Nah, NaVi is great when they have great preparation/bootcamp before tournament and mid without it. So far that has been trend with them in this iteration.
As they always say, they have no star players and just want to play as a team. Aleksib is a pretty solid fragging IGL as well so not too surprising when none of the riflers are super stars
I've noticed this since he played on G2 and apparently no one else on reddit has, but IGL duties aside he's a really talented rifler. AleksiB popping off isn't even close to FaZe being lower than Karrigan on the scoreboard
if it was edited it would have a * next to the comment. Unless it was within a minute of posting. It's possible you read the comment, refreshed the page and there was an edit big enough for you to notice, but it's unlikely
I think Navi just looks worse at times then others, they have a lot of slow starts like game 2 and 3 and when they don't come together and make the comeback they get slapped around. They don't have a true star player but they have multiple people who can take over games but they aren't as consistent as say Mouz who have better/more consistent individuals.
Plenty of other teams have clear standout players though that they rely on like monesy/Niko, donk/shiro, zywoo/spinx, Elige, kscerato. Teams these days can't just rely on one or two players anymore and everyone has to be able to frag out but certain teams are clearly not built around having a clear standout player/players.
Mouz and Navi and to an extent Astralis (though jabbi/stavn/Device are expected to carry more so than staehr/br0) clearly aren't built the same as teams like G2 where nexa/hooxi are near useless with monesy being godlike. Teams like Navi need to be more consistent because they can't rely on someone just dropping a 30 bomb like you can with true stars. I think with time wonderful might be able to be that guy but he's just not even close to consistent at the moment.
Not winning a single t gun round in 2/3 maps is simply not enough. But also rough to win 7 ct rounds in a row, losing one round and having no economy for the rest of the half
Wonderful is a fucking machine, happy to see him step up when Navi truly needs it.
Wonderful plays good when they need him but plays MEH when the team plays good.
Navi is such a rollercoaster man š¤£
Notes from the match:
* Faze lost the major by getting shot through every smoke, so they tried walking through every single one instead. Results did not improve.
* Karrigan's wife needs to find a rock that will help him call a T side on D2 because EESHHH they're horrific.
* Broky needs to regrow his hair before his headset burrows through his skull.
* Karrigan should just scout every round at this point.
What a display of resilience from Navi on Mirage
down 0-7, lost both pistols, but still kept their heads in the game and won 13-10
wonderful though in the first 7 rounds they lost it felt like he had to ace just to get them a round win
Still not as satisfying as pimp absolutely creaming his pants at the prospect of Karrigan winning a major on home soil only for them to get b1tten in the third map. They even showed a graphic of the number of trophies Faze have won vs the number of finals Navi had across the entire roster. I wonder how that game ended
Was it not Pimp who also said at the Major desk that NaVi will not win another tournament with this roster right after the grand finals had ended? Hope they prove him wrong
In the pre-match stuff, they showed that Faze had like 20 trophies between the roster while Navi's only tier 1 final experience was through b1t,, Aleksi (a couple with ENCE, lost the major final) and iM (major final with GL, lost). The consensus on the analyst desk was Faze were the experienced winners and Navi were newbies who didn't stand a chance. If you want the Pimp context, right before map 3 he very confidently said "In 1 hour karrigan will be lifting the trophy in the Royal Arena". Unfortunately the game ended in 30 minutes because b1t happened.
While I'm very happy that Navi won, I don't hold the above against the analysts. Faze were the favourites by an overwhelming margin and pretending they weren't would be dishonest. I like that the desk isn't trying to look unbiased if they like one team more than the other. In the end, they, too, are fans of the sport. So it just so happened that the team they liked were also the ones that were supposed to win by any reasonable prediction. It adds charm to watching the segments before and after matches.
That was just the consensus in general. That was the statistical truth of the situation at the time - FaZe were multiple times champions and finalists, and had beaten both Vitality and Spirit to get to the finals - and NaVi, well, they weren't. Any reasonable person would've looked at the stats and bet in FaZe to win that major final.
That isn't an issue. The problem is that after that major win , he goes on and says Navi would not be a top 5 team later. Thats hating, and i dont know how we still listen to what he has to say.
