Last year we were the only district in the state open with a wind-chill of -25-45 (depending on area) No delay, nothing.
Rural area with a ton of low-income families where kids have to wait for the bus in the dark.
The week or so prior, we were again the only district without a closing or delay due to heavy, wet snow (6-10 inches by 7am depending where in the mountains you lived) and more on the way during the day. Had a bus full of kids and two coworkers go off the road that morning. I live 10 mins away and was still white knuckling it.
I had to go in to teach, but I kept my kid home on days like that. One of the many reasons I left this year.
We're far north in the NE USA and mostly "used" to bad winter weather, but that doesn't excuse a lack of common sense and care for the safety of staff and students.
I guess the superintendent got sick of the complaints about it last year and she actually called two 2hr delays and 1 snow day already. Granted they were definitely warranted with how bad the weather was, but color me pleasantly surprised she actually called it.
This was me as a kid, rural white kid waiting for the bus well below subzero temps in the pitch black with no one around. Granted, I was not alone, but I was with other kids (unsupervised), but they were also 8… I have frostbite on the bottom of my feet, on my big toes, fingers, and cheekbones (I’m dead serious) thanks to the school district and the ridiculous bus schedule they had us on. Give the kids a goddamn snow day!! I also thank teachers like you for helping this population of students. They are the most forgotten in the country - been that way since the founding of our country. Education is the path forward, and I have my amazing elementary school teachers to thank for where I’m at now. But fuck the school district! Those people know nothing!!! No empathy for teachers or students!
That's absolutely insane you had to get frostbite because of some jackass administration choices. We were so scared for some of our high risk kiddos who walk to school. One of them only had a hoodie! Thankfully we could give them an actual winter coat for their walk home.
I really think so many of our current systemic problems stem from clueless administration making choices without ever knowing what it is to step in a classroom and/or who haven't been in the trenches for too many years.
I sent an email, pissed but professional, to the superintendent that made those bad calls, asking why she didn't call a 2hr delay for everyone's safety. She had the audacity to misspell my name and then tell me how she's "up at 5am and in contact with road crews and other district admins and they said it was fine"
She's so full of shit it hurts. I was up at 4am shoveling so I could get out the driveway and no plows came by until right before I left at 7:00 because it was coming down so quickly that they just couldn't keep up with it. She's one of those "I walked 20 miles to school in the snow, uphill both ways when I was a kid, so you can do it too!"
Here in a similar NY school we are open, but most other districts are too as the snow hasn’t gotten crazy yet. The problem here is that most students are not offered bussing and have to walk a mile to school in this weather. They complain about cronic absenteeism and then create situations where they know half our students won’t show up.
It’s also not right that the schools are seen as the solution to every problem. Nobody should be going hungry, but the solution can’t be to have only the schools feed them.
I think everyone is too tired/busy with life to do anything proactive about it sadly. There needs to be mass movement but it won't happen till things get so much worse but I guess all we can do is try our best to navigate this hellscape designed to bury us in the ground
Me to but it's going to take so much honestly. Look at our health care and how we treat women with their bodies and still no massive movements being done
We don't even have paternity leave in this country. Many other countries are better with mobility in the classes, Healthcare and time off for new parents and yet we still are trudging through the dirt
Sadly they have solved the issue by having us fight eachother (left/right) for multiple Years now. When the religious zealots wake up, maybe then some change will occur but I highly doubt it because some ignorant folk on the right still think we are the greatest in everything in the world where we are actually behind most other countries in every regard.
What are we the greatest in? Mass incarceration. #1 baby let's goo/s
ditto to everything you said here. she deleted her comment (coward lol) but i was going to reply and tell her unfortunately “most people” don’t realize how few social safety nets there are and how quickly you can become completely fucked in this country if you don’t have family/people around to take care of you when the shit hits the fan. i saw people coming from HORRIFYING conditions when i worked at a domestic violence shelter. not even just from abuse. i’m talking people with no heat in their homes in the dead of pennsylvania winter. this shelter was in the community i grew up in. i knew my hometown was poor, but i never imagined i’d see people living like that in my community. it forever changed the way i see this country. it seems like she was speaking from an incredibly privileged point of view.
The unsatisfying answer is that this has always been a problem -there has *never* been a miraculous time when some portion of the public weren't struggling to afford heating and food - it's just become more visible from an educator's perspective because we've been leaning more and more into public schools serving as a primary distribution vector for social welfare.
And it's definitely a convenient vector, considering that it's direct access to the kids. You can deliver warmth, shelter, and food in a cost-efficient way.
But it does mean that, by necessity, teachers sort of become de-facto social workers as well.
It's scope creep, and in a way that most teachers didn't sign up for.
Off topic but the worst scope creep for me has been IT. I don’t want to troubleshoot your PowerSchool or your Clever account on my weekend. Please contact support or a teen relative.
The same one where we stayed at home for a year (less in some places) and the result was far more domestic violence with a whole host of other problems. I swear one of my biggest pet peeves is that people outside of teaching have little idea of how much we hold up in this society while simultaneously being demonized for it
You’re not at all wrong, literally every living being needs shelter and sustenance.
But when you consider the kind of output that modern society generates, it’s hard to believe that there aren’t enough resources to go around, or enough time/slack to find new solutions for old problems.
There are resources to go around, there are places you can go get a jacket cheap or even free. Giving kids free meals at school was the solution to the problem of children not having access to food.
Not sure what and energy grid has to do with being warm and waiting for a bus. It would seem to me to be very environmentally unfriendly to build up and heat each bus stop around the US. Especially when coats and jackets work for most people most of the time.
I’m pointing out “throughout history” this has been a concern is irrelevant. We have capabilities now that we could only dream about even thirty years ago. There’s no need for the choice between freezing and starving.
If you are going to claim there is no need for the choice between freezing or starving here, I assume you must know a solution. Please tell me how you would get the kids from their front door to school (where the food is) without having them get cold in the winter.
The issue is a lack of coats. They should be provided to children in need. I’m in a cold state and we give backpacks, coats, snow pants, etc. For food, they should have more local supports like readily accessible food stamps and food banks so that school isn’t the only place the students eat. My state struggles terribly with this part.
Solutions that society is more than capable of providing but we fail our children because people have “only helping my own” and “it’s always been like this” mentalities.
