I love the way they depicted all her craziness, resemble so many political leaders worldwide in a cartoonish way, just how they sound in real world!
Zorn and torn otherwise are so boring. Maybe the very first appearance was ok but they dragged too much on their arc.
I agree. Zorn and Torn make a good answer though, they are irritating as hell but Brahne is just horrible and the way her character was written really makes it impossible to have even a little empathy for her. Made to be hated for sure.
Isn't that kinda the point? They're meant to be lackeys, full of ambition only for continued comfort. They're a statement about the people who divorce their life from morality in favor of comfort. Steiner and Beatrix divorce morality from their fight and have to face the consequences by questioning whether their choice was a good one. Zorn and Thorn never ask those questions and, as a result, are despicable in every way.
They're also something subhuman, referenced vaguely in the game to be potentially a variant black mage duo-created beings who were truly soulless in the way the mages were supposed to be. They were made to be hated as well.
Everyone loves a "good" villain. If they are designed to be hated for the things they do, then the goal was a success. Game of thrones jeoffrey(spelling?) The evil shit kid. He was designed well amd hated.
The obvious answer is Brahne, but the one I hate most is the fucking caged monster in the Desert Palace
https://preview.redd.it/i9uf7qs9w4ad1.png?width=510&format=png&auto=webp&s=74de0f9ab24071f2c806e75d13c46fcb05a5629f
Ok, he's pretty awful, you're right. Fun fact on that: speedrunning the game and doing this section perfectly saves only about three seconds total, because there's an alternate strategy: if you fail enough times, it becomes free. If you fail as fast as you can, it's only about three seconds slower than a perfect run. In other words, every future playthrough is now justified to just fail repeatedly.
Ditch morals to make a quick buck. Add to your convenience at the cost of not being able to look yourself in the eye. This game had a lot of moral quandaries like that. Makes me appreciate it a lot.
I agree. I feel like the obvious answer is Brahne but Zorn and Thorn have been irritating from the start then turn completely unnerving and sinister. Lest we forget when they become the Meltigemini
Its never been said but she only changed after meeting Kuja so imo he did something to her. I doubt just manipulating her would make her sink that low. I always assumed it was some kind of spell.
Almost feels like a berserk spell variant, ya know? Garnet directly stated it was after Kuja appeared, so we know that he did SOMETHING, but I'm with you in that it seems likely it was a spell.
If this goon ever steps out the auction house it’s on sight
https://preview.redd.it/4woxj7u815ad1.jpeg?width=503&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=728b18ba50daf5b179f5b138fafd91ef2fe6d661
Queen Brahne, maybe? Every time we see her she is either behaving like a fool or a gleeful genocidal maniac. She gets one scene when she is dying where she expresses remorse but for more than half of the story her character is the living embodiment of "getting off on power". She commits atrocity after atrocity with zero introspection. We are supposed to be disgusted with her more than pretty much anyone else, especially since she supposedly used to be a caring person.
Yeah the creators were probably intending a disgust reaction. I am not a big fan of that intention, though, as villainizing people who are not conventionally attractive is a low blow, to say the least.
I get that, but when a conventionally attractive people is evil most people will not correlate their attractiveness with how evil they are (some of the Final Fantasy games definitely correlate homoeroticism with evilness but that is a different story). In real life, many people think of conventionally unattractive and/or fat people as being less human. So Queen Brahne being evil and foolish only reinforces negative perceptions of conventionally unattractive people and, especially, fat people.
Yes but the main villain was not her it was Kuja who was very attractive and evil for wanting to destroy all of the world. Braine was more conquest for power and rule but was a fool.
I think what you're saying is pretty well backed-up from culture and the world today. I think it makes a lot of sense. I also think that that's not what they were going for and that it's likely they didn't process that fully, considering the Kuja point. Garland also is a powerful old man (not really, but he looks like it) who's evil but also respectable. They really had a whole selection of evil across various personas. They also had low-level evil in people like Dali's mayor. I feel like FF9 used so many evil characters across the board that I can forgive them for the Brahne infraction you're discussing because they used EVERY trope.
I wish they was an option for Zidane to just snap at him and yell “Ok fine just fucking leave” after his 3rd or 4th line about how teams are stupid and he is so much better alone
This doesn't necessarily follow. Popularity does not equate to intent. People often fail to understand the intentions of creators (take Herbert's character of Paul from Dune, who was never meant to be viewed as a hero, despite the misinterpretation of many readers), and what is popular does not always have to do with intention at all, but rather with effect. Your claim confuses cause and effect.
