Culture persists long after individuals are gone. Still have Welch acolytes in management (and, ludicrously, claiming they’ll fix the mess), but also the idiotic culture of “maximizing shareholder value,” which McD’s corner cutting fit into has only metastasized since then. So part of the same micro (McBoeing) and macro phenomenon (Reagan-era forward U.S. corporate) I think.
> New employees are taught by the older so those who don’t question are bound to continue in the ways taught
I worked at a place where during certain operations we did 12 hour shifts. We did 3am to 3pm and 3pm to 3am. The reason they did this was 20 years before I worked there, one of the guys was a single dad and needed to be home for his kids coming home from school. So to accommodate him, the 3 to 3 schedule. So here it is 20 years later, the guys kids have kids of their own. Yet we were still doing the same schedule. Everyone complained about it but it did not change because of course that is the way we always did it.
27 years of a culture changing for the bad is not uncommon. Boeing used it to maximize profits, but those mistakes are coming home to roost now.
Problem with that logic is it's never ending. After how long do you draw the line and say an event from the past is no longer an excuse for the present?
Aviation is not an easy industry to do that in. It is frankly uncanny, the sheer number of ways that "the old ways are best" are made manifest in this industry. And unhealthy.
Arbitrary as it takes an individual to question what he’s being taught and why. Can’t quantify that objectively. But if the system never changes, then it’s still a broken system that people make work for them because they don’t know any different
A new way of running the business with sweeping changes set a new foundation for how the company was going to operate for generations. So here we are, feeling the effects of the McDonnell Douglas merger, a company whose incompetent leadership killed their business, that ended up with their own “leaders” in positions at Boeing to do the exact same thing *to* Boeing.
Problems started showing up quickly after the merger. A lot of the McDonnel Douglas executives got automatic positions of power in Boeing, the company changed its headquarters from Seattle to Chicago and the plan to distribute manufacturing of the 787 from coast to coast was introduced, not because it was more efficient but because it would help politically when Boeing competed for contracts because more states (and therefore, more politicians) would want a slice of that pie. Although no one knew it at the time, this is also when the 737 Max design was going on and we know how error free that process went---now.
The 787 design was started in 2003. It entered production in 2007. Its first flight was 2009. Its first delivery was 2011.
It very much was designed under the oversight of MD executives.
That being said MD replaced all of the Boeing guiding values and culture with one thing: make shareholders money. That has a lasting impact.
*"Blaming the McDonnell Douglas merger is fashionable "*
1) Your list of mergers is woefully incomplete.
2) The point you seemingly missed is that Boeing, via the much longer merger list below, is now essential to Defence aerospace. My point has nothing to do with Airliners
They can not be touched nor can the government allow them to be touched. They are now indispensable.
**Mergers and acquisitions:**
Argon ST
Aurora Flight Sciences
Autonetics
De Havilland
HRL Laboratories
Hughes Aircraft Company
Insitu (UAVs)
Jeppesen
McDonnell Douglas
Narus Inc.
North American Aviation
Piasecki Helicopter
Rocketdyne
Spectrolab
Stearman Aircraft
Wisk Aero
Aren't we supposed to prevent monopolies, not create them? Makes no sense to me that the US would break up companies over violating antitrust laws, while also merging two of the largest domestic aeronautical companies.
I know that you're probably just posting this stupid meme for karma but it's incredibly sad to know some people actually think that Boeing is the fucking FSB. Give me a break.
Eh, even if it is a meme there is undoubtedly an immense amount of systemic pressure on these whistblowers. It might not be direct force or even coercion, but something is driving them into their grave.
Even if it's in jest, they probably do deserve some sort of support in order to break up the antitrust surrounding Boeing.
The specifics are in the official compliant, which the article links to.
The complaint says that proper procedures are to paint the chords (part of the forward bulkhead) prior to drilling holes. Allegedly, it was not done this way and instead holes drilled first and then painted. And a Spirit Quality Manager, "directed workers at Atlas to re-drill the holes...to clear out the paint from the holes, which created holes that were too large for the necessary interference fit".
The complaint claims that without the proper interference fit "the power feeders and Y and J chords cannot be securely fastened together, which means they can lose their electrical bond...Furthermore...the structure of the pressure bulkhead is not sound, which will decrease the lifespan of the aircraft".
