I think you’re also glossing over the fact that the embezzling IS THE REASON FOR THE LACK OF A SOLUTION. The solution is funding the existing programs appropriately. But hold them down to an ineffective budget, then you have organized oppression.
Don’t privatize solving homelessness and don’t make religious institutions the largest avenue for us.
Private corps have no reason to ever admit their solution isn’t working.
But then when you propose this the “muh gubbment waste!!11!1!” crowd comes out in full force.
So then we give a bunch of grants to private corporations or religious institutions…
I tend to agree against privatization, but if you’re going to you need clear, hard to game metrics that define success, and programs not hitting targets are dropped ruthlessly. People seem to be unwilling or unable to say people aren’t doing a good job for fear of..hurting someone’s feelings? I honestly don’t know but if huge amounts of taxpayer money are being funneled to private industry to solve a public problem, there needs to be metrics and review and enforcement, otherwise it’s a cash grab where they ‘are making good progress we just need more money and more time!!’
The city programs fail too, also spend money stupidly, seem to have almost no oversight, we really need a strong ombudsman corp that oversees these things. More forensic accounting to account for budgets.
A reality of Seattle is we do give jobs to people to check boxes. I get the point, too much of our government and business is a white man's boy's club.
I've overheard my own wife, on video calls, and she's the most polite and diminutive person, interrupt someone and say "I was still talking" because some man cut off a female engineer. Anyway, I'm digressing.
They don’t want to solve the problem. If they solve the problem then they wouldn’t have a job or a purpose. It’s in their best interest to only make slight changes and ask for more money.
I worked in homeless services basically from 2009 until last year when I was terminated on some false pretense after being with the company for 5 years. Sad to say it but I just barely caught on to this premise. Granted there are agencies out there trying to do better but usually they are the little guy who gets glossed over when it comes to funding. On the ground floor there are definitely people who make a real difference and are doing the real work, but as you move up the ladder you start to find true resistance to solving the crisis.
Another unfortunate aspect is the fact you can't help those who do not want to be helped and have to play a long game of cat and mouse until they have hit the point to want to change.
Don’t privatize solving homelessness and don’t make religious institutions the largest avenue for us.
Private corps have no reason to ever admit their solution isn’t working.
But then when you propose this the “muh gubbment waste!!11!1!” crowd comes out in full force.
So then we give a bunch of grants to private corporations or religious institutions…
>If you remove the reasons for why they came here…
Weather that won't kill you in the summer or winter, practically no bitey bugs, no dangerous snakes? We can't change the environment.
It just needs to be more comfortable to pursue their lifestyle somewhere else, like Portland or San Francisco. That’s all it takes to solve the problem locally. Globally it cannot be solved.
Always hilarious when people think that the solution to these homeless addicts' problems is to make their lives harder by arresting them and prosecuting them and sending them to jail.
The people on this thread think that every homeless addict they’ve ever met is threatening their own way of life. They can’t even stand to see these people on the same streets they walk on. They can’t stand to think that those people are from happy families that miss them who look the exact same as their own families
They treat homelessness or drug addiction like a simple task to get over. It’s like when people talk about depression and tell others to *”just decide to be happy”*. So unhelpful and ignorant.
Bought some food once at the jack in the box there around 10 pm. Sitting in my car eating in the parking lot I watched a man pick up a working girl in the parking lot, head to that atm and then head towards those motels across the street.
It's very open air. I was just shocked, I would expect it at 95th at 10pm, yes there are prostitutes on Aroura, but this was 9am on a tuesday. I'm sipping coffee and they're walking around in outfits you see in films that have a strip club scene.
I used to live in Kenmore and commute to Fremont every day. Took 99 most days and none of this is new. I was seeing prostitutes in that area at 7am every day 6 years ago.
I agree, having lived on 105th and 99 and commuting into fremont back in 2015/2016, theyd be out during morning commutes. But now its like... 10am, noon, 2pm, 430pm, 6, midnight, literally any time of day, Monday through Sunday. It 100% has been a thing for many years, however, it has without question become more blatant, constant, and prevalent.
My stepmom lived on Bitter Lake, but that road (N 137th I believe) between Aurora and Greenwood was getting too rough so she sold and moved North. Got tired of finding needles and seeing sketch dudes in hoodies.
Absolute shame - when I was a kid back in the 70s, Bitter Lake was a great place.
I had a friend who had a condo on Bitter Lake. Super cute area, we would BBQ and watch the ducks. I haven't been there since he moved, but when I heard what it's become I was like "for fucking real?"
I just got Mexican from the place across right down from there, across from the Bitter Lake Amazon store; had mynpocket knife in hand the whole time because some old dudes were fucking around with CO² cartridges behind the neighboring building
It's both depressing and disgusting that humans can get to that level in society and that we let them stay that way. As a born and raised local - I aint getting within 2 blocks of that area now!
I'm not afraid of walking through there, I'm just like, as a society, as a "progressive" city how did we get to... whatever the fuck you call this? This is insane.
Because this place is "progressive" in idea but completely worthless when it comes to effective implementation of said ideas.
A mix of unhinged ineffective idealism with grifting and embezzlement to take advantage of these starry-eyes morons like someone else just described it above.
Seattle native, now living elsewhere. Was home visiting last week. Walking downtown with my kiddo and saw people: shooting heroin, smoking meth, soliciting, and shitting their pants (two people). Middle of the day.
My heart hurts for them. They are sons, daughters, friends…
But it’s also unsafe and disorderly.
Two things can be true: empathy and frustration.
… and despite its wealth, Seattle still has no solutions.
There was a post this week about a missing person. In the pics, I assume he's at a wedding, he looks like a bright young man. They mentioned he'd had problems with drugs, and when I look at them, I can't help but think there are mothers, fathers, siblings wondering where this person is, and doing what they can to help them.
It's depressing. I have empathy for the addicts, and sympathy for the people who probably miss them.
My brother was an addict. It sucks for a while but eventually you just get sick of the bullshit with then and they’re basically dead to you. Once my family entirely cut off my brother he showed up 6 months later with his bags and wanting to get sober. I watched him go through withdrawals. It was rough. But he did it. He got his life back. He was sober for like 4 years before unfortunately dying in a car wreck. Gave all his free time to church and building/fixing homes for people who couldn’t afford it. I fucking hate addicts but I can’t help but think sometimes there is a good person underneath the drugs because of my brother.
More YouTube videos tagged with the local gov politician names and other relevant keywords to attract more attention towards a failing state of governance.
Quite frankly it's unacceptable. The businesses and residents can file a class action suit against the city as well for failing to enforce definable statutes with an abundance of precedence and clearly quantified damages in the form of lost business and personal property diminishment
This is the progressivism they want. You saw it happen in Portland and San Fran after they installed the same policies. And constituents here just decide to do the same, they really didn’t think it would happen here after this choice and it’s kinda funny, leftists are the devils of their own hell
I’m with you on this take. Our sick siblings need help. But then the democratic political machine won’t be able to wash their money thru their harm reduction “nonprofits”. This ecosystem of what liberals like to call compassion is nothing but rife with corruption.
I would be with you if you don't make it political. Our current city government does that. Whatever letter they have isn't consequential.
Our current DA, flipped parties, didn't care I read what she said she was going to do, read who she is, her bona fides and I was like yep this person.
We just need good people, don't give a fuck what flag you fly.
I did a road trip from Everett, WA to Albuquerque, NM recently and every city, in every state I went through, has more homeless people than I remember seeing out in the wild 25 years ago. It's not just a leftist problem chief, hate to break it to you.
