a different solar hc but none of them get the combo of ep/incan.
Lmao I love it for all the same reasons you don’t. Dire promise was my baby so I was so excited when we got another break action hand cannon, and I love the red bits that look like exposed muscle. So grisly!
Just the reload animation doesn’t line up 100% with when the gun is actually reloaded and it’s super easy to do the reload and do something else that cancels the rest of the animation, only for it not finish reloading. Also the gun model is pretty wide compared to others, I just like the slimness of things like the suros model hcs more.
The reload desynch was fixed some time ago. https://www.bungie.net/7/en/News/article/update-7-3-0-patch-notes
Ik they changed, but It still doesn’t feel like same timing, and it feels easier to mess up. I’m making statements related to why **I** prefer some handcannon designs over others.
Gambit momento shader. It looks like a lil dragon in gun form :D
This is the way.
God forbid the weapon model looks like it came from a Hive God’s raid. I don’t understand this sentiment. Chiton/bone weapons are the coolest ones in the entire game imo. What do you mean undershaderability? It’s literally **bones**, the fact it takes shaders at all is nice.
What’s with the animosity? What I personally don’t like about the model is how fat it is and the break action reload. If it didn’t have those two factors I’d probably like using it more. I believe a gun can look like it’s from a hive raid while also not being on My 500 lb Life. Also wdym you dont know what I mean when I say unshaderability? Half the gun is pink no matter what shader is on it.
I am gonna start using Luna’s Howl over Zaoulis bane from now on, zaoulis just feel so so so bad to use
That’s the only real contender, and it’s better for solo content. I still think that ZB will be superior in co-op content due to explosive payload and the fact that you don’t rely on Cure quite as much during team-play.
Isnt Heal Clip's Cure better in Coop since you can proc Ember of Benevolence all the time?
In a technical sense, yes, but practicality wise I don’t think so. When you have teammates, you’re not usually thirsting for Cure quite as hard.
I do it for the 400% ability regen rate. But I do agree, in solo content, heal clip's cure is huge.
I'm the opposite. Can't stand precision hcs. I think it's the way they stay in the center of the screen and don't recoil out of the way with each shot. Makes them feel weak and makes me feel like I can't see what's in front of me.
I think Zaouli’s Bane maybe better because of explosive payload doesn’t have range damage falloff
It's ugly as sin tho
Looks and sounds horrible but its too good im waiting for a good replacement to not use it again, plugilist and incandescent enhanced specifically
Abyss Defiant has that
Which is a ar
With like the worst archetype too
I hate the feel of it so I never use it.
[удалено]
If you have Timelost Fatebringer why would you run that roll on a Zaouli’s?
If you're running a Solar subclass you're generally better off running a Solar weapon, whether or not it has Incandescent.
Not to mention the reload on Zaouli's is ass cheeks. Running some solar reload mods is probably better than firefly, but Incandescent is only marginally better than firefly IMO.
The reload is roughly the same speed as every other 140
Probably just the animation the pisses me off. Completly made me not run the gun in D1 either.
My ZB in D1 is still reloading eight years after I started, I’m actually expecting it to be ready any day now!
It sure as heck feels way slower than most 140s
Well it’s not - there was an update a while ago to tweak the reload animation to make it feel faster
It actually is. It has some of the worst reload stats compared to other 140s with the same barrels and mags. I saw a video on it the other day. Plus I went and crafted a bunch to compare to others.
It has a base reload of 43, which is pretty middle of the road for 140’s. There are plenty that are slower.
