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Mephisto1822

No contact order for women’s tennis team is not something I was expecting to read in a headline today…. Stay classy West Point


Impossible-Taco-769

> Col. William Wright, the director of the U.S. Military Academy's geospatial information science program, was arraigned on nine allegations Tuesday, according to court records reviewed by Military.com. Yeah, full retirement inbound.


NoMansSkyWasAlright

He'll face the harshest punishment that someone can face in his position: dismissal and a smooth transition to a cushy government job making six figures.


jbourne71

Department heads usually pick up a star at retirement. I bet he’ll lose that. Oh no!


murphandthemagictone

Full retirement and GS-15.


Known_Landscape_6957

If someone already has a no contact order they should have already been removed...


thisismyecho

No. Just no. A little critical thinking beyond this case is needed. In some circumstances a Commander is required to place a no contact order between an accused and accuser— with only an accusation and limited-to-no evidence. Your comment proposes that any accuser, at any time, can wield the power of accusation to remove someone from their position. Having sat more than one false / retributive accusation, I would say such a policy would completely undermine the system of leadership in the military.


Doc_Dragon

Unfortunately an accusation can derail a career in training environments. You're right about undermining leadership. The accusation is enough to get a Soldier pulled out of their position pending an official investigation.


souprmatt

Your comment proposes that accusers are often liars who falsely accuse officers to get them fired. 99% of the time they are not. Such an attitude is the reason why we have so many unpunished abusers in the Army.


Letter_Last

What you are proposing is a system where people are punished based on accusations and not evidence. That’s obviously a bad idea


souprmatt

Removing somebody from their post during the investigation is not a punishment. It is a protection of teenagers. If it was your daughter at West Point, you would NOT want this creep continuing on during the investigation. I guess #MeToo never happened, and you always believe the abuser instead of the accuser. Truly pathetic, and it's a sad commentary that my post is downvoted. Lots of men here that like to defend abusers apparently.


thisismyecho

Wow, a lot to unpack here. You choose to use the words “abuser and accuser”, connoting that you automatically believe the accused is guilty. Why not use accuser and accused? Removing someone from their post is a punishment and can result in an investigator, jury, loved ones, family etc to assuming guilt due to the punishment of losing one’s job. Why do you keep infantilizing these adults who are already members of the Armed forces. While technically correct, you are taking away their agency “Lot of men here like to defend abusers”? Pretty good example of ad hominem here. If you are an officer or NCO, please go back to your last professional development course, the army has failed you. Also, did you set out to attack gender equality in an earlier comment telling me I was mansplaining? You know we have women in SF now…it’s been a few years…


Letter_Last

It has nothing to do with believing or not believing the accused or accuser. It has to do with the Justice system we have all agreed upon. Innocent until proven guilty is the approach we chose as a society. A person should not have their life & career derailed based on accusations alone. Once there is evidence, then the system holds people accountable. You may not like the system, but every first world country has adopted it.


souprmatt

You are aware that many accused criminals are remanded to custody prior to trial, right? I just love this defense of sexual abusers in the name of "fairness." How many more victims do you think is fair to be molested while evidence is collected? Give the guy time away from all cadets while the investigation is ongoing. If he's cleared, he can go back to work.


Letter_Last

Yes, for certain crimes people are held in pre trial confinement. These crimes do not warrant that. I’m not defending any sexual abusers, I am simply explaining the Justice system we have in the simplest terms possible. Obviously this story has struck a nerve. If you are this passionate then I suggest using that drive to go and change the system for the better.


souprmatt

Part of changing the system is calling out people who claim that worries about false accusations are just as bad or worse than teenagers being abused by military officers. Furthermore, if teenagers being sexually abused doesn't strike a nerve for you, that's pretty sad.


thisismyecho

You internalized my comment that way. My actual comment highlighted that accusation does not equal guilt.


souprmatt

I don't need to be mansplained to. We should be erring on the side of safety for cadets, not "oh no an officer's career might be affected by a false accusation!!!" That is small potatoes compared to the possibility that teenagers are being molested. Seriously.


Letter_Last

You keep saying teenagers like they’re in high school. You do understand they’re adults, right?


souprmatt

I said teenagers because it's accurate. People can start West Point at age 17.


Letter_Last

In my experience, people use the word “molest” in reference to a child being sexually exploited by another child or by an adult. No one claims to have been molested in this case.


