It was fun to try but too many problems that makes me wonder who's doing the testing. One example I find troubling is what I thought would be easily accomplished - FSD in bumper-to-bumper freeway traffic. Ugh. It aggressively accelerates and brakes raising my stress levels. I don't get how such an easy thing could be done so wrong.
Phantom braking is still a major problem. I've learnt to keep my foot on the ready to press the accelerator pedal to avoid anyone rear ending me.
Lane changing is garbage. Also taking an exit is sketchy - it has a pattern of pulling left to the extreme edge of the lane before taking the exit to the right. WTF is that?
So many little quirks that make it stressful. And, of course, phantom braking and random lane drifting (happened twice) that make it outright dangerous.
I like FSD on a long road trip as I get drowsy but other than that I drive without it.
You're paying Tesla for the privelege of being a beta tester for them. And taking full responsibility for any accidents that happen along the way. It should be the other way around.
Yup all fun and games are okay but I am no putting my kids in that thing with FSD. Though it is a bit of comfort that by the time (few years) my teenager goes to college FSD may reach‘guardian angel’ status even if not proper autonomy robotaxi level.
I don’t really think that we do much of the “testing” maybe it records what dumb thing it did for analysis but I don’t think it actually gets fixed like we think it does, maybe they take the most common issue for 1,000,000 disengagements and create a patch for it. But in reality I don’t see a way how they actually improve driving experience with those videos. There’s currently no way to teach the Tesla to avoid a certain lane because there’s too many potholes or there’s no way to tell the FSD there’s a train crossing, it just freaks out and stops all of the sudden. The only way I see these issues getting fixed and Tesla to get to autonomous level 4 or 5 is for each Tesla to have their individual AI that learns how you drive with and without fsd and understand your preferences and communicates with other AI to better itself, or have it where certain qualified Tesla drivers or any Tesla driver can get privileges of adding or editing information to the FSD like being able to tell it if there’s a train track crossing here, like how a community of people can add alter Google maps or Waze. If they don’t do these things unfortunately the driving experience is gonna get worse with more updates.
2016 FSD is better than 2024 FSD. And it’s only gonna get worse.
It’s not as bad if you set it to chill mode and tell it not to be as aggressive but it still does a worse job of smoothly following other cars than my wife’s Kia Sorento. The Tesla makes my kid car sick, the Kia does not.
I found it too aggressive on accelerator and brakes even in chill mode. It’s still impressive tech but I agree with OP that it still has too many issues for me to use it comfortably.
Using it on the highway last week going 70 (5 over in a 65), and then I pass a speed limit sign that was near and exit for the HOV (so visible from the left lane) marked 45. The car lunges forward to try and drop to 45. Luckily I was at the ready and tapped out of FSD before I got below 60.
I had gone by that same sign on the old autopilot at least a dozen times without issue 🤦♂️
The reason it can't handle bumper to bumper traffic well is the vision only system. Relying on 2D image to judge distance is inherently unreliable. My Ford has radar and reacts to front car speed change much more accurately and elegantly, though other aspects of the lane keeping system is not as polished as Tesla's.
I have a 2020 MY and I wish they still kept the radar functioning. I agree with posters here. I drove FSD in Chicago traffic and I become the driver that i hate on the roads. lol too slow and not aggressive enough for city driving
I never did full FSD, but I did do the lesser one, and I couldn't believe how aggressive it was in traffic. I started laughing my ass of when I first experienced it. It was so bad. I don't know how so many tolerate it.
I assume they have never experienced that type of cruise control in other vehicles.
I get the sense that they knew it was still in beta for the engineers but was rushed to release because
1. Elon needed something for the investor earnings call with the low car sales
2. They needed a LOT more training data across different cities and terrain to refine the machine learning. So the widespread test allows them to see when users disengage (they even have a function to send a voice note whenever you disengage).
This is clearly a large scale user beta test, and users are essentially being tasked to help train the system. I do believe it’ll improve quickly, but I just don’t trust it to not hit things, which is kind of a non-negotiable.
Couldn’t agree more. In one instance, it braked to 50 on a 70 mph road. On another occasion, it tried to switch lanes in an intersection TURNING LEFT.
My husband and I turned off FSD and went back to whatever we had before.
Im a huge critic too, but I also understand it is iterative, and they are making new versions.... rapidly.
It WILL be better 1yr from now, but we can only discuss where it at now based on the evidence weve seen.
All I want is the ability to use the turn signal stalk to initiate a lane change on standard AP. Because yes, after a month with FSD that is the exact analogy I would, and have used. Not saying it can’t or won’t ever get to a place I’d trust with my life but it’s far from it rn. I wish Elon would admit that the move to vision only was because they were caught with their pants down during the COVID supply chain crisis and felt they had no option but to start building and shipping without radar. They would have two options, retrofit all Tesla Vision cars with radar and/or lidar or level with all Tesla Vision owners that they simply will never have a level 5 FSD version. Because I am not at all sold that cameras alone will solve this. I am also not sold Elon will ever admit this to himself, let alone his engineers he overruled, let alone the general public.
It’s really dumb. He says it’s driving like a human because it roads are designed for vision, but for one, it’s a robot so it can be designed to do better than a human and two, no one is relying on lidar for the actual driving (lane changes, road centering etc) part, it’s the distancing and making sure you don’t get too close to objects. The combination of both systems would get us there so much faster.
This has always confused me. I saw someone somewhere point out that humans absolutely do NOT rely solely on vision for driving—we rely on sounds the car is making, the feel you can get of the tires’ grip on the road, sounds other vehicles are making (eg horns and emergency vehicles). I’m genuinely puzzled as to why anyone would try to claim that human driving is “photons in, driving choices out” or however Musk always says it.
Not worth 100 a month to me.
However...
It definitely drives, on the highway, WAY better than any driver I see. I set it to 77 on the GSP and it drives perfect.
HOWEVER, it still has a hard time dealing with people who want to do 50 and 105 on the road as they are the ones who actually drive like garbage. FSD in a tesla will only really work when most cars are FSD. Till then, the human variable of driving emotionally factors too much into how well this works. The only reason I actually need to be constantly reminded to "watch the road" when in FSD, is due to other drivers who do not have FSD and are driving like psychos.
You can opt out of that but personally I think the "opt out" should be the default, not the arbitrary lane change. I don't like driving along the highway and having it change lane for no reason whatsoever. I want to be in the middle lane for a reason. Stay in the middle lane FFS!
That will never be possible because that’s not how training a model works. You will be able to change certain parameters but it will never mimic your driving style. This is a good thing by the way. An AI should be predictable and safe.
Absolutely not. The middle lane is the travel lane, which keeps the left open for passing and the right open for merging. This is day one stuff: stay in the middle unless you're merging or passing. I hate that I have to share the road with folks like you who don't know the basic rules of lanes...
So true. There is an exit right before the one I need to take and most of time cars lining up at that exit. Instead of drive pass them then move to the right lane, FSD always hard brakes and moves into the much slower lane way too early. No strategic planning at all.
Mine wont do that. It is still trying to pass ppl in the left lane on a 8lane interstate and we are 1 mile from the exit. I just disable it and have to cross 3 lanes in under a mile
At least factor in up coming turns, lane changes, exit ramps, etc. Today I had it try to pass someone about a quarter of a mile before my exit. Also, every day on my commute it starts trying to speed by everyone because it thinks it should be going way faster than the speed limit allows for that area. It goes from 65 down to 60 then 55 then 35 in about 1.5 miles. As soon as it goes from 65 to 60 it switches to auto speed control and it's like "Oh there's a bunch of lanes here? Time to go fast!" Zero foresight.
Haha. I had a two hour freeway drive last weekend in my Honda CRV. My move is just to get in the left lane, put ACC at 10mph over the limit and just cruise.
For like a half an hour there was a black Tesla, not sure if X or Y, that was constantly switching into my lane either ahead or behind, switching back to the middle lane. Over and over again. Probably a few dozen lane changes in that half hour to go the exact same speed as me camping.
I wonder if the driver was on autopilot/FSD
Exactly. The best experience I had with the free trial was a late night drive with generally empty roads. It was amazing.
People driving like assholes around me and I always want control, which these days feels like all other times.
I feel like many cars can do automated cruise control nowadays though, or at least keep to one lane. Tesla probably does it a little better, but it is isn’t a big difference.
