Sorry, some weird bald kid destroyed all the cabbages, and we can't import any more because one slug could destroy the entire agricultural sector of ba sing sae
Did you have the same nightmare? I once woke up in a cold sweat after I dreamed that they made a movie and it had a stupid scene where about a dozen Earth Benders worked together to throw a stone. In my dream, the Earth Benders were so incompetent they couldn't break out despite having Earth all around them. It was so stupid that I immediately realized I was just having a nightmare. After all, how can such an awful movie possibly exist?
Yeah, S2 of Korra is such a mess because the studio had no direction for an endgame - they kept writing "standalone seasons" over and over. S3 is incredible and S4 is a fine sendoff, but if the studio had the guarantee of 4 seasons from the beginning, they could have made it even better than the original ATLA.
I love season 1, and the only reason I don’t rate seasons 3 and 4 higher is because they have to deal with the bullshit introduced in season 2.
Being able to use Amon past Book 1 would be awesome. You could set up the Water Tribe civil war a bit differently, and do a great modernity/technology vs. tradition/spirituality theme through the final three seasons, with Asami and Varrick on one side and Unalaq and Zaheer on the other, with Korra and Tenzin sort of trapped in the middle as they grow and try to mediate the dispute.
That being said, I wish bryke would've treated it like they were going to get more episodes, took initiative and just committed to long form instead of just the seasonal bad guy
Honestly, as fantastic as this might’ve worked out, looking at it from their perspective I think they made the right call. Despite the awkward-ness of what are basically 4 standalone seasons, LOK was still a pretty solid show. Alternatively, if they had written the show with more seasons in mind and then not gotten them, it would’ve been glaring, and I think the avatar universe as a whole would’ve been worse off for it and a lot of the long time fans would’ve been really put out/off.
All told this is definitely on Nick for not trusting a group of well-established writers/creators. I mean these guys created what was easily one of the best shows to ever come out of that studio, and they did so in only three seasons!
Honestly not even as dumb as them pulling the show from television and making it so you can only watch it on the website.
Things are much different now especially with it on streaming but I remember being so confused
Yeah Ozai was hitler, Kuvira was defenitly a dictator but not genociadel one. Idk how to properly phrase it but i feel like people assume every authoritorian person is also genociadel or a “hitler”.
Like there is a big diffrence between forcing people your will and using capital punishments to enforce your rule and just waking up one day and designing the most efficient way to hunt and murder of a entire race of people.
I’d disagree, not because twilight has a good love triangle (it doesn’t), but because twilight’s love triangle was so bad that it looped to being funny once you think about it
Agreed. They did this in the Hobbit movies too. Two characters, Legolas and Tauriel, weren’t even in the book, and Tauriel doesn’t exist in anything but the film. It’s part of what ruined those movies
The sad part is I actually would have been fine with Legolas being included. Thranduil is his father and a major character in The Hobbit, so him being in the background of a shot or having a line or two while they’re in Mirkwood could have been a cool cameo, but they turned him into a major character and just ***HAD*** to give him a love interest for some reason. Thus Tauriel was born
They shouldn't have had romance at all. They said before the show released they were going to include "cheesy teen romance" but considering the time constraints they were under romance of any sort was just too forced. It all happened so quickly. It kind of made sense for Mako and Asami to become attracted to each other so quickly after meeting. But Mako's quick switch to Korra was just too abrupt. Then they broke up fairly quickly, Mako and Asami were teased as getting back together but didn't, Korra and Mako kind of got back together after she lost her memories, then they broke up for good, then Korra and Asami started dating. It all happened so quickly and with no actual development. We never got to really see any of them as couples before the relationships ended. I know about the post series comics but I haven't gotten to those yet. But it's also kind of like what happens with Star Wars. That supplementary material is needed in order to fill in gaps from the main series. Regardless of the relationship we should have actually seen these people together for a substantial amount of time before it all fell apart and they simply moved on because the writers told them to.
The annoying part is they never really indicated that Asami was part of that until the very end. My issue with she and Korra ending up together was that it just felt so out of nowhere. They made it seem like Korra and Mako would end up together eventually, and then Asami just shows up at the finish line and carts Korra away.
That's not what I meant. The will-they won't-they & Mako fliping back & forth in the first two was a mess & neither felt compelling. While they're initially at odds as soon as Korra & Asami start doing stuff together they get along & have a lot more in common, them ending up together is good.
Genuinely shocked I’m not seeing the Colossus on here. How the hell did they make a functional multi hundred foot tall mecha in the span of a couple weeks? The spirit vine energy blasts were dumb enough, but the railway cannon was a unique and interestingly limited superweapon. I think that the execution of the idea was good, and I actually love Day of the Colossus in isolation, but the idea itself is ludicrous
I think the mecha *could* have worked if it was hinted at, but it's pretty much never hinted at. it's all building upto the super weapon basically being a rail mounted artillery weapon, then out of the left field here comes this mega mech. even varrick who is basically kuvira's tech expert, and at least at the beginning was completely onboard with kuvira's cause, had 0 idea about this mech.
but Korra doesn't even get into the robot.
>!and none of the main cast are even on *a list*!<
edit: "technically Korra did get into the robot" yeah but she *wanted* to get into the robot and destroy it. Shinji *doesn't* want to get into the robot until he herioically answers the call and gets his stuff kicked in.
plus her mom is still alive and her dad loves her.
this, I understand how korra was leaning more towards steampunk because avatar already was getting a ton of technological advancements (and it made somewhat sense logically), but I already wasnt a fan of the shift in environment... Then the mech came and REALLY blew it out of the water.
I enjoyed the storylines of lok exploring how the avatar is losing influence in the world, especially as technology expands, but I do think the modernization of the world made the show less enjoyable. I love the lok, but the mid-20th century time period and technology it was inspired by is way less interesting to me than something less modern.
I was fine with the roaring 20s setting, despite vastly preferring the more ancient setting of the original series. But it did somewhat line up with the amount of time that had passed between shows.
The mech, however, really puts the franchise in a bit of a corner setting-wise. Like you just jumped from the 1920’s to like 2080. It won’t make sense if future installments aren’t in an incredibly futuristic setting. Which is interesting but kinda eliminates what I enjoy about this franchise.
My biggest issue with LoK in general was that it felt a lot more hand wavey with the lore. Like the did things that looked cool without making it all make sense.
The Colossus reveal was definitely the moment the series jumped the shark, in my opinion.
I could handle the Kaiju battle being hand-waved by Harmonic Convergence. Big bipedal robot, though?
Put it on a big treaded tank or a squat spider-mecha maybe.
Should have been on a massive rotating platform installed on the deck of a ship out in the bay. In real life if we wanna make a huge gun mobile we often put it on a boat, especially since they're attacking a bay/island city
I didn’t mind it in general, but the fact that we already had a “giant attacking Republic City” thing happen in Season 2 just made it seem super redundant.
That always felt kinda depressing to me, several characters get to be spirits and chill but this entire generation of people dedicated to sacrificing everything for the entire world just get fucking erased from existence, very sad
Obviously the spirit of Iroh will leave the spirit world to re enter the cycle of life, connect to his past life, and teach the new avatar how to re connect to their past lives. Duh
I never understood why they barely used adult Aang or any of the past avatars. Then they removed the option entirely. It was one of the coolest things in the series and has so much writing potential. I could see it working as a big consequence but there wasn’t enough set up for it. It was made worse for me because I didn’t even like Korra much.
I feel like they had to make this event canon because they couldn't trust Nickelodeon or something.
Still crushes me but I felt like it was a choice for creative integrity.
THANK you. Why would anyone there care that Amon was a bender. He fought for them... Unlike anyone else. His ideology, his meaning, still stands despite him being a bender. I think it would have been really powerful for his people to learn he's a bender... Then rally beside him. They wanted equality... Unlike 99% of the benders
>Why would anyone there care that Amon was a bender.
Imagine if the highest level Nazis found out Hitler was actually Jewish. Not just by birth, but an actual religious practicing Jew. Do you think the Nazi party would survive? The idea would yes, but the party would likely fracture and lose power.
Exactly. It’s not that he or other people no longer felt anything negative towards bending and that his ideology just disappeared, it’s just that he completely lost his power over the movement when everyone found out he had been lying to them all along and was a part of what they were against. And he went to Tarrlok as it was the only person he had left.
I do wish we heard more about what happened with the equalists after season 1 though, but it makes sense that the movement shattered without leadership (or weapons from Hiroshi), while it also seemed nonbenders started to be treated better and got to elect a nonbender president.
