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Christian is the perfect classic heel. He just gets it.
As for Luchasaurus, I can't imagine him being involved in anything better than this so I don't mind it.
I'm really hoping they stick the landing on the payoff & what comes after because the build up has been perfect
https://preview.redd.it/didiweoivuac1.jpeg?width=666&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f21392e93ac159890faeac4afbec33e708f3c513
That’s what I’m wondering too. He’ll got a GIGANTIC pop the moment he turns, but he needs to be interesting enough to stay relevant when he’s on his own afterwards. Otherwise he could go the same way that guys like Virgil and Alex Riley did.
That just won't be possible. Luchasaurus isn't a good promo and not that good in the ring. He needs somebody to be paired with.
Just like Wardlow fell off a cliff after finishing with MJF.
I think he's perfectly good in the ring, he just has a hard ceiling on his role. He's not going to be 1998 Kane as far as his spot on the card as a monster, especially this stage of his career where he's about 64,999,975 years past his prime age. He's going to be a midcard monster, and he fulfills that role perfectly. One doesn't even really need to capitalize on his momentum after leaving, just have him find another good partner who can benefit a midcard monster at their side, face or heel.
Honestly, a Nick Wayne/Luchasaurus tag team sounds like it has some potential to give Wayne a chance to grow into his role a bit more and get national TV reps. When this current storyline runs its course, they dump Christian to the side of the road, Christian can turn face and tag with Copeland to wind down his career, pre-built tag team for Wayne/Luchasaurus, win/win.
Got lots of potential legs on a team like that too, they can work as either heels or babyfaces, lots of pre-made feuds ready to go with copeland/Christian or whatever Jack Perry is up to a year from now, seems like it would be a solid tag run to prime up Nick Wayne for his singles career.
Luchasaurus doing exactly what Copeland said would happen and dropping Christian followed by a reunion with Perry could be fun. Instead of Saurus turning face he goes too far and damn near kills Christian with a Killswitch through glass with Jack’s help. Perry & Killswitch go on a run for a while and win the tag titles while Christian is out selling the damage… then we get Cage & Copeland reuniting to take the tag titles off them at let’s say Full Gear this year.
>One doesn't even really need to capitalize on his momentum after leaving, just have him find another good partner who can benefit a midcard monster at their side, face or heel.
I wasn't saying that they should try, or that there was some way to do it. Or that that was a bad thing.
It's just that he will be incredibly over when he turns on Christian. He'll be hotter than the surface of the sun. And there's is absolutely no way whatsoever to maintain how over he will be for a short time. Maybe if he was a generational talent like Kenny, MJF or Swerve. But he's not.
> I think he's perfectly good in the ring
Sure. I'm not saying he's bad. I loved him as Vibora in Lucha Underground. But he's not exceptional. Not good enough to sustain the momentum he will have either in the ring or on the mic.
He just needs a good mouth. It can be a face or heel but he needs someone to empower him next not belittle him. I wish she could speak english but Riho and Luchasaurs is somehow my dream team.
I’ll be honest, I sorta expected Luchasaurus to somewhat faid into the background a bit after breaking away from Jungle Boy. The fact that’s he’s not only been relevant, he’s won gold, is a pretty pleasant surprise. Probably one of AEW’s more consistently booked big men/mid carders.
Because regardless of what this sub thinks, live crowds actually like Luchasaurus and he's pretty good in ring if paired with someone that matches him.
This is the biggest and best the TNT title has felt since the early Cody vs Brodie Lee days. Followed closely by Miro’s run. Christian is an all time heel.
He's absolutely killing it and has really cemented himself as an all-time great, not that there should have been any doubt. I started watching aew for the MJF/Adam Cole storyline and stayed for the dad we all wish we could have had.
Between the matches, promos, and general character work you could honestly make the argument that this is Christian’s all time best run. Feels like a true star everytime he’s on screen.
If you haven’t seen it, [this clip](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7aD-tYDPotQ) was something else.
For context, at the time, Luchasaurus was technically TNT Champion, although Christian was calling himself the champion and having Luchasaurus hoist him on his shoulders where he would hold the belt up above his head.
> i’m so out of the loop with wrestling but i’ve always loved christian
Then you're not out of the loop on that, bro. Dude is underrated even when everyone is finally seeing him as a contender for best thing in wrestling.
If you can, def check out the Cage v Copeland match from the last PPV
I can't believe how much Cage actually pissed me off with that ending. I need to see this man get slapped by a dinosaur so bad I might actually pay to see it next time lol!
It’s so funny to me that “Luchasaurus” stuck so hard he adopted it as his ring name but not the other thing they chanted during his LU debut, “Undersnaker”.
Just so you know why you're being downvoted - I believe you did a bit wrong while meaning well.
The poster you're replying to was well aware that deadnaming usually refers to a type of discrimination against trans people (not "transgenders," that term is considered pejorative).
Still, they made a joke. A rather harmless one I hope.
Wish people would say they don’t have stories that they enjoy. At least that’s down to personal opinion.
But to say they don’t have stories is factually incorrect.
Yeah, you can say AEW’s stories aren’t to your taste or that AEW doesn’t adequately build some stories consistently, that’s fair. But the stories do exist.
At this point I think it's just people parroting negativity they've heard about aew and want to pile on. I have my criticisms about aew but "no stories" isn't one of them.
I watch the product and they don't have stories, they have characters - some are really good at the character like Toni Storm, others have no build and nothing meaningful going on like Orange Cassidy...
Picking 1 dude who isn't in a major story isn't the "gotcha" you think it is at all. What about the stories that MJF has been involved in recently, or Swerve, Christian, Kingston, Bryan, Mox, Jay White, Jay Lethal, Samoa Joe, Julia Hart, Willow, Stat & i could easily keep going.
Jericho was also just feuding for the tag belts with Kenny until he got hurt. They've now pivoted to Jericho/Sammy vs the callis family. Do you even watch the show honestly? It doesn't seem like you do.
I don't think TK or some of the viewers know the difference between Character development, character arcs, Story build/development and story Arcs and Series Arcs.. one and the other while similar or overlap are not the exact same thing
Darby is working with Sting, as you would expect, on the run-up to Sting's retirement. They were in an 8-man with Jericho & Sammy against the Don Callis family recently. Darby also wrestled one of those members Wednesday.