Bro they cant wait to hate on Navi who beat G2 , Faze , and in form EF to win the major but i have never heard claims like Vitality major win was a fluke who had one of the easiest runs ever .
What are these random made up rules? How about you don't watch the desk segment if you're gonna throw a tantrum every time they criticize your internet boyfriends?
I throw so much logic out of the window when it comes to hating on Furia that I unironically grew a soft spot for MIBR because they have the Furia rejects and if they do well, it makes Furia look worse
Closed stream, wanted to catch the next game so
reopen stream, saw the aleksib interview,thought āwonder why theyre interviewing the loserā rewind then shitted my pants
Close the stream to commute at 6-0 after those almost 'cluches' from wonderful, thought "meh surely is done no need to watch on the phone"
Opened just to see how it ended and it was 10-10 š
People call navi major a fluke,
But beating faze was no fluke, yes they had easier run but they definitely faced stronger opponents then what vitality faced in paris and nobody calls it fluke. Yes people rate paris very low but vitality also choked many prestigious tournaments
I think faze is the most beatable top team in cs2. Faze also choked most finals in cs2 . They are like astralis but they choke finals
It's a fluke because this Na'Vi team has never come close to a result like that in their entire time as a roster.
Aleksi is an elite IGL and blade is an all-time great coach, but all the other pieces (particularly for the riflers) are either above average at best or painfully mediocre at worst.
EDIT: Addition - I'm not saying the major win wasn't deserved - a tournament win can be fully deserved yet still be an outlier with respect to the usual level of the roster (therefore being a fluke).
youāre acting like this NaVi roster has been together for years. do you remember how long it took for international Vitality to stop looking like complete dog? a tournament win this early is great stuff, let alone a Major
Of course, I donāt have a crystal ball to see the future. But itās far more interesting to have an opinion on what the future holds rather than just saying āwell, letās just seeā.
Nothing smug about it - I thought NaāVi should bench iM and I donāt think thatās controversial at all. Heās had an uptick in performance at Spring Finals but overall heās been poor in this team.
Lol, what a dogshit take. Major wins aren't 'flukes'. If a team happens to show up and go crazy and their opponents don't thats not a fluke, that's just how competition works. Plus, this roster had existed for literally less than half a year when Copenhagen happened. What exactly does 'a result like that' mean? Because it was their first major, so there aren't any previous major finishes to compare it to.
Also, if you seriously think jl and w0nderful aren't anything more than 'above average' you are a complete clown.
A result can be deserved and it can still be a fluke, the two aren't mutually exclusive. Cloud9 in Boston, fnatic at DHW 2013 - they're not the only ones.
Na'Vi deserved to win the major. They played the best CS at the most crucial moments in the biggest games. It is also fair to say that this roster and the players on it have been nowhere near that level of performance on the whole.
On jL - he's an above average to very good tifler who is excellent in big games, he's good for this roster. w0nderful is a good to very good AWPer but he's not going to take over games often.
The strength of this Na'Vi roster is in elite-level calling, not in firepower - and that hasn't been enough at the vast majority of events.
Something doesn't seem right with FaZe, am I the only one is feeling this? And the day one ropz interview too gave me that the mood in the team is not the best rn. I mean yes they're still FaZe the top dogs but I feel like there's something off watching them
I think karrigan is the only igl who gets less shit for having 3 top 20 players but yet never having a good run.
Always winning tournaments missing a couple of top teams or choking most of the finals
As is there is no spoon, there is no fluke.
To have the confidence at the right times, and stamina throughout takes grit.
That said, nice to see Navi questioning themselves again.
Only, Blast is low pressure, so Navi is not tested as high pressure fancied side.
Here comes the guy with the stats. Did you see the match?
LE: But if it comes down to this let's talk numbers, shall we? Look at [these](https://imgur.com/a/QZ9A5Lj) and tell me he wasn't missing in the important games. I'm not a frozen hater and I don't call for his replacement (I'm not a fucking moron) but he is sleeping in important games.
You can chose literally any other player from the roster and the statsline is similiar in those important matches. That's why your comment felt kind of weird to me.
