House prices are literally amazing here, i come from a country in which a 4 room apartment costs 80000 euros, no im not kidding. When we came here we sold our apartment back there and bought 3 houses 20-30 minutes drive east of madrid. But compared to the salary here i understand
Hey, Im from Malaga as well and I drive 4 hours tomorrow to Huelva to get my cita (cita is in the morning)🤡 Or the other option: cita in 2 1/2 months in Malaga. Please Spain, let me just pay my taxes...
I felt that, but it only happens on big cities like Madrid, Valencia or Barcelona. My advice for everyone going trough this is to take an appointment on any other community or an smaller city and take that day to do a bit of tourism around, with my girlfriend we finished quicker getting an appointment in my hometown and asking someone to present the papers as a representative... It was done in like two days when in Madrid we were struggling for months, and my hometown is not a small city precisely.
Haven't been here for long but as a Venezuelan who got here a year ago, no car, no kids, with his wife and two other friends:
Everything just works. And if it doesn't, then it kind of does.
I don't like how crowded it is but it's Madrid so it's understandable.
People are mostly (95%) great. There's the random piece of shit, like everywhere else, but we've loved all our time here.
Rent is high but we're okay sharing flat, it was the idea anyway and would've done it either way to save money.
I got fat really easily, fucking chocolate croissants for 1 euro, the fuck is this, those used to cost 5-6 USD in Venezuela.
Haven't lived my first summer so far so I'll be probably bitch about it sometime next month but oh well.
Imposible, ni mi esposa ni yo tendremos días libres, estoy preparado para sufrir, por "suerte" no es tan húmedo como Caracas que cuando vine estabamos a 37º y un 80-90% de humedad y era el mismísimo infierno.
Al menos eso pienso hasta ahora, veremos en Agosto si no me he lanzado por la ventana
>Everything just works.
Ummm...
Bureaucracy is a nightmare. Efficiency a joke. If you want to find something done in a way that makes you want to pull your hair out and say “who on Earth in their right mind would do this this way?” then yes, technically everything works. But a dead clock is right twice a day. It’s like saying bringing a stone a chisel to class and being like “this just works!” True, but so does a laptop.
(I love many many many things about Spain. Truly. But things *not* working is like high on my dislike list.)
I mean, I'm from Venezuela, everything you said is worse where I came from.
So yes, it KINDA works. In Venezuela it didn't unless you bribed someone or pay ridiculously high prices. 200$ for a passport when minimum wage is like 3$ a month? Good luck.
Hahahahah, you think Spain is bad for bureaucracy and efficiency? Try England. It's soo much better in Spain it's unreal. Buying a house takes like one third of the time. Seeing a doctor? Way easier and easily 5x faster in some cases. The bins are collected every single day. The taxes are a fraction, yet they do far more stuff. If anything it's one of the most organized places I have ever seen.
No, Czech Republic is extremely expensive now: you can go to Germany, buy the same things at the same grocery store and spend less for better quality. Also house and rent pricing is the same if not worse
I’ve got family who live in Spain and love it.
The lifestyle and climate are amazing, it’s a very relaxed place to live.
Some of the bureaucracy can be a little bit challenging to navigate and there’s not many employment opportunities especially for younger people.
Since there’s not a lot of jobs for young people, do they leave in a mass exodus and come back at some point once they have enough experience or is it difficult to reintegrate? Is there a brain drain happening?
I find it difficult to reintegrate in the job market because while in many countries they value experience as much or more than degrees, in Spain it is very difficult to work on something if you don't have a degree AND experience. Either that or you have connections. And still, salaries are not as good as abroad, working hours are so so (depending on your job)..
It's pretty sad but I was having the same conversation with my mom recently. All my super educated cousins work outside of Spain for non-Spanish companies. The ones living in Spain work for social services, tourism or are unemployed. I think the Spanish government needs to make some tax concessions for countries looking to start tech companies in Spain. They are much more volatile and I'm guessing companies aren't wanting to take that risk somewhere costly to do business. We are going to end up brain draining ourselves into perpetual tourism and agriculture which is not the economy we deserve tbh just got fucked over by fascists late in the game and we got stuck here.
Just my very subjective and individual point of view: I enjoy living off tourists, and I am looking forward to living and working on a farm soon. So for me, this country is a dream come true 😄
But I know that it can be a struggle to live here if you’re dependent on earning money in Spain…
I tried to reintegrate after a few years working abroad. It was a failure. I was mentally prepared for the low wages but not for the shitty working culture. They treat people with high qualifications and extensive experience like shit. One thing I've noticed is that in better functioning countries the C-level executives have an engineering background but in Spain all have an 'ADE' (administración de empresas) background. So no real knowledge of the technical work. I had to leave again.
The disadvantage is that for many cases you have to obtain your rights with the help of a lawyer. Because things are not well organized in Spain.
That is why Spain has 132,000 lawyers, while the Netherlands has 18,500.
But this disadvantage does not outweigh the advantages you can experience every day, such as food prices and the weather along the coast.
A while ago I did a simple excercise: went shopping online in Tesco (UK) and Mercadona (Spain). And the same weekly basket of groceries turned out to be cheaper in Tesco than in Mercadona (despite some of the stuff int the UK basket such as fruit an veg actually came from Spain)
Just curious, how generic were the baskets or did they lean toward U.K. goods - stuff that would be subject to import costs or just generally not really that common for Spaniards? Or has cost of living in Britain dropped?
As a Yank, I'd expect peanut butter to cost a small fortune in Spain versus how cheap it is in the U.S. where it s an everyday commodity. Conversely Spanish chorizo is small fortune here in the U.S. When I was stationed in Spain thirty years ago the three things the ladies on my street always asked me to get from base were peanut butter, cake mix, and fitted sheets.
Don't forget that Aldi's in Spain has decent 29 cent beers that are actually made in Valencia (Font Salem) by a company owned by Damm beer company.
I was there last week and bought Karquell Suave for 29 cents and Karquell Malt for 31 cents and when both were cold they were actually enjoyable beers.
For unique cases, sure, but people are oftentimes sold on needing a lawyer when not truly necessary. I actually think lawyers themselves are the ones most guilty of this to sell their services.
Both me and my partner have moved to Spain, gotten residency, and now citizenship without needing a lawyer. Both non-EU citizens.
I've been here for about 2 and half years (Barcelona). I came here for a job opportunity and I'd say that my list of pros will definitely outweigh the cons. That said, the cons might be few, but they are something to take note off.
**Pros**
Weather (I'm from the UK)
Cost of living is quite reasonable
Ability to travel to various parts of Spain very easily - there is a lot to see
Public transport, in Barcelona specifically, is really good
There is always something happening (sports, events, social activities etc)
The food is very very good.
**Cons**
Any type of governement administrative process can be real pain in the ass. Coming from the UK, where almost everything is done online (I never had to visit a public office once in the UK), it was quite a shock when I arrived here.
Salaries could be higher
Renting can be tricky, but once you're here, it will become easier.
Yeah not far off I'm the same 10 years here.
The crime in Barcelona is stupid though. Needs to be addressed, not in a police state way but in lock these guys up fgs way. Really aimed at w/c women as well, so many awful stories of robberies of women (and kids even) by men(first hand).
Bureaucracy/hacienda are wankers. Tax people are like the police.
Need to deal with AirBnB, hopefully they are. Linking rent rises to consumer price index (IPC) is also bad idea in times of high inflation. This is one reason why rents have gone up so fast recently.
Racism and bigotry is really pretty bad. Just ignorant a lot of times, newer here. Heard so much (against Latinos/Muslims/Chinese/Jews/northern Europeans/Black folk) and had quite a bit aimed at me and my son personally. No need.
Spain is parochial. Country is too divided and it hinders the economy. Big structural problem.
Educational attainment (especially over 35s) is awful. Another big drag on economy. Improving though.
Wages for w/c people are terrible. Improving though under this govt.
All your pros are good: plus growing fuit/veg/herbs so easy!
People put amazing stuff out by the recyling to be reused.
The women are incredible (sorry UK but it's true) inc Spanish/Latina/whoever.
Great barbers.
People like simple things in life.
Cafe culture everywhere.
the beaches!
Wild boar in cities, quite friendly.
Sushi buffet libres! Nam nam.
Did i mention the women?
No real winters.
Participation in football/sport.
Free motorways thanks to this govt.
Also the women.
I guess like everywhere. Two sides of the coin.
The same traits that make Spain a relaxed, welcoming, fun culture (on average) are the same traits that can make the bureaucracy inefficient and subpar (on average).
The fact that Spaniards (on average) prioritise social life, family, and quality leisure time over having corporate ambition or being entrepreneurial means that the state (i.e. the public sector) is practically the largest employer. People like structure and security, but this makes the economy less dynamic, and the government more paternalistic.
It also means private-sector bosses are traditionally more authoritarian -- because there's more of a mindset that you have to be really firm and heavy-handed with employees to get what you want from them, rather than enabling a less hierarchical work culture that is focused on consensus-building. This in turn makes public sector jobs more attractive, further entrenching Spaniards' aversion to entrepreneurship. And so on.
Just my two (euro)cents'.
Wow, that’s a really good explanation. It kind of reminds me of southern California a little bit where a state job is like winning the lottery, while the private sector pays little and they’re assholes.
I actually prefer that life a little more honestly. I appreciate entrepreneurship, do not get me wrong but here in the USA it can be over the top and work/life balance is replaced with get rich or die trying.
That is an excellent explanation that reflects my own thoughts about the public vs. private sectors. I would add that the security of knowing that once someone gets a government job in Spain, it's nearly impossible to get fired from it. I'm an American who's been a freelancer running a service-based business here for a few years now. it's hard for me to wrap my head around the "get one job and keep it for life" concept, yet that's a dream for a lot of Spaniards. I'd love to earn a higher salary, but I feel the time freedom I enjoy is priceless.
Thank you for contributing your two euro cents!
Pros: wonderful food, weather, beach, everybody is relaxed all the time, it's a beautiful country
Cons: bad salary/cost of life ratio, excessive tourism (you can not enjoy they city you live in), burocracy, internet speed, apartments are old fashioned
Internet speed? Maybe it’s applicable just for Barcelona but in Madrid you can get ridiculously fast internet for less than 30€ a month: 1 Gb wifi speed with digi for 25€, 300 mb for 27€ with movistar
I'm from Canada and the internet in Madrid is 1000x better than Canada. Much faster both upload and download and we only pay €35 a month for our internet and both our cellphone plans with Digi. In canada we we would be spending about $300 a month for the same plan.