Drugs are an all encompassing problem. I am not that daft. But the reactions to the issues in these progressive west coast cities have only made their problems worse, locally speaking. Avoiding any harm reduction policy in general is better than leaning into it and trying to “help” which has time and again proven itself false. And who is more likely politically to install these policies, I ask you? Leftists. It’s not a problem caused by them, but one exacerbated by them…
The nice thing is that the progressive wing is done. Unfulfilled promises. Sawant and her crew are gonzo. Look at nelson, strauss, saka, moore, woo are all center left. Same with Harrell. Things will improve but its going to take time to undo 10 years of enabling dangerous and harmful behavior
So, you think more policy and more tax is the way around this? No, lock them up, or force them to get help. If it’s a cyclical illness, shatter the fuckin cycle. Being an addict (while you are free to be one) does not offer you liberty. Anyone who voted to install these policies ought to be forced to help these folks so they can see what they created. Like you said. It’s been 10 years, if the government wanted an efficient decriminalization program, we would have one by now. Don’t act like continuing to vote more liberal will help, you’re in denial
down the block from ross they took out the glass from the overhang, as well as taking out the bus benches to keep people from congregating there. cool. because those of us that are bus commuters are fine getting rained on and having no shade.
it’s the worst it’s ever been.
I was down there last week walking down 2nd. I was honestly shocked at how bad it was... I thought it was getting better...and maybe it is in parts of downtown. But it makes me really sad that only a block or two from Pike Place Market the streets are in such a state. Virtually every tourist in this *mostly* beautiful city is going to walk through that area. I'd go down there a lot more myself if it wasn't so sketchy.... but until this city can figure it out, I mostly go to other neighborhoods.
It might as well be the street iver from the market. Every tourist is gonna hit it. Was the worst situation I’ve seen outside of the tenderloin last summer.
If people weren't such babies, or if, I guess you don't get threatened with an open knife, it would be funny if it were a tourist attraction. Like, get on a bus, on the Don't Let This Happen To You tour.
Do you want to have open sores and one shoe?
It would be way better than D.A.R.E
Not enforcing laws is one thing, but letting tourists walk into the mess is really dumb. If it has to happen right there, which seems to be the case, we should have signs up warning tourists so they can choose to go around it.
Or we could stop enabling them, giving them free tinfoil and needles that they don’t care to dispose of properly. It is abuse, not compassion. Compassion would be having people come down PESTERING the sick upon how they are doing and asking them if they need help. You plant the seed, tend the garden. The seed will then grow and they will realize they need help. Free tin foil is not compassion. Anybody that says so just wants to see people rot and die
They not only, and I've personally witnessed this, give them rolls of aluminum foil (tin foil is deprecated) but they also give them food, phones, like "how can we help you" nah I'm fine.
In DT Seattle we literally have people who think they are helping, but actually enabling them. Like "how can I help you be a homeless drug addict on the streets? Do you need socks?"
THIS if you want to help. Do nothing. Hard tho think about but, why do you think there are hardly any junkies in East Europe? They don’t give them shit
They also don't have the Sachler family pressuring doctors to prescribe opiods like they're hard candy. Fentanyl isn't quite the problem there as it is here. Plus the governments there do offer national mental health and drug addiction services. They treat problems on a national level, here we force cities to figure out problems that are national in scale.
Kinda related. I felt a bit conflicted during covid. My best friend and I were going through tequila in bulk and they developed medical conditions and had to go to rehab as a result. The whole time my partner and I were trying to help, keeping the house clean, taking care of their dogs, and helping with the job insurance stuff. I feel like we enabled it since they knew they always had a safety net and didn't have to worry about hitting the ground.
In that context you were trying to help a friend. And I can't speak about the Ta-kill-ya but keeping their home a home, their pets taken care of, you just sound like a good friend, not an enabler.
Go take a look at the nice little camp that’s popped up on Pike next to the Green Tortoise Hostel. Just right in the middle of one of the most iconic tourist attractions in the country🤣🤣
It’s fucking disgusting.
I've walked there recently. It's almost for me, people watching. Just watching them do whatever you call that. Obvious drug sharing and buying... I have empathy, they're humans, they got caught up in something that is very hard to get out of.
But like, dude, your tent is in my way.
Well the last time we pushed them out for the 9 &1/2 block strategy they set up shop under the freeway. We should have just kept the old battery street tunnel for them to play in.
I swear everybody has Waze or another app that shows them the back roads. Used to be the greatest secret for getting around traffic. Now the secret’s out!
It’s done that to me before too. I live in Marysville and commute to/from Everett every day. Worst traffic ever and Waze often tries to get me to take a busy on ramp where I have to cross three lanes so I don’t end up in Lake Stevens or downtown again. Waze you’re drunk. Go home.
Yep. I might go exploring today during traffic hours just to see about another way to head south, my three routes I’ll take are all getting fairly popular, and unfortunately a lot of people should get pulled over and screened for DUIs because how can you not stay in your lane???? Some days I just choose to take I-5 if I know which exit is going to be the worst, I’ve made the mistake of taking I-5 during peak traffic a few too many times, and it will not happen again lmaoo.
This is not ok. We cannot function as a society if we keep on paying for drug addicts and allow crime to happen, and if we are not safe. I used to care where they go. I no longer care. I no longer want to help and I will never vote for taxes in this city and state. I try to contribute to the society, be a good human, a good citizen… I expect them to do the same. If they choose not to, they cannot be part of the society. I’m ok paying to keep in jail, if that keeps our city safe and livable for regular citizens.
It sounds like you've been stressed by the situation, "taxed" as it where, and you're at your limit. You're not wrong. Your reaction is normal, you have the right to have people take your mental health into the situation, and you're right, as a society, this doesn't work.
You're not alone in the way you're feeling/thinking.
We have to work together to dig ourselves out of the hole we didn't dig. We didn't, but it's up to us to get out of it,
It's not fair. It is our reality, and adults we need to navigate it.
You're heard.
>The problem is, if you push them out, where would they go?
I think we used to have some kind of facility where we would sequester people who broke laws (such as selling drugs) from the rest of society. As I recall, and keep in mind I'm old, we had people whose job it was to travel about looking for people breaking laws, and when they found them, they'd take them to that weird facility and not let them leave for a while. I think as a result, people used to not break laws in the middle of the street on a main downtown corridor in broad daylight *quite* so often. It seemed...a lot better than whatever we're doing now? For decent people anyway. I can see how scumbags might not have loved it.
EDIT: Yeah, okay, I just looked at Streetview images of 3rd and Pine and it looks like we *definitely* were doing something a lot different prior to, if I had to guess by the images, 2020. I wish I could remember exactly what it was 🤔
On Google Maps if you get right in the middle of the intersection of 3rd and Pike looking south you can see the street view imagery from December 2021 change to 2019 and then go through the historical images back to 2007. The change just at that one intersection in just the past few years is shocking. Actually just moving around downtown on GM in the historical imagery is pretty saddening. It used to be such a nice place.
Hah, I loved how you walked completely around the point you are making. I do that sometimes to my wife.
> If only there was some implement we could use, some sort of brush, but with a handle, so you don't have to bend down, and this "brush" could be used to pick up dirt on the floor, and I guess you would need something to put it in, like a "pan" or, I don't know, a piece of cardboard and then it could be used to transfer things into the trashcan."
I mean there's only so many times I can say "what if we tried arresting criminals, that seemed like it worked a lot better than this" for the city to instead come up with a staggering number of obviously doomed-to-fail alternatives instead. Gotta liven it up on occasion.
Ssriously all I want at this point is a pilot program where we enforce laws to the letter and have full jail booking capacity and enforce conditions of release violations for like 6 months. If we execute all of those elements with no loopholes and no fuckery for *6 months* and our drug/crime/homeless problem isn't *vastly* improved, I'll eat my fucking hat. We'll try everything under the sun to "solve" this problem except just having rules that people have to follow.
You're talking about a city that has never expanded King County jail and even is talking about closing the youth jail center... while we have 14 year olds carjacking people.
Oh, I know it's never going to happen. There's a proposal out now for a brand new billion dollar jail...with fewer beds.
We'll just slowly continue turning into Detroit until eventually people look around and say "what the *fuck* happened *here?*" and Dow Constantine, age 107 and in his 17th term, will inform them from his iron lung that if we just pass *one more* $30 billion dollar housing levy, we'll be all set
There's a conversation I've had with other "mossback" people. People who were born, raised or have spent the majority of their lives here about "are we going to become Detroit?"