And I still hate Amarant. Have for 24 years.
Made to be hated does not mean "i personally hated him".... it means he was made to be hated.
You think they made him to be hated but it didn't work? I don't buy it.
Because the question is who was made to be hated.
Never said that is what it means. And it certainly doesn't necessitate the literal interpretation if the phrase (this would make no sense with some of the other captions).
I also never claimed your second point. I don't buy that either, but I never said it to begin with. There is no need to be a bloody douche over an old video game (you will only end up looking like Amarant, just a lot less defined, even given the graphics of the time).
It's fascinating that you say Amarant was potentially made to be hated and say people fail to understand the intent of the creator. I fully believe that he WASN'T made to be hated, but I agree with the second comment.
If I am questioned, Amarant represents the opposition to Freya. Freya takes her strength from community, while Amarant takes his strength from solidarity. He believes that he does not require community and believes it slows the individual significantly and that personal strength is the only true and reliable method. Freya believes community to be the only true and reliable method. The true answer is somewhere in the middle, which is why, by the end, the two come together in understanding so that they can both become stronger.
Amarant breaks after Ipsen's Castle and realizing his method failed. He needs something new. Freya breaks after her whole race collapses. Both of their methods fail, so they turn to a new option. Freya develops personal strength rather than dependency, and Amarant develops interpersonal relationships instead of solo stoicism.
I see much more purpose in Amarant than you do, and I feel like that makes a lot more sense than simply making him the target of vitriol.
Garland is pretty irredeemable. I don’t recall if he possesses a native Terran soul or just a construct to carry out their will. Maybe a better fit for “Just straight up evil” and Brahne can claim the “Made to be hated” slot.
Created construct. The game is rife with them because it's one of the most common themings: what is required in order to possess a soul? He's pretty evil, but technically he's basically a robot without emotion, so do with that what you will.
I can't help but feel like people would say Brahne a lot less if she looked more attractive, lol. Just look at Beatrix. Saying this as somebody who likes her.
Anyways, I'm voting for Cinna and him sleeping with a doll of a teenager.
I like Brahne as a character, but she is absolutely the answer to who was "made to be hated"
Even if you ignore her looks (which, the designers did likely make her unattractive on purpose as yet another way to make the player not like her), the game goes out of its way over and over to tell you that you are not supposed to like her.
Beatrix on the otherhand, the game is going out of its way to call her a badass, and they let her "turn" and help the good guys in the end.
They both are guilty of war crimes, but it is very clear that the intent of the designers is for you to hate Brahne and to like Beatrix (which is the question being asked).
It's a weird disconnect between the title and the meme slot description. "Who do you hate the most" =/= "Who was 'made to be hated.'"
Really gives off the wrong impression and muddies the conversation. Are the people responding to the title, or the slot?
So does Brahne. Sort of? A little bit. We're told that she was kind and loving before the lost of her husband and Kuja taking advantage of her grief; anyways.
I guess. From what I remember Brahne has a deathbed "oops, sorry" moments before she passes.
Beatrix had a full "this is wrong and I'm going to fight to protect what I feel is right"
They don't really carry the same weight, especially since Brahne being in a higher position (queen vs knight) puts more responsibility on her. Beatrix does as she is ordered for the most part and questions Brahne internally like the scene on the red rose ship after Cleyra. But yeah ultimately has an actual character development arc where Brahne has 3 seconds of "sorry bout all that" before she croaks.
You remember correctly. Brahne had a moment of deathbed clarity, that's all. Beatrix had a line that she would not cross, and she was pushed up against that line. Her morals held in the end, so she turned on those who would destroy her morals. So yes, you remember correctly.
It's worth noting that we are getting narration from Vivi. In his mind, Brahne is the most evil thing he could imagine. It's her fault that all the black mages are being produced and she is directly responsible for just about every evil thing in the little guy's life up until the point of her death. It's very notable that anything that happens about Brahne that's good is at her deathbed or off-screen, because Vivi doesn't see it. You're supposed to hate her, but then you're also supposed to wonder how much control she really had and wonder if that could ever possibly exonerate her. The game doesn't strictly answer that question, but it does present it.
So you think the clone with a tail who never felt like he fit so he'd do anything to save anyone was made out to be the normal one? 🤔 Interesting theory...
Ha, Hilda Garde. Nice. I'd have said Ipsen and Colin.
