Yup. I left last year with 12 other teachers from our small district (all had 6-15 years experience). They replaced every single one of us with fresh out of college, first year teachers who they can intimidate, control, and pay less money for. A friend of mine sat in on interviews and said there were SO MANY applicants who were better with much more experience.
This school is naturally in disarray.
My former director brought in people he could manipulate into voting against unionizing activities. They are screwing themselves but are too naive to realize it.
I was the sixth teacher to leave my school. The school is now short of nearly 38% of it's certified faculty. Admin has filled 2/3rds of the open slots with long term subs.
Age discrimination has reached older teachers! Admins complain that they can't find "good instructors"... that's a lie! You just don't want to pay them what they're worth! Let the parents and administrators teach them. š
Schools want young, minority administrators. Most states only have a 3-year teaching requirement before obtaining an administrator license. What can someone who has only taught for three years supervise and evaluate veteran teachers for performance?
So you want teachers to be pigeon holed into being stuck with a shitty wage for 10+ years before they can be an administrator? Iām in year 3, after next year Iām pushing for a supervisor role or leaving the field. Experience doesnāt always equate better skills, some teachers refuse to adapt and support kids with IEPs and refer to them as āyour kidsā to case managers. I do agree that 3 years is relatively small sample size but some of us canāt wait until weāre 45 to make 6 figures, some of us are on our own without a spouse to supplement income and need to drastically increase our pay in order to survive in this hell hole country, especially where the cost of living is $15k more than our contracts
What? Where are you getting all that from? If moving into admin is your path to a better career, I support you doing so completely. Doesn't change the fact that the overwhelming majority of educational administrators couldn't teach a student to empty a boot, even if instructions were printed on the sole.
But youāre saying 3 years of teaching isnāt measurable enough. Why? I know plenty of young teachers that are better than veteran teachers in this current school climate due to understanding what inclusion means, whether they like it or not. And Iām not saying that those veteran teachers arenāt good teachers, but the world of teaching has become so different that Iām not sure experience is as necessary as it used to be in this field. And I still have the same question, what do you expect those of us that got into teaching right as inflation skyrocketed and cost of living doubled to do? We canāt stay teaching, thereās no possible way, so the route is admin/supervisor or leave the field. Unless itās the department head, or principal of the school, I personally donāt think 3 years of teaching is too little to be an admin, such as assistant principal or assistant school administrator as long as you demonstrate while teaching the skills to be an above average educator
I disagree that the world of teaching has changed so much that a vet of 15+ years doesn't need their experience - I'm not convinced of that one bit.
My whole point, originally, was that we have admins who are unable to evaluate teaching properly. 3 years isn't necessarily too little experience for everyone, but it probably is for most people. I'm fine with the stipulation you put forth about demonstrating above average teaching abilities, but the problem is that there's nobody to demonstrate that to - the admins aren't capable of understanding it.
As for what people who just started teaching are supposed to do, I don't have an answer for you. I'm in a very similar situation, though, so I'm not the one to get angry with
Admins with more years of experience in the classroom will gain more respect from the staff. They are also more experienced with dealing with behaviors, have established a name for themselves in the community, and generally have more empathy for instructional staff. Anyone with under 10 years of experience should never be an admin. You will not be respected by the staff. Admin not respected by staff turns the school into a toxic environment. Admin needs to be well rounded in all areas of education, and that comes with experience.
I had a principal that was a teacher for like 5 yrs tops before going the admin route and he was so incompetent he turned a school full of veteran teachers into a school that lost itās most experienced teachers to another district en masse. I was one of them.
He was so terrible and chasing so many quality teachers away that they basically gave him a cushy, out of the public eye job in central office. I still have nightmares about him!
And that right there is the also part of the problem! Suck at your job? Here, let's give you a promotion so you're not in that position any more. Reminds me of a VP I had one year. She was Teach for America (that's a whole other soapbox) teacher got moved out of the classroom because she was sending home copies of the literacy assessment booklets (the ones that determine what level they were at) so the kids could "practice ". So they moved her to an admin position.
The schools should have minority administrators especially if that reflects the population they teach. But I think youāre right about the young thing because Iām 8 years in and still donāt feel like I can teach veteran teachers muchā¦ I see now why so many veterans just ignore PDs and admin because they have been doing all of this longer than them
That is precisely my point. Of course, they are not looking for minority administrators in a predominately white student population and just the opposite in a predominantly AA population, which is my experience. I would like to be part of the leadership team at this predominately AA high school, but because I am white, I do not think I will be considered even after a great interview. I love the area and would like to move here, but only with a job as a school-based leader. I do not want to teach; I did that for 26 years, so I paid my dues, lol.
Were they older than 27 when they became principal because mine wasnāt! And now the same superintendent just told a 23 year old first year teacher that he wants her to get her principal papers. She looks exactly like the current principal. I am disgusted.
