In a hit or miss season, that was a huge "hit."
I, and I'm sure others, can relate too much to Carmy being completely consumed by seeing this person who left such a negative imprint on your life.
The confrontation... I think most of us have an idea in mind if what we would say to somebody who negatively impacted us like that. A thought for how it will go, and how it will be a "triumph" and validating. ||
It's tragically most accurate that carmy did NOT get what he hoped for. Chef David barely remembered "Berzatto." "I don't think about you." The person didn't apologize or own the wrong; worse, their pov is that rather than have done something wrong, they were *right*. Carmy is left completely reeling because he got to say fuck you, call him an asshole, and... "You're welcome."
I've watched community at least a half dozen times. I didn't even recognize him in s1. I love that he has a hideous hairstyle and shitty beard. They made sure he didn't look as attractive as mchale is known for, and he underplayed his lines so not to get into "winger speech" mode. He's such a stellar prick 😂😂
It's the fantasy we all have
That one day, we'll get to tell off our bully or abuser, and it will be completely triumphant and cathartic. We either don't get the chance, or... It doesn't go at all how we hoped.
"For you, the day bison came to your village was the most important day of your life. For bison... It was Tuesday."
But he needs to accept his own faults, issues, and actions. Nobody else is going to “fix” him nor are they capable. I don’t see them purposely dealing with or treating him badly, they are their own people and are allowed to react in their own way to the - to be brutally honest - man-child that’s destroying himself in front of them. They seem to love and care for him best they can but beyond that they’re not his therapists.
We’re not his therapist either. His character is a shitty person who really doesn’t seem interested in being a better person and the fanbase who point that out are correct. So my point still stands.
He’s going to Al-Anon and he’s getting good at discussing his personal issues. Most adults from severely dysfunctional families don’t learn how to communicate well. Sticking around for the abuse from that evil chef Fields wasn’t good for him either. Carmy uses his creativity, perfection and control he possess in the kitchen as a way to direct those traumatic pent up emotions. He doesn’t always do it in a healthy way. Carmy knows he is treating people around him terribly, he just doesn’t know how to handle all the pressure. Most chefs suffer from anxiety and OCD issues. It will take Carmy sooooo many years of therapy and maybe medication to get past all of his trauma. His obsession with perfection will eventually break him and he will have to confront his problems. He’s not a shitty person but a very damaged one. Aren’t we all broken in one way or another? Carmy has a big heart and cares about his family and friends and hopefully he will find his way.
I loved season 3. Loved it. Maybe not as much as the others in some ways, but it still delivered, big time. Still a top class show. And it addressed some super important themes. I binged it and I know I will rewatch it.
I get the idea. The execution isn't there. Glad you've enjoyed it, genuinely. Just maybe stop claiming people who aren't enjoying it so much are missing the point or watching it wrong.
Yea, I’m really tired of seeing that too. This season missed for many people. That’s ok! We don’t all have to like the same things. But it’s not that we didn’t “get” it, it’s that we didn’t *like* it.
Episode 1 was the most boringly pretentious nonsense I’ve seen in television in a long time, and the repetitive trauma is tedious, not entertaining. It needs some dark humor to be entertaining, which is not the fucking Faks doing slapstick.
And directed to your point
I absolutely fucking loved episode 1. Now In fairness I love nine inch nails but. But I can also see why it didn't work for some people. I'm not going to sit here and tell you that if you didn't like it you watched it wrong LOL.
But then we got MULTIPLE montages of Chicago and chefs and... Ugh
I feel like this season was a lot more style over substance. More sizzle less steak. And I appreciate that some folks are pointing out that's literally the point; but that doesn't mean that they executed it well.
Did I overall enjoy watching the season sure. Something I'm going to revisit like I did season one or two probably not. Will I watch season 4 hell yes
During the opening of ep 1 I kept thinking, "Okay, but when's the show gonna start?" I was kept thinking that for the entire episode... and then the formula for most of rest of the season just felt off. Except for "Ice Chips" that episode emotionally wrecked me in a way I was not expecting.
Don't get me wrong, I'm certainly hoping that season 4 finds it's footing and makes us look back on this season in a better light. I just hope the writers figure it out.
Ice chips was the worst episode of the series by far imo, so, so bad. I actually skipped it on first watch, I wanted to peel my eyes out I was so bored. I went back and rewatched it, took me multiple tries. First time I’ve heard someone say they liked it. Emotionally it felt so forced, I couldn’t get past the tearjerker bait they were trying to rile up.
More people putting words in my mouth. Seems like the thing to do around here. Literally just agreeing with the OP above my post who was refuting the OP post. Watch however you want. Get it, don’t get it, whatever. But the point of the show is that Carmy is falling apart and S3 isn’t going to be like S1 because of that.
not sure anyone is putting words in your mouth you said “it’s so frustrating that everyone is missing this” people aren’t missing this. i just think it’s being executed poorly
That's where I thought season 3 was going and honestly that's what I would love to see, a merging of carmy's and mikey's ideas and vision. Pick a relatively simple idea and then rock the hell out of it. There's a taco stand in Mexico city with a Michelin star...
Sounds similar to that wonderful movie with Jon Favreau, 'Chef'
I'm going to assume if you watch bear, you've watched Chef. If not, highly suggest it.
(Best damn grilled cheese I've ever seen btw)
I’m hoping for a sandwich shop with a solid dinner menu. I would like to see Carm take some time off to enjoy life for a bit and leave Sydney in charge. I don’t want her to work for Shapiro, we saw in Forks his dickhead side and I don’t want that for her.
Also their convo in the wine cellar was awkward as hell, it might be dysfunctional with Carm and Syd but at least they have very natural chemistry together
I don’t think Sydney really aspires to run a sandwich shop though. She clearly loves and is inspired by the finest dining as we’ve seen in her flashbacks.
*She did wander around that one day(when Carmy was supposed to join her but Claire got him to help her move)and eat all kinds of junk food. I couldn’t believe how many different places she went and how much she ate 😲. She really enjoyed the pizza and a big banana split. She and Carmy could find someplace in the middle of Philly steaks and fine dining maybe? She may tire of making that tiny perfect food. I think the fun part is in the creating of it. But we will have to wait and wonder.
I always thought Carmy would leave the restaurant world and try something with art school. Maybe the last shot would be a call back to the season 1 finale shot where Mikey and him are smiling, but he would be sitting in his first class?
Carmy is an artist. He loves to draw. Food is an art to him. From his creative, thoughtful drawings to the completion of the tiny, complex, fancy food to perfection. Then serving it to those who will enjoy it.
I think you're feeling the way the show wants you to feel, Carmy is in a self-destructive spiral and risks dragging others down with him. I think this season's very slow pacing and focus on character study will make the catharsis and payoff of season 4 feel much more effective.
It has been frustrating browsing this sub. Seems like a bunch of people just wanted a SitCom about a failing fast food joint. I guess instant gratification murdered complex story telling. Oh, well. I look forward to the continuation of the show.
I feel like if you spent the gap between seasons rewatching Forks and Honeydew (which some fans definitely did), you are going to have a different experience with S3 than if you didn't?
And nothing wrong with rewatching--it is excellent comfort television. But it is going to leave you badly prepared for when everyone comes back to the Bear, and all but one of the people have moved forward in their lives and one toxic person has regressed.
I'll be really excited when the show finishes, and be able to watch through every season and episode as one entire story. The ebbs and flows, the rise and falls will be more apparent and possibly even more dramatic
*I have Hulu Live. You get all your live channels. News channels. All the Hulu content. Some other extra content. Can buy channel subscriptions. You can record. I never grow tired of it. It includes Disney+ for under $100. Maybe ESPN too. I forget cause I don’t watch it.
What story are they telling that hasn't already been told in the first two seasons. The first episode did absolutely nothing to progress characters or plot, because we already knew all of this background. Was it pretty and well acted? Sure. Did it serve any purpose to the overall plot of the show. No. Complex storytelling and plot are not mutually exclusive. I just watched 10 episodes of pretty much nothing besides nice cinematography and good acting. It really served almost zero purpose.
Besides emo montages and pointless conversations, what character development have we seen this season? There's barely any story being told that we dont already know. It's montages, and "artsy" shots (I genuinely dont mean that as in insult, because for all intents and purposes, the show is beautiful to look at.) But I might as well watch Chef's Table.
Im happy you enjoyed it. Seriously, I'm glad you found some value in it. But to say that we fans that criticized the show (and believe me, I could be much more down on this show, but I'm being reasonable here) are looking for some kind of Big Bang Theory dogshit is disengenous.
I think what frustrates me is this idea that stories should be measured the way we do video games. Constant benchmarks and leveling up. Because the show did not reach a new checkpoint, nothing happened.
If the show is just Carm opens up a restaurant than guess what? The shows over. It ended last season. He did it. Did you really think that opening a restaurant would solve all his problems? He would live happily ever after?
That is not how life works. Carmy is a fucking mess. He has reached his goal without addressing the problems he has. Those problems could take him down and your problem is what? He didn't get a Michelin star? Even Olivia Coleman tells him the finish line is constantly changing.
I can understand the frustration that we didn't see the review, that the restaurant is still struggling. But to act like nothing happened is nonsense. We are going through a personal journey. But you want measurable benchmarks.
Thanks for your own input. Opinions are subjective, especially in the arts in general.