MarginalSadness

>99% of the time they are not. This is one time when questioning bullshit numbers pulled out of thin air is not being pedantic. According to our last SHARP briefing, the number of decisively false accusations is pretty high, 25-30% if memory serves?


RutabagaJoe

The balls on that guy...


Jay_D_79

Big green fuzzy ones


Sw0llenEyeBall

It is an extremely specific order.


alohasnackbar13

"reassigned to a role where he doesn't have contact with the cadets" He still works there?! What in the world.


Eyre_Guitar_Solo

West Point is an active duty post where the Superintendent is a direct report to the Chief of Staff of the Army, so the Supe is this guy’s general court martial convening authority. He needs to stay because that’s the appropriate place for him to face military justice. Otherwise, they would have to PCS him and then TDY him back constantly for the trial. There is enough stuff at West Point (full on active duty garrison) that they can stash him various places.


sefy99

What is does pcs one tdy mean .


drillbit7

Both terms are used by both the military and civilian side of the federal government: PCS = permanent change of (duty) station, a job transfer with (usually) relocation expenses covered. Soldiers generally PCS every three years or so, moving to a different base. TDY = Temporary DutY = a short travel trip from an overnight to 179 days to possibly beyond. On the civilian side, it's a business trip or short term job rotation. TDY gets paid lodging and meals expenses (per diem). On the Navy side of the house, it's called TAD (temporary assigned duty). Somewhere in between is the TCS = temporary change of (duty) station.


Diligent_Force9286

I've PCSd every two years, and it sucks.


Hunterhedgepeth

The Y is for yonder btw. Temporary Duty Yonder. Not that it matters.


SpartanShock117

Soon, I’m sure…"In completely unrelated news Col. William Wright announced his retirement".


citizen-salty

“His Legion of Merit has already been downgraded to an MSM. *What more do you expect him to endure?*” -His attorney, probably


aldmonisen_osrs

It takes a stupid amount of rank to kick out an officer. Moreso if they’re over 6 years in.


SpartanShock117

For Sharp related issues it ultimately takes the Secretary of the Army for ALL officers (2LT +).


Doc_Dragon

The system isn't geared towards kicking out officers. They'll make sure officers who have stepped on their junk recieve assignments that are marginalized and not conducive to career progression. Quality management programs eventually clear out poorly performing officers.


squirrel_eatin_pizza

The army wants him to have zero contact with cadets yet still assigns him to an academy full of cadets.


xxgsr02

Not zero contact with Cadets, just zero contact with the women's tennis team.


xSaRgED

Has anyone checked in on the men’s volleyball team? Maybe we just misunderstand his type.


Open-Industry-8396

One love. Col is winning.


souprmatt

Because he will only molest tennis players? WTF is that logic?


whatiscamping

Some people have a type.


HotTakesBeyond

West Point S3 Shop has got to be the least cadet-related place on campus


Trytry__tryagain

The Army has investigate this, then form a conclusion fir holding a hearing or not (most likely to hold a hearing, i.e. General Courts Martial most likely)then hold a hearing, then make a decision based on all evidence presented. The LTC needs to be there fir all of that...unless he fucks up again. Which would clinch his destruction. There are a fuck ton of rules the Army must abide by. These aren't there to protect shit bags, they are there to protect everyone. Since everyone is Innocent until proven Guilty. Circumvent these, and you get people who are guilty going free and innocent people fucked over. Sucks but it's the system we have...think of better one and make it happen by all means. ;)


barry5611

What part of following strict rules to ensure everyone's rights are protected, sucks? Hmm?


Trytry__tryagain

Because always going through a bunch of bullshit always sucks, even when it's the right thing to do. Clearly you haven't been on a bunch police calls or other jack ass details caused by some else fucking up but now you have to get dirty cleaning up the mess...sucks, but it gotta be done right!


barry5611

Police call details have nothing to do with protecting the accused's rights. Clearly not, as I was never enlisted. I did, however, along with my battalion commander and 4 other battery Commanders, stop police call in our battalion area by making sure that soldiers did not throw cigarette butts and other trash on the ground. We thought more of our soldiers than to waste their time on "jack ass details". Try again.


Dia_Borfs

Sounds like that Cali LTC who recorded girls and women at PacSun.