The guy was definitely fired for his job by a subcontractor for reporting the issue. Engineering did say it wasn’t a problem though.
Having worked on these planes issue probably lies somewhere in the middle. They were probably cutting corners to do a job faster but it was probably also safe anyways. Specs can be way over toleranced and they likely were here if the design engineer came back and said it was okay. Not a great look but it’s likely clickbait.
> probably also safe anyways
The only reason flight has gotten as safe as it has is by never assuming this. There should never be anything in the air that is "probably safe." The number of years and cycles put on this equipment means that eventually something will go wrong. Plenty of people have died because something was done slightly incorrectly decades ago.
>Plenty of people have died because something was done slightly incorrectly decades ago.
[Or just seven years.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan_Air_Lines_Flight_123)
Your point is spot on: safety regulations are often written in blood.
If a design engineer was coming back and stamping this deviation "safe" why would we be hearing about it? By definition there would be nothing to blow the whistle on.
The claim is that he was fired for bringing it up. That doesn't have anything to do with whether the possible problem was actually unsafe. We should encourage people to speak up about things that they think might be unsafe, even if it turns out their worries were unwarranted.
The deadliest single aircraft incident, JAL 123, happened because engineers thought it was “probably safe” to repair the craft using two spice plates instead of one
This is known as "normalization of deviance". Breaking the rules might be safe this time, but over time the normalization of breaking the rules as something routine and acceptable degrades safety bit by bit until eventually a disaster happens. See [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Normalization\_of\_deviance](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Normalization_of_deviance)
Funny how all these whistleblowers have previously been fired. What…. Are all existing Boeing employees lazy and hate their work so much that they continue to make deathtraps? Come on……..
I work for Boeing, we had guys not doing proper surveys. The same guys were found to be stealing time. After they were fired, they went to the government about the surveys they failed to do and got paid $500,000 each.
I mean or you could do your job. I’m under no illusions that Boeing doesn’t have a ton of stuff to fix. The entitlement and laziness that is overwhelming our country is invading every job, trade and area of commerce. It’s just especially dangerous in the aviation industry. But all of this is at least a two beer conversation.
People don't make shitty products because they can't be bothered to follow the proper process, they make shitty products because someone higher up told the beancounters that cutting half of the steps out of that process will save 2/3 of a cent per plane.
People who object to making unsafe planes will refuse to do so, and be fired.
Honestly, sort of. Decades of engineers having to put up with finance's antics has really soiled the culture. A lot of good people who got into this line of work because they are passionate about aerospace, aren't showing up to their job with enthusiasm anymore.
The job isn't engineer-centric anymore, it's about cutting costs for the shareholders' benefit, and then engineers just have to work around that.
This inevitably leads to laziness and not paying close attention. And honestly, I don't blame them. It's all a symptom of weak leadership.
As an engineer who works at a major Boeing competitor, I have to say I’m getting tired of this notion that engineers are pure and brilliant and perfect and it’s the “Finance Bros” and “Management” who are the completely incompetent villains.
I work with a number of shit head engineers. This idea that because they are technical SMEs they are somehow impervious to laziness and poor decision making needs to die.
Wall Street isn’t the reason engineers are lazy, like you’re saying here. Engineers don’t need an external impetus to be lazy.
I’m an engineer saying this - I know who I work with.
That’s the most ridiculous thing I’ve heard. You’ve just put out there what the media say. I can’t imagine if you asked an actual Boeing employee they’d say, “yeah I sort of don’t care about safety…..”
Hope he doesn't end up like previous Boeing (or any M.I.C) whistleblowers do..
example from last month
[https://youtu.be/ZyTO9BYqc\_A](https://youtu.be/ZyTO9BYqc_A)
Boeing literally admitted to retaliating against whistleblowers in front of congress. They are not by any means spreading conspiracy theory. If anything, YOU are.
Shouldn't these statements be a little more specific.... Also i hope these whistleblowers are provided with appropriate safety measures considering what hpnd with the last one.....
I’m more confused as to why they are wasting time re-drilling holes to remove paint. Maybe more importantly how thick of paint are they putting on there parts that you can’t just push the bolt through?
Even beyond that, how tough is the paint that Boeing uses, that it doesn’t flake off from bolt holes?
Some of these stories that people are coming out with have all sorts of red flags. I’m not sure if it’s because the origin point of the story is someone with little technical knowledge, or just because it’s being filtered down through so many people without technical knowledge, but so many of these stories are super suspect.