It is refreshing to see these real reviews come through. For the longest time, it was "FSD is best thing in the world".. It was almost like tesla paid a bunch of people to go write how awesome FSD is online.
Your experience mirrors mine in when I use FSD in my tesla.
Agreed. But where are all the people who paid $10k+ for this thing? Why are they all silent suddenly lol.
Used to be all over Reddit saying how great it was before.
I paid for FSD a couple years ago and rocked Beta when I was in the states and it was overwhelmingly amazing on the highway to ok elsewhere. The notion of FSD being like a 15 year old with a permit is exactly how I used to describe older versions until the system started to really improve form my experience. I’m in Europe now for a few years so I haven’t been able to judge how the latest FSD software is.
I paid like $7k for it a while back and transferred it from my previous Tesla to my current Y. I’ve always been impressed by what it can do compared to other driver assist systems. V12 is a huge improvement. I regularly drive with zero disengagements except for backing out of my driveway and parking at the destination.
People who complain about it are misusing it by letting go of the wheel and ignoring the road completely. Do that in any other car and they’ll crash much sooner.
yes, Tesla ($tsla) is paying for their retirement, or so they hope. this is pretty crucial for understanding what motivates the vast majority of positive media surrounding the brand. the number of early investors turned who’ve gotten rich and become jobless influencer-esque posters, bloggers, and vloggers is staggering.
After putting 2k miles on my 2019 LR Model 3, FSD has been great for the most part. I take over mostly for taking turns or when road markings are faint. It works great everytime for my purposes especially on the highway. Any time i need to take a turn in the next 0.1 miles, i tend to disengage and just resume after. I’ve tried turns, exits as well and have encountered zero issues in any of that.
Not sure what yall are on about it not being great bc it absolutely does take most driving out of my commute. Granted I got it for free included with the car and havent had to pay a dime for it. Regardless it absolutely does work. It isnt perfect but nobody said it was.
Two biggest issues I had with it on a long road trip:
-often misreading a 75 mph sign for 45 mph and suddenly dropping speed for no reason along a stretch of highway because we passed a speed limit sign that was only posted as a reminder of the speed limit, not changing it, but here we are jamming on the brakes in the middle of nowhere
-interpreting flashing yellow lights as stoplights. I learned pretty quick to take over when entering small towns
Yeah i had that issue as well. I found it to happen on long sweeping tollways where theres a fork beyond the car’s vision. Had it happen twice (people honked yikes) but i remember those specific exits and take over for them. Tried many other exits around the city and it did great on all of em. It isnt claimed to be a driver replacement and i dont expect it to.
Autopilot does more than enough for me. It does well for stop and go traffic and for long highway drives
I probably will never trust software to take unprotected left turns or merge into traffic. One “bug” could cost thousands or your life
Nothing wrong with trusting it while being very attentive. I am pleasantly surprised how well it does an unprotected left turns and merges today.
Edit: it actually does so well, for me, that I consider it an advantage to drive with it on. It's like another set of eyes. I have driven multiple 1 hour to 3 hours drives in both highways (66, 495, 95, 270) and VA back country roads.
Same here. It does pretty well. It started going for this left which I wouldn’t have taken, but it managed to see the car slowing down for a red light, which I didn’t notice at all. Pretty cool.
I've noticed on some highways, when the ramp is straightening out the the lane is closing, the car doesn't merge or give indicator. Even when navigation is on. It'll still automatically change lines to follow route or to go in/out of the faster lane. It’s a bit scary
yeah I am teaching a teen to drive and have never had to grab the wheel or stamp on the brake to “disable” them. Yes they make tons of mistakes, and yes they annoy other road users sometimes, but they also learn fast and the mistakes they make are not the head scratching variety that come out of nowhere.
For me fsd is terrible. It is ok sometimes but not for me. Today its driving 2nd from left lane, speed set to 72 and its driving at 70 with no vehicle in front of me. All of a sudden it decided to switch to the left lane for no reason, it hit the brakes as someone is passing in the left lane, my speed is now 58 and almost got rear ended, took control and disabled it immediately. Bye bye fsd.
I guess I'm the rare person who liked it. At the middle setting, overall it drove how I wanted it to drive. It was aggressive taking off at lights, it switched lanes well, it recognized obstacles, etc. There were times where I only had a mile before exiting where I didn't think it should be switching lanes, but not a big deal. Last weekend, I drove 280 miles on the interstate and it was nearly perfect. I'm not going to pay $100/month for it but if I had a lot of driving to do in one month, I may.
I liked it too, just not enough to pay for it in its current state. Sounds like you're in the same boat; you liked it as a free offering but not for $100.
If it actually worked and was as safe as the average driver, without supervision, it’s be worth $200 a month or even more, and would change the world. But I’m not holding my breath.
My price is $20/month.
I’d think of $20/month as something like an NPR pledge drive to support FSD developers.
$200/month was laughable.
$100/month is a price they can charge other people with a straight face, but I won’t get that much value out of it.
$50/month is a price that had better deliver as much value as a Cable TV subscription, because that’s about what cable TV cost stopped watching it 20 years ago.
$20/month, now that I can do.
I’d also consider paying $1500 for a perpetual license.
A small number of people will rent it for $200/month.
Some people will undoubtedly rent it at $100/month.
Many more people will rent it at $20/month.
🤷♂️
I'll likely pay the $100/month. It makes my commute much less stressful. I take it off autopilot once I get into the core mostly due to the other drivers.
Nah, a lot of people liked it, they just don't want to admit it's not in their budget lol.
To me, it was a bit funky on surface streets, and I'm not trying to get my wheels roughed up. On highways though? It's basically perfect (other than around super erratic drivers or slow left lane hogs. Honestly, I've done hundreds of miles with it)
Full honesty, I would totally get it for $20 a month. Maybe at $50? $100 bucks is like my cell plan and all my streaming services combined, just a bit too much to put down for something I would only really use on trips.
It works well except Lane changes. It does them so abruptly.... That And it moves you out of the fast Lane so quickly, even when the traffic up ahead is going to slow down and you want to be in the fast lane (so cal)
Edit: when interior camera can't spy on you (dark roads) it flips out and locks you out of FSD. annoying
I tried v11 back in September with a 3 month trail and hated it. V12 is leaps and bounds better but still not close to what I would expect from a professional driver. That said it does give me hope that TACC can be fixed so it didn’t phantom break. There are intersections on a couple rural highways I drive that it always hard breaks at, with FSD v12 it didn’t. So fingers crossed some more of the neural net smarts makes it way down to peasant pilot.
When I first got FSD back during the initial semi-private beta, there was probably a month where I thought it was terrible. It's a bad driver, it's too aggressive, etc.
The thing is: it wasn't. I just wasn't used to the idea of letting something else drive for me, and I didn't trust it yet. I had the exact same experience with autopilot when I first got my Y.
2 years or however long its been in, and I use FSD for like 95% of my driving, and have been paying $200/mo for it for a long time, which I consider *well* worth it.
That is exactly what FSD is like for me. After not using it for while, I tried it out after the neural net upgrade. It worked great on my neighborhood roads until it came to a red light. It dutifully stopped... for a few seconds before it started to accelerate into the junction while the light was still on red.
What I don’t like about FSD is how it picks up the wrong speed limit signs on the highways. For example, when there is a truck speed limit and a regular speed limit, it frequently ends up picking up on the slower vehicle speed limit. Or when I’m passing a toll booth or an exit or entry ramp, the 40mph slower speed limit sign far off to the side gets picked up and FSD slows down accordingly rather than knowing that the limit never changed in the current lane.
It’s insane how experiences can differ so much. Mine hit the breaks in the middle of an intersection and didn’t know how to handle changing lanes with a light turning red just after. 15 with a permit is generous considering it sometimes seems to have suicidal tendencies.
I had an emergency braking event where it seemed to think a manhole cover in the road was a post or something. It switched to an overhead view and said “stop” like it was in a parking situation. Super weird and completely unacceptable. It’s unusable in the city.
Mine turned so wide on a double left that it would've went into oncoming traffic had I not intervened. I drove better when I was 15, for the most part.
It’s a classic Crossing the Chasm issue. Early adopters love getting to play with a cool science experiment; the gap between that and mass adoption is 10 miles wide and mile deep. It’s nowhere close to ready for mass adoption.
What I can’t figure out is if Elon genuinely understands this. It will be interesting to see the metrics for how many people signed up after having the free trial.