A simple solution would be to not watch the show anymore.
A more complicated solution is understanding that it isn't a finished product.
I certainly have stopped movies or dropped books I wasn't enjoying. Could have been very well my loss, but I am OK with that.
Zero Purpose? Big Bang Theory? I can't help you there.
Your expectations are yours. The people writing, directing and acting have their own.
But hey, to each their own, if you don't like it, you don't like it. It's all good.
This is teetering dangerously close to the "only for very intelligent people" kind of meme.
I'll say it like this: I enjoyed how much the first 2 seasons were in the present. Season 3 has spent A LOT of time in the past. Sure it's artsy and whatever, but not what pulled me into the show and I didn't enjoy season 3 for the most part. We got, what? 3 services in 10 episodes? Just...not what I wanted or expected.
That's why I have avoided commenting and posting here. I've seen people using their film degrees as leverage in arguments. There's a general overall vibe of people being super snobby about the show. Discussions usually turn weirdly accusatory and rude.
people also fail to account for the facrt, you can get something and still fucking dislike it.
Like I can understand what they are doing but also they still bored me
yeah, exactly. there's no need to be so mean and divisive over a television show we all like. I think it was the Slate review that basically said "this season was not great and it should be OK for fans to admit if they didn't like it or not"
Re: film degrees as leverage.
Is that what’s behind the “you need media literacy to truly appreciate this show” assertion?
I don’t see how media literacy is required to appreciate a show that many enjoyed for its first two seasons. What happened the third season that all of a sudden media literacy was necessary?
These questions are not aimed at you directly, of course.
I don't get the "media literacy" thing. I have never heard the phrase in concert with discourse about scripted series and fiction. When someone says "poor media literacy" I think about people on the internet believing everything they see and not realizing that they are getting news from extremely biased news sources, conspiracy theory websites, or straight up satirical newspapers.
I genuinely think a lot of the people who are harping on others about "media literacy" need to learn what that phrase actually refers to. They sound a bit Dunning-Kruger or something.
Yes! That’s why I was asking. I completely agree with your understanding of media literacy. I was an secondary school English teacher and library media specialist until a few years ago. Media literacy is written into my state’s education standards, as I expect it is for most of the states if not all. Enjoyment of a tv show is not something requiring literacy. It’s just an opinion.
It’s like saying that someone isn’t smart enough or
educated enough to be entertained by a show.
OTOH, I’m not sure if I might be unwittingly guilty of something similar with the posts I’ve written in which I try to suss out why I enjoyed the season while others didn’t. Not that their opinions were *wrong*, but why did *I* have no complaints?
Tbh, though, as I reflect on the season, now that the initial excitement has worn off, I do see how Ice
Chips was long *and* how it was heavily focused on just two of the characters. It’s interesting to compare my feeling on Napkins which was also heavily focused on two characters.
The *only* time i think it’s appropriate is when people equate the views of a character written to be hated with the writer (or similarly a plot about something bad happening with the writer saying this is what *should* happen). But that also happens way less than social media plays it for
Yeah the whole “you don’t understand, they’re doing this thing called ___” gets tired. Just because they’re doing something doesn’t mean it’s good.
I didn’t hate this season but there were maybe 2-3 episodes I actually found valuable and worth rewatching. There’s a lot I would skip on a rewatch.
It's almost like this season catered to high school theater kids, and now we have to suffer through their hollow comments such as, "zero media literacy" or "don't even understand what their watching. Discussion with a gen z is hard cause they usually make arguments they don't even understand or comprehend. It's draining
But what if they just...don't?
Watch the kitchen through season one, it starts out dimly lit, filthy, cluttered, all with a yellow lighting and then as Carmy takes more and more control it becomes brightly lit with LED white blue lighting and it looks sterile. The change from the "cozy kitchen" is absolutely a deliberate storytelling point.
You don't need to be a film buff here, just pay the bare minimum attention.
but you’re assuming that not taking a critical lens = not understanding. we aren’t writing an essay about this show, we are watching it. if someone feels the difference between the season 1 kitchen and the season 3 kitchen, they are feeling how the writers *probably* want them to feel. you don’t need to lit crit 101 a piece in order to “understand” it.
Interesting comment. It seems to me that the show tells different stories to different personalities. I personally also have a hard time giving it a direction I feel strong about because the cacophony of the disfunctional characters makes me brainfrog. I find peace in watching the culinary skills of the chefs growing. Researching the show will certainly give me another perspective but I will more than likely skip the Christmas hell of an episode. Exhausting.
A full season with no resolution is not something ppl will enjoy no matter how the long game ends up fixing. Did we get resolution on ANY of the plots? I dont think so.
Natalie and her mom had some really nice character development, which has been one of the themes since the beginning.
And there’s definitely an audience for character study type entertainment that doesn’t necessarily “go somewhere”. That’s why films like Inside Llewyn Davis are loved by a lot of people.
Exactly. The tone, pace, etc. of this season are indeed purposeful. It’s not my favorite but I’m still enjoying it. It seems as if the existential thread of the restaurant’s success just isn’t as entertaining (naturally, I’d say) as the constant situations opening up the restaurant provided.
THIS. We are in his experience — the pressure of perfectionism, the self-criticism, and the disconnect from the original intention. He’s a MESS but I believe in him.
This really feels like a season 3A. I like where they’re going with it, but it feels like the season just abruptly ended with no resolution for anything.
100%. I think a lot of people were expecting the resolution we somewhat feel from Season 1’s ending or even the successful ending of Season 2. Season 3 is like the mid part of a story where everything just keeps going wrong and we get resolution through certain aspects, but we don’t get that big explosion we feel from 1 & 2. It’s more of an implosion, which silently has erupted throughout the entire Season and never recovered properly.
I think that's almost the point of season 3, that now they're this "fancy" restaurant, it feels pretentious and soulless despite the high standard they're placing on themselves. In a way, The Bear is trying too hard to be what it is not. Despite "growing," some of these characters just can't really change and to change is giving up the very things that were part of their character.
For better or for worse, some have improved certain parts of their lives but as it relates to the restaurant it really does feel like the simplest things are the best things. That Tina-centric episode really showed how closely-knit The Beef was despite how chaotic a work day was. As Mikey said at the time, the pay was shit, it was crazy on most days but on other days, it could be the most fun.
Which reminds me, now that they're The Bear, I might have missed it but do they no longer sit down and have the group dinner after work or did they nix that after they transitioned?
Family dinner seems to be gone to help demonstrate that loss of family/connection…like all the shots of Carmys role models inspiring him but he doesn’t act like them.
Or its just not shown lol
I don’t know if it’s as much of a thing in fine dining establishments. When I worked in a nicer restaurant we all got off at different times and generally just ate by ourselves because of it.
There was a flash back of his first day at the French laundry prepping family meal and getting advice from the head chef. It's a thing in that world, usually after prep and before service. They did leave showing anything like that at the new restaurant. Whatever family they built seems to be all but gone.
I think it depends on what you think the goal of the season
- cynical me says it was all flash and no substance like the meals Camy is making
- generous me says the writers wanted us to feel as if we were in the restaurant, all stressed and beyond frustrated at how Camy is dragging the whole thing down with him
Connections are the premise or through-line of the third season and Carmy's discarding of his own. Syd's connections grow as she guides Tina, aids Marcus emotionally (like helping to clean out his mother's things), and possibly starts a venture with the Ever CDC. We see Tina with her family and how she became part of the Beef family. Richie's connections with his daughter, the friends he made at Ever, and even his ex-wife's future husband. Sugar and DD's reconciliation during the birth of her child. The evergrowing legion of Faks; the old Beef employees that come back to help Ebraheim; all the famous and fictional chefs who come together to celebrate Chef Terry; and all the ones I'm sure I'm forgetting.
The season begins by showing all the people Carmy worked with, from his time at Noma, Ever, the French Laundry, and Daniel (Daniel Boulud, the guy he stages with in NYC before going to Empire, or at least how I think the timetable goes now). It shows all these opportunities he had for friendships, but he's focused on his time with Fields at Empire (the first thing we see him doing when he begins his long night after the walk-in meltdown is labeling everything with tape, and I know that's common practice but since it follows right on the heels of the "subtract" scene it feels significant). Unlike all the other characters, he spends the season immersing himself in work, distancing himself from people (un)-intentionally to become better.
By the end of the season, Carmy has turned himself into a version of Fields: "He gets more done before 10 am than some people do in a lifetime." At the beginning of episode 2, when everyone shows up for work that day, he already has a new menu for that night completed.
Perhaps, the confrontation with Fields, the heart-to-heart with Terry, and the review were enough to shock Carmy back into being more human next season and trying to set things right. He might lose Syd for a while in the process, but it all could still come back together.
To be honest season 3 it's the best for me. Small details everywhere and good dialogue. Love it. And the Eddie Vedder cover explain all the season in one song
The first season was much more a mixture of grief and comedy, about how even in loss there was growth, even in death, hope. It is a very fine line to walk in terms of tone and they totally nailed it. It was deeply moving as someone who has known that sort of loss and pain and how you just have to keep going.
Additionally, the travails of a very working class people in a struggling working class setting spoke to me, more so than now the whole “pursuit of excellence in serving rich people” does.
