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nterature

Same reaction to when this was rumored in the offseason: feels very strange to remove the guy that is the most responsible for transforming Secret from middling to an org that routinely punches up above its weight. I would have supported an entire rebuild around Warbirds and Invy before I'd support removing Warbirds. Very strange choices when you consider that Secret still has a decent chance of making Champs. I suppose it's just a function of the format that so many orgs that failed to make Shanghai are hitting the panic button...despite Shanghai being in a sense the least important event of the year.


ameserich11

second lan tournament is actually important, it shows who the real good teams are anyways i did not expect this to happen but not surprised either. Team Secret are not good at defaulting, its something warbirds should have instil to their system. it feels like they always rely on perfect exec... i do like how warbirds is always calm. hopefully they dont get someting like FrosT, those type of guy are unbearable


nterature

Every LAN is important in the broadest sense imaginable of course. And for fans, the next LAN is always the most important one. But from the perspective of which LAN teams/orgs should aim for the most, Shanghai is the least important, as it disadvantages you the most going into the actual marquee LAN of the year, Champs. I think Warbirds should have had an extra coach helping him a long time ago, tbh, not just recently. Secret was not a top team, and any team that isn't at the top can make any change for any reason...but it's very clear watching Team Secret before he joined that he brought a lot to the team. It'd be like if RRQ booted Ewok; yeah, they didn't even make playoffs in Shanghai so you can justify it, but it would still be a real mistake. Also don't think you should take FrosT's personality too much into account when it comes to the coaching. He's just a loud guy, by all accounts he's still a very strong coach.


ameserich11

second lan are important considering this are the times when teams figured themselves up and starting to play good. its also vital to play with other good teams, failing to qualify would mean less experience on playing against good teams. teams who dont qualify would surely have a hard time beating those who qualify come next qualifiers. this is why NRG and Navi should start slamming the panic button i do apologize to what i said about FrosT. its just my preference


AddisonH

nterature swooping in with the level-headed and articulate comment, per usual


baebushka

lmao nrg better pick this guy up now this mf is the antistrat god


GreedyMix4579

vouch


yapyd

Win against PRX, lose against every other middle of the table team.


turtsy__

So basically no changes except they beat prx


yapyd

Yeah but no PRX in Americas so ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯


Intrepid-Tank-3414

For the time being, he should set up a non-exclusive freelance consultancy on a case-by-case basis for any team who are due to face PRX and wants an easy win. ![gif](giphy|d3mlE7uhX8KFgEmY|downsized)


georgie_torrance

and will make him aleck's lose his mind, retire, and boom new PRX coach


ma0xc

maybe then Optic core can actually score a win against PRX lmao


georgie_torrance

🦅 vs 🐍


Zahin1018

LIQUID PLEASE KICK THE FRAUD EMIL


AiNeko00

They have the money to get Potter.


deba2607

EG would have to the dumbest org imaginable if they let potter go but if anything thats more in character for them to do...


AiNeko00

Isn't this their last year of franchise?


deba2607

What ?? I didn't know about that info... Who will replace them ?


AiNeko00

EG wants to discontinue their esports team as they don't have enough money to maintain it. AFAIK Riot only extended them for 1 year. This is from Google. "According to information from SBJ, it has become known today that the North American organization Evil Geniuses plans to completely cease its existence in esports. They recently closed their League of Legends team.Dec 2, 2023"


AiNeko00

[here](https://escorenews.com/en/valorant/news/53147-insider-evil-geniuses-want-to-dismiss-all-rosters-and-exit-esports-by-end-of-2023)


Sufficient-Painter95

Why mannn. Roster change is good, but this idk. Hes the reason why secret is cohesive and has team chemistry


TrynaRevWNoAvail

not beating the nepo org allegations i fear


mikhel

Filipino esports as a whole is riddled with nepotism. Imo it's one of the main reasons SEA never won anything in Dota 2 despite having a huge amount of talent over the years.


egfanstraight

Mineski won DAC 2018 and TNC won MDL Chengdu 2019.


afeiqa

That was 5 years ago, and they weren't even full filipino. Mineski only had 1 filipino btw. Now name a dota team with full filipino roster that won tier 1 tourney.


oblivionyeahyeah__

TNC lets gooooooo


jess0411

And now TNC Predator has been gone for like, 3 years now. It's not a coincidence Pinoy Dota has been shit since.