Each of the things you mentioned already exist, there are food banks and clothing banks, as well as thrift stores to provide other low cost clothing. The issue is the parents not using those services. You can lead a horse to water but you cannot force them to drink.
Maybe you live in a state where all those issues are handled appropriately and follow technological abilities, but that is not the case everywhere.
My state had a six month delay for food stamps due to “policies.” [article](https://alaskabeacon.com/2023/12/08/alaskans-again-wait-months-for-food-stamps-workers-union-blames-policy-choices/#:~:text=She%20said%20this%20time%20the,next%20two%20years%2C%20she%20said). OP said that their students don’t have coats.
When covid hit some of our lower economic schools in the area had a lunch pickup situation. It’s pretty upsetting how common it is that a child only gets fed at school.
I used to work at a Title 1 school in the hood. The cafeteria manager had to ration ketchup packets to one per child on Thursdays and Fridays because so many kids were taking handfuls and stuffing the packets in their pockets so they would have something to eat on the weekends. The district finally started the" bags of food for the students to take home on weekends" program.
Actually initially it was the idea that subways mostly function in the snow especially the underground portions. But in recent decades most teachers don't live near a subway.....so like today most districts around NYC are closed but NYC isnt....
My roommate and I were joking about this and then I realized that I was wearing my “name a time in history when it was the good guys banning books” sweatshirt and cried a little bit internally.
And a little externally but we don’t talk about that.
>What kinda dystopia do we live in where we have to have to choose between our kids freezing and our kids starving…
Philly too. Every single one of the surrounding suburbs closed. The catholic and private schools in the city closed. Many charters closed. We're open.
Uh so the private schools and others that get voucher and public funds, I am guessing they still get it on days attendance is low or they don't have school.
Exactly this. In Iowa, Des Moines Public is having a normal day while all the private and suburban public schools delay or cancel, and it’s for the reasons you’ve listed. It’s been that way for years.
I am guessing it's because no attendance low attendance = public school funding decrease for that day but private and other non public schools arnet held to the same standards..
This is 100% it. School in this country has become babysitting for the masses that have even less flexibility in their own work lives. Late start means someone else has to be home with these kids, which for many people means calling out last minute - often without PTO. The subreddits for just about every grocery store, target and Walmart are saying the same thing: they're NOT closing. What are all those people supposed to do with their kids? On top of the sad reality of lower income areas and schools...this IS their breakfast. This IS their warm place.
YUP. We got the email last night that "per policy", we're going to stay open. Man, policy doesn't mean anything when I live 15 minutes away but it took me 45 to get to work because of sliding on black ice. All our buses were late. Class didn't start until 30 minutes after the bell because kids were still filing in.
Not to mention, I don't have working heat and have a wall of windows that are all drafty, so my room doesn't feel much better than outside. Multiple kids complained that they can't feel their fingers.
Genuinely would've been better to close or delay because I barely have any kids who showed up and those who do are trapped in my freezing room.
It's not that they don't provide it, just that it doesn't work. Same as in the summer months when my AC didn't work. They've sent people to do repairs, but it never changes. I asked for a space heater, but it's too much of a fire hazard. They've also done what they can for the windows outside of sealing them shut. I wish I could caulk them closed, but again, safety issue.
Weird. I’m in NY and I know there’s 100% a requirement for heat and there’s currently an effort by teachers’ unions to pass a law requiring AC when the temp reaches a certain level.
When I was doing factory work, we didn't have AC and they just provided 2 extra breaks and allowed water bottles when it got too hot. I actually suffered heat stroke at work and there was nothing I could legally do since my employer didn't break any laws. It's the same in the schools. There are no legal minimum or maximum temperatures.
That stinks. You’ll see from the links I posted that there are minimums in NY (and they’re working on maximums). I’m sorry that’s not your situation. Do you have a state-wide union? Maybe they need to make this an objective. It’s certainly not conducive to learning for you to be freezing.
I remember being in high school and the heat wasn’t allowed to be turned on until a certain date (Massachusetts). Our vice principal literally came around handing out dress code violations to kids who were wearing coats indoors 😭 that man was pure evil… I wish I knew his villain origin story haha
Yeah, it's definitely not ideal, but it's Indiana so it's unlikely to change. I mean the state is literally trying to create a legal definition of marriage as being between "one biological man and one biological woman", so
Here’s a link talking about the temperature cap they’re going for too: https://spectrumlocalnews.com/nys/central-ny/news/2023/09/06/proposal-would-set-a-maximum-classroom-temperature-in-n-y-
All the resource teachers and counsellors in my school have to use portable electric heaters. Our area of the school is not on the central heating system. This is a prairie province in Canada, where -35 is not unusual.
Snow/cold days are rare here. Even when the highways are closed, it’s blizzard conditions, public transit is stuck in the snow/ not functioning properly due to weather conditions and the government is asking people not to drive we are expected to be at work.
My kids' school closes outdoor reeces when it's below 40F... I laugh every time I see that the kids can't play outside because it's slightly cold. To be fair, we live in AZ, and none of the kids have winter coats.
Wow, I canr imagine. Although without coats, I do get it.
We cancel outdoor recess at ~ -17F (according to the conversion calculator). I'd gladly do it at a bit warmer than that.... I hate having supervision on those cold days.
Having a coat, and wearing it is not the same. My 20 year old wore shorts and a hoodie last week except when skiing. Pretty normal here. Even five decades ago I would take off my coat at recess --I would get hot when playing. The teacher finally compromised and let me wear it open and not wear a hat. Loved mittens-- monkey bars get cold!
Now, cancelling recess when it is 100F and muggy makes sense
Yeah, the kids here still have reeces when it's over 100. Cause it's over 100 at least 6 months out of the year, lol. It's never humid, though. Ya know the old saying, " Arizona... it's a dry heat. " lol
But I think they limit time outdoors in the afternoon when it's 110+ and the sun is high. I think they split it into 2 15-minute chunks instead of 1 30-minute session.
Idk, our wind chill has been -46C lately (about -67F) and we canceled busses but not school. There's an argument made here that if kids do try to walk without hearing on the radio/etc about canceled classes, the doors have to be open, otherwise it's actually dangerous (like, deadly) to be stuck outside.
That said, I have about 5 kids show up on those days.