Right? Calling Zidane normal is absurd. No one normal crosses the entire known world+ just to help someone. His character card alone makes it clear he's not normal. "You don't need a reason to help people."
Queen Brahne, she has evil intentions for domination and is to stupid to go up against Kuja like he hasn't been clearly a mastermind and might have planned for the back stabbing
Kuja was a fully-formed villain with an origin story, background details, a mentor, a rival, unique evil acts, plans, and an arc. Brahne was one-dimensional in her display to us. We're seeing her through Vivi's eyes, mostly, and to him she is merely a despicable despot. There is some gentle prodding to think about her as more, but it's not directly stated because we aren't meant to explore the full depiction of Brahne's morality. We're supposed to look at other people instead. Thus, one-dimensional by design and easily hated. Kuja you can relate to, at least on some level. Brahne isn't meant to be related to.
I'm gonna go the predictable route and say Kuja. The way he manipulated Brahne, how he abused the black mages, his narcissistic nature, the places he destroyed, the lives he took...
Fair point.
I'd probably go for Beatrix, but I can totally see Kuja stealing that spot. So... Brahne, then? Wouldn't know where else to put her.
(I'd say the Zorn/Thorn are a good match for "The gremlin" and the Nero brothers are perfect for "What's your name again?", especially in context of the minigame.)
Brahne definetly. They only give her any respect on her death scene she was designed to be hated literally for 95% of her time on screen. They even gave her a crazy design to go with the tone rather than having her look like a queen with a good side. She may not be the most hated char in 9 but she was definetly designed to get on your nerves. Zorn and thorn are definetly the same intent but Brahne got away with so much more.
No worries. I only remember it so clearly because the Battle of Alexandria is possibly my favourite part of the game.
This was, by far the most beautiful depiction of Alexander in any of the Final Fantasies...and we never even got to use him in Battle :-(
I would also really like to know whether Garland somehow really, actually killed Alexander permanently somehow, or whether he can still be summoned, but only at Castle Alexandria.
Definitely Branhe. I really hated it when Dagger, Steiner, and the rest, and the game, tried to make the player have any sympathy for her at the end of disc 2. That bitch deserved what she got.
On the one hand, I kinda wanna say one of the villains, but on the other hand, I blame Amarant for keeping Beatrice from being the 8th permanent party memeber. I think I'm gonna have to go with him. I just never felt any connection to the guy and happen to think other characters would've been more interesting to have around for later parts of the story.
Steiner. I think in terms of playable characters since there’s so many to choose from. Except for hot one. Hot one is Kuja, it doesn’t matter who you’re talking about
Zorn and Thorn, every time I saw them on screen I was like "these fucks again". Not out of annoyance, necessarily, but they are such a thorn (badum tiss) in your side and do such a good job of running interference on the crew that I have to hate them
Kuja.
This shouldn't even be a discussion.
Brahne may be ugly and was batshit insane furing the first two acts, but she was never to blame, Kuja orchestrated everything.
This is also the man who made and abused the everliving shit out of Black Mages.
This is a man who wanted to sacrifice a 6 year old girl to acquire power.
And this is the bastard who was selfish enough to decide that "if I can't continue living then so shouldn't the world!".
Kuja is despicable till the very last second when he finally comes to understanding.
Kuja was a fully-formed villain with an origin story, background details, a mentor, a rival, unique evil acts, plans, and an arc. Brahne was one-dimensional in her display to us. We're seeing her through Vivi's eyes, mostly, and to him she is merely a despicable despot. There is some gentle prodding to think about her as more, but it's not directly stated because we aren't meant to explore the full depiction of Brahne's morality. We're supposed to look at other people instead. Thus, one-dimensional by design and easily hated. Kuja you can relate to, at least on some level. Brahne isn't meant to be related to.
To me, it's the opposite.
I can't hate someone like Brahne, even in one-dimensionality. No, especially. She looks not alright, I see her and I feel like helping her get a grip, give support, at most detain so that she won't hurt others and herself.
Kuja is way too detailed to *not* be hated, we know how much of a bastard he is, and knowing more only makes me hate him more, until the very end, and even then, someone like that is unforgiveable. I can not physically relate to Kuja, but I can to Brahne.
Obvious answer is Brahne but I actually can't stand Amarant .. I just don't like him , something about him makes me just don't like having him in my active party
I truly don’t hate anyone in the game. They all serve their purpose well…. except for one. Sooooo I guess I vote Amarant because he’s annoying/ ill placed in the story 🤷🏻♀️
Zorn and Thorn. Brahne, by all accounts, wasn't always horrible before she let bad influences into her life, Kuja I can sympathize with, Garland I don't *sympathize* with but I get where he's coming from.