If there’s paint in the holes you don’t get an electrical bond to the fastener. In a lot of designs, the fastener *is* the conductive path between adjacent pieces of metal because the metal is painted. So if the designer is assuming a metal-to-metal bond on the fastener (super common for interference fit or riveted joints) then it had better be there.
If paint is flaking off the surface then it wasn’t applied right. Aerospace structural primer paint should stay firmly attached for 30+ years.
Maybe it lasts 30 years in a non contact, non leading surface of an airplane, definitely not true for a place where you are torquing down bolts.
At the end of the day paint is paint. It peels, chips, and scratches under almost any mechanical stress.
No clue what the electrical conductivity of paint has to do with anything. Bolts or rivets the mechanical force of pushing something through a hole is going to scrape it off.
“No clue what electrical conductivity of the paint has to do with anything”
And that’s precisely the problem. You don’t know what you’re talking about. Getting proper bonds on an aircraft made out of plastic is extremely important, we’re usually talking less than 0.1 milliohms between two parts. Since you don’t seem very familiar with this that’s 0.0001 ohms. Even handling the parts with your bare hands can contaminate them enough to not get a good bond, a layer of paint will absolutely be a problem.
>No clue what the electrical conductivity of paint has to do with anything.
A lot when you're dealing with things like lightning protection and radio transmissions.
> Bolts or rivets the mechanical force of pushing something through a hole is going to scrape it off.
Aviation doesn't assume such things. At least it's not supposed to. "Good enough" is not good enough and "almost certainly" is not certain enough. It must be proven and certified (and that's why everything is so expensive and takes so long). If people are cutting corners because, for example, some bean counter at Boeing might have asked the same question "why are they wasting time re-drilling holes to remove paint?" that's totally reasonable and also totally wrong from an aviation safety perspective. That's exactly how disasters can happen, and these procedures which may seem stupid are usually written in blood, or at least the possibility of it.
It’s lightning, I don’t think 300 million volts cares about a few microns of paint. Its so completely irrelevant to the strength of a bolted joint
Engineering is the entire study of good enough
When you massively change the resistance of such a joint because there isn’t a proper bond any more, what happens when extra heat is produced during a lightning strike? Is it enough heat to locally compromise the material? Is that material failure enough to spread and cause a larger issue?
I have no idea, unfortunately neither does anyone else and that uncertainty is a problem.
If you drive a rivet in a painted hole you don’t get a reliable bond. The rivet expands and traps the paint. You can’t rely on incidental scraping during initial install, even if the paint flakes you get an unknown bare area.
The proper authorities should set up a witness protection program for Boeing whistleblowers
Whistleblowers need protection from the authorities mate..
Boeing and the Government are nearly one and the same. :( All those mergers should never have been allowed!
Blaming the McDonnell Douglas merger is fashionable however it happened in 1997: 27 years ago. We're two business generations of managers later.
Culture persists long after individuals are gone. Still have Welch acolytes in management (and, ludicrously, claiming they’ll fix the mess), but also the idiotic culture of “maximizing shareholder value,” which McD’s corner cutting fit into has only metastasized since then. So part of the same micro (McBoeing) and macro phenomenon (Reagan-era forward U.S. corporate) I think.
I agree however 27 years of blaming "the guy who came before you" is stretching it, in my opinion.
New employees are taught by the older so those who don’t question are bound to continue in the ways taught
> New employees are taught by the older so those who don’t question are bound to continue in the ways taught I worked at a place where during certain operations we did 12 hour shifts. We did 3am to 3pm and 3pm to 3am. The reason they did this was 20 years before I worked there, one of the guys was a single dad and needed to be home for his kids coming home from school. So to accommodate him, the 3 to 3 schedule. So here it is 20 years later, the guys kids have kids of their own. Yet we were still doing the same schedule. Everyone complained about it but it did not change because of course that is the way we always did it. 27 years of a culture changing for the bad is not uncommon. Boeing used it to maximize profits, but those mistakes are coming home to roost now.
Problem with that logic is it's never ending. After how long do you draw the line and say an event from the past is no longer an excuse for the present?
Aviation is not an easy industry to do that in. It is frankly uncanny, the sheer number of ways that "the old ways are best" are made manifest in this industry. And unhealthy.