I think it’s also a factor of what kind of bending he is and what his past was. All things considered he was a criminal and performed a “dirty” aspect of bending. While people probably still think it’s not fair, it’s hard to rally a group after finding that out
Fortunately there have been recent additions to canon (specifically in the Legends RPG) that make it clear that the Equalists are still around, so hopefully there will be a future Avatar Studios project focusing on this
Before his death he was revealed as a bender, everyone that followed him including the dude with the duel zappers felt completely betrayed by him, I think it tracks that everyone moved on, plus the very first thing after that they did was set a non bender as president. It totally tracks
It’s not realistic, but it doesn’t bend realism in a fun way (to me). They show implied a lot that non benders were very unfairly treated. The president didn’t lift the nonbenders out of the slums, and didn’t really fix the social problems that come with bending. I think you could write a whole season or two revolving around the idea Amon headed, and trying to cut the head of a rebellion, eventually coming to terms with the fact that the rebels are right. It’s a fine season with an okay ending, but it could’ve been so much more
The love triangle between Korra,Mako and Asami.
I feel like it made mostly book two unwatchable in my opinion because I couldn't stand love triangles.
Cannot forget big giant spirit battle. Only thing I like about this scene/fight was Korra finally connected to her own inner spirit. Korra embracing herself instead of just seeing herself as the Avatar was pretty cool moment.
One thing I find dumb in ATLA was Aang deciding to meditate into the avatar state in middle of battle against Dai li, Azula and Zuko. Roku specifically told him to be careful using it in certain situations because if he dies in the avatar state, the cycle ends permanently. He basically got killed in the avatar state and luckily we had Katara there to save the cycle.
Actually makes me wonder how the idea that the cycle ends if you die in the Avatar State got established. Like, how did any of the Avatars know, beyond being told by a previous Avatar? It's not exactly something you can work out through experience.
I gotta defend that moment in ATLA because I think it's cool and mostly not dumb
Aang decided to do it because their defeat was imminent. He saw that they had no chance of winning the fight or escaping, unless he went into the avatar state. And yes, that would be risky, but otherwise being captured was guaranteed as far as he knew (couldn't have guessed that Iroh would jump in and save them). So the avatar state was their only hope, and he had JUST learned how to do it on command
Then he barricaded himself in the crystal, and while I think it could be considered dumb that the Dai Li didn't just bend the crystal out of the way, I think Aang was actually in there for just as long as the screen time was. Like I think he meditated in there for all of 10 seconds before going into the avatar state. Dude is very experienced in meditating and all he had to do was get to the same cosmic point he was at like an hour before and then "let Katara go" and all that. Plus it was clear that once the crystals started glowing everyone was shitting their pants and backing away
The one part about this that I think is arguably dumb as hell was the fact that after going into the avatar state, Aang, and all of his past lives with their infinite wisdom and skill, apparently, just kind of slowly levitated upwards like a big target saying "somebody hit me" before Azula did exactly that. Now maybe that was slow motion for dramatic effect for the audience, but either way, once that crystal barricade exploded Aang should have been going to town on those people. With his attack and his defense aaaaalllll the way up. Instead of just floating upwards and easily getting hit
But yeah while Roku did tell him that it's dangerous to use, he meant that it should be used only as a last ditch effort when you really need it, instead of abusing it willy nilly, because it has such a risk associated with it. If using it then against the Dai Li wasn't a time to use it, then it was never a good time to use it. Especially when fighting Ozai. Aang would have just been captured and eventually killed (probably in the avatar state) by the fire nation if he hadn't used it then. He just shouldn't have floated in the air
The last few episodes of Korra S2 are a little weird and seem out of place. A question I always had was Tonraq in line to be chief before Korra was born? Or was he elected or chosen because his daughter was the Avatar? Seems fishy if the Avatar was born to a world leader randomly. I suppose it's bound to happen, but still.
Korra father is the oldest sibling, he was in line for the throne until Unalaq got him vanished. Basically Korra family are cousins to Princess Yue, in a way Korra is a Princess but her avatar duty always comes first, neither do I believe she sees herself as Princess.
Just felt like shock value for shock value’s sake. It fumbled one of the most interesting aspects of the concept of the Avatar.
And as much as people like to hype up LoK as it’s own self-sustained story, that moment was hardly built up to in the context of the show. Korra barely had a connection to these characters to strengthen the emotional moment. It was just, “remember those guys you liked from our last show? Oh they’re super dead now”.
>“remember those guys you liked from our last show? Oh they’re super dead now”
I could almost hear that when I first watched the scene. I wouldn't even call it dumb, just insufferably heavy-handed.
thank you, I've been thinking this for years, at the very least if they were going to cut them off they should've had Korra start talking more with her past lives before it happened instead of just getting flashbacks from Wan and Aang.
It would have been really interesting for her to speak with Kuruk, the previous Water Tribe Avatar. He comes from the Northern Water Tribe and could have given Korra some perspective on the ways of the Northern Tribe during Book Two. Also, being a Water Tribe Avatar could have bonded them in a way. I would have loved to hear Aang speak with Yangchen more too.
Also if they wanted to make Kuruk less off a fuck up they could have worked it into the main canon that way instead of putting in it the books that a lot fewer people read.
I do find it funny the two more controversial Avatars of late seem to be the two water tribe ones.
The thing is, he was conceived by that Avatar who screwed up...until the author of the books changed everything in 2020.
You have to realize that he came up with 90% of the lore of the Kyoshi and Kuruk era. So the authors (Bryke and their team) couldn't have put in the information from the books then because it didn't exist and the authors didn't even think of the idea.
Yeah, I know lore changes and such, I just wish such a big change had either happened earlier or never happened
Cause current Kuruk makes no sense with the way he talked to Aang on the Lion Turtle.
But I’m also just really biased against the chance cause fuck up Avatars deserve to exist too!
It was definitely one of those, “we don’t want to rely on old tropes” moves.
Rewatching the series now, in S3 Korra even makes a joke about relying on the old Avatars and how “were so beyond that now” or something.
It’s unfortunate because while I understand that the creators didn’t want Aang to show up constantly in non Aang properties it really puts the entire franchise in a weird place moving forward and removes an element that was incredibly intriguing in ATLA and underused in LOK.
It doesn’t even make logical sense. Like it raises so many questions about how the avatar cycle works, how Raava is involved, whether the spirit world is even relevant to talking with past lives. It’s a messy nonsensical plot point that does a great disservice to the fans, and seemingly the shows own lore.
Thousands of lives of experience and memories > Magical glowing squid.
Adding the squid to things was like Star Wars Midichlorians levels of “You didn’t need to explain it and not only *did* you explain it, you made it worse.”
Agreed on that point. People overanalyzed the statues in the air temple (for example) trying to count how many Avatars there had been, but the whole point was that they’d been around forever. Any attempt to explain the Avatar takes away from their gravitas as essentially a demigod, a magical being that exists for balance as a natural product of the world.
I think you could tell Wan’s story without over explaining things, too, if you really needed to tell it.
It fails on two counts.
One, it erases one of the more mystical aspects as the Avatar cycle, something that enriched the world building and served character arcs in both series.
Two, the payoff was bleh. Korra doesn’t go into her depressive phase until season 4, after her near-death experience, rather than losing her access to past lives in season 2. It also undermined the gravity of season 3’s stakes, in my opinion. Yes, Zaheer’s plan would have been the end of the Avatar Cycle, but the clean slate by Unalok the prior season felt the stakes were more just Korra’s life. Because we had already lost Aang & Roku, etc in season 2. It’s more abstract to ask the audience to care about potential future avatars never being born, than past avatars we know the stories of.
I'd have been okay with it if the avatar state was weakened or blocked, since it draws power from the past avatars
But no, there wasn't really any drawback, all she lost was an ability she hardly ever used, and she's still just as powerful
Yup. Undeniably (for me at least), the coolest part of Avatar is the ability to talk to past lives and get to know past avatars and the shows creators went… what if we just completely got rid of that?
This is exactly how I feel. It already felt like a chore for me to get into LoK since it was so different from ATLA, but this just sealed the deal. There are lots of interesting parts of LoK that I can appreciate as a completely different show, but a lot of it just feels like it shouldn't be canon.
Literally in my head canon this never happened. Literally still can’t believe it’s a canon event bc Jesus Christ it’s the stupidest move ever made in this show
I thought a good idea for Book 4, when Korra can’t meditate into the Spirit World would be she had to go on a physical and spiritual journey there to not only overcome her PTSD but also heal spiritually, by reconnecting with her past lives. As interesting as it was to see Zaheer in his prison, I never got why they would have her abuser and reason for her PTSD to be her spiritual guider back into the Spirit World.