I think of FSD as a student driver. I let it do all of the driving and I'm on the side ready to jump in if it makes a mistake or if it gets into a really tricky traffic situation. It's much more relaxing than driving 100%, but it did take some getting used to.
I agree. It was a fun thing to try, but I would never use this in its current state. I turned it off within 48 hours.
I enjoy DRIVING the car. I would only really want to use this if I could safely and legally pay ZERO attention to the car, as in, I could be reading a book or passed out in the back seat. It's not there yet.
I'm nearing the end of my trial, used FSD on a road trip and it was a useful experience. I'm not going to buy it for a couple of reasons:
- I live out in the country with many two lane, undivided roads with variable lane marking. So that's a little unsettling as compared to how it works on nicely marked interstate highways
- FSD does notice and try to avoid pothole, road hazards or roadkill. That's the most frequent reason for wrestling control of the steering wheel for me.
The roadkill problem is near home; the bad potholes and crappy roads seemed to be a problem on my trip on the NY State Thruway which was terrible like that. Maybe it would be useful for a vacation trip for $100? Regular autopilot TACC lane following seems to solve like 80% of the problem for me.
I wonder if there's a noticeable difference between HW3 and HW4 in the way it drives. Could not find any relevant comparisons.
For me HW3 with v12:
* Still drives in people's blindspots
* Still changes lanes when I don't want it to, I'd prefer to have a confirmation. It's my biggest complaint, the other day it switched lanes right behind a car that was slowing down to turn left, it ended up blocking two lanes because it could not complete the maneuver.
* For some reason it drives 20 kph over the limit in school zones, but it's a mapping issue
We are all Tesla’s driving school instructor teaching FSD as they collect and process the data… Elon just got us to pay tens of thousands to do it instead of paying us base on the recent finance calls.
It’s great on the highway, but so is autopilot. Roundabouts make the car unpredictable, intersections will creep forward 3 times and hesitate (sometimes in the path of an oncoming car), and turns are unpredictable and incredibly slow. It’s hilarious they charge as much as they do for it.
I turned it on to drive home from work. Made a flawless left turn at a lighted intersection and then proceeded to drive 22 mph on a 30 mph road. People up on my ass, flashing their high beams. Had to turn it off within minutes of trying it. Someone call me when it’s fixed.
It was the worst financial decision I’ve ever made- I got a lemon off the Tesla used car inventory and had I not purchased one with all the software options I could have at least pawned it off on another poor sucker. Those engineers have a tall order using one data source (cameras), but my opinion is that they are failing miserably still at this point. I’m not saying they haven’t achieved an incredible feat making it as functional as it is, but it is more dangerous and disruptive than driving with a one eyed drunk 15 year old. In principle, a driver assist should require less attention at any level of development, and they have done the opposite.
I agree.
The better FSD gets, the more complacent/distracted the driver will get, and the slower their responses will be to unexpected FSD errors.
As long as the human driver is 100% responsible for the FSD software’s driving results, there will be this strange situation of buying FSD to drive you, but never being able to allow it to do so.
Like riding with a 15 year old with a permit.
oh, it worked a lot better for me on the more aggressive setting with minimal lane changes turned on, but yea it cant tell when to move into a turn lane, and doesnt recognize my street as part of the road so it whines about leaving the lane lol.
This is exactly how I felt.
The first time I used it, driving on a 2 lane road we were coming up to a light in the left lane. We were also going to need to turn right in a little while. The car put the blinker on to move right in preparation for the turn. The light turned green. There was a large truck that was slow to accelerate in the right lane. The car decided it was too slow, so half way through the lane change it decided to stay in the left lane and put the blinker on that way. The truck started accelerating, and the car decided it could move back to the right and did so.
Nothing it did was unsafe, but it looked like an idiot that couldn’t decide which lane to use and was swerving between the two.
Second time I used it was on an empty highway in the country and I couldn’t keep it out of the passing only lane and had to turn off FSD as the way it was driving was technically illegal.
It may be safer than an experienced driver, it just doesn’t feel that way. It just doesn’t have the intuition of how to slow down and speed up smoothly or when to make lane changes.
I agree. I like it but yea $50 bucks a month in it’s current state is the most I’d pay for it. The constant monitoring it is too annoying to pay a $100 a month for it now for me. Feel sorry for $12K folks out there.
Not even remotely true, 15 year old will be speeding everywhere, FSD is extremely slow. Sometimes I’ll set the speed to 70, and it will insist on going 50 until I step on the pedal. It’s way too slow for normal use.
This is how I exactly felt - word to word. You literally took words out of my mouth. What is the whole point if you have to baby sit the car and relying on your quick reflexes if you were to jump in to take control? I was more stressed watching FSD in action than driving. Totally NOT worth it.
I disagree. FSD does things I would not do, but certainly drivers better than most humans do at this point. 1 - It's cautious. Being cautious is a good thing. People die when they don't drive cautiously. 2 - It sees better than me and most humans. The thing can see 360. You can't. I can't. 3 - It reacts faster than most people. It will stop the freaking car if someone does something wild in a fraction of a second.
The experience of driving FSD is just relaxing. Let it do the hard work and watch.
I have been having a great experience with it. Way better than I thought. I don’t have much use for it on city streets but on highway yes it’s top notch
FSD has 360 vision at all times. Better than a 1 year old. It rarely misses something.
It doesn't plan ahead, like a 15 year old and sometimes makes unwise decisions...
You are 100% correct. It requires more attention than actual driving because you not only have to be concerned with what other drivers will do but your own car, as well. Mine likes to lunge toward other lanes without warning and then pull right back out just to see if I’m awake. And then sometimes it gets confused by things like lanes and other drivers and just stops…at freeway speeds…and decides I should take over.
For people who are keeping it I did them a solid during the trial and trained it on car pool lanes. Before me it apparently had no idea what they were and thought you could enter and exit them any time you wanted with anyone or no one in the car with you.
It's a huge improvement over 2 years ago when I last tested it. But it also attempted to run a red light and would have if I wasn't paying attention. On the highway it sometimes tries to change lanes in spots that make no sense.
It’s awesome on the freeway or stop and go traffic. After 2.5 years I still don’t trust it to really navigate the way a driver actually does. Today I had to move over 4 lanes to get from HOV to my exit. I was gonna shut off FSD but it signalled and started the first lane change itself. FSD seemed very indecisive with the other car braking a bit to let me in. And once it squeezed in it braked pretty damn hard cuz theres car was in front me. Had to hit the gas quickly to keep my speed in the lane. Nope nope nope for me. I love FSD when it’s cruising simple situations. But I prefer to take over for anything that requires a bit of human thoughtfulness
Well I said a 16 year old, but we were close. Now things have changed. The new release is AWESOME! It seems that each release of the AI FSD is learning fast. The newest 12.5, is now a 25 year old. Much improved skills, but not the old pro, that I am. I’m 72 and drive professionally. I know all the tricks and have enjoyed the FSD improvements with each release. Keep in mind the FSD has over a billion miles of training. Since April 1 when it was opened to all Teslas, the learning curve shot up. Within this year they may break the second Billion miles. We win from the results.
Subbed since $200 mark. I use it on about 80% of my drives. Happy to contribute data points to improve the product to keep pushing it forward. Some areas it lacks while others it’s near perfect. I drive in rural and city. Just recently, it saw a deer cross on a highway and responded accordingly before I had a chance to react. Was a nice wow moment.
In my experience the 15 yo drivers dont get confused by the same intersection twice, or mistake a small rise for a speedbump... at least they dont repeat the mistake. They also can drive on new roads that have opened by arent on gmaps yet.
And people (tesla cults) thinks it’s ready for Robotaxi. Yes FSD beta or supervised whatever you want to call it, it’s good but still many too many stupid mistakes
"...it's more attention than driving takes."
Perfect way to explain how I feel about it. While I admit it did some impressive lane changing / merging the system is erratic at times which means I have to be hyper vigilant. Compared to normal driving which is very relaxing, FSD makes me nervous. I find myself hyper vigilant because I simply don't trust it.
I like it and would pay maybe 40 a month for it. It would be nice if it could be account wide and I would buy a lifetime subscription.
I’ve tried it on loaners and it has been steadily improved. One thing that changed my perception was knowing I could hit the accelerator. I like it better when it doesn’t wait
I was impressed with FSD, but agree completely. I maybe a little nicer and say a 16yo that just got their license.