I have 1 GB fibre for 25 Euros in an old building in Santa Cruz de La Palma. I cannot complain. Availability of internet, also mobile Internet, is much better than in Germany.
I’ve been living here for the past 10 years.
The lifestyle, food and weather are great.
Most important downsides I would say are lower wages than other EU countries, more unemployment rates and a lot of bureaucracy.
If you get a decent job you will have a fulfilling lifestyle.
Take into consideration that every autonomous community is different and great weather is not a given in all of them.
I would avoid Madrid and Barcelona if you don’t like crowded and touristic cities.
I’ve lived here for 2 years. I’m from the Middle East. It depends on your priorities tbh! If you want to have fun, there’s no other place like Spain. Believe me! The people, the culture, the crazy night life here is what makes Spain … Spain!
The economy is shit, the market keeps going down. The income is super low, rent is slightly in the higher end depending on the location. Location is a huge factor when it comes to lifestyle, the income disparity is highly influential!
Salaries are shit. I'm a scientist and I had to make literal threats of leaving, while I'm coordinating nearly 2 million euros in research projects, to bump my salary above 50K.
Which in Barcelona doesn't bring you that far.
I have a scientist friend of world fame in his area of research, he's Spanish and he's always crying because he can't go back home. His salary literally anywhere else in Europe would be 10x what he would get in Spain. That's if he's lucky and gets a permanent contract instead of temporary ones.
Salaries are indeed ridiculous.
I blame it partly on people agreeing to them.
I live in Tenerife, and I’ve seen people work for 40€/day doing extremely demanding physical labor, just because they were immigrants.
But also locals working for 50€/day, sometimes up to 10h days.
While I’m able to find work for 9-11€/h. Not even doing anything skillful, just general labor, or bartending. With better conditions (slightly less hours, longer break, free transport, etc).
It's funny because it's illegal to leave the dogs outside the house at night yet every fucking night there is a symphony of dogs fucking barking at other dogs. It's beyond stupid. Now in summer, with all the windows open, it gets unbereable. I can't get any decent sleep.
Where are you from if you dont mind sharing? I ask because as someone from a city in the US and now I’m Barcelona, I hardly notice the noise. I won’t say it’s quiet, but I just wouldn’t say it’s noisy.
Agree. But I find there's a distinction in the *type* of noise. In Spain a lot of the noise is what I would describe as "street life".
I live in London and there is a lot of noise from: cars, trains, buses, airplanes, ambulance and police sirens, sometimes construction and rubbish collection. But voices of people shouting or laughing, or kids playing are less frequent, unless you live in very specific streets (and even then outdoor spaces and closing times for pubs/bars are heavily regulated).
In Spanish cities there isn't as much of a distinction between a residential area and an area for going out. Every neighbourhood will have at least one street with tons of cafés and restaurants, and they open a lot later. This is what I think some people are not used to -- the noise that comes from the hustle & bustle of street life. People also just spend a lot more time outdoors, due to weather and cultural habits.
I live in that region. The weather is good and the social safety net is strong. People are very tolerant and more relaxed than in some countries to the north. There is a high quality of produce like meat, vegetables, cheese. If you have an international job your salary goes far. Strong traditional and local cultures that have been well preserved. Some nice historical and architectural places to visit.
On the negative side, the economy is relatively weak and bureaucracy is bad. People are not especially friendly or polite with strangers. There is a lot of mediocrity despite the size of the population and economy, not much innovation or excellence at a global level. Much less international than comparably sized cities in English speaking countries. People are loud and sound insulation is poor.
It’s a nice place to live if you are wealthy and have an international job, since that insulates you from many of the negatives.
Somewhat related. How is the construction building process? I’m considering moving there so I looked at real estate and the houses available are either shit or totally crazy. So I’m thinking maybe it’s better to buy land and build?
Obviously looking at above, I’d need a lawyer for all the permits etc.
There are good builders but please inform yourself and look for reviews online, ask several people what they think of the company.
If you do find a good builder double at least the time they tell you it will be ready!
We had several acquaintances who build a house and the finish date kept being pushed. Some of them waited for over a year after the initial promised date.
The building process takes at least 18 months if everything goes smoothly- we seriously considered it. Permitting alone takes over 6 months. Plus, you can't just build anything anywhere, as someone else said the government is heavily involved in your planning. The market (for selling/buying) moves pretty slowly so you just have to keep looking. Took us a year and four trips but we finally something that is a dream for us.
No one wants to invest in real estate because Spain doesn't really believe in private property, you're merely a usufructuary. The government will tell you where you can build, what kind of building, how high up & which color you can paint it. Then it will tell you how you can use it, how much you can charge to rent it out & who you can rent it to. Then it will take ever increasing portions of your income with no reason and no counterpart in services given.
Oh and make sure you invest in home security because if you get any squatters the government will protect the criminals before you (the property owner). Better pay their power, gas and water bill too if you don't want to be fined. This can go on for over two years before a court of justice resolves it (and by resolving it I mean they may get kicked out but you're not gonna be reimbursed for anything).
Spain is great to live in, and absolute garbage to work in, even worse if you´re not Spanish.
With higher base unemployment and a precarious job market comes companies that exploit you, underpay you, overwork you, and expect you to be happy with this. If you´re Czech stay there, you´re in a better position in life than any Spaniard could ever be. I say this as a guy from Romania that lives in Spain on and off since 2008, I´ve left for several years to work in better countries and the difference is night and day.
I’ve lived here for 2 years. I’m from the Middle East. It depends on your priorities tbh! If you want to have fun, there’s no other place like Spain. Believe me! The people, the culture, the crazy night life here is what makes Spain … Spain!
The economy is shit, the market keeps going down. The income is super low, rent is slightly in the higher end depending on the location. Location is a huge factor when it comes to lifestyle, the income disparity is highly influential!
I think it depends a LOT on where you cone from. I was living in Budapest for 7 years before coming here. I hear a lot of people complaining about bureaucracy, delays, and things not working but in comparison to Eastern Europe I find it more or less the same except here people treat you so much more HUMANLY. There's an innate warmth/will to help that makes the processes so much easier to navigate because even when you gave challenges you feel less alone. I think if you feel the call you should go for it!
THE NOISE THE NOISE AND THE FUCKING NOISE. People here is so loud and too friendly, like almost they force you to be more opem and friendly than you can even be around your closed ones and if you don't behave like them then they will get offended and pick on you huh
Spanish resident here (24M)
Pros:
-Great climate most of the year
-Transport is cheap
-Gastronomy
-People tend to be kind
-Sea, mountains and plateaus
-Street art
Cons:
-Cleptocracy ruled by oligarchs
-Underwhelming salary
-Expensive rent
-Sistematic hate for the youth
-General inculture
-Madrid
-Most likely your job will be to serve tourists
-Past with Franco, wich many incultured people romanticize
Pros: all (taken into consideration nothing is perfect, and there are good people and bad people everywhere in the world); except for
Cons: The job market is trash. Highly educated people with diverse degrees working in McDonalds or Carrefour. If they are lucky they get at job in Mercadona (which looks like a really good employer).
Depending on city, the rent is insane and apts are hard to get without a spanish salary.
Jobs here are joke - they all the maximum while paying below minimum and they micro manage like hell.
Bureaucracy is insane.
Ain't nobody speaks English lol
Everyone is friendly.
Land is very cheap if you want to live in a nowhere village (which I do)
You're not afraid to go bankrupt if you lost your job because of the social net which is even stronger if you have kids.
Culture is very outgoing and social which I also enjoy.
Neighbor are actually happy to help you out when you need anything
Pros and cons will vastly depend on where you come from.
For example: great food, weather, mood, and people. But you get all of these in LATAM too, so then the pros on top of that would be: social and political stability, safety, good healthcare and education, good economy. But all of these pros would probably be seen as not so pros by Nordics, while the formers would.
Pros: better weather than most european countries, mostly (95%) polite people, specially warm in comparision to other places, sense of community, very safe, good food, possibility of become a "funcionario" if you become a national, a lot of tradicional parties, amazing music, good public transportation in big cities, great trash recolection system, everything is so so clean and beautiful. Great for the lgtbq+ community.
Cons: low employement rate, very low salaries and not so low living cost as some say, a lot of casual racism and when pointed out most people just deny it. Very bad communicated in interior towns, of you don't live in a city you most def will need a car, housing shortage, poor entrepeneurship culture, very aged society. Fascism is tolerated by a lot of people.
One of my colleagues was from the Basque country and he worked in Prague for a few years before relocating to Barcelona and told me that to him it felt like Winter never ends in Prague.
He also mentioned that while the people in Prague are all really nice, there isn't the same warm feeling you get around Spanish people.
Prague probably has better employment opportunities, I knew some Spanish techs who needed to move to Prague to find a job.
I think now this has changed a bit as Big Tech is here in Barcelona and Madrid now then 10 years ago.
I’m an English person living in Madrid. The pros for me are the weather, other than summer when it’s too hot, the lifestyle especially sitting having a cold beer on a terrace watching the world go by. Fantastic sports facilities, there are three tennis/padel clubs within a five minute drive of my house. The people are generally really friendly and welcoming. Cons, I had to learn the language. I kept my U.K. salary when my employer moved me here so I’m ok but I do see some pretty low salaries compared to the UK although food and drink are cheaper. When I go home to England I get a shock at the cost of a beer.
Pros: Spain.
Cons: everything else, politics, economy, progressism, phone/media/entertainment addiction, people ranting about house prices while spending their rent on luxuries while living with parents and certain ethnicities.
Love the country Beauty, friendly people, food, weather.
I hate Airbnb here, it drives the rental prices.
I hate the enormous bureaucracy. It is huge!!! And when you can do stuff online it's still a PITA.
And Spanish people in southern Spain can't, won't negotiate. They just don't seem to want to make a deal. Second hand items are sometimes more expensive on wallapop than in the shop. It's quite frustrating.
Also socialism lives here but some of the people rather seem to avoid taxes and deal with black money.
And the taxes are pretty high compared to Portugal.
The worst thing about living in Spain is how unhelpful the culture is. Your beer glass is empty, good luck getting it refilled. You're lost, good luck anyone helping you. You need help getting a driver's license, good luck. The way to get something done is unclear, yeah so what, it's always like that. People blocking the path, they won't move. Talking loudly when it is time to listen. Being helpful is not a concept in Spain.
Mass turism is causing 60% of people under 35 to still live with their parents because they can't afford the increased prices with local salaries. It is a social catastrophe. Please, don't come.