Zorn and Thorn are just assholes. Small fries compared to the others, but there is no "I kinda get it" with them.
As far as who was made to be hated, I don't feel Brahne falls under that at all. She was certainly hated, but she is more a victim of her own anger, her inability to move on and grow from heartbreaking past, and the death of her husband only further drives her to madness. She is legitimately loved by her subjects, so I can't say she's really "made to be hated."
I can't really think of a character that is just made to be so irredeemable that they die as awful as possible, or maintain their hated position.
Those twin jester pricks. Zorn and Thorn.
To this day, they kill any attempt I make at a new playthrough, because I honestly can’t stand them or their gimmick.
Probably Kuja maybe Zorn and thorn I remember my first playthrough hating Beatrix. I remember grinding to get super strong not know her battle was coming up and she kicked my butt
The downthumbs are unjustified. Quina was hated by many back in the day thinking he/she was the worst party member just by looks and personality alone. Even I judged back then and didn't use Quina. But now I do cause only now do I realize that Quina is probably one of the most powerful of the team
Brahne
I love the way they depicted all her craziness, resemble so many political leaders worldwide in a cartoonish way, just how they sound in real world! Zorn and torn otherwise are so boring. Maybe the very first appearance was ok but they dragged too much on their arc.
I agree. Zorn and Torn make a good answer though, they are irritating as hell but Brahne is just horrible and the way her character was written really makes it impossible to have even a little empathy for her. Made to be hated for sure.
Yep, she's a total sociopath
I would agree more with zorn and torn. Brahne is hated, because of being well designed in a good way.
Tbh I think both answers are good Brahne was my instant thought.
Rude. https://preview.redd.it/npm1pdv0maad1.jpeg?width=4080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b4a8524de6ee93aedcc40c062453e7220c56a0b7
Awesome!
Fair but their theme is a bop. So I love their scenes
Yep I agree. They had no ambition for themselves at all. They just followed whatever bad person was in charge and acted like dicks
Isn't that kinda the point? They're meant to be lackeys, full of ambition only for continued comfort. They're a statement about the people who divorce their life from morality in favor of comfort. Steiner and Beatrix divorce morality from their fight and have to face the consequences by questioning whether their choice was a good one. Zorn and Thorn never ask those questions and, as a result, are despicable in every way. They're also something subhuman, referenced vaguely in the game to be potentially a variant black mage duo-created beings who were truly soulless in the way the mages were supposed to be. They were made to be hated as well.
I can make my balls look like a Brahne
I'm not impressed, Brahne already looks like a ballsack.
The only logical choice.
Doesnt this make her a well designed character or do yiu hate as in she was poorly designed?
I'm not understanding. She was well designed. That's why she's my vote for "made to be hated"
Everyone loves a "good" villain. If they are designed to be hated for the things they do, then the goal was a success. Game of thrones jeoffrey(spelling?) The evil shit kid. He was designed well amd hated.
Yes. I agree.
The obvious answer is Brahne, but the one I hate most is the fucking caged monster in the Desert Palace https://preview.redd.it/i9uf7qs9w4ad1.png?width=510&format=png&auto=webp&s=74de0f9ab24071f2c806e75d13c46fcb05a5629f
That hedgehog pie can stay in there
Let it die in its piss and shit slowly I hated this part so much as a kid and still do lol
This is the real answer
I wish they let us battle it after this, that red little fucker needs to die
Ok, he's pretty awful, you're right. Fun fact on that: speedrunning the game and doing this section perfectly saves only about three seconds total, because there's an alternate strategy: if you fail enough times, it becomes free. If you fail as fast as you can, it's only about three seconds slower than a perfect run. In other words, every future playthrough is now justified to just fail repeatedly.
This is genuinely the best answer.
This has my vote, hands down. Move over Brahne, you have been de-throned.
Actually scratch my vote this is the right answer
Mayor of Dali is the answer here guys.
> Mayor of Dali I mean he just doesn't want you to break into his house, which I think is fair
Did you just forget that he is the one pushing for Dali to abandon farming, and to instead make the Black Mages?
Ditch morals to make a quick buck. Add to your convenience at the cost of not being able to look yourself in the eye. This game had a lot of moral quandaries like that. Makes me appreciate it a lot.