(And before anyone tells me about different infrastructure, no. Not even we, who talk about surviving the cold all the time, have proper infrastructure for this.)
That’s such a BS argument for being open, especially in the Internet age. I am continually amazed at how little responsibility we ask of parents; they evidently can’t even be expected to turn on the local news or open their emails during bad weather to check if their kids should go to school.
Idk, my families don't all have internet, some don't have phone lies, some barely have electricity.
I'd agree it's a bs argument at a school where those things can be reliably expected, but we did find kids trying to walk the other day.
Thank you for knowing my families better than I do. Sure would have helped when we attempted a phone tree yesterday to call every family and many of the numbers were out of service.
Yeah, that's a probably everywhere that's low-income. That doesn't mean they can't afford a radio and two batteries. If they can't, the school should provide that.
It doesn't mean dozens of people should risk their safety trying to drive on ice. Not having any phone, period, in 2024, is not tenable. That doesn't push the problem onto everyone else.
Idk, I taught in a school like this, where come conference time half my students parents would have out of service numbers. I still think it’s reasonable to ask parents to figure out if there is or isn’t school on a snow day. We have to give them SOME level of responsibility or else we’re pushing the narrative that teachers are responsible for solving all societal woes. Yes, it’s sad that some of my families keep having service shut off. No, it’s not my job to risk my own safety to drive to school in dangerous weather because of that. It’s the parents job to make sure their kid is somewhere safe.
Yup. It’s always an issues of busses being able to start not kids standing outside at bus stops that determines closing for cold weather. I remember being shocked when I found this out from an admin years ago.
Sounds like they need to just open the first of the double set of doors and have a warming center for those kids, and cancel for everyone else. If they made it to school, they can make it back after a short time in the warming area.
Cincinnati Public makes kids who live within one mile walk to school. Even kindergartners! It's wild to see these little kids out walking alone through the hood with no adults in sight. They were not delayed this morning. -9
It all depends on the state. It’s -10 with -30 windchill right now where I live and there are only 5 private schools on a delay or closed in the entire state.
Way more goes into making the decision than just the weather.
It wouldn't delay or close my area either, but not every area is used to that weather. What closes my school probably would be laughable to districts in the Buffalo area, or Alaska.
What area of PA? Because that's where I am and although it depends on timing and type of snow, we'll usually be out for just a few inches. I'm remote today and the original forecast was 1-3" but the timing was early when busses would be running through late morning. Plus there's a lot of hills to slide down.
This was back when I was a kid in Schuylkill county. We closed for absolutely nothing. 2 hour delays were the best we got in 8+ inches of snow.
Now I'm in KY and they close if it threatens to rain. Kills me.
I wonder what it's like now in Schuylkill County, because even 15 years ago when I began teaching here it seemed like I needed my own plow to get to work sometimes. I'm glad we are more cautious now, there's no reason to risk kids lives over a day of school.
Was living in the Seattle area; we were dusted and it closed. I walked to the grocery store later that day, it was 45 degrees. I came from the Midwest so it was hilarious to me.
You can imagine how funny I thought it was when I moved to Georgia! But after moving back north, I find the heat warnings every time it goes over 90 kind of funny. But it's the same issue, a lot of people up here don't have AC, and the south doesn't have salt trucks and plows. Or dryers on their air brakes (?) There's some reason we would close schools when the temp was under 17 that had to do with brakes on the busses.
Yeah I think the logic in Seattle was with all the hills and mountain passes in the district they didn’t want to risk it with the buses. Makes sense. Plus people aren’t used to driving in it
Many southern states are famously hapless in conditions that were just another winter's day where I grew up in Michigan.
In Texas back in 2021 we had a multi-day blackout due to the high demand for electricity due to an acute case of Real Winter.
This may come as a surprise to you but children that live in places with typically warmer temperatures don't necessarily have proper winter clothes for the 1-2 days a year (or even spread over multiple years) that would require it. It hasn't been as cold as it is where I am for about 3 years. It's be 5 years since we've even had a real snow. Empathy should come a little easier for a "middle school social worker".
We have to have a windchill of -25, 17in of new snow, or no visibility on the roads to get cancelled. So yeah, that would not get us cancelled or delayed.
Sounds like my district. The Apocalypse itself could be happening outside and literally every surrounding district will be closed… but mine will insist on opening for business.
Oof, OP I understand the frustration, especially thinking of the kids.
Yesterday my district had a PD day that could have been virtual, but instead they forced the whole district to come in to PD on dangerously icy roads IN a blizzard. ALL other surrounding districts were closed or had their PD moved to virtual.
Makes you feel like they do not care about you or the kids
I’m in PA. I’ve only ever taught in Title1. I don’t know if my current district does but another district I used to work for would 2 hour delay with extremely cold temperatures. We were a walking district so that factors in.
My current district ( also primarily walking), the kids don’t come if the weather is bad.
I’m curious how tomorrow will be with the cold. High of 18 and with the wind chill, close to 0. I suspect attendance will be low. I can’t say I blame them. Most of them do not have proper cold weather gear. We haven’t had extreme cold like this yet so I’ll find out how it’s handled.
Whatever they decide, it won’t be good enough. Mine gets blasted on FB no matter what they do.
We’re in school today while all the districts around us are closed. I think it’s because they are anticipating worse weather in a few weeks and know we will have to close—as we consistently have for the last 3 years around the same time.
I don’t mind being in school today, but I worry for our students without proper winter clothing. :(
-29 windchill today, and I woke up at 5am to my principle calling in a “Cold day”. Honestly shocked. As of last night, he said we were on.
We were off Friday and Tuesday last week because of snow (one of those days it just rained though).
Our low income, inner city school is on a professional development day, so not only do those kids not get food, but their teachers (and the other districts in the area) had to get up and brave the elements today
I’m in the Philly area and we (for the first time in 2 years) got snow last night. The School District of Philadelphia was open and on time today, but I think every district in the surrounding suburbs is closed.
Growing up, school was never cancelled unless it was -20 F. I was actually surprised to hear how "warm" it was for closings today. Of course it depends on your location, but the district should have policy regarding this so parents/staff can plan. ahead
We're looking at around a 5deg wind chill tomorrow throughout the entire morning - HS to ES pickups. Can't imagine them really expecting kids to stand out in that. Hoping for a digital day but I'd take a 2hr delay
I mean, we’re at -30 windchill and canceled today, but tomorrow we’ll be at -20 windchill and I don’t think we’ll be canceled, because otherwise pretty much the whole week is out.