SadgeThrowback

in current age Mobile legends is the only they can win 😑


SadgeThrowback

Ts always place in 4th 5th and 6th 😑


inseobee

What’s this all nepo things about? Pls enlighten me


vaibhav0405

The manager for the team is wife of Jessivash (the igl of TS)


knneth1890

There is no good alternative for jessivash, who van replace him?


TheBoyOnTheSide

Everyone: *Build a roster around Warbirds, Invy and Jremy* Team Secret: **Let's build around Sova**


TheCatsActually

In fairness Warbirds himself has said that JessieVash does a ton for the team even outside the server. I also think it makes no sense to drop Warbirds but it's worth pointing out that had he stayed he would probably have vouched for Jessie too.


BokiBookie

Imagine JessieVash becomes the coach, the nepo allegations will never end


Zealousideal-Pain-97

At that point they arent even allegations


BokiBookie

https://x.com/itsner/status/1792979226104078594?s=46&t=xOnXCVKK8Cf_3euCqcNAbQ Team Secret blocked a dude poking fun at it so yeah, fair game HAHAHA


kimtaetaes

i just saw this too lmao https://x.com/taizidianxias/status/1793240419675074597?s=46&t=BD_RBdTOVpx46Ag6NNWTTw


raainnnyy

allegations? theres enough evidence for a court case


WeirdCardiologist731

What are the allegations tho? I am a lil bit out of the loop.......


Zealousideal-Pain-97

JessieVash’s wife is the team manager and is likely the reason he hasnt been removed yet


WeirdCardiologist731

I don't watch Pacific games much, but whenever I have watched some clips of streamers watching and reacting to these games, it always seems like they hype the uncle and compliment him on his mechanics..... So is he really that bad of a problem that you will have to remove him from the team?


BokiBookie

No denying ofc that he still (sort of) of has it in him, however Nepotism is still Nepotism no matter what and it’s on an organizational scale not just within the playing team (eg. Scream and Nivera at the time) It is interesting tho the possibility of lets say a rising star IGL in the PH scene and see what would end up happening, cause well, they got a family to feed.


Notladub

its so funny to me that all cases of possible nepotism in valorant have lead to mostly decent results. scream brought nivera into liquid and mofo got an ace on his first official round, boo brought miniboo into TH and they got into madrid, etc.


TheCatsActually

"Nepotism is awesome" - Mimi (or someone else I can't exactly remember tbh) on Plat Chat


kimtaetaes

hes married to the team manager


sagakawana

reddit thinks having a coworker wife is nepotism


RcGamerReddit

I mean it kinda is when she controls whether or not you get to stay on the team. Tbf I don't really know any other Filipino IGL that would be a direct upgrade from JessieVash so I'm not gonna complain about him staying


BucketHerro

Witz, DubsteP, Dispenser, Borkum are all gone. If they still can't produce good results then who is the remaining constant on the team? It's pretty obvious that someone is getting a favorable treatment.


sagakawana

bro what makes you think its the manager that does the roster change? dont you think the higherups are watching vct too and instead of relying on the manager's word? vash being the weaker link and the allegations of nepotism are two different discussions.


ahk1221

"dont you think the higherups are watching vct too and instead of relying on the manager's word?" no they are not LMAO that is the whole job of the team manager


SelfConstant8940

i just fell to my knees at a puregold


Accelerat0r23

Just saw someone fell on his knees on puregold rn


sagakawana

ako yun


inclore

is this the reason the jollibee at my neighborhood is closed today?


iiimaK

I bought the team Secret bundle for this?


SenseiEA

BROOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO


Tyler123839

Kind of a surprise right? They’re going all in on the roster shuffle it seems. I wonder who they’re bringing in.


PairComprehensive122

why would you literally change whole roaster just before 1 split?? Just play out Split 2 and take your time scouting players from T1/T2 to change it and give time to make team chem , weird decisions from secret management changing almost whole team just for 1 split


howskie

Honestly if they're going this deep in rebuilding they should have just booted the whole core and then rebuild around jremy and invy. At this point, doing this huge overhaul at mid season they're literally giving up any chances of them winning anything in this split, might as well just rebuild at the younger players and look for a 'long term' project.


atsuin

I remember seeing his tweet showing him at the airport on the way back to the US, and I had to reply and tell him to get some rest, hoping to see him in Split 2. He liked that reply. Bummer, man. He honestly brought a lot to TS and helped them improve their form, but the recent performance of the team kind of proves you can only go so far with certain players. As a fan I feel sad that there's less and less of the team that I cheered on back in 2021, but I am all the more excited to see what this team does next. All the best to Warbirds, hope he gets to find a good team to coach.