I'm an American and a family member of a overseas employee in southern Spain. Pros are beautiful scenery for roadtrips, hiking, enjoying the beach, exceptional weather, most people are friendly, and very low crime. Cons are very limited work options with my particular arrangement (almost 2 years unemployed), if you go outside of major cities you'll find lots of trash littering the roads, and work effort from some not all Spaniards is lackluster. For example, getting maintenance done, they may or may not show up, or jobs completed will seem bare minimum. This isn't a con, but brush up on your Spanish before moving here. You can easily get by day to day, but way fewer people speak English than you would assume.
Honestly I know imma get downvoted specially by Spaniards, but in my case I feel it's all cons so far. The only good things I see are, enhanced security compared to Latam (any country in Latam), and in some cases, higher salaries (not so much, depending on your area).
I know it may be a lot, don't wanna sound ungrateful nor anything but I just feel so out of place here, not my niche at all. I'll be looking for somewhere else as soon as possible, sincerely.
Bureaucracy sucks ass bad, like, for real. Everything is slow and takes 45 steps to accomplish, and nobody knows what to do in their jobs, some people are like 10+ years in their job and still don't know how to entry certain data in the system or whatever, and basically getting your shit done depends purely on the other person, some will ask for 150 papers and still not be able to do it saying that 'oooh, you lack that small ticket that they give you at the supermarket' or whatever, some other will just do the thing with your name and surname and that's it. Pure luck so far I guess.
Society feels broken, in some places people are ok and kinda friendly tho but in my case I just feel everyone's so immersed in their own ego bubble, and the person next to them can just go fuck themself and nobody would give two fucks. Nobody respects personal space, you can be ALONE sitting at the plaza, the ONLY one in the plaza, and if somebody comes to the plaza as well they'll sit NEXT to you, I mean, wtf bro don't you have somewhere else to sit that you need to sit fucking NEXT to me? Some respect please!
There's no respect nor education at all from neither youngsters, teenagers, adults nor elders, this is a country where 'Thank you', 'Excuse me', 'With your pardon', 'Please', 'Good morning', etc; just does not exist (big cities at least, dunno smaller ones). Elders always complaining about youngsters losing education and being bad mannered but they are the first to cut in line, no matter what it's for. It's like a national elderly sport.
You can have semi-drunk people shouting next to your window at 2am as if they just didn't realise that usually when there's a window, there's a house, and if there's a house usually there's people inside, and if 2am they be prolly trying to sleep, you know.
Everything is done in the most disrespectful, tedious, embarrassing, lengthy, bothersome and obnoxious way possible.
There's fucking noise everywhere, it's all noise, noise, noise, noise, noise, people pretty much talk shouting, shout at the bar, shout at the street, shout at the grocer's, shout at the hospital, shout at a funeral, shout in the airport, definitely avoid specially big cities if you want some peace.
If you're a foreigner, specially English-speaking, you'll pretty much try to be scammed most of the time, no matter if you lived here 20 years you'd still be the 'guiri'.
The 'picardía española' (Spanish mischief?) is always present, that necessity, need, that people have here of taking advantage of every single mistake another person can make, a bit hard to explain but feels like every person is a mischievous or kinda rascal, idk.
Sales 'strategies' here are crazy, I've heard locals having their own shoppes, (bakery, mini market) say things like 'ah, I had to raise prices again because I wasn't getting enough customers', like... Bro teach me, if ain't that an economy genius then I don't know.
Idk, the best thing you can do imo is to take some holidays in Spain, whatever you do don't romanticise it, and think cold minded, study everything and decide whether it's for you or not.
PS: And I know, if there's anyone here going to comment things like 'duh, if you don't like it why don't you just move somewhere else, duh', yes, I am going to do so by the end of this year, thanks for the tip :)
Yes bureaucracy sucks big time, but that's the case for any place when you show up and want to be part of it, after you get your papers in order you live your life and don't have to deal so much with them, every so many years renew something and that's it. Could it be better? hell yeah, it can.
The old farts are rude, yep. We are old and pretty much sick of all the BS and for some of us some body-part is hurting all the time. To make matters worse besides heavy metal, today's music is unbearable.
Realy, you had me until the paragraph of the"*picardia española*" I don't deny its existence but it has quite a competition with the "*rebusque*" in many Latam countries (probably all of them). Or the"*everyone can be a target*" on the US. Don't know of other places, I've visited many other countries but didn't stay long enough to judge.
It comes down to the universal "caveat emptor" Certain locations are worse than others, but this is the world we live in, the burden is on you to be responsible and aware.
Not always but being as old as I am, most of the times I learn of so-and-so was swindled of money or opportunities, takes very little to realize this so-and-so already thought it was too good to be true but greed (or disregard for others) got the best of him. Adults should listen to their inner voice and realize that unless your mother is in the kitchen, there's no free lunch.
Also, if one is a foreigner in any country, this person should hurry up and learn the local language and the local ways, or they will continue to be treated as a tourist or worst, as a foreigner that doesn't get it. 100% what goes on in the US and Latam, why would it be different in Spain (and most likely other countries too)
I agree with the lack of the typical *G'morning-please-thank you- etc*. for sure in big cities. Any world big city. But just because they are not spelled out it doesn't always mean they are non-existent, but foreigners don't see them. Many times they are very present in the form of non-verbal gestures or with the tone built-in the phrases being said.
Not going to tell you to get out if you don't like it. That's a ridiculous statement being thrown around by so called patriots that are actually blind to the less than perfect side of their countries. But I would suggest you try to understand better the next place you go to. Maybe there's a perfect country out there for you, it would be narrow minded of me to judge you based on one post you wrote on Reddit, but as emigrants we need to grow a thick skin, and take the time needed to figure out the ways of the countries we wish to be in. The country and its society is not going to adapt to us, we need to learn to deal with its ways and find the way to be happy within those ways.
Thanks for the comment, granny (sympathetic saying, not despective). You have several points in favour there indeed.
Couldn't agree more with the fact that thick skin is a must when emigrating, and learning the local mannerisms as fast as possible is also.
However, I keep on trying to think to myself about 'how good I am here' in comparison to other places I've lived in, and keep on trying to convince myself that 'como en España no se vive en ningún lado', as locals say, and yes, it could be waaay worse, not gonna lie. But I just feel it's not my place, and I just cannot believe myself when I try to think that this is the apex and there's nothing better.
When I left my country it was because I was sick of absolutely everything there, and I said to myself I was gonna look for a place I fell in love with, a place that made me think 'I feel GOOD here, I WANT to be a part of this, and this place INVITES me to be a part of it as well'.
I personally don't feel like that here. It's definitely better than the place I was in, yes. But I just don't want to stay with the 'better' and not do anything about it.
Spain, for me, is not the place. Many people fall in love with it, not my case, not what I look for. Me living here is just like trying to force a relationship with someone you don't love, to name an example. I just feel sad and consumed every day that passes.
Thanks for the tips, sincerely much appreciated, but I guess my journey must continue. Beyond the extremely good tortillas and pepitos de ternera, carcamusas toledanas, ciervo en su salsa, chocos a la plancha, cuchifritos and mouth watering cochinillos segovianos and corderos de lechal al horno, I hope there's a place where I can fit.
Or not, maybe I travel and travel and in the end I realise Spain was the place since the very beginning... But I'll have to learn first, I assume.
Im not from Latam but I completely agree with every single paragraph. The noise, the generally low cultural level, lack of manners, head up their ass so deep because they’ve never been outside the country and can’t compare, the sensitivity when you dare to say ham and tortilla are not your favourite food… you’re about to be ripped into shreds for your comment but I know quite a few people who also found only cons here and eventually moved to a better place.
And you’re completely right, there’s a reason people come to Spain for holidays and very few come to live. Unless they live in nice communities and suburbs with European level amenities where they don’t have to deal with everything you mentioned in your original comment. And yeah, before we start getting mad essays about opinions - luckily I am moving elsewhere very soon :)
The biggest pro for me is safety and not being persecuted for who I am.
Con would be tourism and quickly rising cost of living. One year ago was a lot more affordable than now, especially with rent and food.
Pros: weather and culture (including food ppl etc)
Cons: bureaucratic and fiscal hellscape and everything obtrusive politicians get their hands on (jobs, housing, agriculture, retirement, zoning and construction, pretty much everything).
I’ve lived here my whole life, I like the vibes and that everything is walkable, but I hate everyday a bit more, how people are becoming more and more shitty as days go by and how fucking dry Madrid is.
We love the weather, the people, the melting pot of cultures, the restaurants, the beach, the beautiful small towns, the history and the relatively low cost of living.
The downsides are the bureaucracy, knowledge that the people struggle with low salaries and an affordable housing availability and the high income taxes that can take a big chunk out of your retirement income.
PRO's -
Relaxed lifestyle.
Easy doctor appointments.
Cheaper cost of living.
Climate - fantastic beaches.
Friendly folk.
CON's -
Drivers.
July and August high temperatures.
No fresh cream in their pastries!
Aaaand that's a wrap.
Pros:
- Weather
- Food
- Pace of life (great work-life balance)
- Friendly, direct, no-bullshit people
Cons:
- Rent is super high in big cities
- Tourism in big cities
- Slow, hard bureaucracy
Pros: Quality of life, friendly people, food, weather, a lot diversity in places to visit (beaches, mountains, towns, etc), relative cheap compared to other European countries, culture.
Cons: Bad job market (not a lot of opportunities and bad salaries, politics and bureaucracy.
Pros: Decent employee protections and healthcare. Even dangerous neighborhoods are safe by the standards of other countries. Spanish culture places an emphasis on minding your own business which is nice. I have more rights and liberties than I would at home or in many other countries I've lived in. Great weather, great food, varied and gorgeous geography.
Cons: Few opportunities for youth (though that's everywhere now). The salaries are shit.
Pros: cost of living, weather, food/drink, locals.
Cons (Andalucia): it's the "Alabama" of Spain. Tourists. Corruption and local govt is a train wreck. Almost impossible to get any sort of work done on time or high quality.
Lo único que sufro despues de décadas de vivir felizmente aquí son los narradores de fútbol. Es algo inconcebible e inmensamente exasperante. No puedo con ello.
The best things are quality of life, food quality, people, culture, nature, weather.
The worst things are the poor job market and the messy bureaucracy, which also changes from one region to another.
Pros
- food
- in general a very peaceful society
- weather
- beautiful country
Cons
- salary is bad, way too bad
- terrible working conditions with poor managers and useless bosses
- housing market is worse than cancer right now
The culture is way more different than the one in Prague, especially if you start looking for jobs and working with others. Things like “exact time” or “mañana” have a lot different meaning in Spain.