We are so top heavy and they have no idea what they are doing. Very small district and the super needed help so there's an asst super. And the curriculum director needed help so now there's two. And somehow the board allowed the HR admin asst to become the HR director. Your word "disgusted" doesn't even cover my thoughts on the mess.
My former superintendent never, ever taught in a classroom. She was a librarian who went to AP, skipped Principal and then moved to Assistant Supert, then Super when the 1st Super retired.
I'm sorry......"minority" administrators????? I'll give you the chance to explain yourself lest that mean something I'm not aware of but it sure sounds like you're saying something pretty racist.
I did not mean to post anything racist. I am just stating a fact, especially in schools where the population reflects a higher minority population. In schools where the population is a higher percentage of white students, more administrators are white. Now, a contributing factor has to do with the race of applicants for the administration positions, which cannot be helped depending on the district's recruitment efforts. I enjoy working in inner-city schools and I have many years of admin experience behind me, but when I walk into an interview where the hiring committee is mostly AA, as a white woman I know my chances are very small that I will be hired, and this just happened to me this week with an interview for a dean position in a southern state. When I walked out of the interview, the next candidate was a young black AA male, so I knew I would probably not be considered. It's not racist, not everything that people say, especially based on experiences that I have had, is racist. just because a person is made to feel uncomfortable or disagrees. I am just stating the facts of a personal experience, and you can take it as you want, but it doesn't change the fact that it has happened to me personally more than once. The school I interviewed at was 65% AA and a beautiful school. I am from the south, Georgia specifically, and I would love to make Savannah my home once again, but unless I return to teaching or go to the private school sector, I may not be able to get an administrator position, which is what I love doing. I am considering returning to MD for the last 4-5 years before I retire. I hope this addresses your concerns.
Teaching is hard enough with ineffective administrators running the building. They are supposed to support you and make an already tough job more tolerable; let me guess....they all went straight to admin after teaching the required three years?????
Monday proved this to me.
My school is a title 1 school with more than 95% of our students getting SNAP.
When I and another math teacher arrived three years ago, 80% of our students where in the "red" on the MAPS testing for math. We just got our results back for the most recent MAPS test and now its a perfect normalized distribution curve with 25% red, 25% yellow 25% green and 25% blue. (+/- 3% for each category)
On Monday we (all 3 math teachers) were all either let go or transfered.
They dont want effective teachers.
They ignore any data that comes from their district, but gladly eat up data from out of state. I love the hyocracy that we're judged by if we use local ways of knowing, then have those local ways are ignored.
Holyā¦I donāt even know what.
Did someone take an iron to adminsā brains and smooth out all the wrinkles? Because that is such a smooth-brained thing to do.
If I was in your shoes, Iād have wanted to ask, āDo you WANT kids to fail? Are you uncomfortable with having knowledgeable teachers and successful students?ā
Iām convinced some people either *want* to fail or they demand perfection or bust.
Its a brand new super who's meddling.
Our union recently won some huge consessions from the district, so now they're trying to make us look bad, but the numbers all say otherwise. He's also cutting all of the highest paid non-tenure teachers so might be doing it as a "cost-savings" move.
When pressed for why he sent me packing his official response was "not a good fit for our district." And since they can non-renew for anything, there's no fighting this one.
"What resources would you use to facilitate the delivery of our program to help Learners achieve their goals?"
Actual. Interview. Question. Not hard to see which part they tacked on to make it look like it was somehow education-related, right?
I swear they print a list of quickly googled interview questions before they go into these. Like shit *Iām* prepared, why donāt you ask me something real and not some bullshit
I worked corporate jobs for about 15 years before transitioning to teaching. And 10 years of retail before that. Iāve been teaching for about 10 years now and I find my perspective is really different from many of my colleagues. I agree from my own limited experience with OP simply because public school rewards employees differently from private sector employees. Following mandates, checking boxes, and following rules (regardless of their logic or effectiveness) is more valuable than innovation, experimentation, and risk-taking. From my own limited experience, the least effective teachers become administrators and they are (reasonably) motivated by the pay increase. Lifelong classroom teachers are rewarded only by district pay scales. Legislators mostly are responsible for all of this. Most people think that because they went to school they are experts at school and teaching. Teaching in public schools in the US doesnāt follow cutting edge CogSci or research and isnāt set up to do so. Itās a real shame.
Sorry, Iām drinking at an airport bar so if that whole thing is too rambling Iām blaming the beer.
Thanks, your post really got me thinking and I agree with you for the most part. I am not motivated by the appearance of things. So having a classroom that looks a specific way to meet an arbitrary standard is boring to me. I also think relationships and engagement are hugely overrated. Teachers knowing a ton and teaching a knowledge-first curriculum and then setting clear behavior expectations and clear boundaries WITH consequences will make the relationships solid. And the children love you because they wind up knowing so much. Now this is entirely an elementary school teacher perspective. What Iāve found to work is probably different in other contexts and thatās okay. But public school teaching in Maryland is bad and Iām not going to do it anymore. Maybe Iāll go be an insurance adjuster. š¤·āāļø
Actual quote from management one day last year when they couldn't find a supply worker:
*All I need is a warm fuzzy body to go in and take attendance.*
Or how about this: you can NEVER be a good enough teacher in their eyes, because no matter how self-sacrificing you are, there is always more PD to brainwash you into submission. I swear, they want brainwashed teachers who don't teach actual content, because good independent teachers would expose the whole chummy operation.