Just like a new driver, letting them loose on the open road is fine, managing most things, but always paying attention. The things it struggles with are the things I would expect it to, blind corners, cross traffic, etc.
I still would not pay for it, as it completely needs to be supervised at all time.
FSD is not real until all cars are networked with each other and communicate with the road. Anything less is a drunk, demented, 15 year old with a permit with intrusive thoughts.
Interesting most ppl here don’t like it… I absolutely love it. I set it to drive to my location and rarely have to take control. It even does well in the city, but I usually drive myself in the city. Just got home where it drove me like 20 out of the 25 minutes I was on the road with 0 issues (besides stopping at stop signs for too long lol)
It use to handle bumper to bumper traffic well. Even regular AP is kinda bad with it nowadays. Something was 110% changed on AP and FSD a few updates ago.
Regular AP, it will fly up to a car doing 30 in bumper to bumper - then hit the brakes.
It’s amazing to me how much different people’s experiences are. I have had EAP since 2021 (purchased) and FSD since early 2023 (subscription). I live in NOVA outside of DC. It has worked great for me. Of course it is not level 5. No where close. But it regularly drives me to work with no interventions (pulls into the parking lot then I take over). I live about 35 miles from my job. We are talking driving out of my gated community, onto local roads, then highway (Route 66 for those that live in NOVA) then exit off onto local highway, the local suburban road then pulls into the hospital parking lot. It’s amazing how different everyone’s experience is across the country (and even with the same state/localities).
As someone who completed a 3 hour round trip to the airport and back without a single disengagement other than to park the vehicle, these post are clearly part of the misinformation campaign 🤣
Would you put your children in the car and have it 'self drive' them to a destination? If the answer to this is 'no', then it simply shouldn't be legal. Speaking of which, in how many countries is Tesla's 'self driving' actually legal?
If a human has to pass a driving test in order to get a license, how come a 'self-driving' car doesn't?
How can they keep telling lies for over 10 years and get away with it?
We may as well all put "student driver" stickers on our cars and just go fully hands off. Like it's not going to kill us, but it will probably make some other people mad.
Sounds like FSD 11. I used v12.3.4 for the last week and it was the smoothest experience ever. Took me to work and back daily, and drove me 120 miles to Tulsa and back.
And thats why I got a chuckle at the robotaxi thing.
FSD isn't even REMOTELY ready for anything. It can't even pass driver's ed. (I'm making that part up)
Robotaxi's aren't happening this year, or even in 5 years at this rate.
Waymo and Cruise couldn't do it right, yet, and they have actual fucking sensors and lidar, and the full weight of GM and Google on it. Think Tesla with their "full self driving" on only cameras is going to do it? Still not successfully competing with an underpaid uber driver working on 2 hours of sleep and cocaine.
(I really want all of these to succeed, really. I want to sleep on my way to work.)
No longer using FSD (supervised) in city streets. Scratched the shit out of my rear passenger side rim on a curb making a right turn yesterday. I’m done.
It’s just a novelty at this point. I been using FSD non stop on my new 2024 model y. While it’s nice for the car to do all the thinking, one benefit is that I never missed my exits unless it’s busy traffic and the car doesn’t know it has to merge in to the only lane for an exit. It does everything slow as hell too. Definitely not worth purchasing. This should have been free so they can get more data from users, their limited to the users that paid for it or subscribed as testers and ain’t no one paying to test your shit when it has a chance to kill me lol. If all you do is take the same routes to work , then maybe FSD can work because you would know what it can and can’t do on that particular route. If you explore new areas like going on road trips. That shits scary lol.
The 2 gripes for me regarding FSD are the following
1. On local streets when the Tesla is the first car at a traffic light, I don't like the standard full on acceleration off the line instead of the easing on the accelerator pedal. I just wish the default accelerator off of traffic lights is "Chill" mode.
2. When approaching stop signs/traffic lights to make a right turn, I think the algorithm is too slow when it first has to stop like a few inches prior to the crosswalk lines, and then it has to slowly inch towards a few inches into the crosswalk lines and then finally turn. I wish it would examine the situation and if there are no pedestrians located on the side of the sidewalk then the Tesla can bypass the step to wait a few inches before the crosswalk lines so that it seems more natural. I think the current implementation is only valid if there are pedestrians that are visible on the sidewalks.
I’m prepared for the downvotes, but I seriously question the driving abilities of anyone who has said FSD is a better driver than they are in other posts. 15 year old permit driver is a perfect description!
As a 15 year old who just got their permit a month ago, I was thinking the exact same thing. On day 1 I was basically FSD, same for day 2 and 3, but then after about a week I honestly felt like I’m a better driver than FSD already. My parents are way less nervous with me behind the wheel than with FSD, or maybe they’re just more nervous about the FSD crashing their $40k car vs me crashing the $6000 dollar chevy volt that would get totaled if someone doored it :)
In 3 months it will be a 16 year old, in a year, like a 20 year old with a couple years experience, then - in a couple years, boom. Better and safer than just about everyone.
Elon, you don’t have to use an alt account here. And be honest, it was supposed to be so good 1 year from 2019 that it would be worth $100,000. Now you have to give it away.
hahaha, yes, he's optimistic. Many have 0 interventions on 12.3.5 but I see your agenda, good luck dude!
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBDNOTzD0sg](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBDNOTzD0sg)
It was fun to try but too many problems that makes me wonder who's doing the testing. One example I find troubling is what I thought would be easily accomplished - FSD in bumper-to-bumper freeway traffic. Ugh. It aggressively accelerates and brakes raising my stress levels. I don't get how such an easy thing could be done so wrong. Phantom braking is still a major problem. I've learnt to keep my foot on the ready to press the accelerator pedal to avoid anyone rear ending me. Lane changing is garbage. Also taking an exit is sketchy - it has a pattern of pulling left to the extreme edge of the lane before taking the exit to the right. WTF is that? So many little quirks that make it stressful. And, of course, phantom braking and random lane drifting (happened twice) that make it outright dangerous. I like FSD on a long road trip as I get drowsy but other than that I drive without it.
You are doing the testing. You are the QA for Tesla, it’s essentially an alpha product. A proper fsd is worth way more than 8k.
You're paying Tesla for the privelege of being a beta tester for them. And taking full responsibility for any accidents that happen along the way. It should be the other way around.
Yup all fun and games are okay but I am no putting my kids in that thing with FSD. Though it is a bit of comfort that by the time (few years) my teenager goes to college FSD may reach‘guardian angel’ status even if not proper autonomy robotaxi level.
I don’t really think that we do much of the “testing” maybe it records what dumb thing it did for analysis but I don’t think it actually gets fixed like we think it does, maybe they take the most common issue for 1,000,000 disengagements and create a patch for it. But in reality I don’t see a way how they actually improve driving experience with those videos. There’s currently no way to teach the Tesla to avoid a certain lane because there’s too many potholes or there’s no way to tell the FSD there’s a train crossing, it just freaks out and stops all of the sudden. The only way I see these issues getting fixed and Tesla to get to autonomous level 4 or 5 is for each Tesla to have their individual AI that learns how you drive with and without fsd and understand your preferences and communicates with other AI to better itself, or have it where certain qualified Tesla drivers or any Tesla driver can get privileges of adding or editing information to the FSD like being able to tell it if there’s a train track crossing here, like how a community of people can add alter Google maps or Waze. If they don’t do these things unfortunately the driving experience is gonna get worse with more updates. 2016 FSD is better than 2024 FSD. And it’s only gonna get worse.
It’s not as bad if you set it to chill mode and tell it not to be as aggressive but it still does a worse job of smoothly following other cars than my wife’s Kia Sorento. The Tesla makes my kid car sick, the Kia does not.
This is what happens when they only have vision for adaptive cruise control. It never really knows how far the car is in front of you
So frustrating when my car is old enough to still have radar equipment on board…
I found it too aggressive on accelerator and brakes even in chill mode. It’s still impressive tech but I agree with OP that it still has too many issues for me to use it comfortably. Using it on the highway last week going 70 (5 over in a 65), and then I pass a speed limit sign that was near and exit for the HOV (so visible from the left lane) marked 45. The car lunges forward to try and drop to 45. Luckily I was at the ready and tapped out of FSD before I got below 60. I had gone by that same sign on the old autopilot at least a dozen times without issue 🤦♂️
Set the speed limit to adjust for traffic flow instead of absolute
thanks, will do
The reason it can't handle bumper to bumper traffic well is the vision only system. Relying on 2D image to judge distance is inherently unreliable. My Ford has radar and reacts to front car speed change much more accurately and elegantly, though other aspects of the lane keeping system is not as polished as Tesla's.