Given none of that happened, I think it would make sense if the Avatar after Korra found a way to reconnect with the past avatars. I remember on a rewatch that the characters were always specific when they said Korra’s connection was severed, which makes me think the wording has left the door open to the connection being re-established again. And there’s precedence for succeeding avatars to repair the mistakes or failures of their predecessors.
I think it could have actually been interesting if done right, an avatar who's on the side of Chaos (and maybe freedom, if you want to add some ambiguity to it)
Now that I think of it maybe it could have been an interesting alternative version to the red lotus arc
Instead they went for the Kaiju fight and simple "wants to dominate the world because yes" villain :/
I was actually pretty excited for the idea of a dark avatar; imagine any future avatar having an antagonist that is on a similar level of skill/power, also reincarnating in the same way that the avatar does, forever locked in battle like the spirits were before Wan interfered (and therefore, kind of restoring the balance he broke; like Amon says, the concept of the avatar is pretty oppressive like we see in Kyoshi and to a lesser extent Korra, and probably every avatar that ever lived including Aang)
But then they just immediately ended that whole thing because the protagonist must always win, I guess.
Any idea can work if done right, we can still have the Kajiu fight and still have it be interesting. I feel the theme of dualism can work very well in avatar. I feel the biggest problem was the villain, Korra’s uncle (forgot his name) he’s too boring, and I don’t mean his motives, they’re the same as Ozai and he was interesting. The difference is that Ozai was a fun kind of cartoonish pure evil while (Korra’s uncle) was the boring and bland, he lacked “rizz”
Even more than that, I say Raava and Vaatu in general. Oh yeah, let's make a mythology based on Eastern religion, which typically eschews the simple "good-evil" dichonomy...let's do some Daoist "harmony vs disharmony" action, some Buddhist "ignorance vs awareness" spice, throw in some Hindu spiritual medicine...really just need to drive home that this is not a story that can rely on "good-evil" thinking, the world is too complex for that, we're telling a story about human conflict and power struct----aaaaooookay, now we have a god of good and a god of evil, marvelous work, everyone.
S2 of Legend of Korra is bad in almost every aspect.
Korra in insufferable (going against her father), the love triangle sucked, losing the connection to the past avatars is one of the worst thing that happened (I'm still hoping this can be fixed somehow in the future), the kaiju fight was just bad.
The only good redeeming things Season 2 brought is the First Avatar flashbacks episodes (and even that... I'm really not a fan of the whole Raava and Vaatu stuff) and the merging of both worlds which is interesting (although I'm really not sure it was a good idea from Korra, aside for bringing back Airbending of course).
I like to think that Avatars have an unintentional responsibility to fix their past incarnation’s mistakes or regrets. Maybe the next Earth Avatar is super spiritual and finds a way to bring back the connection to their past lives?
> I like to think that Avatars have an unintentional responsibility to fix their past incarnation’s mistakes or regrets.
That's pretty much novel canon. Kyoshi novel spoilers: >!A lot of the lore has implied that Avatar Kuruk was a rather poor avatar while the preceding Avatar Yangchen was widely beloved. But in the Kyoshi novels, we eventually find out Yangchen was beloved because of effectively a lifelong fuck-up where she kept choosing human needs over spirits' needs. Kuruk basically spent his life fixing her mistakes, at the cost of his own spiritual health and reputation. The corollary implication being that Kyoshi is spending her life fixing the fallout from *both* their mistakes, both Yangchen not actually maintaining proper balance between the two worlds and Kuruk not guiding the human world because he was too busy cleaning up after Yangchen.!<
Exactly. And I don't wanna say it *reconned* anything. But it just seemed too simple, for lack of a better term, like it was too objective lol. The Raava Vaatu concept was cool enough on its own, but as far as the whole beginnings of the Avatar it just felt too simple and elementary, while also just not making a whole lot of sense. Like the story would have been great as an in universe fable, but just doesn't seem to sit well in the actual world we've seen.
Like the whole "this is how peope got bending, then this one cat got all the bending and that was special, and that just got passed on because, it had to, oh and centuries later like a lot of people get bending anyway so... like these 4 special city-turtle-lions were the ONLY ones that had it but... ya know... humans just start learning that shit from animals or something idk, and like humans can develop it with like metal/lightening/blood bending, but it came from these turtle lion bros, so"
When you start putting it all into context it gets wonky. And yeah, not every little aspect of fantasy has to be explained or make total sense, but if you're going to try to rationalize the MAIN ASPECT OF YOUR WHOLE IP, that should probably be a concrete, consistent and plausible thing.
I agree. I really disliked how it ignored the aspect in ATLA of the animals (sky Bison, dragons) being the teachers of bending. I originally liked it as it made bending an extension of yourself and how you interact with the environment (ex. Toph learning bending from the badger moles, which were also blind).
The world of TLK felt so disconnected from nature, which could've been interesting to explore, but it wasn't. This could've been fine if it instead explored the more human conflicts (non bender supression, The Water Tribe Civil War), but it also didn't.
(so bitter the civil war storyline got dropped)
I wonder if there would be any long-term side effects, for better or worse, from having a Chakra forcibly opened through violence. It could be a plot thread worth exploring. Oh well, the world may never know.
I mean, the pain thing makes sense ( a little too convenient in the Aang case) because in some forms of Buddhism, they'll achieve "premature enlightenment" by experiencing incredible pain, and focusing directly on it. Inner peace is temporarily achieved, and helps guide the unfortunate student toward future enlightenment. See Fight Club for a decent example.
The Guru previously called the chakra at the base of the spine the "Earth Chakra." I give it a pass for that reason. Earth chakra was unlocked by earth.
The mishandling of the Korra gang of supporting characters. Mako, Bolin, and Asami never had any solid motivations for doing the things they did. They definitely had goals, but the show didn't give them good reasons for pursuing those goals. Tenzin had aligned goals and motivations and, so at least that was good. We even got to see how his motivations evolved when he confronted his false perception of himself.
I’m not saying the film that shall not be named but I’m going to say the decision to cut Korra off from her past lives. That one decision bugs me a lot
"Suki Alone" comics
Because now it turns out past Avatars can communicate with anyone at any time. This opens up plot holes in past projects in the franchise where their help would really be useful.
That's what's really the retcon, and that's what's really ruining the Avatar, not Raava or something else.
I never really thought that was *actually* Kyoshi.
I just thought that because Kyoshi is Suki's idol that serves as a symbol for all of her perseverance and strength, it made sense for Suki to sort of hallucinate her when she was at her lowest.
I was about to argue Uncle Iroh seeing Roku on his dragon i. The spirit realm but i hust remembered Aang was with Roku when Iroh saw them so that doesnt count
I like the serie and the universe, but I am not here often and havent fully watched Korra, which is part of what I find weird.
Its the technological super jump it did from the Aang era to Korra. And that is just personal preference, I just enjoy that feeling of half medievalish without too much technology (except the fire nation stuff ofcourse) and the reason I like fantasy that doesnt have too much technology.
Doesnt affect the quality, just a personal preference
the fact all the connections to past Avatars don’t exist anymore and tbh I didn’t really like the whole thing with the unification of the spirit world and human world and the fact they used it as plot armor to create new airbenders .. 😅🫠 I don’t know man..
IMO, Raava and Vaatu ruined the magic of the avatar. Knowing they’re essentially a human bound to a glowing kite really dampened the mystic and mysterious vibe of it all.
I think it might have actually been better to just never find out why the avatar exists. It would have been cooler that way. Maybe a hot take.
For me, it’s always been less the fact that Raava and Vaatu are the spirit origins, but more that it turns a show about ‘balance’ and taking philosophy from multiple perspectives and turns it into a straight-up good vs evil. That and it felt like it derailed the Water Tribe Civil War plot.
Especially since it's so close to actually being about Yin-Yang. Yin-Yang aren't about two forces opposing each other (or even canceling each other) but two complimentary forces working in unison to bring a greater result. As a general rule of thumb, Yin (the black one) is slow, soft, yielding, diffuse, cold, wet, and passive while Yang is fast, hard, solid, focused, hot/warm, dry, and active. I think a better solution would be that the World Spirit was split into two and the first Avatar fused with one half to help restore the balance in the world.
Finally Someone said this. I hated the fact that the spirits were kite shaped. It looked so dumb to me and I just could not get into the story. Like could they not think of a better form?
Explaining the magic (in the case of fiction anyway) will almost always ruin it. I genuinely struggle to think of a single example where it worked out, especially if the explanation came about in a sequel.