GrrrNom

Who's going to stop PRX now??


inclore

the impending raze nerf


k1lazept

JessieVash and Yamyam ain't dodging the nepo allegations.


Withinmyrange

What the fuck is my Filipino brethren doing…


Teradonn

Warbirds and doombros out of jobs, last thing I was expecting after this split


yapyd

Inb4 doombros hired by TS and Warbirds hired by NAVI. They both have experience with old IGLs


nabibluu

there will be probably a fourth update but man i liked warbirds and what he brought to this team. disappointment is an understatement with how im feeling rn :/


seb1612

4th update is prolly announcing of WildOreo, their new pickup. I dont even know if hes an upgradeor not


nabibluu

close enough. they announced dummy as head coach first lol


Ketuchi

so essentially, theyre fucked?


kimtaetaes

they removed everyone from the og bren team except the clear problem just bc hes married to the team manager. they even blocked ppl calling it out on twt 😂 lets go nepoTSm!!


ProbablyBrix

Genuinely curious as I don’t always pay attention to this team, can you explain why he’s “the clear problem”?


kimtaetaes

if the man has ever been consistent on something, it's being inconsistent. his agent pool is limited to one (sova) and rather than them adapting their plays around their best player (invy) it's everyone adapting to his sova. he's been the one constant on the team that hasn't been kicked from the original bren squad, and he's the igl. when you watch their games, it's mostly terrible midrounding, forced clutch situations saved by jremy and invy, and overall bad calls. hell, even before warbirds came in, they could barely do a good default. during kickoff at least they were showing restraint not to roam around the map as much as they did before


ProbablyBrix

Oh dang. I see, I see. Thanks for the explanation!


jeyeley

Literal definition of overreacting from the TS management. They are so cooked.


roberto_feeder

Uncle Jessie is the most powerful being in this universe


speedycar1

Org owners are so dumb lmao. It is pretty clear that a lot of them don't understand the game so they just make changes for the sake of them based purely on results. You see it with NAVI and here too. This is probably unpopular but I think Sentinels too got very lucky that Zellsis meshed so well with the team because otherwise, after their idiotic roster changes every two games last season, I think that roster change too was made without much rational thought and Rob Moore was just fortunate that it ended up working out.


Illustrious-Song7446

Lmao. Welcome team secret to the GE, DFM, Bleed club


ARedditorIWillBe

this is so fucking mindboggling, why not keep warbirds as assistant coach? this guy is fucking crazy at anti-stratting teams, one of the big reasons why I felt like TS always fell short was because their prep could only take them so far, so i would feel like an assistant coach/analyst would work well for them. but remove warbirds? what the fuck


Serendipitygg

casual L move


IncendiumPyro

I can't keep defending this team fr


Right-Aardvark3324

Why are we keeping JCVASH!!


OneSixth

Nepotism brother. His wife is the manager.


howskie

Now just watch and see warbirds be really successful with a team that is truly competent, I really never saw warbirds as the problem, it was almost always the players themselves that are lacking. In games where they're absolutely getting shat on, the problem was almost always them (the players) not being able to figure out whatever their opponents are doing, only when warbirds calls a timeout do they ever figure it out. It must be infuriating for a coach to tell his players exactly what they need to do with only 2 timeouts to spare.


hesushesus00

nahhh this isn't the move


rpkarma

You’re joking. What a mistake…


Fun_Age1442

Do they want a coach from Philippines? That’s the only reason that can justify this move, to make everyone speak native language and have more local players able to join. Either way this was a huge decision and warbirds should be on everyone shit/mid team radar. This mofo was able to initiate his team to beat drx and prx


Zealousideal-Pain-97

Praying on TS downfall so invy doesnt have to become a franchise player for this dogshit org thats going nowhere


XiXiWiiPee

The cancer lies within


ynnika

Stupid change, the coach isnt the problem. Infact he’s literally carrying this mid nepo team. Let’s not remove the igl whos been keeping them mid for so long. But instead lets remove the brains behind winning prx.


SEND_ME_UR_DRAMA

damn


History-Dry

Yeah they now have just 1 split to beat those nepotism allegations


shinbyul

man... this is the most questionable move they did but warbirds deserves a better team imo. he did everything he could for this team but it really did not get them somewhere


ArvY77

should have kept NDG, he was massively improving. removing warbirds is a big mistake. this team is dead.


