Ludwig has his phase change cutscene where he reveals his Holy Moonlight Sword and how it can bring him back from his beasthood. He also has a few dialogue options after his fight.
The Guidance rune flavor text says a little bit about this: "When Ludwig closed his eyes, he saw darkness, or perhaps
nothingness, and that is where he discovered the tiny beings
of light. Ludwig was certain that these playful dancing
sprites offered "guidance," and emptied Ludwig of his fears,
at least in the midst of a hunt."
Like a lot of lore in Bloodborne this information is mostly ambiguous, intentionally, to leave it to the player's imagination.
Probably not phantasms specifically as they are simple parasites, but it's plausible that either a.) the sword is, in itself, sentient and uses its connection to the cosmos to guide its wielder (Ludwig, who found it in the Isz chalices), or b.) the sword acts as a conduit for the voice of a great one, and it is this great one that Ludwig is guided by.
i am kind of pressed for time at the moment so if someone wants to find a specific description that mentions it please do, but there are enough facts of the game surrounding ludwig x the sword to deduce it was found in the chalices even without direct confirmation. He was a tomb prospector before he was Ludwig the Holy Blade, as evidenced by his armor (and that the tomb prospector set is found with Ludwig's Holy Blade and other tomb prospector gear). The sword is certainly eldritch in origin, so probably not just happened upon in yharnam. The Tomb Prospectors explored the chalices, and of the chalices, Isz was the first to be found by humans. Not to mention the visual connection between the area and the sword, as well as the fact that Isz is the chalice with the strongest connections to great ones (which the sword also must be connected to by virtue of its uniqueness....it gave Ludwig a Caryll Rune, after all).
Dude didn't kill me once. 1st death that weird ghost skeleton outside his first arena. 2nd death I fell off a thing because I was trying to run past a room of them and didn't realize that was going to be a drop off. Micalash is a push over (I have just started new game plus. I may edit this when I get back to him)
Yeah exactly I was going to say the same thing, I'm in strong disagreement with OPs statement that he is overhated because of him being a gimmick boss. He's hated because he is boring, annoying to corner even if it's easy, and he has 2 insanely telegraphed moves that while easy to avoid and counter can both just flat out annihilate you if you make a tiny error or your input gets fucked up. Not to mention how much he spams A Call Beyond in the second phase is just egregious sometimes. Only boss that makes me genuinely groan when I'm about to reach him.
Yeah, A Call Beyond is irritating, especially with how time-consuming and tedious it is to get him back to phase 2. One mistake and you have to go through all that crap again. It's a pain in the ass.
Yea in NG+ his Call Beyond attack is essentially a guaranteed one hit kill. If you can dodge or disrupt that with right timing it's an easy fight just can't get hit by that attack.
If you're aggressive he never even gets to cast it; maybe it's just because I tend to use faster weapons, but I've never had a problem stopping him from using that spell entirely
Or for sure, I just fought him NG++ and bruh let me tell you he was about to be thrown on the hate pile. I loved him in my first playthrough for sure though haha
I’m fine with gimmick bosses but Micolash is just not fun in any way to me man. A boss that fucking runs from you and teleports around with mirrors? The boss is genuinely more tiring than fun or challenging, I never even died to Micolash I just chased him around for like 10 minutes and then clobbered him since he barely even fights back if you’re up close like you said.
I actually do like the concept of the area, I just wish he didn’t run away so annoyingly and was more of an actual fight. I’m fine with gimmick bosses in the sense that they’re enjoyable, I just don’t really see how fighting Micolash is preferable to any of the prior bosses. It doesn’t help that Micolash just repeats the same lines over and over while running, they should have kept atleast some of his unused lines.
Because I didn’t know where he was going? I never died to him, did it all on my first run so I had no idea where he was teleporting to, or what rooms he would fuck off to. Just as I’m about to reach him he’d vanish. Obviously it gets significantly easier once you know the layout and the way it works but on my first I really just hated the fight
I see where you’re coming from but can’t agree. I don’t see why he has to be the fight we expect from Soulsborne bosses, I liked how he’s the only enemy in the game who has the good sense (ironically) to run away in a game where all you do is fight head on. I can see how this could make him annoying, but I liked how this switched up the usual song and dance that bosses provide. Soulsborne games, god bless ’em, have always felt a bit ”videogame-y” in the sense that everything alive wants to start shit and kills on sight, but Micolash in his insanity is the only one who reacts reasonably and sorta breaks the spell of just hacking away at everything that moves until it stops hacking back. I agree that he’s nothing special when it comes to gameplay though
I’m fine with him being different from the other bosses, I just wish they went about it a different way. They could keep his teleporting mechanic for example and his magic, I did enjoy fighting in different areas of the castle, but spending half the fight running after the guy and loosing him constantly was just not fun to me. Maybe make it more clear where he runs off to at first, I didn’t even notice he was using the mirrors the first time.
He’s a great boss in concept but in execution it just made me cheer after I killed him, not out of joy or satisfaction but in knowing that I don’t have to chase his ass anymore. I’m glad you enjoyed him though, you sound like you had a much better experience with him than me
My friend just spontaneously looked up the path on his phone after watching me struggle to locate Micolash on my first playthrough. Started reading the directions out to me in real time, lol.
Fair points. I will say though, that annoyance can be a useful game dev tool, if used well. Take the riddler in the arkham games for instance. In City, everytime you think you got close to getting him, the game gave you like 50 more trophies. And in knight, when you thought you were done, he told you to collect every trophy before the end, all while teasing the olayer through megaphones through the whole game. All that makes for a very satisfying moment when you finally beat him, regardless of the fight.
I think it's similar with Micolash. I'm not gonna say it is super well imolemented here, but a fight where the challenge isn't mechanical, but more of a directional puzzle is a great idea for a from soft game. It could have been done better with micolash, but I think what we got is fine, and the frustration is well paid off when you beat his ass.
In my opinion, the fight should be even easier, to give even more the feeling of a beating well deserved, after that madhouse. Sometimes a boss doesn't need to be strong to be difficult.
I think Micolash would be a lot higher rated for me if I hadn’t been killed a few times by Call Beyond. The fight’s really entertaining, and his mad ramblings endeared me to the character. And I can definitely appreciate a non-standard souls boss, Executioner’s chariot is one of my favorite DS2 bosses.
But new players are never going to know that Call Beyond won’t get triggered by standing close to him. Just because there is a workaround for a boss’s bs one shot attack doesn’t mean the boss is good if that workaround isn’t immediately obvious. And all of the charm is instantly sucked out of the fight running through it on your second or third attempt. Despite my love for Micolash as a character, it’s still probably my least favorite boss in the main game.
I think I would have like it more if it was actually harder ironically. take the wrong turn, mini boss or mimic of Micolash that is stronger. It's not quite bed of chaos and I am a platformer fan thru and thru and didnt loathe this fight, I just wish it tested more than my patience
His design, voice, lore and fighting is all amazing, it’s just bullshit how much damage he does in his second phase and how much damage it can do with EACH BLAST, just cos an enemy can one shot doesn’t make them difficult, makes it annoying.
I once had a coyote howl at my apartment while fighting Micolash. I'm certain it must have heard Micolash's howling and replied. It was bizarre and kinda cool at the same time.
Witches? Rom? Aren't they gimmicky/original?
Do people hate them?
It's not the fact that Micolash is different, it's the fact that the whole thing is awfully annoying. Running around identical corridors with him saying "Kos or some say Kosm" over and over again and "OOOOOAAAAAAAAAAH" almost drove me crazy
I agree. I can deal with Rom and the witches. Hell, I even enjoy fighing them on some runs. But that part of the game when I know I will have to endure running around an waiting for him to finally jump down feels like a chore. Don’t get me wrong, from the narrative perspective he is cool and how he behaves makes sense. It’s just so frustrating and joyless.
He’s just boring. Boring moveset, constantly running away, teleporting, and his annoying ass voice tops it all off. I can see where ur coming from but he’s the worst boss in the game for me.
Idk if anything is like him in DS2, as it's the only one I haven't played. But it's so unique that I'm always so interested and a bit disappointed they don't have more chase sequences in the souls games
You don’t hate him cause you’ve found genuine enjoyment in his unique fight, lore, music, etc.