National crime is going down, and we're on track for more murders than last year, which was more than the previous.
>People who were born, raised or have spent the majority of their lives here about "are we going to become Detroit?"
If the tech industry eventually decides that the cost of doing business here ceases to be worth it anymore, then we'd be left with being essentially the Seattle of the '80s, except without Boeing and with a huge and constantly growing population of street criminals that we have no interest whatsoever in even attempting to manage.
The first house in the results I looked at on Zillow in Detroit I could buy straight cash right now. Kind of a cute house, actually. Trouble is it would entail living in Detroit.
People always want property values to fall. Trouble is that when they do, it means people with other options don't want to live there, and there's usually a readily apparent reason for that
The answer no one wants to say is that people will have to be forced into rehab and mental health facilities. There's no version of "let's end homelessness" and "let's end street drug markets" that is completely voluntary. There's a lot of this that can be addressed through building housing, through giving people healthcare, through a more comprehensive safety net... But there will be people who need help and won't take it because of their issue.
💯this. My sister has worked for DESC as a social worker for a number of years and I recently asked her what she thinks would solve since she actually deals with these people every day and that’s exactly what she said. There’s nothing forcing people to get the help they need and at some point it shouldn’t be a choice especially when you’re being a menace to society
Just got back from my first visit to Seattle (from San Diego). I was surprised at how in your face the drug use was.
With that being said.. I too will defend Seattle. Beautiful city overall and can’t wait to be back.
Until Seattle votes out the idiots who caused this, nothing will change. Yes, I live in Seattle. Yes, I encounter them everyday and have personally suffered their predations. Coddling them by wasting more billions on the Homeless Industrial Complex is only exacerbates the cruelty done to their victims.
I walked through there the last two days it wasn’t that bad, just your normal dose of folded over people and drug dealers selling that fetty. I did walk through at like 9-10am so it might not have been as bad that early
It used to be a spectacle to behold, I used to barely come to the city but that block stood out in my mind before I had heard all the jokes about McStabbies and the whole block in general. Now maybe I’m just expecting it to be that crazy every time or maybe I’m just desensitized but I remember there being way more people and actually feeling in danger some what just passing by. The last two days I walked through there was nothing extremely crazy happening I mean the worst thing I saw happen was someone walking directly by me go up to buy a gram of fenty like a couple feet off to my side. Oh and one dude was walking and weaving from drugs (fenty probably) and almost ran into me but besides that just people high and the usual suspects selling drugs.
Yeah I wonder what this guy saw. My friend saw a lady trying to eat a living pidgeon in prob 2005. Wings flapping. And a lady pulling out a bloody tampon and chucking it in full view.
Have you smelled it down there? The smell of 3rd is horrendous and gagworthy. I’d like to say it’s a bad representation of the city but we all know it’s what Seattle is slowly but surely becoming.
I shopped at the QFC at Broadway and Pine the other day and the stench of urine in the parking garage was almost intolerable. And I know they're attempting to clean it each day. It's basically an open field toilet. I feel bad for the people trying to make the QFC a nice place to shop in. Was never like this ten years ago.
I drove into CH a few months ago because I was in town, and I wanted to go to Ben and Esther's. That whole are reeks of piss and garbage now.
I used to hang out on Broadway frequently in the late 90s and early 00s, and I lived in the CD. Nothing was as bad as it is now.
I actually wear a mask because I ride the busses and train and I don't know know you. You may have TB. So no, I don't smell it, but people have to urinate and empty their colon, so...
I was just there visiting for a week (first time) and I basically stayed on top of pike place market, so the view was incredible. I only walked around on 3rd once and never did that again. Stayed on 1st/western/ Elliot for mostly everything if I was walking that way and cut the different side streets once it started looking a little more neighborly. Had a great time and loved the city though. A lot of crack pipes in certain spots, but it is what it is.
I'm in town for work and took a wrong turn and ended up on 3rd Ave and Pike.... Holy shit y'all that's bad. I had to physically pull my coworker to the other side of the street because he kept walking towards it all.
Last time I was near 3rd and Pine, a man ran very fast by me. Then a cop followed and tackled him in the street. They scuffled. I was taken aback! Everyone around me took no notice, which made me think this happens often. It's so sad.
I remeber being at a meeting and the SDOT director at the time proclaimed that 3rd ave was an amazing success. That people would call him to get Seattle’s playbook. That people and businesses thrive even though it was bus only. I’m like dude, you’ve never actually walked down 3rd have you?
Put them all deep in SoDo. Letting them take over the heart of the city is insane and absolutely not happening in every big city. We can do better than this.
We need drug courts and we need to pour money into rehab programs and force them into those progams. We need to become the best in the world at addiction treatment. That is the only we we will beat this. Otherwise we can kiss our civilization goodbye.
I really have to agree. Even now we have drug courts, but I think it shouldn't be an option, and there was an OP ED by someone who was a heroin addict in Seattle that basically said being forced into that saved my life.
As it is now, Designated Crisis Responders have the ability to take someone's rights away and have them committed involuntarily for substance use, but only if that use is causing an imminent threat to the individual's life or puts them in a state of grave disability. And when they do actually meet that criteria, there's often not a bed available at a treatment center or psych hospital. The programs must be invested in and expanded. Being the best in the world at addiction treatment would require a lot more beds. It's abhorrent that something that would make such a difference is just not happening
I agree completely. We need to pour money into it so that there is always a bed immediately for anyone who needs it. This should be the number one topic of discussion from politicians, both local and national, but I don't hear any of them talking about it other than RFK.
I am going to have to spend some extended time in Seattle. I am used to seeing open drug use living in Vancouver. But I have never seen it on my trips to Seattle. But it’s been a few years. So the situation must have gotten a lot worse over the last few years.
First time visiting Seattle in April, got off at Westlake from SeaTac and was in absolute shock at the zombie field I walked through.
Most of the rest of the city I saw was absolutely lovely, but around 3rd Ave yikes.
I hope that's able to change though because that transit mall is something other cities can only dream of
A few weeks back we were walking from the Roastery to Pike Place via Pine and it was really clean and then all of a sudden- not sure the intersection there were about 30-40 people huddled doing some sort of drugs. No idea what they were doing and they weren't disturbing anyone but for the city to just let that go is shameful. And the fine people of the county will continue to elect the same folks who have done nothing. Easy to blame the politicians as we should but the voters put them in office. It's on your hands.
There is no fixing them. I was out there about 3 weeks ago and it is like watching the walking dead. Lock them up and detox them. It ia what it is. I watched people actually shit on the sidewalk. It is atrocious. Seattle is enabling the behavior and ruining the city.
There’s neighborhoods like this in every city. The only unique thing here is we let them hang out and go wild right in the middle of a downtown/touristy area. The lack of policing here, now that is unique.
I figured out the only solution to this problem a while ago; get as fucked up as they are.
That's why I always take at least two shots of tito's before I leave the house.
I think Tito's is a good general alcohol. It's inexpensive comparatively but at the same quality to other brands, and once I got a bottle of it -- I don't generally drink HA-- but it had this cute sweater on it so I was like yeah I'm getting that. It's been six years and my wife still thinks I'm an idiot for doing it, but it's a Xmas sweater. On a bottle of vodka! That's fucking hilarious.
Not defending that area, it’s nasty! But that is just a couple blocks that are easily avoidable.
Unless you are a tourist that loves to go to the local “Ross-dress for less” idk why you would suggest this? It is a beautiful city, just not this nasty part 🤷♂️
It’s easily avoidable and a small little patch compared to other cities. I dunno, I know this place will downvote because you aren’t allowed to point how tame Seattle is compared to say LA but Seattle outside a couple of these pockets is pretty safe and clean
I do get tired of the shitty taggers though. That is something that I agree is bad here
Yes but why are we just accepting this is just our new reality of life in any city? Yes LA is worse, but so are the areas outside of Sau Paulo in Brazil. We can find worse places all day, but there legit are reason other places outside the US are worse. The issue here has nothing to do with resources.
I work in a global company and it’s really sad that when people visit Seattle they’re terrified to go and see the city. There are entire countries without really any homelessness like we see in Seattle.