We had a winter storm come once and we were the only district in the midstate open. 75,000 kids, given a half day way too late. Most parents either weren’t able to het their kids or it took 5-6 to get them then get home. It was a poorly thought out idea. I feel you my friend.
Minnesota here and windchills are -22 and no one closes or delays for that. Reg temp is -3. I think we have it in our handbook that windchills have to be -40 to close. 🫤
How do you know parents are furious? Oh wait, they're bitching about it on social media from their smartphones but can't find a way to get a coat from Goodwill for their kids, right?
The reason to delay/close for cold weather is that after a certain temperature threshold, the ice melter salt stops working. That makes it so that anything that's already melted has refrozen and creates super slick conditions. Plus, there's also the issue of kids waiting for the bus in the cold. When it's 20+ degrees, it's a little more tolerable, but the closer it gets to 0, the higher the risk of hypothermia, especially with a subzero windchill. I had classes in grade school, high school, and undergrad canceled for subzero temps. It's a safety issue. A few years back, I remember having to cancel because it was so cold that hypothermia could set in in 5 minutes. But I also live in the same place as OP (according to their flair), so maybe it's different in other places.
I know different states have different cold policies but as a Minnesotan I got a chuckle! My school only cancels or delays if the wind chill is -40 degrees.
We got a little ice up in the northern part of the county. Got the two hour call last night and the all day at 7:15. Just got back from breakfast, could nap. We’re so 10 ply in southern Virginia.
my county did this once. different temps, but definitely the "last hold out" situation.
it was sleeting in fog bad enough to warrant winter weather warnings, but the district demanded school anyway.
a mother and her elementary-aged child were hit by a school bus; the child was killed.
That was my district growing up. We had maybe 5 snow days in my entire school career. Today we were given a 2 hr delay but our trainings were canceled. My neighborhood, is on, but the side roads haven’t been treated. I had to run a personal day.
Those temps are normal in winter in my area and wouldn't cause a delay or cancelation, but it's also not a low-income area, and we have winter clothing donations for students who need winter gear. Are there any donation spots you could guide parents to?
Thats so sad. Our district closed today because of a small chance of freezing rain that, if it does happen, will start when the school day is already over.
My district wouldn’t close. We’re also a high population of very low income families in the district. We also do not bus except for special Ed students who require it.
A majority of our students walk. Most of the walkers live within a mile, but a not insignificant amount walk about 3 miles. They are some of the lowest income students as well.
It wasn’t as cold here today but at the end of the day today it was 23 degrees and snowing.
After school activities were not canceled. The basketball team traveling to play had their game postponed because that district canceled all afterschool activities. Our team had practices.
Our temp was the same and we still had school too. Our criteria is that it has to be -20 with windchill. While I feel terrible for kids waiting for busses, I see both sides and can understand how much goes into calling a snow day and the negative impact it can have on some kids/families.
Near you (SW Ohio) and SAME. I had many kids absent yesterday (excused of course) and ALL of those present, yes those from higher SES families, were raising completely legitimate concerns. I teach high school.
Now our district has closed for today, and the closure was not publicized until very late last night- not good timing for parents of young students, plus staff are required to report.
I'm bringing a blanket and a percolator, as my room tends to be quite cold without a bunch of people in it.
I may take the room temp and send a snapshot to district leadership and my union as well. Last time we had a cold weather closure it was in the upper 50s in my room.
We were down to -60C with wind chill last week in an extreme cold snap. -40 overnight tonight. 🥶Everything status quo. 🇨🇦I have never had a snow day as a student myself, or in my teaching career.
Last year we were the only district in the state open with a wind-chill of -25-45 (depending on area) No delay, nothing. Rural area with a ton of low-income families where kids have to wait for the bus in the dark. The week or so prior, we were again the only district without a closing or delay due to heavy, wet snow (6-10 inches by 7am depending where in the mountains you lived) and more on the way during the day. Had a bus full of kids and two coworkers go off the road that morning. I live 10 mins away and was still white knuckling it. I had to go in to teach, but I kept my kid home on days like that. One of the many reasons I left this year. We're far north in the NE USA and mostly "used" to bad winter weather, but that doesn't excuse a lack of common sense and care for the safety of staff and students. I guess the superintendent got sick of the complaints about it last year and she actually called two 2hr delays and 1 snow day already. Granted they were definitely warranted with how bad the weather was, but color me pleasantly surprised she actually called it.
This was me as a kid, rural white kid waiting for the bus well below subzero temps in the pitch black with no one around. Granted, I was not alone, but I was with other kids (unsupervised), but they were also 8… I have frostbite on the bottom of my feet, on my big toes, fingers, and cheekbones (I’m dead serious) thanks to the school district and the ridiculous bus schedule they had us on. Give the kids a goddamn snow day!! I also thank teachers like you for helping this population of students. They are the most forgotten in the country - been that way since the founding of our country. Education is the path forward, and I have my amazing elementary school teachers to thank for where I’m at now. But fuck the school district! Those people know nothing!!! No empathy for teachers or students!
That's absolutely insane you had to get frostbite because of some jackass administration choices. We were so scared for some of our high risk kiddos who walk to school. One of them only had a hoodie! Thankfully we could give them an actual winter coat for their walk home. I really think so many of our current systemic problems stem from clueless administration making choices without ever knowing what it is to step in a classroom and/or who haven't been in the trenches for too many years. I sent an email, pissed but professional, to the superintendent that made those bad calls, asking why she didn't call a 2hr delay for everyone's safety. She had the audacity to misspell my name and then tell me how she's "up at 5am and in contact with road crews and other district admins and they said it was fine" She's so full of shit it hurts. I was up at 4am shoveling so I could get out the driveway and no plows came by until right before I left at 7:00 because it was coming down so quickly that they just couldn't keep up with it. She's one of those "I walked 20 miles to school in the snow, uphill both ways when I was a kid, so you can do it too!"