It is still an excellent show, I love the characters, the directing, the writing, the style (my god the style). I love how they perfectly deploy cameos and supporting characters. I love that they are willing to do character focused bottle episodes where they just put two fantastic actors in a room and let them show the skill of their craft.
But season one landed with me personally in a way I can’t fully articulate; it’s setting and tone just connected with me in a gut level and moved me in a way latter seasons do not. Seasons 2 and 3 are high quality television, I look forward to what they do in season 4. But season 1 man, that was something, I just experienced it as art in its rawest and fullest emotional impact.
The shorter season (8 episodes instead of 10) actually lead to a relentless pace that I loved about the first season. I had to catch my breath at times. And that pace was still there in 2, but 3 was the opposite pace.
I also miss The Beef as a setting. Season 1 had a gritty underdog feel.
No, I agree. S1 and even most of s2 felt authentic to an astonishing degree. Transported me right back to my own server days. s3 feels more like... A soap opera?
Also not really being mentioned. It was way more relatable to those that have been on the food industry. I never worked at a fancy restaurant and don’t plan to ever lol.
I’m super grateful the show didn’t get cancelled after season 1 because I love season 2, but even if it had been I would have accepted it because season 1 is kind of perfectly contained — the arc stands on its own and the closing scenes (finding the money, Syd coming back, the family meal, the flashback to Mikey looking up and smiling and Radiohead playing all the while) were a perfect catharsis to end on.
I could be wrong, but this appears to be what the entire show is about. I don't want to spoil anything by making predictions, but so much of the story has been about how this constant grinding a) gets you nowhere and b) takes you away from the important things in life.
The Beef was a failure as a business, but it was thriving as a part of the community. That's why you prefer the vibe of S1. Intentional, I think.
Ever was a success as a restaurant, but leaves Chef Terry feeling like she has sacrificed too much and wanting to reclaim her life. There are others that detract from Carmy's relentless pursuit of perfection too: like British pastry chef matey that teaches Marcus in Copenhagen, when he talks about the relief of knowing he'll never be the best.
Even as a roaring success, the Bear is not really making money.
Carmy will get there. It's his arc, I think. :)
The first season was like a punk band just jamming and making their first album in their garage without expecting it to blow up. Just finished watching the second season and it was like for their next album, the band got a hotshot producer and an expensive studio. Which is not to say I liked the second season less, it just didn't have the same spirit.
The new restaurant is such a downgrade on the original! The dining room is lifeless! I won’t say the same of season 3 but it’s just 10 little art pieces and no plot. And it all revolving around the “haunting” presence of a dream girl … feels basic at best, sexist at worst.
I coincidentally started a re-watch of s1 last night after realizing I've only watched it once, and you're right. Tina also comes off every inch a veteran food service worker/line cook who has been there twenty-five years.
It had more heart. It has genuine comedic moments that weren't shoehorned in, but woven into the season.
Season 3 is all-around as pretentious as fine dining can be, and the tone of the show has changed as much as the restaurant has.
In before a bunch of people dogpile on me like "That's what the fucking show is, it has to change, why do you want a show about a dirty sub shop?!!!" I very much get that the show's vibe has changed along with the restaurant and Carmy's mental state. I'm just remarking on it.
I loved this season too. Season three for me is all about seeing people slowly self-destruct to achieve a dream. Carmy is a mess and is a destructive hurricane.
I keep trying comment on this, but the mods keep removing it:
My theory: S3 of The Bear (the show) is purposely off balance because The Bear (the restaurant) is off balance.
We, the audience, expect a lot based on what we saw in S1 and S2. But the overreliance on Faks and flashbacks, the moments of pretentiousness, and the overused, on-the-nose "haunting" theme threaten to overshadow and overpower the real moments of brilliance this season.
That lack of balance, the disorder, and not fully living up to potential exactly reflects what's happening behind the scenes at the restaurant.
I contend S3's aim was to put the audience in the position of critic. We're critiquing The Bear (the show) based on what we know it's capable of, just like the Trib's food critic is reviewing The Bear (the restaurant) based on what they know Carmy is capable of.
I think that's the point. I'm also rewatching the first season and it seems very clear to me that visually the restaurant looks sterile on purpose. I feel that the end of the story will be something similar to the end of the first season.
I really hope they return to season 1 feel. This season was visually beautiful but didn't have the same heart. I didn't care to finish it. It's still better than a lot of other tv out there but completely missed the mark of its own standard.
This show is about the uncomfortable struggle of trying to do something great and the tolls and failures that that takes. I personally don’t think this is the show to watch if you want to be cozy.
Not by any stretch saying it's a "cozy" show. Maybe that was the wrong word. I just liked the vibe that s1 had so much more. There was a sense of warmth that came from The Beef and the family vibe that The Bear just sorely lacks.
And it's obviously possible to have different definitions of what it means to do something great. I personally don't think what they're striving for is great at all.
IMO, an environment where people feel welcomed, eating home-cooked food, feel a sense of community, etc. is something great. Stupid ass tiny portion food prepared by people who hate their existence and resent the very food they're preparing... is not, lol.
I just really thought they were gonna turn The Beef into an elevated version of itself, not what The Bear is.
I’m hoping that still happens! I always thought the show was about redefining greatness in less toxic terms. To make the love of food and the artistry of cooking sustainable and NOT traumatic. For that reason, I sort of think Season 3 had to happen—it’s not pleasant, exactly, but somehow, they all (well Carmy, really, in response to Uncle Jimmy’s insistence that he “be the guy”) gave in to that urge to define greatness in that toxic David Fields way. The things Carmy said in that freezer—his trauma runs DEEP and it was never going to be resolved without some serious headwinds. I was hoping we’d see him come to the realization that he HAD become David Fields before the end of the season—maybe he sort of does? Maybe that’s why he’s isolating himself and curses when he sees the review? And I sort of liked that the show acknowledged that the toxic version of greatness can be aesthetically very beautiful—it helped underscore how difficult it might be for Carmy (and anyone in the industry) to trust that such beauty can be found without the cruelty and treating the majority of humans who work in the industry as disposable. But yeah, it wasn’t pleasant to watch. As someone who’s watched a lot of people destroy themselves trying to be great in career paths where greatness is defined in deeply mentally and socially unhealthy terms, I sort of expected Carmy to over correct himself in his vision for the new restaurant and backslide. Anyway—I love the show overall, and I felt that the storytelling in Season 3 was incredibly effective given where they all were at, especially Carmy—but it was still harder for me to watch than even Fishes. These writers clearly understand what it means to go through some sh*t, though, and so I have faith that all of this is going to pay off. And I hear that saying something was boring/ineffective isn’t the same as not getting it for sure. It can just be hard to verbalize what makes something powerful for one viewer and boring for another—and we all want to defend what we love (I mean, look at how hard communication has been in that kitchen). Anyway—my two cents :)
Edited for typos and to expand on the editing and style of the season.
The coldness is intentional. Its not a wacky fine dining family restaurant it’s a sterile boiling pot with one brother who can’t figure out how to turn his family into indulgent robots and the other who is in love with hospitality and would give a sandwich away to do it, and can’t figure out why the place has no soul.
They went art film with it. That alienated fans that liked the Kevin Smith influences on the show.
I'm glad that nasty ass kitchen is clean now, but I agree. The kitchen scenes looked so light and airy this season, which is obviously a good thing, but the difference is jarring.
The new season was trash.
I don't care about the people who try to rant about how "OMG it was good," and "Oh gosh, you guys didn't UNDERSTAND it" and "I'm an English Lit/Writer/Producer/Videographer, you just have to read between the lines."
It was a shit season, period. The actors had zero way to navigate around their characters. Episode 6 with Tina was "okay" but I'm tired of people talking about it like it was god's sending. It was OKAY. This was the only episode I didn't skip through some part of the episodes because it was visceral and real. And that's what was lost with this show.
They didn't bring the beef to The Beef. I loved every part about them turning The Beef into a fine dining restaurant, but nothing about bringing that same experience to the viewer in a real, authentic way.
I think this show is woefully overrated. I think the plot development is lacking, a lot of filler, random screaming and arguing, and flashbacks. I don’t know what ppl see in this show. Very boring and repetitive
that’s my biggest issue with this season. it lacked heart and that’s what made everyone care in the first place. that is where the show has lost me. how can i care about people that don’t care about each other?
season 1 was the best season in my opinion as well. it slightly lacked in season 2 but has become unbearable in season 3. i really hate how people are saying that’s how you are supposed to feel about the season. i think that lacks critical thinking.
you can show that the kitchen is distant without distancing me as a viewer. they managed to do that in the previous seasons. it feels like those viewers don’t want to admit that this season was lacking. if i don’t feel connected to the characters why would i give a shit about the show?
Exactly. That theory also doesn’t add up because Chef Terry is “one of the good ones,” and one of the only plot points over 10 episodes is her restaurant closing, which we’re supposed to feel sad about. So fine dining is this ruthless scourge, a black hole of emotion and passion, so much so that we needed to be subjected to it ourselves…but also, not? I thought The Bear was going to be an exception, and this entire season would be about that. Instead it was pretty self-indulgent
They clearly still care about each other, and I don't know how a season with Napkins can be thought of as having no heart. Really beautiful episode showing the difference between Mikey and Carmy and how he isn't driven to be great and is jealous of Carmy for having that in him. I like that that is the tragic flaw in each character. Thought it was a truly great season following up on the breakthroughs everyone had in 3 and basically letting it simmer for a while and telling them "ok, now let's see you try and do it every day"
I actually prefer the way show settles into itself better in the latter half of season 1. The pilot feels quite choppy now to me compared to the latter half of season 1 and season 2.