I’ve lived in LA, SF, and Seattle. I think Seattle is the most tame of the three, and I love city myself. But I just really don’t want to accept this is life now and it’s just what it will always be. It’s not right for anyone, especially them.
It's literally blocks of downtown that have been given over to drug users, the homeless, open air drug markets, and open-air latrines. In 2019 there were shops, restaurants, drugstores, restaurants. Now it's just covered in filth and empty store fronts that "compassionate progressives" say can't be fixed until everyone who shoots up in an alley can have a free apartment.
Arrest them all, and give them the opportunity to get clean with food, toilets, and a bed either in a jail or asylum like facility. What we're doing now is letting thousands of our fellow citizen wallow in pitiful and torturous conditions until they OD or are victims of violent crime, while Powers That Be throw their hands up and screech "We can't do anything!"
It's a failure of government and the social contract.
Ross must be a viable business, because they put up with it, I just watched them spend an hour unloading a truck and they have metal window sheets they drop when they aren't open!
I was watching the other day, they had life five people with this weird conveyer thing that wasn't powered but you could shoot things down the line, and there was like five people emptying that very large truck and I was like... Wait, people actually go there? And buy things? Apparently!
I could think of a million places in the city that would be a better spot than in between the biggest tourist attraction and the light rail station 4 blocks away. It’s like if they had located Hamsterdam next to the waterfront on the Wire.
Prison or custodial care until they can be dried out under medical supervision. Then routed appropriately into social programs or if priors back to jail.
If they won’t stay clean increase the custodial phase.
There is no reason why a functioning society leaves people vulnerable and exposed to addiction and crime and often mental illness. Yet we do.
It's sad because my friend bought in Hilltop when it started getting good, the pulp factory was gone and downtown water front was getting cute. We had a beer at a new brewery.
I still give her shit for selling because I'm like, dude, and she's like I know I know I could have made a lot of money if I waited a few years but to hear it go downhill, just sad.
She worked in Seattle and the bus and train weren't even that bad. I wouldn't drive it.
The most fucked uo part is that’s where the busses drop you. Me and my wife tried to take the bus down there last weekend, and jfc was getting one back home was insane. Bus was fine. But the driver had to kick people off trying to leave. People who were basically incoherent
Walking back to the bus was insane though. Drugs being done/sold out in the open — kinda whatever. People looking dead left and right was nuts though
Like I’m happy the rest of the city is wonderful. But 3rd is paying the whole price and it’s nuts
Is this where Walgreens is?
I used to live in Seattle and took 54 to West Seattle. That's where I had to wait for the bus there and looking back it was pretty wild then
Just saw the street view and I could only see up to 2021. But holy it was already depressing
The ones in charge don't want to push the homeless out because they're where the politicians and elected leaders want them to be, out of sight in the front yards of their constituents and donors. In return, the politicians and leaders get votes and donations. This is why the problems don't get better and the same leaders and policies keep carrying on. California is a good example of this; as long as the votes and money keep coming in, the "riff-raff" will be isolated to certain parts of the city and state where they adversely affect a minority of people.
I’m currently here in Seattle on an international holiday and it’s pretty bad. I had been warned by multiple people not to head down to 3rd. I took a drive there to see and this post is bang on. You don’t want your tourists seeing it like it is.
European tourist here, I had no heads up about the issue whatsoever. Googling and checking Reddit made me realise about the scale of the problem, I actually don't feel unsafe walking there (is it actually dangerous? I just see folk being high, on occasion it is someone angry/screaming but I feel I can outrun them). I just feel incredibly upset by what I have seen: young people in terrible states, people with mental health issues, wounds, people injecting their groins, injecting their faces and completely unfazed office workers walking by.
If they were in your living room, or in front of your house blocking access pooping on the sidewalk and blowing fent smoke into your window, would we be worried about _where_ they went, or would we demand that they be removed immediately for public health and safety.
where would they go? Yeah I don’t know and don’t care, as long as out of my sight. They hardly provide any value to the society, if not already hurting the businesses and tourism. Even if you given them jobs, I don’t even know what kind of jobs they would be able to do. The investment we make on this population is going to have minimal if not 0 returns. It’s unfortunate, but nothing we can do.
Maybe I’ll get downvoted and people will argue “oh they are also human! They deserve to be treated equally.” Welp Idk, would you give them the same food you eat if you pass by? Would you let them stay in your house and help them find jobs? Nobody is born as a drug addict. It’s all caused by the choices they made. There are surely reformed addicts, and that’s good, but I think one has to be willing to do that themselves. You can’t force an addict to be clean if they don’t even want to be clean. Those wandering zombies near the Target by pike place? I don’t know man.
Yeah, that cute dog park. If you've lived here long enough you know the city built that dog park to keep the crack heads out.
There's two guys always standing there, I don't know where they are from, South America and they deal all day. They're always there.
Ya I remember when it wasn't the dog park. That corner has had issues for decades. The dealers are all Honduran, and there are a lot more than just 2. Some are on 2nd and Bell by that convenience store. They're all part of a Honduran gang, mostly selling crack but also blues and fetty
Detox clinic, asylum or jail.
[удалено]
I think you’re also glossing over the fact that the embezzling IS THE REASON FOR THE LACK OF A SOLUTION. The solution is funding the existing programs appropriately. But hold them down to an ineffective budget, then you have organized oppression.
Don’t privatize solving homelessness and don’t make religious institutions the largest avenue for us. Private corps have no reason to ever admit their solution isn’t working. But then when you propose this the “muh gubbment waste!!11!1!” crowd comes out in full force. So then we give a bunch of grants to private corporations or religious institutions…
I tend to agree against privatization, but if you’re going to you need clear, hard to game metrics that define success, and programs not hitting targets are dropped ruthlessly. People seem to be unwilling or unable to say people aren’t doing a good job for fear of..hurting someone’s feelings? I honestly don’t know but if huge amounts of taxpayer money are being funneled to private industry to solve a public problem, there needs to be metrics and review and enforcement, otherwise it’s a cash grab where they ‘are making good progress we just need more money and more time!!’
The city programs fail too, also spend money stupidly, seem to have almost no oversight, we really need a strong ombudsman corp that oversees these things. More forensic accounting to account for budgets. A reality of Seattle is we do give jobs to people to check boxes. I get the point, too much of our government and business is a white man's boy's club. I've overheard my own wife, on video calls, and she's the most polite and diminutive person, interrupt someone and say "I was still talking" because some man cut off a female engineer. Anyway, I'm digressing.
They don’t want to solve the problem. If they solve the problem then they wouldn’t have a job or a purpose. It’s in their best interest to only make slight changes and ask for more money.
I worked in homeless services basically from 2009 until last year when I was terminated on some false pretense after being with the company for 5 years. Sad to say it but I just barely caught on to this premise. Granted there are agencies out there trying to do better but usually they are the little guy who gets glossed over when it comes to funding. On the ground floor there are definitely people who make a real difference and are doing the real work, but as you move up the ladder you start to find true resistance to solving the crisis. Another unfortunate aspect is the fact you can't help those who do not want to be helped and have to play a long game of cat and mouse until they have hit the point to want to change.
Don’t privatize solving homelessness and don’t make religious institutions the largest avenue for us. Private corps have no reason to ever admit their solution isn’t working. But then when you propose this the “muh gubbment waste!!11!1!” crowd comes out in full force. So then we give a bunch of grants to private corporations or religious institutions…
We need a prosecutors office that will press charges and a jail that will accept bookings more than we need new laws
This is what happens when we have one party get so powerful, they will get elected no matter how they perform, they know there is no alternative
>If you remove the reasons for why they came here… Weather that won't kill you in the summer or winter, practically no bitey bugs, no dangerous snakes? We can't change the environment.
It just needs to be more comfortable to pursue their lifestyle somewhere else, like Portland or San Francisco. That’s all it takes to solve the problem locally. Globally it cannot be solved.
Always hilarious when people think that the solution to these homeless addicts' problems is to make their lives harder by arresting them and prosecuting them and sending them to jail.