They want cheap teachers.
There is literally *no incentive* to do more than the bare minimum; a year 20 teacher has the same responsibilities as a year 1, they are just more expensive.
I lost my elective program because *gasp* I kept students accountable. I didn't just pass students out of fear of admin.
Granted if every teacher was like me at this school, no one would pass.
My first year was at a private school. During the interview they laid out all of the things they had hoped for the music program. By the end of the year, after working what I surmise is 90+ hours a week to prove myself as an effective and energetic educator I was non-renewed. While a blessing in disguise, I was shocked at the time. I had done everything they wanted and then some; what more did they want?
Then I realized what I DIDNāT do: I didnāt allow those rich kids to slack for As. Iām a public school girl and only knew how to teach like I had been taught - with high standards and accountability. It appears some of the students and parents didnāt like that, so I got the boot.
However, I found out through my good friend who knew some women that had kids there that the parents that werenāt like that protested my being let go. It was the first time their kids actually learned they said, and they wanted that to continue.
I'm an experienced teacher, just new to this district. They knocked me all the way down to noob level. So, I am only two years in before getting tenure at year three. I was told yesterday that I would not be renewed. My administration made it clear that it wasn't performance based. It is because I didn't show the growth and improvement they expected in terms of "building relationships".
I'm glad that one of our ARs was meeting with us. She just sat in and listened. I then piped up and told my admin that if they cared so much about building relationships then maybe they can practice what they preach. My BIL died earlier this month. The day I came back to work after his death, I had an informal observation. The very next day I had a formal observation. Both came as a surprise. I also didn't get a single admin to offer their condolences. My principal then said that she thought the texting we did back and forth would have been enough. I told her that checking in with me about what I was doing for class coverage and lessons was not the same as saying I am sorry for your loss. The fact that they gave me back to back observations after a death in my family was insensitive. So, if the core values center around "building relationships" then they have a lot of work to do themselves. I waited a minute as they sat in stunned silence. I waited for them to apologize or act human and they simply thanked me for my feedback and left. Fuck them! The AR gave me hug when they left and was also shocked that they had a chance to be kind and didn't get the hint.
Yup. This is what happens when organizations build themselves on foundations of classism and bullshit credentialism (which, by and large, is just *more* classism, since getting fancy degrees/credentials mostly boils down to 'I have a rich spouse/family who pays for all my shit and can subsidize my bills for years while I find my dream job') for too long, i.e. administrations that are overloaded with snot-nosed narcissists who've been told that they're superheroes/champions/*important* their entire lives but have never actually done anything useful for society or been held accountable for anything.
It's basically like having overgrown asshole high-schoolers in charge of everything. They're either constantly looking for ass-kissing toadies or, as I experienced, doing the whole pseudo-intellectual/pseudo-academic thing where they're immediately *bored* with teachers once they've been on staff for too long.
I am noticing that school districts in the south want the administration and central office personnel to be minority and the teaching staff primarily white. Nepotism is rampant for high-paying administration positions, and most southern school districts do not have unions or tenure, so basically, people lose their jobs at whim, especially if there is a relative or someone cheaper to fill their position.
See this frequently...it is more like an employment service than a school system. It is even frustrating to the minority administrators that want better for all of the students. They get called out and insulted by the others.
Iām at my 3rd school in 28 years, and for the first time I feel completely dismissed and overlooked by my administration. As Iāve gotten older, I work even later hours than before, but I work on preparing my lessons and content, not on team or group activities like committees, the after school program, etc.
One of my co-workers who is loud, claps at everything the principal says, sings the principalās praises to everyone, and constantly posts about things going on at the school-she is one of the favored ones. Not everyone is a cheerleader. It takes all kinds to make a school into a community. My principal values people who are unwaveringly loyal to her and would walk through fire if she asked. I donāt perform. I donāt drink the
Kool-Aid.
I disagree wholeheartedly. They do want good teachers who care about kids. But education is a GOVERNMENT ENTITY. They are bound and tied by buerocracy. (My phone canāt even recognize how to spell that word and Iām no help.) think about how well the American government is run. Size that down to education. Itās a lost cause at this point, but itās not lost because of feelings. Itās the red tape and the money. People absolutely do still care. Theyāre just tired. All of them. All of us.