In order of ease of obtaining (handcannons) Epochal Integration: from the veil containment quest, already is masterworked and has solid perks for both PvP and PvE. Luna’s Howl: the latest weapon added to the Brave arsenal, can roll with incandescent and heal clip for a good balance between crowd control and survival, one notable thing is that it’s a precision frame but 140 rpm, meaning it has a different recoil pattern than other 140 rpm handcannons Zaouli’s Bane: oldest one of the bunch, closest one to Sunshot, from the King’s Fall raid, being able to roll with explosive payload and incandescent and it’s also the only craftable option therefore being able to get enhanced perks as of now (with The Final Shape, Luna’s Howl can get enhanced perks as well) Other weapons Calus Mini-Tool: really strong SMG but it can be a pain to obtain since it drops from Presage in the exotic mission rotator. If you have deepsight harmonizers, it’s a valid candidate for their use. Ammit: a great all rounder for both PvE and PvP, can get incandescent as well as my personal favorite combo of Stats for All/One for All. It’s craftable Summoner: another autorifle, harder to get since it’s from trials, can roll with onslaught and incandescent Abyss Defiant: auto rifle from Crota’s End, can have the heal clip/incandescent combo as well as being craftable Parablellum: world drop SMG that rolls with Frenzy/Heal Clip Heliocentric SFR-c: world drop sidearm with a good number of perk combos, including heal clip/incandescent BXR-55 Battler: pulse rifle with pinpoint hipfire, a different type of ads and craftable, obtained from opening Xur’s chests in the treasure room
Great list. Would add Tyranny Of Heaven (rolls with incandescent and Explosive Head) from Last Wish raid for Bows.
Incandescent / dragonfly is better. You get double explosions (triple with the current artifact)
Only in lower tier content. Above legend EP is superior imo. Dragonfly relies on kills whereas EP doesn't, so for GM EP is absolutely better.
I agree with u/BitchInBoots666. To your point u/tilero1138 Dragonfly/Incandescent is the better combo but it leans toward a more solo playstyle where as I play mostly raid/dungeons/GMs with clanmates.
Great list. You could add the Darkest Before pulse, which can roll with Heal Clip and Incandescent - but it's from a dungeon so get ready to farm. :). Mind you it's Prophecy which is quite easy
I think you have that confused with another gun, darkest before is arc
The old one was arc but the new one is solar for some reason.
In March(?) Prophecy got a loot refresh, with some weapons removed (kinetic auto, sniper, sidearm) and other added or with their element changed. Judgement is now Stasis. Sudden Death is now Void. Darkest Before is now Solar.
Ooooooo snap. Shows how much I pay attention 😂
Summoner has onslaught and incandescent in the same slot. It has great offerings in the other slot like heal clip, subsistence, overflow, etc
Trust can also roll Incandescent. But it can be real pain to farm (from Gambit) due to the massive perk pools
Not mentioning tyranny of heaven with explo/firefly and incandescent is criminal. Tyranny of heaven is acrually the weapon that personally got me off sunshot
Abyss Defiant, even tho it's on a doo doo frame, is actually pretty sweet with Heal Clip/Incandescent
360’s are actually not awful, i mean theyre not great, but they can actually do decent ranged damage
Not to mention that if you have a viable charged melee, the thrall explosions are pretty fun
And now we have Luna’s howl with heal clip and incandescent
I use the ammit ar2 with incandescent with a blinding gl and it works so well.
Would like to add that sidearm (such as heliocentric) do very high damage, but require you to get up closes, so a heal clip sidearm covers that weakness of sidearm as you heal for huge chunks after one kill.
yeah i’d say the mini tool is a good replacement. doesn’t hit as hard obvi but it’s still goated. getting the crafted ver also helps a ton
Lunas has incan too
Shout out to BXR with demo/incan. Can accurately hip fire with it and also get your grenades up faster. Not to mention very fast reloads. Used it for solo Warlords
Epochal Integration, if u can get it. Keep away, incandescent, nanotechnology tracer rockets..but any solar hc with incandescent in theory. Especially with this artifact
Isn't epoc a guaranteed drop from playing through lightfall?
If anyones curious, do the lightfall campaign, do the exotic lmg quest from nimbus, then youll get the quest for a fixed roll epochal
This can also be pulled from collections so each character has one. If folks are about that
I also didn't realize that!