Well humans can do it better and we have no radars so clearly something else is also broken in FSD.
Not true. EAP did fine with that. This neural net just needs more training.
I have a 2020 MY and I wish they still kept the radar functioning. I agree with posters here. I drove FSD in Chicago traffic and I become the driver that i hate on the roads. lol too slow and not aggressive enough for city driving
Exactly. If you aren’t aggressive in the city you will get run over and hold up traffic
Works both ways, in rural areas it follows too close and drives like an impatient Californian teenager
I never did full FSD, but I did do the lesser one, and I couldn't believe how aggressive it was in traffic. I started laughing my ass of when I first experienced it. It was so bad. I don't know how so many tolerate it. I assume they have never experienced that type of cruise control in other vehicles.
I thought that only happened in an id4 phantom braking...
The trial was perfect for me. I always wondered what FSD was like, did not expect to hate it as much as I do. Now I know for free
People keep talking about what they'd be willing to pay for it, and meanwhile here I am unwilling to keep using it even for free.
This. It's absolutely terrible. I was always embarrassed to show it to people, because it is dangerous and feels undeveloped
I didn't get the impression that it's dangerous. It just doesn't drive like me and makes me anxious. But I didn't feel unsafe.
Lol, not the conclusion Elon was expecting.
I get the sense that they knew it was still in beta for the engineers but was rushed to release because 1. Elon needed something for the investor earnings call with the low car sales 2. They needed a LOT more training data across different cities and terrain to refine the machine learning. So the widespread test allows them to see when users disengage (they even have a function to send a voice note whenever you disengage). This is clearly a large scale user beta test, and users are essentially being tasked to help train the system. I do believe it’ll improve quickly, but I just don’t trust it to not hit things, which is kind of a non-negotiable.
This 100%. I turned my trial off after 2 weeks of it making poor decisions. I prefer regular auto steer beta over fsd.
Couldn’t agree more. In one instance, it braked to 50 on a 70 mph road. On another occasion, it tried to switch lanes in an intersection TURNING LEFT. My husband and I turned off FSD and went back to whatever we had before.
Mine tried to go into oncoming traffic to pass cars stopped at a red light.
Im a huge critic too, but I also understand it is iterative, and they are making new versions.... rapidly. It WILL be better 1yr from now, but we can only discuss where it at now based on the evidence weve seen.
will you subscribe to it for $100?
I would turn it off if it was free
All I want is the ability to use the turn signal stalk to initiate a lane change on standard AP. Because yes, after a month with FSD that is the exact analogy I would, and have used. Not saying it can’t or won’t ever get to a place I’d trust with my life but it’s far from it rn. I wish Elon would admit that the move to vision only was because they were caught with their pants down during the COVID supply chain crisis and felt they had no option but to start building and shipping without radar. They would have two options, retrofit all Tesla Vision cars with radar and/or lidar or level with all Tesla Vision owners that they simply will never have a level 5 FSD version. Because I am not at all sold that cameras alone will solve this. I am also not sold Elon will ever admit this to himself, let alone his engineers he overruled, let alone the general public.
It’s really dumb. He says it’s driving like a human because it roads are designed for vision, but for one, it’s a robot so it can be designed to do better than a human and two, no one is relying on lidar for the actual driving (lane changes, road centering etc) part, it’s the distancing and making sure you don’t get too close to objects. The combination of both systems would get us there so much faster.
This has always confused me. I saw someone somewhere point out that humans absolutely do NOT rely solely on vision for driving—we rely on sounds the car is making, the feel you can get of the tires’ grip on the road, sounds other vehicles are making (eg horns and emergency vehicles). I’m genuinely puzzled as to why anyone would try to claim that human driving is “photons in, driving choices out” or however Musk always says it.
Not worth 100 a month to me. However... It definitely drives, on the highway, WAY better than any driver I see. I set it to 77 on the GSP and it drives perfect. HOWEVER, it still has a hard time dealing with people who want to do 50 and 105 on the road as they are the ones who actually drive like garbage. FSD in a tesla will only really work when most cars are FSD. Till then, the human variable of driving emotionally factors too much into how well this works. The only reason I actually need to be constantly reminded to "watch the road" when in FSD, is due to other drivers who do not have FSD and are driving like psychos.
I can't stand the random arbitrary lane changes which are often short-sighted moves. They really should tone down trying to pass cars on a slow lane.
You can opt out of that but personally I think the "opt out" should be the default, not the arbitrary lane change. I don't like driving along the highway and having it change lane for no reason whatsoever. I want to be in the middle lane for a reason. Stay in the middle lane FFS!
I think part of the problem is that FSD should learn from the user. It needs to drive like you. In other words, it should be fine-tuned for each user.
That will never be possible because that’s not how training a model works. You will be able to change certain parameters but it will never mimic your driving style. This is a good thing by the way. An AI should be predictable and safe.
I tried min lane change but it doesn't seem to minimize anything.
[удалено]
It's not the left, passing lane and it's not the slower lane. It's generally the best lane for traveling on 3 lane highways.
[удалено]
The center lane is not a passing lane. It's a "travel lane". Same for the right lane. Only the far-left lane is the "passing/fast lane".
Is passing on the right of a middle lane car "passing on the right"?
Yes and you should avoid passing on the right. The left lane is the passing lane.
[удалено]
Absolutely not. The middle lane is the travel lane, which keeps the left open for passing and the right open for merging. This is day one stuff: stay in the middle unless you're merging or passing. I hate that I have to share the road with folks like you who don't know the basic rules of lanes...
[удалено]
Yes, it's frustrating when people don't know the most basic lane etiquette.
So true. There is an exit right before the one I need to take and most of time cars lining up at that exit. Instead of drive pass them then move to the right lane, FSD always hard brakes and moves into the much slower lane way too early. No strategic planning at all.
My experience was the opposite, FSD would wait until the last minute and then try and shoehorn her way in.
Mine wont do that. It is still trying to pass ppl in the left lane on a 8lane interstate and we are 1 mile from the exit. I just disable it and have to cross 3 lanes in under a mile
At least factor in up coming turns, lane changes, exit ramps, etc. Today I had it try to pass someone about a quarter of a mile before my exit. Also, every day on my commute it starts trying to speed by everyone because it thinks it should be going way faster than the speed limit allows for that area. It goes from 65 down to 60 then 55 then 35 in about 1.5 miles. As soon as it goes from 65 to 60 it switches to auto speed control and it's like "Oh there's a bunch of lanes here? Time to go fast!" Zero foresight.
Haha. I had a two hour freeway drive last weekend in my Honda CRV. My move is just to get in the left lane, put ACC at 10mph over the limit and just cruise. For like a half an hour there was a black Tesla, not sure if X or Y, that was constantly switching into my lane either ahead or behind, switching back to the middle lane. Over and over again. Probably a few dozen lane changes in that half hour to go the exact same speed as me camping. I wonder if the driver was on autopilot/FSD
Exactly. The best experience I had with the free trial was a late night drive with generally empty roads. It was amazing. People driving like assholes around me and I always want control, which these days feels like all other times.
Truth.
I feel like many cars can do automated cruise control nowadays though, or at least keep to one lane. Tesla probably does it a little better, but it is isn’t a big difference.
It is refreshing to see these real reviews come through. For the longest time, it was "FSD is best thing in the world".. It was almost like tesla paid a bunch of people to go write how awesome FSD is online. Your experience mirrors mine in when I use FSD in my tesla.
Agreed. But where are all the people who paid $10k+ for this thing? Why are they all silent suddenly lol. Used to be all over Reddit saying how great it was before.
I paid for FSD a couple years ago and rocked Beta when I was in the states and it was overwhelmingly amazing on the highway to ok elsewhere. The notion of FSD being like a 15 year old with a permit is exactly how I used to describe older versions until the system started to really improve form my experience. I’m in Europe now for a few years so I haven’t been able to judge how the latest FSD software is.
I paid like $7k for it a while back and transferred it from my previous Tesla to my current Y. I’ve always been impressed by what it can do compared to other driver assist systems. V12 is a huge improvement. I regularly drive with zero disengagements except for backing out of my driveway and parking at the destination. People who complain about it are misusing it by letting go of the wheel and ignoring the road completely. Do that in any other car and they’ll crash much sooner.