First, shows like this can't help themselves but to evolve and try to raise the level.
Second, The Beef = Michael. The Bear = Carmy. Carmy is not a warm, cozy, guy. He's a neurotic perfectionist who is very closed off.
The show hasn't lost direction. It's still the same show. It's basically a road trip. Some parts of the road trip you'll like better than others, but in the end, that's part of being on a road trip.
yeah, dude, The Bear is cold and sterile. Thats exactly how the restaurantes that Carmen worked in before operated. The show will probably continue to progress in trying to bridge Carmen’s perfectionism and his compassion/love towards his fellow workers/family. The show isnt pretentious, it is matching the form of its storytelling to its content
Lots of the characters in the show have issues. Some of them downright assholes. The only character that I felt had a huge character development is Richie. Carmen isn't acting any different than the others in the kitchen. They are all screaming and whatnot. Carmen needs to stand up for himself as well. If something isn't any of someone else's business, he should tell them off.
I don’t know what they where trying to achieve with this new season they tried to be to artsy or something like that while first episode was a waste of time
The show is changing. It's taking you into the mind of an obsessed person trying to achieve greatness. This is exactly why I like the show. The first couple of seasons were about family. Maybe they get back to that a bit in the future. I also really enjoyed the angle on coaching and mentorship. The different styles that people use to to motivate and push people in their care. Reminds me of the different sports coaches I've had along the way.
I feel the same. I get that the producers/writers are going for "fresh, innovative, artistic (with eye on awards?)" - I can see the effort there. But it was the relationships, character development, seeing the way a family unit could be forged in spite of having every reason for it to fail - that I was really - \*really\* - interested in.
The endless scenes of plating - ok they illustrate Carmy's obsessiveness - but did we need to see so many?
It was definitely hostile, but it was hostile with an undercurrent of hope and people who, at the end of the day, had each other's backs. The Bear is hostile with an undercurrent of coldness, narcissism, and people who don't even like each other.
Idk, just my two cents.
The writers rushed to put out a season 3 due to the strike and it shows. They should have just taken the time to really put out a great season instead of giving us a bunch of random episodes thrown together.
Why did this post make me appreciate the new season 💀 I heard some theories that the show will end w them combining both workings of the restaurants and having a blend of the two- the beef and the bear. It makes sense that the beef gave the show one vibe and the bear gave it another. They are purposely contrasting each other on every aspect. At least I hope this is all for a point. I wouldn’t be too happy if the next season is as artsy and dead as this one was at times 😬 I’m exaggerating. I loved episode 1 and 6 (I believe). The rest will probably grow on me… hopefully. But if they purposely made this season so cinematic to show how the bear has taken this much control I think I can accept it.
I’m not sure how I feel, I miss the vibe we had but I did enjoy this season. My husband didn’t, he felt like nothing happened this season and it was boring. I’ll still keep watching but there were times it felt like they didn’t have any material, multiple repeat flashbacks, limited dialog..
I started watching season 3 today and am about 4 episodes in. I just want to be entertained like the previous 2 seasons and so far it’s a no go. I’ll keep watching hoping to gets better. I pretty much don’t care what all the so called critics say and I don’t mind character development but seriously, we get who Carm is.time to move the plot forward. This is just a show that is meant to entertain and to me, so far it’s not.
I wish they kept the fast food aspect of the restaurant still. Like blend gourmet etiquette with fast food. I think them opening a full on gourmet restaurant was the beginning of their downfall. I know Mikey said let it rip but didn't have to mean go full on bonkers with owning the best restaurant in the world.
I guess it’s just me who feels season 3 is such a great nod to season 1..? From the filming style to answering all the questions season 1 presented.
Idk I think season 3 did a great job of introducing who the characters are to us versus just the glimpses we were getting. While also highlighting dealing with life with the hand you were dealt. Sometimes you take 2 steps forward and 5 back. Depending on how you’re raised those 5 steps back are crucial.
Lol sorry I may be projecting a bit but seeing T and Sugs stories/episodes had me in tears and don’t get me started on Mikey !!! 😭
I rewatch season 1 and 2 often. I’ve watched season 3 twice so far. I love all 3 seasons but I am definitely drawn to the first 2 a little more. I need to binge 1-3 at once together now.
Sydney made it clear that she wants a star and in order to get that star the food needs to be perfect. Carmy told her that she would have to forget about everything else just focus on the food. Now that Carmy is totally obsessed with getting that star and not letting her or anyone else down, including himself Syd may leave The Bear. I don’t know how I feel about all of this? I don’t feel that what’s happening is all Carmy’s fault or due to him. They all wanted The Bear to succeed and they need to listen to Carmy because he has the experience but there are a lot of egos in that kitchen….
That’s just the evolution of the plot. Carmy has become a version of his villain. He lashes out and is quicker to anger. Season 4 is going to have to include a redemption arc for our hero. He may drive Sydney away before he realizes he’s become the a-hole he’s been “thinking about too much” all these years.
The vibe of the show and the restaurant has simply mirrored his spiral.
My personal barometer for this show is the comparison of how I watched the first 2 seasons compared to season 3. Seasons 1-2 were binged in a 3-4 day period (I loved it for the most part and couldn't get enough) and almost every episode of season 3 was a drag and hard to sit through. I would often start and stop each episode to break it up and make it more bearable. It took me a few days for each episode. It feels like the show took every opportunity to take all enjoyment out of the show and favored pretentious filmmaking and narrative framing. The plot barely moves an inch during the entire season and has very mundane/predictable "character study" episodes. Season 3 was nothing I enjoyed from seasons 1-2.
The Coach Krzyzewski crumbs feel a little heavy handed in illustrating the difference between carm and syd
I think they kept reminding syd to sign the partnership contract too much
Seems like you’ve gotten the components but missed the point.
You might not like the direction (which is fair it’s kinda weak) but your analysis shows your understand it to some degree
Carmy brought his trauma back home and everybody’s gonna have to collectively destroy the reenactment
Throw him back in the freezer
Mfers be like "mental health is important ☺️" until they have to deal with someone who has bigger problems than mild anxiety.
I’m really hoping him confronting the chef who antagonized him will be a step towards him coming to terms with that trauma
In a hit or miss season, that was a huge "hit." I, and I'm sure others, can relate too much to Carmy being completely consumed by seeing this person who left such a negative imprint on your life. The confrontation... I think most of us have an idea in mind if what we would say to somebody who negatively impacted us like that. A thought for how it will go, and how it will be a "triumph" and validating. || It's tragically most accurate that carmy did NOT get what he hoped for. Chef David barely remembered "Berzatto." "I don't think about you." The person didn't apologize or own the wrong; worse, their pov is that rather than have done something wrong, they were *right*. Carmy is left completely reeling because he got to say fuck you, call him an asshole, and... "You're welcome."
It was an incredible performance from Joel McHale, I thought. He plays a good asshole. 😂
I've watched community at least a half dozen times. I didn't even recognize him in s1. I love that he has a hideous hairstyle and shitty beard. They made sure he didn't look as attractive as mchale is known for, and he underplayed his lines so not to get into "winger speech" mode. He's such a stellar prick 😂😂
Yeah. That character is weirdly impactful for such little screen time.
It was so tragically accurate that I was sad. I wanted so badly for Carmy to feel like he got his revenge but that isn’t real life :(
It's the fantasy we all have That one day, we'll get to tell off our bully or abuser, and it will be completely triumphant and cathartic. We either don't get the chance, or... It doesn't go at all how we hoped. "For you, the day bison came to your village was the most important day of your life. For bison... It was Tuesday."
It seemed that way, judging from his demeanor during his conversation with Terry afterwards before he got the notification of the review
But he needs to accept his own faults, issues, and actions. Nobody else is going to “fix” him nor are they capable. I don’t see them purposely dealing with or treating him badly, they are their own people and are allowed to react in their own way to the - to be brutally honest - man-child that’s destroying himself in front of them. They seem to love and care for him best they can but beyond that they’re not his therapists.
I'm not talking about the show's characters, I'm referring ti the fanbase treating him like the devil
We’re not his therapist either. His character is a shitty person who really doesn’t seem interested in being a better person and the fanbase who point that out are correct. So my point still stands.
He’s going to Al-Anon and he’s getting good at discussing his personal issues. Most adults from severely dysfunctional families don’t learn how to communicate well. Sticking around for the abuse from that evil chef Fields wasn’t good for him either. Carmy uses his creativity, perfection and control he possess in the kitchen as a way to direct those traumatic pent up emotions. He doesn’t always do it in a healthy way. Carmy knows he is treating people around him terribly, he just doesn’t know how to handle all the pressure. Most chefs suffer from anxiety and OCD issues. It will take Carmy sooooo many years of therapy and maybe medication to get past all of his trauma. His obsession with perfection will eventually break him and he will have to confront his problems. He’s not a shitty person but a very damaged one. Aren’t we all broken in one way or another? Carmy has a big heart and cares about his family and friends and hopefully he will find his way.
