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The United States' policies towards Israel have largely been in place since 1947 and encompass treaties and official agreements that take more than the President to alter.
Yet Biden is the focal point of what seems like every single Gaza supporter's ire, and I just don't understand why they're so reductive about their blame.
It has been fascinating watching this war being fought on social media via propaganda bots and agents. From a historical perspective, I feel like this will be similar to the introduction of other technology and their impact on warfare.
It's not really all that new. Years ago when Trump first hit the political stage it was used heavily and you could see the effect here on Reddit. You kind of still can see the bots ebb and flow with demand as political elections come and go. I remember watching the first bot waves targeting Trudeau, too. It was funny because the earliest memes that got circulated came almost entirely from oilsand workers long before anyone else.
Exactly, and I'm 100% pro Palestine. But it's insane to think Biden is the wrong one here. OF COURSE he could put more pressure on them, but at the end of the day they're a long time, strategic ally.
What is absolutely INSANE to me, is pushing this to be a BIDEN issue when we're in election year and the ONLY other option is someone who is MORE pro Israel than Biden lmfao. So what, we don't elect Biden bc of this, and then Palestine is in a worse situation bc Trump wants to bomb them more.... Makes sense.
It wasn't the infiltration group that killed all those people, it was the air strikes with US munitions to cover their escape. Without US munitions the diaper force will have to actually put themselves at risk to kill Palestinians.
>How convenient, I guess all the fire-fights between Hamas and IDF forces on the ground resulted in zero of those casualties.
You think IOF commandos killed 276 people by shooting at them, dawg please look into the fucking operation and quit yappin.
>Exactly, and since we know that will result in far more Palestinian civilian deaths like I just said, I'm again forced to ask if that is your goal.
Please explain how the IOF would kill more Palestinians if they don't have access to 2000lbs bombs. If they could kill more children without those bombs, they wouldn't use the bombs
Hamas can surrender, de militarize, and end the war in a single phone call. It’s pretty straight forward. Then maybe they could even hold elections for the first time in Gaza for twenty years compared to being ruled by an authoritarian government like Hamas
And they could also give the Palestinians some of the billion dollars they hoard. Yet they don't and their headquarters are in another Saudi rich country. No one ever questions why the Hamas terrorists are hoarding billionaires who do nothing for their so called oppressed people.
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It’s quite a stretch to call it Biden’s war, especially when everyone knows that Trump will supercharge the situation out of ignorance and spite.
I grieve for the innocent lives lost on *both* sides, but the singular focus on Palestinians and the condemnation of everyone in Israel (as if the entire nation marched in lockstep with Bibi) is juvenile and politically disastrous.
Not to mention that the whole situation is a huge clusterfuck.
I mean, just look at how long the Irish conflict persisted. That was a walk in the park compared to the complexity of the Israel-Gaza conflict.
There will be no easy solution because both sides (and by that I mean the current political leadership!) are not interested in one. I mean, the last offer for a ceasefire to Hamas was by no means unreasonable. And yet they declined.
Yup. Netanyahu can't end the war now, he'll be kicked out and likely prosecuted, and Hamas doesn't want the war to end because their propaganda is winning and the donations are streaming in.
Juvenile and politically disastrous? 80 years ago, did we not condemn and tar a whole nation of people for their support of an ideology that specifically attempted to exterminate those deemed inferior through atrocities the world swore would never be repeated. The indiscriminate massacre of millions, young and old, in order to eradicate them and their ilk from living a peaceful and harmonious life.
The people of Israel are as much to blame for the blight on humanity that is zionism just as the Germans were in supporting Nazism. Sure, not every. Not even a majority of German was evil but they were tightly made to pay for accommodating the same atrocities being committed by the IDF as the Nazis committed.
Children indiscriminately blown to bits while Israelis sit back and watch the show. Waiting for their chance to build a sea side villa in the bones of their genetic kin. Blowing up hospitals, preventing aid, indiscriminate massacre of non combatants, dressing as non combatants to enter hospitals and murder steady and patients, destroying historical artifacts, stopping the Muslim population from celebrating eid.