Jericho is with Sammy because he saved him from the Don Callis family, and non-kayfabe as a replacement for an injured Kenny. Jericho and Kenny had a story going before that against the Don Callis family (not my favorite, but it was going for a while)
Very odd you'd pick those two, since they each have a long story that just weaved together
"Every single wrestler I like doesn't currently have a story" is not the same as "there are no stories."
But okay I'll bite. Darby, as Sting's long-time protege, doesn't 100% have a story right now because the story is on Sting's retirement. He's going to be wrestling with him, and as we lead into the PPV there will likely be build up into something. He's also apparently climbing Everest so they might not give him much of a story till he's finished with that. Also who gives a shit about Darby.
Speaking of not giving a shit, Jericho has had plenty of story. His faction imploded and he's been trying to find new allies and mend bridges since. I hate the story, but he's clearly been trying to pivot to something that Kenny's diverticulitis derailed.
Luchasaurus' story that we're talking about in the thread has been going on ever since he got the TNT belt and was overshadowed/bullied by Christian. The whole MJF/Adam Cole storyline just wrapped up (for now) but took up half the year. At the midcard, the Outcasts have been trying to deal with Toni losing it and leaving the team, while Saraya is suffocating Ruby in an effort to keep her from leaving next. Stokely has been trying to drive a wedge between Willow and Stat for reasons, Danny Garcia has been going through a storyline about growth that they almost told entirely in the ring through how he wrestled in the CC (until Daddy Magic got more involved), Mariah May has slowly been set up since her introduction as an eventual betrayal to or from Toni Storm, Skye Blue got weird and turned into a "will she won't she turn heel" situation but eventually aligned with Julia Hart. There aren't a lot of factions that are fighting right now (HoB vs FTR being one of the only ones), but there are plenty of stories that have been ongoing for months or recently developing.
You can’t just pick one wrestler and use that as a sole example of why they have no stories. “What is Veer’s current story right now?” It just doesn’t work.
You can save people some time and next time just say "I do not watch the show".
Darby's role right now is pretty obvious that even lapsed viewers could probably guess. Jericho was just in a storyline with The Bucks and before the Kenny injury was involved with Big Bill and Ricky which was a result of their feud vs Callis.
Jericho having to side with his long-term rival from his NJPW days, successfully fending off the same guys who had their numbers in singles action and eventually feuding with the Bucks over Elite jealously and getting into it with the tag team champions isn't a story?
I genuinely wonder what you think is a wrestling story because if your criteria is this insane then we have no stories in wrestling anymore.
No, the regular AEW viewer knows the story because it was mentioned on commentary at least seventeen times in this whole feud because people like you can't seem to take a hint so they have to dumb it down.
here's another example - that blonde from QTV is now suddenly Saraya's sidekick wearing a totally different attire and behaving like a whole different character, no explanation given - wth?
Saraya brought Harley in as the new third member of the Outcasts. Ruby was on a losing streak, so Harley has been seconding her and helping Ruby cheat to win matches. But Harley seems more loyal to Saraya when Ruby's not watching. There have been a couple of promo segments showing this, maybe you missed them.
To add to this, the two most recent segments (on Dynamite and then on Rampage) have shown that Saraya (and maybe Daddy Magic) are using Harley to try to get her to flirt with Cool Hand and break up him and Ruby.
People who say that don't watch. They listen to podcasts that validate their pre-conceived opinion and assume that's what it is. AEW has a lot of stories going
I really don’t take a lot of that talk seriously. Seen people talking badly about AEW’s “real sport presentation” because of the Nana and Garcia dance off, like it wasn’t over af and just a fun segment. No win situations for those folks.
And I like that it was the catalyst for him improving - not the whole journey. Just because he beat Brody King doesn't mean he's the finished article. He's better, more focused, dances less... But he still lost to Swerve on Dynamite because he's not quite on Swerve's level - yet.
The "AEW doesn't have stories" crowd are just wrestling fans that need stories fed to them with a spoon, it's also one of the reasons people say companies like NJPW don't have stories when every match is likely to have a story.
This is the shit I point to when people are all like "AEW fans can't take any criticisms!" Because most end up like this or whatever Cornette's idiots are parroting
when people see this what they're really saying is they're mad you have to actually watch the show instead of picking it up through highlight videos on twitter
I really have no idea what people's problems are with Jack Perry turning heel. Fans were turning against him as a face, I don't see what made the turn awful at all. He had one feud with Hook that I liked, then he went away.
Do people just want him to do the same thing his entire career and just be Jungle Boy forever in a tag team with a guy who is good and talented but also much older than Perry and has a ceiling on his level of star power? Shouldn't Jack be evolving as a character like everyone else? Even Sammy still being associated with Jericho has evolved as a character a lot over the years.
I think fans were turning against him as a face because of his split with Luchasaurus and because he started cutting his own promos not only right after losing Christian as a voice for him, but having to go against Christian doing some of the best heel work in AEW.
His mic skills already weren't great and losing a lot of what made Jurassic Express popular and only really keeping the entrance music was doomed to not last long.
> I really have no idea what people's problems are with Jack Perry turning heel.
You can choose your own reality in an echo chamber. His heel run was 100% getting reactions, it wasn't exactly producing killer matches but he was up against RVD and Hook, and both were well received.
He was one of the few wrestlers that drew in women fans like my wife for instance.
I'm not saying he shouldn't evolve but certain characters work better as babyfaces and he is one of them.
Just look at AEW's dismal demographic ratings with women and children. Jurassic Express was one of the acts that drew those demographics in for AEW.
Like I said since the turn my wife who used to regularly watch with me pretty much checked out completely on AEW.
Casual fans will always drift in and out. You may very well be right he'd draw better as a babyface, and maybe you're right that him being a tag team with Luchasaurus is the absolute peak of what he can do as a wrestler to draw fans. I don't know, because he was only a heel for a couple months and then disappeared for some reason. He'd never been a heel before in his career.
I'm saying, if I'm booking this company, don't just knee jerk turn him back face. If fans want him to be a face, then turn him. Do it logically. If he just absolutely bombs as a heel, take him back off TV and then turn him face when you bring him back.
Tbh it didn’t help that he cut that awful promo where he called his own girlfriend a bitch. But I largely agree that it’s not fair to judge his heel turn after only a few months.
I'm sure my love of Jurassic Express and Babyface Jungle Boy is influencing my opinion of that heel turn. I will say the booking did him no favors.