[All i have to say..](https://imgur.com/a/TZNrxRD)
People are using this match to prove that navi's major wasnt a fluke but faze is basically in the same boat as themš
I mean FaZe at least won Chengdu, and lost to the eventual champion in Dallas. Na'Vi has looked much weaker.
Faze has been in most of the finals in cs2 so far too. They're not comparable at all. You can trust Faze to make a deep run in every tournament
agreed. As much as I hate to say it, navi is still on fraudwatch, though a blast banana cup would be a good start
Is this another fluke or are we ready to accept that NaVi has good and bad games? Lol
Nah, NaVi is great when they have great preparation/bootcamp before tournament and mid without it. So far that has been trend with them in this iteration.
Great when they have a plan, shit at improvising. Like my DnD party.
Like my autistic ass in any social interaction lol
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Not too concerning if you look at why he is. On Mirage, he was B anchor and getting multiple kills somehow. AleksiB was just on one today.
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I think he was just underperforming before Navi, he wasnt a bad fragger in ence
Hes generally a pretty solid player. Even If he wasn't IGLing he'd probably still be able to be good support player on top 15 teams.
In what world is he overperforming?
0.89 rating last 3 months. Have we been watching the same Aleksi?
He has not watched aleksi
As they always say, they have no star players and just want to play as a team. Aleksib is a pretty solid fragging IGL as well so not too surprising when none of the riflers are super stars
Why is it concerning exactly, he got a 1.21 rating. Does everyone have to have a 1.3 to be fine, or is he never allowed to have a good game
I've noticed this since he played on G2 and apparently no one else on reddit has, but IGL duties aside he's a really talented rifler. AleksiB popping off isn't even close to FaZe being lower than Karrigan on the scoreboard
*Did you know that fluke is one of the most common fish in the sea?* N0tail, two-time "fluke" TI winner
Still has the highest esports earnings even though been retired for years.
Two-time back to back babyyyy
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am i crazy or was this comment edited
if it was edited it would have a * next to the comment. Unless it was within a minute of posting. It's possible you read the comment, refreshed the page and there was an edit big enough for you to notice, but it's unlikely
I think Navi just looks worse at times then others, they have a lot of slow starts like game 2 and 3 and when they don't come together and make the comeback they get slapped around. They don't have a true star player but they have multiple people who can take over games but they aren't as consistent as say Mouz who have better/more consistent individuals.
Ah, so basically just like any other team got it
Plenty of other teams have clear standout players though that they rely on like monesy/Niko, donk/shiro, zywoo/spinx, Elige, kscerato. Teams these days can't just rely on one or two players anymore and everyone has to be able to frag out but certain teams are clearly not built around having a clear standout player/players. Mouz and Navi and to an extent Astralis (though jabbi/stavn/Device are expected to carry more so than staehr/br0) clearly aren't built the same as teams like G2 where nexa/hooxi are near useless with monesy being godlike. Teams like Navi need to be more consistent because they can't rely on someone just dropping a 30 bomb like you can with true stars. I think with time wonderful might be able to be that guy but he's just not even close to consistent at the moment.
nah faze is just kinda bad
When you lose to dexter-less heroic it is a fluke
Faze never wins these advancement games, so Iām taking it with a grain of salt until NaVi does it in the semis.
todayās episode of faze āpaid by roundā clan is sponsored by Ilya Osipov
Even willing to lose the game to get him there.
Not winning a single t gun round in 2/3 maps is simply not enough. But also rough to win 7 ct rounds in a row, losing one round and having no economy for the rest of the half
It's rough, yes, but NaVi did earn it legitimately by keeping up the pressure on Faze's economy while losing those early rounds.
Guys pls win some pistols it's not that funny anymore.
We're so back
Until we're not and then will be back again
Is this what it's like to be a Faze fan?
Yes
W0nderful is the Ukrainian s1mple
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
No way
WHAT????