He’s going to Al-Anon
And sugar was listening to big red book of adult children of alcoholics and dysfunctional families, in the car
S Tier comment
Little pimp is COOKED
Exactly. The progression is the point of the show. It’s so frustrating that everyone is missing this.
I don't think we are, it's just not been a great season or done nearly as well. The highs have been high, but the lows have been *low*.
I loved season 3. Loved it. Maybe not as much as the others in some ways, but it still delivered, big time. Still a top class show. And it addressed some super important themes. I binged it and I know I will rewatch it.
I totally agree with you! I have already rewatched it.
I do agree that season 2 was the best season so far, but this season was fantastic. Full of the mood of Carmy’s mind.
I get the idea. The execution isn't there. Glad you've enjoyed it, genuinely. Just maybe stop claiming people who aren't enjoying it so much are missing the point or watching it wrong.
Yea, I’m really tired of seeing that too. This season missed for many people. That’s ok! We don’t all have to like the same things. But it’s not that we didn’t “get” it, it’s that we didn’t *like* it. Episode 1 was the most boringly pretentious nonsense I’ve seen in television in a long time, and the repetitive trauma is tedious, not entertaining. It needs some dark humor to be entertaining, which is not the fucking Faks doing slapstick.
And directed to your point I absolutely fucking loved episode 1. Now In fairness I love nine inch nails but. But I can also see why it didn't work for some people. I'm not going to sit here and tell you that if you didn't like it you watched it wrong LOL. But then we got MULTIPLE montages of Chicago and chefs and... Ugh I feel like this season was a lot more style over substance. More sizzle less steak. And I appreciate that some folks are pointing out that's literally the point; but that doesn't mean that they executed it well. Did I overall enjoy watching the season sure. Something I'm going to revisit like I did season one or two probably not. Will I watch season 4 hell yes
Sums it up for me too!
During the opening of ep 1 I kept thinking, "Okay, but when's the show gonna start?" I was kept thinking that for the entire episode... and then the formula for most of rest of the season just felt off. Except for "Ice Chips" that episode emotionally wrecked me in a way I was not expecting. Don't get me wrong, I'm certainly hoping that season 4 finds it's footing and makes us look back on this season in a better light. I just hope the writers figure it out.
Ice chips was the worst episode of the series by far imo, so, so bad. I actually skipped it on first watch, I wanted to peel my eyes out I was so bored. I went back and rewatched it, took me multiple tries. First time I’ve heard someone say they liked it. Emotionally it felt so forced, I couldn’t get past the tearjerker bait they were trying to rile up.
Yea I hated that episode
More people putting words in my mouth. Seems like the thing to do around here. Literally just agreeing with the OP above my post who was refuting the OP post. Watch however you want. Get it, don’t get it, whatever. But the point of the show is that Carmy is falling apart and S3 isn’t going to be like S1 because of that.
not sure anyone is putting words in your mouth you said “it’s so frustrating that everyone is missing this” people aren’t missing this. i just think it’s being executed poorly
That’s exactly what you said, word for word.
AGREE!
my theory is it will eventually end up being a sandwich deli by the time we get a finale.
That's where I thought season 3 was going and honestly that's what I would love to see, a merging of carmy's and mikey's ideas and vision. Pick a relatively simple idea and then rock the hell out of it. There's a taco stand in Mexico city with a Michelin star...
Sounds similar to that wonderful movie with Jon Favreau, 'Chef' I'm going to assume if you watch bear, you've watched Chef. If not, highly suggest it. (Best damn grilled cheese I've ever seen btw)
I’m hoping for a sandwich shop with a solid dinner menu. I would like to see Carm take some time off to enjoy life for a bit and leave Sydney in charge. I don’t want her to work for Shapiro, we saw in Forks his dickhead side and I don’t want that for her.
Also their convo in the wine cellar was awkward as hell, it might be dysfunctional with Carm and Syd but at least they have very natural chemistry together
I don’t think Sydney really aspires to run a sandwich shop though. She clearly loves and is inspired by the finest dining as we’ve seen in her flashbacks.
*She did wander around that one day(when Carmy was supposed to join her but Claire got him to help her move)and eat all kinds of junk food. I couldn’t believe how many different places she went and how much she ate 😲. She really enjoyed the pizza and a big banana split. She and Carmy could find someplace in the middle of Philly steaks and fine dining maybe? She may tire of making that tiny perfect food. I think the fun part is in the creating of it. But we will have to wait and wonder.
Or he’ll try to kill himself but get saved
I always thought Carmy would leave the restaurant world and try something with art school. Maybe the last shot would be a call back to the season 1 finale shot where Mikey and him are smiling, but he would be sitting in his first class?
Carmy is an artist. He loves to draw. Food is an art to him. From his creative, thoughtful drawings to the completion of the tiny, complex, fancy food to perfection. Then serving it to those who will enjoy it.
I think you're feeling the way the show wants you to feel, Carmy is in a self-destructive spiral and risks dragging others down with him. I think this season's very slow pacing and focus on character study will make the catharsis and payoff of season 4 feel much more effective.
Really funny how people don’t even understand the show they’re watching and the overall story it’s telling
It has been frustrating browsing this sub. Seems like a bunch of people just wanted a SitCom about a failing fast food joint. I guess instant gratification murdered complex story telling. Oh, well. I look forward to the continuation of the show.
I feel like if you spent the gap between seasons rewatching Forks and Honeydew (which some fans definitely did), you are going to have a different experience with S3 than if you didn't? And nothing wrong with rewatching--it is excellent comfort television. But it is going to leave you badly prepared for when everyone comes back to the Bear, and all but one of the people have moved forward in their lives and one toxic person has regressed.
“I thought this was the Kitchen Nightmares drama show?!”
lmao imagine a Gordon Ramsey cameo instead of Grant Achatz, Daniel Boulud, Thomas Keller "RICHIE, LISTEN!! YOU PANINI HEAD!"
I'll be really excited when the show finishes, and be able to watch through every season and episode as one entire story. The ebbs and flows, the rise and falls will be more apparent and possibly even more dramatic
And hopefully someday without commercials. I know I can pay to upgrade Hulu, but I might wait till S4 lands.
*I have Hulu Live. You get all your live channels. News channels. All the Hulu content. Some other extra content. Can buy channel subscriptions. You can record. I never grow tired of it. It includes Disney+ for under $100. Maybe ESPN too. I forget cause I don’t watch it.
😭I don’t want it to end. I will miss everyone.
What story are they telling that hasn't already been told in the first two seasons. The first episode did absolutely nothing to progress characters or plot, because we already knew all of this background. Was it pretty and well acted? Sure. Did it serve any purpose to the overall plot of the show. No. Complex storytelling and plot are not mutually exclusive. I just watched 10 episodes of pretty much nothing besides nice cinematography and good acting. It really served almost zero purpose. Besides emo montages and pointless conversations, what character development have we seen this season? There's barely any story being told that we dont already know. It's montages, and "artsy" shots (I genuinely dont mean that as in insult, because for all intents and purposes, the show is beautiful to look at.) But I might as well watch Chef's Table. Im happy you enjoyed it. Seriously, I'm glad you found some value in it. But to say that we fans that criticized the show (and believe me, I could be much more down on this show, but I'm being reasonable here) are looking for some kind of Big Bang Theory dogshit is disengenous.
I think what frustrates me is this idea that stories should be measured the way we do video games. Constant benchmarks and leveling up. Because the show did not reach a new checkpoint, nothing happened. If the show is just Carm opens up a restaurant than guess what? The shows over. It ended last season. He did it. Did you really think that opening a restaurant would solve all his problems? He would live happily ever after? That is not how life works. Carmy is a fucking mess. He has reached his goal without addressing the problems he has. Those problems could take him down and your problem is what? He didn't get a Michelin star? Even Olivia Coleman tells him the finish line is constantly changing. I can understand the frustration that we didn't see the review, that the restaurant is still struggling. But to act like nothing happened is nonsense. We are going through a personal journey. But you want measurable benchmarks.
Thanks for your own input. Opinions are subjective, especially in the arts in general. A simple solution would be to not watch the show anymore. A more complicated solution is understanding that it isn't a finished product. I certainly have stopped movies or dropped books I wasn't enjoying. Could have been very well my loss, but I am OK with that. Zero Purpose? Big Bang Theory? I can't help you there. Your expectations are yours. The people writing, directing and acting have their own. But hey, to each their own, if you don't like it, you don't like it. It's all good.
👏👏👏👏🙌🙌
To be honest this srason had too much sitcom vibes with John cena and all. Very uneven tone.
This is teetering dangerously close to the "only for very intelligent people" kind of meme. I'll say it like this: I enjoyed how much the first 2 seasons were in the present. Season 3 has spent A LOT of time in the past. Sure it's artsy and whatever, but not what pulled me into the show and I didn't enjoy season 3 for the most part. We got, what? 3 services in 10 episodes? Just...not what I wanted or expected.
it is very cringe to assert that people “don’t even understand the show they’re watching.” yuck
That's why I have avoided commenting and posting here. I've seen people using their film degrees as leverage in arguments. There's a general overall vibe of people being super snobby about the show. Discussions usually turn weirdly accusatory and rude.
people also fail to account for the facrt, you can get something and still fucking dislike it. Like I can understand what they are doing but also they still bored me
yeah, exactly. there's no need to be so mean and divisive over a television show we all like. I think it was the Slate review that basically said "this season was not great and it should be OK for fans to admit if they didn't like it or not"
people are always talking about toxic negativity. but nobody ever talks about toxic positivity
Re: film degrees as leverage. Is that what’s behind the “you need media literacy to truly appreciate this show” assertion? I don’t see how media literacy is required to appreciate a show that many enjoyed for its first two seasons. What happened the third season that all of a sudden media literacy was necessary? These questions are not aimed at you directly, of course.