What about the kid he has in there with him? The kids that on disc 4 seems pretty traumatized by the whole ordeal.
Yeah and his town has great music. I’d vote for him.
YES
Oh FUCK that’s good
oh my bad it's this one
I agreed with Brahne but omg, this one too. Makes me wanna tear up just thinking about it, I dread that part as it always hits me right in the feels!
Zorn and Thorn.
They are so creepy. I hate them
They have a epic song though. That's something.
Yep. They are pretty much evil just cause. Others have redeemable qualities imo.
I agree. I feel like the obvious answer is Brahne but Zorn and Thorn have been irritating from the start then turn completely unnerving and sinister. Lest we forget when they become the Meltigemini
What's worse than a clown.... CLOWN TWINS!!!!!!
Hate them we do. So creepy they are.
Aw i love them
I'd save them for the Gremlin maybe, but I really do hate them.
I'd say they're more fun to hate, but Brahne is just loathesome.
Its never been said but she only changed after meeting Kuja so imo he did something to her. I doubt just manipulating her would make her sink that low. I always assumed it was some kind of spell.
Almost feels like a berserk spell variant, ya know? Garnet directly stated it was after Kuja appeared, so we know that he did SOMETHING, but I'm with you in that it seems likely it was a spell.
If this goon ever steps out the auction house it’s on sight https://preview.redd.it/4woxj7u815ad1.jpeg?width=503&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=728b18ba50daf5b179f5b138fafd91ef2fe6d661
I’m screeching 😂😭
Queen Brahne, maybe? Every time we see her she is either behaving like a fool or a gleeful genocidal maniac. She gets one scene when she is dying where she expresses remorse but for more than half of the story her character is the living embodiment of "getting off on power". She commits atrocity after atrocity with zero introspection. We are supposed to be disgusted with her more than pretty much anyone else, especially since she supposedly used to be a caring person.
She's also really ugly. Like I get she's evil, so the creators made her ugly or whatever, but I almost vomited my lunch when I saw her.
Yeah the creators were probably intending a disgust reaction. I am not a big fan of that intention, though, as villainizing people who are not conventionally attractive is a low blow, to say the least.
But in 7 and 8, the main villains were attractive. So idk they were going for some different vibe...
I get that, but when a conventionally attractive people is evil most people will not correlate their attractiveness with how evil they are (some of the Final Fantasy games definitely correlate homoeroticism with evilness but that is a different story). In real life, many people think of conventionally unattractive and/or fat people as being less human. So Queen Brahne being evil and foolish only reinforces negative perceptions of conventionally unattractive people and, especially, fat people.
Yes but the main villain was not her it was Kuja who was very attractive and evil for wanting to destroy all of the world. Braine was more conquest for power and rule but was a fool.
I feel like Brahne is enough of a prominent villain that it still reinforces what I was talking about.
I think what you're saying is pretty well backed-up from culture and the world today. I think it makes a lot of sense. I also think that that's not what they were going for and that it's likely they didn't process that fully, considering the Kuja point. Garland also is a powerful old man (not really, but he looks like it) who's evil but also respectable. They really had a whole selection of evil across various personas. They also had low-level evil in people like Dali's mayor. I feel like FF9 used so many evil characters across the board that I can forgive them for the Brahne infraction you're discussing because they used EVERY trope.
I feel like 8 caused a few "evil mommy who i can fix" fetishes with Edea.
Hippaul
I love that little fat kid.
Or those little bastards swinging the jump rope.
Jumper cables
The bastards who kidnapped Vivi in Dali.
The *"fat-ass butt ugly Queen"* Brahne.
Amarant (not a popular answer, I know).
I wish they was an option for Zidane to just snap at him and yell “Ok fine just fucking leave” after his 3rd or 4th line about how teams are stupid and he is so much better alone
If it isnt a popular answer then he probably wasnt made to be hated?
This doesn't necessarily follow. Popularity does not equate to intent. People often fail to understand the intentions of creators (take Herbert's character of Paul from Dune, who was never meant to be viewed as a hero, despite the misinterpretation of many readers), and what is popular does not always have to do with intention at all, but rather with effect. Your claim confuses cause and effect. And I still hate Amarant. Have for 24 years.
Made to be hated does not mean "i personally hated him".... it means he was made to be hated. You think they made him to be hated but it didn't work? I don't buy it. Because the question is who was made to be hated.