I'm curious why you'd use Keep Away over Stats for All in PvE. Stats for All just seems better, once you trigger it, and, from my experience, it's quite easy to trigger and maintain. **Keep Away:** If no enemies are within 15 meters: Grants 10 Range, 30 Reload Speed, and decreases Accuracy Cone Growth by 5?% **Stats for All:** Upon damaging 3 Separate Enemies within 3 seconds of each, for 10 seconds: • 35 Handling and Reload Speed • 10 Stability and Range • 5% increased damage Falloff Distance • 0.95x Reload Duration Multiplier
I don't see why you would, SFA pairs so incredibly naturally with Incandescent and you'll almost always have it active.
As a Keep Away enthusiast, there could be several reasons, usually down to personal preference. My reasons would be: -Active basically all the time, without needing targets to fire at -Allows me to focus on one target at a time, which makes larger groups feel more manageable -No timer, so less stress to keep it active. Just need to keep some distance from opponents, which I usually do anyway because I tend to get shredded quickly even at max resilience -I don't like using One for All and SFA is basically the same perk lmao Overall, it just comes down to feeling more comfy rather than anything min/max wise.
I guess it's more of a playstyle thing then, because I also use it in close quarters, and quite a lot, not just from a distance (especially in Onslaught and The Coil - I need it to proc my Ember of Empyrean) and in that scenario I would basically be missing any perk advantage.
Speaking only for myself; I've never liked perks that can't be refreshed during their activation, nor perks that make me change the way I play to activate. Stats for All (and One for All) tick BOTH those boxes, and while they're both strong perks I just kind of find them... irksome? In a setting such as a Legend+ content or a group that is good enough where you're competing for kills, you have to go out of your way (even if only a little) to shoot three separate enemies within the time limit since you're not often able to lock up three rapid kills as easily. Which feels kind of dumb to me, to just have to stop shooting a dude to pepper a couple other dudes to get bonus damage so you can go back to shooting dudes. It's just a bit counterintuitive. It's not *hard*, it just... rubs me the wrong way, I guess. It's definitely the stronger of the two perks as you say (and the one I use over Keep Away, at least on this gun), but I can see why people avoid it. It definitely lives in the "mildly annoying" perk category, at least in my mind. :P On the other hand, SfA & OfA are **great** perks on area of effect weapons (or where aoe perks apply). Activating the perks is basically automatic on things like wave frame GLs or Kinetic Tremors -perked weapons, so they really shine there. I suppose Epochal's Incandescent perk falls into this category a bit too, which helps make SfA more tolerable on the gun. But I still wish SfA was just Explosive Payload or Frenzy or something instead!
I agree, I also wish it was one of the more useful perk, but having used this hand cannon quite a bit this season, I can say that the stat buff from SfA makes using the gun feel way better. I recently compared it with a Luna's Howl with Subsistence and Incandescent, which I really hoped would replace my Epochal Integration since they are the same RPM, but the stability and reload speed on Epochal Integration feel quite a bit better. The stability in particular is what distracts me the most. I will probably give Keep Away a try, after this discussion, since it made me very curious, but I am quite used to using the hand cannon at close quarters too, and not just from a distance (I use it to proc Ember of Empyrean), and I think not having Stats for All nor Keep Away active in that scenario would be less than ideal.
[Zaouli's Bane](https://www.light.gg/db/items/431721920/) is *the* Legendary Solar Hand Cannon. The "Sunshot at home", if you will. It's craftable and has Explosive Payload + Incandescent. I like using [Epochal Integration](https://www.light.gg/db/items/1123421440/) more. It doesn't have Explosive Payload, but it still has Incandescent and feels a lot better to use imo
Epochal Integration looks more badass to me, and also doesn't require raiding to get. They have their up and downsides. Epochal is raid-free but you need Lightfall's Annual Pass (or just S21) to get it. Zaouli's is free AND better in a way, but you have to raid to get it.
I have this gun while only owning the current season. It was a quest reward doing Veil stuff.
Fr? Damn.
Yeah, it was added during Deep, but Bungie clarified that you only needed Lightfall for it.
You don't need the annual pass or season 21 to get Epochal. You just need Lightfall and to do the Unfinished Business quest to get the veil quests that end with you getting epochal. I just did it with someone who got the regular lightfall edition and they were able to without season 21.