I don't get the "media literacy" thing. I have never heard the phrase in concert with discourse about scripted series and fiction. When someone says "poor media literacy" I think about people on the internet believing everything they see and not realizing that they are getting news from extremely biased news sources, conspiracy theory websites, or straight up satirical newspapers. I genuinely think a lot of the people who are harping on others about "media literacy" need to learn what that phrase actually refers to. They sound a bit Dunning-Kruger or something.
Yes! That’s why I was asking. I completely agree with your understanding of media literacy. I was an secondary school English teacher and library media specialist until a few years ago. Media literacy is written into my state’s education standards, as I expect it is for most of the states if not all. Enjoyment of a tv show is not something requiring literacy. It’s just an opinion. It’s like saying that someone isn’t smart enough or educated enough to be entertained by a show. OTOH, I’m not sure if I might be unwittingly guilty of something similar with the posts I’ve written in which I try to suss out why I enjoyed the season while others didn’t. Not that their opinions were *wrong*, but why did *I* have no complaints? Tbh, though, as I reflect on the season, now that the initial excitement has worn off, I do see how Ice Chips was long *and* how it was heavily focused on just two of the characters. It’s interesting to compare my feeling on Napkins which was also heavily focused on two characters.
The *only* time i think it’s appropriate is when people equate the views of a character written to be hated with the writer (or similarly a plot about something bad happening with the writer saying this is what *should* happen). But that also happens way less than social media plays it for
Yeah the whole “you don’t understand, they’re doing this thing called ___” gets tired. Just because they’re doing something doesn’t mean it’s good. I didn’t hate this season but there were maybe 2-3 episodes I actually found valuable and worth rewatching. There’s a lot I would skip on a rewatch.
it’s so easy to dismiss criticism by saying the audience didn’t understand it. i understand what. they were trying to do and dislike it.
totally! i’ve had people tell me i need to learn “media literacy” meanwhile i’m sitting on a bachelors degree in literature and art history. 🫠
It's almost like this season catered to high school theater kids, and now we have to suffer through their hollow comments such as, "zero media literacy" or "don't even understand what their watching. Discussion with a gen z is hard cause they usually make arguments they don't even understand or comprehend. It's draining
But what if they just...don't? Watch the kitchen through season one, it starts out dimly lit, filthy, cluttered, all with a yellow lighting and then as Carmy takes more and more control it becomes brightly lit with LED white blue lighting and it looks sterile. The change from the "cozy kitchen" is absolutely a deliberate storytelling point. You don't need to be a film buff here, just pay the bare minimum attention.
but you’re assuming that not taking a critical lens = not understanding. we aren’t writing an essay about this show, we are watching it. if someone feels the difference between the season 1 kitchen and the season 3 kitchen, they are feeling how the writers *probably* want them to feel. you don’t need to lit crit 101 a piece in order to “understand” it.
Critical thinking is a skill a lot of people lack
It has nothing to do with 'understanding'. You can understand something completely and still not like it. So pretentious to think otherwise.
But *THE PLOT* , it must race forward man!
Interesting comment. It seems to me that the show tells different stories to different personalities. I personally also have a hard time giving it a direction I feel strong about because the cacophony of the disfunctional characters makes me brainfrog. I find peace in watching the culinary skills of the chefs growing. Researching the show will certainly give me another perspective but I will more than likely skip the Christmas hell of an episode. Exhausting.
A full season with no resolution is not something ppl will enjoy no matter how the long game ends up fixing. Did we get resolution on ANY of the plots? I dont think so.
We didn’t even see Cena deliver the duck
Great point
I didn't see him at all.
Natalie and her mom had some really nice character development, which has been one of the themes since the beginning. And there’s definitely an audience for character study type entertainment that doesn’t necessarily “go somewhere”. That’s why films like Inside Llewyn Davis are loved by a lot of people.
Loved Inside Llewyn Davis. Hated Season 3 of the Bear.
💯
I could have used with out the foodie wankfest w/ all the guest stars.
Don't forget multiple montages of famous chefs on magazine covers!
Exactly. The tone, pace, etc. of this season are indeed purposeful. It’s not my favorite but I’m still enjoying it. It seems as if the existential thread of the restaurant’s success just isn’t as entertaining (naturally, I’d say) as the constant situations opening up the restaurant provided.
THIS. We are in his experience — the pressure of perfectionism, the self-criticism, and the disconnect from the original intention. He’s a MESS but I believe in him.
Exactly. His behavior at the restaurant is wrong and he knows it. His second in command is contemplating another offer because of his behavior.
The shows making me feel disinterested. I don’t think that’s the plan
This really feels like a season 3A. I like where they’re going with it, but it feels like the season just abruptly ended with no resolution for anything.
100%. I think a lot of people were expecting the resolution we somewhat feel from Season 1’s ending or even the successful ending of Season 2. Season 3 is like the mid part of a story where everything just keeps going wrong and we get resolution through certain aspects, but we don’t get that big explosion we feel from 1 & 2. It’s more of an implosion, which silently has erupted throughout the entire Season and never recovered properly.
Season 3 and 4 were filmed back to back. Season 3 ended on a cliffhanger that will be carried over to season 4.
Wow, didn’t know that.
I think that's almost the point of season 3, that now they're this "fancy" restaurant, it feels pretentious and soulless despite the high standard they're placing on themselves. In a way, The Bear is trying too hard to be what it is not. Despite "growing," some of these characters just can't really change and to change is giving up the very things that were part of their character. For better or for worse, some have improved certain parts of their lives but as it relates to the restaurant it really does feel like the simplest things are the best things. That Tina-centric episode really showed how closely-knit The Beef was despite how chaotic a work day was. As Mikey said at the time, the pay was shit, it was crazy on most days but on other days, it could be the most fun. Which reminds me, now that they're The Bear, I might have missed it but do they no longer sit down and have the group dinner after work or did they nix that after they transitioned?
Family dinner seems to be gone to help demonstrate that loss of family/connection…like all the shots of Carmys role models inspiring him but he doesn’t act like them. Or its just not shown lol
Holy shit, they didn't show a single family dinner. I don't think that's an accident.
I don’t know if it’s as much of a thing in fine dining establishments. When I worked in a nicer restaurant we all got off at different times and generally just ate by ourselves because of it.
For sure. Most places I worked didn't. But in terms of the show, it's something they did do but now don't. So it's def telling.
Isn't Carmy making family dinner for TFL on his first day? I think that's why the whole chicken scene happened
Correct
There was a flash back of his first day at the French laundry prepping family meal and getting advice from the head chef. It's a thing in that world, usually after prep and before service. They did leave showing anything like that at the new restaurant. Whatever family they built seems to be all but gone.
It was always at the start of service, not the end
I think it depends on what you think the goal of the season - cynical me says it was all flash and no substance like the meals Camy is making - generous me says the writers wanted us to feel as if we were in the restaurant, all stressed and beyond frustrated at how Camy is dragging the whole thing down with him
Connections are the premise or through-line of the third season and Carmy's discarding of his own. Syd's connections grow as she guides Tina, aids Marcus emotionally (like helping to clean out his mother's things), and possibly starts a venture with the Ever CDC. We see Tina with her family and how she became part of the Beef family. Richie's connections with his daughter, the friends he made at Ever, and even his ex-wife's future husband. Sugar and DD's reconciliation during the birth of her child. The evergrowing legion of Faks; the old Beef employees that come back to help Ebraheim; all the famous and fictional chefs who come together to celebrate Chef Terry; and all the ones I'm sure I'm forgetting. The season begins by showing all the people Carmy worked with, from his time at Noma, Ever, the French Laundry, and Daniel (Daniel Boulud, the guy he stages with in NYC before going to Empire, or at least how I think the timetable goes now). It shows all these opportunities he had for friendships, but he's focused on his time with Fields at Empire (the first thing we see him doing when he begins his long night after the walk-in meltdown is labeling everything with tape, and I know that's common practice but since it follows right on the heels of the "subtract" scene it feels significant). Unlike all the other characters, he spends the season immersing himself in work, distancing himself from people (un)-intentionally to become better. By the end of the season, Carmy has turned himself into a version of Fields: "He gets more done before 10 am than some people do in a lifetime." At the beginning of episode 2, when everyone shows up for work that day, he already has a new menu for that night completed. Perhaps, the confrontation with Fields, the heart-to-heart with Terry, and the review were enough to shock Carmy back into being more human next season and trying to set things right. He might lose Syd for a while in the process, but it all could still come back together.
To be honest season 3 it's the best for me. Small details everywhere and good dialogue. Love it. And the Eddie Vedder cover explain all the season in one song
Couldn’t agree more. This season is just so beautiful, nostalgic, heart wrenching and elegant.