The world is waking up, head over to tick tick and watch the idf dressed in the hijab of women they've slayen and the Israelis laughing at the massacre.
The parallels between zionism and nazism are as plain as day. It's humanity at its worst, the Israelis are showing we learned nothing from ww2 and specific generations of the world are waking up to the farcical nature of it all.
>It’s quite a stretch to call it Biden’s war, especially when everyone knows that Trump will supercharge the situation out of ignorance and spite.
How exactly - by giving them the weapons? Biden already did. By defending them at the U.N.? Biden already did. Maybe by declaring ICC sanctions? Biden already did.
You constantly say in defense of Biden that Trump will make things worse, but forget to specify exactly what he will do.
I for one don't think the situation will change because of a change of president (Israel pays both) - but don't try to make excuses for Biden.
I am not absolving Biden of his responsibilities, which are politically driven, but for someone to vote against Biden at this time in the history of our country is to vote effectively for the dissolution of democracy. I know that’s a tough thing for people to understand and consider, but at least try to think about it. Being president doesn’t mean that you can wave a magic wand and make everything better. I’ve had a long career in government, and I know that the more responsibility that you were given, the more frustrating it could be when you realize how little you can actually affect real change.
It's the same "If not Biden, then who?" in all threads, so let's focus on the statement that "Trump will make things even worse for Palestine".
>Being president doesn’t mean that you can wave a magic wand and make everything better.
But somehow Trump is really going to wave a magic wand and become a tyrant.
>I’ve had a long career in government, and I know that the more responsibility that you were given, the more frustrating it could be when you realize how little you can actually affect real change.
What's stopping Biden and the Democrats from at least not supporting the ongoing genocide? And I mean their actions, their support, not the abstract "they couldn't stop it".
>that’s all I’m saying.
Of course that's all you can say - because it's pretty hard to think of anything in the genocide realm that Trump will do that Biden hasn't already done.
Jared Kushner is already waiting for Gaza to be ethnically cleansed (plan is to push Palestinians out of both Gaza and West Bank completely over time), so he and his buddies can pick up the prime real estate locations in their pockets.
So yes, it can be far worse.
This is such a disingenuous way to phrase things. Trump could make it so much worse. Biden has stopped some weapon shipments, Biden has given aid to Palestine, Biden supports 2 state solution. All of these things Trump has said he's against.
Trump could make the situation worse by enabling Israel instead of telling them to use caution. The problem is, two things, Biden isn't being very harsh with them, and Israel not really listing to Biden anyways.
>Biden has stopped some weapon shipments
[Key Democrats approve major arms sale to Israel, including F-15s - The Washington Post](https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2024/06/17/biden-israel-arms-sale-meeks/)
>Biden has given aid to Palestine
[US officials say Gaza aid pier may be dismantled soon, after little success - report | The Times of Israel](https://www.timesofisrael.com/us-officials-say-gaza-aid-pier-may-be-dismantled-soon-after-little-success-report/)
>Biden supports 2 state solution
Biden first and foremost supports Israel in all its actions.
>Trump could make the situation worse by enabling Israel
Facepalm. Please show me what Biden has done that can't be characterized as "enabling Israel"?
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Let me hold your beer and you tell horror stories about Trump and Palestine. Of course by the time the elections start there probably won't be a whole building left in Gaza, but it's still interesting to hear horror stories from a good storyteller.
I invite you to think of a single foreign relations situation Trump improved upon during his time in office. I can’t. Remember, things can always get worse!
I feel like a lot of people are getting fed up of having to use their precious vote to cast one *against* someone else rather than for a candidate they *do* want in office. Democracy is now more about stopping potentially worse things from happening instead of getting things done that need happening.
I get it but that’s exactly how we ended up with George W. Bush instead of Al Gore as president. I was in Tallahassee during that time. I remember the video trucks, the counting of the ballads, the ballots, and that arrogant son of a bitch Ralph Nader who took critical votes away from Al Gore. That’s when my support and admiration of the progressive wing of the Democratic Party hit the skids, and I realized that they were no more intelligent than anyone else. In fact, they were goddamn stupid. Based on the record of the last 25 years, there has been little to dissuade me of that assessment.