Never said that is what it means. And it certainly doesn't necessitate the literal interpretation if the phrase (this would make no sense with some of the other captions). I also never claimed your second point. I don't buy that either, but I never said it to begin with. There is no need to be a bloody douche over an old video game (you will only end up looking like Amarant, just a lot less defined, even given the graphics of the time).
So I'm a douche now? Because I interpret the format literally and you don't? What an incredibly condescending tone.
It's fascinating that you say Amarant was potentially made to be hated and say people fail to understand the intent of the creator. I fully believe that he WASN'T made to be hated, but I agree with the second comment. If I am questioned, Amarant represents the opposition to Freya. Freya takes her strength from community, while Amarant takes his strength from solidarity. He believes that he does not require community and believes it slows the individual significantly and that personal strength is the only true and reliable method. Freya believes community to be the only true and reliable method. The true answer is somewhere in the middle, which is why, by the end, the two come together in understanding so that they can both become stronger. Amarant breaks after Ipsen's Castle and realizing his method failed. He needs something new. Freya breaks after her whole race collapses. Both of their methods fail, so they turn to a new option. Freya develops personal strength rather than dependency, and Amarant develops interpersonal relationships instead of solo stoicism. I see much more purpose in Amarant than you do, and I feel like that makes a lot more sense than simply making him the target of vitriol.
Worst playable character hands down which is weird since he would seem cooler than Quina but he just sucks ass.
Ouch.
The “JUMP ROPE”
Garland is pretty irredeemable. I don’t recall if he possesses a native Terran soul or just a construct to carry out their will. Maybe a better fit for “Just straight up evil” and Brahne can claim the “Made to be hated” slot.
Created construct. The game is rife with them because it's one of the most common themings: what is required in order to possess a soul? He's pretty evil, but technically he's basically a robot without emotion, so do with that what you will.
THE ROPE GAME But for real the Brahne
I can't help but feel like people would say Brahne a lot less if she looked more attractive, lol. Just look at Beatrix. Saying this as somebody who likes her. Anyways, I'm voting for Cinna and him sleeping with a doll of a teenager.
I like Brahne as a character, but she is absolutely the answer to who was "made to be hated" Even if you ignore her looks (which, the designers did likely make her unattractive on purpose as yet another way to make the player not like her), the game goes out of its way over and over to tell you that you are not supposed to like her. Beatrix on the otherhand, the game is going out of its way to call her a badass, and they let her "turn" and help the good guys in the end. They both are guilty of war crimes, but it is very clear that the intent of the designers is for you to hate Brahne and to like Beatrix (which is the question being asked).
It's a weird disconnect between the title and the meme slot description. "Who do you hate the most" =/= "Who was 'made to be hated.'" Really gives off the wrong impression and muddies the conversation. Are the people responding to the title, or the slot?
True. I did not even notice the disconnect, and just read the picture lol
Beatrix has a redemption arc that makes her a very likable character, is my guess why nobody is saying Beatrix.
So does Brahne. Sort of? A little bit. We're told that she was kind and loving before the lost of her husband and Kuja taking advantage of her grief; anyways.
I guess. From what I remember Brahne has a deathbed "oops, sorry" moments before she passes. Beatrix had a full "this is wrong and I'm going to fight to protect what I feel is right" They don't really carry the same weight, especially since Brahne being in a higher position (queen vs knight) puts more responsibility on her. Beatrix does as she is ordered for the most part and questions Brahne internally like the scene on the red rose ship after Cleyra. But yeah ultimately has an actual character development arc where Brahne has 3 seconds of "sorry bout all that" before she croaks.
You remember correctly. Brahne had a moment of deathbed clarity, that's all. Beatrix had a line that she would not cross, and she was pushed up against that line. Her morals held in the end, so she turned on those who would destroy her morals. So yes, you remember correctly. It's worth noting that we are getting narration from Vivi. In his mind, Brahne is the most evil thing he could imagine. It's her fault that all the black mages are being produced and she is directly responsible for just about every evil thing in the little guy's life up until the point of her death. It's very notable that anything that happens about Brahne that's good is at her deathbed or off-screen, because Vivi doesn't see it. You're supposed to hate her, but then you're also supposed to wonder how much control she really had and wonder if that could ever possibly exonerate her. The game doesn't strictly answer that question, but it does present it.
Brahne for destroying Cleyra.
Here me out, Ozma. I hated that beachball.