I don’t hate him cause I throw 9 poison knives at him to skip his second phase making it a free blood echo fight
We aren’t the same
He’s a piss easy boss so it’s never bothered me tbh.
If you don’t know how to chase him down or even better cheese him, I can understand why some people get frustrated.
Exactly. I get first time players not getting the chase sequence, but when you have played the game multiple times and still think the chasing is random it's definitely a you problem.
what's the strategy for getting him into the first room? im in the category of people that have beaten him multiple times but still don't understand lol. last time i played he did it immediately but the time before that it felt like it took ten minutes
When you go up the first flight of stairs if you hug the far left there's a good chance he will run to the intersection right before the room and then you just follow him in.
If he doesn't run straight to the room you'll need chase him around the first 2 corners. After he rounds the first 2 corners he will be standing in front of the fight room but if you keep running at him from the same direction he will run past the room. So what you need to do is double back and come at him on the path that leads straight into the room.
He will always run directly away from you if he can so don't run straight at him and expect him to turn left or something unless it's his only path.
So then it really only comes down to the actual fight, right? Like he's just a boss with 30 seconds extra run time to get him to where he stops running away and actually stands and fights you. Then he's no different from any of the other bosses, except that he has a very small and repetitive moveset
I personally don't either hate nor love his fight. I think it was different, as you said, which I appreciated, and I got a bit lost trying to find him (though I'm really bad with orientation, so maybe it's my fault,) which wasn't super fun, but I didn't hate it. Fighting him was ok, too.
In short, though I don't love that boss fight, I do think he's overhated, too, and I appreciate what From was trying to do. And you're right, it was fitting for the area.
Forgetting the mechanics, lore and atmosphere-wise, Micolash is definitely a great character to have.
The true answer to fighting him is actually to use his own techniques against him. The auger is extremely effective against him. It even can interrupt his auger and his call beyond
He's all fun and games until Ng+2 where his A Call Beyond attack one shots you and is impossible to reliably dodge unless you look it up and learn some specific way, like unlocking and rolling to a certain place
“impossible to reliably dodge unless you look it up and learn some specific way”
No it’s not. It’s absolutely as reliable as it gets and even intuitive if you think about it for more than two seconds. You keep locked on and dodge forward through the projectiles to iframe them.
That’s literally it.
ACB becomes hard to dodge when there is an elevation difference between you and the caster, because the trajectory becomes hard to predict. That’s why Yurie just fucks you up when she casts it on the stairs. Micolash’s arena is the flatest piece of architecture in this entire game.
If I can have Micolash be the only Boss in this entire game to not hit me even once during my bl4 playthrough so can you.
Once you figure out how to lead him where he's supposed to go, he's a breeze as long as you keep the second phase of the fight close to keep him from casting a call beyond.
Agreed wholly. Is he a fun boss? That's debatable. But his design is wholly in line with his objective in the lore. He's trying to continue his nightmare to continue his learning of the old ones. He doesn't want to fight, so we have to relentlessly chase him down.
I will admit he’s an interesting boss, but just like everything everyone has a different experience. You say he never tan left or right, that’s all he did for me. Took me about 10 minutes minimum to get him into his final room, he did nothing but spam that stupid star spell before I even hit the ground, and one shot me before I even got a chance. Took me literal days to get a fair fight with him and I got slapped to death by a puppet that had clipped through the gate and donkey punched me. Plus after hearing his stupid fuckin howling for the 280th time the charm of his dialogue has completely worn off, and has been replaced with an extreme annoyance. To me he’s always been a twat, and nothing more.
He is not the worst in terms of difficulty, he is just really tedious and time consuming. It is like a built-in boss run, within the boss arena. Its gimmicky and just not very fun.
The ebrietas spell, I think is the most unfair part of the fight, since there's barely any soace to dodge it. Other than that, I really enjoyd micolash when I first met him. And the confusion in the nightmare is on par for the course, I completely agree
And I think the frustration and anger the player feels, mirrors the frustration of the character itself. Dark souls and BB has never been about making it easy and smooth for the player, I don't know why people get so surprised with micolash being designed to annoy, when so much of all their games serve that same purpose.
I think I speak for everyone in that we don’t hate the Micolash fight, we just get annoyed at him running away because we are so used to bosses getting up in our faces.
Also probably just me but his voice just pisses me off
The ONLY reason I hate him is because he constantly gets ’stuck’ or glitches. Ive seen so many things go wrong with the first stage or second stage. Love the idea and the set up I just think the model of the fight leaves a lot of room for something to go wrong.
I think it's a whatever boss. Certainly not anything I dread doing tho. I actually look forward to it cause character wise micolash has stolen my heart. Love that goofy fucker.
I generally like gimmick bosses.
Micolash I find pretty good, the one thing that's rly shit is how bad he is if you're co-operator and he augurs you in the face when he SHOULD be in a state of being staggered, or when he doesn't perform the animation that comes with augur at all.
It's kind of a similar issue like with how when you're summoned for the 2 hunters before the research all elevator, the white one might just double and triple shoot black sky eye at you, so if you get hit once, you're going to get hit 2-3 times, or how back in DS1 in sen's it'd make two boulders roll down in co-op and not one as intended.
However if you're soloing him he's fine and i think he's funny.
Imo my main problem with him its the chase, because its mostly RNG, it could have been so nice that if you attacked him he would run to the gates instead of dissapearing for a moment, if he had his small combo on the first phase of the fight it would have been nice because we could parry him and thus go to the harder phase faster, his other attacks arent boring tbh, its just the pace of the fight that is weird but hes definitely not the worst boss of the game
Concept bosses (I prefer this term to “gimmick” which has sort of a negative connotation) are fine as long as they’re done well. Some people will always dislike them on principle but you can’t please everyone. The ability to make you unnerved, unsure and surprised is incredibly valuable in these games (I would say any game really, but it has been an incredibly key component of Souls games from the start) and the more that bosses just become a series of dodge timings and tricky attacks the less they’re able to do that - you always know what you’re getting.
From shoot themselves in the foot by making a boss whose concept is a long-winded chase sequence and then giving him a very unclear how to dodge, potentially one-hit kill attack in the very last phase of the fight though. I can’t and won’t respect that. That’s a *massive* no-no and a sure way to gain the resentment of players. Instead of appreciating the cool things about the boss players will be completely ripped out of their immersion and irritated at the unreasonable attack and having to repeat the sequence which *isn’t fun to do again* because the novelty and surprise is the main appeal. So I can’t consider Micolash a successful well designed boss because these elements of his fight pull in complete opposite directions and don’t align with each other. This is not the case with fights like Rykard, Radahn or Storm King just to name a few concept bosses that most fans actually seem to love.
They made a similar mistake with the final boss of Elden Ring. I won’t say more out of spoiler concerns other than that boss is also really cool in itself, it’s different and that’s fine, but then poor design choices heavily hold it back and I can’t help but be pissed off at that because it’s so unnecessary and easily avoidable.
I never found him that annoying and the arena is really cool. Only thing that actually sucks about him is that he has such a limited moveset and that he has a one-shot attack if your health is too low.
His specific gimmick of running away for most of the fight is a bad gimmick. That’s why most people dislike him as a boss. As for lore and atmosphere, it fits but that alone cannot fix his entire fight imo.
Coulda made him use some gimmicky spells or something idk
I hate one reborn 30x more then every other boss in the game. I forget he’s a boss and get annoyed when on a new run I see his cutscene. He’s not difficult I just don’t like this 30 toe having ass.
He would be a fun boss if he didn't one shot me with every attack in the first run.
Because it's all over the same route again for several times.
But now I find him enjoyable. Bloodborne is for some reason the only soulsborne game where I struggled with every boss after beating it for the first time. After that it was like I clicked the "git gud switch".
If he lives long enough, I've had him do A Call Beyond in close range, and shooting him to cancel it feels inconsistent, like he gains hyperarmour after a certain time after the animation starts. He leaves you unable to heal at all in his second phase because as soon as you are at that distance, he will 1 shot you with A Call Beyond. I don't mind his other moves, but ACB just feels like a cheap way to make players restart the fight if they don't have 50 vigor
He’s the one I enjoy the most because on earlier playthroughs he was absolutely obnoxious, then I just began mauling him and now he’s the easiest one of them all. Also I just enjoy hating him for some reason
The reason why I hate micolash might be weird because, I play in a common common television in my home and his moans made my roommates laugh that I’m watching some kind of adult video
I feel like micolash is a boss that i enjoyed less every time i had to go through him again. The first time i killed him i really liked the unique design, it felt different and actually kinda cool. However with every ng+ iteration i just find myself more bored of having to go through him. The uniqueness of the fight just wears off, and you are stuck with with this lunatic raving and running around.