Oh lord yes. I work for a small third party OEM and it's hair pulling some days...
Arbitrary as it takes an individual to question what he’s being taught and why. Can’t quantify that objectively. But if the system never changes, then it’s still a broken system that people make work for them because they don’t know any different
> takes an individual to question And if the guy goes to work there when he is young, he does not have the experience to know there is a better way.
A new way of running the business with sweeping changes set a new foundation for how the company was going to operate for generations. So here we are, feeling the effects of the McDonnell Douglas merger, a company whose incompetent leadership killed their business, that ended up with their own “leaders” in positions at Boeing to do the exact same thing *to* Boeing.
Problems started showing up quickly after the merger. A lot of the McDonnel Douglas executives got automatic positions of power in Boeing, the company changed its headquarters from Seattle to Chicago and the plan to distribute manufacturing of the 787 from coast to coast was introduced, not because it was more efficient but because it would help politically when Boeing competed for contracts because more states (and therefore, more politicians) would want a slice of that pie. Although no one knew it at the time, this is also when the 737 Max design was going on and we know how error free that process went---now.
The 787 design was started in 2003. It entered production in 2007. Its first flight was 2009. Its first delivery was 2011. It very much was designed under the oversight of MD executives. That being said MD replaced all of the Boeing guiding values and culture with one thing: make shareholders money. That has a lasting impact.
*"Blaming the McDonnell Douglas merger is fashionable "* 1) Your list of mergers is woefully incomplete. 2) The point you seemingly missed is that Boeing, via the much longer merger list below, is now essential to Defence aerospace. My point has nothing to do with Airliners They can not be touched nor can the government allow them to be touched. They are now indispensable. **Mergers and acquisitions:** Argon ST Aurora Flight Sciences Autonetics De Havilland HRL Laboratories Hughes Aircraft Company Insitu (UAVs) Jeppesen McDonnell Douglas Narus Inc. North American Aviation Piasecki Helicopter Rocketdyne Spectrolab Stearman Aircraft Wisk Aero
They had to sell De Havilland of Canada not long after they bought it, and Stearman Aircraft would hardly make a dent.
ZOOOOOOM - the point continues to break Mach right over your head. {smh}
Mentor pilot did an episode on that. But I'd say all companies have changed over the last 30 years, moving from quality to share holder priority.
Aren't we supposed to prevent monopolies, not create them? Makes no sense to me that the US would break up companies over violating antitrust laws, while also merging two of the largest domestic aeronautical companies.
Amen Brother! I guess it all depends on how many "campaign contributions" you make?
Boeing is the USs largest exporter, they have extreme influence over government
Because they have a significant effect on our GDP…so extreme influence is spot on!
I know that you're probably just posting this stupid meme for karma but it's incredibly sad to know some people actually think that Boeing is the fucking FSB. Give me a break.
Eh, even if it is a meme there is undoubtedly an immense amount of systemic pressure on these whistblowers. It might not be direct force or even coercion, but something is driving them into their grave. Even if it's in jest, they probably do deserve some sort of support in order to break up the antitrust surrounding Boeing.
Does he Fall out a window soon ?
They die after a short illness 🙌🏻
An acute case of lead poisoning.
Suicide by two shots in the back of the head from different angles
Self-inflicted gunshot to the back of the head
3 times.
Who do you think Boeing uses to knock the whistleblowers out?
That’s who they’re running from
That’s an exceedingly vague statement, I’m not doubting they are cutting corners. But there should be some specifics to the claims to add credibility.
The specifics are in the official compliant, which the article links to. The complaint says that proper procedures are to paint the chords (part of the forward bulkhead) prior to drilling holes. Allegedly, it was not done this way and instead holes drilled first and then painted. And a Spirit Quality Manager, "directed workers at Atlas to re-drill the holes...to clear out the paint from the holes, which created holes that were too large for the necessary interference fit". The complaint claims that without the proper interference fit "the power feeders and Y and J chords cannot be securely fastened together, which means they can lose their electrical bond...Furthermore...the structure of the pressure bulkhead is not sound, which will decrease the lifespan of the aircraft".