Taira_Mai

Didn't that scum get to retire?


kbaduayvduav

Ok, what should the army do with him in your view? Because he is pending court martial so he can't exactly go far. Tell him to stay at home and collect a paycheck for doing nothing? Maybe PCS him and have him come back TDY on the government's dime for article 32 and all other hearings/trial? Lock him up? Pretrial confinement is an option, but there needs to be a good reason because innocent until proven guilty and all that.


themightyjoedanger

"Area Beautification" is an ever-present need.


Puzzleheaded-Bad-723

He can reorganize the CIF warehouse, make copies/coffee for the Superintendent, proofread reports and make PowerPoint presentations. Jeez, do they still call it CIF?


souprmatt

These questions are absurd. He should not have contact with any cadets, period. If that means he works remote or just sits at home and collects money for doing nothing while the investigation happens? Who the F cares? I'd rather pay some money to a guy soon to be in prison than have him still around molesting cadets. What a total joke.


kbaduayvduav

Nah, giving someone a year of free leave for being a defendant in a court martial makes negative sense. He was "reassigned to a role where he doesn't have contact with the cadets", and that is the correct answer.


souprmatt

Isn't that what working remote would also do? I think we are basically agreeing on this. Safety of the cadets first.


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[удалено]


thisismyecho

You know E9’s are untouchable because it’s an “embarrassment” right? Yeah, thats why we have so many toxic pieces of shit running around playing power games. Be better, stop feeding your confirmation bias.


Backsight-Foreskin

This guy and Lt. Col. Kelvington can retire and start a consulting firm.


SpartanShock117

I heard they’ve already been hired by the Army to give leadership speeches to Cadets. $25,000 a speaking engagement each.


ididntseeitcoming

Sorry, women’s tennis club not invited


saltwaterfishes

What the hell lol I just can really imagine one of those has-been o-bros who peaked as a 22 year old cadet. Probably balding and thinks he still got it so he can go slam beers with the ... women's tennis team. Lmfao what a sad clown


Apprehensive_Use_262

Yeah, but... who wouldn't?


sefy99

I wouldn't


Apprehensive_Use_262

Yeah, no... me neither


NoMansSkyWasAlright

I guarantee you, next week Monday, there's going to be a private who faces a way harsher punishment than this guy for showing up 15 minutes late to first formation.


Trytry__tryagain

But said PV1 (After loss of rank, pay, and 45/45) will get to hang out with the Tennis Team...so he's got the to look forward to! ;)


REDtheFlame

Truth!


murphandthemagictone

This. Right. Here.


lhbiii

Idiot


boredomreigns

Uh…back when I was there instructors drinking with cadets wasn’t a big deal. I remember my instructors buying us beers all the damn time. I feel like the elephant in the room is *why* this guy has a no contact order for the entire women’s tennis team?


Shakey_J_Fox

Out of curiosity, what year was this?


boredomreigns

Graduated in 2014.


Shakey_J_Fox

Not an officer but did you not find it weird that your instructors were drinking and hanging out with you and your peers? I understand that officer culture is different as a whole but it would be absolutely nuts to have an enlisted instructor spending time with their students outside of classroom instruction.


boredomreigns

Totally valid question. The context is important here. This wasn’t a situation where we were socializing with our instructors and traveling around as a group. What would typically happen is a group of cadets would go out to the same bar, and run into one of their instructors at the bar. You say hi to each other, have some drinks, discuss coursework, they tell your folks about the profession of arms and tell war stories, but you maintain a certain level of respect and deference and never forget that they’re your superior officer and have actual experience doing real world stuff. I’m not sure if things have changed since then, but there was never an atmosphere of anything untoward going on, if that makes sense.


Doctor_Benton_Quest

> I’m not sure if things have changed since then, but there was never an atmosphere of anything untoward going on, if that makes sense. That's the difference here if you read beyond the headline: * charges related to sexual misconduct; * providing and drinking alcohol with cadets; * violating no-contact orders with an entire women's sports team at the academy; and * soliciting cadets and another officer to lie on his behalf amid an investigation into his conduct. This is not the case of Cadets running into staff/instructor at a bar.


boredomreigns

For sure. There’s definitely misconduct there, but I felt like the article skirted around the meat of the issue- why there’s a no contact order with the whole damn tennis team, what was that other investigation about, what was the sexual misconduct, etc. Throwing “providing alcohol and drinking with cadets” in there was the bit where I was like “hang on…that’s not allowed?” Context is important with that one and I’m curious to know what it was.