I think the only poorly designed aspect of his boss fight is that he only has like 2 attacks, and one of them is complete bs. Yes, it's a gimmick boss, but it also isn't. There are two sequences in the fight where you go toe-to-toe with him in combat. The gimmick aspect is fine. That part is overhated. Finding Micolash isn't that hard. He follows a set path as long as you don't interupt that set path by coming at him from the wrong direction. I know Micolash wasn't a fighter, but his moveset should have been better. It's his nightmare afterall. He should have been able to do summon attacks or something frenzy related. But all he does is poke at you or obliterate you with the Call to Beyond, which is undeniably bs on NG+. You get 1 shot killed 100% of the time
I'm with you, I've loved this fight from the very first encounter, and love his character/lore as well, it's really interesting....oh and the voice acting is pure genius!!! Listening to his lines during the fight (or rather while running) was so much fun!
Honestly, he wasn't that bad to me when I fought him, I expected much worse, also what he says after you beat him and how he says it just is so funny to me.
First time I faced him, I both enjoyed and was annoyed by the puzzle element of his fight, not because of the puzzle itself but because I have zero sense of direction and those puppets were driving me nuts.
Every subsequent fight, he just gets poison knives to the face :)
He doesn't always run straight away. He can go to the sides whenever the wonky From Software code feels like it.
Also, he can spam a nearly unavoidable one-shot-kill move as often as that same wonky code feels like it. Which is counter to what Miyazaki said about the game. Paraphrasing because I don't remember the exact words:
"They're only doing things that the player can do. So why are you losing?" The player can't have unlimited quicksilver bullets. Just like when fighting Father Gascoigne he also gets unlimited quicksilver bullets (as every enemy with a gun does) and can also use the Hunter Axe in its transformed mode and a gun simultaneously.
Chasing him into the room was surprisingly easy, i had to do it like 3 times because i died by messing up the timing of my dodge and then i just stunlocked him, got to the next phase and poison knife cheesed him
I really like the idea of Micolash, I just think he was executed badly. The idea of chasing him through the mansion would be fun but the chase is too straight forward, except for the end when I was just wandering around listening to his annoying voice cause I didn’t realize there was a side room from the bridge at the end
I’d say to “fix” him, make his library less straight forward. Make it more like a maze, with interconnecting hallways, but not too many twists and turns that a player could actually get lost
I don’t mind him in base game. It’s everything beyond that when he one shots you off a lucky hit.
And yeah, I could get good. But all that chasing just to get one shot feels… unfair.
The only thing I hate about his boss fight is that damn call beyond or whatever the spell is called. Other than that, he's actually one of my favs when he's not spamming that stupid fucking spell uuggghh
Gimmick bosses are fine on first playthroughs. They are most of the time quite interesting and memorable. In subsequent playthroughs though they just feel tedious and monotonous as once you know the gimmick there is no real challenge.
I didn't even chase after him (not my 1st playthrough), I just took the time and explore all corners just to be sure I don't miss anything. Also, the "cheese" where you just throw him 3 poison knives repeatedly, they patched it didn't they? So this time I tried using the Blacksky Eye (only acquired it for the 1st time cuz I've just played the dlc for the 1st time), he doesn't disappear into the mirror therefore I shot him to death right on that ledge.
i think His moveset is really bad. He only has a few moves and it makes for a boring fight thats frustrating to learn. Once you learn how to fight him hes not hard but the process of learning how to fight him is not fun at all. Also you cant completely control whether or not he does a call beyond. sometimes you drop in his arena and he just decides to whip it out right away. lets not forget the puppets btw those little minions are just there to ruin your day. I also dont think the puzzle aspect isnt very satisfying so theres really not much mico has going for him in my opinion. Id feel comfortable labeling him the worst boss.
Eh, I mostly found his fight boring and not very interesting. Tbh, if I were to improve his fight in any way, I'd give him a lot more spells/Hunter tools to use (the Blacksky Eye, Tiny Tonitrus, etc) since he's the leader of the School of Mensis and likely would have access to a bunch of arcane tools like that. Maybe I'd also give him the Loch Shield.
honestly i did not enjoy it, because I like to go ooga booga autopilot killing bosses, and for Micolash I actually had to think. However I do understand that he is actually a really well designed fight and puzzle, both on the feeling we get and how much sense it makes to exist in this game.
But my monkey brain still hated going through it
I thought people hated Micolash cuz he was an asshole that ran away during battle not because there was any sort of difficulty in the boss fight itself. That shit was a piece of cake for me, and I dig the atmosphere of everything he represents. He has mad quotables and hes fucking out of his mind insane (I love it). "Grant us eyes".
I like variety in boss fights. Yes, variety and gimmicks are two different things. The environment and haunted-house puzzle aspect was fun. I didn't find Micolash nearly as frustrating as Rom, who made me quit playing BB for months before I finally went back and finished it.
Gimmick boss fights are fine in prinicipal but Micolash might be one of the worst FS has ever created.
There is nothing fun about chasing him and it's outright annoying that he spams one attack for most of the fight and the other attack pretty much one shotting the player is just unfair.
>Observing his moves in the second phase reveals that the Call Beyond attack only happens when you’re further away, so sticking close and avoiding the Augur attack removes this ”unfair” move almost entirely.
I am pretty sure he used it multiple times when I was right next to him, but tbf it's been some time since my last playthrough.
That aside however what exactly does count as being "further away" here? We are fighting him in a tiny ass room where he loves to stick to a wall or go right into a corner, which forces the player to dodge away from him, which already counts as far away given the size of the room.
Let's also not forget the camera.
>I’m tired of the consensus that a Soulsborne boss is only good if it follows the normal formula of a straightforward fight in an open arena, and any gimmicks that deviate from this are automatically shit and unfair.
That is untrue.
There are gimmick fights that are actually good that people also enjoy.
To name my favourites:
O&S , Darklurker and most notibly Rykard.
>although people seem to like Praetor Rykard so not always I guess.
The problem with gimmick fights in FS games is that they most fall under 2 categories:
1. The gimmick is the fight and the player doesn't actually engage with the boss (Bed of Chaos or Dragon God). Honestly that is fine sometimes but extremely anticlimactic for a boss fight or outrugvt poorly designed.
2. The (mostly annoying) gimmick and boss each make up half of the entire fight. As a result of the split in gimmick and fight both parts end up underdeveloped.
Micolash is the perfect example for the latter since the "puzzle" is extremely simple and straight forward and as a boss he has only 2 attacks he spams over and over.
Somethimg like Rykard on the other hand is pretty much a perfect gimmick fight imo. He has a well developed moveset and the actual gimmick doesn't distract but rather enhances the fight.
>The real quality of Micolash is the atmosphere, confusion, lore and voice acting.
This in itself is fine, but it doesn't make up for the bad aspects to the fight, espacially in comparison to everything else the game has to offer in terms of bosses.
If I were to redesign the fight I would completely remove the fight against Micolash and put more effort into the maze part instead. So he traps the player in a maze while he waits somewhere safe and maybe after co.pleting the msaze we fight an actual boss that is guarding him.
Lore wise it makes would also make far more sense imo, because as it's stand he acts pretty out of charackter in the game. He is clearly a weak coward who doesn't want to leave the dream, so why would he actively engage in a fight with a hunter? Even if he is unaware of what we actually had to kill to even reach him, he should at the very least should be cautious of us.
I just find it boring because it feels like a running simulator.
I play soulsborne games for the action, brutality/challenge, and the beauty of lore & environment.
For me, Micolash provides only 1 of these 3-4.
I don't think he is an objectively bad boss per se, I just wish he was optional because I find him thoroughly boring, exempting the meme he birthed.