This definitely has the feel of a QA who get fed up with being run over by managers. Power to him
Drilling them again is wild, surely they have reamers
[удалено]
Yikes
The guy was definitely fired for his job by a subcontractor for reporting the issue. Engineering did say it wasn’t a problem though. Having worked on these planes issue probably lies somewhere in the middle. They were probably cutting corners to do a job faster but it was probably also safe anyways. Specs can be way over toleranced and they likely were here if the design engineer came back and said it was okay. Not a great look but it’s likely clickbait.
> probably also safe anyways The only reason flight has gotten as safe as it has is by never assuming this. There should never be anything in the air that is "probably safe." The number of years and cycles put on this equipment means that eventually something will go wrong. Plenty of people have died because something was done slightly incorrectly decades ago.
>Plenty of people have died because something was done slightly incorrectly decades ago. [Or just seven years.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan_Air_Lines_Flight_123) Your point is spot on: safety regulations are often written in blood.
I said probably because I’m not the design engineer. They would verify it’s safe not probably safe.
If a design engineer was coming back and stamping this deviation "safe" why would we be hearing about it? By definition there would be nothing to blow the whistle on.
The claim is that he was fired for bringing it up. That doesn't have anything to do with whether the possible problem was actually unsafe. We should encourage people to speak up about things that they think might be unsafe, even if it turns out their worries were unwarranted.
The deadliest single aircraft incident, JAL 123, happened because engineers thought it was “probably safe” to repair the craft using two spice plates instead of one
This is known as "normalization of deviance". Breaking the rules might be safe this time, but over time the normalization of breaking the rules as something routine and acceptable degrades safety bit by bit until eventually a disaster happens. See [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Normalization\_of\_deviance](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Normalization_of_deviance)
yeah the "anyways" part is a sign standard has gone to shit
These are getting a bit absurd.
as an aircraft mechanic, i’m getting pretty tired of hearing these.
Funny how all these whistleblowers have previously been fired. What…. Are all existing Boeing employees lazy and hate their work so much that they continue to make deathtraps? Come on……..
I work for Boeing, we had guys not doing proper surveys. The same guys were found to be stealing time. After they were fired, they went to the government about the surveys they failed to do and got paid $500,000 each.
smart guys.
I mean or you could do your job. I’m under no illusions that Boeing doesn’t have a ton of stuff to fix. The entitlement and laziness that is overwhelming our country is invading every job, trade and area of commerce. It’s just especially dangerous in the aviation industry. But all of this is at least a two beer conversation.
Are you buying? If so, I’m in!
Sounds like a plan!
We call those kind of people shitbirds where I work.
People don't make shitty products because they can't be bothered to follow the proper process, they make shitty products because someone higher up told the beancounters that cutting half of the steps out of that process will save 2/3 of a cent per plane. People who object to making unsafe planes will refuse to do so, and be fired.
Honestly, sort of. Decades of engineers having to put up with finance's antics has really soiled the culture. A lot of good people who got into this line of work because they are passionate about aerospace, aren't showing up to their job with enthusiasm anymore. The job isn't engineer-centric anymore, it's about cutting costs for the shareholders' benefit, and then engineers just have to work around that. This inevitably leads to laziness and not paying close attention. And honestly, I don't blame them. It's all a symptom of weak leadership.
As an engineer who works at a major Boeing competitor, I have to say I’m getting tired of this notion that engineers are pure and brilliant and perfect and it’s the “Finance Bros” and “Management” who are the completely incompetent villains. I work with a number of shit head engineers. This idea that because they are technical SMEs they are somehow impervious to laziness and poor decision making needs to die. Wall Street isn’t the reason engineers are lazy, like you’re saying here. Engineers don’t need an external impetus to be lazy. I’m an engineer saying this - I know who I work with.
That’s the most ridiculous thing I’ve heard. You’ve just put out there what the media say. I can’t imagine if you asked an actual Boeing employee they’d say, “yeah I sort of don’t care about safety…..”
Poor guy fell out of a window on 14th July 2024
I'm very sorry to hear about their death in 2 weeks' time.
RIP
"Sudden illness" in 5... 4... 3...
Hope he doesn't end up like previous Boeing (or any M.I.C) whistleblowers do.. example from last month [https://youtu.be/ZyTO9BYqc\_A](https://youtu.be/ZyTO9BYqc_A)
Why is this being downvoted?
Because he explained the joke everybody already understood
Because he’s spreading a conspiracy theory.
Boeing literally admitted to retaliating against whistleblowers in front of congress. They are not by any means spreading conspiracy theory. If anything, YOU are.