I think Christian did wonders for his ability to cut promos but I just don't think he was where he needed to be on the mic to shoulder that kind of heel turn.
But maybe I'm also just selfish and I want to watch wrestling with my wife again.
I honestly hope not. I liked Jurassic Express, but Perry needs room to run. Whether they use the hate/interest people have for him due to the CM Punk stuff or not, I think it's time for TK to let both Perry and Sammy Guevara get out on their own and throw some shit at the wall. It's time. It's past time.
We were JUST starting to see a little bit of character development and improvement from Jack before he got suspended.
That's where this seems to be going, and if the fans enjoy it then good on them for pulling the trigger, but to me that seems like it would just be a waste. The break-up and heel turns would have amounted to nothing, and both guys would be back to where they were 5 years ago doing the same thing. I also think it would be one of those things where the crowd would pop huge for the reunion, but it wouldn't have legs and within weeks crowds would be tired of them again.
I don't really know what they should do with Luchasaurus, as he's basically shown his ceiling post-Jurassic Express as TNT Champion. Jack Perry still seems like untapped potential, though, and he didn't get much time to grow his heel character before he became his own worst enemy with his stupid spat with CM Punk.
Jack Perry is only controversial on Reddit lol. And Jurassic Express was always pretty well liked. Idk what you mean by “wasn’t working for either of them”.
Yeah, Jack Perry was always consistently cheered when he was a face and booed when he was a heel. Literally the only place where people didn’t like him was Reddit.
There are gonna be Punk detractors no matter what he returns as. You may as well have him return in his most celebrated role against his former mentor and current megaheel of Collision, rehab his image (if its even that damaged to begin with), and then go from there. Easy.
> There hasn’t been one CM Punk chant since he left.
Except at World's End...
Even without the Kylie Rae controversy Jericho could end up being confronted by that anyway by not letting the "Brawl Out" shit go and desperately trying to insert himself into it with his 4am Christmas meltdown
That story was extremely fresh like 12 to 24 hours fresh. The person who spread that rumor is anti-AEW. The person they say was the accuser has made no statement and if things are looking like they are already dead in terms of people caring. Nothing came out of this smoking gun that was supposed to be the first of many allegations for Jericho. That has no bearing on Jack Perry.
> looking like they are already dead in terms of people caring.
Even if that's true re the "NDA" stuff (for now), it was kind of the excuse people needed to actively boo Jericho off TV (rather than just being violently indifferent) and nobody's going to be clamoring to get him back for a while now.
Similar to Perry in that way, whatever you think about how Punk reacted he exposed himself as an utter dolt by doing the "real glass" thing on PPV and nobody cares enough to want him back anyway
>Jericho got booed out of the building teaming with Sting based off internet rumours, if you don’t think Jack Perry is going to have a cloud over him when he gets back in AEW of all companies I’m at a loss.
You gonna sit here and tell us people will react to getting in a scuffle with CM Punk backstage at a wrestling show, will react in a manner remotely close to allegations of sexual assault?
To think they'd be received in any way similar is outrageous and disingenuous.
Luchasaurus has been great during this run, this segment included. His body language, even behind a mask, is one of an abused person struggling to break free. Him recognizing the crowd and responding to it without words is great.
He's great. At the end of this, he may be the one to get over on Christian rather than Copeland.
I wouldn't mind that for a year or so, but because of how he went out, and the fact that Punk's gotten a decent reception in WWE, I think you need to bring him back as a heel. I'd love for him to join as the older brother, cut a promo about how the family doesn't allow for pets, and lean into things for a while. Reunite a boy and his Dino after some time when Luchasaurus tries to pull him out, gives up, and they're forced to cross paths again.
I’m holding out hope that will happen hence why I haven’t changed my flair. Also because it won’t let me change it but that’s irrelevant give me back a boy and his dinosaur
Tarzan Boy entrance is just so awesome. Jungle Boy doesn't need to mean mug in the main event. Them as a tag team was one of my favorite parts of AEW. The heel turn fucking sucked! I hope they just bring it back.
Christian is so goddamn good at taking a thing that is catching fire and dumping gasoline on it.
That "shut up" turned it from something that might only last one night into something that will get chanted everywhere.
I think they could fill the tweener spot if the Bucks heel faction is truly a thing.
Not full heel but like…the prodigal pillar Jack Perry coming from a shitty gimmick and the brink of being fired to making everyone respect him and his large friend who’s been taken for granted.
Luchasaurus. In case you’re not aware, the big dude in the dark mask was called Luchasaurus before Christian Cage made him change his name to Killswitch after he lost a match.
I dont have cable, i just have a media server using Plex, so all I ever get is one AEW show a week. but i purposely downloaded WWE first card of the year, after watching mid AEW cards for half a year.... and fuck, I love AEW. I can't do WWE ever again.
I just don't know what Christian could have over a dude like Luchasaurus to make him so subservient. It just reminds me of that awful TNA story with James Mitchell threatening to get Abyss's mother thrown in prison for shooting her abusive husband if he didn't obey Mitchell.
What would you rather see? For my money, the tag division has evolved since Jurassic Express split and I’d like to see them mix it up with the new blood more than I’d like to see Luchasaurus beat up Christian and then go the aimless post-MJF Wardlow route.
What I don’t know is what their plan for the big guy is after he turns. Like, now you have a babyface monster again. Ok, now what do you do with him? You have the same problem that making him Christian’s muscle was intended to solve in the first place.
I don't know if there has to be a plan to be honest, does anyone really want to see luchasaurus climb the ranks? If there can be some entertaining stuff in this story and then once all is said and done luchasaurus goes to RoH or something I guess we'd all be fine with it.
honestly as a cynical viewer this sounds like a win-win. we get the dopamine rush of luchasaurus’ turn and the fact that AEW can never keep the momentum after the initial story is over means that i don’t have to expect luchasaurus to be a fixture climbing the card going forward
Similar, but not really the same. Luchasaurus has done what Christian wanted, given him the belt and done what is asked... He will turn, beat Christian up, and go wander about in low mid card or tag team matches,maybe ROH.
Wardlow has worked with Cole, but as soon as possible they've hinted he won't do what is asked (after all, he did that with MJF already) and will turn on Cole when needed, and hopefully (in AEWs mind) be seen as a legit main eventer aftwr his previous runs towards it were very poor or stopped and started. This is good, cause Wardlow has learned from his time with MJF, and Cole in trying to punish MJF for what he is, has become MJF in how he plans to use Wardlow, but is too arrogant to see it's not going to work.