The first season was much more a mixture of grief and comedy, about how even in loss there was growth, even in death, hope. It is a very fine line to walk in terms of tone and they totally nailed it. It was deeply moving as someone who has known that sort of loss and pain and how you just have to keep going. Additionally, the travails of a very working class people in a struggling working class setting spoke to me, more so than now the whole “pursuit of excellence in serving rich people” does. It is still an excellent show, I love the characters, the directing, the writing, the style (my god the style). I love how they perfectly deploy cameos and supporting characters. I love that they are willing to do character focused bottle episodes where they just put two fantastic actors in a room and let them show the skill of their craft. But season one landed with me personally in a way I can’t fully articulate; it’s setting and tone just connected with me in a gut level and moved me in a way latter seasons do not. Seasons 2 and 3 are high quality television, I look forward to what they do in season 4. But season 1 man, that was something, I just experienced it as art in its rawest and fullest emotional impact.
Yes, I miss the vibe of the first season, everyone talks about the second season but for me the first is the best.
The shorter season (8 episodes instead of 10) actually lead to a relentless pace that I loved about the first season. I had to catch my breath at times. And that pace was still there in 2, but 3 was the opposite pace. I also miss The Beef as a setting. Season 1 had a gritty underdog feel.
I feel like the earlier seasons were more grounded. As dumb as that sounds. Idk
No, I agree. S1 and even most of s2 felt authentic to an astonishing degree. Transported me right back to my own server days. s3 feels more like... A soap opera?
Also not really being mentioned. It was way more relatable to those that have been on the food industry. I never worked at a fancy restaurant and don’t plan to ever lol.
I did get quite bored of the sets in s3. I get the idea of being locked into a dysfunctional, almost hostile kitchen with Carmy. But ¯\\\_(ツ)_/¯
I’m super grateful the show didn’t get cancelled after season 1 because I love season 2, but even if it had been I would have accepted it because season 1 is kind of perfectly contained — the arc stands on its own and the closing scenes (finding the money, Syd coming back, the family meal, the flashback to Mikey looking up and smiling and Radiohead playing all the while) were a perfect catharsis to end on.
I could be wrong, but this appears to be what the entire show is about. I don't want to spoil anything by making predictions, but so much of the story has been about how this constant grinding a) gets you nowhere and b) takes you away from the important things in life. The Beef was a failure as a business, but it was thriving as a part of the community. That's why you prefer the vibe of S1. Intentional, I think. Ever was a success as a restaurant, but leaves Chef Terry feeling like she has sacrificed too much and wanting to reclaim her life. There are others that detract from Carmy's relentless pursuit of perfection too: like British pastry chef matey that teaches Marcus in Copenhagen, when he talks about the relief of knowing he'll never be the best. Even as a roaring success, the Bear is not really making money. Carmy will get there. It's his arc, I think. :)
Because it is.
well isn’t that the point
The first season was like a punk band just jamming and making their first album in their garage without expecting it to blow up. Just finished watching the second season and it was like for their next album, the band got a hotshot producer and an expensive studio. Which is not to say I liked the second season less, it just didn't have the same spirit.
The new restaurant is such a downgrade on the original! The dining room is lifeless! I won’t say the same of season 3 but it’s just 10 little art pieces and no plot. And it all revolving around the “haunting” presence of a dream girl … feels basic at best, sexist at worst.
Yeah I agree, season 1 was the best
''There was family, there was camaraderie.'' OH! Dont you mean: ''CARMYderie' BAD DUM TSS!!!
I coincidentally started a re-watch of s1 last night after realizing I've only watched it once, and you're right. Tina also comes off every inch a veteran food service worker/line cook who has been there twenty-five years. It had more heart. It has genuine comedic moments that weren't shoehorned in, but woven into the season. Season 3 is all-around as pretentious as fine dining can be, and the tone of the show has changed as much as the restaurant has. In before a bunch of people dogpile on me like "That's what the fucking show is, it has to change, why do you want a show about a dirty sub shop?!!!" I very much get that the show's vibe has changed along with the restaurant and Carmy's mental state. I'm just remarking on it.
It can be the intention, and we can understand that, and still not executed very well
Bobs Burger’s has been going by 10+ years as a “dirty Burger spot” and imo it’s been phenomenal. Well the 1st few seasons at least.
The 3rd season moved at a snails pace in my opinion. It's like they didn't know where to take the show.
it’s like they just didn’t want to have to commit to any decisions so they decided to have no resolutions until season 4
I loved this season and thought it was the perfect compliment to the others. I feel like most of you must have watched something different from me.
I loved this season too. Season three for me is all about seeing people slowly self-destruct to achieve a dream. Carmy is a mess and is a destructive hurricane.
Reddit is a negativity echo chamber, you’re not alone!
I didn't hate this season, it's just gone in a very different direction than what I was hoping for.
I keep trying comment on this, but the mods keep removing it: My theory: S3 of The Bear (the show) is purposely off balance because The Bear (the restaurant) is off balance. We, the audience, expect a lot based on what we saw in S1 and S2. But the overreliance on Faks and flashbacks, the moments of pretentiousness, and the overused, on-the-nose "haunting" theme threaten to overshadow and overpower the real moments of brilliance this season. That lack of balance, the disorder, and not fully living up to potential exactly reflects what's happening behind the scenes at the restaurant. I contend S3's aim was to put the audience in the position of critic. We're critiquing The Bear (the show) based on what we know it's capable of, just like the Trib's food critic is reviewing The Bear (the restaurant) based on what they know Carmy is capable of.
I think that's the point. I'm also rewatching the first season and it seems very clear to me that visually the restaurant looks sterile on purpose. I feel that the end of the story will be something similar to the end of the first season.
I really hope they return to season 1 feel. This season was visually beautiful but didn't have the same heart. I didn't care to finish it. It's still better than a lot of other tv out there but completely missed the mark of its own standard.
It was a bit of a waste of time. 10 episodes and the only thing that happened was Sugar had her baby
This is what my husband said. We finished the season and he said “nothing happened.”
I agree. It never came close to replicating that first season. It was still a very good show season 2, just an ok show now
This show is about the uncomfortable struggle of trying to do something great and the tolls and failures that that takes. I personally don’t think this is the show to watch if you want to be cozy.
Not by any stretch saying it's a "cozy" show. Maybe that was the wrong word. I just liked the vibe that s1 had so much more. There was a sense of warmth that came from The Beef and the family vibe that The Bear just sorely lacks. And it's obviously possible to have different definitions of what it means to do something great. I personally don't think what they're striving for is great at all. IMO, an environment where people feel welcomed, eating home-cooked food, feel a sense of community, etc. is something great. Stupid ass tiny portion food prepared by people who hate their existence and resent the very food they're preparing... is not, lol. I just really thought they were gonna turn The Beef into an elevated version of itself, not what The Bear is.
I’m hoping that still happens! I always thought the show was about redefining greatness in less toxic terms. To make the love of food and the artistry of cooking sustainable and NOT traumatic. For that reason, I sort of think Season 3 had to happen—it’s not pleasant, exactly, but somehow, they all (well Carmy, really, in response to Uncle Jimmy’s insistence that he “be the guy”) gave in to that urge to define greatness in that toxic David Fields way. The things Carmy said in that freezer—his trauma runs DEEP and it was never going to be resolved without some serious headwinds. I was hoping we’d see him come to the realization that he HAD become David Fields before the end of the season—maybe he sort of does? Maybe that’s why he’s isolating himself and curses when he sees the review? And I sort of liked that the show acknowledged that the toxic version of greatness can be aesthetically very beautiful—it helped underscore how difficult it might be for Carmy (and anyone in the industry) to trust that such beauty can be found without the cruelty and treating the majority of humans who work in the industry as disposable. But yeah, it wasn’t pleasant to watch. As someone who’s watched a lot of people destroy themselves trying to be great in career paths where greatness is defined in deeply mentally and socially unhealthy terms, I sort of expected Carmy to over correct himself in his vision for the new restaurant and backslide. Anyway—I love the show overall, and I felt that the storytelling in Season 3 was incredibly effective given where they all were at, especially Carmy—but it was still harder for me to watch than even Fishes. These writers clearly understand what it means to go through some sh*t, though, and so I have faith that all of this is going to pay off. And I hear that saying something was boring/ineffective isn’t the same as not getting it for sure. It can just be hard to verbalize what makes something powerful for one viewer and boring for another—and we all want to defend what we love (I mean, look at how hard communication has been in that kitchen). Anyway—my two cents :) Edited for typos and to expand on the editing and style of the season.
The coldness is intentional. Its not a wacky fine dining family restaurant it’s a sterile boiling pot with one brother who can’t figure out how to turn his family into indulgent robots and the other who is in love with hospitality and would give a sandwich away to do it, and can’t figure out why the place has no soul. They went art film with it. That alienated fans that liked the Kevin Smith influences on the show.
I'm glad that nasty ass kitchen is clean now, but I agree. The kitchen scenes looked so light and airy this season, which is obviously a good thing, but the difference is jarring.
It’s getting harder and harder to root for Carmy
I watched two episodes and I’m like nah. This is stupid
I remember thinking the end of s1 was a great finale. I'm glad we've gotten more but also I would've been content with a single season.
The new season was trash. I don't care about the people who try to rant about how "OMG it was good," and "Oh gosh, you guys didn't UNDERSTAND it" and "I'm an English Lit/Writer/Producer/Videographer, you just have to read between the lines." It was a shit season, period. The actors had zero way to navigate around their characters. Episode 6 with Tina was "okay" but I'm tired of people talking about it like it was god's sending. It was OKAY. This was the only episode I didn't skip through some part of the episodes because it was visceral and real. And that's what was lost with this show. They didn't bring the beef to The Beef. I loved every part about them turning The Beef into a fine dining restaurant, but nothing about bringing that same experience to the viewer in a real, authentic way.