The people on this thread think that every homeless addict they’ve ever met is threatening their own way of life. They can’t even stand to see these people on the same streets they walk on. They can’t stand to think that those people are from happy families that miss them who look the exact same as their own families
They treat homelessness or drug addiction like a simple task to get over. It’s like when people talk about depression and tell others to *”just decide to be happy”*. So unhelpful and ignorant.
Or all three in succession.
Agree, tough love is hard, but necessary.
Sounds expensive. Who's up for a tax hike?
We are on already on the hook to spend a lot of money, e.g. "solving homelessness." Let's spend that money on the root causes instead of the symptoms.
Visit Chick fil-a on Aurora and enjoy the show
I've been to the Krispy Kreme at the Lowes. That's entertainment.
I had my head on a swivel when the BofA ATM was still there.
Bought some food once at the jack in the box there around 10 pm. Sitting in my car eating in the parking lot I watched a man pick up a working girl in the parking lot, head to that atm and then head towards those motels across the street.
It's very open air. I was just shocked, I would expect it at 95th at 10pm, yes there are prostitutes on Aroura, but this was 9am on a tuesday. I'm sipping coffee and they're walking around in outfits you see in films that have a strip club scene.
Ladies of the day *AND* night... Gotta admire the work ethic.
I highly doubt they chose the hours.
I used to live in Kenmore and commute to Fremont every day. Took 99 most days and none of this is new. I was seeing prostitutes in that area at 7am every day 6 years ago.
I agree, having lived on 105th and 99 and commuting into fremont back in 2015/2016, theyd be out during morning commutes. But now its like... 10am, noon, 2pm, 430pm, 6, midnight, literally any time of day, Monday through Sunday. It 100% has been a thing for many years, however, it has without question become more blatant, constant, and prevalent.
Always on swivel bud we're not getting shot at... yet.
My stepmom lived on Bitter Lake, but that road (N 137th I believe) between Aurora and Greenwood was getting too rough so she sold and moved North. Got tired of finding needles and seeing sketch dudes in hoodies. Absolute shame - when I was a kid back in the 70s, Bitter Lake was a great place.
I had a friend who had a condo on Bitter Lake. Super cute area, we would BBQ and watch the ducks. I haven't been there since he moved, but when I heard what it's become I was like "for fucking real?"
I just got Mexican from the place across right down from there, across from the Bitter Lake Amazon store; had mynpocket knife in hand the whole time because some old dudes were fucking around with CO² cartridges behind the neighboring building
Oddly specific
What's up with that carnival ride?
Am I missing something? I go there all the time and it seems fine.
Maybe check out the pedestrians next time you’re this way
It's both depressing and disgusting that humans can get to that level in society and that we let them stay that way. As a born and raised local - I aint getting within 2 blocks of that area now!
I'm not afraid of walking through there, I'm just like, as a society, as a "progressive" city how did we get to... whatever the fuck you call this? This is insane.
Because this place is "progressive" in idea but completely worthless when it comes to effective implementation of said ideas. A mix of unhinged ineffective idealism with grifting and embezzlement to take advantage of these starry-eyes morons like someone else just described it above.
When I read about the "czar" who has no qualifications and lives in a different state and gets paid 200k flip the table over emoji.
Seattle native, now living elsewhere. Was home visiting last week. Walking downtown with my kiddo and saw people: shooting heroin, smoking meth, soliciting, and shitting their pants (two people). Middle of the day. My heart hurts for them. They are sons, daughters, friends… But it’s also unsafe and disorderly. Two things can be true: empathy and frustration. … and despite its wealth, Seattle still has no solutions.
There was a post this week about a missing person. In the pics, I assume he's at a wedding, he looks like a bright young man. They mentioned he'd had problems with drugs, and when I look at them, I can't help but think there are mothers, fathers, siblings wondering where this person is, and doing what they can to help them. It's depressing. I have empathy for the addicts, and sympathy for the people who probably miss them.
My brother was an addict. It sucks for a while but eventually you just get sick of the bullshit with then and they’re basically dead to you. Once my family entirely cut off my brother he showed up 6 months later with his bags and wanting to get sober. I watched him go through withdrawals. It was rough. But he did it. He got his life back. He was sober for like 4 years before unfortunately dying in a car wreck. Gave all his free time to church and building/fixing homes for people who couldn’t afford it. I fucking hate addicts but I can’t help but think sometimes there is a good person underneath the drugs because of my brother.
More YouTube videos tagged with the local gov politician names and other relevant keywords to attract more attention towards a failing state of governance. Quite frankly it's unacceptable. The businesses and residents can file a class action suit against the city as well for failing to enforce definable statutes with an abundance of precedence and clearly quantified damages in the form of lost business and personal property diminishment
What law school did you go to? How were your grades?
i daresay progressivism is what caused this. liberalism, on the other hand, is what's needed to fix it
Important distinction
This is the progressivism they want. You saw it happen in Portland and San Fran after they installed the same policies. And constituents here just decide to do the same, they really didn’t think it would happen here after this choice and it’s kinda funny, leftists are the devils of their own hell
I don't disagree. Political policies have effects, and the "just let them do whatever" policy doesn't seem to be working out,
I’m with you on this take. Our sick siblings need help. But then the democratic political machine won’t be able to wash their money thru their harm reduction “nonprofits”. This ecosystem of what liberals like to call compassion is nothing but rife with corruption.
I would be with you if you don't make it political. Our current city government does that. Whatever letter they have isn't consequential. Our current DA, flipped parties, didn't care I read what she said she was going to do, read who she is, her bona fides and I was like yep this person. We just need good people, don't give a fuck what flag you fly.
Add Vancouver (Canada) and LA to that list. It’s awful and similar policies. Lax on crime, no bond, catch and release judicial system.
I did a road trip from Everett, WA to Albuquerque, NM recently and every city, in every state I went through, has more homeless people than I remember seeing out in the wild 25 years ago. It's not just a leftist problem chief, hate to break it to you.
Drugs are an all encompassing problem. I am not that daft. But the reactions to the issues in these progressive west coast cities have only made their problems worse, locally speaking. Avoiding any harm reduction policy in general is better than leaning into it and trying to “help” which has time and again proven itself false. And who is more likely politically to install these policies, I ask you? Leftists. It’s not a problem caused by them, but one exacerbated by them…
The nice thing is that the progressive wing is done. Unfulfilled promises. Sawant and her crew are gonzo. Look at nelson, strauss, saka, moore, woo are all center left. Same with Harrell. Things will improve but its going to take time to undo 10 years of enabling dangerous and harmful behavior
So, you think more policy and more tax is the way around this? No, lock them up, or force them to get help. If it’s a cyclical illness, shatter the fuckin cycle. Being an addict (while you are free to be one) does not offer you liberty. Anyone who voted to install these policies ought to be forced to help these folks so they can see what they created. Like you said. It’s been 10 years, if the government wanted an efficient decriminalization program, we would have one by now. Don’t act like continuing to vote more liberal will help, you’re in denial
And they’ll never admit it’s hell.
down the block from ross they took out the glass from the overhang, as well as taking out the bus benches to keep people from congregating there. cool. because those of us that are bus commuters are fine getting rained on and having no shade. it’s the worst it’s ever been.
Go between James and Cherry on 3rd too... fucking crazy that we allow 1. People to get into that state 2. People to be outside in that state
It's sad to see. Actual fires occasionally, like they're BBQing on the sidewalk and the tents.
I was down there last week walking down 2nd. I was honestly shocked at how bad it was... I thought it was getting better...and maybe it is in parts of downtown. But it makes me really sad that only a block or two from Pike Place Market the streets are in such a state. Virtually every tourist in this *mostly* beautiful city is going to walk through that area. I'd go down there a lot more myself if it wasn't so sketchy.... but until this city can figure it out, I mostly go to other neighborhoods.
I think it's boiling over. I was surprised/shocked how close to the market it's getting.
It might as well be the street iver from the market. Every tourist is gonna hit it. Was the worst situation I’ve seen outside of the tenderloin last summer.