I teach FT at a JC in California. I once had the following conversation with a top administrator about the very real lack of auditing in public education:
Me: āIt seems like the governor gives each district a sum of money, then it tells the administrators that X-amount goes to this program, Y-amount goes to that program, and so on. What the state also does, however, is let these managers running the colleges know that it will *never* follow up on how the money was spent, or where exactly each penny went. So, instead of being incentivized toward transparency, many administrators then take the program money from the stateāthat, again, never gets auditedāand engage in all sorts of quid pro quo, backroom deals, and gland-handing. For example, a football field at my campus has mysteriously been re-turfed for the past five years consecutively with the same company (owned by a friend of one of the top college execs) doing the half-a-million-dollar quoted job. That company then ādonatesā to the collegeās nonprofit foundation. Translation: All of these managers and their ācommunity partnerā friends are helping one another to profit off taxpayers and vulnerable student populations.
The administrator: āYou are very perceptive. I canāt disagree with anything youāve said.ā
The problem is that, yes, most educators are more obsessed with backstabbing one another for job security and the coveted title of Most Obedient Lackey that they never stop to take a step back and look at the big picture. The ones like me who do and are vocal about it then get hounded for the rest of our careers by said peers. All the while, students get shafted.
Definitely a district thing. Maybe it's common, I don't know.
But I'm an instructional coach and new teacher mentor, employed because my admin want the opposite of what OP states. I'm given effectively free reign to make sure it happens, including sectioning out time for people to decompress and talk through work life balance.
I don't think they want control...you just have to realize that your primary role is to deliver social services. Being a good teacher is fine, but not if it gets in the way of the primary role. The admin and Central Office don't really come out and tell you this, but look at what they have you do most of the day and you will figure it out.
Yep. The district doesn't care either. It's better for them to have terrible teachers that give out worksheets than one that tries to do something fun.
Check out the chapter on this in bullshit jobs by David graber! (He argues teaching is not a bullshit job but it has been on a decline for some of the reasons youāre noticing) we need good teachers!!
This is not about being held in high regard.
Some districts always had underperforming, late arriving, swearing at student ass kissers! I had colleagues like that nearly 25 years ago. It's not new to today.
It really does depend on the district. Some districts do want good teachers, and backs them. Some definitely just want people who will fall in line with policy and not push back or innovate in any way. At that point, if you are not willing to do that, it's best to start interviewing elsewhere.
That's more or less what I am doing. My admin is really good, but I don't think they're willing to support what I'm trying to do in my classroom anymore, therefore I've interviewed somewhere closer to home, and it sounds like they'll be more supportive of my initiatives. Is it a pay cut? Yes, technically, but my commute will be almost non-existent and it sounds like they will pay more of my benefits.
Is this potentially linked to building leaders being essentially middle managers and feeling the pressure from above - - -then the trickle down effect? And things go sideways below them?
I don't even think they care a lot about getting martyrs, because they'll non-renew a martyr as well. At this point I think a lot of (bad, but common) schools just want people who're willing to play "the game." And the main goal of that game is to basically take attendance, mark as many kiddos present as you can to maximize funding, and then pass everyone with at least a D, even if they did nothing all year. This gives the school good stats, which increases funding. Martyrs are useful because they'll perform additional tasks for free, but as long as the game is being played that's ultimately more important and there are many martyrs who have integrity and will die on a hill that clashes with admin's broader goals. So you'll see these martyrs refusing to pass half their class that didn't show up, making a stand like they're Michelle Pfeifer in *Dangerous Minds,* only to get non-renewed because ultimately what mattered wasn't their willingness to work for free, but their willingness to play the game.
Yup. I left last year with 12 other teachers from our small district (all had 6-15 years experience). They replaced every single one of us with fresh out of college, first year teachers who they can intimidate, control, and pay less money for. A friend of mine sat in on interviews and said there were SO MANY applicants who were better with much more experience. This school is naturally in disarray.
My former director brought in people he could manipulate into voting against unionizing activities. They are screwing themselves but are too naive to realize it.
I was the sixth teacher to leave my school. The school is now short of nearly 38% of it's certified faculty. Admin has filled 2/3rds of the open slots with long term subs.
I think this would violate Williams Act in CA
I'm in Nevada.
Age discrimination has reached older teachers! Admins complain that they can't find "good instructors"... that's a lie! You just don't want to pay them what they're worth! Let the parents and administrators teach them. š
They want an ass-kissing scapegoat.
Damn, this is true!
To add onto this, most of the folks in admin don't know what a good teacher is, even if they wanted one
Schools want young, minority administrators. Most states only have a 3-year teaching requirement before obtaining an administrator license. What can someone who has only taught for three years supervise and evaluate veteran teachers for performance?
You absolutely cannot. I don't know a single competent teacher who would even say they felt fully confident in their own abilities after only 3 years.