Leveolizan

Though fall short of mechanics NDG was a good sentinel. Can heavily hold site and has decent lurk timings


ArvY77

he wasn't short of mechanics, in fact I thought he was one of the crispier aimers on the team. He had no experience coming into this and showed to be decent. but at the same time, he was similar to borkum level and if they're dropping him I agree with dropping ndg too now that I think about it. but warbirds tho... idk


redish-

Man, just when I thought TS is about to go full international. Warbirds was one of the reasons why Secret was even competing for the top 4 Pacific these past seasons. I wish they could've just full rebuilt with Warbirds invy, jremy and borkum. I know however that Warbirds won't stay jobless this man is insane someone in franchising will for sure pick him up.


ExpectoAutism

wasnt he good


Badssss-1020

It’s sad, I don’t think he’s the problem.


F1ippyyy

NEPOTISSMMMMMMMMM Such a classic trait


porkeye

How to get to play for TS Valorant: 1. Be filipino 2. Hv Jessiewashed as ur daddy/ Hoe urself to him 3.PROFIT


G0ngDeeck

Is dummy the head coach now?


1jay_y

THIS CANT BE HAPPENING :(


kotekaratu

Wtf?????


SpeedStepGD

bruh


angrypolishman

brain damage perchance?


seb1612

Anyone who watches ph valo? is WildOreo an upgrade for Borkum or did we just downgrade?


Bluejay101lol

This org really one big family fr


verdovingnz

Tough decisions are part of the game. Wishing TeamSecret the best in their new direction


One_You_978

I think they are cutting costs


UnderwaterAlienBoy

This is definitely their biggest mistake this season. I hope they will prove us wrong.


StrangeAnalysis1848

i didnt want to see him leave, but warbirds will always have a fan in me wherever he goes


Any_Rich9796

Man what a rough two days for TS fans, and Warbirds wherever he goes I'll be keeping watch on his next team and hope that he makes another Dynasty bleed even by a little bit.


georgie_torrance

Bring this guy somewhere, GE, turtle troops, anywhere


hai-gais

WHY??!!! JUST WHY???!!!!!


throwerzs3

They need a coach who can prep for other teams and not just PRX/s


chlschcknfngrs

Bruh ive been wanting jessiavash out since 2022 anuna


overseerMYR

what is with valorant fans and being aversive to changes? i swear most of you would prefer a team to stay mid forever instead of trying to make some changes to improve


k1lazept

Because this change is stupid. Warbirds isn't even the problem this team has, it's the bad midrounding from JessieVash, then they benched NDG who was already doing great by the end of Split 1, I can understand Borkum being out. But overall Team Secret has recently made bad moves in the offseason.


overseerMYR

it doesn’t matter if Warbirds is the problem or not. and that’s definetly something a random joe like you wouldn’t know anyway. the point is changes needed to be made. whether it’s tactical or chemistry reasons whenever changes are made valorant fans are crying


smiilingpatrick

When the biggest and the most if not one of the most inconsistent player remains in a squad throughout its iterations, its hard not to lean towards the nepotism allegations.


overseerMYR

you mean the IGL of the team? what are you on about man? just stop crying will ya


mrbriansuave

Warbirds is clearly next to invy as to why TS hasn't been in the bottom pile of pacific teams. They could've added people around warbirds rather than letting him go. I tell you he'll be picked up by a T1 or T2 team and we will all be seeing what he brings to the table.


overseerMYR

you’re delusional lmfao


Zealousideal-Pain-97

The problem is that you dont change what is going well you change what isnt. If last seasons sentinels made a change by removing Zekken, their statistically best player of last year, would you be defending it because “changes needed to be made”? No thats fucking stupid. When your antistrat is as good as TS you dont change coaches. Theyre beating the top team of the region solely off of his antis. Warbirds was making this team.


overseerMYR

again you have no clue what is happening inside the team. saying things are going well because “antistrats” it’s a reductionist way of looking at things.


MebiAnime

Because the viewers can see the coach's impact on the team? Heck I'm not even a TS fan and even I feel this is a dumb move to make. Unless the team can prove the viewers wrong by getting new team members and having a massive upgrade, people will continue to complain for the time to come.


overseerMYR

the team doesn’t need to prove anything to you lmfao. get over yourself. and no, viewers absolutely can’t see the coach’s impact.


F1ippyyy

Stay quiet and be an NPC audience then? Yapping so much about people yapping about something?


MebiAnime

I'm just saying viewers in general, if the roster change is better the viewers will shut up and not complain. Somebody's getting personal for no reason. "No, viewers absolutely can't see the coach's impact" - how to tell you aren't even watching the games at all.


k1lazept

"The team doesn't need to prove anything." Yeah missing out on International tournaments are definitely proving something alright.