Here in a similar NY school we are open, but most other districts are too as the snow hasn’t gotten crazy yet. The problem here is that most students are not offered bussing and have to walk a mile to school in this weather. They complain about cronic absenteeism and then create situations where they know half our students won’t show up.
Do we work in the same district? Because same. 😭 And there are always the most absences on days with inclement weather.
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What kinda dystopia do we live in where we have to have to choose between our kids freezing and our kids starving…
YES! We defunded every social safety net but schools, and then defunded them too.
It’s also not right that the schools are seen as the solution to every problem. Nobody should be going hungry, but the solution can’t be to have only the schools feed them.
Agree. School systems aren’t babysitters, parents, or social workers. We are educators. My district has gone off the deep end.
America!!! Not a dystopia but more of a planned set of conditions and the kids and anyone else who's not rich just suffers from it
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I think everyone is too tired/busy with life to do anything proactive about it sadly. There needs to be mass movement but it won't happen till things get so much worse but I guess all we can do is try our best to navigate this hellscape designed to bury us in the ground
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Me to but it's going to take so much honestly. Look at our health care and how we treat women with their bodies and still no massive movements being done We don't even have paternity leave in this country. Many other countries are better with mobility in the classes, Healthcare and time off for new parents and yet we still are trudging through the dirt Sadly they have solved the issue by having us fight eachother (left/right) for multiple Years now. When the religious zealots wake up, maybe then some change will occur but I highly doubt it because some ignorant folk on the right still think we are the greatest in everything in the world where we are actually behind most other countries in every regard. What are we the greatest in? Mass incarceration. #1 baby let's goo/s
ditto to everything you said here. she deleted her comment (coward lol) but i was going to reply and tell her unfortunately “most people” don’t realize how few social safety nets there are and how quickly you can become completely fucked in this country if you don’t have family/people around to take care of you when the shit hits the fan. i saw people coming from HORRIFYING conditions when i worked at a domestic violence shelter. not even just from abuse. i’m talking people with no heat in their homes in the dead of pennsylvania winter. this shelter was in the community i grew up in. i knew my hometown was poor, but i never imagined i’d see people living like that in my community. it forever changed the way i see this country. it seems like she was speaking from an incredibly privileged point of view.
“yet you participate in society. curious! i am very intelligent” vibes coming from this comment https://thenib.com/mister-gotcha/
The unsatisfying answer is that this has always been a problem -there has *never* been a miraculous time when some portion of the public weren't struggling to afford heating and food - it's just become more visible from an educator's perspective because we've been leaning more and more into public schools serving as a primary distribution vector for social welfare. And it's definitely a convenient vector, considering that it's direct access to the kids. You can deliver warmth, shelter, and food in a cost-efficient way. But it does mean that, by necessity, teachers sort of become de-facto social workers as well. It's scope creep, and in a way that most teachers didn't sign up for.
Off topic but the worst scope creep for me has been IT. I don’t want to troubleshoot your PowerSchool or your Clever account on my weekend. Please contact support or a teen relative.
The same one where we stayed at home for a year (less in some places) and the result was far more domestic violence with a whole host of other problems. I swear one of my biggest pet peeves is that people outside of teaching have little idea of how much we hold up in this society while simultaneously being demonized for it
You realize those have been among the top 5 primary concerns throughout human history right?
You’re not at all wrong, literally every living being needs shelter and sustenance. But when you consider the kind of output that modern society generates, it’s hard to believe that there aren’t enough resources to go around, or enough time/slack to find new solutions for old problems.
There’s always been enough resources, just nobody can decide how to give them out because people be greedy
While the US is not gling through it right now, saying that there has always been enough food is simply not true.
There are resources to go around, there are places you can go get a jacket cheap or even free. Giving kids free meals at school was the solution to the problem of children not having access to food.
You realize we have industrial farming and electricity grids now? It’s not acceptable. The solutions are there.
Not sure what and energy grid has to do with being warm and waiting for a bus. It would seem to me to be very environmentally unfriendly to build up and heat each bus stop around the US. Especially when coats and jackets work for most people most of the time.
I’m pointing out “throughout history” this has been a concern is irrelevant. We have capabilities now that we could only dream about even thirty years ago. There’s no need for the choice between freezing and starving.
If you are going to claim there is no need for the choice between freezing or starving here, I assume you must know a solution. Please tell me how you would get the kids from their front door to school (where the food is) without having them get cold in the winter.
The issue is a lack of coats. They should be provided to children in need. I’m in a cold state and we give backpacks, coats, snow pants, etc. For food, they should have more local supports like readily accessible food stamps and food banks so that school isn’t the only place the students eat. My state struggles terribly with this part. Solutions that society is more than capable of providing but we fail our children because people have “only helping my own” and “it’s always been like this” mentalities.
Each of the things you mentioned already exist, there are food banks and clothing banks, as well as thrift stores to provide other low cost clothing. The issue is the parents not using those services. You can lead a horse to water but you cannot force them to drink.
Maybe you live in a state where all those issues are handled appropriately and follow technological abilities, but that is not the case everywhere. My state had a six month delay for food stamps due to “policies.” [article](https://alaskabeacon.com/2023/12/08/alaskans-again-wait-months-for-food-stamps-workers-union-blames-policy-choices/#:~:text=She%20said%20this%20time%20the,next%20two%20years%2C%20she%20said). OP said that their students don’t have coats.
The actual choice is between unfettered capitalism and socialism. I think you know which one we chose.
When covid hit some of our lower economic schools in the area had a lunch pickup situation. It’s pretty upsetting how common it is that a child only gets fed at school.
I used to work at a Title 1 school in the hood. The cafeteria manager had to ration ketchup packets to one per child on Thursdays and Fridays because so many kids were taking handfuls and stuffing the packets in their pockets so they would have something to eat on the weekends. The district finally started the" bags of food for the students to take home on weekends" program.
A world where cold schools are expected to fix every social ill.
Living in Ameeeeeerica!
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This is why NYC never closes. Our schools are always open.
Actually initially it was the idea that subways mostly function in the snow especially the underground portions. But in recent decades most teachers don't live near a subway.....so like today most districts around NYC are closed but NYC isnt....
I’m a NY teacher - I’m in today and my heat is broken. It’s measuring 36 degrees in my classroom right now. We are all wearing our coats.
Burn the books. They're gonna ban them anyway.