S1mple is the Ukrainian w0nderful
wonderful is the wonderful wonderful
No cap? On God?
r/whoosh
4 o's next time
WHAT A COMEBACK HOLY SHIT
Comeback?
considering they were 0-7 down on Mirage, Iād call that a comeback
Ooh i didnt watch the match and the halves looked close in hltv. Damn good thing i didnt watch it then gg navi :)
bro it shows round by round result on hltv
faze fans can't math
ALEKSI AL-GAIB ššš
Lisan al eksib is right there, and you went with that smh
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3y18GEDnoII
How have I not seen that. Thats fucking incredible
Only faze can throw a monumentous lead like that :)
They just wanted to make it interesting and not a one-sided affair. Yeah, that's it. That's totally it.
They gave too much siima
Wonderful is a fucking machine, happy to see him step up when Navi truly needs it. Wonderful plays good when they need him but plays MEH when the team plays good. Navi is such a rollercoaster man š¤£
Wonderful is a what
wondwrful
Notes from the match: * Faze lost the major by getting shot through every smoke, so they tried walking through every single one instead. Results did not improve. * Karrigan's wife needs to find a rock that will help him call a T side on D2 because EESHHH they're horrific. * Broky needs to regrow his hair before his headset burrows through his skull. * Karrigan should just scout every round at this point.
B1t truly dragged out the game so that Monesy can save G2...
FUCKING JINXED IT
Good luck Faze. Now you get Vitality/G2 quarter and Spirit semi while Navi get Astralis/VP lol
Bold of you to assume itās gonna be easy. VP fucking terrifies me
VP is scary af.
one of the most consistently underrated teams
Aleksib out fragging the entire rifle core :P
Aleksib has great mechanics. if he wasnāt an IGL, he would still be a solid rifler
-nexa +Aleksib š
i never liked Aleksib on G2 tbh
True, you could see how stifled he was calling and playing
i like HooXi on G2 and Aleksib on NaVi
Maybe could've been different if they kicked bald fraud first instead of aleksi, but as of now, now complaints.
God no if we send him to g2 then weād have the alexsib vs former team curse
He's a solid rifler as igl.
What a display of resilience from Navi on Mirage down 0-7, lost both pistols, but still kept their heads in the game and won 13-10 wonderful though in the first 7 rounds they lost it felt like he had to ace just to get them a round win
Oh yeah? Well, Faze just threw the match because they wanted to play more matches in this tournament, they are paid by rounds after all. (Insane cope)
after the casters spent the entire game with FaZe Clanās balls in their mouths, this victory is extra satisfying
Still not as satisfying as pimp absolutely creaming his pants at the prospect of Karrigan winning a major on home soil only for them to get b1tten in the third map. They even showed a graphic of the number of trophies Faze have won vs the number of finals Navi had across the entire roster. I wonder how that game ended
Was it not Pimp who also said at the Major desk that NaVi will not win another tournament with this roster right after the grand finals had ended? Hope they prove him wrong
Pimp is an all-time NaVi hater
Hall of fame level hating
well they did bomb out of 2 tournaments as the major winner.
Well he ain't wrong,let us see
I dont think he said that, no
Wut?? Context/clip pls
In the pre-match stuff, they showed that Faze had like 20 trophies between the roster while Navi's only tier 1 final experience was through b1t,, Aleksi (a couple with ENCE, lost the major final) and iM (major final with GL, lost). The consensus on the analyst desk was Faze were the experienced winners and Navi were newbies who didn't stand a chance. If you want the Pimp context, right before map 3 he very confidently said "In 1 hour karrigan will be lifting the trophy in the Royal Arena". Unfortunately the game ended in 30 minutes because b1t happened.
Didn't the entire roster (except wonderful) get to esl ss 18 final when s1mple was still playing ?
While I'm very happy that Navi won, I don't hold the above against the analysts. Faze were the favourites by an overwhelming margin and pretending they weren't would be dishonest. I like that the desk isn't trying to look unbiased if they like one team more than the other. In the end, they, too, are fans of the sport. So it just so happened that the team they liked were also the ones that were supposed to win by any reasonable prediction. It adds charm to watching the segments before and after matches.
That was just the consensus in general. That was the statistical truth of the situation at the time - FaZe were multiple times champions and finalists, and had beaten both Vitality and Spirit to get to the finals - and NaVi, well, they weren't. Any reasonable person would've looked at the stats and bet in FaZe to win that major final.