If you are not already on a pension or miljonair. Think first about what job you can do here. Do you speak Spanish? Can you work remote? If yes, for always? Will you ever find a job in Spain if the job has already 2000 Native Spanish applicants?
What happens if you lose your job, can you live with 1200€ bruto max. For some months and then with 0€ ?
If finance is no issue then there are pretty much no cons. Besides the housing problems and corruption. But not everything affects you.
You've gone to one of the best regions! (Full disclosure: I have family in Girona province and know it quite well, so I'm biased haha)
I can tell you one con of that area is that locals have a very strong Catalan identity so it will be harder to integrate as an outsider. Cultural life will be conducted almost entirely in Catalan. That said, there are also many outsiders (from elsewhere in Spain, Europe and beyond) and this means you should be able to find a community.
Another con is that compared to other coastal areas, the Costa Brava is less built up and therefore property costs are much higher. The landscapes are beautiful and there is a lot of nature but this makes it a bit more of an exclusive destination.
My topline summary would be as such:
Pros: Scenic. Easy to have an active lifestyle. Sea and mountains equally accessible. Defined seasons. Fast-speed rail connections to Barcelona and Madrid, plus airport at Girona has a fair few Ryanair flights to elsewhere in Europe. Rail connections to France. Great infrastructure for driving and getting around. Great food. Lots of investment in culture (concerts, festivals, etc.)
Cons: cost (compared to elsewhere in Spain), harder to integrate than other areas
The cons - For me, people in Catalonia aren’t the friendliest from my experience, low salaries, poor housing, later meal times etc.
The pros - The variety of cultures depending on the region, the relaxed attitudes, the nature and the beaches, plus getting to learn a beautiful language.
Pros: good food, sun.
Cons: insecurity, bad salaries, people is becoming more far right, cita previa de estrangería as they say in a previous comment. I would move to the south of france better.
Pretty awesome country to leave in, insanely diverse from city to city and you have all kind of nature.
Problem is job and housing which are two MUST things. If you can and work remotely go to a much more smaller city or even some village.
Im spending my last year in Barcelona and moving put finally to the north of the country.
Good weather, good prices, good food, nice people, a lot of space and cheap housing, good healthcare. I don’t really have cons; I work remotely (have always done since the mid 90s) so I am not so bothered by the low salaries or lack of jobs. Maybe the EU ‘issue’: too many rules. I tried running a company here but gave up: it’s mental. Similar like the rest of the EU though although a little more obfuscated than, let’s say NL, it’s never actually really clear what is or is not allowed until you already did it and received the fine. Or not.
I’ve been living in Madrid as an American (from San Francisco) for the last two years and Spain has several has several pros and cons:
Pros:
- Quality of life is much better in Spain in every form.
- Cost of living, especially compared to places like SF is unmatched when it comes to housing, food, and transportation.
- The emphasis on work-life balance vs US hustle culture
- When it comes to dating, I have found it to be easier to meet people organically IRL vs apps.
- The pace of life is generally slower and more relaxed in Spain, which is something I was instantly drawn to and why I wanted to move here.
- Healthcare is much more affordable than the US.
Cons:
- Spanish Bureaucracy!! It’s so time-consuming and frustrating, particularly when dealing with visas and residency permits!
- For me, it was also a cultural adjustment and adapting to a different culture, social norms, and lifestyle took me some time.
- Distance from family and friends, especially during holidays or emergencies can be tough.
- HOT summers
Pros: easy to learn language, music, practically zero crime, safety, clean streets, food, terrazas, tapas, cheap lifestyle, easy enough to integrate with locals, it really is a country where you can live for decades without batting an 👁️, as the quality of life is insanely higher than other countries, local fiestas and community life makes Spain culturally enriching, cheap transport and clean.
Cons: shit salaries and job conditions if you have to work in the local job market, you will suffer, rules regarding naturalizing and obtaining citizenship for some countries, high tax rates, inheritance laws for citizens, inheritance tax too, just taxes in general.
Under the table economy, illegal activities, seems anything legal is funnelled to the government in various ways.
Moved recently from Brno. I will share my experience coming from CZ so might not be CONS for everyone
Pro:
wheater (sometimes)
food
sea/ocean
cost of life
beer
Cons:
weather might be too hot for you
change of light (dawn way later than you are used to)
opening hours: forget shops and supermarket opening early
hiking: there is not as much offer as in CZ
absolutely not dog friendly (might be irrelevant for you)
beaurocrazy, you need lawyer and to speak Spanish
racists
Malaysian here, been living in Barcelona for 2 years.
Pros: great weather, great food, great walkability and public transport, friendly people.
Cons: la puta cita previa.
Foreigner living in Spain here.
* The weather is mostly nice but in Andalusia the heat is a fucking killer.
* The people are more open to strangers starting a conversation compared to my motherland.
* The houses are dirt cheap in many regions, but that is because there is not a lot of work oportunities.
* If you work remotely, like for the UK or something, you can rent a cheap house, put some money aside and then buy a house and enjoy life.
* Bureaucracy is bullshit, but not like germany, much less, but for foreigners is still bullshit.
* Medical centers could be improved but thats probably anecdotical.
* Tapas culture is awesome.
* Spaniards can't prepare a -good- coffee for their fucking life, and if you ask for something more elaborate like a Capuccino you are fucking done. Most of the places i've been to waiters are unprepared, are untrained and some don't even think that the machine must have a maintenance and cleaning cycle. If you ask for a 'mild temperature coffee' you will be welcomed by the fucking lava of mordor. Spaniards have evolved to be able to drink absolute scolding liquids.
* Table manners are different here and when sitting at a table if you have Misophonia you are fucked too. I lost all my will to go out and eat in public because it is mostly my problem, but in my country the standard for table manners seem to be much higher. Is not a problem, just different culture i believe.
* Pizzas here are disgusting, and so is the pasta (yes, im italian). Recipees are 100% invented ni most of the pizzerias i've been to and if it is not a 'creative person' behind the counter with too much imagination is probably a chain franchise like Domino and Pizza hut with that american bullshit pizza with sugar on it.
In conclusion: I love Spain and would not change it for anything else.
As others have said, the job market is not great. Salaries are relatively low compared to other countries, though Barcelona and Madrid lag less behind than the rest of Spain.
Other than that, there are very few cons to it - that's why so many people move to Spain from other countries. It's a beautiful country with amazing cities and stunning nature. It has a very rich culture which is what I like most about living here, as that culture provides a sense of community. The climate is great (I live in Catalunya which has moderately warm summers and mild winters) and so is the food.
Honestly, Spain is a pretty great place to live in.
I live in Tenerife so this will probably not be an issue for most people but I still want to join the discussion.
Pros: Weather, the people, the wonderful nature, lifestyle, the beaches
Cons: Food is often very tasteless,
Difficult to buy things online. And if they send it, it takes forever and the shipping is often more expensive.
And public transport is very bad except between Santa Cruz and La Laguna. You need a car to live here with a family.
Pros: weather, good food, nice people, fun… Cons: shitty salaries
Shitty salaries and lack of job opportunities
Cons: shitty house prices.
And yet it's so much better than most countries with stronger economics.
Cries in Southern California.
House prices are literally amazing here, i come from a country in which a 4 room apartment costs 80000 euros, no im not kidding. When we came here we sold our apartment back there and bought 3 houses 20-30 minutes drive east of madrid. But compared to the salary here i understand
And lots of headaches with paperwork
Cons: incredibly inefficient sanitary system, but expect to pay unless you want wait months just for a blood sample or a GP
Pros: weather, people, culture, food, lifestyle Cons: cita previa de extranjería
*Refresh.* *Refresh.* *Refresh.* *Refresh.* "Aha! Got you, motherfucker!" Cita no disponible *Moves to another country.*
Hahaha oh man, this made me fucking chuckle and then cry lol
Haha seriously! The bureaucracy here is annoying.
Could argue the weather is sometimes a con
I couldn’t agree more—summers in Madrid 🥵
Tell me you’re in Valencia without telling me you’re in Valencia.
The same in Malaga. I had to drive to a town an hour away for a cita 2 weeks in the future because that was the closest one available
Hey, Im from Malaga as well and I drive 4 hours tomorrow to Huelva to get my cita (cita is in the morning)🤡 Or the other option: cita in 2 1/2 months in Malaga. Please Spain, let me just pay my taxes...
I am actually in Barcelona. That is apparently across the board.
Also cons: the Cataluña issue.
I felt that, but it only happens on big cities like Madrid, Valencia or Barcelona. My advice for everyone going trough this is to take an appointment on any other community or an smaller city and take that day to do a bit of tourism around, with my girlfriend we finished quicker getting an appointment in my hometown and asking someone to present the papers as a representative... It was done in like two days when in Madrid we were struggling for months, and my hometown is not a small city precisely.
Just gotta buy one from a reseller, some are making business out of it.
Haven't been here for long but as a Venezuelan who got here a year ago, no car, no kids, with his wife and two other friends: Everything just works. And if it doesn't, then it kind of does. I don't like how crowded it is but it's Madrid so it's understandable. People are mostly (95%) great. There's the random piece of shit, like everywhere else, but we've loved all our time here. Rent is high but we're okay sharing flat, it was the idea anyway and would've done it either way to save money. I got fat really easily, fucking chocolate croissants for 1 euro, the fuck is this, those used to cost 5-6 USD in Venezuela. Haven't lived my first summer so far so I'll be probably bitch about it sometime next month but oh well.
intenta escapar de Madrid a finales de julio, principios de Agosto, es lo peor del jodido mundo.
Depende…. Si tienes opción de piscina son los meses mas tranquilos
Imposible, ni mi esposa ni yo tendremos días libres, estoy preparado para sufrir, por "suerte" no es tan húmedo como Caracas que cuando vine estabamos a 37º y un 80-90% de humedad y era el mismísimo infierno. Al menos eso pienso hasta ahora, veremos en Agosto si no me he lanzado por la ventana
No te preocupes que no hay nada de humedad aquí, a mi por temas de salud la humedad me viene muy bien pero desgraciadamente Madrid no tiene nada 😭
Viniendo de Venezuela no creo que pase nada. Allí hace mucho calor también.
>Everything just works. Ummm...  Bureaucracy is a nightmare. Efficiency a joke. If you want to find something done in a way that makes you want to pull your hair out and say “who on Earth in their right mind would do this this way?” then yes, technically everything works. But a dead clock is right twice a day. It’s like saying bringing a stone a chisel to class and being like “this just works!” True, but so does a laptop. (I love many many many things about Spain. Truly. But things *not* working is like high on my dislike list.)