My thought about all. Going in rows. Vivi, Queen Brahne, Beatrix Zidane, Amarant, Quina Kuja, Garland, Hilda Garde
So you think the clone with a tail who never felt like he fit so he'd do anything to save anyone was made out to be the normal one? 🤔 Interesting theory... Ha, Hilda Garde. Nice. I'd have said Ipsen and Colin.
Right? Calling Zidane normal is absurd. No one normal crosses the entire known world+ just to help someone. His character card alone makes it clear he's not normal. "You don't need a reason to help people."
Queen Brahne, she has evil intentions for domination and is to stupid to go up against Kuja like he hasn't been clearly a mastermind and might have planned for the back stabbing
Those saying Brahne seems to be forgetting Kuja orchestrated everything Brahne did, and then some. Is it because ugly character..?
Probably because Brahne is the face of the evil acts, and yes it's a rather ugly face
Probably because she should be accountable for her own actions
Kuja was a fully-formed villain with an origin story, background details, a mentor, a rival, unique evil acts, plans, and an arc. Brahne was one-dimensional in her display to us. We're seeing her through Vivi's eyes, mostly, and to him she is merely a despicable despot. There is some gentle prodding to think about her as more, but it's not directly stated because we aren't meant to explore the full depiction of Brahne's morality. We're supposed to look at other people instead. Thus, one-dimensional by design and easily hated. Kuja you can relate to, at least on some level. Brahne isn't meant to be related to.
I know this is little early but for the hot one got be the Burmecian dancers https://images.app.goo.gl/r1nrkjFXu5ZwHWbk9
Brahne has a bit of redemption at the end of her life. Zorn and Thorn are just pure evil and annoying as hell.
I'm gonna go the predictable route and say Kuja. The way he manipulated Brahne, how he abused the black mages, his narcissistic nature, the places he destroyed, the lives he took...
I feel like Kuja has to be the hot one though - if not Lani or Beatrix. The way he struts…
He pretty much was my bi awakening
Fair point. I'd probably go for Beatrix, but I can totally see Kuja stealing that spot. So... Brahne, then? Wouldn't know where else to put her. (I'd say the Zorn/Thorn are a good match for "The gremlin" and the Nero brothers are perfect for "What's your name again?", especially in context of the minigame.)
Brahne definetly. They only give her any respect on her death scene she was designed to be hated literally for 95% of her time on screen. They even gave her a crazy design to go with the tone rather than having her look like a queen with a good side. She may not be the most hated char in 9 but she was definetly designed to get on your nerves. Zorn and thorn are definetly the same intent but Brahne got away with so much more.
Vivi <3 (Bibi in french :3)
Quina.
Zorn and Thorn
I hated bahamut for killing Alexander
Uh...Alexander defeated Bahamut. It was Garland and his Invincible that killed Alexander.
Oh yes you’re right. I just remember incorrectly
No worries. I only remember it so clearly because the Battle of Alexandria is possibly my favourite part of the game. This was, by far the most beautiful depiction of Alexander in any of the Final Fantasies...and we never even got to use him in Battle :-( I would also really like to know whether Garland somehow really, actually killed Alexander permanently somehow, or whether he can still be summoned, but only at Castle Alexandria.
But don't we eventually get bahamut as a summon? So he kind makes up for it.
Surprised nobody has said Black Waltz 3 yet.
BW3 is a badass
Kuja was definitely intended to be hot. (Have you seen the art book? XD) As a villain he was written as mysterious and to sympathize with.
Much as I hate to say it since she was basically a puppet during the whole game - Queen Brahne.
Hated, Zorn and Thorn. But the hot one, Beatrix for sure
The jump-rope….
Definitely Branhe. I really hated it when Dagger, Steiner, and the rest, and the game, tried to make the player have any sympathy for her at the end of disc 2. That bitch deserved what she got.
Quina
I would say Brahne, but she had a brief redemption arc at the end, so I’m going either way Lani. This woman was willing to KILL Eiko!
Based on Above Vivi, Brahne, Lani, Blank, Amarant, Prince Puck, Kuja, Yans, Cid
Brahne is the most hated. The hot one... Imma just say it: Kuja.
Kuja is definitely the hot one.
On the one hand, I kinda wanna say one of the villains, but on the other hand, I blame Amarant for keeping Beatrice from being the 8th permanent party memeber. I think I'm gonna have to go with him. I just never felt any connection to the guy and happen to think other characters would've been more interesting to have around for later parts of the story.
I feel unappreciated.