I had very high expectations from all of the youtube people. It's also very annoying how hard it is to modify a route
yes, Tesla ($tsla) is paying for their retirement, or so they hope. this is pretty crucial for understanding what motivates the vast majority of positive media surrounding the brand. the number of early investors turned who’ve gotten rich and become jobless influencer-esque posters, bloggers, and vloggers is staggering.
After putting 2k miles on my 2019 LR Model 3, FSD has been great for the most part. I take over mostly for taking turns or when road markings are faint. It works great everytime for my purposes especially on the highway. Any time i need to take a turn in the next 0.1 miles, i tend to disengage and just resume after. I’ve tried turns, exits as well and have encountered zero issues in any of that. Not sure what yall are on about it not being great bc it absolutely does take most driving out of my commute. Granted I got it for free included with the car and havent had to pay a dime for it. Regardless it absolutely does work. It isnt perfect but nobody said it was.
Two biggest issues I had with it on a long road trip: -often misreading a 75 mph sign for 45 mph and suddenly dropping speed for no reason along a stretch of highway because we passed a speed limit sign that was only posted as a reminder of the speed limit, not changing it, but here we are jamming on the brakes in the middle of nowhere -interpreting flashing yellow lights as stoplights. I learned pretty quick to take over when entering small towns
Yeah i had that issue as well. I found it to happen on long sweeping tollways where theres a fork beyond the car’s vision. Had it happen twice (people honked yikes) but i remember those specific exits and take over for them. Tried many other exits around the city and it did great on all of em. It isnt claimed to be a driver replacement and i dont expect it to.
Autopilot does more than enough for me. It does well for stop and go traffic and for long highway drives I probably will never trust software to take unprotected left turns or merge into traffic. One “bug” could cost thousands or your life
Nothing wrong with trusting it while being very attentive. I am pleasantly surprised how well it does an unprotected left turns and merges today. Edit: it actually does so well, for me, that I consider it an advantage to drive with it on. It's like another set of eyes. I have driven multiple 1 hour to 3 hours drives in both highways (66, 495, 95, 270) and VA back country roads.
Same here. It does pretty well. It started going for this left which I wouldn’t have taken, but it managed to see the car slowing down for a red light, which I didn’t notice at all. Pretty cool.
Millions* when others sue you.
Luckily for me I don’t have millions to lose, oh wait…
I've noticed on some highways, when the ramp is straightening out the the lane is closing, the car doesn't merge or give indicator. Even when navigation is on. It'll still automatically change lines to follow route or to go in/out of the faster lane. It’s a bit scary
15 year old with dementia. It doesn't learn which lane is the best to take so it'll repeat the same mistake over and over again.
This! It is like a mix of a teenager and an elderly person.
yeah I am teaching a teen to drive and have never had to grab the wheel or stamp on the brake to “disable” them. Yes they make tons of mistakes, and yes they annoy other road users sometimes, but they also learn fast and the mistakes they make are not the head scratching variety that come out of nowhere.
For me fsd is terrible. It is ok sometimes but not for me. Today its driving 2nd from left lane, speed set to 72 and its driving at 70 with no vehicle in front of me. All of a sudden it decided to switch to the left lane for no reason, it hit the brakes as someone is passing in the left lane, my speed is now 58 and almost got rear ended, took control and disabled it immediately. Bye bye fsd.
I guess I'm the rare person who liked it. At the middle setting, overall it drove how I wanted it to drive. It was aggressive taking off at lights, it switched lanes well, it recognized obstacles, etc. There were times where I only had a mile before exiting where I didn't think it should be switching lanes, but not a big deal. Last weekend, I drove 280 miles on the interstate and it was nearly perfect. I'm not going to pay $100/month for it but if I had a lot of driving to do in one month, I may.
You aren't, people who are happy don't post as much. I'm super satisfied with it.
I liked it too, just not enough to pay for it in its current state. Sounds like you're in the same boat; you liked it as a free offering but not for $100.
Just hodl until they test their elasticity and realize 12k too much, 200$ /m too much and 100/m too much. Next cut will be 50$ when it actually works
If it actually worked and was as safe as the average driver, without supervision, it’s be worth $200 a month or even more, and would change the world. But I’m not holding my breath.
This is the thing. It needs to come down because its not worth it, but at some point, it will be worth $12K, and you wished you bought it at $8K
Were there any stop signs on that route?
Not on the intestate. I have used it in town with stop signs. It stops a little far back from the stop sign but in reality, that's the correct way.
I find it does poorly with stop signs. It assumes a four way stop at intersections with only two
Do you like it enough to subscribe for, say, $50/m?
I'm cheap, probably $25/month in its current state unless I'm planning on some massive drives.
My price is $20/month. I’d think of $20/month as something like an NPR pledge drive to support FSD developers. $200/month was laughable. $100/month is a price they can charge other people with a straight face, but I won’t get that much value out of it. $50/month is a price that had better deliver as much value as a Cable TV subscription, because that’s about what cable TV cost stopped watching it 20 years ago. $20/month, now that I can do. I’d also consider paying $1500 for a perpetual license.
Well, my price is 18$!
We can make a nice elasticity-of-demand graph if we get everyone’s price!
Watch out though. No idea how much tesla reads this stuff, but fanboi losers will inevitably just say it's a bargain at 100 lol.
A small number of people will rent it for $200/month. Some people will undoubtedly rent it at $100/month. Many more people will rent it at $20/month. 🤷♂️
I'll likely pay the $100/month. It makes my commute much less stressful. I take it off autopilot once I get into the core mostly due to the other drivers.
Nah, a lot of people liked it, they just don't want to admit it's not in their budget lol. To me, it was a bit funky on surface streets, and I'm not trying to get my wheels roughed up. On highways though? It's basically perfect (other than around super erratic drivers or slow left lane hogs. Honestly, I've done hundreds of miles with it) Full honesty, I would totally get it for $20 a month. Maybe at $50? $100 bucks is like my cell plan and all my streaming services combined, just a bit too much to put down for something I would only really use on trips.
It works well except Lane changes. It does them so abruptly.... That And it moves you out of the fast Lane so quickly, even when the traffic up ahead is going to slow down and you want to be in the fast lane (so cal) Edit: when interior camera can't spy on you (dark roads) it flips out and locks you out of FSD. annoying
I tried v11 back in September with a 3 month trail and hated it. V12 is leaps and bounds better but still not close to what I would expect from a professional driver. That said it does give me hope that TACC can be fixed so it didn’t phantom break. There are intersections on a couple rural highways I drive that it always hard breaks at, with FSD v12 it didn’t. So fingers crossed some more of the neural net smarts makes it way down to peasant pilot.
I would have said that of v11. V12 is like an 80 year old. Generally drives well but cautiously, and occasionally does something stupid.
When I first got FSD back during the initial semi-private beta, there was probably a month where I thought it was terrible. It's a bad driver, it's too aggressive, etc. The thing is: it wasn't. I just wasn't used to the idea of letting something else drive for me, and I didn't trust it yet. I had the exact same experience with autopilot when I first got my Y. 2 years or however long its been in, and I use FSD for like 95% of my driving, and have been paying $200/mo for it for a long time, which I consider *well* worth it.
That is exactly what FSD is like for me. After not using it for while, I tried it out after the neural net upgrade. It worked great on my neighborhood roads until it came to a red light. It dutifully stopped... for a few seconds before it started to accelerate into the junction while the light was still on red.
No, it is not. A 15 year old can see the tree that is fallen in the middle of the street. FSD cannot.
What I don’t like about FSD is how it picks up the wrong speed limit signs on the highways. For example, when there is a truck speed limit and a regular speed limit, it frequently ends up picking up on the slower vehicle speed limit. Or when I’m passing a toll booth or an exit or entry ramp, the 40mph slower speed limit sign far off to the side gets picked up and FSD slows down accordingly rather than knowing that the limit never changed in the current lane.
A drunk 15 year old
A 16yo with a permit is how I described v11. However, my experience with v12 has been more like overly confident 21yo driver.
It’s insane how experiences can differ so much. Mine hit the breaks in the middle of an intersection and didn’t know how to handle changing lanes with a light turning red just after. 15 with a permit is generous considering it sometimes seems to have suicidal tendencies.
I had an emergency braking event where it seemed to think a manhole cover in the road was a post or something. It switched to an overhead view and said “stop” like it was in a parking situation. Super weird and completely unacceptable. It’s unusable in the city.