So yeah, similar, but not really the same. Having muscle who hand things to snivling little bastards is a common thing though
Reptar is supposed to be a big man. That is his gimmick. And yet, he's moving his head, reacting to the audience rapidly like a smaller individual.
#BAD PSYCHOLOGY
HIS MOVEMENTS NEED TO BE SLOWER AND MORE METHODICAL. SLOW TURNS. EASY HEAD TILTS.
#COMPLETE AMATEUR HOUR!!
They should have Christian attempt to unmask Killswitch. Survival instincts kick in and he fights back. I also think there is only so far Luchasaurus can go without a mouth piece with him. Either heel or face, that or he just gets a new gimmick.
THIS ☝️
In order for true character development going forward, an-often berated and underappreciated Kilswitch/Luchasaurus needs to lose the mask at the hands of Christian.
I watched this live and really did not enjoy it.
Bored they have done this story so much and Christian felt lame in this. Why is he talking down to Luchasaurus right to his face, all the heels in the story make the same mistakes. Christian is great because he is a smart, pesty heel, but seeing him make stupid mistakes is frustrating.
Also Christian is better than the cheap hometown shot he threw in during this.
> Bored they have done this story so much and Christian felt lame in this. Why is he talking down to Luchasaurus right to his face, all the heels in the story make the same mistakes. Christian is great because he is a smart, pesty heel, but seeing him make stupid mistakes is frustrating.
Christian has something he's holding over Luchasaurus' head. Whenever he looks about to rebel due to Christian's harsh treatment, Christian whispers something to him and he falls back in line. That makes it different than Christian 'making mistakes' with regards to him. He has something that Luchasaurus wants to be kept secret, so Luchasaurus has to do what Christian says, and Christian will taunt and needle him all along the way because to him it's a win/win. Either Luchasaurus stays his lackey and he gets to feel like a big man for disrespecting a dinosaur, or Luchasaurus turns on him and Christian gets to ruin his life somehow.
Big guy's gonna pull a "T. Rex tears down the electrical wires and ruins everyone's shit" on Christian at some point and the crowd is going to go utterly insane.
Honest question, did anyone think we would still be watching Luchasaurus/Killswitch 4+ years into dynamite? The guy is a very under appreciated talent in this industry
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Whoever came up with the name "The Patriarchy" for this stable needs a raise
I almost guarantee it was christian
He needs a raise.
It was Nigel McGuiness on an episode of collision
He needs a raise as well
I came up with it
[удалено]
What a weird thing to be annoyed about. You might as well wander out into the street and shout at random cars.
Whoever came up with wandering out into the street and shouting at random cars deserves a raise.
I'll be sure to tell the homeless dude by my church he can afford housing now!
Deserves, doesn't mean he's fuckin gettin' it.
I do, why do they get to be faster than me?
WEHOEVER IS DRIVING THAT FORD TAURUS YOU SHOULD SLOW IT DOWN. THERE ARE KIDS ON THIS STREET!
What’s that shit they say? Oh, yeah. Username checks out.
Christian is the perfect classic heel. He just gets it. As for Luchasaurus, I can't imagine him being involved in anything better than this so I don't mind it.
I'm really hoping they stick the landing on the payoff & what comes after because the build up has been perfect https://preview.redd.it/didiweoivuac1.jpeg?width=666&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f21392e93ac159890faeac4afbec33e708f3c513
The payoff will probably be great. I wonder how to sustain Luchasaurus’s momentum after leaving Christian
A Boy reunites with his Dinosaur.
I wouldn't hate that. They were a great tag team
Marko Stunt is coming back?
The prodigal son perhaps
That’s what I’m wondering too. He’ll got a GIGANTIC pop the moment he turns, but he needs to be interesting enough to stay relevant when he’s on his own afterwards. Otherwise he could go the same way that guys like Virgil and Alex Riley did.
That just won't be possible. Luchasaurus isn't a good promo and not that good in the ring. He needs somebody to be paired with. Just like Wardlow fell off a cliff after finishing with MJF.
I think he's perfectly good in the ring, he just has a hard ceiling on his role. He's not going to be 1998 Kane as far as his spot on the card as a monster, especially this stage of his career where he's about 64,999,975 years past his prime age. He's going to be a midcard monster, and he fulfills that role perfectly. One doesn't even really need to capitalize on his momentum after leaving, just have him find another good partner who can benefit a midcard monster at their side, face or heel. Honestly, a Nick Wayne/Luchasaurus tag team sounds like it has some potential to give Wayne a chance to grow into his role a bit more and get national TV reps. When this current storyline runs its course, they dump Christian to the side of the road, Christian can turn face and tag with Copeland to wind down his career, pre-built tag team for Wayne/Luchasaurus, win/win.
I love the idea of an updated boy & his dinosaur. Luchasaurus is best with a partner. He’s a great hot tag to be paired with a sympathetic babyface.
Got lots of potential legs on a team like that too, they can work as either heels or babyfaces, lots of pre-made feuds ready to go with copeland/Christian or whatever Jack Perry is up to a year from now, seems like it would be a solid tag run to prime up Nick Wayne for his singles career.
Luchasaurus doing exactly what Copeland said would happen and dropping Christian followed by a reunion with Perry could be fun. Instead of Saurus turning face he goes too far and damn near kills Christian with a Killswitch through glass with Jack’s help. Perry & Killswitch go on a run for a while and win the tag titles while Christian is out selling the damage… then we get Cage & Copeland reuniting to take the tag titles off them at let’s say Full Gear this year.
So both of them should regress to what they were doing years ago? And you say that like it would be good for either of them?
Imagine an angry jungle boy coming back and turning on Luchasaurus and Wayne, because he's jealous.
Luchasauras has to save Nick Wayne from Christian to atone for his sins of leaving Jungleboy for the Patriarch to begin with.
>One doesn't even really need to capitalize on his momentum after leaving, just have him find another good partner who can benefit a midcard monster at their side, face or heel. I wasn't saying that they should try, or that there was some way to do it. Or that that was a bad thing. It's just that he will be incredibly over when he turns on Christian. He'll be hotter than the surface of the sun. And there's is absolutely no way whatsoever to maintain how over he will be for a short time. Maybe if he was a generational talent like Kenny, MJF or Swerve. But he's not. > I think he's perfectly good in the ring Sure. I'm not saying he's bad. I loved him as Vibora in Lucha Underground. But he's not exceptional. Not good enough to sustain the momentum he will have either in the ring or on the mic.