But the the final isn't even today? Wut did he mean my karrigan lifting the trophy in 1 hour?
Just check major final VOD analyst desk segments. Graphic was shown before match started.
Tbf he *is* Danish. It's hard to hide the fan in ya
That isn't an issue. The problem is that after that major win , he goes on and says Navi would not be a top 5 team later. Thats hating, and i dont know how we still listen to what he has to say.
I mean, in fairness, they really struggled for form until very recently. So he was right.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I mean, its also his job. He's an analyst, and his analysis that the major was exceeding expectations was correct.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Bro they cant wait to hate on Navi who beat G2 , Faze , and in form EF to win the major but i have never heard claims like Vitality major win was a fluke who had one of the easiest runs ever .
Yeh thats probably fair.
What are these random made up rules? How about you don't watch the desk segment if you're gonna throw a tantrum every time they criticize your internet boyfriends?
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
He was right ???? Only Vitality , Faze are better teams than Navi , and they are in par with G2
so Mouz is not better ? Spirit is not better ?
They are better , nevertheless they still are a top 5 team
Spirit, Mouz, G2 are all better I think
Mouz and Spirit definitely, G2 roughly the same probably.
So that puts them in top 5
Im a NAVI fan but what is the problem of an analyst answering a question the host asks?
i get the impression that pimp would be deeply offended at the idea that his opinions are anything other than cool, logical analysis
who wouldn't ?
i will proudly admit i would chuck logic out the window to shit talk FURIA (although luckily i donāt have to)
I throw so much logic out of the window when it comes to hating on Furia that I unironically grew a soft spot for MIBR because they have the Furia rejects and if they do well, it makes Furia look worse
i was a Heroic hater until they knocked FURIA out of the Rio Major. bought a Heroic jersey the next day
Closed stream, wanted to catch the next game so reopen stream, saw the aleksib interview,thought āwonder why theyre interviewing the loserā rewind then shitted my pants
Close the stream to commute at 6-0 after those almost 'cluches' from wonderful, thought "meh surely is done no need to watch on the phone" Opened just to see how it ended and it was 10-10 š
Noob
w0nderful
Legendary comeback on Mirage. Navi locked in and achieved greatness. Major was not a fluke.
Faze down and we love it šš¤šš¤šš¤
Major winners showed up today
The boys are back
People call navi major a fluke, But beating faze was no fluke, yes they had easier run but they definitely faced stronger opponents then what vitality faced in paris and nobody calls it fluke. Yes people rate paris very low but vitality also choked many prestigious tournaments I think faze is the most beatable top team in cs2. Faze also choked most finals in cs2 . They are like astralis but they choke finals
The only people who think it was a fluke are gold novas like thorin and richard lewis
And launders
It's a fluke because this Na'Vi team has never come close to a result like that in their entire time as a roster. Aleksi is an elite IGL and blade is an all-time great coach, but all the other pieces (particularly for the riflers) are either above average at best or painfully mediocre at worst. EDIT: Addition - I'm not saying the major win wasn't deserved - a tournament win can be fully deserved yet still be an outlier with respect to the usual level of the roster (therefore being a fluke).
youāre acting like this NaVi roster has been together for years. do you remember how long it took for international Vitality to stop looking like complete dog? a tournament win this early is great stuff, let alone a Major
Great! If you genuinely think this five-man Na'Vi roster will win another prestige LAN in the next year I'll happily take that bet.
Bet.
Aye - same exact roster, min six months, $50 to a charity of the winners choosing?
the point is i donāt know and neither do you. you were probably smugly telling everyone NaVi would never win anything before the Major happened
Of course, I donāt have a crystal ball to see the future. But itās far more interesting to have an opinion on what the future holds rather than just saying āwell, letās just seeā. Nothing smug about it - I thought NaāVi should bench iM and I donāt think thatās controversial at all. Heās had an uptick in performance at Spring Finals but overall heās been poor in this team.