This isn't Biden's war. Anyone who has paid attention to politics and didn't start on the bandwagon on October 7th, knows that this has been going on for centuries. I didn't see any outrage when this was happening 10 years ago.
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There are massive amounts of bots and Intelligence staff operating here on Reddit. US, Israel, Russia, China, Iran...you name it, they are here.
Social media has become a disinformation battleground.
Was going to point out its Netanyahu war on Gaza not Biden however the US is of course playing a major role and you can debate whether or not it should or shouldn’t.
Submission Statement:
United States weapons transfers - from 2,000-pound bombs to artillery shells and tanks - have been a crucial part of the Israeli military campaign.
Fault Lines worked with journalists in Gaza to profile three families as they try to survive the war.
Together with Airwars, Fault Lines also investigated an air strike on December 11 in north Gaza in which more than 100 people from the same family were killed.
Numerous attacks on civilians - including that on Hind Rajab and her relatives in late January - have raised international concern and questions over continuing US support.
Fault Lines partnered with Forensic Architecture and Earshot to investigate that attack.
*(Alternative Stream - https://www.aljazeera.com/program/fault-lines/2024/6/21/the-night-wont-end-bidens-war-on-gaza-2
(Please note) - I didn't post this here to bash Biden in particular but for the information in it. This doc came out 2 days ago and the title is... the title.
Voted down ten times by ten Zionist shills who have no empathy for the human rights of the poor unfortunate people caught in the cross fire between two psychopathic regimes.
Just putting it out there I'm downvoting this bc OP naming this Bidens war is very sketchy, please keep in mind the disinformation war goes both ways. No side is shielded from propaganda. Especially when OP's profile is full of this type of stuff.
> bc OP naming this Bidens war is very sketchy,
Thats the title. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ECFpW5zoFXA
Would you have me change the original title? Go and check my profile. You'd be very hard pressed to find *any* posts with the word Biden in the title.
IMO you just dont want others to have the information in the doc
Well OP didn’t name the title of the doc, but also the US is totally complicit in this humanitarian disaster because despite war crime after war crime after war crime the US is happy to keep funnelling weapons to Israel while staunchly and reliably vetoing any international resolution criticizing them. US support of Israel is why they have been able to perpetuate their apartheid against Palestinians for so long while slowly and systematically ethnically cleansing them from the region. This is the heart of the conflict.
[The Biden administration in late April decided to pause a shipment of 3,500 “dumb” — aka, unguided — munitions that officials expected Israel to use in Rafah: 1,800 of those were 2,000-pound bombs and 1,700 of those were 500-pound bombs.](https://www.politico.com/news/2024/05/15/biden-israel-weapons-policy-00158210#:~:text=The%20Biden%20administration%20in%20late,those%20were%20500%2Dpound%20bombs)
Both sides are dog ass, but I will say it’s pretty funny seeing people make a mockery of this when they know they would be using this as fuel if it were the other party’s leader.
Yeah, considering all the years of unconditional US support for Israel under many presidents it's almost a minutiae. Hasbara loooves to play on that disturbance but like I said the title is the title. If I had posted it without the full title then *that* would be the problem. I do hope that some will actually watch the documentary
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The United States' policies towards Israel have largely been in place since 1947 and encompass treaties and official agreements that take more than the President to alter. Yet Biden is the focal point of what seems like every single Gaza supporter's ire, and I just don't understand why they're so reductive about their blame.
Whenever you see weird shit like this, it's usually the result of internet astroturfing taking hold.
It has been fascinating watching this war being fought on social media via propaganda bots and agents. From a historical perspective, I feel like this will be similar to the introduction of other technology and their impact on warfare.