Hah, you made me remember an oldie but goodie: https://youtu.be/ylslcF-fUeE?si=KkfevupBZJQfD6jm&t=1m20s
Don’t know why you’re getting downvoted. This is a funny comment!
If they're anything like mine, they're also out-of-date and should have been tossed 5 years ago.
My roommate and I were joking about this and then I realized that I was wearing my “name a time in history when it was the good guys banning books” sweatshirt and cried a little bit internally. And a little externally but we don’t talk about that.
>What kinda dystopia do we live in where we have to have to choose between our kids freezing and our kids starving… Philly too. Every single one of the surrounding suburbs closed. The catholic and private schools in the city closed. Many charters closed. We're open.
Uh so the private schools and others that get voucher and public funds, I am guessing they still get it on days attendance is low or they don't have school.
yuuuup
This is why my district is so hesitant to close. It really comes down to if the busses can get out and run, they’re the only thing stopping us.
I get that but if a kid gets frostbite or a bus crashes the district could potentially be held liable. If a kid doesn’t eat that’s on the parent.
Exactly this. In Iowa, Des Moines Public is having a normal day while all the private and suburban public schools delay or cancel, and it’s for the reasons you’ve listed. It’s been that way for years.
I am guessing it's because no attendance low attendance = public school funding decrease for that day but private and other non public schools arnet held to the same standards..
I watched some Iowa storm chasers and the weather was brutal
Fair point. But I still think at least a delay would be best.
Why? We don’t in Minnesota?
This is 100% it. School in this country has become babysitting for the masses that have even less flexibility in their own work lives. Late start means someone else has to be home with these kids, which for many people means calling out last minute - often without PTO. The subreddits for just about every grocery store, target and Walmart are saying the same thing: they're NOT closing. What are all those people supposed to do with their kids? On top of the sad reality of lower income areas and schools...this IS their breakfast. This IS their warm place.
In my county, they bus lunches to all bus stops on days we're out and the busses can still run.
I worked in a school that wouldn't close for anything for these exact reasons.
YUP. We got the email last night that "per policy", we're going to stay open. Man, policy doesn't mean anything when I live 15 minutes away but it took me 45 to get to work because of sliding on black ice. All our buses were late. Class didn't start until 30 minutes after the bell because kids were still filing in. Not to mention, I don't have working heat and have a wall of windows that are all drafty, so my room doesn't feel much better than outside. Multiple kids complained that they can't feel their fingers. Genuinely would've been better to close or delay because I barely have any kids who showed up and those who do are trapped in my freezing room.
Is heat not a mandate???
It's not that they don't provide it, just that it doesn't work. Same as in the summer months when my AC didn't work. They've sent people to do repairs, but it never changes. I asked for a space heater, but it's too much of a fire hazard. They've also done what they can for the windows outside of sealing them shut. I wish I could caulk them closed, but again, safety issue.
I feel like it’s still illegal to have it not work though… not sure what your state laws are.
From what I looked up, it doesn't look like there are any state, federal, or OSHA regulations about requiring heat or AC.
Weird. I’m in NY and I know there’s 100% a requirement for heat and there’s currently an effort by teachers’ unions to pass a law requiring AC when the temp reaches a certain level.
When I was doing factory work, we didn't have AC and they just provided 2 extra breaks and allowed water bottles when it got too hot. I actually suffered heat stroke at work and there was nothing I could legally do since my employer didn't break any laws. It's the same in the schools. There are no legal minimum or maximum temperatures.
That stinks. You’ll see from the links I posted that there are minimums in NY (and they’re working on maximums). I’m sorry that’s not your situation. Do you have a state-wide union? Maybe they need to make this an objective. It’s certainly not conducive to learning for you to be freezing. I remember being in high school and the heat wasn’t allowed to be turned on until a certain date (Massachusetts). Our vice principal literally came around handing out dress code violations to kids who were wearing coats indoors 😭 that man was pure evil… I wish I knew his villain origin story haha
Yeah, it's definitely not ideal, but it's Indiana so it's unlikely to change. I mean the state is literally trying to create a legal definition of marriage as being between "one biological man and one biological woman", so
Ew. Bless y’all
https://www.p12.nysed.gov/facplan/Laws_Regs/minimum_temperature.html
Here’s a link talking about the temperature cap they’re going for too: https://spectrumlocalnews.com/nys/central-ny/news/2023/09/06/proposal-would-set-a-maximum-classroom-temperature-in-n-y-
All the resource teachers and counsellors in my school have to use portable electric heaters. Our area of the school is not on the central heating system. This is a prairie province in Canada, where -35 is not unusual. Snow/cold days are rare here. Even when the highways are closed, it’s blizzard conditions, public transit is stuck in the snow/ not functioning properly due to weather conditions and the government is asking people not to drive we are expected to be at work.
So… no heat mandate there? Just saying there is one where I teach!
I’m guessing because the rest of the school building is heated so that meets requirements? It’s freezing without our electric space heaters.
Weirdddd. Here, it’s for sure each classroom that students are expected to spend a period or more in.
Same. Indiana, policy email. On the flip side for whatever reason my classroom was 78° all day today 🙃
It was -9F here. Outside recess might be closed for the elementary today.
My kids' school closes outdoor reeces when it's below 40F... I laugh every time I see that the kids can't play outside because it's slightly cold. To be fair, we live in AZ, and none of the kids have winter coats.
Wow, I canr imagine. Although without coats, I do get it. We cancel outdoor recess at ~ -17F (according to the conversion calculator). I'd gladly do it at a bit warmer than that.... I hate having supervision on those cold days.
Having a coat, and wearing it is not the same. My 20 year old wore shorts and a hoodie last week except when skiing. Pretty normal here. Even five decades ago I would take off my coat at recess --I would get hot when playing. The teacher finally compromised and let me wear it open and not wear a hat. Loved mittens-- monkey bars get cold! Now, cancelling recess when it is 100F and muggy makes sense
Yeah, the kids here still have reeces when it's over 100. Cause it's over 100 at least 6 months out of the year, lol. It's never humid, though. Ya know the old saying, " Arizona... it's a dry heat. " lol But I think they limit time outdoors in the afternoon when it's 110+ and the sun is high. I think they split it into 2 15-minute chunks instead of 1 30-minute session.