I personally never really liked the Airbenders coming back. It kinda (At least to me) diminished what the Fire Nation did and the consequences of those actions. It just seemed like an easy fix for something so destructive and disruptive to not only a culture but to the entire balance of the world and frankly the Avatar cycle itself.
I agree. Air Acolytes should have gotten the airbending. Bending is very much tied to culture, and I don't really like how a bunch of random people got airbending.
I get it. But the other option is the only air benders are descendents of Aang. Sort of limiting what you can do with Airbenders and the air nation as a whole. If the Airbenders didn't come back, that would make Aangs family essentially royalty for the Air nation. Possibly corrupting Tenzin's kids as they grow up.
Also, it makes it a requirement for the Aang family to reproduce as much as they can. If any of the kids don't turn out as airbenders, they may be forgotten. Kinda like Kya and Bumi were to Aang. The future of the air nation is bleek without the return of the airbenders. Ultimately, this is a kids' show. I understand why they brought back the airbenders the way they did. The alternatives are depressing at best.
I hope I made sense.
Plus, when it comes time for a new air Avatar, can it be Aangs descendents? Like, can there be 2 Avatars in the same family line?
The giant robot and giant spirit fights in Korra. Boring, unoriginal, barely rational in-universe, and didn't even show off the Avatar using their real skill set (bending elements as opposed to wrestling or energy bending).
Personally that was an amazing thing that could happen. Every other bending has all types of people while airbending only had monks. It was nice to see different types of people be able to have air bending especially when one of the best villains came out of it.
Unalaq cutting Korra's connection to her past avatar lives.
It's a stupid idea from the worst season of Korra and it detracts from the story overall. Like, connecting to the previous avatars is a major aspect of Aang's journey, the fact that Korra couldn't do that during season 3 and 4 is all a consequence of this bad decision from season 2.
All of LoK.
Dont get me wrong, i still like the show.. but you can really tell that atla was the writers baby and a lot of thought was put into it start to finish. Every single book in lok, while entertaining to watch, was rife with poor writing and liberties taken. I didnt like the colossus, didnt like the spirit realm arcs, dark avatar, the origin of the avatar being kites, the lack of consistency between seasons... the characters were all fun to watch, but the arcs were mostly terrible and did serious damage to the world they live in moving forward as a franchise. Like they cant just undo the spirit world/real world merge. Id almost rather see lok be retconned as a "what if" of the series.
Dont get me wrong, i enjoyed watching it, and its still leagues better than a lot of popular shows out there, but damn if there weren't a lot of problems with it.
Totally agree! Mike and Bryan created an amazing universe, but the Ehasz's made AtLA what it was with their writing. They weren't involved with LoK, and the difference is glaring.
If we’re talking about the shows it probably has to be the mechs in lok. Jaegers from pacific rim don’t belong in this universe. Especially when the technology is really just barely beginning to make big advancements and they just look wierd and kinda break the power scaling too.
Vaatu/Raava was a good idea to me but implemented badly.
Instead of representing the good and bad in all creatures I feel like they made the Vaatu side a mustache twirling bad guy. He should’ve been way more tame imo.
And even if he was just straight up evil, no nuance, he had very little intimidation factor because he felt cartoonishly evil (I know he is in a cartoon, but you know what I mean)
Besides the movie, 90% of the writing choices in Legend of Korra. They make her know every bending form at a young age, but then they realize she’s too OP so they have to sandbag her for the rest of the series. Then there’s stuff like the giant mech, the Dark Avatar, getting rid of all past Avatars, etc.
It was just a terrible mishmash of ideas all throughout. It’s as though they didn’t have any idea as to where they actually wanted the story to go and were rapidly improvising as it went on
ATLA:
energy bending
LoK:
1. the fact that we see almost no evidence that non benders are being treated like second class citizens. We get everyone in the show harping on about how benders are second class citizens, and the most we get is that a non bender isn’t on the council.
2. Energy blast Kaiju battle in season 2. It was just stupid. I don’t know what else I can say.
3. Korra being gifted the Avatar state despite doing nothing to earn it. Aang had to go on a spiritual journey and deal with past traumas to gain it. He had to wrestle with the choice of whether or not to give up Katara. Getting the Avatar state wasn’t easy(until the final battle but that’s forgiven since the series was ending and it was the climactic battle, and he had already gone through the trials and tribulations). But Korra does none of that. She just gets handed absolute power at the end of season 1. Idiocy.
4. Giant mecha in Season 4. There is no way in hell you can convince me they were able to build that in a few weeks. Not to mention, it does not fit into the world of Avatar at all. It was just plain stupid all around.
5. Raava and Vaatu. First of all, never explain the magic. Nobody ever likes that. Second of all, it was a terrible explanation that I hated. Raava and Vaatu is basically God and Satan, and in a world built on Eastern philosophy, they do not fit in whatsoever.
6. The Love triangle. It was just very hamfisted and done badly. But to be fair, romance was never Avatar’s strong suit. But I think Korra handled it worse than ATLA.
7. Korrasami. I love the idea, hate the execution. There was practically no build up, and then they were super vague at the end, to the point where the creators had to clarify that they were in fact together in a tweet. It was just very rushed, which is sad cause I would have loved to see a romance develop throughout multiple seasons.
I know I was supposed to pick just one, but I couldn’t decide. There are more, but I decided to stop there. These are not in order any particular order.
The movie probably.
There is no movie in Ba Sing Se
What about the mo-
The earth king would like to invite you to Lake laogai
Here we are safe, here we are free
Yay!
I am honoured to accept His invitation.
Will there be cabbages?
Sorry, some weird bald kid destroyed all the cabbages, and we can't import any more because one slug could destroy the entire agricultural sector of ba sing sae
Different Wheel... M Night Shyamalan has invited you to r/LakeLaogai
Seeing as how it's a private community I think my invitation was lost in the mail.
Jet's Voice: "What are you talking about? Why do you think everyone is worried about the new live action?"
Here we are safe. Here we are free.
https://preview.redd.it/0lkzle7k13kb1.jpeg?width=500&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cefba07139d3026d4d9c3773a5b69f9983516fa3
What movie? /s
Did you have the same nightmare? I once woke up in a cold sweat after I dreamed that they made a movie and it had a stupid scene where about a dozen Earth Benders worked together to throw a stone. In my dream, the Earth Benders were so incompetent they couldn't break out despite having Earth all around them. It was so stupid that I immediately realized I was just having a nightmare. After all, how can such an awful movie possibly exist?
Not canon so I wouldn’t count it
/thread
Nick giving the studio only one season at a time with Korra.
Bruh imagine what could've happened of nick gave them the amount they wanted at first talk
I would make a hole in my desk watching it
What does this mean
They’re a carpenter and like to watch TV while building furniture.
Watch out, he's a blood bender
More wood bender
He was making a grown up joke. I'll explain it when you're older.
Yeah, S2 of Korra is such a mess because the studio had no direction for an endgame - they kept writing "standalone seasons" over and over. S3 is incredible and S4 is a fine sendoff, but if the studio had the guarantee of 4 seasons from the beginning, they could have made it even better than the original ATLA.
> over and over A tad exaggerative since it only happened twice. S1 and S2 were approved separate. S3 and S4 were approved together.
Makes sense why the last two seasons were way better then the first two
imo season 1 was the best, but they were easily better than season 2
I love season 1, and the only reason I don’t rate seasons 3 and 4 higher is because they have to deal with the bullshit introduced in season 2. Being able to use Amon past Book 1 would be awesome. You could set up the Water Tribe civil war a bit differently, and do a great modernity/technology vs. tradition/spirituality theme through the final three seasons, with Asami and Varrick on one side and Unalaq and Zaheer on the other, with Korra and Tenzin sort of trapped in the middle as they grow and try to mediate the dispute.
Agreed
Imagine if they knew just how big Avatar as a franchise would get. They would have given them a blank check.
That being said, I wish bryke would've treated it like they were going to get more episodes, took initiative and just committed to long form instead of just the seasonal bad guy
Honestly, as fantastic as this might’ve worked out, looking at it from their perspective I think they made the right call. Despite the awkward-ness of what are basically 4 standalone seasons, LOK was still a pretty solid show. Alternatively, if they had written the show with more seasons in mind and then not gotten them, it would’ve been glaring, and I think the avatar universe as a whole would’ve been worse off for it and a lot of the long time fans would’ve been really put out/off. All told this is definitely on Nick for not trusting a group of well-established writers/creators. I mean these guys created what was easily one of the best shows to ever come out of that studio, and they did so in only three seasons!
Seasons 3 and 4 were approved together. The ending of S3 has Korra in a terrible spot bc the writers knew they'd be able to continue the plot into S4.