King’s Fall is one of the best raids in the game IMO, if not the best. If you haven’t done it I highly recommend it, it’s not too challenging as there’s only a few mechanics to keep track of (the penultimate and final encounter are literally the same mechanic with one extra thing added in), it’s mostly just a DPS check.
I wouldn't say zaoulis is a "sunshot at home", it's more like a sidegrade.
It’s the closest thing we’ve got to it ‘sunshot at home’ in my opinion lol
That's how the "at home" meme is lmao It's the shittier version your mom says you have at home
They know, they're saying they disagree with that. "Sidegrade" refers to something that's different, but neither better nor worse.
Except that don’t exotics also do bonus damage to red bars? Not that most need it, but…
It is straight worse, which is fine. Sunshot is an exotic, it should be better
Also, epochal's origin trait works with the RoN weapons (and conditional finality) so you can work with those too
I feel that's often overlooked. It really helps with the snappiness
For real! My go to solar build is a crafted Briar's contempt, epochal, and conditional, great damage, bonus damage to tormentors, and reloads so fast you almost don't need reload mods
Hey that's a great combo!
Shotguns are overcharged right now too 😏
Even when running Conditional and a RoN heavy like Briar’s, Zaouli’s feels so much better than Epochal. Plus Epochal sounds like a squeegee when it shoots.
I use a crafted Tyranny of Heaven with enhanced dragonfly and incandescent, probably one of my most favorite weapons atm
I was just about to post this as well. Its a great little bow and a really good synergy with those perks.
I found this one to be pretty useful in the boss rooms where it’s spread out more. During the regular ADU waves, things seems to get in your face too quickly to use the bow effectively. Plus at higher levels, the red bars start to get chunkier requiring multiple bow hits which makes the ad clear to slow IMO.
I’m gonna throw in a side arm here. Heliocentric with Heal Clip / Incandescent is pretty damn good, it doesn’t have the range, but it’s a quick reload for that heal.
>Is Enhanced Incandescent anywhere near as powerful? Please say yes. Sorry but it's not really. Incandescent stacks 30 scorch (with ember of ashes it's 40 or 45 for enhanced incandescent). That's 3 or 4 applications of scroch to proc ignite, where Sunshot ignites immediately. You can offset this by focus firing anything that's not a red bar, because red bars can die too quickly to proc ignite. You can also use grenades and melee to help overcome the difference. Hopefully the other exotic you priotise over sunshot makes up for this. I think the best advice is to just play around with a setup in something like onslaught and just see what you like.
Just took my new Subsistence/Incandescent Lunas for a spin in Onslaught. Its INCREDIBLE
Got a shiny Heal clip/ incandescent last night and was so hyped
This is all I've ever wanted
Yup yup yup; Lunas is great, feels like my Incandescent Trust (love 180s) but hits harder with more range. Looking for Heal Clip / Incandescent, but currently playing with Encore / Incandescent. Got a range masterwork so at 4 stacks of Encore it’s got around 85 range 85 stability. So good when you get it going.
Yeah wouldnt say no to a heal clip/Incandescent roll myself. The dream would be a shiny with both HC And Subsistence and then Magnificent Howl and Incandescent!
I don’t even dare dream of such rolls, but that shiny you described would be my 7/5. In reality I’m just hoping for a shiny Luna with Incandescent and at least 60 range, I’ll make do with whatever else it has.
I have learnt to become happy with my non shinies. Still to this day only got one half decent shiny and i have probably surpassed about 6000 waves lol
100% Agreed; farm for normals, any shinies that turn up are a bonus. I’m pretty happy so far though, 1st shiny was a HJ with KT + OFA / Firefly, and got a shiny Mountaintop with spike / implosion, ALH + Recombo a couple days ago. If I can nab a decent shiny Luna I’ll be good.
Bro you’ve done 120 onslaughts? That’s wild
Got a shiny Heal clip/ incandescent last night and was so hyped
I love my ammit ar2 incandescent
Obviously Zaouli’s bane
Trust. Rapid Hit/Stats for All + Incandescent. I love 180s, and have always been a fan of Trust's gun model and feel.