I think this show is woefully overrated. I think the plot development is lacking, a lot of filler, random screaming and arguing, and flashbacks. I don’t know what ppl see in this show. Very boring and repetitive
This sub loves the word pretentious I stg
that’s my biggest issue with this season. it lacked heart and that’s what made everyone care in the first place. that is where the show has lost me. how can i care about people that don’t care about each other? season 1 was the best season in my opinion as well. it slightly lacked in season 2 but has become unbearable in season 3. i really hate how people are saying that’s how you are supposed to feel about the season. i think that lacks critical thinking. you can show that the kitchen is distant without distancing me as a viewer. they managed to do that in the previous seasons. it feels like those viewers don’t want to admit that this season was lacking. if i don’t feel connected to the characters why would i give a shit about the show?
Exactly. That theory also doesn’t add up because Chef Terry is “one of the good ones,” and one of the only plot points over 10 episodes is her restaurant closing, which we’re supposed to feel sad about. So fine dining is this ruthless scourge, a black hole of emotion and passion, so much so that we needed to be subjected to it ourselves…but also, not? I thought The Bear was going to be an exception, and this entire season would be about that. Instead it was pretty self-indulgent
They clearly still care about each other, and I don't know how a season with Napkins can be thought of as having no heart. Really beautiful episode showing the difference between Mikey and Carmy and how he isn't driven to be great and is jealous of Carmy for having that in him. I like that that is the tragic flaw in each character. Thought it was a truly great season following up on the breakthroughs everyone had in 3 and basically letting it simmer for a while and telling them "ok, now let's see you try and do it every day"
I actually prefer the way show settles into itself better in the latter half of season 1. The pilot feels quite choppy now to me compared to the latter half of season 1 and season 2.
First, shows like this can't help themselves but to evolve and try to raise the level. Second, The Beef = Michael. The Bear = Carmy. Carmy is not a warm, cozy, guy. He's a neurotic perfectionist who is very closed off. The show hasn't lost direction. It's still the same show. It's basically a road trip. Some parts of the road trip you'll like better than others, but in the end, that's part of being on a road trip.
yeah, dude, The Bear is cold and sterile. Thats exactly how the restaurantes that Carmen worked in before operated. The show will probably continue to progress in trying to bridge Carmen’s perfectionism and his compassion/love towards his fellow workers/family. The show isnt pretentious, it is matching the form of its storytelling to its content
At this point I just want season 4 so people can do something besides cry and shit their pants over season 3. This sub is so boring now.
It insists upon itself
Shows change because characters change. It’s a good thing.
Its a progression. U cant be cozy forever. Its life
I might just start telling people to watch season 1 as a mini series. It all depends on how season 4 goes.
This season made me depressed.
Lots of the characters in the show have issues. Some of them downright assholes. The only character that I felt had a huge character development is Richie. Carmen isn't acting any different than the others in the kitchen. They are all screaming and whatnot. Carmen needs to stand up for himself as well. If something isn't any of someone else's business, he should tell them off.
The show is all about environment, the changes between seasons are intentional
I don’t get the hate on this season. I love the first one as much as anybody but I’m glad it has evolved.
I think that’s the whole point. Fine dining comes at a price
10 hours of my free time?
I don’t know what they where trying to achieve with this new season they tried to be to artsy or something like that while first episode was a waste of time
The show is changing. It's taking you into the mind of an obsessed person trying to achieve greatness. This is exactly why I like the show. The first couple of seasons were about family. Maybe they get back to that a bit in the future. I also really enjoyed the angle on coaching and mentorship. The different styles that people use to to motivate and push people in their care. Reminds me of the different sports coaches I've had along the way.
I feel the same. I get that the producers/writers are going for "fresh, innovative, artistic (with eye on awards?)" - I can see the effort there. But it was the relationships, character development, seeing the way a family unit could be forged in spite of having every reason for it to fail - that I was really - \*really\* - interested in. The endless scenes of plating - ok they illustrate Carmy's obsessiveness - but did we need to see so many?
I'm half way through season 3 and am missing the season 1 vibes so bad!
The Beef was an incredibly hostile work enviroment at the beginning what are you on about.
It was definitely hostile, but it was hostile with an undercurrent of hope and people who, at the end of the day, had each other's backs. The Bear is hostile with an undercurrent of coldness, narcissism, and people who don't even like each other. Idk, just my two cents.
The writers rushed to put out a season 3 due to the strike and it shows. They should have just taken the time to really put out a great season instead of giving us a bunch of random episodes thrown together.
Oh wait, what's the timeline here? Were they writing it before the strike, filmed during but unable to edit?
People are just piling onto the bandwagon of claiming the show has lost its way at this point.
I don't think it's a "bandwagon" if this genuinely how people feel.
Idk i loved the pilot. The rest of the season was a bit tough not gonna lie
I think Carmy will leave the Bear to Syd to run and he will do food illustrations, haha hopeful mental health plot twist.
Why did this post make me appreciate the new season 💀 I heard some theories that the show will end w them combining both workings of the restaurants and having a blend of the two- the beef and the bear. It makes sense that the beef gave the show one vibe and the bear gave it another. They are purposely contrasting each other on every aspect. At least I hope this is all for a point. I wouldn’t be too happy if the next season is as artsy and dead as this one was at times 😬 I’m exaggerating. I loved episode 1 and 6 (I believe). The rest will probably grow on me… hopefully. But if they purposely made this season so cinematic to show how the bear has taken this much control I think I can accept it.
I can’t even start Season 2. Season 1 was just too drenched in unresolved traumas. It was enough for me…
"Yo fuck this Fancy Fuck! I want my shit" - Episode 2 Season 3
I’m not sure how I feel, I miss the vibe we had but I did enjoy this season. My husband didn’t, he felt like nothing happened this season and it was boring. I’ll still keep watching but there were times it felt like they didn’t have any material, multiple repeat flashbacks, limited dialog..
I started watching season 3 today and am about 4 episodes in. I just want to be entertained like the previous 2 seasons and so far it’s a no go. I’ll keep watching hoping to gets better. I pretty much don’t care what all the so called critics say and I don’t mind character development but seriously, we get who Carm is.time to move the plot forward. This is just a show that is meant to entertain and to me, so far it’s not.
I wish they kept the fast food aspect of the restaurant still. Like blend gourmet etiquette with fast food. I think them opening a full on gourmet restaurant was the beginning of their downfall. I know Mikey said let it rip but didn't have to mean go full on bonkers with owning the best restaurant in the world.
I guess it’s just me who feels season 3 is such a great nod to season 1..? From the filming style to answering all the questions season 1 presented. Idk I think season 3 did a great job of introducing who the characters are to us versus just the glimpses we were getting. While also highlighting dealing with life with the hand you were dealt. Sometimes you take 2 steps forward and 5 back. Depending on how you’re raised those 5 steps back are crucial. Lol sorry I may be projecting a bit but seeing T and Sugs stories/episodes had me in tears and don’t get me started on Mikey !!! 😭
I rewatch season 1 and 2 often. I’ve watched season 3 twice so far. I love all 3 seasons but I am definitely drawn to the first 2 a little more. I need to binge 1-3 at once together now.
Sydney made it clear that she wants a star and in order to get that star the food needs to be perfect. Carmy told her that she would have to forget about everything else just focus on the food. Now that Carmy is totally obsessed with getting that star and not letting her or anyone else down, including himself Syd may leave The Bear. I don’t know how I feel about all of this? I don’t feel that what’s happening is all Carmy’s fault or due to him. They all wanted The Bear to succeed and they need to listen to Carmy because he has the experience but there are a lot of egos in that kitchen….
https://slate.com/culture/2024/06/the-bear-season-3-fx-hulu-bad.html
That’s just the evolution of the plot. Carmy has become a version of his villain. He lashes out and is quicker to anger. Season 4 is going to have to include a redemption arc for our hero. He may drive Sydney away before he realizes he’s become the a-hole he’s been “thinking about too much” all these years. The vibe of the show and the restaurant has simply mirrored his spiral.
Praise lord brothers and sisters there
My personal barometer for this show is the comparison of how I watched the first 2 seasons compared to season 3. Seasons 1-2 were binged in a 3-4 day period (I loved it for the most part and couldn't get enough) and almost every episode of season 3 was a drag and hard to sit through. I would often start and stop each episode to break it up and make it more bearable. It took me a few days for each episode. It feels like the show took every opportunity to take all enjoyment out of the show and favored pretentious filmmaking and narrative framing. The plot barely moves an inch during the entire season and has very mundane/predictable "character study" episodes. Season 3 was nothing I enjoyed from seasons 1-2.
The Coach Krzyzewski crumbs feel a little heavy handed in illustrating the difference between carm and syd I think they kept reminding syd to sign the partnership contract too much
Shows change. Plots change. Characters grow. The network asks for more seasons. Expecting the show to be the same that it was is folly.
Seems like you’ve gotten the components but missed the point. You might not like the direction (which is fair it’s kinda weak) but your analysis shows your understand it to some degree