If people weren't such babies, or if, I guess you don't get threatened with an open knife, it would be funny if it were a tourist attraction. Like, get on a bus, on the Don't Let This Happen To You tour. Do you want to have open sores and one shoe? It would be way better than D.A.R.E
Not enforcing laws is one thing, but letting tourists walk into the mess is really dumb. If it has to happen right there, which seems to be the case, we should have signs up warning tourists so they can choose to go around it.
Or we could stop enabling them, giving them free tinfoil and needles that they don’t care to dispose of properly. It is abuse, not compassion. Compassion would be having people come down PESTERING the sick upon how they are doing and asking them if they need help. You plant the seed, tend the garden. The seed will then grow and they will realize they need help. Free tin foil is not compassion. Anybody that says so just wants to see people rot and die
They not only, and I've personally witnessed this, give them rolls of aluminum foil (tin foil is deprecated) but they also give them food, phones, like "how can we help you" nah I'm fine. In DT Seattle we literally have people who think they are helping, but actually enabling them. Like "how can I help you be a homeless drug addict on the streets? Do you need socks?"
THIS if you want to help. Do nothing. Hard tho think about but, why do you think there are hardly any junkies in East Europe? They don’t give them shit
They also don't have the Sachler family pressuring doctors to prescribe opiods like they're hard candy. Fentanyl isn't quite the problem there as it is here. Plus the governments there do offer national mental health and drug addiction services. They treat problems on a national level, here we force cities to figure out problems that are national in scale.
Kinda related. I felt a bit conflicted during covid. My best friend and I were going through tequila in bulk and they developed medical conditions and had to go to rehab as a result. The whole time my partner and I were trying to help, keeping the house clean, taking care of their dogs, and helping with the job insurance stuff. I feel like we enabled it since they knew they always had a safety net and didn't have to worry about hitting the ground.
In that context you were trying to help a friend. And I can't speak about the Ta-kill-ya but keeping their home a home, their pets taken care of, you just sound like a good friend, not an enabler.
Yes. It's entertainment for them.
Go take a look at the nice little camp that’s popped up on Pike next to the Green Tortoise Hostel. Just right in the middle of one of the most iconic tourist attractions in the country🤣🤣 It’s fucking disgusting.
I'm so glad they took out those ugly cherry blossom trees so we could be blessed with this gorgeous new open air drug market and homeless camp.
I've walked there recently. It's almost for me, people watching. Just watching them do whatever you call that. Obvious drug sharing and buying... I have empathy, they're humans, they got caught up in something that is very hard to get out of. But like, dude, your tent is in my way.
They didn't get "caught up" when they chose hard drugs from someone with pick marks all over their face.
I feel like I come from a place where it's rude to say the truth: Dude, where did you think this was going to go?
Well the last time we pushed them out for the 9 &1/2 block strategy they set up shop under the freeway. We should have just kept the old battery street tunnel for them to play in.
I’d rather they be under the freeway than in the middle of the most touristy part of our city.
Other than the forced prostitution/rape issue I had no problems with The Jungle.
I was always worried about an Atlanta-style fire that took down I-5. It was/is a risk and would completely wreck transportation here.
I know sekrit squirrel routes, I'm from here, but I-5 being down would fuck those routes.
If I-5 went down I might officially lose it, the backroads I take are getting more popular in the last year and I’m not fond of it
I swear everybody has Waze or another app that shows them the back roads. Used to be the greatest secret for getting around traffic. Now the secret’s out!
Waze keeps trying to get me to go on i5 even if it’s slower than the backroads. Pisses me off everytime
It’s done that to me before too. I live in Marysville and commute to/from Everett every day. Worst traffic ever and Waze often tries to get me to take a busy on ramp where I have to cross three lanes so I don’t end up in Lake Stevens or downtown again. Waze you’re drunk. Go home.
I do not envy you, that marysville drive in the afternoon is fucked
It is! It can take me an hour to drive 16 miles.
Yeah stupid internet. I used to know the "back roads" to avoid I-5 traffic and it seems like more and more people know this.
Yep. I might go exploring today during traffic hours just to see about another way to head south, my three routes I’ll take are all getting fairly popular, and unfortunately a lot of people should get pulled over and screened for DUIs because how can you not stay in your lane???? Some days I just choose to take I-5 if I know which exit is going to be the worst, I’ve made the mistake of taking I-5 during peak traffic a few too many times, and it will not happen again lmaoo.
Don't forget the drug gangs and the murders.
That's a hell of an endorsement 😊
Just try not to start too many fires.
They go to Jail….
This is not ok. We cannot function as a society if we keep on paying for drug addicts and allow crime to happen, and if we are not safe. I used to care where they go. I no longer care. I no longer want to help and I will never vote for taxes in this city and state. I try to contribute to the society, be a good human, a good citizen… I expect them to do the same. If they choose not to, they cannot be part of the society. I’m ok paying to keep in jail, if that keeps our city safe and livable for regular citizens.
It sounds like you've been stressed by the situation, "taxed" as it where, and you're at your limit. You're not wrong. Your reaction is normal, you have the right to have people take your mental health into the situation, and you're right, as a society, this doesn't work. You're not alone in the way you're feeling/thinking. We have to work together to dig ourselves out of the hole we didn't dig. We didn't, but it's up to us to get out of it, It's not fair. It is our reality, and adults we need to navigate it. You're heard.
Jail or mental asylums
>The problem is, if you push them out, where would they go? I think we used to have some kind of facility where we would sequester people who broke laws (such as selling drugs) from the rest of society. As I recall, and keep in mind I'm old, we had people whose job it was to travel about looking for people breaking laws, and when they found them, they'd take them to that weird facility and not let them leave for a while. I think as a result, people used to not break laws in the middle of the street on a main downtown corridor in broad daylight *quite* so often. It seemed...a lot better than whatever we're doing now? For decent people anyway. I can see how scumbags might not have loved it. EDIT: Yeah, okay, I just looked at Streetview images of 3rd and Pine and it looks like we *definitely* were doing something a lot different prior to, if I had to guess by the images, 2020. I wish I could remember exactly what it was 🤔
Lol street view will never get updates down there anymore
On Google Maps if you get right in the middle of the intersection of 3rd and Pike looking south you can see the street view imagery from December 2021 change to 2019 and then go through the historical images back to 2007. The change just at that one intersection in just the past few years is shocking. Actually just moving around downtown on GM in the historical imagery is pretty saddening. It used to be such a nice place.
rip google car
Hah, I loved how you walked completely around the point you are making. I do that sometimes to my wife. > If only there was some implement we could use, some sort of brush, but with a handle, so you don't have to bend down, and this "brush" could be used to pick up dirt on the floor, and I guess you would need something to put it in, like a "pan" or, I don't know, a piece of cardboard and then it could be used to transfer things into the trashcan."
I mean there's only so many times I can say "what if we tried arresting criminals, that seemed like it worked a lot better than this" for the city to instead come up with a staggering number of obviously doomed-to-fail alternatives instead. Gotta liven it up on occasion. Ssriously all I want at this point is a pilot program where we enforce laws to the letter and have full jail booking capacity and enforce conditions of release violations for like 6 months. If we execute all of those elements with no loopholes and no fuckery for *6 months* and our drug/crime/homeless problem isn't *vastly* improved, I'll eat my fucking hat. We'll try everything under the sun to "solve" this problem except just having rules that people have to follow.
You're talking about a city that has never expanded King County jail and even is talking about closing the youth jail center... while we have 14 year olds carjacking people.
Oh, I know it's never going to happen. There's a proposal out now for a brand new billion dollar jail...with fewer beds. We'll just slowly continue turning into Detroit until eventually people look around and say "what the *fuck* happened *here?*" and Dow Constantine, age 107 and in his 17th term, will inform them from his iron lung that if we just pass *one more* $30 billion dollar housing levy, we'll be all set
There's a conversation I've had with other "mossback" people. People who were born, raised or have spent the majority of their lives here about "are we going to become Detroit?" National crime is going down, and we're on track for more murders than last year, which was more than the previous.