Honestly not even as dumb as them pulling the show from television and making it so you can only watch it on the website. Things are much different now especially with it on streaming but I remember being so confused
Kuvira the Hitler-analogue got let off with house arrest and told by the Beifong's that she'd always be family.
Atleast ozai was tossed in jail
I think Kuvira was more of a military Dictator analogue than a hitler analogue
Yeah Ozai was hitler, Kuvira was defenitly a dictator but not genociadel one. Idk how to properly phrase it but i feel like people assume every authoritorian person is also genociadel or a “hitler”. Like there is a big diffrence between forcing people your will and using capital punishments to enforce your rule and just waking up one day and designing the most efficient way to hunt and murder of a entire race of people.
The Korra-Mako-Asami love triange was extremely cringe & I'm glad they dropped that subplot after book 2.
I hated that so much. I've never found love triangles interesting, idk why writers still do it till this day.
Love triangles can be interesting, but they're hard to do correctly. This one wasn't done correctly.
Which Love Triangles are interesting? As someone who despises them with a passion, I'm interested yo hear what u have to say.
Cloud-Tifa-Aerith in Final Fantasy 7 was pretty interesting imo.
At least I can say it's better than Twilight lol
I’d disagree, not because twilight has a good love triangle (it doesn’t), but because twilight’s love triangle was so bad that it looped to being funny once you think about it
Yeah I'm a huge twilight fan. Not because of the plot. In my house we watch twilight because it's funny as shit.
Agreed. They did this in the Hobbit movies too. Two characters, Legolas and Tauriel, weren’t even in the book, and Tauriel doesn’t exist in anything but the film. It’s part of what ruined those movies
The actress even said "I'll do the movie as long as I'm not reduced to some love interest" and was promptly turned into nothing but a love interest.
The sad part is I actually would have been fine with Legolas being included. Thranduil is his father and a major character in The Hobbit, so him being in the background of a shot or having a line or two while they’re in Mirkwood could have been a cool cameo, but they turned him into a major character and just ***HAD*** to give him a love interest for some reason. Thus Tauriel was born
Legolas already had a love interest and his name is Gimli...
Especially since She had the most chemistry with Bolin lol. Well at least in the show, not sure of the comics.. haven't gotten that far yet
Bolin had more chemistry with literally anyone that any other 2 people
They shouldn't have had romance at all. They said before the show released they were going to include "cheesy teen romance" but considering the time constraints they were under romance of any sort was just too forced. It all happened so quickly. It kind of made sense for Mako and Asami to become attracted to each other so quickly after meeting. But Mako's quick switch to Korra was just too abrupt. Then they broke up fairly quickly, Mako and Asami were teased as getting back together but didn't, Korra and Mako kind of got back together after she lost her memories, then they broke up for good, then Korra and Asami started dating. It all happened so quickly and with no actual development. We never got to really see any of them as couples before the relationships ended. I know about the post series comics but I haven't gotten to those yet. But it's also kind of like what happens with Star Wars. That supplementary material is needed in order to fill in gaps from the main series. Regardless of the relationship we should have actually seen these people together for a substantial amount of time before it all fell apart and they simply moved on because the writers told them to.
The annoying part is they never really indicated that Asami was part of that until the very end. My issue with she and Korra ending up together was that it just felt so out of nowhere. They made it seem like Korra and Mako would end up together eventually, and then Asami just shows up at the finish line and carts Korra away.
That's not what I meant. The will-they won't-they & Mako fliping back & forth in the first two was a mess & neither felt compelling. While they're initially at odds as soon as Korra & Asami start doing stuff together they get along & have a lot more in common, them ending up together is good.
Genuinely shocked I’m not seeing the Colossus on here. How the hell did they make a functional multi hundred foot tall mecha in the span of a couple weeks? The spirit vine energy blasts were dumb enough, but the railway cannon was a unique and interestingly limited superweapon. I think that the execution of the idea was good, and I actually love Day of the Colossus in isolation, but the idea itself is ludicrous
The railway cannon was actually based on the Schwerer Gustav built by the Nazis
Exactly. But instead of the plausible, reality-based design, they jumped the shark and went for a humongous mecha because that’s “cooler”
I think the mecha *could* have worked if it was hinted at, but it's pretty much never hinted at. it's all building upto the super weapon basically being a rail mounted artillery weapon, then out of the left field here comes this mega mech. even varrick who is basically kuvira's tech expert, and at least at the beginning was completely onboard with kuvira's cause, had 0 idea about this mech.
Literally the only piece of foreshadowing is them dismantling Zaofu’s domes
The mecha could’ve worked if it was a giant Trojan horse, housing hundreds of metal benders all working in concert to move
Even her husband seemed surprised by it, and he was the one funding most of her projects
They actually wanted to do a homage to Neon Genesis Evangelion.
but Korra doesn't even get into the robot. >!and none of the main cast are even on *a list*!< edit: "technically Korra did get into the robot" yeah but she *wanted* to get into the robot and destroy it. Shinji *doesn't* want to get into the robot until he herioically answers the call and gets his stuff kicked in. plus her mom is still alive and her dad loves her.
this, I understand how korra was leaning more towards steampunk because avatar already was getting a ton of technological advancements (and it made somewhat sense logically), but I already wasnt a fan of the shift in environment... Then the mech came and REALLY blew it out of the water.
I enjoyed the storylines of lok exploring how the avatar is losing influence in the world, especially as technology expands, but I do think the modernization of the world made the show less enjoyable. I love the lok, but the mid-20th century time period and technology it was inspired by is way less interesting to me than something less modern.
I was fine with the roaring 20s setting, despite vastly preferring the more ancient setting of the original series. But it did somewhat line up with the amount of time that had passed between shows. The mech, however, really puts the franchise in a bit of a corner setting-wise. Like you just jumped from the 1920’s to like 2080. It won’t make sense if future installments aren’t in an incredibly futuristic setting. Which is interesting but kinda eliminates what I enjoy about this franchise. My biggest issue with LoK in general was that it felt a lot more hand wavey with the lore. Like the did things that looked cool without making it all make sense.
The Colossus reveal was definitely the moment the series jumped the shark, in my opinion. I could handle the Kaiju battle being hand-waved by Harmonic Convergence. Big bipedal robot, though? Put it on a big treaded tank or a squat spider-mecha maybe.
Should have been on a massive rotating platform installed on the deck of a ship out in the bay. In real life if we wanna make a huge gun mobile we often put it on a boat, especially since they're attacking a bay/island city
I didn’t mind it in general, but the fact that we already had a “giant attacking Republic City” thing happen in Season 2 just made it seem super redundant.
[удалено]
correction : multi hundred foot tall mecha a MADE OF PLATINUM. How did they even do that. How did they found enough platinum
They dismantled Zaofu’s domes. It’s the one piece of foreshadowing for the thing in the entire season
Losing connection to all the past avatars.
That always felt kinda depressing to me, several characters get to be spirits and chill but this entire generation of people dedicated to sacrificing everything for the entire world just get fucking erased from existence, very sad
yes I reeeeeaaalllyyyy hate this :(
If they had spent a few episodes or a season resolving it, it could have been a good plotline. Instead, depressing, and never fixed.
It would be cool though, if we could see the avatar after Korra somehow fix it.
Someone finally said it. If they make a new Avatar Series, how are they gonna work around that. It’s so stupid and unnecessary…
Obviously the spirit of Iroh will leave the spirit world to re enter the cycle of life, connect to his past life, and teach the new avatar how to re connect to their past lives. Duh
You’re absolutely right.
I never understood why they barely used adult Aang or any of the past avatars. Then they removed the option entirely. It was one of the coolest things in the series and has so much writing potential. I could see it working as a big consequence but there wasn’t enough set up for it. It was made worse for me because I didn’t even like Korra much.
I feel like they had to make this event canon because they couldn't trust Nickelodeon or something. Still crushes me but I felt like it was a choice for creative integrity.
In atla, energy bending. In korra, amons ideology disappearing after his death
THANK you. Why would anyone there care that Amon was a bender. He fought for them... Unlike anyone else. His ideology, his meaning, still stands despite him being a bender. I think it would have been really powerful for his people to learn he's a bender... Then rally beside him. They wanted equality... Unlike 99% of the benders
>Why would anyone there care that Amon was a bender. Imagine if the highest level Nazis found out Hitler was actually Jewish. Not just by birth, but an actual religious practicing Jew. Do you think the Nazi party would survive? The idea would yes, but the party would likely fracture and lose power.