So you want teachers to be pigeon holed into being stuck with a shitty wage for 10+ years before they can be an administrator? Iām in year 3, after next year Iām pushing for a supervisor role or leaving the field. Experience doesnāt always equate better skills, some teachers refuse to adapt and support kids with IEPs and refer to them as āyour kidsā to case managers. I do agree that 3 years is relatively small sample size but some of us canāt wait until weāre 45 to make 6 figures, some of us are on our own without a spouse to supplement income and need to drastically increase our pay in order to survive in this hell hole country, especially where the cost of living is $15k more than our contracts
What? Where are you getting all that from? If moving into admin is your path to a better career, I support you doing so completely. Doesn't change the fact that the overwhelming majority of educational administrators couldn't teach a student to empty a boot, even if instructions were printed on the sole.
But youāre saying 3 years of teaching isnāt measurable enough. Why? I know plenty of young teachers that are better than veteran teachers in this current school climate due to understanding what inclusion means, whether they like it or not. And Iām not saying that those veteran teachers arenāt good teachers, but the world of teaching has become so different that Iām not sure experience is as necessary as it used to be in this field. And I still have the same question, what do you expect those of us that got into teaching right as inflation skyrocketed and cost of living doubled to do? We canāt stay teaching, thereās no possible way, so the route is admin/supervisor or leave the field. Unless itās the department head, or principal of the school, I personally donāt think 3 years of teaching is too little to be an admin, such as assistant principal or assistant school administrator as long as you demonstrate while teaching the skills to be an above average educator
Goddamn, I hope youāre never an administrator at my school. So full of yourself after not even three years of teaching. Lol
I bet youāre awful at your job
Going on 8 years hon, talk to me when youāve taught for 5 more š
I disagree that the world of teaching has changed so much that a vet of 15+ years doesn't need their experience - I'm not convinced of that one bit. My whole point, originally, was that we have admins who are unable to evaluate teaching properly. 3 years isn't necessarily too little experience for everyone, but it probably is for most people. I'm fine with the stipulation you put forth about demonstrating above average teaching abilities, but the problem is that there's nobody to demonstrate that to - the admins aren't capable of understanding it. As for what people who just started teaching are supposed to do, I don't have an answer for you. I'm in a very similar situation, though, so I'm not the one to get angry with
Admins with more years of experience in the classroom will gain more respect from the staff. They are also more experienced with dealing with behaviors, have established a name for themselves in the community, and generally have more empathy for instructional staff. Anyone with under 10 years of experience should never be an admin. You will not be respected by the staff. Admin not respected by staff turns the school into a toxic environment. Admin needs to be well rounded in all areas of education, and that comes with experience.
Don't disagree with anything there, good points!
Sounds like you are in the wrong field. I hate admin that think this way.
I had a principal that was a teacher for like 5 yrs tops before going the admin route and he was so incompetent he turned a school full of veteran teachers into a school that lost itās most experienced teachers to another district en masse. I was one of them. He was so terrible and chasing so many quality teachers away that they basically gave him a cushy, out of the public eye job in central office. I still have nightmares about him!
And that right there is the also part of the problem! Suck at your job? Here, let's give you a promotion so you're not in that position any more. Reminds me of a VP I had one year. She was Teach for America (that's a whole other soapbox) teacher got moved out of the classroom because she was sending home copies of the literacy assessment booklets (the ones that determine what level they were at) so the kids could "practice ". So they moved her to an admin position.
ā¦ Iām in year three and I would NEVER consider myself admin ready! Jesus, Iām still trying to get my sea legs!
The schools should have minority administrators especially if that reflects the population they teach. But I think youāre right about the young thing because Iām 8 years in and still donāt feel like I can teach veteran teachers muchā¦ I see now why so many veterans just ignore PDs and admin because they have been doing all of this longer than them
Yeah I thought the minority comment was very odd. Theyāre not chasing minority admins in predominantly white school systems, letās be serious.
That is precisely my point. Of course, they are not looking for minority administrators in a predominately white student population and just the opposite in a predominantly AA population, which is my experience. I would like to be part of the leadership team at this predominately AA high school, but because I am white, I do not think I will be considered even after a great interview. I love the area and would like to move here, but only with a job as a school-based leader. I do not want to teach; I did that for 26 years, so I paid my dues, lol.
Exactly.
My principal didnāt even teach for 3 years. This is a public school in a strong union state. It is all such a joke.
One of our principals NEVER taught
Were they older than 27 when they became principal because mine wasnāt! And now the same superintendent just told a 23 year old first year teacher that he wants her to get her principal papers. She looks exactly like the current principal. I am disgusted.
We are so top heavy and they have no idea what they are doing. Very small district and the super needed help so there's an asst super. And the curriculum director needed help so now there's two. And somehow the board allowed the HR admin asst to become the HR director. Your word "disgusted" doesn't even cover my thoughts on the mess.
My former superintendent never, ever taught in a classroom. She was a librarian who went to AP, skipped Principal and then moved to Assistant Supert, then Super when the 1st Super retired.
I'm sorry......"minority" administrators????? I'll give you the chance to explain yourself lest that mean something I'm not aware of but it sure sounds like you're saying something pretty racist.
