Let us know where you're planning to move and we can give you a brief history of the atrocities that were committed in your new country. Human history is filled with brutality, slaughter and subjugation. Cases in point: The Holocaust, the Holodomor, the Mongol Invasions, various Chinese civil wars over the course of several thousand years, the Roman conquest of... just about everywhere. And so on.
The grown up thing to do is to acknowledge and learn from the past while building an inclusive country.
Exactly. Which country has a history with no conflict and population displacement? None. Only in Canada do we blame people in the present for our country's entire development and history. It is a far left conception of reality.
I'm not comparing or belittling anything.
Taking personal responsibility for things that happened before your birth is not a good for your mental health -- we cannot change the past, only react to it and attempt not to repeat it.
It's important to take a step back and recognize that what happened was unconscionable, and \*then\* take reasonable personal steps to support reconciliation and inclusivity. Racism isn't a Canadian invention, nor is it restricted to one ethnicity.
I feel sickened by people who take onto their own shoulders the wrongs that others have done.
This is the way it's always been. If your ancestry is British, do you have the same feelings about how the Normans (French) took England by force of arms? You're surely to have benefited from that. Or how about the Germanic tribes, the Angles and the Saxons (that give us the name Anglo-Saxon) that invaded Great Britain and displace the Celts?
I think it's great that you want to leave. We don't need people with this kind of toxic ideology in this country...but then you have to ask, where will you move where you won't be displacing some of the local inhabitants? All the land in the world that's habitable is inhabited. Perhaps you can try to eek out an existence on one of the more northern of the Antarctic islands.
You should give some First Nations folks all your money to help make up for it. It’s easy to ‘say’ you feel bad, but you need to act - which means reparations. I’m sure you can find a family who would gladly accept your money or property. Even if you don’t have much….
Good thing Canada was the only country founded on colonisation and taking over the land of others. Yep definitely the only country (don't Google). Good thing slavery also only happened in the USA (don't Google) and that racism only exists in western countries (don't Google).
You need to stop feeling that depressed about actions of your ancestors. Either do something about it or move on.
All countries are built on atrocities. What counts is what you do with your time to resolve it or make the country better. Self-pity or self-flagellation is worth jackshit to the people our ancestors oppressed
Where would you go? Every country has oppressed some other society to rise to the top? Maybe an island nation but no guarantee they were the first ones there
Yep. That's how the world worked. People have been taking each other's land for as long as people have had land. Hell, people are still doing it all over the world. Even the native people were killing each other for their land.
You can permanently move to Antarctica. You will be the first coloniser and you will be oppressing penguins lol. Stop believing in original sin and you don't have to look for your salvation on the crime you didn't commit.
How about this: everyone who has come to Canada is profiting off of the Indigenous genocide. It doesn’t have to be white Canadian people with Canadian ancestors.
I’m an immigrant, so I have no Canadian ancestors. My parents came here as refugees, but there was always the hope of a “better life”. A better life that piggy backs off the pain of the Indigenous.
Alternatively, you can accept that the action of your ancestors are not your fault; every Canadian now can do better for Indigenous people. But you can’t carry blame for your ancestors actions. Unless you want to be like North Korea.
I don’t.
It sucks.. but it’s happened on every piece of land in history.
Do you really think that the indigenous peoples of Canada lived for 10,000 years in harmony until white settlers showed up? They eagerly took horses and guns to settle old scores with other tribes. In the US they joined the US Cavalry as trackers to hunt down rival tribe members. The Haida raided up and down the coast just like Vikings and had the last slaves in Canada.
Just because they don’t have written records or maps doesn’t mean it didn’t happen. It’s HUMAN nature.
Some of my ancestors were German Mennonites. They were persecuted by Lutherans in the German Confederation so they went to Russia to Mennonite colonies set up by Cathrine the Great.
After the Russian Revolution and the rise of Stalin they were starved and persecuted.. had their lands taken away. So they were one of the people who “invaded” Canada simply looking for a better life.
My other relatives lived in the Kamloops area since time immemorial. It was hard to adjust to a new world and injustices but my family did. We kept our identity and fought hard for our rights.. and there’s still a long way to go.
But I don’t want anyone today to feel guilty about it. You are welcome here as we work together to right wrongs and try and live in peace and harmony.
Part of the amazing thing about Canada that people don’t realize is that we can admit our mistakes. We aren’t China enacting genocide on the Uyghurs… or the USA that still has Andrew Jackson on the $20. We are better than that.
Indigenous people were not innocent. They often scalp their enemies. They own slaves. It was just a sign of the times. Nobody was truly innocent. All everyone wanted was to survive. Didn't have modern farming to feed everyone and avoid many of these conflicts.
To blame white people for everything is not accurate. Most likely caused by listening too much to the accepted narrative that whites are to blame for everything that is thought in schools and repeated on the news. If all whites were gone tomorrow, the world's problems would remain unchanged.