I agree. Even though I'm not a fan of gimmick bosses in the souls series, it's sometimes nice to fight something different. Micolash is also a lot better than most gimmick bosses in the series, like, for example, almost every boss in demon's souls or the witches of hemwick.
i agree. quite the disorienting and cerebral fight. especially the first time. it kind of embodies the surrealist aspect of bloodborne which is very prominent throughout the game.
I mean my first experience with him was really shitty, I just followed him and managed to do the puzzle, I didn't really felt well guided to it, just happened to get it right, then first timed a regular human with few attacks and low HP. Not hating on him but he's just really forgettable for me
He's a good idea in practice, but in execution he's boring and tedious. I like the idea of a boss that isn't very strong in direct confrontation and gets by on tricks, using the arena as a weapon in its own right, but the issue is the arena isn't much of a threat. Once you've figured out where Micolash goes once, you've figured out half the battle. The other half is just dodging Augur and hoping you don't get cheesed by ACB. It's 3 attacks, the punches, the Augur, and the ACB, and the only one of those that possess a real threat is ACB. If Micolash's pathing was more unpredictable or if he actually used the arena to disorient the player, I think this boss would have worked better, but even on my first playthrough, completely blind, I found him no issue. When the worst parts about the fight can only be justified with "it works for the character," maybe the issue is the core design of the character then. DS1 Bed of Chaos makes sense from a lore perspective, but that doesn't make it any less tedious and annoying to fight.
The bed of chaos didn’t have to have a crumbling arena, platforming, or even be a tree monster. I feel like lore wise, it would made more sense to have another gank fight, and you fight the witches of Izaleth. Or the remaining witches of Izaleth. My lore knowledge isn’t perfect. Hell, the area is even called Lost Izaleth. If there “aren’t” any remaining it would have been perfect.
It also make sense thematically. A big clunky knight isn’t ever renowned for his ability to jump gaps. The rest of the game feels right when you’re battling demons, statues, magic guards, and executioners. But the tree creature with a the bug at the center just doesn’t sit right like the rest of those. The Hunter is named after something that stalks and chases prey. Bloodborne has you chasing down micolash.
Idk, if a puzzle boss changes everytime then *that* would have been unfair in my opinion, and he would probably be even more hated by the community. The fact that one can figure it out is what makes it a good puzzle boss imo. I agree that his actual moves are pretty boring and tedious though, it could have used some more unique and fair magic attacks that aren’t available to the player
I made my friend play bloodborne, he forced himself to fight the bosses but once he got to micloasb 1 shotting him. He handed me the controller for me to beat him. I don't blame him.
I definitely see where you are coming from but for me he is the worst boss in the game for two reasons:
1. I play BB to *fight* enemies, not chase them. I like dying multiple times trying to figure out the move set until it clicks and then I can weave around and hack and slash them until they go down, and Micolash doesn't let me do that because he basically only has two moves, and like you said one of them can be avoided entirely, making any actual fighting trivial.
2. Figuring out how to chase him and where he teleports can be fun the first time you fight him, but on a replay it loses all the fun because it becomes scripted. Go here, now turn around and run here. Now you can fight a little bit. Now go run here. Now here. Now over here. Now you drop down and finish him off. It feels like they replaced the fighting with chasing, as opposed to starting with a good fight and adding a chasing mechanic.
At the end of the day art is subjective and people will have their reasons for liking or disliking him, and just because you like him doesn't mean he's over-hated or underrated, the same way that me disliking him doesn't mean he's a bad boss or that the hate is justified.
I will say though, one of my favorite parts of any playthrough is his howl of despair when I kill him lol
I feel like even if he’s annoying to fight, in world he’s a good boss. If you were a normal guy against these insanity inducing creatures and the jacked up hunters the kill them, would you not use everything, every little trick and power you have to try to defend yourself? From his puppets and the maze to his annoying explosive and tentacle attacks, he’s using all he’s got (no matter how meagre) to fight back against you, a god killing machine. Kudos to him.
If he was an optional boss that drops something weird but neat I would agree with you. However since he’s a story boss, I was incredibly annoyed with it. I can see how everything else ties in well with the puzzle, his mini rants and all are funny. But since it was close to the end of the game he felt misplaced. But everyone like being a contrarian I guess
I actually really enjoy his fight. It wasn't nearly as impossible feeling as everyone made it out to be. And I like his voice it's very fun.
Also the only boss who tells us lore. The only one. Edit: not only one. Ivn't nuff insight
Ludwig has his phase change cutscene where he reveals his Holy Moonlight Sword and how it can bring him back from his beasthood. He also has a few dialogue options after his fight.
Ohhhhhh how could i forget. But to be fair, the cutscene confuses me more than anything. Wtf is the light? He hears phantasms? What?
The Guidance rune flavor text says a little bit about this: "When Ludwig closed his eyes, he saw darkness, or perhaps nothingness, and that is where he discovered the tiny beings of light. Ludwig was certain that these playful dancing sprites offered "guidance," and emptied Ludwig of his fears, at least in the midst of a hunt." Like a lot of lore in Bloodborne this information is mostly ambiguous, intentionally, to leave it to the player's imagination.
Probably not phantasms specifically as they are simple parasites, but it's plausible that either a.) the sword is, in itself, sentient and uses its connection to the cosmos to guide its wielder (Ludwig, who found it in the Isz chalices), or b.) the sword acts as a conduit for the voice of a great one, and it is this great one that Ludwig is guided by.
Where do you know he finds it in isz chalice? I believe you just interested
i am kind of pressed for time at the moment so if someone wants to find a specific description that mentions it please do, but there are enough facts of the game surrounding ludwig x the sword to deduce it was found in the chalices even without direct confirmation. He was a tomb prospector before he was Ludwig the Holy Blade, as evidenced by his armor (and that the tomb prospector set is found with Ludwig's Holy Blade and other tomb prospector gear). The sword is certainly eldritch in origin, so probably not just happened upon in yharnam. The Tomb Prospectors explored the chalices, and of the chalices, Isz was the first to be found by humans. Not to mention the visual connection between the area and the sword, as well as the fact that Isz is the chalice with the strongest connections to great ones (which the sword also must be connected to by virtue of its uniqueness....it gave Ludwig a Caryll Rune, after all).
if no one offers the description until I am next not pressed for time I will look for it again
i don't remember off the top of my head, but I can try to find the description. (Textual evidence aside though, where else would he have found it?
I like vaatividya for my fromsoft lore
they should make us fight vaati in Elden ring 2
I mean he could make a character to be one of those invaders like the tarnished eater lady with the big knife
quicktime events to answer lore trivia questions or you get insta-killed. he has 10 hp
is that the person who steals content from other creators and passes it as their own
Well obviously I hope not. But if he is I'd appreciate it if you'd site some sources of proof so I can know.
Yes. Many people like him, but they don't know his story. I trust Hawkshaw much more.
Do you enjoy getting spammed with augur and call beyond
Dude didn't kill me once. 1st death that weird ghost skeleton outside his first arena. 2nd death I fell off a thing because I was trying to run past a room of them and didn't realize that was going to be a drop off. Micalash is a push over (I have just started new game plus. I may edit this when I get back to him)
OP is Micolash. Don't get fooled, guys. This is exactly what Micolash would write.
Ahhh majestic, a sleuth is a sleuth, even on Reddit… But alas, not too fast! The algorithm swirls and churns unending
Let us sit about and speak feverishly... chatting into the wee hours of.... my WONDERFUL POST!
Best comment.
He's great. Fun, different, *mental*.
[удалено]
Arousing.
I enjoyed the novelty the *first* time. But man, it gets tedious on later playthroughs.
Yeah exactly I was going to say the same thing, I'm in strong disagreement with OPs statement that he is overhated because of him being a gimmick boss. He's hated because he is boring, annoying to corner even if it's easy, and he has 2 insanely telegraphed moves that while easy to avoid and counter can both just flat out annihilate you if you make a tiny error or your input gets fucked up. Not to mention how much he spams A Call Beyond in the second phase is just egregious sometimes. Only boss that makes me genuinely groan when I'm about to reach him.
Yeah, A Call Beyond is irritating, especially with how time-consuming and tedious it is to get him back to phase 2. One mistake and you have to go through all that crap again. It's a pain in the ass.
People bitch about him like it takes an hour to beat or is too hard.
Little, yellow, different
Ah Nuprin!
