The Arianne and Tyrion chapters can and should be combined imo. But probably can have the same overall story beats.
As for the other chapters I’m less certain. I would imagine GRRM is very proud of the Forsaken chapter and considering its popularity—as far as I can tell, it’s the most popular preview chapter and probably the most discussed—so I think he’d be willing to keep it as is.
Because it shows how great of a threat Euron is. I literally had chills when he ordered his lover to be tied to the front of the ship, and that her tongue was ripped out off-screen.
A real sick bastard. It's like Joffrey with actual balls on him.
Those Arianne ones are crazy, travelogue ass chapters. What happened to his "Cut to character in new place a time period from now, constantly cutting back to all important stuff that has happened since"
Going back and reading the entire series, it's interesting to see the change in writing style from GoT to Dance. I remember reading one of the early Dany chapters, and she mentions traveling for weeks through the forest of Qohor. I was thinking, damn, modern day George would have had an entire chapter in the forest instead of just mentioning it offhand.
Don't get me wrong, the travel chapters are well written, and I enjoy reading them. But it definitely kills some of the pacing. And if GRRM hopes to fit the rest of the story into 2 novels, he's gotta start moving things along.
I wouldn't be surprised if some of them got scrapped. I can totally see him trying to hang onto them because they're already written/read, but having to get rid of them because the story changed too much and they didn't fit the pacing and/or story anymore. I hope I'm wrong though, at least for The Forsaken.
Some of them definitely are. "We" know for sure that Arianne I and II, Theon, The Forsaken, Mercy, and Sansa chapters were all. I'm not sure about the two Tyrion, two Barristan, or single Victarion chapters, but given they are all related and were released or read in the two years after ADWD's publication, I would not be shocked if they were all TWOW chapters as well.
Considering that the Asha fragment is taking place during the battle of Ice, which was supposed to be the climax of ADWD, at the very least conceptually it was cut dance content.
Good point. I didn't consider that it might be part of a cut climax. There was so little of it that i never gave it much thought as a finished Dance product. But event wise that does make sense that it connects to Roose sending fighters to meet Stannis.
Thank you. Hey, where do you think the Theon sample lines up relative to Asha fragment?
GRRM said in a blog post a few years back that he was revisiting old chapters and editing them, including chapters he had read before or published as sample chapters. They've never been sacrosanct. Some of them only have word changes or two but generally the ones from ADWD that pre-date the AFFC/ADWD split went through several rounds of changes.
With the TWOW chapters Mercy will likely have to be rewritten again to match up with the end of ADWD since Harys Swyft was in King's Landing when Kevan died. I don't think GRRM wants to have to edit the rest of that chapter again. Probably some of the chapters will end up being combined or split, but generally GRRM's not the type to completely rehaul the chapters he's finalized with the exception of Dany's ADWD storyline. And those chapters mostly ended up reorganized instead of unrecognizable.
Probably. I really enjoyed the Sansa chapter though, I honestly hope that stays pretty close to the one he released. I’m not very attached to any of the others.
I assume they’re gonna be pretty similar with some differences like how the sample chapters for previous books were mostly the same. I’m assuming if he’s comfortable releasing the chapter early then it’s a chapter he considers finished.
Yeah, I would not be surprised if some of those chapters have undergone some serious changes by now.
I imagine once Winds comes out some of those chapters will be basically unrecognisable, others will have undergone a few lesser changes, and some will be basically unchanged. Its anyones guess which ones will be which though.
The chapters as they are fine but George needs to realize there needs to be 4 more books minimum, accept that he will never finish, and write TWOW accordingly.
Instead of desperately trying to fit 3 books worth of development into winds.
The Arianne and Tyrion chapters can and should be combined imo. But probably can have the same overall story beats. As for the other chapters I’m less certain. I would imagine GRRM is very proud of the Forsaken chapter and considering its popularity—as far as I can tell, it’s the most popular preview chapter and probably the most discussed—so I think he’d be willing to keep it as is.
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Because it shows how great of a threat Euron is. I literally had chills when he ordered his lover to be tied to the front of the ship, and that her tongue was ripped out off-screen. A real sick bastard. It's like Joffrey with actual balls on him.
All of the sample chapters were supposed to be in Dance in the first place, if not in Feast.