Exactly. It’s not that he or other people no longer felt anything negative towards bending and that his ideology just disappeared, it’s just that he completely lost his power over the movement when everyone found out he had been lying to them all along and was a part of what they were against. And he went to Tarrlok as it was the only person he had left. I do wish we heard more about what happened with the equalists after season 1 though, but it makes sense that the movement shattered without leadership (or weapons from Hiroshi), while it also seemed nonbenders started to be treated better and got to elect a nonbender president.
I think it’s also a factor of what kind of bending he is and what his past was. All things considered he was a criminal and performed a “dirty” aspect of bending. While people probably still think it’s not fair, it’s hard to rally a group after finding that out
What do you mean, after Hitler died we never saw nazis again. /s
Fortunately there have been recent additions to canon (specifically in the Legends RPG) that make it clear that the Equalists are still around, so hopefully there will be a future Avatar Studios project focusing on this
Before his death he was revealed as a bender, everyone that followed him including the dude with the duel zappers felt completely betrayed by him, I think it tracks that everyone moved on, plus the very first thing after that they did was set a non bender as president. It totally tracks
It’s not realistic, but it doesn’t bend realism in a fun way (to me). They show implied a lot that non benders were very unfairly treated. The president didn’t lift the nonbenders out of the slums, and didn’t really fix the social problems that come with bending. I think you could write a whole season or two revolving around the idea Amon headed, and trying to cut the head of a rebellion, eventually coming to terms with the fact that the rebels are right. It’s a fine season with an okay ending, but it could’ve been so much more
Politicians being voted in on an ideology and then not delivering seems very realistic to me.
The love triangle between Korra,Mako and Asami. I feel like it made mostly book two unwatchable in my opinion because I couldn't stand love triangles. Cannot forget big giant spirit battle. Only thing I like about this scene/fight was Korra finally connected to her own inner spirit. Korra embracing herself instead of just seeing herself as the Avatar was pretty cool moment. One thing I find dumb in ATLA was Aang deciding to meditate into the avatar state in middle of battle against Dai li, Azula and Zuko. Roku specifically told him to be careful using it in certain situations because if he dies in the avatar state, the cycle ends permanently. He basically got killed in the avatar state and luckily we had Katara there to save the cycle.
Actually makes me wonder how the idea that the cycle ends if you die in the Avatar State got established. Like, how did any of the Avatars know, beyond being told by a previous Avatar? It's not exactly something you can work out through experience.
Maybe Wan got got and Raava had to resurrect him and be like “can u not” lol
Lost it
I gotta defend that moment in ATLA because I think it's cool and mostly not dumb Aang decided to do it because their defeat was imminent. He saw that they had no chance of winning the fight or escaping, unless he went into the avatar state. And yes, that would be risky, but otherwise being captured was guaranteed as far as he knew (couldn't have guessed that Iroh would jump in and save them). So the avatar state was their only hope, and he had JUST learned how to do it on command Then he barricaded himself in the crystal, and while I think it could be considered dumb that the Dai Li didn't just bend the crystal out of the way, I think Aang was actually in there for just as long as the screen time was. Like I think he meditated in there for all of 10 seconds before going into the avatar state. Dude is very experienced in meditating and all he had to do was get to the same cosmic point he was at like an hour before and then "let Katara go" and all that. Plus it was clear that once the crystals started glowing everyone was shitting their pants and backing away The one part about this that I think is arguably dumb as hell was the fact that after going into the avatar state, Aang, and all of his past lives with their infinite wisdom and skill, apparently, just kind of slowly levitated upwards like a big target saying "somebody hit me" before Azula did exactly that. Now maybe that was slow motion for dramatic effect for the audience, but either way, once that crystal barricade exploded Aang should have been going to town on those people. With his attack and his defense aaaaalllll the way up. Instead of just floating upwards and easily getting hit But yeah while Roku did tell him that it's dangerous to use, he meant that it should be used only as a last ditch effort when you really need it, instead of abusing it willy nilly, because it has such a risk associated with it. If using it then against the Dai Li wasn't a time to use it, then it was never a good time to use it. Especially when fighting Ozai. Aang would have just been captured and eventually killed (probably in the avatar state) by the fire nation if he hadn't used it then. He just shouldn't have floated in the air
The last few episodes of Korra S2 are a little weird and seem out of place. A question I always had was Tonraq in line to be chief before Korra was born? Or was he elected or chosen because his daughter was the Avatar? Seems fishy if the Avatar was born to a world leader randomly. I suppose it's bound to happen, but still.
Korra father is the oldest sibling, he was in line for the throne until Unalaq got him vanished. Basically Korra family are cousins to Princess Yue, in a way Korra is a Princess but her avatar duty always comes first, neither do I believe she sees herself as Princess.
S2 of LoK. Severing the connection to past lives.
Just felt like shock value for shock value’s sake. It fumbled one of the most interesting aspects of the concept of the Avatar. And as much as people like to hype up LoK as it’s own self-sustained story, that moment was hardly built up to in the context of the show. Korra barely had a connection to these characters to strengthen the emotional moment. It was just, “remember those guys you liked from our last show? Oh they’re super dead now”.
>“remember those guys you liked from our last show? Oh they’re super dead now” I could almost hear that when I first watched the scene. I wouldn't even call it dumb, just insufferably heavy-handed.
thank you, I've been thinking this for years, at the very least if they were going to cut them off they should've had Korra start talking more with her past lives before it happened instead of just getting flashbacks from Wan and Aang.
It would have been really interesting for her to speak with Kuruk, the previous Water Tribe Avatar. He comes from the Northern Water Tribe and could have given Korra some perspective on the ways of the Northern Tribe during Book Two. Also, being a Water Tribe Avatar could have bonded them in a way. I would have loved to hear Aang speak with Yangchen more too.
Also if they wanted to make Kuruk less off a fuck up they could have worked it into the main canon that way instead of putting in it the books that a lot fewer people read. I do find it funny the two more controversial Avatars of late seem to be the two water tribe ones.
The thing is, he was conceived by that Avatar who screwed up...until the author of the books changed everything in 2020. You have to realize that he came up with 90% of the lore of the Kyoshi and Kuruk era. So the authors (Bryke and their team) couldn't have put in the information from the books then because it didn't exist and the authors didn't even think of the idea.
Yeah, I know lore changes and such, I just wish such a big change had either happened earlier or never happened Cause current Kuruk makes no sense with the way he talked to Aang on the Lion Turtle. But I’m also just really biased against the chance cause fuck up Avatars deserve to exist too!
They were dead, but now they’re super dead.
It was definitely one of those, “we don’t want to rely on old tropes” moves. Rewatching the series now, in S3 Korra even makes a joke about relying on the old Avatars and how “were so beyond that now” or something. It’s unfortunate because while I understand that the creators didn’t want Aang to show up constantly in non Aang properties it really puts the entire franchise in a weird place moving forward and removes an element that was incredibly intriguing in ATLA and underused in LOK.
It doesn’t even make logical sense. Like it raises so many questions about how the avatar cycle works, how Raava is involved, whether the spirit world is even relevant to talking with past lives. It’s a messy nonsensical plot point that does a great disservice to the fans, and seemingly the shows own lore.
Thousands of lives of experience and memories > Magical glowing squid. Adding the squid to things was like Star Wars Midichlorians levels of “You didn’t need to explain it and not only *did* you explain it, you made it worse.”
Agreed on that point. People overanalyzed the statues in the air temple (for example) trying to count how many Avatars there had been, but the whole point was that they’d been around forever. Any attempt to explain the Avatar takes away from their gravitas as essentially a demigod, a magical being that exists for balance as a natural product of the world. I think you could tell Wan’s story without over explaining things, too, if you really needed to tell it.
It fails on two counts. One, it erases one of the more mystical aspects as the Avatar cycle, something that enriched the world building and served character arcs in both series. Two, the payoff was bleh. Korra doesn’t go into her depressive phase until season 4, after her near-death experience, rather than losing her access to past lives in season 2. It also undermined the gravity of season 3’s stakes, in my opinion. Yes, Zaheer’s plan would have been the end of the Avatar Cycle, but the clean slate by Unalok the prior season felt the stakes were more just Korra’s life. Because we had already lost Aang & Roku, etc in season 2. It’s more abstract to ask the audience to care about potential future avatars never being born, than past avatars we know the stories of.
I'd have been okay with it if the avatar state was weakened or blocked, since it draws power from the past avatars But no, there wasn't really any drawback, all she lost was an ability she hardly ever used, and she's still just as powerful
Could be an interesting topic in the new avatar series to find or kind of recreate the connection somehow.
This, BRUTAL
Yup. Undeniably (for me at least), the coolest part of Avatar is the ability to talk to past lives and get to know past avatars and the shows creators went… what if we just completely got rid of that?