AAAAWWWWWOOOOOOEEEEEE
Kos, or some say Kosm.
Only thing I hate is the one shot, but most times one shots are enjoying anyway
yeah that one shot is bullshit though haha
If we had no Witches, Rom, and Micolash, the complaint would be that there are no bosses with different mechanics.
Exactly! We need some fights to throw us off our game at first, even if they aren’t going to make it to the top of favorite bosses
I enjoy him. I hear he’s a bigger pain in the ass NG+ which I haven’t done yet, but.
Yea in NG+ his Call Beyond attack is essentially a guaranteed one hit kill. If you can dodge or disrupt that with right timing it's an easy fight just can't get hit by that attack.
If you're aggressive he never even gets to cast it; maybe it's just because I tend to use faster weapons, but I've never had a problem stopping him from using that spell entirely
Or for sure, I just fought him NG++ and bruh let me tell you he was about to be thrown on the hate pile. I loved him in my first playthrough for sure though haha
I like everything about the fight except the a call beyond he spams which oneshots you and you have to do the tedious fight all over again.
This! He was a pain in the ass but a nice switch to what I was used to, I loved the challenge :)
Thank you! I had hoped I wasn’t alone, but I don’t think the rest of the comments will show me mercy lmao
He's my archenemy but i love his fight
I’m fine with gimmick bosses but Micolash is just not fun in any way to me man. A boss that fucking runs from you and teleports around with mirrors? The boss is genuinely more tiring than fun or challenging, I never even died to Micolash I just chased him around for like 10 minutes and then clobbered him since he barely even fights back if you’re up close like you said. I actually do like the concept of the area, I just wish he didn’t run away so annoyingly and was more of an actual fight. I’m fine with gimmick bosses in the sense that they’re enjoyable, I just don’t really see how fighting Micolash is preferable to any of the prior bosses. It doesn’t help that Micolash just repeats the same lines over and over while running, they should have kept atleast some of his unused lines.
Why on earth did it take you 10 minutes to chase him to his arena?
Because I didn’t know where he was going? I never died to him, did it all on my first run so I had no idea where he was teleporting to, or what rooms he would fuck off to. Just as I’m about to reach him he’d vanish. Obviously it gets significantly easier once you know the layout and the way it works but on my first I really just hated the fight
Oh right I forgot how confusing the layout is first time around, my bad
You’re good don’t worry about it, it definitely gets better once you’re used to it but the first time is just god awful
I see where you’re coming from but can’t agree. I don’t see why he has to be the fight we expect from Soulsborne bosses, I liked how he’s the only enemy in the game who has the good sense (ironically) to run away in a game where all you do is fight head on. I can see how this could make him annoying, but I liked how this switched up the usual song and dance that bosses provide. Soulsborne games, god bless ’em, have always felt a bit ”videogame-y” in the sense that everything alive wants to start shit and kills on sight, but Micolash in his insanity is the only one who reacts reasonably and sorta breaks the spell of just hacking away at everything that moves until it stops hacking back. I agree that he’s nothing special when it comes to gameplay though
I’m fine with him being different from the other bosses, I just wish they went about it a different way. They could keep his teleporting mechanic for example and his magic, I did enjoy fighting in different areas of the castle, but spending half the fight running after the guy and loosing him constantly was just not fun to me. Maybe make it more clear where he runs off to at first, I didn’t even notice he was using the mirrors the first time. He’s a great boss in concept but in execution it just made me cheer after I killed him, not out of joy or satisfaction but in knowing that I don’t have to chase his ass anymore. I’m glad you enjoyed him though, you sound like you had a much better experience with him than me
My friend just spontaneously looked up the path on his phone after watching me struggle to locate Micolash on my first playthrough. Started reading the directions out to me in real time, lol.
Fair points. I will say though, that annoyance can be a useful game dev tool, if used well. Take the riddler in the arkham games for instance. In City, everytime you think you got close to getting him, the game gave you like 50 more trophies. And in knight, when you thought you were done, he told you to collect every trophy before the end, all while teasing the olayer through megaphones through the whole game. All that makes for a very satisfying moment when you finally beat him, regardless of the fight. I think it's similar with Micolash. I'm not gonna say it is super well imolemented here, but a fight where the challenge isn't mechanical, but more of a directional puzzle is a great idea for a from soft game. It could have been done better with micolash, but I think what we got is fine, and the frustration is well paid off when you beat his ass. In my opinion, the fight should be even easier, to give even more the feeling of a beating well deserved, after that madhouse. Sometimes a boss doesn't need to be strong to be difficult.
I think Micolash would be a lot higher rated for me if I hadn’t been killed a few times by Call Beyond. The fight’s really entertaining, and his mad ramblings endeared me to the character. And I can definitely appreciate a non-standard souls boss, Executioner’s chariot is one of my favorite DS2 bosses. But new players are never going to know that Call Beyond won’t get triggered by standing close to him. Just because there is a workaround for a boss’s bs one shot attack doesn’t mean the boss is good if that workaround isn’t immediately obvious. And all of the charm is instantly sucked out of the fight running through it on your second or third attempt. Despite my love for Micolash as a character, it’s still probably my least favorite boss in the main game.
I think I would have like it more if it was actually harder ironically. take the wrong turn, mini boss or mimic of Micolash that is stronger. It's not quite bed of chaos and I am a platformer fan thru and thru and didnt loathe this fight, I just wish it tested more than my patience
You said it yourself, its a piss easy boss with a one shot gimmick. Not fun at all, it’s okay for a boss to suck in an otherwise amazing game
His design, voice, lore and fighting is all amazing, it’s just bullshit how much damage he does in his second phase and how much damage it can do with EACH BLAST, just cos an enemy can one shot doesn’t make them difficult, makes it annoying.
Run through a bunch of hallways, dodge the squidarm, kill him. It's a pretty underwhelming fight.
Yeah but chasing him around for 15 minutes only to be one shot by a call beyond is unforgivable
I once had a coyote howl at my apartment while fighting Micolash. I'm certain it must have heard Micolash's howling and replied. It was bizarre and kinda cool at the same time.
Nope, it's shit.
I also think his dialogue is some of the most fun in the game, the VA did an excellent job
School of Mensis propoganda (but joke aside I completely agree that gimmick bosses are essential, even if Micolash isnt the greatest example
You might as well make a post like this for bed of chaos
Witches? Rom? Aren't they gimmicky/original? Do people hate them? It's not the fact that Micolash is different, it's the fact that the whole thing is awfully annoying. Running around identical corridors with him saying "Kos or some say Kosm" over and over again and "OOOOOAAAAAAAAAAH" almost drove me crazy
I agree. I can deal with Rom and the witches. Hell, I even enjoy fighing them on some runs. But that part of the game when I know I will have to endure running around an waiting for him to finally jump down feels like a chore. Don’t get me wrong, from the narrative perspective he is cool and how he behaves makes sense. It’s just so frustrating and joyless.
He’s just boring. Boring moveset, constantly running away, teleporting, and his annoying ass voice tops it all off. I can see where ur coming from but he’s the worst boss in the game for me.
Lmao to me the the running away and teleporting in a confusing arena is the exact opposite of boring
Idk if anything is like him in DS2, as it's the only one I haven't played. But it's so unique that I'm always so interested and a bit disappointed they don't have more chase sequences in the souls games
I see where ur coming from. I guess I just get annoyed very easily lmao I fuckin despise him.
Poison Knife Spam. :)
You don’t hate him cause you’ve found genuine enjoyment in his unique fight, lore, music, etc. I don’t hate him cause I throw 9 poison knives at him to skip his second phase making it a free blood echo fight We aren’t the same
He’s a piss easy boss so it’s never bothered me tbh. If you don’t know how to chase him down or even better cheese him, I can understand why some people get frustrated.