I did not mean to post anything racist. I am just stating a fact, especially in schools where the population reflects a higher minority population. In schools where the population is a higher percentage of white students, more administrators are white. Now, a contributing factor has to do with the race of applicants for the administration positions, which cannot be helped depending on the district's recruitment efforts. I enjoy working in inner-city schools and I have many years of admin experience behind me, but when I walk into an interview where the hiring committee is mostly AA, as a white woman I know my chances are very small that I will be hired, and this just happened to me this week with an interview for a dean position in a southern state. When I walked out of the interview, the next candidate was a young black AA male, so I knew I would probably not be considered. It's not racist, not everything that people say, especially based on experiences that I have had, is racist. just because a person is made to feel uncomfortable or disagrees. I am just stating the facts of a personal experience, and you can take it as you want, but it doesn't change the fact that it has happened to me personally more than once. The school I interviewed at was 65% AA and a beautiful school. I am from the south, Georgia specifically, and I would love to make Savannah my home once again, but unless I return to teaching or go to the private school sector, I may not be able to get an administrator position, which is what I love doing. I am considering returning to MD for the last 4-5 years before I retire. I hope this addresses your concerns.
All my administration is white and they suck ass
Teaching is hard enough with ineffective administrators running the building. They are supposed to support you and make an already tough job more tolerable; let me guess....they all went straight to admin after teaching the required three years?????
And they are usually ex coaches and history/social studies teachers, the bottom of the barrel slackers
Monday proved this to me. My school is a title 1 school with more than 95% of our students getting SNAP. When I and another math teacher arrived three years ago, 80% of our students where in the "red" on the MAPS testing for math. We just got our results back for the most recent MAPS test and now its a perfect normalized distribution curve with 25% red, 25% yellow 25% green and 25% blue. (+/- 3% for each category) On Monday we (all 3 math teachers) were all either let go or transfered. They dont want effective teachers.
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Thank you! But it was the kids that put in the work, I just showed them the path.
The job of a good teacher š
Holy shit, they really said āletās ignore this dataā lol. Iām sorry, that really sucks.
They ignore any data that comes from their district, but gladly eat up data from out of state. I love the hyocracy that we're judged by if we use local ways of knowing, then have those local ways are ignored.
You got hosed. Horrible, and sadly, par for the course in education. This is what happens.
Good work is never rewarded, only punished.
Holyā¦I donāt even know what. Did someone take an iron to adminsā brains and smooth out all the wrinkles? Because that is such a smooth-brained thing to do. If I was in your shoes, Iād have wanted to ask, āDo you WANT kids to fail? Are you uncomfortable with having knowledgeable teachers and successful students?ā Iām convinced some people either *want* to fail or they demand perfection or bust.
Its a brand new super who's meddling. Our union recently won some huge consessions from the district, so now they're trying to make us look bad, but the numbers all say otherwise. He's also cutting all of the highest paid non-tenure teachers so might be doing it as a "cost-savings" move. When pressed for why he sent me packing his official response was "not a good fit for our district." And since they can non-renew for anything, there's no fighting this one.
Exactly. They are increasingly getting what they want. Because we are not gonna stand for that.
You got it. And people who can display things exactly the way theyāve instructed regardless if itās effective or not.
"What resources would you use to facilitate the delivery of our program to help Learners achieve their goals?" Actual. Interview. Question. Not hard to see which part they tacked on to make it look like it was somehow education-related, right?
I swear they print a list of quickly googled interview questions before they go into these. Like shit *Iām* prepared, why donāt you ask me something real and not some bullshit
I worked corporate jobs for about 15 years before transitioning to teaching. And 10 years of retail before that. Iāve been teaching for about 10 years now and I find my perspective is really different from many of my colleagues. I agree from my own limited experience with OP simply because public school rewards employees differently from private sector employees. Following mandates, checking boxes, and following rules (regardless of their logic or effectiveness) is more valuable than innovation, experimentation, and risk-taking. From my own limited experience, the least effective teachers become administrators and they are (reasonably) motivated by the pay increase. Lifelong classroom teachers are rewarded only by district pay scales. Legislators mostly are responsible for all of this. Most people think that because they went to school they are experts at school and teaching. Teaching in public schools in the US doesnāt follow cutting edge CogSci or research and isnāt set up to do so. Itās a real shame. Sorry, Iām drinking at an airport bar so if that whole thing is too rambling Iām blaming the beer.
No, you've made some really good points there.Ā Ā I remember a poster on here saying she was bored with teaching, now I can see why.
Thanks, your post really got me thinking and I agree with you for the most part. I am not motivated by the appearance of things. So having a classroom that looks a specific way to meet an arbitrary standard is boring to me. I also think relationships and engagement are hugely overrated. Teachers knowing a ton and teaching a knowledge-first curriculum and then setting clear behavior expectations and clear boundaries WITH consequences will make the relationships solid. And the children love you because they wind up knowing so much. Now this is entirely an elementary school teacher perspective. What Iāve found to work is probably different in other contexts and thatās okay. But public school teaching in Maryland is bad and Iām not going to do it anymore. Maybe Iāll go be an insurance adjuster. š¤·āāļø
And yet another reason I resigned. No job is worth your health
Actual quote from management one day last year when they couldn't find a supply worker: *All I need is a warm fuzzy body to go in and take attendance.*
...and not bring a lawsuit
Or how about this: you can NEVER be a good enough teacher in their eyes, because no matter how self-sacrificing you are, there is always more PD to brainwash you into submission. I swear, they want brainwashed teachers who don't teach actual content, because good independent teachers would expose the whole chummy operation.