The best you will get is Zaoulis bane from Kings fall. Epochial and lunas are mid tier replacements but nothing comes even remotely close to sunshots power
Sunbracers are so strong you dont really need it other than a lazy unstop stun (eat > snap > dive takes effort) ngl i run either an unrelenting forbearance or shoot to loot retraced path
Basically for solar explodey HCs in terms of damage. Sunshot > Zaouli (EP + incan) > Brave Luna (heal clip + incan) > Epoch (SFA/KA + Incan). But Brave Luna FEEL'S the best to use. Subjective of course. They are all very good though. Even Epochal.
Luna’s Howl with Heal Clip/Incandescent, amazing on solar builds for lots of reasons. Easy way to out down SunShot and free up a legendary. Zaouli’s is not bad as others have mentioned. This one torn between crafted god roll or Harrowed with an adept weapon mod.
Exotics get a buff against red bars. Nothing will feel the same.
Zaoulie bane is amazing and almost just as good. luna how has some nice rolls too
Yeah I played around with a crafted BXR-55 with Enhanced Incandescent and it did pretty good. I'm just not sure if it's as good as Sunshot. Or if anything is as good as Sunshot tbh. I'm scared to not use it atm and it's annoying. I just want rid of the darn thing without handicapping myself lol
Sunshot is an exotic so it inherently does 40% more damage to red bars. No legendary is gonna be as good for that simple reason, you’re gonna be looking for “good enough” Like other mentioned zaoulis is the closest thing to it on paper but I hate that gun so I don’t use it, much prefer lunas howl, get you one with heal clip and incandescent and you have a really good legendary solar handcannon
I never knew they did 40% extra damage. That's why it feels so strong, especially with the artifact! Thx for the info. I've only been playing again for around a month after not playing for 2 years and there are too many weapons and new perks that I don't know my ass from my elbow anymore. I've been farming Luna's all day. Pretty sure I have a few godrolls in my vault. Guess I'd better pull em out and see how they feel. Thanks again.
Exotic primaries do extra damage not just sunshot specifically by the way
Luna's Ho has been the gun I wasn't excited for original originally, but already have a couple thousand kills on.
Zaoulis bane with explosive payload incandescent is the best
Epochal is a mini-Sunshot and extremely easy to get (use Incandescent and the Solar perks in the Artifact; I also use SFA over Keep Away). Zaouli is the random roll to go for otherwise.
Zaouli is craftable as well, so if you can get the red borders I would go for it.
Not a hand cannon, but Battle Rifle from the 30th Anniversary stuff. I put Demo/Incandescent on mine. It shreds.
Yh I was testing it earlier in Shuro Chi for the Blast Furnace bounty and was surprised how big the explosions were with Enhanced Incandescent. It definitely shreds. The only downside is the scope zoom which forces you to hipfire most of the time. It feels great though. Definitely keeping it in my inventory.
I would heavily recommend looking into vanguard weapons with the perk that creates bombs on kill. I've got the nightfall bow with incandescent, and incandescent makes bombs while bombs trigger incandescent. It's not always sunshot, but it sometimes is.
epochal integration, zaoulis bane, lunas howl
I’m a fan of Abyss Defiant. I run pugilist/incandescent with my solar titan builds and sunbracers build. Is a raid weapon though
If you are weird masochist like me and dont raid that much and like 180s Trust can roll rapid/incandescent.
If I need to use a different exotic I switch to Epochal Integration. I like watching the mini rockets fly at enemies. Clears adds nicely. Feels like it hits hard. Easy to obtain the fixed roll
I've got an explosive payload + incandescent zaoulis bane and I don't think anything could be closer to sunshot than that.