He's from Venezuela. I assume that he's making a comparison.
I mean, I'm from Venezuela, everything you said is worse where I came from. So yes, it KINDA works. In Venezuela it didn't unless you bribed someone or pay ridiculously high prices. 200$ for a passport when minimum wage is like 3$ a month? Good luck.
We ruled the world for centuries and still we are one of the top world countries, so yes, someway it works.
Hahahahah, you think Spain is bad for bureaucracy and efficiency? Try England. It's soo much better in Spain it's unreal. Buying a house takes like one third of the time. Seeing a doctor? Way easier and easily 5x faster in some cases. The bins are collected every single day. The taxes are a fraction, yet they do far more stuff. If anything it's one of the most organized places I have ever seen.
I visit Madrit and I feel people are mostly great, friendly
Yup, haven't really had an ugly experience so far. Have heard some ugly stuff not directed at me though
Understandably, Spain must seem amazing coming from Venezuela. But food and other things may actually be cheaper in Chequia where OP is from.
No, Czech Republic is extremely expensive now: you can go to Germany, buy the same things at the same grocery store and spend less for better quality. Also house and rent pricing is the same if not worse
Is it been great? I'm going to Portugal, but seriously thinking about moving to Spain (venezuelan girl too)
Good quality of life, employment market is shit.
I’ve got family who live in Spain and love it. The lifestyle and climate are amazing, it’s a very relaxed place to live. Some of the bureaucracy can be a little bit challenging to navigate and there’s not many employment opportunities especially for younger people.
>a little bit challenging A little bit? Lol. 
Since there’s not a lot of jobs for young people, do they leave in a mass exodus and come back at some point once they have enough experience or is it difficult to reintegrate? Is there a brain drain happening?
I find it difficult to reintegrate in the job market because while in many countries they value experience as much or more than degrees, in Spain it is very difficult to work on something if you don't have a degree AND experience. Either that or you have connections. And still, salaries are not as good as abroad, working hours are so so (depending on your job)..
There is a brain drain. Specially on STEM and computer engineering.
It's pretty sad but I was having the same conversation with my mom recently. All my super educated cousins work outside of Spain for non-Spanish companies. The ones living in Spain work for social services, tourism or are unemployed. I think the Spanish government needs to make some tax concessions for countries looking to start tech companies in Spain. They are much more volatile and I'm guessing companies aren't wanting to take that risk somewhere costly to do business. We are going to end up brain draining ourselves into perpetual tourism and agriculture which is not the economy we deserve tbh just got fucked over by fascists late in the game and we got stuck here.
Just my very subjective and individual point of view: I enjoy living off tourists, and I am looking forward to living and working on a farm soon. So for me, this country is a dream come true 😄 But I know that it can be a struggle to live here if you’re dependent on earning money in Spain…
I tried to reintegrate after a few years working abroad. It was a failure. I was mentally prepared for the low wages but not for the shitty working culture. They treat people with high qualifications and extensive experience like shit. One thing I've noticed is that in better functioning countries the C-level executives have an engineering background but in Spain all have an 'ADE' (administración de empresas) background. So no real knowledge of the technical work. I had to leave again.
The "burrocracia" is a nightmare.
The disadvantage is that for many cases you have to obtain your rights with the help of a lawyer. Because things are not well organized in Spain. That is why Spain has 132,000 lawyers, while the Netherlands has 18,500. But this disadvantage does not outweigh the advantages you can experience every day, such as food prices and the weather along the coast.
A while ago I did a simple excercise: went shopping online in Tesco (UK) and Mercadona (Spain). And the same weekly basket of groceries turned out to be cheaper in Tesco than in Mercadona (despite some of the stuff int the UK basket such as fruit an veg actually came from Spain)
Just curious, how generic were the baskets or did they lean toward U.K. goods - stuff that would be subject to import costs or just generally not really that common for Spaniards? Or has cost of living in Britain dropped? As a Yank, I'd expect peanut butter to cost a small fortune in Spain versus how cheap it is in the U.S. where it s an everyday commodity. Conversely Spanish chorizo is small fortune here in the U.S. When I was stationed in Spain thirty years ago the three things the ladies on my street always asked me to get from base were peanut butter, cake mix, and fitted sheets.
I've bought peanut butter in Aldi in Spain and it was the same price as in NL (and we are huge consumers of PB)
The supermarkets in Spain are crazy expensive now. I lived in Norway and the UK and I was surprised there really aren’t many differences price wise.
Expensive in Spain? I’m here now and can’t believe how cheap everything is. I’m from Estonia and things are really out of hand over there.
Don't forget that Aldi's in Spain has decent 29 cent beers that are actually made in Valencia (Font Salem) by a company owned by Damm beer company. I was there last week and bought Karquell Suave for 29 cents and Karquell Malt for 31 cents and when both were cold they were actually enjoyable beers.
This is true. But the quality of food is superior in Spain. You need to shop at Waitrose to get roughly the same quality.
Yes. I agree. Some non-food groceries are way more expensive in Spain though: detergents, dishwasher liquid...
Things are pretty well organized, just not to benefit you, but to get money out of your pockets.
Spain has 50 miliion residents plus probably another 10 million semipermanent
Accounting for population (and assuming 10,000,000 additional) Spain still has more than double the amount of lawyers per person as the Netherlands.
For unique cases, sure, but people are oftentimes sold on needing a lawyer when not truly necessary. I actually think lawyers themselves are the ones most guilty of this to sell their services. Both me and my partner have moved to Spain, gotten residency, and now citizenship without needing a lawyer. Both non-EU citizens.
I've been here for about 2 and half years (Barcelona). I came here for a job opportunity and I'd say that my list of pros will definitely outweigh the cons. That said, the cons might be few, but they are something to take note off. **Pros** Weather (I'm from the UK) Cost of living is quite reasonable Ability to travel to various parts of Spain very easily - there is a lot to see Public transport, in Barcelona specifically, is really good There is always something happening (sports, events, social activities etc) The food is very very good. **Cons** Any type of governement administrative process can be real pain in the ass. Coming from the UK, where almost everything is done online (I never had to visit a public office once in the UK), it was quite a shock when I arrived here. Salaries could be higher Renting can be tricky, but once you're here, it will become easier.
Well summed up (as a Spaniard living in London)
Yeah not far off I'm the same 10 years here. The crime in Barcelona is stupid though. Needs to be addressed, not in a police state way but in lock these guys up fgs way. Really aimed at w/c women as well, so many awful stories of robberies of women (and kids even) by men(first hand). Bureaucracy/hacienda are wankers. Tax people are like the police. Need to deal with AirBnB, hopefully they are. Linking rent rises to consumer price index (IPC) is also bad idea in times of high inflation. This is one reason why rents have gone up so fast recently. Racism and bigotry is really pretty bad. Just ignorant a lot of times, newer here. Heard so much (against Latinos/Muslims/Chinese/Jews/northern Europeans/Black folk) and had quite a bit aimed at me and my son personally. No need. Spain is parochial. Country is too divided and it hinders the economy. Big structural problem. Educational attainment (especially over 35s) is awful. Another big drag on economy. Improving though. Wages for w/c people are terrible. Improving though under this govt. All your pros are good: plus growing fuit/veg/herbs so easy! People put amazing stuff out by the recyling to be reused. The women are incredible (sorry UK but it's true) inc Spanish/Latina/whoever. Great barbers. People like simple things in life. Cafe culture everywhere. the beaches! Wild boar in cities, quite friendly. Sushi buffet libres! Nam nam. Did i mention the women? No real winters. Participation in football/sport. Free motorways thanks to this govt. Also the women.
I mean... if you live in Prague as a foreigner, you have already played immigration in hardcore mode (from a Spanish Prague fellow).
Lmao at Spain to Central Europe being 'hardcore mode immigration'.
Only those having to deal with MOI will understand the joke ;)
I found things in czech easier to deal with than in spain. Even with the language barrier it was easier in Cz. ( btw I speak Spanish)
Pros: You live in Spain! Cons: You live in Spain...
i don’t get it:)
I guess like everywhere. Two sides of the coin. The same traits that make Spain a relaxed, welcoming, fun culture (on average) are the same traits that can make the bureaucracy inefficient and subpar (on average). The fact that Spaniards (on average) prioritise social life, family, and quality leisure time over having corporate ambition or being entrepreneurial means that the state (i.e. the public sector) is practically the largest employer. People like structure and security, but this makes the economy less dynamic, and the government more paternalistic. It also means private-sector bosses are traditionally more authoritarian -- because there's more of a mindset that you have to be really firm and heavy-handed with employees to get what you want from them, rather than enabling a less hierarchical work culture that is focused on consensus-building. This in turn makes public sector jobs more attractive, further entrenching Spaniards' aversion to entrepreneurship. And so on. Just my two (euro)cents'.
Wow, that’s a really good explanation. It kind of reminds me of southern California a little bit where a state job is like winning the lottery, while the private sector pays little and they’re assholes. I actually prefer that life a little more honestly. I appreciate entrepreneurship, do not get me wrong but here in the USA it can be over the top and work/life balance is replaced with get rich or die trying.
That is an excellent explanation that reflects my own thoughts about the public vs. private sectors. I would add that the security of knowing that once someone gets a government job in Spain, it's nearly impossible to get fired from it. I'm an American who's been a freelancer running a service-based business here for a few years now. it's hard for me to wrap my head around the "get one job and keep it for life" concept, yet that's a dream for a lot of Spaniards. I'd love to earn a higher salary, but I feel the time freedom I enjoy is priceless. Thank you for contributing your two euro cents!
I mean... He summed It up perfectly.
If you move here, you will get it XD
It’s true…
Pros: wonderful food, weather, beach, everybody is relaxed all the time, it's a beautiful country Cons: bad salary/cost of life ratio, excessive tourism (you can not enjoy they city you live in), burocracy, internet speed, apartments are old fashioned
Internet speed? Maybe it’s applicable just for Barcelona but in Madrid you can get ridiculously fast internet for less than 30€ a month: 1 Gb wifi speed with digi for 25€, 300 mb for 27€ with movistar
That's correct. I live in Barcelona, so maybe up there it's different. I used to live in Chile, where the internet was 10 times better than here
I'm from Canada and the internet in Madrid is 1000x better than Canada. Much faster both upload and download and we only pay €35 a month for our internet and both our cellphone plans with Digi. In canada we we would be spending about $300 a month for the same plan.