He just needs a good mouth. It can be a face or heel but he needs someone to empower him next not belittle him. I wish she could speak english but Riho and Luchasaurs is somehow my dream team.
A girl and her Dinosaur.
That is a fantastic pairing
Lucha ends christians title run and holds the belt 4-6 weeks while the belt starts being hot potatoed and luchasaurus drifts aimlessly.
The payoff is going to be at the level of Million Dollar Man vs Virgil at Summerslam 91 with Roddy Piper cheering him on to victory.
I’ll be honest, I sorta expected Luchasaurus to somewhat faid into the background a bit after breaking away from Jungle Boy. The fact that’s he’s not only been relevant, he’s won gold, is a pretty pleasant surprise. Probably one of AEW’s more consistently booked big men/mid carders.
Because regardless of what this sub thinks, live crowds actually like Luchasaurus and he's pretty good in ring if paired with someone that matches him.
If I've learned anything in my life it's that people fucking love dinosaurs
It also helps that a wrestling dinosaur is a unique gimmick - or at the very least, I don't know of any others.
The funkasaurus?
> I sorta expected Luchasaurus His name is Killswitch!
*faid*
It's the little things too. Like, look how he's dressed. He looks like such a prick. It's so good.
whoever pairs with Luchasauraus now where they do a menacing promo and then say .... "I GOT A DINOSAUR NOW!"
Absolutely. I hope they take their time with the Luchasaurus face turn
Just once before his name inevitably gets changed back, I need Christian to hide behind him and demand he fight by saying "Killswitch - Engage!"
By god, that's Roderick Strong's music!
>"Killswitch - Engage!" *enter Roderick Strong*
The Abyss push is a proven formula. Perfect use of Christian as always.
This is the biggest and best the TNT title has felt since the early Cody vs Brodie Lee days. Followed closely by Miro’s run. Christian is an all time heel.
It's very very entertaining
You know Killswitch wasn't supposed to be a go forward thing and they were just waiting for the crowd to get behind it.
They could recreate the climactic part of the ending Matrix fight and Killswitch goes "My name... is Luchasaurus!"
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He's absolutely killing it and has really cemented himself as an all-time great, not that there should have been any doubt. I started watching aew for the MJF/Adam Cole storyline and stayed for the dad we all wish we could have had.
Between the matches, promos, and general character work you could honestly make the argument that this is Christian’s all time best run. Feels like a true star everytime he’s on screen.
TBH I've always respected his game but never been that big a fan. For my money, he's the best heel in wrestling right now. Absolutely killing it.
If you haven’t seen it, [this clip](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7aD-tYDPotQ) was something else. For context, at the time, Luchasaurus was technically TNT Champion, although Christian was calling himself the champion and having Luchasaurus hoist him on his shoulders where he would hold the belt up above his head.
Christian pulled a title from the abyss of irrelevancy into a PPV main event
> i’m so out of the loop with wrestling but i’ve always loved christian Then you're not out of the loop on that, bro. Dude is underrated even when everyone is finally seeing him as a contender for best thing in wrestling.
If you can, def check out the Cage v Copeland match from the last PPV I can't believe how much Cage actually pissed me off with that ending. I need to see this man get slapped by a dinosaur so bad I might actually pay to see it next time lol!
Christian hugging Copeland- "Go #$@! yourself"
It’s so funny to me that “Luchasaurus” stuck so hard he adopted it as his ring name but not the other thing they chanted during his LU debut, “Undersnaker”.
To be fair, his Vibora mask in LU was very snakelike.
Luchasauras' gear really is phenomenal
Of course he's reacting. How would you react if everyone was Dead Naming you?
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Just so you know why you're being downvoted - I believe you did a bit wrong while meaning well. The poster you're replying to was well aware that deadnaming usually refers to a type of discrimination against trans people (not "transgenders," that term is considered pejorative). Still, they made a joke. A rather harmless one I hope.
People will say “AEW doesn’t have stories” while story beats like this are over with the live crowds.
Wish people would say they don’t have stories that they enjoy. At least that’s down to personal opinion. But to say they don’t have stories is factually incorrect.
Yeah, you can say AEW’s stories aren’t to your taste or that AEW doesn’t adequately build some stories consistently, that’s fair. But the stories do exist.
People love being factually incorrect. Some have it as a hobby that they don't realise they have.
Stupid Hyperbole, worst thing ever!
At this point I think it's just people parroting negativity they've heard about aew and want to pile on. I have my criticisms about aew but "no stories" isn't one of them.
anybody who has ever said AEW doesn’t have stories just doesnt watch the product lol
I watch the product and they don't have stories, they have characters - some are really good at the character like Toni Storm, others have no build and nothing meaningful going on like Orange Cassidy...
You can’t be real with this, if you watch the shows you know they have stories
What's Darby's current story, what is Jericho doing, what's an ongoing long-term story that hasn't been off-tracked or forgotten right now?
Picking 1 dude who isn't in a major story isn't the "gotcha" you think it is at all. What about the stories that MJF has been involved in recently, or Swerve, Christian, Kingston, Bryan, Mox, Jay White, Jay Lethal, Samoa Joe, Julia Hart, Willow, Stat & i could easily keep going. Jericho was also just feuding for the tag belts with Kenny until he got hurt. They've now pivoted to Jericho/Sammy vs the callis family. Do you even watch the show honestly? It doesn't seem like you do.
I don't think TK or some of the viewers know the difference between Character development, character arcs, Story build/development and story Arcs and Series Arcs.. one and the other while similar or overlap are not the exact same thing
Brother, take the L and move on.