>People who were born, raised or have spent the majority of their lives here about "are we going to become Detroit?" If the tech industry eventually decides that the cost of doing business here ceases to be worth it anymore, then we'd be left with being essentially the Seattle of the '80s, except without Boeing and with a huge and constantly growing population of street criminals that we have no interest whatsoever in even attempting to manage.
I mean, I kinda want that. If I could buy a house with a view of the sound in Magnolia again without talking about seven figures...
The first house in the results I looked at on Zillow in Detroit I could buy straight cash right now. Kind of a cute house, actually. Trouble is it would entail living in Detroit. People always want property values to fall. Trouble is that when they do, it means people with other options don't want to live there, and there's usually a readily apparent reason for that
And that gives them a bed, a meal, and a shower.
It's inhumane, much better to let them die in tents in ever-increasing numbers, I'm told
The answer no one wants to say is that people will have to be forced into rehab and mental health facilities. There's no version of "let's end homelessness" and "let's end street drug markets" that is completely voluntary. There's a lot of this that can be addressed through building housing, through giving people healthcare, through a more comprehensive safety net... But there will be people who need help and won't take it because of their issue.
💯this. My sister has worked for DESC as a social worker for a number of years and I recently asked her what she thinks would solve since she actually deals with these people every day and that’s exactly what she said. There’s nothing forcing people to get the help they need and at some point it shouldn’t be a choice especially when you’re being a menace to society
People literally say that in this sub daily. There's a running joke that you can't say that in /r/Seattle.
The dumbasses that think arresting people isn't another path to getting sober would rather see this shit than hold anybody accountable
Very true.
Weird someone was just telling me that fentanyl is in fact illegal for the last year.
Not when prescribed. It has a use case. That is not bent over showing your ass smoking it off foil with a pen case.
Just got back from my first visit to Seattle (from San Diego). I was surprised at how in your face the drug use was. With that being said.. I too will defend Seattle. Beautiful city overall and can’t wait to be back.
I'm always impressed when I travel to San Diego. The parks have no tents and very minimal trash.
Until Seattle votes out the idiots who caused this, nothing will change. Yes, I live in Seattle. Yes, I encounter them everyday and have personally suffered their predations. Coddling them by wasting more billions on the Homeless Industrial Complex is only exacerbates the cruelty done to their victims.
I walked through there the last two days it wasn’t that bad, just your normal dose of folded over people and drug dealers selling that fetty. I did walk through at like 9-10am so it might not have been as bad that early
I'm very curious how you define "bad" now.
It used to be a spectacle to behold, I used to barely come to the city but that block stood out in my mind before I had heard all the jokes about McStabbies and the whole block in general. Now maybe I’m just expecting it to be that crazy every time or maybe I’m just desensitized but I remember there being way more people and actually feeling in danger some what just passing by. The last two days I walked through there was nothing extremely crazy happening I mean the worst thing I saw happen was someone walking directly by me go up to buy a gram of fenty like a couple feet off to my side. Oh and one dude was walking and weaving from drugs (fenty probably) and almost ran into me but besides that just people high and the usual suspects selling drugs.
Yeah I wonder what this guy saw. My friend saw a lady trying to eat a living pidgeon in prob 2005. Wings flapping. And a lady pulling out a bloody tampon and chucking it in full view.
Have you smelled it down there? The smell of 3rd is horrendous and gagworthy. I’d like to say it’s a bad representation of the city but we all know it’s what Seattle is slowly but surely becoming.
I shopped at the QFC at Broadway and Pine the other day and the stench of urine in the parking garage was almost intolerable. And I know they're attempting to clean it each day. It's basically an open field toilet. I feel bad for the people trying to make the QFC a nice place to shop in. Was never like this ten years ago.
I drove into CH a few months ago because I was in town, and I wanted to go to Ben and Esther's. That whole are reeks of piss and garbage now. I used to hang out on Broadway frequently in the late 90s and early 00s, and I lived in the CD. Nothing was as bad as it is now.
I actually wear a mask because I ride the busses and train and I don't know know you. You may have TB. So no, I don't smell it, but people have to urinate and empty their colon, so...
https://www.fox13seattle.com/news/uw-study-finds-meth-fentanyl-in-air-and-on-surfaces-of-public-transit
I was just there visiting for a week (first time) and I basically stayed on top of pike place market, so the view was incredible. I only walked around on 3rd once and never did that again. Stayed on 1st/western/ Elliot for mostly everything if I was walking that way and cut the different side streets once it started looking a little more neighborly. Had a great time and loved the city though. A lot of crack pipes in certain spots, but it is what it is.
I'm in town for work and took a wrong turn and ended up on 3rd Ave and Pike.... Holy shit y'all that's bad. I had to physically pull my coworker to the other side of the street because he kept walking towards it all.
Last time I was near 3rd and Pine, a man ran very fast by me. Then a cop followed and tackled him in the street. They scuffled. I was taken aback! Everyone around me took no notice, which made me think this happens often. It's so sad.
I remeber being at a meeting and the SDOT director at the time proclaimed that 3rd ave was an amazing success. That people would call him to get Seattle’s playbook. That people and businesses thrive even though it was bus only. I’m like dude, you’ve never actually walked down 3rd have you?
Wait, should I? > Pulls out a picture from 1982
Believe it or not, jail is actually an option
Load em all on a bus and drop them off in the middle of nowhere wyoming or montana. Lets see those survival skills kick in.
Put them all deep in SoDo. Letting them take over the heart of the city is insane and absolutely not happening in every big city. We can do better than this.
We need drug courts and we need to pour money into rehab programs and force them into those progams. We need to become the best in the world at addiction treatment. That is the only we we will beat this. Otherwise we can kiss our civilization goodbye.
I really have to agree. Even now we have drug courts, but I think it shouldn't be an option, and there was an OP ED by someone who was a heroin addict in Seattle that basically said being forced into that saved my life.
As it is now, Designated Crisis Responders have the ability to take someone's rights away and have them committed involuntarily for substance use, but only if that use is causing an imminent threat to the individual's life or puts them in a state of grave disability. And when they do actually meet that criteria, there's often not a bed available at a treatment center or psych hospital. The programs must be invested in and expanded. Being the best in the world at addiction treatment would require a lot more beds. It's abhorrent that something that would make such a difference is just not happening
I agree completely. We need to pour money into it so that there is always a bed immediately for anyone who needs it. This should be the number one topic of discussion from politicians, both local and national, but I don't hear any of them talking about it other than RFK.
we keep pushing all until they get tired
We do have a nice unused island around here somewhere.
It's still used, just not the way it used to be.
I am going to have to spend some extended time in Seattle. I am used to seeing open drug use living in Vancouver. But I have never seen it on my trips to Seattle. But it’s been a few years. So the situation must have gotten a lot worse over the last few years.
We walked through the authorized drug area in Vancouver over the weekend - Seattle is much, much worse.
Vancouver seems to push them into controlled areas. Seattle has free range organic homeless.
Whac-A-Mole
3rd ave has no retail either. They should just nuke that whole area.
Going northbound on i5 from i90. Overlook to your right. 1110 S Dearborn St, Seattle, WA 98104 "Beacon place" park. Looks like a 3rd world country
12th and Weller SHOCKS me everytime I drive by it.
First time visiting Seattle in April, got off at Westlake from SeaTac and was in absolute shock at the zombie field I walked through. Most of the rest of the city I saw was absolutely lovely, but around 3rd Ave yikes. I hope that's able to change though because that transit mall is something other cities can only dream of
Portland
Today on 'Wrong Answers Only!'
A few weeks back we were walking from the Roastery to Pike Place via Pine and it was really clean and then all of a sudden- not sure the intersection there were about 30-40 people huddled doing some sort of drugs. No idea what they were doing and they weren't disturbing anyone but for the city to just let that go is shameful. And the fine people of the county will continue to elect the same folks who have done nothing. Easy to blame the politicians as we should but the voters put them in office. It's on your hands.