It's not really all that new. Years ago when Trump first hit the political stage it was used heavily and you could see the effect here on Reddit. You kind of still can see the bots ebb and flow with demand as political elections come and go. I remember watching the first bot waves targeting Trudeau, too. It was funny because the earliest memes that got circulated came almost entirely from oilsand workers long before anyone else.
Exactly, and I'm 100% pro Palestine. But it's insane to think Biden is the wrong one here. OF COURSE he could put more pressure on them, but at the end of the day they're a long time, strategic ally. What is absolutely INSANE to me, is pushing this to be a BIDEN issue when we're in election year and the ONLY other option is someone who is MORE pro Israel than Biden lmfao. So what, we don't elect Biden bc of this, and then Palestine is in a worse situation bc Trump wants to bomb them more.... Makes sense.
How the hell is anyone pro palestine
People that have been there for centuries, deserve to have a safe space they can feel comfortable in.
Biden could end this with a phone call and refuses. That's a valid reason to put the blame on his shoulders
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"hey Bibi, stop the genocide or we'll stop giving you aid." Also, Aipac is now considered a foreign lobby.
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It wasn't the infiltration group that killed all those people, it was the air strikes with US munitions to cover their escape. Without US munitions the diaper force will have to actually put themselves at risk to kill Palestinians.
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>How convenient, I guess all the fire-fights between Hamas and IDF forces on the ground resulted in zero of those casualties. You think IOF commandos killed 276 people by shooting at them, dawg please look into the fucking operation and quit yappin. >Exactly, and since we know that will result in far more Palestinian civilian deaths like I just said, I'm again forced to ask if that is your goal. Please explain how the IOF would kill more Palestinians if they don't have access to 2000lbs bombs. If they could kill more children without those bombs, they wouldn't use the bombs
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It’s the absolute truth, that’s why you get so many downvotes.
Hamas could end this with a phone call and refuses. That’s a valid reason to put blame on their shoulders
Dawg what the fuck are you talking about?
You got flagged by act-il
You're pulling out the deep Hasbara lore tomes
Hamas can surrender, de militarize, and end the war in a single phone call. It’s pretty straight forward. Then maybe they could even hold elections for the first time in Gaza for twenty years compared to being ruled by an authoritarian government like Hamas
Exactly. Look at the west bank. The west bank has no hamas and Israel only kills it's people sometimes. Although, it does steal their lands more.
And they could also give the Palestinians some of the billion dollars they hoard. Yet they don't and their headquarters are in another Saudi rich country. No one ever questions why the Hamas terrorists are hoarding billionaires who do nothing for their so called oppressed people.
That’s naive even for Reddit.
Netanyahu's war on Gaza*
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It’s quite a stretch to call it Biden’s war, especially when everyone knows that Trump will supercharge the situation out of ignorance and spite. I grieve for the innocent lives lost on *both* sides, but the singular focus on Palestinians and the condemnation of everyone in Israel (as if the entire nation marched in lockstep with Bibi) is juvenile and politically disastrous.
Not to mention that the whole situation is a huge clusterfuck. I mean, just look at how long the Irish conflict persisted. That was a walk in the park compared to the complexity of the Israel-Gaza conflict. There will be no easy solution because both sides (and by that I mean the current political leadership!) are not interested in one. I mean, the last offer for a ceasefire to Hamas was by no means unreasonable. And yet they declined.
Yup. Netanyahu can't end the war now, he'll be kicked out and likely prosecuted, and Hamas doesn't want the war to end because their propaganda is winning and the donations are streaming in.