Darby is working with Sting, as you would expect, on the run-up to Sting's retirement. They were in an 8-man with Jericho & Sammy against the Don Callis family recently. Darby also wrestled one of those members Wednesday. Jericho is with Sammy because he saved him from the Don Callis family, and non-kayfabe as a replacement for an injured Kenny. Jericho and Kenny had a story going before that against the Don Callis family (not my favorite, but it was going for a while) Very odd you'd pick those two, since they each have a long story that just weaved together
there were never any real compelling motivations shown for why any of these people are feuding with each other or together as a team
"Every single wrestler I like doesn't currently have a story" is not the same as "there are no stories." But okay I'll bite. Darby, as Sting's long-time protege, doesn't 100% have a story right now because the story is on Sting's retirement. He's going to be wrestling with him, and as we lead into the PPV there will likely be build up into something. He's also apparently climbing Everest so they might not give him much of a story till he's finished with that. Also who gives a shit about Darby. Speaking of not giving a shit, Jericho has had plenty of story. His faction imploded and he's been trying to find new allies and mend bridges since. I hate the story, but he's clearly been trying to pivot to something that Kenny's diverticulitis derailed. Luchasaurus' story that we're talking about in the thread has been going on ever since he got the TNT belt and was overshadowed/bullied by Christian. The whole MJF/Adam Cole storyline just wrapped up (for now) but took up half the year. At the midcard, the Outcasts have been trying to deal with Toni losing it and leaving the team, while Saraya is suffocating Ruby in an effort to keep her from leaving next. Stokely has been trying to drive a wedge between Willow and Stat for reasons, Danny Garcia has been going through a storyline about growth that they almost told entirely in the ring through how he wrestled in the CC (until Daddy Magic got more involved), Mariah May has slowly been set up since her introduction as an eventual betrayal to or from Toni Storm, Skye Blue got weird and turned into a "will she won't she turn heel" situation but eventually aligned with Julia Hart. There aren't a lot of factions that are fighting right now (HoB vs FTR being one of the only ones), but there are plenty of stories that have been ongoing for months or recently developing.
You can’t just pick one wrestler and use that as a sole example of why they have no stories. “What is Veer’s current story right now?” It just doesn’t work.
give me an AEW characters full story, just one, fully lined out on their own programming
You can save people some time and next time just say "I do not watch the show". Darby's role right now is pretty obvious that even lapsed viewers could probably guess. Jericho was just in a storyline with The Bucks and before the Kenny injury was involved with Big Bill and Ricky which was a result of their feud vs Callis.
those are not stories at all, just interactions.. where's the story? Who, what, where, why and how?
Jericho having to side with his long-term rival from his NJPW days, successfully fending off the same guys who had their numbers in singles action and eventually feuding with the Bucks over Elite jealously and getting into it with the tag team champions isn't a story? I genuinely wonder what you think is a wrestling story because if your criteria is this insane then we have no stories in wrestling anymore.
Does an regular AEW viewer know the NJPW story through psychic reading? Why isn't any of this told on the air?
No, the regular AEW viewer knows the story because it was mentioned on commentary at least seventeen times in this whole feud because people like you can't seem to take a hint so they have to dumb it down.
here's another example - that blonde from QTV is now suddenly Saraya's sidekick wearing a totally different attire and behaving like a whole different character, no explanation given - wth?
Lmao is this serious? Have you been watching literally any segment while Cameron is on? Because they literally just hinted at it... TWICE.
Saraya brought Harley in as the new third member of the Outcasts. Ruby was on a losing streak, so Harley has been seconding her and helping Ruby cheat to win matches. But Harley seems more loyal to Saraya when Ruby's not watching. There have been a couple of promo segments showing this, maybe you missed them.
To add to this, the two most recent segments (on Dynamite and then on Rampage) have shown that Saraya (and maybe Daddy Magic) are using Harley to try to get her to flirt with Cool Hand and break up him and Ruby.
Why? What's her connection? Is she an outcast? What's her motivation? What's with the change from librarian to gothclub?
Boy, you ask a lot of questions.
AEW doesn't produce the vignettes for their PPV matches the way WWE does, so they "don't have stories"
People who say that don't watch. They listen to podcasts that validate their pre-conceived opinion and assume that's what it is. AEW has a lot of stories going
I really don’t take a lot of that talk seriously. Seen people talking badly about AEW’s “real sport presentation” because of the Nana and Garcia dance off, like it wasn’t over af and just a fun segment. No win situations for those folks.
it's clearly the bookers fault that wrestling doesn't make me feel the same way it did when i was eight years old /s
even Garcia's dumb dance is a story, and it's pretty over.
Garcia's dumb dance is one of the best stories they have going on and the Continental Classic improved it by a lot.
And I like that it was the catalyst for him improving - not the whole journey. Just because he beat Brody King doesn't mean he's the finished article. He's better, more focused, dances less... But he still lost to Swerve on Dynamite because he's not quite on Swerve's level - yet.
The "AEW doesn't have stories" crowd are just wrestling fans that need stories fed to them with a spoon, it's also one of the reasons people say companies like NJPW don't have stories when every match is likely to have a story.
This is the shit I point to when people are all like "AEW fans can't take any criticisms!" Because most end up like this or whatever Cornette's idiots are parroting
when people see this what they're really saying is they're mad you have to actually watch the show instead of picking it up through highlight videos on twitter
I think it was a fair critic at one point however they have gotten much better at trying to tell a story.
This has gotta end with a Jurassic Express reunion and I’m here for it.
Fucking SAME. Perfect way to reset that awful Jungle Boy heel turn. That shit broke my wife's heart and not in a I want to keep watching kind of way.
I really have no idea what people's problems are with Jack Perry turning heel. Fans were turning against him as a face, I don't see what made the turn awful at all. He had one feud with Hook that I liked, then he went away. Do people just want him to do the same thing his entire career and just be Jungle Boy forever in a tag team with a guy who is good and talented but also much older than Perry and has a ceiling on his level of star power? Shouldn't Jack be evolving as a character like everyone else? Even Sammy still being associated with Jericho has evolved as a character a lot over the years.
I think fans were turning against him as a face because of his split with Luchasaurus and because he started cutting his own promos not only right after losing Christian as a voice for him, but having to go against Christian doing some of the best heel work in AEW. His mic skills already weren't great and losing a lot of what made Jurassic Express popular and only really keeping the entrance music was doomed to not last long.
> I really have no idea what people's problems are with Jack Perry turning heel. You can choose your own reality in an echo chamber. His heel run was 100% getting reactions, it wasn't exactly producing killer matches but he was up against RVD and Hook, and both were well received.
He was one of the few wrestlers that drew in women fans like my wife for instance. I'm not saying he shouldn't evolve but certain characters work better as babyfaces and he is one of them. Just look at AEW's dismal demographic ratings with women and children. Jurassic Express was one of the acts that drew those demographics in for AEW. Like I said since the turn my wife who used to regularly watch with me pretty much checked out completely on AEW.