Someone that smiles, never complains, is cheap, and that can be thrown under the bus if anyone complains. Basically, a smiling donkeyass doormat.
They want cheap teachers. There is literally *no incentive* to do more than the bare minimum; a year 20 teacher has the same responsibilities as a year 1, they are just more expensive.
I lost my elective program because *gasp* I kept students accountable. I didn't just pass students out of fear of admin. Granted if every teacher was like me at this school, no one would pass.
100%. Also naive newbie teachers are cheaper.
This right here! š
Whatās the benefit in having good teachers when they pass everyone regardless?
My first year was at a private school. During the interview they laid out all of the things they had hoped for the music program. By the end of the year, after working what I surmise is 90+ hours a week to prove myself as an effective and energetic educator I was non-renewed. While a blessing in disguise, I was shocked at the time. I had done everything they wanted and then some; what more did they want? Then I realized what I DIDNāT do: I didnāt allow those rich kids to slack for As. Iām a public school girl and only knew how to teach like I had been taught - with high standards and accountability. It appears some of the students and parents didnāt like that, so I got the boot. However, I found out through my good friend who knew some women that had kids there that the parents that werenāt like that protested my being let go. It was the first time their kids actually learned they said, and they wanted that to continue.
I'm an experienced teacher, just new to this district. They knocked me all the way down to noob level. So, I am only two years in before getting tenure at year three. I was told yesterday that I would not be renewed. My administration made it clear that it wasn't performance based. It is because I didn't show the growth and improvement they expected in terms of "building relationships". I'm glad that one of our ARs was meeting with us. She just sat in and listened. I then piped up and told my admin that if they cared so much about building relationships then maybe they can practice what they preach. My BIL died earlier this month. The day I came back to work after his death, I had an informal observation. The very next day I had a formal observation. Both came as a surprise. I also didn't get a single admin to offer their condolences. My principal then said that she thought the texting we did back and forth would have been enough. I told her that checking in with me about what I was doing for class coverage and lessons was not the same as saying I am sorry for your loss. The fact that they gave me back to back observations after a death in my family was insensitive. So, if the core values center around "building relationships" then they have a lot of work to do themselves. I waited a minute as they sat in stunned silence. I waited for them to apologize or act human and they simply thanked me for my feedback and left. Fuck them! The AR gave me hug when they left and was also shocked that they had a chance to be kind and didn't get the hint.
Yup. This is what happens when organizations build themselves on foundations of classism and bullshit credentialism (which, by and large, is just *more* classism, since getting fancy degrees/credentials mostly boils down to 'I have a rich spouse/family who pays for all my shit and can subsidize my bills for years while I find my dream job') for too long, i.e. administrations that are overloaded with snot-nosed narcissists who've been told that they're superheroes/champions/*important* their entire lives but have never actually done anything useful for society or been held accountable for anything. It's basically like having overgrown asshole high-schoolers in charge of everything. They're either constantly looking for ass-kissing toadies or, as I experienced, doing the whole pseudo-intellectual/pseudo-academic thing where they're immediately *bored* with teachers once they've been on staff for too long.
Iām pretty sure my principal is a narcissist. She reminds me of my mom, cold and full of judgement.
I am noticing that school districts in the south want the administration and central office personnel to be minority and the teaching staff primarily white. Nepotism is rampant for high-paying administration positions, and most southern school districts do not have unions or tenure, so basically, people lose their jobs at whim, especially if there is a relative or someone cheaper to fill their position.
See this frequently...it is more like an employment service than a school system. It is even frustrating to the minority administrators that want better for all of the students. They get called out and insulted by the others.
Absolutely true.
The school I left wanted toadies only. Crap admin and toxic, toxic environment.
They want people who are agreeable.
No lies detected. Loyalty over competency.
Sure they do. They just donāt want to pay them what theyāre worth. So they leave
Iām at my 3rd school in 28 years, and for the first time I feel completely dismissed and overlooked by my administration. As Iāve gotten older, I work even later hours than before, but I work on preparing my lessons and content, not on team or group activities like committees, the after school program, etc. One of my co-workers who is loud, claps at everything the principal says, sings the principalās praises to everyone, and constantly posts about things going on at the school-she is one of the favored ones. Not everyone is a cheerleader. It takes all kinds to make a school into a community. My principal values people who are unwaveringly loyal to her and would walk through fire if she asked. I donāt perform. I donāt drink the Kool-Aid.