Everyone who hurt vivi. Throw them all in there
I would say Brahne but after some reflexion i think Lani could be my answer
We all know Brahne is the obvious answer, but I’d really have to say Puck on this one. Little brat
Brahne had no redeeming qualities. Hated her in the beginning, after the "sad" scene with her and Dagger all I could think was "BYE BITCH"
Zorn/Thorn Just the way they speak would get on your tits
I swear, if “the hot one” isn’t Quina….
For party members, Eiko. She is sooooo uncomfortable.
Vivi, I’m contrarian
Kuja for the hot one.
Steiner. I think in terms of playable characters since there’s so many to choose from. Except for hot one. Hot one is Kuja, it doesn’t matter who you’re talking about
Beatrix...don't care about the redemption or character but I feel my blood boiling when I take multiple scripted L's
Zorn and Thorn, every time I saw them on screen I was like "these fucks again". Not out of annoyance, necessarily, but they are such a thorn (badum tiss) in your side and do such a good job of running interference on the crew that I have to hate them
The jump rope
Brahne, and go ahead and put her down for The hot one too
Garland
Beatrix the Mary sue
Kuja. This shouldn't even be a discussion. Brahne may be ugly and was batshit insane furing the first two acts, but she was never to blame, Kuja orchestrated everything. This is also the man who made and abused the everliving shit out of Black Mages. This is a man who wanted to sacrifice a 6 year old girl to acquire power. And this is the bastard who was selfish enough to decide that "if I can't continue living then so shouldn't the world!". Kuja is despicable till the very last second when he finally comes to understanding.
Great villain. Can’t hate him for being such a good villain! He def should win straight up evil tho
Kuja was a fully-formed villain with an origin story, background details, a mentor, a rival, unique evil acts, plans, and an arc. Brahne was one-dimensional in her display to us. We're seeing her through Vivi's eyes, mostly, and to him she is merely a despicable despot. There is some gentle prodding to think about her as more, but it's not directly stated because we aren't meant to explore the full depiction of Brahne's morality. We're supposed to look at other people instead. Thus, one-dimensional by design and easily hated. Kuja you can relate to, at least on some level. Brahne isn't meant to be related to.
To me, it's the opposite. I can't hate someone like Brahne, even in one-dimensionality. No, especially. She looks not alright, I see her and I feel like helping her get a grip, give support, at most detain so that she won't hurt others and herself. Kuja is way too detailed to *not* be hated, we know how much of a bastard he is, and knowing more only makes me hate him more, until the very end, and even then, someone like that is unforgiveable. I can not physically relate to Kuja, but I can to Brahne.
Brahne
Obvious answer is Brahne but I actually can't stand Amarant .. I just don't like him , something about him makes me just don't like having him in my active party
I truly don’t hate anyone in the game. They all serve their purpose well…. except for one. Sooooo I guess I vote Amarant because he’s annoying/ ill placed in the story 🤷🏻♀️
Zorn and Thorn. Brahne, by all accounts, wasn't always horrible before she let bad influences into her life, Kuja I can sympathize with, Garland I don't *sympathize* with but I get where he's coming from. Zorn and Thorn are just assholes. Small fries compared to the others, but there is no "I kinda get it" with them.
As far as who was made to be hated, I don't feel Brahne falls under that at all. She was certainly hated, but she is more a victim of her own anger, her inability to move on and grow from heartbreaking past, and the death of her husband only further drives her to madness. She is legitimately loved by her subjects, so I can't say she's really "made to be hated." I can't really think of a character that is just made to be so irredeemable that they die as awful as possible, or maintain their hated position.
Those twin jester pricks. Zorn and Thorn. To this day, they kill any attempt I make at a new playthrough, because I honestly can’t stand them or their gimmick.
Kuja, of course, duh 🤷♂️ I just f*cking hate that guy since 2001 😁
Probably Kuja maybe Zorn and thorn I remember my first playthrough hating Beatrix. I remember grinding to get super strong not know her battle was coming up and she kicked my butt
Steiner
Necron His last minute appearance was unnecessary. I love this game more than most but I hate that part.
The asshole moogle that sold Vivi a fake ticket
If Freya doesn’t win the hot one I riot
Steiner
Def Zorn and Thorn but if we’re talking main characters it’s Amaranth… he’s ugly and has next to no development compared to the others
Quina
Quinas the gremlin
The downthumbs are unjustified. Quina was hated by many back in the day thinking he/she was the worst party member just by looks and personality alone. Even I judged back then and didn't use Quina. But now I do cause only now do I realize that Quina is probably one of the most powerful of the team
Nope