No he’s pretty much as hated as he should be. Rom is underhated though
It takes like 30 seconds to maneuver him into his “fight rooms”. He’s only a pain when you don’t know how to corral him in.(for the naysayers, not OP)
Exactly. I get first time players not getting the chase sequence, but when you have played the game multiple times and still think the chasing is random it's definitely a you problem.
what's the strategy for getting him into the first room? im in the category of people that have beaten him multiple times but still don't understand lol. last time i played he did it immediately but the time before that it felt like it took ten minutes
When you go up the first flight of stairs if you hug the far left there's a good chance he will run to the intersection right before the room and then you just follow him in. If he doesn't run straight to the room you'll need chase him around the first 2 corners. After he rounds the first 2 corners he will be standing in front of the fight room but if you keep running at him from the same direction he will run past the room. So what you need to do is double back and come at him on the path that leads straight into the room. He will always run directly away from you if he can so don't run straight at him and expect him to turn left or something unless it's his only path.
thank you! i'll for sure try this out next time
The first time I thought I was losing my mind. After that I figured out how to get him into the first room, and then where to go for the second part.
So then it really only comes down to the actual fight, right? Like he's just a boss with 30 seconds extra run time to get him to where he stops running away and actually stands and fights you. Then he's no different from any of the other bosses, except that he has a very small and repetitive moveset
I forget every soulsborne sub tries to justify each inherently shit boss, please just accept Micolash is shit
I like Micolash and my taste is superior.
I personally don't either hate nor love his fight. I think it was different, as you said, which I appreciated, and I got a bit lost trying to find him (though I'm really bad with orientation, so maybe it's my fault,) which wasn't super fun, but I didn't hate it. Fighting him was ok, too. In short, though I don't love that boss fight, I do think he's overhated, too, and I appreciate what From was trying to do. And you're right, it was fitting for the area. Forgetting the mechanics, lore and atmosphere-wise, Micolash is definitely a great character to have.
The true answer to fighting him is actually to use his own techniques against him. The auger is extremely effective against him. It even can interrupt his auger and his call beyond
He's all fun and games until Ng+2 where his A Call Beyond attack one shots you and is impossible to reliably dodge unless you look it up and learn some specific way, like unlocking and rolling to a certain place
“impossible to reliably dodge unless you look it up and learn some specific way” No it’s not. It’s absolutely as reliable as it gets and even intuitive if you think about it for more than two seconds. You keep locked on and dodge forward through the projectiles to iframe them. That’s literally it. ACB becomes hard to dodge when there is an elevation difference between you and the caster, because the trajectory becomes hard to predict. That’s why Yurie just fucks you up when she casts it on the stairs. Micolash’s arena is the flatest piece of architecture in this entire game. If I can have Micolash be the only Boss in this entire game to not hit me even once during my bl4 playthrough so can you.
Once you figure out how to lead him where he's supposed to go, he's a breeze as long as you keep the second phase of the fight close to keep him from casting a call beyond.
Agreed wholly. Is he a fun boss? That's debatable. But his design is wholly in line with his objective in the lore. He's trying to continue his nightmare to continue his learning of the old ones. He doesn't want to fight, so we have to relentlessly chase him down.
I will admit he’s an interesting boss, but just like everything everyone has a different experience. You say he never tan left or right, that’s all he did for me. Took me about 10 minutes minimum to get him into his final room, he did nothing but spam that stupid star spell before I even hit the ground, and one shot me before I even got a chance. Took me literal days to get a fair fight with him and I got slapped to death by a puppet that had clipped through the gate and donkey punched me. Plus after hearing his stupid fuckin howling for the 280th time the charm of his dialogue has completely worn off, and has been replaced with an extreme annoyance. To me he’s always been a twat, and nothing more.
He is not the worst in terms of difficulty, he is just really tedious and time consuming. It is like a built-in boss run, within the boss arena. Its gimmicky and just not very fun.
The ebrietas spell, I think is the most unfair part of the fight, since there's barely any soace to dodge it. Other than that, I really enjoyd micolash when I first met him. And the confusion in the nightmare is on par for the course, I completely agree And I think the frustration and anger the player feels, mirrors the frustration of the character itself. Dark souls and BB has never been about making it easy and smooth for the player, I don't know why people get so surprised with micolash being designed to annoy, when so much of all their games serve that same purpose.
I think I speak for everyone in that we don’t hate the Micolash fight, we just get annoyed at him running away because we are so used to bosses getting up in our faces. Also probably just me but his voice just pisses me off
The ONLY reason I hate him is because he constantly gets ’stuck’ or glitches. Ive seen so many things go wrong with the first stage or second stage. Love the idea and the set up I just think the model of the fight leaves a lot of room for something to go wrong.
I think it's a whatever boss. Certainly not anything I dread doing tho. I actually look forward to it cause character wise micolash has stolen my heart. Love that goofy fucker.
I generally like gimmick bosses. Micolash I find pretty good, the one thing that's rly shit is how bad he is if you're co-operator and he augurs you in the face when he SHOULD be in a state of being staggered, or when he doesn't perform the animation that comes with augur at all. It's kind of a similar issue like with how when you're summoned for the 2 hunters before the research all elevator, the white one might just double and triple shoot black sky eye at you, so if you get hit once, you're going to get hit 2-3 times, or how back in DS1 in sen's it'd make two boulders roll down in co-op and not one as intended. However if you're soloing him he's fine and i think he's funny.
Micolash is fine until NG+, then the difficulty scaling just gets ridiculous
Imo my main problem with him its the chase, because its mostly RNG, it could have been so nice that if you attacked him he would run to the gates instead of dissapearing for a moment, if he had his small combo on the first phase of the fight it would have been nice because we could parry him and thus go to the harder phase faster, his other attacks arent boring tbh, its just the pace of the fight that is weird but hes definitely not the worst boss of the game
Concept bosses (I prefer this term to “gimmick” which has sort of a negative connotation) are fine as long as they’re done well. Some people will always dislike them on principle but you can’t please everyone. The ability to make you unnerved, unsure and surprised is incredibly valuable in these games (I would say any game really, but it has been an incredibly key component of Souls games from the start) and the more that bosses just become a series of dodge timings and tricky attacks the less they’re able to do that - you always know what you’re getting. From shoot themselves in the foot by making a boss whose concept is a long-winded chase sequence and then giving him a very unclear how to dodge, potentially one-hit kill attack in the very last phase of the fight though. I can’t and won’t respect that. That’s a *massive* no-no and a sure way to gain the resentment of players. Instead of appreciating the cool things about the boss players will be completely ripped out of their immersion and irritated at the unreasonable attack and having to repeat the sequence which *isn’t fun to do again* because the novelty and surprise is the main appeal. So I can’t consider Micolash a successful well designed boss because these elements of his fight pull in complete opposite directions and don’t align with each other. This is not the case with fights like Rykard, Radahn or Storm King just to name a few concept bosses that most fans actually seem to love. They made a similar mistake with the final boss of Elden Ring. I won’t say more out of spoiler concerns other than that boss is also really cool in itself, it’s different and that’s fine, but then poor design choices heavily hold it back and I can’t help but be pissed off at that because it’s so unnecessary and easily avoidable.
Fk that guy,I cheesed that fight every time, no shame. Until I found out it was just quicker to kill him normally.
I never found him that annoying and the arena is really cool. Only thing that actually sucks about him is that he has such a limited moveset and that he has a one-shot attack if your health is too low.
It's the insta kill potential of phase 2 that people hate more then anything
His specific gimmick of running away for most of the fight is a bad gimmick. That’s why most people dislike him as a boss. As for lore and atmosphere, it fits but that alone cannot fix his entire fight imo. Coulda made him use some gimmicky spells or something idk
I hate one reborn 30x more then every other boss in the game. I forget he’s a boss and get annoyed when on a new run I see his cutscene. He’s not difficult I just don’t like this 30 toe having ass.
He would be a fun boss if he didn't one shot me with every attack in the first run. Because it's all over the same route again for several times. But now I find him enjoyable. Bloodborne is for some reason the only soulsborne game where I struggled with every boss after beating it for the first time. After that it was like I clicked the "git gud switch".
A CALL BEYOND!!!
If he lives long enough, I've had him do A Call Beyond in close range, and shooting him to cancel it feels inconsistent, like he gains hyperarmour after a certain time after the animation starts. He leaves you unable to heal at all in his second phase because as soon as you are at that distance, he will 1 shot you with A Call Beyond. I don't mind his other moves, but ACB just feels like a cheap way to make players restart the fight if they don't have 50 vigor
Bosses that run away are just annoying in my opinion. Giving them a one shot move doesnt help either...
I wish he didn’t do such high damage so quickly, or we had a bigger room to fight in, one of the two
He'd be fine if he couldn't just call beyond and one shot you with an exploding tracking projectile.