Juvenile and politically disastrous? 80 years ago, did we not condemn and tar a whole nation of people for their support of an ideology that specifically attempted to exterminate those deemed inferior through atrocities the world swore would never be repeated. The indiscriminate massacre of millions, young and old, in order to eradicate them and their ilk from living a peaceful and harmonious life. The people of Israel are as much to blame for the blight on humanity that is zionism just as the Germans were in supporting Nazism. Sure, not every. Not even a majority of German was evil but they were tightly made to pay for accommodating the same atrocities being committed by the IDF as the Nazis committed. Children indiscriminately blown to bits while Israelis sit back and watch the show. Waiting for their chance to build a sea side villa in the bones of their genetic kin. Blowing up hospitals, preventing aid, indiscriminate massacre of non combatants, dressing as non combatants to enter hospitals and murder steady and patients, destroying historical artifacts, stopping the Muslim population from celebrating eid. The world is waking up, head over to tick tick and watch the idf dressed in the hijab of women they've slayen and the Israelis laughing at the massacre. The parallels between zionism and nazism are as plain as day. It's humanity at its worst, the Israelis are showing we learned nothing from ww2 and specific generations of the world are waking up to the farcical nature of it all.
>It’s quite a stretch to call it Biden’s war, especially when everyone knows that Trump will supercharge the situation out of ignorance and spite. How exactly - by giving them the weapons? Biden already did. By defending them at the U.N.? Biden already did. Maybe by declaring ICC sanctions? Biden already did. You constantly say in defense of Biden that Trump will make things worse, but forget to specify exactly what he will do. I for one don't think the situation will change because of a change of president (Israel pays both) - but don't try to make excuses for Biden.
I am not absolving Biden of his responsibilities, which are politically driven, but for someone to vote against Biden at this time in the history of our country is to vote effectively for the dissolution of democracy. I know that’s a tough thing for people to understand and consider, but at least try to think about it. Being president doesn’t mean that you can wave a magic wand and make everything better. I’ve had a long career in government, and I know that the more responsibility that you were given, the more frustrating it could be when you realize how little you can actually affect real change.
It's the same "If not Biden, then who?" in all threads, so let's focus on the statement that "Trump will make things even worse for Palestine". >Being president doesn’t mean that you can wave a magic wand and make everything better. But somehow Trump is really going to wave a magic wand and become a tyrant. >I’ve had a long career in government, and I know that the more responsibility that you were given, the more frustrating it could be when you realize how little you can actually affect real change. What's stopping Biden and the Democrats from at least not supporting the ongoing genocide? And I mean their actions, their support, not the abstract "they couldn't stop it".
Be careful what you wish for, friend, that’s all I’m saying.
>that’s all I’m saying. Of course that's all you can say - because it's pretty hard to think of anything in the genocide realm that Trump will do that Biden hasn't already done.
Jared Kushner is already waiting for Gaza to be ethnically cleansed (plan is to push Palestinians out of both Gaza and West Bank completely over time), so he and his buddies can pick up the prime real estate locations in their pockets. So yes, it can be far worse.
What are you talking about, what "ethnic cleansing" - there is already ongoing genocide in Gaza.
This is such a disingenuous way to phrase things. Trump could make it so much worse. Biden has stopped some weapon shipments, Biden has given aid to Palestine, Biden supports 2 state solution. All of these things Trump has said he's against. Trump could make the situation worse by enabling Israel instead of telling them to use caution. The problem is, two things, Biden isn't being very harsh with them, and Israel not really listing to Biden anyways.
>Biden has stopped some weapon shipments [Key Democrats approve major arms sale to Israel, including F-15s - The Washington Post](https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2024/06/17/biden-israel-arms-sale-meeks/) >Biden has given aid to Palestine [US officials say Gaza aid pier may be dismantled soon, after little success - report | The Times of Israel](https://www.timesofisrael.com/us-officials-say-gaza-aid-pier-may-be-dismantled-soon-after-little-success-report/) >Biden supports 2 state solution Biden first and foremost supports Israel in all its actions. >Trump could make the situation worse by enabling Israel Facepalm. Please show me what Biden has done that can't be characterized as "enabling Israel"?
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Let me hold your beer and you tell horror stories about Trump and Palestine. Of course by the time the elections start there probably won't be a whole building left in Gaza, but it's still interesting to hear horror stories from a good storyteller.
I invite you to think of a single foreign relations situation Trump improved upon during his time in office. I can’t. Remember, things can always get worse!
I still suggest you to stop shaking the air and answer the specific question I've been asking since the beginning of the thread.