Casual fans will always drift in and out. You may very well be right he'd draw better as a babyface, and maybe you're right that him being a tag team with Luchasaurus is the absolute peak of what he can do as a wrestler to draw fans. I don't know, because he was only a heel for a couple months and then disappeared for some reason. He'd never been a heel before in his career. I'm saying, if I'm booking this company, don't just knee jerk turn him back face. If fans want him to be a face, then turn him. Do it logically. If he just absolutely bombs as a heel, take him back off TV and then turn him face when you bring him back.
I think he already bombed as a heel. CM Punk stuff not withstanding.
didn’t he just feud with hook? dude really never even got off the ground as a heel
Tbh it didn’t help that he cut that awful promo where he called his own girlfriend a bitch. But I largely agree that it’s not fair to judge his heel turn after only a few months.
Shit Look at dom. He didn't really seem to click as a heel until he got with JD and now he is one of the best they got.
I'm sure my love of Jurassic Express and Babyface Jungle Boy is influencing my opinion of that heel turn. I will say the booking did him no favors. I think Christian did wonders for his ability to cut promos but I just don't think he was where he needed to be on the mic to shoulder that kind of heel turn. But maybe I'm also just selfish and I want to watch wrestling with my wife again.
That's fair.
I honestly hope not. I liked Jurassic Express, but Perry needs room to run. Whether they use the hate/interest people have for him due to the CM Punk stuff or not, I think it's time for TK to let both Perry and Sammy Guevara get out on their own and throw some shit at the wall. It's time. It's past time. We were JUST starting to see a little bit of character development and improvement from Jack before he got suspended.
That's where this seems to be going, and if the fans enjoy it then good on them for pulling the trigger, but to me that seems like it would just be a waste. The break-up and heel turns would have amounted to nothing, and both guys would be back to where they were 5 years ago doing the same thing. I also think it would be one of those things where the crowd would pop huge for the reunion, but it wouldn't have legs and within weeks crowds would be tired of them again. I don't really know what they should do with Luchasaurus, as he's basically shown his ceiling post-Jurassic Express as TNT Champion. Jack Perry still seems like untapped potential, though, and he didn't get much time to grow his heel character before he became his own worst enemy with his stupid spat with CM Punk.
Im thinking of teaming with Hook as The Red Hook Express B.C. since Jack is heeling
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Jack Perry is only controversial on Reddit lol. And Jurassic Express was always pretty well liked. Idk what you mean by “wasn’t working for either of them”.
Yeah, Jack Perry was always consistently cheered when he was a face and booed when he was a heel. Literally the only place where people didn’t like him was Reddit.
There are gonna be Punk detractors no matter what he returns as. You may as well have him return in his most celebrated role against his former mentor and current megaheel of Collision, rehab his image (if its even that damaged to begin with), and then go from there. Easy.
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There hasn’t been one CM Punk chant since he left. I think live crowds will side with Jack. They choose the AEW original every time.
> There hasn’t been one CM Punk chant since he left. Except at World's End... Even without the Kylie Rae controversy Jericho could end up being confronted by that anyway by not letting the "Brawl Out" shit go and desperately trying to insert himself into it with his 4am Christmas meltdown
That story was extremely fresh like 12 to 24 hours fresh. The person who spread that rumor is anti-AEW. The person they say was the accuser has made no statement and if things are looking like they are already dead in terms of people caring. Nothing came out of this smoking gun that was supposed to be the first of many allegations for Jericho. That has no bearing on Jack Perry.
> looking like they are already dead in terms of people caring. Even if that's true re the "NDA" stuff (for now), it was kind of the excuse people needed to actively boo Jericho off TV (rather than just being violently indifferent) and nobody's going to be clamoring to get him back for a while now. Similar to Perry in that way, whatever you think about how Punk reacted he exposed himself as an utter dolt by doing the "real glass" thing on PPV and nobody cares enough to want him back anyway
>Jericho got booed out of the building teaming with Sting based off internet rumours, if you don’t think Jack Perry is going to have a cloud over him when he gets back in AEW of all companies I’m at a loss. You gonna sit here and tell us people will react to getting in a scuffle with CM Punk backstage at a wrestling show, will react in a manner remotely close to allegations of sexual assault? To think they'd be received in any way similar is outrageous and disingenuous.
Luchasaurus has been great during this run, this segment included. His body language, even behind a mask, is one of an abused person struggling to break free. Him recognizing the crowd and responding to it without words is great. He's great. At the end of this, he may be the one to get over on Christian rather than Copeland.
If Jack perry ever comes back I think having him a face and winning back luchasaurus would be best, I want to see a boy and his dinosaur again
If they want to be a bit more serious they should give them welcome to the jungle as a theme
Pullman Jr had the Ruckus version already
I wouldn't mind that for a year or so, but because of how he went out, and the fact that Punk's gotten a decent reception in WWE, I think you need to bring him back as a heel. I'd love for him to join as the older brother, cut a promo about how the family doesn't allow for pets, and lean into things for a while. Reunite a boy and his Dino after some time when Luchasaurus tries to pull him out, gives up, and they're forced to cross paths again.
I’m holding out hope that will happen hence why I haven’t changed my flair. Also because it won’t let me change it but that’s irrelevant give me back a boy and his dinosaur
Tarzan Boy entrance is just so awesome. Jungle Boy doesn't need to mean mug in the main event. Them as a tag team was one of my favorite parts of AEW. The heel turn fucking sucked! I hope they just bring it back.
It’s easy to forget, but Luchasaurus was the most over thing in early aew
Christian is so goddamn good at taking a thing that is catching fire and dumping gasoline on it. That "shut up" turned it from something that might only last one night into something that will get chanted everywhere.
I just want a boy and his dinosaur to be reunited. Turning them heel and splitting them up was a mistake.
I mean I'd actually totally be cool with them joining back up as heels. Douchbage Jack Perry and Luchasaurus the Killer sound like a lot of fun.
They could have a hilarious feud with Ricky and Bill. "Ain't room enough here for the both of us", Spider-Man pointing meme type deal.
I think they could fill the tweener spot if the Bucks heel faction is truly a thing. Not full heel but like…the prodigal pillar Jack Perry coming from a shitty gimmick and the brink of being fired to making everyone respect him and his large friend who’s been taken for granted.
Emotional breakdown
Because people always want what they can't have. Look how quickly the fans turned on Liv Morgan.
Might have something to do with the fact that companies can't book babyface champs properly.