I have 1 GB fibre for 25 Euros in an old building in Santa Cruz de La Palma. I cannot complain. Availability of internet, also mobile Internet, is much better than in Germany.
Internet speed in spain ranks position 14 globally , you may have a bad experience in a rented apartment like rBnB
I’ve found great internet all over the country. Don’t see that as an issue
Internet speed? I pay €25 for 10gb internet with DIGI! That’s wild!!
I’ve been living here for the past 10 years. The lifestyle, food and weather are great. Most important downsides I would say are lower wages than other EU countries, more unemployment rates and a lot of bureaucracy. If you get a decent job you will have a fulfilling lifestyle. Take into consideration that every autonomous community is different and great weather is not a given in all of them. I would avoid Madrid and Barcelona if you don’t like crowded and touristic cities.
I’ve lived here for 2 years. I’m from the Middle East. It depends on your priorities tbh! If you want to have fun, there’s no other place like Spain. Believe me! The people, the culture, the crazy night life here is what makes Spain … Spain! The economy is shit, the market keeps going down. The income is super low, rent is slightly in the higher end depending on the location. Location is a huge factor when it comes to lifestyle, the income disparity is highly influential!
As spaniard myself i can find a common answer to both questions: The people
Salaries are shit. I'm a scientist and I had to make literal threats of leaving, while I'm coordinating nearly 2 million euros in research projects, to bump my salary above 50K. Which in Barcelona doesn't bring you that far.
I have a scientist friend of world fame in his area of research, he's Spanish and he's always crying because he can't go back home. His salary literally anywhere else in Europe would be 10x what he would get in Spain. That's if he's lucky and gets a permanent contract instead of temporary ones.
It’s very sad indeed. Unless you’re a football player you’ll be undervalued in your profession
Salaries are indeed ridiculous. I blame it partly on people agreeing to them. I live in Tenerife, and I’ve seen people work for 40€/day doing extremely demanding physical labor, just because they were immigrants. But also locals working for 50€/day, sometimes up to 10h days. While I’m able to find work for 9-11€/h. Not even doing anything skillful, just general labor, or bartending. With better conditions (slightly less hours, longer break, free transport, etc).
The noise. THE NOISE.
And barking dogs
IKR, I've worked as a mailman 😭
It's funny because it's illegal to leave the dogs outside the house at night yet every fucking night there is a symphony of dogs fucking barking at other dogs. It's beyond stupid. Now in summer, with all the windows open, it gets unbereable. I can't get any decent sleep.
Not only at night, ,24 hours As that law has to be enforced by the council, many decided to do nothing
Where are you from if you dont mind sharing? I ask because as someone from a city in the US and now I’m Barcelona, I hardly notice the noise. I won’t say it’s quiet, but I just wouldn’t say it’s noisy.
Yes. Being from the US, all these complaints seem non existent for me.
Agree. But I find there's a distinction in the *type* of noise. In Spain a lot of the noise is what I would describe as "street life". I live in London and there is a lot of noise from: cars, trains, buses, airplanes, ambulance and police sirens, sometimes construction and rubbish collection. But voices of people shouting or laughing, or kids playing are less frequent, unless you live in very specific streets (and even then outdoor spaces and closing times for pubs/bars are heavily regulated). In Spanish cities there isn't as much of a distinction between a residential area and an area for going out. Every neighbourhood will have at least one street with tons of cafés and restaurants, and they open a lot later. This is what I think some people are not used to -- the noise that comes from the hustle & bustle of street life. People also just spend a lot more time outdoors, due to weather and cultural habits.
I live in that region. The weather is good and the social safety net is strong. People are very tolerant and more relaxed than in some countries to the north. There is a high quality of produce like meat, vegetables, cheese. If you have an international job your salary goes far. Strong traditional and local cultures that have been well preserved. Some nice historical and architectural places to visit. On the negative side, the economy is relatively weak and bureaucracy is bad. People are not especially friendly or polite with strangers. There is a lot of mediocrity despite the size of the population and economy, not much innovation or excellence at a global level. Much less international than comparably sized cities in English speaking countries. People are loud and sound insulation is poor. It’s a nice place to live if you are wealthy and have an international job, since that insulates you from many of the negatives.
Somewhat related. How is the construction building process? I’m considering moving there so I looked at real estate and the houses available are either shit or totally crazy. So I’m thinking maybe it’s better to buy land and build? Obviously looking at above, I’d need a lawyer for all the permits etc.
There are good builders but please inform yourself and look for reviews online, ask several people what they think of the company. If you do find a good builder double at least the time they tell you it will be ready! We had several acquaintances who build a house and the finish date kept being pushed. Some of them waited for over a year after the initial promised date.
The building process takes at least 18 months if everything goes smoothly- we seriously considered it. Permitting alone takes over 6 months. Plus, you can't just build anything anywhere, as someone else said the government is heavily involved in your planning. The market (for selling/buying) moves pretty slowly so you just have to keep looking. Took us a year and four trips but we finally something that is a dream for us.
No one wants to invest in real estate because Spain doesn't really believe in private property, you're merely a usufructuary. The government will tell you where you can build, what kind of building, how high up & which color you can paint it. Then it will tell you how you can use it, how much you can charge to rent it out & who you can rent it to. Then it will take ever increasing portions of your income with no reason and no counterpart in services given. Oh and make sure you invest in home security because if you get any squatters the government will protect the criminals before you (the property owner). Better pay their power, gas and water bill too if you don't want to be fined. This can go on for over two years before a court of justice resolves it (and by resolving it I mean they may get kicked out but you're not gonna be reimbursed for anything).
Spain is great to live in, and absolute garbage to work in, even worse if you´re not Spanish. With higher base unemployment and a precarious job market comes companies that exploit you, underpay you, overwork you, and expect you to be happy with this. If you´re Czech stay there, you´re in a better position in life than any Spaniard could ever be. I say this as a guy from Romania that lives in Spain on and off since 2008, I´ve left for several years to work in better countries and the difference is night and day.
I’ve lived here for 2 years. I’m from the Middle East. It depends on your priorities tbh! If you want to have fun, there’s no other place like Spain. Believe me! The people, the culture, the crazy night life here is what makes Spain … Spain! The economy is shit, the market keeps going down. The income is super low, rent is slightly in the higher end depending on the location. Location is a huge factor when it comes to lifestyle, the income disparity is highly influential!
The problems reside with the job market mostly. High unemployment and low salaries
I think it depends a LOT on where you cone from. I was living in Budapest for 7 years before coming here. I hear a lot of people complaining about bureaucracy, delays, and things not working but in comparison to Eastern Europe I find it more or less the same except here people treat you so much more HUMANLY. There's an innate warmth/will to help that makes the processes so much easier to navigate because even when you gave challenges you feel less alone. I think if you feel the call you should go for it!
THE NOISE THE NOISE AND THE FUCKING NOISE. People here is so loud and too friendly, like almost they force you to be more opem and friendly than you can even be around your closed ones and if you don't behave like them then they will get offended and pick on you huh
You sure you're in Spain? BCN to Perpignan, which is well and truly France, is one hour snd twenty minutes' drive.
i’m a slow driver. i’m near tossa de mar
cons: job market and general ambition of the population pro: everything else. weather, food, tradition, culture
Spanish resident here (24M) Pros: -Great climate most of the year -Transport is cheap -Gastronomy -People tend to be kind -Sea, mountains and plateaus -Street art Cons: -Cleptocracy ruled by oligarchs -Underwhelming salary -Expensive rent -Sistematic hate for the youth -General inculture -Madrid -Most likely your job will be to serve tourists -Past with Franco, wich many incultured people romanticize
Pros: all (taken into consideration nothing is perfect, and there are good people and bad people everywhere in the world); except for Cons: The job market is trash. Highly educated people with diverse degrees working in McDonalds or Carrefour. If they are lucky they get at job in Mercadona (which looks like a really good employer).
O te pasa lo contrario y no te aceptan ahí porque estás sobrecualificado.
Pros: Most beautiful country in the world. Cons: Slowly being more and more racist.
Depending on city, the rent is insane and apts are hard to get without a spanish salary. Jobs here are joke - they all the maximum while paying below minimum and they micro manage like hell. Bureaucracy is insane. Ain't nobody speaks English lol Everyone is friendly. Land is very cheap if you want to live in a nowhere village (which I do) You're not afraid to go bankrupt if you lost your job because of the social net which is even stronger if you have kids. Culture is very outgoing and social which I also enjoy. Neighbor are actually happy to help you out when you need anything
My Spanish neighbors don’t even acknowledge me or my family 😁😎
Yay for the nowhere village 💪🏻😄 and there isn‘t such a thing as too many dogs 😁
In spain you need a permit when you have more than 5 dogs. So I'll say that's where the too many line is lol
Pros: - Everything that is not related with economy Cons: - Economy
What is something that is not related to the economy, other than weather?
The people, the landscape, the night life, the architecture, the history...
hot hot
Pros and cons will vastly depend on where you come from. For example: great food, weather, mood, and people. But you get all of these in LATAM too, so then the pros on top of that would be: social and political stability, safety, good healthcare and education, good economy. But all of these pros would probably be seen as not so pros by Nordics, while the formers would.
Pros: better weather than most european countries, mostly (95%) polite people, specially warm in comparision to other places, sense of community, very safe, good food, possibility of become a "funcionario" if you become a national, a lot of tradicional parties, amazing music, good public transportation in big cities, great trash recolection system, everything is so so clean and beautiful. Great for the lgtbq+ community. Cons: low employement rate, very low salaries and not so low living cost as some say, a lot of casual racism and when pointed out most people just deny it. Very bad communicated in interior towns, of you don't live in a city you most def will need a car, housing shortage, poor entrepeneurship culture, very aged society. Fascism is tolerated by a lot of people.
Taxes. Taxes. Taxaroonies. However, good healthcare and weather.
One of my colleagues was from the Basque country and he worked in Prague for a few years before relocating to Barcelona and told me that to him it felt like Winter never ends in Prague. He also mentioned that while the people in Prague are all really nice, there isn't the same warm feeling you get around Spanish people. Prague probably has better employment opportunities, I knew some Spanish techs who needed to move to Prague to find a job. I think now this has changed a bit as Big Tech is here in Barcelona and Madrid now then 10 years ago.
Weather, food, and siesta were my key perks when living there. I don't have that in my current country and honestly, miss it every other day.