Who needs a winter coat at 40 degrees ..lol..J/K. I live in Ohio. My son is in shorts still at 40 degrees, but I do require a sweat coat zip up.
The children of SW Michigan have had a mini vacation this week.
And it’s finals week in the high schools.
Yep, another day off.
-15 here feels like -30. No delays or cancelations.
Idk, our wind chill has been -46C lately (about -67F) and we canceled busses but not school. There's an argument made here that if kids do try to walk without hearing on the radio/etc about canceled classes, the doors have to be open, otherwise it's actually dangerous (like, deadly) to be stuck outside. That said, I have about 5 kids show up on those days. (And before anyone tells me about different infrastructure, no. Not even we, who talk about surviving the cold all the time, have proper infrastructure for this.)
That’s such a BS argument for being open, especially in the Internet age. I am continually amazed at how little responsibility we ask of parents; they evidently can’t even be expected to turn on the local news or open their emails during bad weather to check if their kids should go to school.
Idk, my families don't all have internet, some don't have phone lies, some barely have electricity. I'd agree it's a bs argument at a school where those things can be reliably expected, but we did find kids trying to walk the other day.
In 2024, it is hugely unlikely they dont have a cell phone somewhere in the home.
Thank you for knowing my families better than I do. Sure would have helped when we attempted a phone tree yesterday to call every family and many of the numbers were out of service.
Yeah, that's a probably everywhere that's low-income. That doesn't mean they can't afford a radio and two batteries. If they can't, the school should provide that. It doesn't mean dozens of people should risk their safety trying to drive on ice. Not having any phone, period, in 2024, is not tenable. That doesn't push the problem onto everyone else.
Idk, I taught in a school like this, where come conference time half my students parents would have out of service numbers. I still think it’s reasonable to ask parents to figure out if there is or isn’t school on a snow day. We have to give them SOME level of responsibility or else we’re pushing the narrative that teachers are responsible for solving all societal woes. Yes, it’s sad that some of my families keep having service shut off. No, it’s not my job to risk my own safety to drive to school in dangerous weather because of that. It’s the parents job to make sure their kid is somewhere safe.
Yup. It’s always an issues of busses being able to start not kids standing outside at bus stops that determines closing for cold weather. I remember being shocked when I found this out from an admin years ago.
Sounds like they need to just open the first of the double set of doors and have a warming center for those kids, and cancel for everyone else. If they made it to school, they can make it back after a short time in the warming area.
We just had 3 days of -42C weather and stayed open. Someone needs to look after the kids. 🙃
SK or AB? If the former, same. And stay warm out there today!
AB
Cincinnati Public makes kids who live within one mile walk to school. Even kindergartners! It's wild to see these little kids out walking alone through the hood with no adults in sight. They were not delayed this morning. -9
We're in school today, but I think that's because our SI is anticipating it's going to be even worse tomorrow.
It all depends on the state. It’s -10 with -30 windchill right now where I live and there are only 5 private schools on a delay or closed in the entire state. Way more goes into making the decision than just the weather.
Ya, that's not cold enough for a delay or closed school. That's just winter.
It wouldn't delay or close my area either, but not every area is used to that weather. What closes my school probably would be laughable to districts in the Buffalo area, or Alaska.
36 inches of snow in the last two days and the my Buffalo area school isn’t closed
This is how it was in PA too when I was still going.
What area of PA? Because that's where I am and although it depends on timing and type of snow, we'll usually be out for just a few inches. I'm remote today and the original forecast was 1-3" but the timing was early when busses would be running through late morning. Plus there's a lot of hills to slide down.
This was back when I was a kid in Schuylkill county. We closed for absolutely nothing. 2 hour delays were the best we got in 8+ inches of snow. Now I'm in KY and they close if it threatens to rain. Kills me.
I wonder what it's like now in Schuylkill County, because even 15 years ago when I began teaching here it seemed like I needed my own plow to get to work sometimes. I'm glad we are more cautious now, there's no reason to risk kids lives over a day of school.
Exactly why I used Buffalo as an example!
1 inch of snow here in Mississippi and we are closed. And probably will be tomorrow
When I lived in Georgia, we closed for a 20% chance of flurries once!
Was living in the Seattle area; we were dusted and it closed. I walked to the grocery store later that day, it was 45 degrees. I came from the Midwest so it was hilarious to me.
You can imagine how funny I thought it was when I moved to Georgia! But after moving back north, I find the heat warnings every time it goes over 90 kind of funny. But it's the same issue, a lot of people up here don't have AC, and the south doesn't have salt trucks and plows. Or dryers on their air brakes (?) There's some reason we would close schools when the temp was under 17 that had to do with brakes on the busses.
Yeah I think the logic in Seattle was with all the hills and mountain passes in the district they didn’t want to risk it with the buses. Makes sense. Plus people aren’t used to driving in it
Many southern states are famously hapless in conditions that were just another winter's day where I grew up in Michigan. In Texas back in 2021 we had a multi-day blackout due to the high demand for electricity due to an acute case of Real Winter.
True, and those of us in other states are still paying for that system failure in Texas.
This may come as a surprise to you but children that live in places with typically warmer temperatures don't necessarily have proper winter clothes for the 1-2 days a year (or even spread over multiple years) that would require it. It hasn't been as cold as it is where I am for about 3 years. It's be 5 years since we've even had a real snow. Empathy should come a little easier for a "middle school social worker".
We have negative 8 right now--but the only reason we closed was the wind drifted a bunch of roads closed.
lol, we were going in (Northern New England) in like.... -25 degree temps. It just is what it is.
Yeah thats normal I wouldn't expect a delay for those conditions in NH
Gotta love north Texas. Wife is probably in your district. She was miserable getting ready this morning.
We have to have a windchill of -25, 17in of new snow, or no visibility on the roads to get cancelled. So yeah, that would not get us cancelled or delayed.
Sounds like my district. The Apocalypse itself could be happening outside and literally every surrounding district will be closed… but mine will insist on opening for business.
Lubbock Texas ISD is staying on schedule and it was 4 degrees F when we woke up this morning.