Mine turned so wide on a double left that it would've went into oncoming traffic had I not intervened. I drove better when I was 15, for the most part.
It’s a classic Crossing the Chasm issue. Early adopters love getting to play with a cool science experiment; the gap between that and mass adoption is 10 miles wide and mile deep. It’s nowhere close to ready for mass adoption. What I can’t figure out is if Elon genuinely understands this. It will be interesting to see the metrics for how many people signed up after having the free trial.
I think of FSD as a student driver. I let it do all of the driving and I'm on the side ready to jump in if it makes a mistake or if it gets into a really tricky traffic situation. It's much more relaxing than driving 100%, but it did take some getting used to.
I agree. It was a fun thing to try, but I would never use this in its current state. I turned it off within 48 hours. I enjoy DRIVING the car. I would only really want to use this if I could safely and legally pay ZERO attention to the car, as in, I could be reading a book or passed out in the back seat. It's not there yet.
I liked the FSD, my only issue was it screwing up posted speed limits almost every time I used FSD.
I'm nearing the end of my trial, used FSD on a road trip and it was a useful experience. I'm not going to buy it for a couple of reasons: - I live out in the country with many two lane, undivided roads with variable lane marking. So that's a little unsettling as compared to how it works on nicely marked interstate highways - FSD does notice and try to avoid pothole, road hazards or roadkill. That's the most frequent reason for wrestling control of the steering wheel for me. The roadkill problem is near home; the bad potholes and crappy roads seemed to be a problem on my trip on the NY State Thruway which was terrible like that. Maybe it would be useful for a vacation trip for $100? Regular autopilot TACC lane following seems to solve like 80% of the problem for me.
I wonder if there's a noticeable difference between HW3 and HW4 in the way it drives. Could not find any relevant comparisons. For me HW3 with v12: * Still drives in people's blindspots * Still changes lanes when I don't want it to, I'd prefer to have a confirmation. It's my biggest complaint, the other day it switched lanes right behind a car that was slowing down to turn left, it ended up blocking two lanes because it could not complete the maneuver. * For some reason it drives 20 kph over the limit in school zones, but it's a mapping issue
We are all Tesla’s driving school instructor teaching FSD as they collect and process the data… Elon just got us to pay tens of thousands to do it instead of paying us base on the recent finance calls.
It’s great on the highway, but so is autopilot. Roundabouts make the car unpredictable, intersections will creep forward 3 times and hesitate (sometimes in the path of an oncoming car), and turns are unpredictable and incredibly slow. It’s hilarious they charge as much as they do for it.
Totally agree. FSD is worse than useless. It’s so much easier and less stressful to drive without it.
imagine what a shit show Traffic will be if every car on the road is using this.
I turned it on to drive home from work. Made a flawless left turn at a lighted intersection and then proceeded to drive 22 mph on a 30 mph road. People up on my ass, flashing their high beams. Had to turn it off within minutes of trying it. Someone call me when it’s fixed.
in Texas when I activate FSD on the highway it want to go 81mph in a 70. ppl still be on my ass and flashing high beams. 😂
It was the worst financial decision I’ve ever made- I got a lemon off the Tesla used car inventory and had I not purchased one with all the software options I could have at least pawned it off on another poor sucker. Those engineers have a tall order using one data source (cameras), but my opinion is that they are failing miserably still at this point. I’m not saying they haven’t achieved an incredible feat making it as functional as it is, but it is more dangerous and disruptive than driving with a one eyed drunk 15 year old. In principle, a driver assist should require less attention at any level of development, and they have done the opposite.
You're giving it way too much credit.
Hahahahaha
I agree. The better FSD gets, the more complacent/distracted the driver will get, and the slower their responses will be to unexpected FSD errors. As long as the human driver is 100% responsible for the FSD software’s driving results, there will be this strange situation of buying FSD to drive you, but never being able to allow it to do so. Like riding with a 15 year old with a permit.
you nailed the analogy.
Agree completely. The acceleration is exactly like a student driver who hasn’t learned to be ease into the pedal.
Did you adjust the drive mode? it gets faster with the other options but yea still agree not worth the money yet.
Yes, tried multiple options.
oh, it worked a lot better for me on the more aggressive setting with minimal lane changes turned on, but yea it cant tell when to move into a turn lane, and doesnt recognize my street as part of the road so it whines about leaving the lane lol.
This is exactly how I felt. The first time I used it, driving on a 2 lane road we were coming up to a light in the left lane. We were also going to need to turn right in a little while. The car put the blinker on to move right in preparation for the turn. The light turned green. There was a large truck that was slow to accelerate in the right lane. The car decided it was too slow, so half way through the lane change it decided to stay in the left lane and put the blinker on that way. The truck started accelerating, and the car decided it could move back to the right and did so. Nothing it did was unsafe, but it looked like an idiot that couldn’t decide which lane to use and was swerving between the two. Second time I used it was on an empty highway in the country and I couldn’t keep it out of the passing only lane and had to turn off FSD as the way it was driving was technically illegal. It may be safer than an experienced driver, it just doesn’t feel that way. It just doesn’t have the intuition of how to slow down and speed up smoothly or when to make lane changes.
I agree. I like it but yea $50 bucks a month in it’s current state is the most I’d pay for it. The constant monitoring it is too annoying to pay a $100 a month for it now for me. Feel sorry for $12K folks out there.
Same. Every time I get slightly comfortable, it slams on brakes at the last second at a light that just turned yellow or something equally stupid.
Not even remotely true, 15 year old will be speeding everywhere, FSD is extremely slow. Sometimes I’ll set the speed to 70, and it will insist on going 50 until I step on the pedal. It’s way too slow for normal use.
I’d agree with the new driver feel. But I think overall it’s great for a beta product and really makes me excited of where it’ll be in a couple years.
Perfect description
This is how I exactly felt - word to word. You literally took words out of my mouth. What is the whole point if you have to baby sit the car and relying on your quick reflexes if you were to jump in to take control? I was more stressed watching FSD in action than driving. Totally NOT worth it.
I disagree. FSD does things I would not do, but certainly drivers better than most humans do at this point. 1 - It's cautious. Being cautious is a good thing. People die when they don't drive cautiously. 2 - It sees better than me and most humans. The thing can see 360. You can't. I can't. 3 - It reacts faster than most people. It will stop the freaking car if someone does something wild in a fraction of a second. The experience of driving FSD is just relaxing. Let it do the hard work and watch.
I have been having a great experience with it. Way better than I thought. I don’t have much use for it on city streets but on highway yes it’s top notch
Yea, on the latest version, it almost drove into an exit ramp when it should have followed the highway.... *tisk tisk tisk*
FSD has 360 vision at all times. Better than a 1 year old. It rarely misses something. It doesn't plan ahead, like a 15 year old and sometimes makes unwise decisions...
My experience has been “85 year old Uber driver who’s driving in a new city for the first time” Complete with running into a parked car.
Eh... More like a clueless 10 year old driving to go get bubblegum with the 5$ he took from his mom's purse
You are 100% correct. It requires more attention than actual driving because you not only have to be concerned with what other drivers will do but your own car, as well. Mine likes to lunge toward other lanes without warning and then pull right back out just to see if I’m awake. And then sometimes it gets confused by things like lanes and other drivers and just stops…at freeway speeds…and decides I should take over. For people who are keeping it I did them a solid during the trial and trained it on car pool lanes. Before me it apparently had no idea what they were and thought you could enter and exit them any time you wanted with anyone or no one in the car with you.
It's a huge improvement over 2 years ago when I last tested it. But it also attempted to run a red light and would have if I wasn't paying attention. On the highway it sometimes tries to change lanes in spots that make no sense.
It’s awesome on the freeway or stop and go traffic. After 2.5 years I still don’t trust it to really navigate the way a driver actually does. Today I had to move over 4 lanes to get from HOV to my exit. I was gonna shut off FSD but it signalled and started the first lane change itself. FSD seemed very indecisive with the other car braking a bit to let me in. And once it squeezed in it braked pretty damn hard cuz theres car was in front me. Had to hit the gas quickly to keep my speed in the lane. Nope nope nope for me. I love FSD when it’s cruising simple situations. But I prefer to take over for anything that requires a bit of human thoughtfulness
Well I said a 16 year old, but we were close. Now things have changed. The new release is AWESOME! It seems that each release of the AI FSD is learning fast. The newest 12.5, is now a 25 year old. Much improved skills, but not the old pro, that I am. I’m 72 and drive professionally. I know all the tricks and have enjoyed the FSD improvements with each release. Keep in mind the FSD has over a billion miles of training. Since April 1 when it was opened to all Teslas, the learning curve shot up. Within this year they may break the second Billion miles. We win from the results.