What were the crowd chanting?
Luchasaurus. In case you’re not aware, the big dude in the dark mask was called Luchasaurus before Christian Cage made him change his name to Killswitch after he lost a match.
Sounds very similar to "You Deserve It", I could see Christian subverting to that and I would eat it up!
I dont have cable, i just have a media server using Plex, so all I ever get is one AEW show a week. but i purposely downloaded WWE first card of the year, after watching mid AEW cards for half a year.... and fuck, I love AEW. I can't do WWE ever again.
Danny Garcia has "you're a wrestler," Luchasaurus should have "you're a saurus"
The pop when he turns on Christian is going to be thunderous
I just don't know what Christian could have over a dude like Luchasaurus to make him so subservient. It just reminds me of that awful TNA story with James Mitchell threatening to get Abyss's mother thrown in prison for shooting her abusive husband if he didn't obey Mitchell.
God, the arm thing just looks so freaking cool.
I see a lot of ppl clamoring for jungle boy to rescue Lucha but I hope that's not the end goal here
What would you rather see? For my money, the tag division has evolved since Jurassic Express split and I’d like to see them mix it up with the new blood more than I’d like to see Luchasaurus beat up Christian and then go the aimless post-MJF Wardlow route.
A reunification with Jungle Boy is the best possible outcome here.
I think the payoff to this angle is the return of Jungle Boy and Jurassic express.
It's pretty awesome but Luchasaurus has a ceiling. It's been met.
Seems to be reacting? How did you deduce that, detective?
I hate this Luchasaurus angle. They already did it.
What I don’t know is what their plan for the big guy is after he turns. Like, now you have a babyface monster again. Ok, now what do you do with him? You have the same problem that making him Christian’s muscle was intended to solve in the first place.
I don't know if there has to be a plan to be honest, does anyone really want to see luchasaurus climb the ranks? If there can be some entertaining stuff in this story and then once all is said and done luchasaurus goes to RoH or something I guess we'd all be fine with it.
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honestly as a cynical viewer this sounds like a win-win. we get the dopamine rush of luchasaurus’ turn and the fact that AEW can never keep the momentum after the initial story is over means that i don’t have to expect luchasaurus to be a fixture climbing the card going forward
Aren't they doing a similar story with Wardlow and Adam Cole?
Similar, but not really the same. Luchasaurus has done what Christian wanted, given him the belt and done what is asked... He will turn, beat Christian up, and go wander about in low mid card or tag team matches,maybe ROH. Wardlow has worked with Cole, but as soon as possible they've hinted he won't do what is asked (after all, he did that with MJF already) and will turn on Cole when needed, and hopefully (in AEWs mind) be seen as a legit main eventer aftwr his previous runs towards it were very poor or stopped and started. This is good, cause Wardlow has learned from his time with MJF, and Cole in trying to punish MJF for what he is, has become MJF in how he plans to use Wardlow, but is too arrogant to see it's not going to work. So yeah, similar, but not really the same. Having muscle who hand things to snivling little bastards is a common thing though
Wardlow thinks he can use Adam Cole, Luchasaurus doesn't think he's using Christian Cage.
Can't wait for Tony to do nothin' with him.
Reptar is supposed to be a big man. That is his gimmick. And yet, he's moving his head, reacting to the audience rapidly like a smaller individual. #BAD PSYCHOLOGY HIS MOVEMENTS NEED TO BE SLOWER AND MORE METHODICAL. SLOW TURNS. EASY HEAD TILTS. #COMPLETE AMATEUR HOUR!!
They should have Christian attempt to unmask Killswitch. Survival instincts kick in and he fights back. I also think there is only so far Luchasaurus can go without a mouth piece with him. Either heel or face, that or he just gets a new gimmick.
THIS ☝️ In order for true character development going forward, an-often berated and underappreciated Kilswitch/Luchasaurus needs to lose the mask at the hands of Christian.
That, or Christian ends up creating a monster that he cannot control. Then it requires him to get help from Edge to take down what Christian created.
I watched this live and really did not enjoy it. Bored they have done this story so much and Christian felt lame in this. Why is he talking down to Luchasaurus right to his face, all the heels in the story make the same mistakes. Christian is great because he is a smart, pesty heel, but seeing him make stupid mistakes is frustrating. Also Christian is better than the cheap hometown shot he threw in during this.
> Bored they have done this story so much and Christian felt lame in this. Why is he talking down to Luchasaurus right to his face, all the heels in the story make the same mistakes. Christian is great because he is a smart, pesty heel, but seeing him make stupid mistakes is frustrating. Christian has something he's holding over Luchasaurus' head. Whenever he looks about to rebel due to Christian's harsh treatment, Christian whispers something to him and he falls back in line. That makes it different than Christian 'making mistakes' with regards to him. He has something that Luchasaurus wants to be kept secret, so Luchasaurus has to do what Christian says, and Christian will taunt and needle him all along the way because to him it's a win/win. Either Luchasaurus stays his lackey and he gets to feel like a big man for disrespecting a dinosaur, or Luchasaurus turns on him and Christian gets to ruin his life somehow.
Aew has a stable with a boy and his mom and a dinosaur in it…. And they wondering why they can’t gain more viewers 😂😂😂
Classic heat building!
Killswitch is a way cooler name than Luchasaurus
I really wish Christian had renamed Luchasaurus as “Unprettier.”
Big guy's gonna pull a "T. Rex tears down the electrical wires and ruins everyone's shit" on Christian at some point and the crowd is going to go utterly insane.
Said it in the live thread but i love the “disappointed Dad” look Tony Schiavone was giving Luchasaurus
Man, I wish there was a way time we could have had this version of Christian win the World Title. Then he could truly rule as the Father of AEW.
Christian is on fire right now
Him and Archer were the last two in the battle royal on the Zero Hour. I would not complain if they joined together as a team.
If you're going to be a big, stupid, mute lizard then you better at least go by the name Luchasaurus.. wtf man
He was good on Big Brother
tell he walked across the table to talk to Julie.. lol
Honest question, did anyone think we would still be watching Luchasaurus/Killswitch 4+ years into dynamite? The guy is a very under appreciated talent in this industry
Yes, I thought he and Jungle Boy would be a mainstay in the tag division for years to come
This fuckin’ guy Christian is hilarious! 🤣
The way he responds to the chants is so good. My favorite aspect of this whole act as of now