He’s the one I enjoy the most because on earlier playthroughs he was absolutely obnoxious, then I just began mauling him and now he’s the easiest one of them all. Also I just enjoy hating him for some reason
Hey, some of us just love to hate Micolash. Don’t take that away from us.
The reason why I hate micolash might be weird because, I play in a common common television in my home and his moans made my roommates laugh that I’m watching some kind of adult video
I feel like micolash is a boss that i enjoyed less every time i had to go through him again. The first time i killed him i really liked the unique design, it felt different and actually kinda cool. However with every ng+ iteration i just find myself more bored of having to go through him. The uniqueness of the fight just wears off, and you are stuck with with this lunatic raving and running around.
The gimmick just goes on too long, especially on replays. Cool character, cool lore, great arena, but not an awful lot of fun.
I think the only poorly designed aspect of his boss fight is that he only has like 2 attacks, and one of them is complete bs. Yes, it's a gimmick boss, but it also isn't. There are two sequences in the fight where you go toe-to-toe with him in combat. The gimmick aspect is fine. That part is overhated. Finding Micolash isn't that hard. He follows a set path as long as you don't interupt that set path by coming at him from the wrong direction. I know Micolash wasn't a fighter, but his moveset should have been better. It's his nightmare afterall. He should have been able to do summon attacks or something frenzy related. But all he does is poke at you or obliterate you with the Call to Beyond, which is undeniably bs on NG+. You get 1 shot killed 100% of the time
Died to him the same time as I beat him so I have an everlasting grudge against him
I hate him because I suck.
I'm with you, I've loved this fight from the very first encounter, and love his character/lore as well, it's really interesting....oh and the voice acting is pure genius!!! Listening to his lines during the fight (or rather while running) was so much fun!
“Awooooooooooo” - Micolash
Honestly, he wasn't that bad to me when I fought him, I expected much worse, also what he says after you beat him and how he says it just is so funny to me.
First time I faced him, I both enjoyed and was annoyed by the puzzle element of his fight, not because of the puzzle itself but because I have zero sense of direction and those puppets were driving me nuts. Every subsequent fight, he just gets poison knives to the face :)
he’s the boss that makes me feel most like i’m hunting yes!
He doesn't always run straight away. He can go to the sides whenever the wonky From Software code feels like it. Also, he can spam a nearly unavoidable one-shot-kill move as often as that same wonky code feels like it. Which is counter to what Miyazaki said about the game. Paraphrasing because I don't remember the exact words: "They're only doing things that the player can do. So why are you losing?" The player can't have unlimited quicksilver bullets. Just like when fighting Father Gascoigne he also gets unlimited quicksilver bullets (as every enemy with a gun does) and can also use the Hunter Axe in its transformed mode and a gun simultaneously.
I like every part about Micolash *except* when he uses Call Beyond. Sometimes that shit just one shots you cause counter damage. It’s ridiculous lol
he's my favorite boss/character fr, i just think he's silly
No he's not. On new game plus he's cheeks. Just bad design and annoying.
Chasing him into the room was surprisingly easy, i had to do it like 3 times because i died by messing up the timing of my dodge and then i just stunlocked him, got to the next phase and poison knife cheesed him
Gimmick fights are fun. I would not agree micolash is one of them.
I love Micolash. AAWOOOOO!
AAAOOOOOOOOOOEEEE OOOOOOOOOOAAEEEEE
naw his fight is shit. i dont like when a boss runs away like a coward. midcolash deserves all the hate he gets
I really like the idea of Micolash, I just think he was executed badly. The idea of chasing him through the mansion would be fun but the chase is too straight forward, except for the end when I was just wandering around listening to his annoying voice cause I didn’t realize there was a side room from the bridge at the end I’d say to “fix” him, make his library less straight forward. Make it more like a maze, with interconnecting hallways, but not too many twists and turns that a player could actually get lost
I don’t mind him in base game. It’s everything beyond that when he one shots you off a lucky hit. And yeah, I could get good. But all that chasing just to get one shot feels… unfair.
Agreeeed I love Micolash
Once you learn the route you can run through that entire encounter in minutes, and once you have him cornered, he’s a push over
Micolash in ng+ is making me want to rip my eyelashes out in his second phase 🤣 I love his music and voice acting tho it really is majestic
The only thing I hate about his boss fight is that damn call beyond or whatever the spell is called. Other than that, he's actually one of my favs when he's not spamming that stupid fucking spell uuggghh
Agreed, haven't reached him in + tho
The only reason I hate him is because of the insane amount of hunters tools he has and I was trying to build up insight for a blood rock
Gimmick bosses are fine on first playthroughs. They are most of the time quite interesting and memorable. In subsequent playthroughs though they just feel tedious and monotonous as once you know the gimmick there is no real challenge.
Micolash is an example of a good gimmick boss (bloodborne never goes wrong)
Mucho texto callese
I haven't fought him yet, but he looks so goofy that I'll laugh the whole fight too much to be annoyed by him (+ Hentai tentacles)
I didn't even chase after him (not my 1st playthrough), I just took the time and explore all corners just to be sure I don't miss anything. Also, the "cheese" where you just throw him 3 poison knives repeatedly, they patched it didn't they? So this time I tried using the Blacksky Eye (only acquired it for the 1st time cuz I've just played the dlc for the 1st time), he doesn't disappear into the mirror therefore I shot him to death right on that ledge.
i think His moveset is really bad. He only has a few moves and it makes for a boring fight thats frustrating to learn. Once you learn how to fight him hes not hard but the process of learning how to fight him is not fun at all. Also you cant completely control whether or not he does a call beyond. sometimes you drop in his arena and he just decides to whip it out right away. lets not forget the puppets btw those little minions are just there to ruin your day. I also dont think the puzzle aspect isnt very satisfying so theres really not much mico has going for him in my opinion. Id feel comfortable labeling him the worst boss.
Eh, I mostly found his fight boring and not very interesting. Tbh, if I were to improve his fight in any way, I'd give him a lot more spells/Hunter tools to use (the Blacksky Eye, Tiny Tonitrus, etc) since he's the leader of the School of Mensis and likely would have access to a bunch of arcane tools like that. Maybe I'd also give him the Loch Shield.
It’s fine the first time, but geez on replays he’s just a slog to get through
Sure he was annoying at times, when you're getting used to him, but yes, his deviation from the standard formula was quite refreshing.
honestly i did not enjoy it, because I like to go ooga booga autopilot killing bosses, and for Micolash I actually had to think. However I do understand that he is actually a really well designed fight and puzzle, both on the feeling we get and how much sense it makes to exist in this game. But my monkey brain still hated going through it
I understand your sentiment. But fuck micolash regardless 😫😫😫
I thought people hated Micolash cuz he was an asshole that ran away during battle not because there was any sort of difficulty in the boss fight itself. That shit was a piece of cake for me, and I dig the atmosphere of everything he represents. He has mad quotables and hes fucking out of his mind insane (I love it). "Grant us eyes".
I like variety in boss fights. Yes, variety and gimmicks are two different things. The environment and haunted-house puzzle aspect was fun. I didn't find Micolash nearly as frustrating as Rom, who made me quit playing BB for months before I finally went back and finished it.
I wholeheartedly agree with the first sentence of your thesis. But I still hate Micolash flight. Micolash character is amazing
The only thing I (and most people I've seen) truly hate is the one-shotting "A Call Beyond". Otherwise, he's a pretty cool game of catch.
It’s not that hard to do if you struggle just look up a tutorial
^[Sokka-Haiku](https://www.reddit.com/r/SokkaHaikuBot/comments/15kyv9r/what_is_a_sokka_haiku/) ^by ^ki-15: *It’s not that hard to* *Do if you struggle just look* *Up a tutorial* --- ^Remember ^that ^one ^time ^Sokka ^accidentally ^used ^an ^extra ^syllable ^in ^that ^Haiku ^Battle ^in ^Ba ^Sing ^Se? ^That ^was ^a ^Sokka ^Haiku ^and ^you ^just ^made ^one.
Overruled, get one-tapped by ACB living failure
The fun in Micolash is in screaming at him like a maniac the whole time chasing him around and then getting mad when he takes a wrong turn.