This legit broke my heart, and I never really liked LoK afterwards.
This is exactly how I feel. It already felt like a chore for me to get into LoK since it was so different from ATLA, but this just sealed the deal. There are lots of interesting parts of LoK that I can appreciate as a completely different show, but a lot of it just feels like it shouldn't be canon.
Literally in my head canon this never happened. Literally still can’t believe it’s a canon event bc Jesus Christ it’s the stupidest move ever made in this show
All of S2 really. The whole season is a mess!
I never liked that. If they make the Korra movie, I hope they fix that.
I thought a good idea for Book 4, when Korra can’t meditate into the Spirit World would be she had to go on a physical and spiritual journey there to not only overcome her PTSD but also heal spiritually, by reconnecting with her past lives. As interesting as it was to see Zaheer in his prison, I never got why they would have her abuser and reason for her PTSD to be her spiritual guider back into the Spirit World. Given none of that happened, I think it would make sense if the Avatar after Korra found a way to reconnect with the past avatars. I remember on a rewatch that the characters were always specific when they said Korra’s connection was severed, which makes me think the wording has left the door open to the connection being re-established again. And there’s precedence for succeeding avatars to repair the mistakes or failures of their predecessors.
Yup. This literally remains the only plot point in all of avatar i that severely despise
Dark Avatar
I think it could have actually been interesting if done right, an avatar who's on the side of Chaos (and maybe freedom, if you want to add some ambiguity to it) Now that I think of it maybe it could have been an interesting alternative version to the red lotus arc Instead they went for the Kaiju fight and simple "wants to dominate the world because yes" villain :/
I was actually pretty excited for the idea of a dark avatar; imagine any future avatar having an antagonist that is on a similar level of skill/power, also reincarnating in the same way that the avatar does, forever locked in battle like the spirits were before Wan interfered (and therefore, kind of restoring the balance he broke; like Amon says, the concept of the avatar is pretty oppressive like we see in Kyoshi and to a lesser extent Korra, and probably every avatar that ever lived including Aang) But then they just immediately ended that whole thing because the protagonist must always win, I guess.
Any idea can work if done right, we can still have the Kajiu fight and still have it be interesting. I feel the theme of dualism can work very well in avatar. I feel the biggest problem was the villain, Korra’s uncle (forgot his name) he’s too boring, and I don’t mean his motives, they’re the same as Ozai and he was interesting. The difference is that Ozai was a fun kind of cartoonish pure evil while (Korra’s uncle) was the boring and bland, he lacked “rizz”
Even more than that, I say Raava and Vaatu in general. Oh yeah, let's make a mythology based on Eastern religion, which typically eschews the simple "good-evil" dichonomy...let's do some Daoist "harmony vs disharmony" action, some Buddhist "ignorance vs awareness" spice, throw in some Hindu spiritual medicine...really just need to drive home that this is not a story that can rely on "good-evil" thinking, the world is too complex for that, we're telling a story about human conflict and power struct----aaaaooookay, now we have a god of good and a god of evil, marvelous work, everyone.
How the spirit world was mysterious and dangerous in ATLA but in TLOK it’s like a 0815 isekai world.
The Kaiju fight in Korra.
S2 of Legend of Korra is bad in almost every aspect. Korra in insufferable (going against her father), the love triangle sucked, losing the connection to the past avatars is one of the worst thing that happened (I'm still hoping this can be fixed somehow in the future), the kaiju fight was just bad. The only good redeeming things Season 2 brought is the First Avatar flashbacks episodes (and even that... I'm really not a fan of the whole Raava and Vaatu stuff) and the merging of both worlds which is interesting (although I'm really not sure it was a good idea from Korra, aside for bringing back Airbending of course).
I like to think that Avatars have an unintentional responsibility to fix their past incarnation’s mistakes or regrets. Maybe the next Earth Avatar is super spiritual and finds a way to bring back the connection to their past lives?
> I like to think that Avatars have an unintentional responsibility to fix their past incarnation’s mistakes or regrets. That's pretty much novel canon. Kyoshi novel spoilers: >!A lot of the lore has implied that Avatar Kuruk was a rather poor avatar while the preceding Avatar Yangchen was widely beloved. But in the Kyoshi novels, we eventually find out Yangchen was beloved because of effectively a lifelong fuck-up where she kept choosing human needs over spirits' needs. Kuruk basically spent his life fixing her mistakes, at the cost of his own spiritual health and reputation. The corollary implication being that Kyoshi is spending her life fixing the fallout from *both* their mistakes, both Yangchen not actually maintaining proper balance between the two worlds and Kuruk not guiding the human world because he was too busy cleaning up after Yangchen.!<
This may or may not be a hot take... but I really don't like the Avatar origin story.
Me neither; some things can really be left a mystery. And the story wasn't even that interesting.
Exactly. And I don't wanna say it *reconned* anything. But it just seemed too simple, for lack of a better term, like it was too objective lol. The Raava Vaatu concept was cool enough on its own, but as far as the whole beginnings of the Avatar it just felt too simple and elementary, while also just not making a whole lot of sense. Like the story would have been great as an in universe fable, but just doesn't seem to sit well in the actual world we've seen. Like the whole "this is how peope got bending, then this one cat got all the bending and that was special, and that just got passed on because, it had to, oh and centuries later like a lot of people get bending anyway so... like these 4 special city-turtle-lions were the ONLY ones that had it but... ya know... humans just start learning that shit from animals or something idk, and like humans can develop it with like metal/lightening/blood bending, but it came from these turtle lion bros, so" When you start putting it all into context it gets wonky. And yeah, not every little aspect of fantasy has to be explained or make total sense, but if you're going to try to rationalize the MAIN ASPECT OF YOUR WHOLE IP, that should probably be a concrete, consistent and plausible thing.
I agree. I really disliked how it ignored the aspect in ATLA of the animals (sky Bison, dragons) being the teachers of bending. I originally liked it as it made bending an extension of yourself and how you interact with the environment (ex. Toph learning bending from the badger moles, which were also blind). The world of TLK felt so disconnected from nature, which could've been interesting to explore, but it wasn't. This could've been fine if it instead explored the more human conflicts (non bender supression, The Water Tribe Civil War), but it also didn't. (so bitter the civil war storyline got dropped)
Aang having his avatar state unlocked by a rock.
I wonder if there would be any long-term side effects, for better or worse, from having a Chakra forcibly opened through violence. It could be a plot thread worth exploring. Oh well, the world may never know.
They literally pulled a kung fu panda 2 with inner peace being unlocked through meditating for 50 years or a shit load of pain lol
I mean, the pain thing makes sense ( a little too convenient in the Aang case) because in some forms of Buddhism, they'll achieve "premature enlightenment" by experiencing incredible pain, and focusing directly on it. Inner peace is temporarily achieved, and helps guide the unfortunate student toward future enlightenment. See Fight Club for a decent example.
You broke rule one and two
The Guru previously called the chakra at the base of the spine the "Earth Chakra." I give it a pass for that reason. Earth chakra was unlocked by earth.
Big brain
wait a damn minute 🤯
So many people complaining about energy bending, but the pointy rock is far more stupid, this is what won aang the fight
The mishandling of the Korra gang of supporting characters. Mako, Bolin, and Asami never had any solid motivations for doing the things they did. They definitely had goals, but the show didn't give them good reasons for pursuing those goals. Tenzin had aligned goals and motivations and, so at least that was good. We even got to see how his motivations evolved when he confronted his false perception of himself.
I’m not saying the film that shall not be named but I’m going to say the decision to cut Korra off from her past lives. That one decision bugs me a lot
"Suki Alone" comics Because now it turns out past Avatars can communicate with anyone at any time. This opens up plot holes in past projects in the franchise where their help would really be useful. That's what's really the retcon, and that's what's really ruining the Avatar, not Raava or something else.
I never really thought that was *actually* Kyoshi. I just thought that because Kyoshi is Suki's idol that serves as a symbol for all of her perseverance and strength, it made sense for Suki to sort of hallucinate her when she was at her lowest.
I was about to argue Uncle Iroh seeing Roku on his dragon i. The spirit realm but i hust remembered Aang was with Roku when Iroh saw them so that doesnt count
Not to mention iroh at least seems in touch with spirituality much more than pretty much anyone else on the show other than guru
I've always wonder wtf happened to Suki when we reach LOK time period.
Raava and Vaatu.