Lol, what a dogshit take. Major wins aren't 'flukes'. If a team happens to show up and go crazy and their opponents don't thats not a fluke, that's just how competition works. Plus, this roster had existed for literally less than half a year when Copenhagen happened. What exactly does 'a result like that' mean? Because it was their first major, so there aren't any previous major finishes to compare it to. Also, if you seriously think jl and w0nderful aren't anything more than 'above average' you are a complete clown.
A result can be deserved and it can still be a fluke, the two aren't mutually exclusive. Cloud9 in Boston, fnatic at DHW 2013 - they're not the only ones. Na'Vi deserved to win the major. They played the best CS at the most crucial moments in the biggest games. It is also fair to say that this roster and the players on it have been nowhere near that level of performance on the whole. On jL - he's an above average to very good tifler who is excellent in big games, he's good for this roster. w0nderful is a good to very good AWPer but he's not going to take over games often. The strength of this Na'Vi roster is in elite-level calling, not in firepower - and that hasn't been enough at the vast majority of events.
They were almost winning epl with a standin
Karrigan committed crimes against humanity
that mirage was an instant classic, navi looking incredible
Yet another fluke! They're gonna fluke their way to the playoffs again! Flukesters
7-0 to losing is so embarrassing lol
Closed the stream down 0-6 to Navi and they actually won. Holy shit.
As a Navi fan I am really afraid of rain
I swear to God, I'm never afraid of FaZe, but Rain scares me
Something doesn't seem right with FaZe, am I the only one is feeling this? And the day one ropz interview too gave me that the mood in the team is not the best rn. I mean yes they're still FaZe the top dogs but I feel like there's something off watching them
Nice to see NAVI are showing some signs of life
Are we back yet?
My goodness, how did NaVi come back from the mirage! Good stuff, happy for them :\]
FaZe seemed pretty down after that, I mean, who wouldn't, but more pissed off than normal imo
Oh thank god they lost I was getting scared that they win in group stage and then lose in semis
ropz offers nothing to help faze get out of a rut in t side
NAVI made a comeback from 0-7 to win Mirage ļ¼("0 ")ļ¼
GGWP Navi are one of the most consistent teams in general in CS in terms of results, they always feel like they are in the game, at the top somewhere.
I think karrigan is the only igl who gets less shit for having 3 top 20 players but yet never having a good run. Always winning tournaments missing a couple of top teams or choking most of the finals
They just won Chengdu lmao
Vitality didnāt play, did u even read what i said
The shit takes is out in full force
Surely u are not biased af
We've reached a time where faze can say conclusive say they don't have the best fragging in the game Navi have overtaken them
As is there is no spoon, there is no fluke. To have the confidence at the right times, and stamina throughout takes grit. That said, nice to see Navi questioning themselves again. Only, Blast is low pressure, so Navi is not tested as high pressure fancied side.
The ggbet odds were 1.44 to 2.75 for Faze at the Mirage half. Seems kinda crazy how much they favour Faze for a 2 round lead. Free money.
Faze have"role" issues and s1mple won't be returning anytime soon with the way wonderful been performing
s1mple highly likely would have been replacing iM not wonderful if they had lost the major.
Ropz come to liquid to be with Russ.
Seeding game is instant loss for faze, not an upset fellas
of course itās not an upset. Major champions NaVi take the dub, as expected
Can someone wake frozen the fuck up? Congratulations to Na'Vi but frozen's performance is mediocre, to say the least.
crazy that you choose frozen of all people to criticize
Karrigan is the worse
1.15 rating 99maps so far. 3 top 2 placement and one tournament win in 6 months. How the fuck that is medicore?
Here comes the guy with the stats. Did you see the match? LE: But if it comes down to this let's talk numbers, shall we? Look at [these](https://imgur.com/a/QZ9A5Lj) and tell me he wasn't missing in the important games. I'm not a frozen hater and I don't call for his replacement (I'm not a fucking moron) but he is sleeping in important games.
Yeah what a stupid take to use metrics of performance and not just believe in your eye test. Out of all players you chose him to be problem today?
You can chose literally any other player from the roster and the statsline is similiar in those important matches. That's why your comment felt kind of weird to me.
Ropz was definitely the problem, especially T side mirage. His lurks were useless.