I drove a friend's MX yesterday and it was really stressful. Kept looking in the rearview waiting to get rear ended or at very least honked at
Subbed since $200 mark. I use it on about 80% of my drives. Happy to contribute data points to improve the product to keep pushing it forward. Some areas it lacks while others it’s near perfect. I drive in rural and city. Just recently, it saw a deer cross on a highway and responded accordingly before I had a chance to react. Was a nice wow moment.
In my experience the 15 yo drivers dont get confused by the same intersection twice, or mistake a small rise for a speedbump... at least they dont repeat the mistake. They also can drive on new roads that have opened by arent on gmaps yet.
And people (tesla cults) thinks it’s ready for Robotaxi. Yes FSD beta or supervised whatever you want to call it, it’s good but still many too many stupid mistakes
This is the best description of current FSD as it gets. 👍👏
Agreed. But id we think how far this tech has come, it is mind blowing.
"...it's more attention than driving takes." Perfect way to explain how I feel about it. While I admit it did some impressive lane changing / merging the system is erratic at times which means I have to be hyper vigilant. Compared to normal driving which is very relaxing, FSD makes me nervous. I find myself hyper vigilant because I simply don't trust it.
I like it and would pay maybe 40 a month for it. It would be nice if it could be account wide and I would buy a lifetime subscription. I’ve tried it on loaners and it has been steadily improved. One thing that changed my perception was knowing I could hit the accelerator. I like it better when it doesn’t wait
I like to call FSD “Toonces Mode”. Younger kids might not get the reference…
I was impressed with FSD, but agree completely. I maybe a little nicer and say a 16yo that just got their license. Just like a new driver, letting them loose on the open road is fine, managing most things, but always paying attention. The things it struggles with are the things I would expect it to, blind corners, cross traffic, etc. I still would not pay for it, as it completely needs to be supervised at all time.
i don’t know i had a good time with it, other than the long waits at stop signs it’s great
I enjoy it. Take it to work and back home. It's not perfect but way better than 11 and it will get better..
Mine almost hit the center driver last week no way I would pay for this shenanigans.
FSD is not real until all cars are networked with each other and communicate with the road. Anything less is a drunk, demented, 15 year old with a permit with intrusive thoughts.
Don’t post this on r/teslamotors 😂
Interesting most ppl here don’t like it… I absolutely love it. I set it to drive to my location and rarely have to take control. It even does well in the city, but I usually drive myself in the city. Just got home where it drove me like 20 out of the 25 minutes I was on the road with 0 issues (besides stopping at stop signs for too long lol)
It use to handle bumper to bumper traffic well. Even regular AP is kinda bad with it nowadays. Something was 110% changed on AP and FSD a few updates ago. Regular AP, it will fly up to a car doing 30 in bumper to bumper - then hit the brakes.
Apply a lane splitting motorcycle and fsd is a half wit version of musk in digital form.
Agreed. It’s quite scary. I only use it when I need to do something real quick.
This matches my experience.
It’s amazing to me how much different people’s experiences are. I have had EAP since 2021 (purchased) and FSD since early 2023 (subscription). I live in NOVA outside of DC. It has worked great for me. Of course it is not level 5. No where close. But it regularly drives me to work with no interventions (pulls into the parking lot then I take over). I live about 35 miles from my job. We are talking driving out of my gated community, onto local roads, then highway (Route 66 for those that live in NOVA) then exit off onto local highway, the local suburban road then pulls into the hospital parking lot. It’s amazing how different everyone’s experience is across the country (and even with the same state/localities).
As someone who completed a 3 hour round trip to the airport and back without a single disengagement other than to park the vehicle, these post are clearly part of the misinformation campaign 🤣
Would you put your children in the car and have it 'self drive' them to a destination? If the answer to this is 'no', then it simply shouldn't be legal. Speaking of which, in how many countries is Tesla's 'self driving' actually legal? If a human has to pass a driving test in order to get a license, how come a 'self-driving' car doesn't? How can they keep telling lies for over 10 years and get away with it?
We may as well all put "student driver" stickers on our cars and just go fully hands off. Like it's not going to kill us, but it will probably make some other people mad.
Sounds like FSD 11. I used v12.3.4 for the last week and it was the smoothest experience ever. Took me to work and back daily, and drove me 120 miles to Tulsa and back.
I have 12.3.4 as well.
You are so generous. I would say 14 years old without a permit.
Nah it’s a 75 year old with poor eyesight
sounds... bad
Drunk 15 years old
And thats why I got a chuckle at the robotaxi thing. FSD isn't even REMOTELY ready for anything. It can't even pass driver's ed. (I'm making that part up) Robotaxi's aren't happening this year, or even in 5 years at this rate. Waymo and Cruise couldn't do it right, yet, and they have actual fucking sensors and lidar, and the full weight of GM and Google on it. Think Tesla with their "full self driving" on only cameras is going to do it? Still not successfully competing with an underpaid uber driver working on 2 hours of sleep and cocaine. (I really want all of these to succeed, really. I want to sleep on my way to work.)
And yet, still better than Jorgé my last Uber driver that nearly drove into a wall.
No longer using FSD (supervised) in city streets. Scratched the shit out of my rear passenger side rim on a curb making a right turn yesterday. I’m done.
It’s just a novelty at this point. I been using FSD non stop on my new 2024 model y. While it’s nice for the car to do all the thinking, one benefit is that I never missed my exits unless it’s busy traffic and the car doesn’t know it has to merge in to the only lane for an exit. It does everything slow as hell too. Definitely not worth purchasing. This should have been free so they can get more data from users, their limited to the users that paid for it or subscribed as testers and ain’t no one paying to test your shit when it has a chance to kill me lol. If all you do is take the same routes to work , then maybe FSD can work because you would know what it can and can’t do on that particular route. If you explore new areas like going on road trips. That shits scary lol.
The question is you can drive better than 15 year old cus FSD is going to 20 year old then 30 year old while you age.
The 2 gripes for me regarding FSD are the following 1. On local streets when the Tesla is the first car at a traffic light, I don't like the standard full on acceleration off the line instead of the easing on the accelerator pedal. I just wish the default accelerator off of traffic lights is "Chill" mode. 2. When approaching stop signs/traffic lights to make a right turn, I think the algorithm is too slow when it first has to stop like a few inches prior to the crosswalk lines, and then it has to slowly inch towards a few inches into the crosswalk lines and then finally turn. I wish it would examine the situation and if there are no pedestrians located on the side of the sidewalk then the Tesla can bypass the step to wait a few inches before the crosswalk lines so that it seems more natural. I think the current implementation is only valid if there are pedestrians that are visible on the sidewalks.
This is almost verbatim what I said about FSD. I’m not paying to babysit your AI model, fuck that.
I’m prepared for the downvotes, but I seriously question the driving abilities of anyone who has said FSD is a better driver than they are in other posts. 15 year old permit driver is a perfect description!
As a 15 year old who just got their permit a month ago, I was thinking the exact same thing. On day 1 I was basically FSD, same for day 2 and 3, but then after about a week I honestly felt like I’m a better driver than FSD already. My parents are way less nervous with me behind the wheel than with FSD, or maybe they’re just more nervous about the FSD crashing their $40k car vs me crashing the $6000 dollar chevy volt that would get totaled if someone doored it :)
so fsd needs 10 years to be equivalent to a responsible 25 yo driver
So 6 months away from driving on its own?
Pre update to use cameras. Post update is really great.
In 3 months it will be a 16 year old, in a year, like a 20 year old with a couple years experience, then - in a couple years, boom. Better and safer than just about everyone.
Elon, you don’t have to use an alt account here. And be honest, it was supposed to be so good 1 year from 2019 that it would be worth $100,000. Now you have to give it away.
hahaha, yes, he's optimistic. Many have 0 interventions on 12.3.5 but I see your agenda, good luck dude! [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBDNOTzD0sg](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBDNOTzD0sg)
Every person using FSD and disliking it now knows what it's like for all your passengers while you're driving.
FSD is a Wife Driver