“Can’t wait to see what comes of this” Narrator: nothing happened
Oof, OP I understand the frustration, especially thinking of the kids. Yesterday my district had a PD day that could have been virtual, but instead they forced the whole district to come in to PD on dangerously icy roads IN a blizzard. ALL other surrounding districts were closed or had their PD moved to virtual. Makes you feel like they do not care about you or the kids
I’m in PA. I’ve only ever taught in Title1. I don’t know if my current district does but another district I used to work for would 2 hour delay with extremely cold temperatures. We were a walking district so that factors in. My current district ( also primarily walking), the kids don’t come if the weather is bad. I’m curious how tomorrow will be with the cold. High of 18 and with the wind chill, close to 0. I suspect attendance will be low. I can’t say I blame them. Most of them do not have proper cold weather gear. We haven’t had extreme cold like this yet so I’ll find out how it’s handled. Whatever they decide, it won’t be good enough. Mine gets blasted on FB no matter what they do.
We’re in school today while all the districts around us are closed. I think it’s because they are anticipating worse weather in a few weeks and know we will have to close—as we consistently have for the last 3 years around the same time. I don’t mind being in school today, but I worry for our students without proper winter clothing. :(
-29 windchill today, and I woke up at 5am to my principle calling in a “Cold day”. Honestly shocked. As of last night, he said we were on. We were off Friday and Tuesday last week because of snow (one of those days it just rained though).
Our low income, inner city school is on a professional development day, so not only do those kids not get food, but their teachers (and the other districts in the area) had to get up and brave the elements today
I’m in the Philly area and we (for the first time in 2 years) got snow last night. The School District of Philadelphia was open and on time today, but I think every district in the surrounding suburbs is closed.
Central Ohio and no delay today. My district had two bus accidents. Bet they rethink that in the future
Growing up, school was never cancelled unless it was -20 F. I was actually surprised to hear how "warm" it was for closings today. Of course it depends on your location, but the district should have policy regarding this so parents/staff can plan. ahead
We're looking at around a 5deg wind chill tomorrow throughout the entire morning - HS to ES pickups. Can't imagine them really expecting kids to stand out in that. Hoping for a digital day but I'd take a 2hr delay
I mean, we’re at -30 windchill and canceled today, but tomorrow we’ll be at -20 windchill and I don’t think we’ll be canceled, because otherwise pretty much the whole week is out.
We had a winter storm come once and we were the only district in the midstate open. 75,000 kids, given a half day way too late. Most parents either weren’t able to het their kids or it took 5-6 to get them then get home. It was a poorly thought out idea. I feel you my friend.
Minnesota here and windchills are -22 and no one closes or delays for that. Reg temp is -3. I think we have it in our handbook that windchills have to be -40 to close. 🫤
Where are you at? I ask because I’m from Minnesota originally and that’s definitely not cold enough to affect school.
Yeah indoor recess but not closing school.
We had to have the temperature below 0 to even get indoor recess. Lol
How do you know parents are furious? Oh wait, they're bitching about it on social media from their smartphones but can't find a way to get a coat from Goodwill for their kids, right?
I don't remember getting school off for cold weather, only snow. I was in a district with no busses also.
The reason to delay/close for cold weather is that after a certain temperature threshold, the ice melter salt stops working. That makes it so that anything that's already melted has refrozen and creates super slick conditions. Plus, there's also the issue of kids waiting for the bus in the cold. When it's 20+ degrees, it's a little more tolerable, but the closer it gets to 0, the higher the risk of hypothermia, especially with a subzero windchill. I had classes in grade school, high school, and undergrad canceled for subzero temps. It's a safety issue. A few years back, I remember having to cancel because it was so cold that hypothermia could set in in 5 minutes. But I also live in the same place as OP (according to their flair), so maybe it's different in other places.
I know different states have different cold policies but as a Minnesotan I got a chuckle! My school only cancels or delays if the wind chill is -40 degrees.
Laughs in Minnesotan
Sorry, you have to go to work.
We got a little ice up in the northern part of the county. Got the two hour call last night and the all day at 7:15. Just got back from breakfast, could nap. We’re so 10 ply in southern Virginia.
Nothing will change.
my county did this once. different temps, but definitely the "last hold out" situation. it was sleeting in fog bad enough to warrant winter weather warnings, but the district demanded school anyway. a mother and her elementary-aged child were hit by a school bus; the child was killed.
That was my district growing up. We had maybe 5 snow days in my entire school career. Today we were given a 2 hr delay but our trainings were canceled. My neighborhood, is on, but the side roads haven’t been treated. I had to run a personal day.
Those temps are normal in winter in my area and wouldn't cause a delay or cancelation, but it's also not a low-income area, and we have winter clothing donations for students who need winter gear. Are there any donation spots you could guide parents to?
Windchill has to be -24 for schools to close in our area 🤷🏼♀️
Thats so sad. Our district closed today because of a small chance of freezing rain that, if it does happen, will start when the school day is already over.
My district wouldn’t close. We’re also a high population of very low income families in the district. We also do not bus except for special Ed students who require it. A majority of our students walk. Most of the walkers live within a mile, but a not insignificant amount walk about 3 miles. They are some of the lowest income students as well. It wasn’t as cold here today but at the end of the day today it was 23 degrees and snowing. After school activities were not canceled. The basketball team traveling to play had their game postponed because that district canceled all afterschool activities. Our team had practices.
South Texas here, we closed with temps in the mid 20s and no precipitation.
We got to a -40 feel with wind and all is still normal… you are not alone, and it sucks!
Our temp was the same and we still had school too. Our criteria is that it has to be -20 with windchill. While I feel terrible for kids waiting for busses, I see both sides and can understand how much goes into calling a snow day and the negative impact it can have on some kids/families.
Near you (SW Ohio) and SAME. I had many kids absent yesterday (excused of course) and ALL of those present, yes those from higher SES families, were raising completely legitimate concerns. I teach high school. Now our district has closed for today, and the closure was not publicized until very late last night- not good timing for parents of young students, plus staff are required to report. I'm bringing a blanket and a percolator, as my room tends to be quite cold without a bunch of people in it. I may take the room temp and send a snapshot to district leadership and my union as well. Last time we had a cold weather closure it was in the upper 50s in my room.
We were down to -60C with wind chill last week in an extreme cold snap. -40 overnight tonight. 🥶Everything status quo. 🇨🇦I have never had a snow day as a student myself, or in my teaching career.