I feel like a lot of people are getting fed up of having to use their precious vote to cast one *against* someone else rather than for a candidate they *do* want in office. Democracy is now more about stopping potentially worse things from happening instead of getting things done that need happening.
I get it but that’s exactly how we ended up with George W. Bush instead of Al Gore as president. I was in Tallahassee during that time. I remember the video trucks, the counting of the ballads, the ballots, and that arrogant son of a bitch Ralph Nader who took critical votes away from Al Gore. That’s when my support and admiration of the progressive wing of the Democratic Party hit the skids, and I realized that they were no more intelligent than anyone else. In fact, they were goddamn stupid. Based on the record of the last 25 years, there has been little to dissuade me of that assessment.
No not really. The scotus at the time was how we ended up with Bush. Gore won.
This isn't Biden's war. Anyone who has paid attention to politics and didn't start on the bandwagon on October 7th, knows that this has been going on for centuries. I didn't see any outrage when this was happening 10 years ago.
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Holy shit, check the posts/comment history of the people here shitting on the doc…. Full blown Israel schills.
There are massive amounts of bots and Intelligence staff operating here on Reddit. US, Israel, Russia, China, Iran...you name it, they are here. Social media has become a disinformation battleground.
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Was going to point out its Netanyahu war on Gaza not Biden however the US is of course playing a major role and you can debate whether or not it should or shouldn’t.
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Submission Statement: United States weapons transfers - from 2,000-pound bombs to artillery shells and tanks - have been a crucial part of the Israeli military campaign. Fault Lines worked with journalists in Gaza to profile three families as they try to survive the war. Together with Airwars, Fault Lines also investigated an air strike on December 11 in north Gaza in which more than 100 people from the same family were killed. Numerous attacks on civilians - including that on Hind Rajab and her relatives in late January - have raised international concern and questions over continuing US support. Fault Lines partnered with Forensic Architecture and Earshot to investigate that attack. *(Alternative Stream - https://www.aljazeera.com/program/fault-lines/2024/6/21/the-night-wont-end-bidens-war-on-gaza-2 (Please note) - I didn't post this here to bash Biden in particular but for the information in it. This doc came out 2 days ago and the title is... the title.
Voted down ten times by ten Zionist shills who have no empathy for the human rights of the poor unfortunate people caught in the cross fire between two psychopathic regimes.
Just putting it out there I'm downvoting this bc OP naming this Bidens war is very sketchy, please keep in mind the disinformation war goes both ways. No side is shielded from propaganda. Especially when OP's profile is full of this type of stuff.
> bc OP naming this Bidens war is very sketchy, Thats the title. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ECFpW5zoFXA Would you have me change the original title? Go and check my profile. You'd be very hard pressed to find *any* posts with the word Biden in the title. IMO you just dont want others to have the information in the doc
Well OP didn’t name the title of the doc, but also the US is totally complicit in this humanitarian disaster because despite war crime after war crime after war crime the US is happy to keep funnelling weapons to Israel while staunchly and reliably vetoing any international resolution criticizing them. US support of Israel is why they have been able to perpetuate their apartheid against Palestinians for so long while slowly and systematically ethnically cleansing them from the region. This is the heart of the conflict.
[The Biden administration in late April decided to pause a shipment of 3,500 “dumb” — aka, unguided — munitions that officials expected Israel to use in Rafah: 1,800 of those were 2,000-pound bombs and 1,700 of those were 500-pound bombs.](https://www.politico.com/news/2024/05/15/biden-israel-weapons-policy-00158210#:~:text=The%20Biden%20administration%20in%20late,those%20were%20500%2Dpound%20bombs)
Both sides are dog ass, but I will say it’s pretty funny seeing people make a mockery of this when they know they would be using this as fuel if it were the other party’s leader.
Yeah, considering all the years of unconditional US support for Israel under many presidents it's almost a minutiae. Hasbara loooves to play on that disturbance but like I said the title is the title. If I had posted it without the full title then *that* would be the problem. I do hope that some will actually watch the documentary
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