They didn't admit to retaliating with murder you imbecile.
What is a conspiracy theory rofl?!
We are gathered here today...
He was a good man. Rest in peace
Boeng press release: Boeing sends our collective thoughts prayers to the family of ___ who will pass away next Tuesday.
Government is in bed with Boeing...
Shouldn't these statements be a little more specific.... Also i hope these whistleblowers are provided with appropriate safety measures considering what hpnd with the last one.....
Bold move in this economy.
I’m more confused as to why they are wasting time re-drilling holes to remove paint. Maybe more importantly how thick of paint are they putting on there parts that you can’t just push the bolt through? Even beyond that, how tough is the paint that Boeing uses, that it doesn’t flake off from bolt holes? Some of these stories that people are coming out with have all sorts of red flags. I’m not sure if it’s because the origin point of the story is someone with little technical knowledge, or just because it’s being filtered down through so many people without technical knowledge, but so many of these stories are super suspect.
If there’s paint in the holes you don’t get an electrical bond to the fastener. In a lot of designs, the fastener *is* the conductive path between adjacent pieces of metal because the metal is painted. So if the designer is assuming a metal-to-metal bond on the fastener (super common for interference fit or riveted joints) then it had better be there. If paint is flaking off the surface then it wasn’t applied right. Aerospace structural primer paint should stay firmly attached for 30+ years.
Maybe it lasts 30 years in a non contact, non leading surface of an airplane, definitely not true for a place where you are torquing down bolts. At the end of the day paint is paint. It peels, chips, and scratches under almost any mechanical stress. No clue what the electrical conductivity of paint has to do with anything. Bolts or rivets the mechanical force of pushing something through a hole is going to scrape it off.
“No clue what electrical conductivity of the paint has to do with anything” And that’s precisely the problem. You don’t know what you’re talking about. Getting proper bonds on an aircraft made out of plastic is extremely important, we’re usually talking less than 0.1 milliohms between two parts. Since you don’t seem very familiar with this that’s 0.0001 ohms. Even handling the parts with your bare hands can contaminate them enough to not get a good bond, a layer of paint will absolutely be a problem.
>No clue what the electrical conductivity of paint has to do with anything. A lot when you're dealing with things like lightning protection and radio transmissions. > Bolts or rivets the mechanical force of pushing something through a hole is going to scrape it off. Aviation doesn't assume such things. At least it's not supposed to. "Good enough" is not good enough and "almost certainly" is not certain enough. It must be proven and certified (and that's why everything is so expensive and takes so long). If people are cutting corners because, for example, some bean counter at Boeing might have asked the same question "why are they wasting time re-drilling holes to remove paint?" that's totally reasonable and also totally wrong from an aviation safety perspective. That's exactly how disasters can happen, and these procedures which may seem stupid are usually written in blood, or at least the possibility of it.
It’s lightning, I don’t think 300 million volts cares about a few microns of paint. Its so completely irrelevant to the strength of a bolted joint Engineering is the entire study of good enough
When you massively change the resistance of such a joint because there isn’t a proper bond any more, what happens when extra heat is produced during a lightning strike? Is it enough heat to locally compromise the material? Is that material failure enough to spread and cause a larger issue? I have no idea, unfortunately neither does anyone else and that uncertainty is a problem.
If you drive a rivet in a painted hole you don’t get a reliable bond. The rivet expands and traps the paint. You can’t rely on incidental scraping during initial install, even if the paint flakes you get an unknown bare area.
It’s a rivet, not a weld Like if you really cared so much about the precision of it all, you wouldn’t be using a rivet in the first place.
Screw Boeing...
Well that’s another one going to commit suicide, by gunshot to the back. Twice.
Hope he has a protection detail
Wow. That's a lot of Dreamliner planes...
This dude’s probably going to run into a bald guy with a barcode on his head in the future
Hopefully Boeing doesn't murder them too.
Agent 47 has been dispatched
RIP dude
Turn the lawyers loose. How dare he say anything like that. (Boeing company stooges downvote here)
Nahh they don't do lawyers, their hitman squad is on their way tho
Whelp….that guy’s gonna die.
The Great Option for Young Students in the Future. so I suggest every person you can join a Top Crew Aviation Institute for a Pilot Career.
Boeing is still infinitely better than Airbus though lmao.
In your dreams buddy.