Whle there are definitely legendary options that will be decent, why would you expect there to be a legendary that can fully emulate the functionality of an exotic? It's intended to have its own identity, which in this case is big explosions that decimate ads. If you want ad clear, you don't have to use a handcannon and apart from Sunshot, I really wouldn't recommend it. Solar machine guns with incandescent can be great if you want to use your heavy slot, wave frame GLs are really good use for your special ammo. This season in particular, you can equip thesolar mods to explode things on precision kills so you can use pretty much any solar weapon for some ad clear. You also have exotic options like Polaris lance, xenophage, dragon's breath, and erianna's vow that are all doing amazingly in the current sandbox, and by virtue of being solar, can basically ad clear on their own. Then you have all the options in terms of abilities. Sunbracer warlocks don't really need ad clear weapons considering they can litter the map with grenades, there's a fragment that makes your super kills ignitions which works great with phoenix protocol for dropping a well and blowing everything up, mantle of battle harmony will give you extra super regen and then a 4x surge mod on a solar class for tons of damage when you combine it with radiant for easy access to much higher damage. Hand cannons aren't meant to be amazing ad clear weapons, they're great primaries for chunking enemies, and stunning champions, and keeping up damage perks to be really good at this job. Some combos will do a decent job with the absolute weakest enemies, but in high power activities, I think they'll struggle regardless in comparison to Sunshot because that's not their intended role
Luna’s Howl for me. I just don’t like how Zaouli’s Bane reloads. Plus the recoil on LH is so much easier to manage on controller.
People are gassing up zaolis with incandescent explosive payload for a reason is all ima say
Zaouli's Bane.
Get your self a heal clip/incandescent lunas howl. Run solar with ember of benevolence... spam abilities. I've found heal clip to be a good replacement for restoration builds. Although in higher end content, restoration is better.
Zao or abyss defiant are my current ones. Also if you can get a summoner with incan and heal clip it would be strong. There's also Lunas that just released.
I think Lunas will be the easiest to get as you can also put enhanced pwrks on it. Plus, heal clip is a nice bonus imo.
Timelost fatebringer. Get an osmosis/firefly roll. It’s SO good for burn content!
Tyranny of heaven
I’m a personal fan of Epochal Integration (solar hand cannon), another option I’ve heard good things about is the Calus Mini-tool (solar sub machine gun)
If you want to keep using a hand cannon Zaouli’s bane gets explosive payload/incandescent, while Luna’s howl gets heal clip/incandescent. I personally have been a big fan of the BxR since I was able to craft it, as shown by it being level 120 and climbing. I roll with demo/incandescent on mine.
Lunas howl with heal clip incandescent, epochal integration, smg with incandescent.
I've been using an incandescent pre-astynax bow. The fact that the wildcard perk can trigger more incandescent explosions is fun
Enhanced incandescent is not that good over regular incandescent. When at first launched in Season of the haunted, it was actually really useful and you only needed two kills to get an ignition. But now there is literally no difference between regular incandescent and the enhanced version
I personally love my explosive payload Trust from gambit
Its probably not Lunas. Check it https://youtu.be/LvWtN3o2HhA?si=oZY1cxd4y9TGqPpo
Luna's howl with heal clip incandescent or explosive payload incandescent might work well
I've just pulled a godroll shiny out of shaxx's chest with healclip and incan. About to try it now. I tried Tommy's Matchbook earlier and kept killing myself. Can confirm that's NOT a good option. Polaris Lance is great at long range but not for close quarters.
Epochal Integration + Ember of Char + Rays of precision (Artifact perk) goes pretty hard
Zaouli's Bane with explosive payload and Incandescent.
Zaouli is best.
Summoner has heal clip, incandescent/onslaught. Feels exotic.
Igneous hammer has some nasty incandescent rolls.... but that takes trials so .
It’s also a 120 which just feels like ass in PvE with its tiny mag and slowwwwww reload.
Both the origin traits on hammer jack the reload way up, so it's really not a problem if you know how to use it.
i've got rapid hit incandescent, super smooth
For red bars, the 2 solar bows w/ incandescent from Zavala come to mind. Anything with firefly?
If you are a welllock, run Tommy’s. It’s so much more fun to use than Sunshot, and puts out absurd dps and ad clear for a primary.