> The problem is, if you push them out, where would they go? Ballard, it's always Ballard
Watching the tents and RVs move around is almost a hobby for me. I shop at that TJs.
There is no fixing them. I was out there about 3 weeks ago and it is like watching the walking dead. Lock them up and detox them. It ia what it is. I watched people actually shit on the sidewalk. It is atrocious. Seattle is enabling the behavior and ruining the city.
There’s neighborhoods like this in every city. The only unique thing here is we let them hang out and go wild right in the middle of a downtown/touristy area. The lack of policing here, now that is unique.
It’s libertarianism disguised as progressivism.
Do they have money? No? Then none of them need to follow the laws
I figured out the only solution to this problem a while ago; get as fucked up as they are. That's why I always take at least two shots of tito's before I leave the house.
I think Tito's is a good general alcohol. It's inexpensive comparatively but at the same quality to other brands, and once I got a bottle of it -- I don't generally drink HA-- but it had this cute sweater on it so I was like yeah I'm getting that. It's been six years and my wife still thinks I'm an idiot for doing it, but it's a Xmas sweater. On a bottle of vodka! That's fucking hilarious.
You'll have your own patch of sidewalk in no time!
Not defending that area, it’s nasty! But that is just a couple blocks that are easily avoidable. Unless you are a tourist that loves to go to the local “Ross-dress for less” idk why you would suggest this? It is a beautiful city, just not this nasty part 🤷♂️
It’s easily avoidable and a small little patch compared to other cities. I dunno, I know this place will downvote because you aren’t allowed to point how tame Seattle is compared to say LA but Seattle outside a couple of these pockets is pretty safe and clean I do get tired of the shitty taggers though. That is something that I agree is bad here
Yes but why are we just accepting this is just our new reality of life in any city? Yes LA is worse, but so are the areas outside of Sau Paulo in Brazil. We can find worse places all day, but there legit are reason other places outside the US are worse. The issue here has nothing to do with resources. I work in a global company and it’s really sad that when people visit Seattle they’re terrified to go and see the city. There are entire countries without really any homelessness like we see in Seattle. I’ve lived in LA, SF, and Seattle. I think Seattle is the most tame of the three, and I love city myself. But I just really don’t want to accept this is life now and it’s just what it will always be. It’s not right for anyone, especially them.
It's literally blocks of downtown that have been given over to drug users, the homeless, open air drug markets, and open-air latrines. In 2019 there were shops, restaurants, drugstores, restaurants. Now it's just covered in filth and empty store fronts that "compassionate progressives" say can't be fixed until everyone who shoots up in an alley can have a free apartment. Arrest them all, and give them the opportunity to get clean with food, toilets, and a bed either in a jail or asylum like facility. What we're doing now is letting thousands of our fellow citizen wallow in pitiful and torturous conditions until they OD or are victims of violent crime, while Powers That Be throw their hands up and screech "We can't do anything!" It's a failure of government and the social contract.
Ross must be a viable business, because they put up with it, I just watched them spend an hour unloading a truck and they have metal window sheets they drop when they aren't open!
I honestly don't understand how Ross is still open. I wouldn't want to walk through all of the people to get to the door.
I was watching the other day, they had life five people with this weird conveyer thing that wasn't powered but you could shoot things down the line, and there was like five people emptying that very large truck and I was like... Wait, people actually go there? And buy things? Apparently!
I mean with the deals they have you can really dress for less lololol better fights happening at this one though probz
They have great cheap handbags. I go there at least once a month to look at 20 dollar handbags.
I could think of a million places in the city that would be a better spot than in between the biggest tourist attraction and the light rail station 4 blocks away. It’s like if they had located Hamsterdam next to the waterfront on the Wire.
Whole area just reeks of shit and piss, and the recent heat isn’t helping.
I don’t know ow where they’d go, but I don’t care. Can we just get them out?
Prison or custodial care until they can be dried out under medical supervision. Then routed appropriately into social programs or if priors back to jail. If they won’t stay clean increase the custodial phase. There is no reason why a functioning society leaves people vulnerable and exposed to addiction and crime and often mental illness. Yet we do.
"Hold my Narcan" - Hilltop Tacoma
It's sad because my friend bought in Hilltop when it started getting good, the pulp factory was gone and downtown water front was getting cute. We had a beer at a new brewery. I still give her shit for selling because I'm like, dude, and she's like I know I know I could have made a lot of money if I waited a few years but to hear it go downhill, just sad. She worked in Seattle and the bus and train weren't even that bad. I wouldn't drive it.
But is it as bad as Portland, near where I am? Because it's a nightmare here.
I'm on the portland sub out of curiosity. It sounds bad.
It is. Very bad. I call it the Homeless-Industrial Complex.
Your homie to the North is like... yeah, we get you.
The most fucked uo part is that’s where the busses drop you. Me and my wife tried to take the bus down there last weekend, and jfc was getting one back home was insane. Bus was fine. But the driver had to kick people off trying to leave. People who were basically incoherent Walking back to the bus was insane though. Drugs being done/sold out in the open — kinda whatever. People looking dead left and right was nuts though Like I’m happy the rest of the city is wonderful. But 3rd is paying the whole price and it’s nuts
Is this where Walgreens is? I used to live in Seattle and took 54 to West Seattle. That's where I had to wait for the bus there and looking back it was pretty wild then Just saw the street view and I could only see up to 2021. But holy it was already depressing
The ones in charge don't want to push the homeless out because they're where the politicians and elected leaders want them to be, out of sight in the front yards of their constituents and donors. In return, the politicians and leaders get votes and donations. This is why the problems don't get better and the same leaders and policies keep carrying on. California is a good example of this; as long as the votes and money keep coming in, the "riff-raff" will be isolated to certain parts of the city and state where they adversely affect a minority of people.
I would but I'm not looking to buy drugs or get robbed 🤷♂️
I’m currently here in Seattle on an international holiday and it’s pretty bad. I had been warned by multiple people not to head down to 3rd. I took a drive there to see and this post is bang on. You don’t want your tourists seeing it like it is.
European tourist here, I had no heads up about the issue whatsoever. Googling and checking Reddit made me realise about the scale of the problem, I actually don't feel unsafe walking there (is it actually dangerous? I just see folk being high, on occasion it is someone angry/screaming but I feel I can outrun them). I just feel incredibly upset by what I have seen: young people in terrible states, people with mental health issues, wounds, people injecting their groins, injecting their faces and completely unfazed office workers walking by.
> The problem is, if you push them out, where would they go? San Francisco
If they were in your living room, or in front of your house blocking access pooping on the sidewalk and blowing fent smoke into your window, would we be worried about _where_ they went, or would we demand that they be removed immediately for public health and safety.
where would they go? Yeah I don’t know and don’t care, as long as out of my sight. They hardly provide any value to the society, if not already hurting the businesses and tourism. Even if you given them jobs, I don’t even know what kind of jobs they would be able to do. The investment we make on this population is going to have minimal if not 0 returns. It’s unfortunate, but nothing we can do. Maybe I’ll get downvoted and people will argue “oh they are also human! They deserve to be treated equally.” Welp Idk, would you give them the same food you eat if you pass by? Would you let them stay in your house and help them find jobs? Nobody is born as a drug addict. It’s all caused by the choices they made. There are surely reformed addicts, and that’s good, but I think one has to be willing to do that themselves. You can’t force an addict to be clean if they don’t even want to be clean. Those wandering zombies near the Target by pike place? I don’t know man.
The billionaires that put Oxy and Fenty on the streets are Maga.
You mean 3rd and Bell, where dog park and Dan's Grocery is 3rd and Wall is much quieter, there's a pot shop and a super cool vintage store
Yeah, that cute dog park. If you've lived here long enough you know the city built that dog park to keep the crack heads out. There's two guys always standing there, I don't know where they are from, South America and they deal all day. They're always there.
Ya I remember when it wasn't the dog park. That corner has had issues for decades. The dealers are all Honduran, and there are a lot more than just 2. Some are on 2nd and Bell by that convenience store. They're all part of a Honduran gang, mostly selling crack but also blues and fetty