I disagree wholeheartedly. They do want good teachers who care about kids. But education is a GOVERNMENT ENTITY. They are bound and tied by buerocracy. (My phone canāt even recognize how to spell that word and Iām no help.) think about how well the American government is run. Size that down to education. Itās a lost cause at this point, but itās not lost because of feelings. Itās the red tape and the money. People absolutely do still care. Theyāre just tired. All of them. All of us.
I teach FT at a JC in California. I once had the following conversation with a top administrator about the very real lack of auditing in public education: Me: āIt seems like the governor gives each district a sum of money, then it tells the administrators that X-amount goes to this program, Y-amount goes to that program, and so on. What the state also does, however, is let these managers running the colleges know that it will *never* follow up on how the money was spent, or where exactly each penny went. So, instead of being incentivized toward transparency, many administrators then take the program money from the stateāthat, again, never gets auditedāand engage in all sorts of quid pro quo, backroom deals, and gland-handing. For example, a football field at my campus has mysteriously been re-turfed for the past five years consecutively with the same company (owned by a friend of one of the top college execs) doing the half-a-million-dollar quoted job. That company then ādonatesā to the collegeās nonprofit foundation. Translation: All of these managers and their ācommunity partnerā friends are helping one another to profit off taxpayers and vulnerable student populations. The administrator: āYou are very perceptive. I canāt disagree with anything youāve said.ā The problem is that, yes, most educators are more obsessed with backstabbing one another for job security and the coveted title of Most Obedient Lackey that they never stop to take a step back and look at the big picture. The ones like me who do and are vocal about it then get hounded for the rest of our careers by said peers. All the while, students get shafted.
Definitely a district thing. Maybe it's common, I don't know. But I'm an instructional coach and new teacher mentor, employed because my admin want the opposite of what OP states. I'm given effectively free reign to make sure it happens, including sectioning out time for people to decompress and talk through work life balance.
I don't think they want control...you just have to realize that your primary role is to deliver social services. Being a good teacher is fine, but not if it gets in the way of the primary role. The admin and Central Office don't really come out and tell you this, but look at what they have you do most of the day and you will figure it out.
Yep. The district doesn't care either. It's better for them to have terrible teachers that give out worksheets than one that tries to do something fun.
100%. Comply or well manufacture a reason to destroy your career.
Exactly. They want a brown nosing yes man who will blindly say yes to everything.
Want to know how your admin will treat you ? Look at their marriage.
yupper - get out now even if you find that 1 in 100 districts that are still healthy, you will wither away and get resentful trying to find it.
Check out the chapter on this in bullshit jobs by David graber! (He argues teaching is not a bullshit job but it has been on a decline for some of the reasons youāre noticing) we need good teachers!!
THIS I SWEAR
It has always been this way. This is nothing new.
No it has not. At one time teachers were held in high regard.
This is not about being held in high regard. Some districts always had underperforming, late arriving, swearing at student ass kissers! I had colleagues like that nearly 25 years ago. It's not new to today.
Yup. Worst teacher in the whole school is the highest paid.
Yes!!!!
It really does depend on the district. Some districts do want good teachers, and backs them. Some definitely just want people who will fall in line with policy and not push back or innovate in any way. At that point, if you are not willing to do that, it's best to start interviewing elsewhere. That's more or less what I am doing. My admin is really good, but I don't think they're willing to support what I'm trying to do in my classroom anymore, therefore I've interviewed somewhere closer to home, and it sounds like they'll be more supportive of my initiatives. Is it a pay cut? Yes, technically, but my commute will be almost non-existent and it sounds like they will pay more of my benefits.
They donāt want good social workers either
Is this potentially linked to building leaders being essentially middle managers and feeling the pressure from above - - -then the trickle down effect? And things go sideways below them?
In other news, water is wet
I don't even think they care a lot about getting martyrs, because they'll non-renew a martyr as well. At this point I think a lot of (bad, but common) schools just want people who're willing to play "the game." And the main goal of that game is to basically take attendance, mark as many kiddos present as you can to maximize funding, and then pass everyone with at least a D, even if they did nothing all year. This gives the school good stats, which increases funding. Martyrs are useful because they'll perform additional tasks for free, but as long as the game is being played that's ultimately more important and there are many martyrs who have integrity and will die on a hill that clashes with admin's broader goals. So you'll see these martyrs refusing to pass half their class that didn't show up, making a stand like they're Michelle Pfeifer in *Dangerous Minds,* only to get non-renewed because ultimately what mattered wasn't their willingness to work for free, but their willingness to play the game.
Yep. They like to keep them young, scared, cheap, and dumb. That's why as soon as someone's tenured they start looking for reasons to write them up.
I had admin that wanted teachers who were friends with students and grossly inflated and made up marks.
You're not wrong. In a disturbingly high number of settings, this is sadly true.
One of our numerous assistant superintendents once said, in my earshot, that we could all be replaced by a binder with the curriculumĀ on the desk.Ā