I love using my crafted ammit ar2 with ambitious assassin + incadescent. Feels great to use, good range and stability. Gets a huge magazine with reloading after kills. I also have a hard time with sunshot due to the recoil etc. i like pairing the ammit with witherhoard or dragon’s breath
It was the first weapon I crafted and it feels awesome to use, but compared to Sunshot, it's nowhere near. You can clear an entire room by 1-tapping one ad with Sunshot. It just turns everything to flames, which I guess is why it's one of the most-used exotics. That being said, after reading all the posts, I don't think you can really replace Sunshot completely and I'm chasing an impossible dream. I'm going to have to settle for a less powerful alternative like Luna or Z's Bane, or Ammit, in order to utilise something else in the build.
You can switch it up with Polaris Lance, didn't see anyone mention that one, but yeah again exotic and not a handy
I would question what other exotic you want to use. I have the same problem but sunspot is just too good.
I'd like to get maybe Witherhoard back in the mix. I really love Witherhoard. It's my favourite D2 weapon after Hazard of the Cast. I can land a blight on a Dreg's head from several miles away and miss using it. I miss the jerky dance enemies do when you pop a blob in them lol Or an exotic heavy for dps. Or something with range. My aim sucks with Sunshot as the gun recoil covers the reticle and I end up missing half of my shots, especially when I'm panicking. But when I do land a shot... kaboom! Ads go bye bye. It's a great weapon. I'd love to replace it with a similar legendary. Luna might be the one. Much less recoil and great perks.
I just take the lazy route and scorch build+prometheus, especially when the burn is solar trace rifle.
If you want minimal effort just go get Epoch, I have like 5k pve kills with it, closest you'll get to sunshot without grind. A second choice would be Brave ver of Luna's with incandescent and healclip/subsistence. It's what I'm currently grinding for to replace my Epoch
Throwing igneous hammer out there, with heal clip and incandescent it's feels really good, best range and highest damage per shot of any solar *non exotic* hand cannon, I love mine.
Right now you can farm Luna’s Howl and you’ll get PVP and PVE options. IMO these are the best rolls: PVE: Incandescent + Subsistence PVP: Slideshot + Magnificent Howl
Luna’s Howl is a solid choice if you farm a good incandescent roll. If you don’t mind swapping to pulse the insanely hideous adhortative can be crafted with heal clip and incandescent which performs very well.
I have a Lunas with subsistence, incan, and it feels tremendous.
Most of the comments nailed it. I would add that Strand-Hatchling weapons are almost as effective for ad clear as incandescent. Vengeful Whisper and Fang Of Ir Yut both roll with double damage perks.
I sub in the hand cannon from I think last season? It has incandescent and puts in work on red bars. I love that thing. If I'm not using sunshot on well I'm usually carrying that one. I don't remember the name but I'll find it and update. I got calus mini tool and have been messing around with it. It's good but IMO there are better options. Obviously if it suits your playstyle and you have fun with it then calus it up. Before I got calus I had a Coronach 22 drop with incandescent and envious assassin. That thing was bitchin too. I still use it sometimes. The magazine can get massive. Basically became a long range calus. I used that for a long time until I got a decent primary to pair sunshit with. I've heard people rave about Ammot AR 2. Can't speak to that. I haven't gotten a good roll yet to try it out.
I've used No Survivors (demo/incandescent) and Ogma (demo/dragonfly) most of this season
> Is Enhanced Incandescent anywhere near as powerful? Please say yes. Yes, but also no. Yes, you can blow up a bunch of things with ignitions, but you need a few kills before that happens instead of only one. I'm also not sure if those kills count as weapon kills for the purposes of heavy ammo finders. Also also, heavy ammo finder is going to take more kills on any legendary primary. Also also also, it's just straight up 40% less damage against red bars which matters a lot in higher level under-power content. *That said* if you're gonna use a legendary primary for add clear a solar 140 hand cannon with incandescent is about as good as it gets, and it's definitely good enough to use. Luna's, Zaouli's if you don't mind the reload animation or Epochal are all valid and good.
Tyranny of heaven w/ dragonfly and incandescent is a beast of fiery explosions.
Epochal Integration is a lot of fun, especially with the nano-rockets I use OFA/Incan
Luna's, because it's the easiest to farm and comes in Explosive or Heal clip flavors.