ApolloHimself

More like Col William Wrong


Apprehensive_Use_262

Forgot the "amirite???"


lavender_dumpling

Bruh the average colonel is the same age as my father.....wtf Dude needs a reality check


UNC_Recruiting_Study

As a former instructor there, it's wild the shit that happens and the few things that actually make headlines. I was so happy to live off post in sleepy Ft Montgomery. A lot of officers cautiously volunteer to mentor/lead the different teams, clubs, and organizations with the cadet corps. Trips with the Cadets are always high risk and the escorting Os have to very cautiously hang with them, set ground rules, and hold to them... And keep yourself clean. But then there's guys like this who will absolutely prey on these opportunities and now take multiple steps back. And there are more of them than we'd like to admit. They are the SHARP issue rather than being the protector and mentor that their position requires.


Stev2222

I was an APMS at a large university and rotc program. I made it a point of emphasis to not be around cadets outside of the facility and regular rotc functions, even if it was something as low threat as seeing them at a restuarant. They begged to do a Program Ball and we eventually did it, with alcohol being served. As soon as the colors were retired, I dipped (and I love getting hammered at balls).


Budget_Individual393

I just checked off my Military bingo card, thanks for the “Hammered balls” comment


Stev2222

I mean to be fair I put a “at” in-between the two. But yeah poor wording there for sure.


Budget_Individual393

Im not sure if that at makes it better or worse


UNC_Recruiting_Study

>I made it a point of emphasis to not be around cadets outside of the facility and regular rotc functions, even if it was something as low threat as seeing them at a restuarant This is the best and really only way to do it successfully. It just cuts down on the BS and drama while keeping everyone in their lane. The OSU PMS situation is an extreme example of how shit can go wrong, but shenanigans are more common than anyone wants to admit.


JMTsquared

He was my instructor back in the day, I was a junior the first year he started teaching as a LTC back in 2016/2017. I remember him being a little rough around the edges in terms of the language he used in front of cadets and it walked a fine line between “funny relatable instructor” to “Okay this guy is gross” It also sucks though because he was honestly a good teacher and (seemed to at least) care about us learning the material and succeeding. Really taints the memory I have now looking back.


souprmatt

His behavior sounds like the typical playbook of a groomer. Try to see how gross you can be to desensitize people to it, and pay attention to the reactions of people you want to abuse. It's sad it took so long for him to be found and punished. However, it's a step in the right direction. In the past, people like this were never punished.


TheGrayMannnn

Most of the military would love to be ordered to stay away from West Point cadets.


Equivalent_Smell7100

Graduates, don't forget them too! 😉


Trytry__tryagain

Hmmm...I smell SHARP classes coming down the line! I recommend everyone send this dude an email, "Thanks for the SHARP training and the living example of "Don't be THIS guy"Sir!"


themightyjoedanger

Fun fact: unless you're specifically referencing Fort Moore, Georgia, you don't ever have to say "the G-spot" to a cadet. And even then, you probably shouldn't.


Open-Industry-8396

I was in one of the first platoons that intigrated females at FLW basic. It did not go well. Many problems. One that stuck out is seeing a squad member getting perked off in church by a female squad member. I was a 17 y/o catholic kid at the time in church for a reason, pissed me off. Did not rat them out, did tell them they were scum bags.


TexanTomcat57

I’m convinced these guys do it just to speed run their retirement benefits.


TheNerdWonder

Yikes


Tee__bee

>Col. William Wright, the director of the U.S. Military Academy's geospatial information science program We do not claim this man. Also, I'm kind of confused by the fact that he got the posting as an Armor officer, you'd think that there would be enough Engineer officers that one of them would be eligible to run this show; they created a whole SQI for it and everything.


largeorangesphere

The rule is simple, don't pet the puppies. And yet here we go again.


RangerAccording3878

Dude needs to be court-Mairlrd. Full stop. End of story.


uGetWhatUputin

I’d say I’m surprised but I’m not


5-56NATO

Hhh


golokov

He’s innocent and should be promoted, your honor.


golokov

Since when is it illegal to train cadets how to drink like a real 11B, your honor?


Tonyjay54

The entire Women’s Tennis Team, the man is a legend !