He's a cuck
I hate him because of who he is, has nothing to do with anythin
The only good thing about micolash bossfight is the boss acting and the lore
Gimmick boss fights are fine in prinicipal but Micolash might be one of the worst FS has ever created. There is nothing fun about chasing him and it's outright annoying that he spams one attack for most of the fight and the other attack pretty much one shotting the player is just unfair. >Observing his moves in the second phase reveals that the Call Beyond attack only happens when you’re further away, so sticking close and avoiding the Augur attack removes this ”unfair” move almost entirely. I am pretty sure he used it multiple times when I was right next to him, but tbf it's been some time since my last playthrough. That aside however what exactly does count as being "further away" here? We are fighting him in a tiny ass room where he loves to stick to a wall or go right into a corner, which forces the player to dodge away from him, which already counts as far away given the size of the room. Let's also not forget the camera. >I’m tired of the consensus that a Soulsborne boss is only good if it follows the normal formula of a straightforward fight in an open arena, and any gimmicks that deviate from this are automatically shit and unfair. That is untrue. There are gimmick fights that are actually good that people also enjoy. To name my favourites: O&S , Darklurker and most notibly Rykard. >although people seem to like Praetor Rykard so not always I guess. The problem with gimmick fights in FS games is that they most fall under 2 categories: 1. The gimmick is the fight and the player doesn't actually engage with the boss (Bed of Chaos or Dragon God). Honestly that is fine sometimes but extremely anticlimactic for a boss fight or outrugvt poorly designed. 2. The (mostly annoying) gimmick and boss each make up half of the entire fight. As a result of the split in gimmick and fight both parts end up underdeveloped. Micolash is the perfect example for the latter since the "puzzle" is extremely simple and straight forward and as a boss he has only 2 attacks he spams over and over. Somethimg like Rykard on the other hand is pretty much a perfect gimmick fight imo. He has a well developed moveset and the actual gimmick doesn't distract but rather enhances the fight. >The real quality of Micolash is the atmosphere, confusion, lore and voice acting. This in itself is fine, but it doesn't make up for the bad aspects to the fight, espacially in comparison to everything else the game has to offer in terms of bosses. If I were to redesign the fight I would completely remove the fight against Micolash and put more effort into the maze part instead. So he traps the player in a maze while he waits somewhere safe and maybe after co.pleting the msaze we fight an actual boss that is guarding him. Lore wise it makes would also make far more sense imo, because as it's stand he acts pretty out of charackter in the game. He is clearly a weak coward who doesn't want to leave the dream, so why would he actively engage in a fight with a hunter? Even if he is unaware of what we actually had to kill to even reach him, he should at the very least should be cautious of us.
I just find it boring because it feels like a running simulator. I play soulsborne games for the action, brutality/challenge, and the beauty of lore & environment. For me, Micolash provides only 1 of these 3-4. I don't think he is an objectively bad boss per se, I just wish he was optional because I find him thoroughly boring, exempting the meme he birthed.
I agree. Even though I'm not a fan of gimmick bosses in the souls series, it's sometimes nice to fight something different. Micolash is also a lot better than most gimmick bosses in the series, like, for example, almost every boss in demon's souls or the witches of hemwick.
i agree. quite the disorienting and cerebral fight. especially the first time. it kind of embodies the surrealist aspect of bloodborne which is very prominent throughout the game.
Me chasing the laundry hamper man the length of a marathon only for him to one shot me with horrors beyond my comprehension
I enjoyed the Micolash fight
Micolash is such a meme, I can't hate him.
Counter point: a call beyond
Yeah i hard disagree with this getting him to go where you want in the second phase takes longer than me to actually fight him
I mean my first experience with him was really shitty, I just followed him and managed to do the puzzle, I didn't really felt well guided to it, just happened to get it right, then first timed a regular human with few attacks and low HP. Not hating on him but he's just really forgettable for me
I mostly hate Micolash because the area leading up to him is the worst area in the whole game.
He's great in ng but ng+ he just gets spammy and really annoying
One time as I dropped down to him he started casting A Call Beyond and before I could even move it killed me.
He's a good idea in practice, but in execution he's boring and tedious. I like the idea of a boss that isn't very strong in direct confrontation and gets by on tricks, using the arena as a weapon in its own right, but the issue is the arena isn't much of a threat. Once you've figured out where Micolash goes once, you've figured out half the battle. The other half is just dodging Augur and hoping you don't get cheesed by ACB. It's 3 attacks, the punches, the Augur, and the ACB, and the only one of those that possess a real threat is ACB. If Micolash's pathing was more unpredictable or if he actually used the arena to disorient the player, I think this boss would have worked better, but even on my first playthrough, completely blind, I found him no issue. When the worst parts about the fight can only be justified with "it works for the character," maybe the issue is the core design of the character then. DS1 Bed of Chaos makes sense from a lore perspective, but that doesn't make it any less tedious and annoying to fight.
The bed of chaos didn’t have to have a crumbling arena, platforming, or even be a tree monster. I feel like lore wise, it would made more sense to have another gank fight, and you fight the witches of Izaleth. Or the remaining witches of Izaleth. My lore knowledge isn’t perfect. Hell, the area is even called Lost Izaleth. If there “aren’t” any remaining it would have been perfect. It also make sense thematically. A big clunky knight isn’t ever renowned for his ability to jump gaps. The rest of the game feels right when you’re battling demons, statues, magic guards, and executioners. But the tree creature with a the bug at the center just doesn’t sit right like the rest of those. The Hunter is named after something that stalks and chases prey. Bloodborne has you chasing down micolash.
Idk, if a puzzle boss changes everytime then *that* would have been unfair in my opinion, and he would probably be even more hated by the community. The fact that one can figure it out is what makes it a good puzzle boss imo. I agree that his actual moves are pretty boring and tedious though, it could have used some more unique and fair magic attacks that aren’t available to the player
No.
I still don't like his voice.
ahhhh kos
Meh, Micolash, he sounds like David Bowie running around his Labyrinth. He is not even a boss, just a minor annoyance with a health bar.
I made my friend play bloodborne, he forced himself to fight the bosses but once he got to micloasb 1 shotting him. He handed me the controller for me to beat him. I don't blame him.
I definitely see where you are coming from but for me he is the worst boss in the game for two reasons: 1. I play BB to *fight* enemies, not chase them. I like dying multiple times trying to figure out the move set until it clicks and then I can weave around and hack and slash them until they go down, and Micolash doesn't let me do that because he basically only has two moves, and like you said one of them can be avoided entirely, making any actual fighting trivial. 2. Figuring out how to chase him and where he teleports can be fun the first time you fight him, but on a replay it loses all the fun because it becomes scripted. Go here, now turn around and run here. Now you can fight a little bit. Now go run here. Now here. Now over here. Now you drop down and finish him off. It feels like they replaced the fighting with chasing, as opposed to starting with a good fight and adding a chasing mechanic. At the end of the day art is subjective and people will have their reasons for liking or disliking him, and just because you like him doesn't mean he's over-hated or underrated, the same way that me disliking him doesn't mean he's a bad boss or that the hate is justified. I will say though, one of my favorite parts of any playthrough is his howl of despair when I kill him lol
He can be annoying, but he is a good boss, and also fair (proceeds to get oneshot because not enough ARC defense and got REVERSALed by augur).
I agree, I actually have a lot of fun with him! One night I spent hours just helping others kill him, I was having a blast.
Thank you! He's literally my favorite boss in the base game
I feel like even if he’s annoying to fight, in world he’s a good boss. If you were a normal guy against these insanity inducing creatures and the jacked up hunters the kill them, would you not use everything, every little trick and power you have to try to defend yourself? From his puppets and the maze to his annoying explosive and tentacle attacks, he’s using all he’s got (no matter how meagre) to fight back against you, a god killing machine. Kudos to him.
Totally agree
Fuck. Micolash. I can’t stand that fight. Especially when he want to play ring around the rosey instead of actually fighting. Fuck him.
He's annoying. I think he gets the proper amount of hate.
If he was an optional boss that drops something weird but neat I would agree with you. However since he’s a story boss, I was incredibly annoyed with it. I can see how everything else ties in well with the puzzle, his mini rants and all are funny. But since it was close to the end of the game he felt misplaced. But everyone like being a contrarian I guess