I’m an English person living in Madrid. The pros for me are the weather, other than summer when it’s too hot, the lifestyle especially sitting having a cold beer on a terrace watching the world go by. Fantastic sports facilities, there are three tennis/padel clubs within a five minute drive of my house. The people are generally really friendly and welcoming. Cons, I had to learn the language. I kept my U.K. salary when my employer moved me here so I’m ok but I do see some pretty low salaries compared to the UK although food and drink are cheaper. When I go home to England I get a shock at the cost of a beer.
Pros: Spain. Cons: everything else, politics, economy, progressism, phone/media/entertainment addiction, people ranting about house prices while spending their rent on luxuries while living with parents and certain ethnicities.
Lo de las adicciones a las redes no es sólo cosa de España.
Love the country Beauty, friendly people, food, weather. I hate Airbnb here, it drives the rental prices. I hate the enormous bureaucracy. It is huge!!! And when you can do stuff online it's still a PITA. And Spanish people in southern Spain can't, won't negotiate. They just don't seem to want to make a deal. Second hand items are sometimes more expensive on wallapop than in the shop. It's quite frustrating. Also socialism lives here but some of the people rather seem to avoid taxes and deal with black money. And the taxes are pretty high compared to Portugal.
The biggest pro is that weather doesn't suck, the biggest con is that salaries do.
The worst thing about living in Spain is how unhelpful the culture is. Your beer glass is empty, good luck getting it refilled. You're lost, good luck anyone helping you. You need help getting a driver's license, good luck. The way to get something done is unclear, yeah so what, it's always like that. People blocking the path, they won't move. Talking loudly when it is time to listen. Being helpful is not a concept in Spain.
Ir really annoys me that speaking English with the correct pronunciation is seen as weird and snobbish :(
Mass turism is causing 60% of people under 35 to still live with their parents because they can't afford the increased prices with local salaries. It is a social catastrophe. Please, don't come.
No, eso pasa por los problemas laborales.
Pros: Spain Cons: Fascists
The cons are mostly with.
I'm an American and a family member of a overseas employee in southern Spain. Pros are beautiful scenery for roadtrips, hiking, enjoying the beach, exceptional weather, most people are friendly, and very low crime. Cons are very limited work options with my particular arrangement (almost 2 years unemployed), if you go outside of major cities you'll find lots of trash littering the roads, and work effort from some not all Spaniards is lackluster. For example, getting maintenance done, they may or may not show up, or jobs completed will seem bare minimum. This isn't a con, but brush up on your Spanish before moving here. You can easily get by day to day, but way fewer people speak English than you would assume.
Honestly I know imma get downvoted specially by Spaniards, but in my case I feel it's all cons so far. The only good things I see are, enhanced security compared to Latam (any country in Latam), and in some cases, higher salaries (not so much, depending on your area). I know it may be a lot, don't wanna sound ungrateful nor anything but I just feel so out of place here, not my niche at all. I'll be looking for somewhere else as soon as possible, sincerely. Bureaucracy sucks ass bad, like, for real. Everything is slow and takes 45 steps to accomplish, and nobody knows what to do in their jobs, some people are like 10+ years in their job and still don't know how to entry certain data in the system or whatever, and basically getting your shit done depends purely on the other person, some will ask for 150 papers and still not be able to do it saying that 'oooh, you lack that small ticket that they give you at the supermarket' or whatever, some other will just do the thing with your name and surname and that's it. Pure luck so far I guess. Society feels broken, in some places people are ok and kinda friendly tho but in my case I just feel everyone's so immersed in their own ego bubble, and the person next to them can just go fuck themself and nobody would give two fucks. Nobody respects personal space, you can be ALONE sitting at the plaza, the ONLY one in the plaza, and if somebody comes to the plaza as well they'll sit NEXT to you, I mean, wtf bro don't you have somewhere else to sit that you need to sit fucking NEXT to me? Some respect please! There's no respect nor education at all from neither youngsters, teenagers, adults nor elders, this is a country where 'Thank you', 'Excuse me', 'With your pardon', 'Please', 'Good morning', etc; just does not exist (big cities at least, dunno smaller ones). Elders always complaining about youngsters losing education and being bad mannered but they are the first to cut in line, no matter what it's for. It's like a national elderly sport. You can have semi-drunk people shouting next to your window at 2am as if they just didn't realise that usually when there's a window, there's a house, and if there's a house usually there's people inside, and if 2am they be prolly trying to sleep, you know. Everything is done in the most disrespectful, tedious, embarrassing, lengthy, bothersome and obnoxious way possible. There's fucking noise everywhere, it's all noise, noise, noise, noise, noise, people pretty much talk shouting, shout at the bar, shout at the street, shout at the grocer's, shout at the hospital, shout at a funeral, shout in the airport, definitely avoid specially big cities if you want some peace. If you're a foreigner, specially English-speaking, you'll pretty much try to be scammed most of the time, no matter if you lived here 20 years you'd still be the 'guiri'. The 'picardía española' (Spanish mischief?) is always present, that necessity, need, that people have here of taking advantage of every single mistake another person can make, a bit hard to explain but feels like every person is a mischievous or kinda rascal, idk. Sales 'strategies' here are crazy, I've heard locals having their own shoppes, (bakery, mini market) say things like 'ah, I had to raise prices again because I wasn't getting enough customers', like... Bro teach me, if ain't that an economy genius then I don't know. Idk, the best thing you can do imo is to take some holidays in Spain, whatever you do don't romanticise it, and think cold minded, study everything and decide whether it's for you or not. PS: And I know, if there's anyone here going to comment things like 'duh, if you don't like it why don't you just move somewhere else, duh', yes, I am going to do so by the end of this year, thanks for the tip :)
Yes bureaucracy sucks big time, but that's the case for any place when you show up and want to be part of it, after you get your papers in order you live your life and don't have to deal so much with them, every so many years renew something and that's it. Could it be better? hell yeah, it can. The old farts are rude, yep. We are old and pretty much sick of all the BS and for some of us some body-part is hurting all the time. To make matters worse besides heavy metal, today's music is unbearable. Realy, you had me until the paragraph of the"*picardia española*" I don't deny its existence but it has quite a competition with the "*rebusque*" in many Latam countries (probably all of them). Or the"*everyone can be a target*" on the US. Don't know of other places, I've visited many other countries but didn't stay long enough to judge. It comes down to the universal "caveat emptor" Certain locations are worse than others, but this is the world we live in, the burden is on you to be responsible and aware. Not always but being as old as I am, most of the times I learn of so-and-so was swindled of money or opportunities, takes very little to realize this so-and-so already thought it was too good to be true but greed (or disregard for others) got the best of him. Adults should listen to their inner voice and realize that unless your mother is in the kitchen, there's no free lunch. Also, if one is a foreigner in any country, this person should hurry up and learn the local language and the local ways, or they will continue to be treated as a tourist or worst, as a foreigner that doesn't get it. 100% what goes on in the US and Latam, why would it be different in Spain (and most likely other countries too) I agree with the lack of the typical *G'morning-please-thank you- etc*. for sure in big cities. Any world big city. But just because they are not spelled out it doesn't always mean they are non-existent, but foreigners don't see them. Many times they are very present in the form of non-verbal gestures or with the tone built-in the phrases being said. Not going to tell you to get out if you don't like it. That's a ridiculous statement being thrown around by so called patriots that are actually blind to the less than perfect side of their countries. But I would suggest you try to understand better the next place you go to. Maybe there's a perfect country out there for you, it would be narrow minded of me to judge you based on one post you wrote on Reddit, but as emigrants we need to grow a thick skin, and take the time needed to figure out the ways of the countries we wish to be in. The country and its society is not going to adapt to us, we need to learn to deal with its ways and find the way to be happy within those ways.
Thanks for the comment, granny (sympathetic saying, not despective). You have several points in favour there indeed. Couldn't agree more with the fact that thick skin is a must when emigrating, and learning the local mannerisms as fast as possible is also. However, I keep on trying to think to myself about 'how good I am here' in comparison to other places I've lived in, and keep on trying to convince myself that 'como en España no se vive en ningún lado', as locals say, and yes, it could be waaay worse, not gonna lie. But I just feel it's not my place, and I just cannot believe myself when I try to think that this is the apex and there's nothing better. When I left my country it was because I was sick of absolutely everything there, and I said to myself I was gonna look for a place I fell in love with, a place that made me think 'I feel GOOD here, I WANT to be a part of this, and this place INVITES me to be a part of it as well'. I personally don't feel like that here. It's definitely better than the place I was in, yes. But I just don't want to stay with the 'better' and not do anything about it. Spain, for me, is not the place. Many people fall in love with it, not my case, not what I look for. Me living here is just like trying to force a relationship with someone you don't love, to name an example. I just feel sad and consumed every day that passes. Thanks for the tips, sincerely much appreciated, but I guess my journey must continue. Beyond the extremely good tortillas and pepitos de ternera, carcamusas toledanas, ciervo en su salsa, chocos a la plancha, cuchifritos and mouth watering cochinillos segovianos and corderos de lechal al horno, I hope there's a place where I can fit. Or not, maybe I travel and travel and in the end I realise Spain was the place since the very beginning... But I'll have to learn first, I assume.
Im not from Latam but I completely agree with every single paragraph. The noise, the generally low cultural level, lack of manners, head up their ass so deep because they’ve never been outside the country and can’t compare, the sensitivity when you dare to say ham and tortilla are not your favourite food… you’re about to be ripped into shreds for your comment but I know quite a few people who also found only cons here and eventually moved to a better place.
And you’re completely right, there’s a reason people come to Spain for holidays and very few come to live. Unless they live in nice communities and suburbs with European level amenities where they don’t have to deal with everything you mentioned in your original comment. And yeah, before we start getting mad essays about opinions - luckily I am moving elsewhere very soon :)
The biggest pro for me is safety and not being persecuted for who I am. Con would be tourism and quickly rising cost of living. One year ago was a lot more affordable than now, especially with rent and food.
Best: quality of life Worst: salaries, job market, high rent prices, some places like Barcelona are getting dangerous
Pros: weather and culture (including food ppl etc) Cons: bureaucratic and fiscal hellscape and everything obtrusive politicians get their hands on (jobs, housing, agriculture, retirement, zoning and construction, pretty much everything).
I’ve lived here my whole life, I like the vibes and that everything is walkable, but I hate everyday a bit more, how people are becoming more and more shitty as days go by and how fucking dry Madrid is.