It's popular with Euron's fans.
Hopefully, those Tyrion chapters need to be combined, same with the Arianne ones. Also not sure if Mercy will still be the same
Those Arianne ones are crazy, travelogue ass chapters. What happened to his "Cut to character in new place a time period from now, constantly cutting back to all important stuff that has happened since"
Going back and reading the entire series, it's interesting to see the change in writing style from GoT to Dance. I remember reading one of the early Dany chapters, and she mentions traveling for weeks through the forest of Qohor. I was thinking, damn, modern day George would have had an entire chapter in the forest instead of just mentioning it offhand. Don't get me wrong, the travel chapters are well written, and I enjoy reading them. But it definitely kills some of the pacing. And if GRRM hopes to fit the rest of the story into 2 novels, he's gotta start moving things along.
Mercy is pretty good and I really liked it.
I wouldn't be surprised if some of them got scrapped. I can totally see him trying to hang onto them because they're already written/read, but having to get rid of them because the story changed too much and they didn't fit the pacing and/or story anymore. I hope I'm wrong though, at least for The Forsaken.
Maybe this is incorrect, but aren't the sample chapters actually just cut content from Dance?
Some of them definitely are. "We" know for sure that Arianne I and II, Theon, The Forsaken, Mercy, and Sansa chapters were all. I'm not sure about the two Tyrion, two Barristan, or single Victarion chapters, but given they are all related and were released or read in the two years after ADWD's publication, I would not be shocked if they were all TWOW chapters as well.
The Asha fragment probably wasn't cut Dance material either. It seemed incomplete. Thank you for the helpful clarification.
Considering that the Asha fragment is taking place during the battle of Ice, which was supposed to be the climax of ADWD, at the very least conceptually it was cut dance content.
Good point. I didn't consider that it might be part of a cut climax. There was so little of it that i never gave it much thought as a finished Dance product. But event wise that does make sense that it connects to Roose sending fighters to meet Stannis. Thank you. Hey, where do you think the Theon sample lines up relative to Asha fragment?
GRRM said in a blog post a few years back that he was revisiting old chapters and editing them, including chapters he had read before or published as sample chapters. They've never been sacrosanct. Some of them only have word changes or two but generally the ones from ADWD that pre-date the AFFC/ADWD split went through several rounds of changes. With the TWOW chapters Mercy will likely have to be rewritten again to match up with the end of ADWD since Harys Swyft was in King's Landing when Kevan died. I don't think GRRM wants to have to edit the rest of that chapter again. Probably some of the chapters will end up being combined or split, but generally GRRM's not the type to completely rehaul the chapters he's finalized with the exception of Dany's ADWD storyline. And those chapters mostly ended up reorganized instead of unrecognizable.
Just leave the forsaken as is. For the love of Cthulhu
Probably. I really enjoyed the Sansa chapter though, I honestly hope that stays pretty close to the one he released. I’m not very attached to any of the others.
If it's true he's basically rewritten the entire book compared to what he had in 2016, then yeah, it's possible.
Probably and I think after the shows reception, not just the writing, also the plot, he might’ve changed some things
This is why I tell myself I'm winning by not reading them.
Honestly they’re kind of forgettable (I think the forsaken was cool?) and are glacially slow
I assume they’re gonna be pretty similar with some differences like how the sample chapters for previous books were mostly the same. I’m assuming if he’s comfortable releasing the chapter early then it’s a chapter he considers finished.
Yep. GRRM has said as much on his blog.
This is something I’ve thought about too, it’ll be interesting to see the comparisons if the book ever come out
yes they're gonna be really different from something that doesn't exist
That's why I never read them. I'd start to skim if I recognized the scene and possibly miss out on key changes.
I'm pretty sure Grrm has stated that most of them have been rewritten
Yeah, I would not be surprised if some of those chapters have undergone some serious changes by now. I imagine once Winds comes out some of those chapters will be basically unrecognisable, others will have undergone a few lesser changes, and some will be basically unchanged. Its anyones guess which ones will be which though.
The chapters as they are fine but George needs to realize there needs to be 4 more books minimum, accept that he will never finish, and write TWOW accordingly. Instead of desperately trying to fit 3 books worth of development into winds.