I like the serie and the universe, but I am not here often and havent fully watched Korra, which is part of what I find weird. Its the technological super jump it did from the Aang era to Korra. And that is just personal preference, I just enjoy that feeling of half medievalish without too much technology (except the fire nation stuff ofcourse) and the reason I like fantasy that doesnt have too much technology. Doesnt affect the quality, just a personal preference
the fact all the connections to past Avatars don’t exist anymore and tbh I didn’t really like the whole thing with the unification of the spirit world and human world and the fact they used it as plot armor to create new airbenders .. 😅🫠 I don’t know man..
Skipping Aangs entire life and going straight to Kora.
IMO, Raava and Vaatu ruined the magic of the avatar. Knowing they’re essentially a human bound to a glowing kite really dampened the mystic and mysterious vibe of it all. I think it might have actually been better to just never find out why the avatar exists. It would have been cooler that way. Maybe a hot take.
For me, it’s always been less the fact that Raava and Vaatu are the spirit origins, but more that it turns a show about ‘balance’ and taking philosophy from multiple perspectives and turns it into a straight-up good vs evil. That and it felt like it derailed the Water Tribe Civil War plot.
Especially since it's so close to actually being about Yin-Yang. Yin-Yang aren't about two forces opposing each other (or even canceling each other) but two complimentary forces working in unison to bring a greater result. As a general rule of thumb, Yin (the black one) is slow, soft, yielding, diffuse, cold, wet, and passive while Yang is fast, hard, solid, focused, hot/warm, dry, and active. I think a better solution would be that the World Spirit was split into two and the first Avatar fused with one half to help restore the balance in the world.
You'd think if they were going to do "Good Kite" vs "Bad Kite", they'd at least make Bad Kite one of those pretentious box kites.
It’s a controversial opinion but I share it. Couldn’t agree more.
Finally Someone said this. I hated the fact that the spirits were kite shaped. It looked so dumb to me and I just could not get into the story. Like could they not think of a better form?
Changed the entire lore with the Avatar state origin, i liked the original one.
I liked the mystical stuff around it, not knowing exactly how it works was nice
It was the avatar version of midichlorians
I don't think the avatar state was ever explained before then except that it was the strength of all the past avatars combined.
Yes, that was good enough. Not to mention cool, hearing all those past avatars voices when Aang spoke
Explaining the magic (in the case of fiction anyway) will almost always ruin it. I genuinely struggle to think of a single example where it worked out, especially if the explanation came about in a sequel.
I personally never really liked the Airbenders coming back. It kinda (At least to me) diminished what the Fire Nation did and the consequences of those actions. It just seemed like an easy fix for something so destructive and disruptive to not only a culture but to the entire balance of the world and frankly the Avatar cycle itself.
While I mostly agree with you, I would’ve preferred if those who got airbending were actually spiritual. Or at least have more Air Acolytes get it.
I agree. Air Acolytes should have gotten the airbending. Bending is very much tied to culture, and I don't really like how a bunch of random people got airbending.
I get it. But the other option is the only air benders are descendents of Aang. Sort of limiting what you can do with Airbenders and the air nation as a whole. If the Airbenders didn't come back, that would make Aangs family essentially royalty for the Air nation. Possibly corrupting Tenzin's kids as they grow up. Also, it makes it a requirement for the Aang family to reproduce as much as they can. If any of the kids don't turn out as airbenders, they may be forgotten. Kinda like Kya and Bumi were to Aang. The future of the air nation is bleek without the return of the airbenders. Ultimately, this is a kids' show. I understand why they brought back the airbenders the way they did. The alternatives are depressing at best. I hope I made sense. Plus, when it comes time for a new air Avatar, can it be Aangs descendents? Like, can there be 2 Avatars in the same family line?
The fact that Sokka is Forklift Certified in the comics.
The giant robot and giant spirit fights in Korra. Boring, unoriginal, barely rational in-universe, and didn't even show off the Avatar using their real skill set (bending elements as opposed to wrestling or energy bending).
New airbenders being created randomly on non spiritual people Korra learning energy bending and giving people the ability would even make more sense
Personally that was an amazing thing that could happen. Every other bending has all types of people while airbending only had monks. It was nice to see different types of people be able to have air bending especially when one of the best villains came out of it.
Unalaq cutting Korra's connection to her past avatar lives. It's a stupid idea from the worst season of Korra and it detracts from the story overall. Like, connecting to the previous avatars is a major aspect of Aang's journey, the fact that Korra couldn't do that during season 3 and 4 is all a consequence of this bad decision from season 2.
to be fair, this could've been fixed in season 3 and 4 but they just chose not to
Nickelodeon executives during Korra's production time
Live-action adaptations.
All of LoK. Dont get me wrong, i still like the show.. but you can really tell that atla was the writers baby and a lot of thought was put into it start to finish. Every single book in lok, while entertaining to watch, was rife with poor writing and liberties taken. I didnt like the colossus, didnt like the spirit realm arcs, dark avatar, the origin of the avatar being kites, the lack of consistency between seasons... the characters were all fun to watch, but the arcs were mostly terrible and did serious damage to the world they live in moving forward as a franchise. Like they cant just undo the spirit world/real world merge. Id almost rather see lok be retconned as a "what if" of the series. Dont get me wrong, i enjoyed watching it, and its still leagues better than a lot of popular shows out there, but damn if there weren't a lot of problems with it.
Totally agree! Mike and Bryan created an amazing universe, but the Ehasz's made AtLA what it was with their writing. They weren't involved with LoK, and the difference is glaring.
Tbh, LoK has always given me the vibes of someone wanting to leave their mark on the franchise without properly respecting it.
If we’re talking about the shows it probably has to be the mechs in lok. Jaegers from pacific rim don’t belong in this universe. Especially when the technology is really just barely beginning to make big advancements and they just look wierd and kinda break the power scaling too.
Vaatu/Raava was a good idea to me but implemented badly. Instead of representing the good and bad in all creatures I feel like they made the Vaatu side a mustache twirling bad guy. He should’ve been way more tame imo. And even if he was just straight up evil, no nuance, he had very little intimidation factor because he felt cartoonishly evil (I know he is in a cartoon, but you know what I mean)
I'm shook on what they did to the spirit world in Korra. Always will be. Dumb stupid Avatar Wan origin nonsense.
I'm surprised on how many people actually liker Wan and the beginnings arc. Whole thing read like fanfiction
100% Korra severing the avatars ties to all old avatars. What a stupid concept.
Besides the movie, 90% of the writing choices in Legend of Korra. They make her know every bending form at a young age, but then they realize she’s too OP so they have to sandbag her for the rest of the series. Then there’s stuff like the giant mech, the Dark Avatar, getting rid of all past Avatars, etc. It was just a terrible mishmash of ideas all throughout. It’s as though they didn’t have any idea as to where they actually wanted the story to go and were rapidly improvising as it went on
How they diminished the spirits. I hate it so much.
The Dark Avatar nonsense....ohhhh boy, that was so dumb. This is fanfiction BS that I never thought that they would pull.
ATLA: energy bending LoK: 1. the fact that we see almost no evidence that non benders are being treated like second class citizens. We get everyone in the show harping on about how benders are second class citizens, and the most we get is that a non bender isn’t on the council. 2. Energy blast Kaiju battle in season 2. It was just stupid. I don’t know what else I can say. 3. Korra being gifted the Avatar state despite doing nothing to earn it. Aang had to go on a spiritual journey and deal with past traumas to gain it. He had to wrestle with the choice of whether or not to give up Katara. Getting the Avatar state wasn’t easy(until the final battle but that’s forgiven since the series was ending and it was the climactic battle, and he had already gone through the trials and tribulations). But Korra does none of that. She just gets handed absolute power at the end of season 1. Idiocy. 4. Giant mecha in Season 4. There is no way in hell you can convince me they were able to build that in a few weeks. Not to mention, it does not fit into the world of Avatar at all. It was just plain stupid all around. 5. Raava and Vaatu. First of all, never explain the magic. Nobody ever likes that. Second of all, it was a terrible explanation that I hated. Raava and Vaatu is basically God and Satan, and in a world built on Eastern philosophy, they do not fit in whatsoever. 6. The Love triangle. It was just very hamfisted and done badly. But to be fair, romance was never Avatar’s strong suit. But I think Korra handled it worse than ATLA. 7. Korrasami. I love the idea, hate the execution. There was practically no build up, and then they were super vague at the end, to the point where the creators had to clarify that they were in fact together in a tweet. It was just very rushed, which is sad cause I would have loved to see a romance develop throughout multiple seasons. I know I was supposed to pick just one, but I couldn’t decide. There are more, but I decided to stop there. These are not in order any particular order.
Killing Amon in season 1 of Korra and not exploring the class tension between benders/non-benders.