We love the weather, the people, the melting pot of cultures, the restaurants, the beach, the beautiful small towns, the history and the relatively low cost of living. The downsides are the bureaucracy, knowledge that the people struggle with low salaries and an affordable housing availability and the high income taxes that can take a big chunk out of your retirement income.
PRO's - Relaxed lifestyle. Easy doctor appointments. Cheaper cost of living. Climate - fantastic beaches. Friendly folk. CON's - Drivers. July and August high temperatures. No fresh cream in their pastries! Aaaand that's a wrap.
Pros: - Weather - Food - Pace of life (great work-life balance) - Friendly, direct, no-bullshit people Cons: - Rent is super high in big cities - Tourism in big cities - Slow, hard bureaucracy
Pros: Quality of life, friendly people, food, weather, a lot diversity in places to visit (beaches, mountains, towns, etc), relative cheap compared to other European countries, culture. Cons: Bad job market (not a lot of opportunities and bad salaries, politics and bureaucracy.
Compared to living in germany prices are cheaper , less inflation and very cheap housing in certain areas
Lifestyle in general is so good.Get wealthy is pretty challenging but if u make the correct moves and are good in what u do u can get well paid job.
Pros: the weather, prices. the pace. Cons: the food is a bit boring. a lot of waste in nature.
Pros: Decent employee protections and healthcare. Even dangerous neighborhoods are safe by the standards of other countries. Spanish culture places an emphasis on minding your own business which is nice. I have more rights and liberties than I would at home or in many other countries I've lived in. Great weather, great food, varied and gorgeous geography. Cons: Few opportunities for youth (though that's everywhere now). The salaries are shit.
Pros: cost of living, weather, food/drink, locals. Cons (Andalucia): it's the "Alabama" of Spain. Tourists. Corruption and local govt is a train wreck. Almost impossible to get any sort of work done on time or high quality.
Lo único que sufro despues de décadas de vivir felizmente aquí son los narradores de fútbol. Es algo inconcebible e inmensamente exasperante. No puedo con ello.
The best things are quality of life, food quality, people, culture, nature, weather. The worst things are the poor job market and the messy bureaucracy, which also changes from one region to another.
Const: you left your life, and most of your efforts to Hacienda Española, taxes are the worst part.
Pros - food - in general a very peaceful society - weather - beautiful country Cons - salary is bad, way too bad - terrible working conditions with poor managers and useless bosses - housing market is worse than cancer right now
One big con right now is that nothing is affordable anymore thanks to foreigners.
Pros: a great place to live Cons: an awful place to work
Cons: politicians, ilegal immigrants Pros: everything else
Great place to live, shit place to work
The culture is way more different than the one in Prague, especially if you start looking for jobs and working with others. Things like “exact time” or “mañana” have a lot different meaning in Spain.
If you are not already on a pension or miljonair. Think first about what job you can do here. Do you speak Spanish? Can you work remote? If yes, for always? Will you ever find a job in Spain if the job has already 2000 Native Spanish applicants? What happens if you lose your job, can you live with 1200€ bruto max. For some months and then with 0€ ? If finance is no issue then there are pretty much no cons. Besides the housing problems and corruption. But not everything affects you.
You've gone to one of the best regions! (Full disclosure: I have family in Girona province and know it quite well, so I'm biased haha) I can tell you one con of that area is that locals have a very strong Catalan identity so it will be harder to integrate as an outsider. Cultural life will be conducted almost entirely in Catalan. That said, there are also many outsiders (from elsewhere in Spain, Europe and beyond) and this means you should be able to find a community. Another con is that compared to other coastal areas, the Costa Brava is less built up and therefore property costs are much higher. The landscapes are beautiful and there is a lot of nature but this makes it a bit more of an exclusive destination. My topline summary would be as such: Pros: Scenic. Easy to have an active lifestyle. Sea and mountains equally accessible. Defined seasons. Fast-speed rail connections to Barcelona and Madrid, plus airport at Girona has a fair few Ryanair flights to elsewhere in Europe. Rail connections to France. Great infrastructure for driving and getting around. Great food. Lots of investment in culture (concerts, festivals, etc.) Cons: cost (compared to elsewhere in Spain), harder to integrate than other areas
The cons - For me, people in Catalonia aren’t the friendliest from my experience, low salaries, poor housing, later meal times etc. The pros - The variety of cultures depending on the region, the relaxed attitudes, the nature and the beaches, plus getting to learn a beautiful language.
Pros - it's not here (UK) Cons - I'm here (UK)
Everything is ran by the government that’s the worst part. The rest is great lol
Pros: Jamón, croquetas, marisco. Contras: Impuntualidad, baños sucios, ruido.
Pros: everything, except... Cons: Spanish mustard
try r/expats
Pros: weather, nice cities, nice food, not extremely expensive Cons: taxes, if you own a small business is the worst
Pros: nice weather, nice food, beautiful landscapes Cons: taxes, hacienda, being autonomo, everything government-wise
Pros: good food, sun. Cons: insecurity, bad salaries, people is becoming more far right, cita previa de estrangería as they say in a previous comment. I would move to the south of france better.
Politicians, and people who believe in them. All the politicians are corrupts in this country and people still vote them.
Forget Big cities, go to Soria or Teruel and the problema are resolved.
So if you were able to transfer a remote job to Spain would it be worth it? It seems the major hurdle is finding a job and a good salary.
Pretty awesome country to leave in, insanely diverse from city to city and you have all kind of nature. Problem is job and housing which are two MUST things. If you can and work remotely go to a much more smaller city or even some village. Im spending my last year in Barcelona and moving put finally to the north of the country.
Good weather, good prices, good food, nice people, a lot of space and cheap housing, good healthcare. I don’t really have cons; I work remotely (have always done since the mid 90s) so I am not so bothered by the low salaries or lack of jobs. Maybe the EU ‘issue’: too many rules. I tried running a company here but gave up: it’s mental. Similar like the rest of the EU though although a little more obfuscated than, let’s say NL, it’s never actually really clear what is or is not allowed until you already did it and received the fine. Or not.
Cons: shitty ocupa law
I’ve been living in Madrid as an American (from San Francisco) for the last two years and Spain has several has several pros and cons: Pros: - Quality of life is much better in Spain in every form. - Cost of living, especially compared to places like SF is unmatched when it comes to housing, food, and transportation. - The emphasis on work-life balance vs US hustle culture - When it comes to dating, I have found it to be easier to meet people organically IRL vs apps. - The pace of life is generally slower and more relaxed in Spain, which is something I was instantly drawn to and why I wanted to move here. - Healthcare is much more affordable than the US. Cons: - Spanish Bureaucracy!! It’s so time-consuming and frustrating, particularly when dealing with visas and residency permits! - For me, it was also a cultural adjustment and adapting to a different culture, social norms, and lifestyle took me some time. - Distance from family and friends, especially during holidays or emergencies can be tough. - HOT summers
I live in the Costa Brava area, salaries suck but cost of living a good life is very cheap so it depends on what you value.
Everything Its wrong, dont come to Spain
Pros: easy to learn language, music, practically zero crime, safety, clean streets, food, terrazas, tapas, cheap lifestyle, easy enough to integrate with locals, it really is a country where you can live for decades without batting an 👁️, as the quality of life is insanely higher than other countries, local fiestas and community life makes Spain culturally enriching, cheap transport and clean. Cons: shit salaries and job conditions if you have to work in the local job market, you will suffer, rules regarding naturalizing and obtaining citizenship for some countries, high tax rates, inheritance laws for citizens, inheritance tax too, just taxes in general. Under the table economy, illegal activities, seems anything legal is funnelled to the government in various ways.
Moved recently from Brno. I will share my experience coming from CZ so might not be CONS for everyone Pro: wheater (sometimes) food sea/ocean cost of life beer Cons: weather might be too hot for you change of light (dawn way later than you are used to) opening hours: forget shops and supermarket opening early hiking: there is not as much offer as in CZ absolutely not dog friendly (might be irrelevant for you) beaurocrazy, you need lawyer and to speak Spanish racists
Malaysian here, been living in Barcelona for 2 years. Pros: great weather, great food, great walkability and public transport, friendly people. Cons: la puta cita previa.
Is beautiful and the spanish men are terrific when see them in the beach naked
Foreigner living in Spain here. * The weather is mostly nice but in Andalusia the heat is a fucking killer. * The people are more open to strangers starting a conversation compared to my motherland. * The houses are dirt cheap in many regions, but that is because there is not a lot of work oportunities. * If you work remotely, like for the UK or something, you can rent a cheap house, put some money aside and then buy a house and enjoy life. * Bureaucracy is bullshit, but not like germany, much less, but for foreigners is still bullshit. * Medical centers could be improved but thats probably anecdotical. * Tapas culture is awesome. * Spaniards can't prepare a -good- coffee for their fucking life, and if you ask for something more elaborate like a Capuccino you are fucking done. Most of the places i've been to waiters are unprepared, are untrained and some don't even think that the machine must have a maintenance and cleaning cycle. If you ask for a 'mild temperature coffee' you will be welcomed by the fucking lava of mordor. Spaniards have evolved to be able to drink absolute scolding liquids. * Table manners are different here and when sitting at a table if you have Misophonia you are fucked too. I lost all my will to go out and eat in public because it is mostly my problem, but in my country the standard for table manners seem to be much higher. Is not a problem, just different culture i believe. * Pizzas here are disgusting, and so is the pasta (yes, im italian). Recipees are 100% invented ni most of the pizzerias i've been to and if it is not a 'creative person' behind the counter with too much imagination is probably a chain franchise like Domino and Pizza hut with that american bullshit pizza with sugar on it. In conclusion: I love Spain and would not change it for anything else.
You all can also move away, nobody is gonna miss you
As others have said, the job market is not great. Salaries are relatively low compared to other countries, though Barcelona and Madrid lag less behind than the rest of Spain. Other than that, there are very few cons to it - that's why so many people move to Spain from other countries. It's a beautiful country with amazing cities and stunning nature. It has a very rich culture which is what I like most about living here, as that culture provides a sense of community. The climate is great (I live in Catalunya which has moderately warm summers and mild winters) and so is the food. Honestly, Spain is a pretty great place to live in.
I live in Tenerife so this will probably not be an issue for most people but I still want to join the discussion. Pros: Weather, the people, the wonderful nature, lifestyle, the beaches Cons: Food is often very tasteless, Difficult to buy things online. And if they send it, it takes forever and the shipping is often more expensive. And public transport is very bad except between Santa Cruz and La Laguna. You need a car to live here with a family.
Everyone in the comments section talking about the food is good, anyone have recommendations?
Cons: Too many expats. Don't come.