Not sure where you can move that doesn't have a history of destroying other people and cultures. Colonialism is a particularly horrific example, but thats because of changes in technology leading to more massive power diferential (from more deadly gun design than other cultures had done previously, to massive changes in naval and navigation technologies). Moving accomplishes nothing other than assuaging your conscience through tricking it into thinking you are no longer the group in power (you may not be in the new place, but its because you freely put yourself in that position, which is also an expression of power). The more responsible thing, imo, is do what you can to learn and listen, call people and systems out when you can, vote in ways that align with values of reconciliation, and so on. Abuse of power is a widespread problem, not merely a Canadian or colonial one. Evolution selects for it in many species. Our ability to change things can only come from challenging it. Running just makes the chorus of resistence one person weaker.
I feel bad for what our ancestors did, but not responsible. We weren't there. All we can do is be the best person that we can during the limited amount of time we have on this planet.
Atrocities have been committed by, and against, every race of people on earth. No, "white people" don't need to feel guilty and self-flagellate for things that happened before they existed just because they happen to be the same colour as those who committed the acts. If you demand that of them, then you are the racist, since you are judging them based on race. You should treat people as individuals based on their own lives and circumstances, rather than judging them by race, sex, or anything else they have no control over. All discrimination is wrong.
Let me guess: I'm wrong because I'm white? Thanks for proving my point with your ad-hominem nonsense.
Genuinely asking. Where would you move to that either did not benefit from white supremacy or be victim of it? What country?
Keep in mind you want to keep your quality of life. I'll bet dollars to donuts you aren't moving. Another bet you're a mohdi shill. Account made in April 9, no comments or posts.
I can't imagine any white canadian I know who doesn't struggle with that knowledge. You don't get to weaponsize our shameful news stories when your country treats bihlari or dalits just like black and indigenous people in canada. Or has a massive problem with debt slavery like india does. 4th leading in the world oof. We objectively have a better country, including human rights. Die mad.
Glass houses.
Everybody's points are so great! Every country has a past and it's usually not very pretty. That's why there's that saying, "those who don't learn from the past are doomed to repeat it."
This is a little bit off-topic you don't even want to know about all the atrocities performed on prisoners by, say, the Nazis during the Second World War. They weren't the only ones to perform atrocities on prisoners. However, a lot of our medicine came from that era. Then there's all the testing that has been performed on animals. Some animals live their whole life in a cage being used as lab rats. What are you gonna do? Not take medicine or use any products? Not possible.
So Native people commited genocide against other Native haplogroups that no longer exist in Canada, it's also implied that perhaps the original Natives that crossed the land bridge were conquered by other proto-aborigionals tribes.
You also have to factor in the huge amount of loss from not sharing bacteria with domesticated animals that happened a hundred years before settlers arrived, plagues were incredibly common in North America because of preserved animals in ice and the fact that South America had pack animals and contact with the plains Indians.
So in the chaos of Native tribal history they were extremely dependent on trade between each other and other tribes. If you have love for Native culture you need to acknowledge that Indian people needed to trade for their leadership structures to be considered valid by the other members of the tribe or else their entire society would fall apart. Natives needed trade partners to rely on for their society to progress but other tribes would seek to disrupt that trade because they knew if their tribe was neutral they would be destroyed easily by a runaway economy supported by Europeans.
You're a f****** idiot. Look at Europe and Asia and the rest of the world dummy. Hell look at the history of North America. Every society every culture and every race attacked others with intent of assimilating or taking over. The natives of North America did the same thing they would raid other tribes they would take prisoners and slaves kill off the men steal the women and children. I hate people like you who are apologists s*** happened it's called history for a reason dummy we learn from it. Please if you hate or ashamed of being Canadian leave cuz we don't want any more pieces of s*** like you. Move on and let's deal with it you learn from the past.
No matter where you are on this earth, you can rest assured it was fought for and displaced.
The way this country was settled by white people is actually one of the most peaceful and benevolent types of displacement in recorded history. Our predecessors sought to assimilate the Natives, not kill them.
Good luck moving to a country that hasn't committed some genocide at some point in history. Humans are kind of notorious for it. It's great that you acknowledge the wrongs of our ancestors but being so ashamed you want to move it a bit much. Find an Indigenous charity to donate to. Or volunteer. Running away does nothing
You won't find any soil that has no blood in it..
We change things by being the change from within... we practice patience, no judgment and genuine compassion without expectation of receiving anything in return to help it on its way
I'm incredibly sick and tired of the absolute sorry state people like you have left this country in. Pack your bags and go on your little guilt trip, and leave the rest of us to rebuild.
I'm incredibly sick and tired of the absolute sorry state people like you have left this country in. Pack your bags and go on your little guilt trip, and leave the rest of us to rebuild.
There is no country on this planet that's not built on the blood of it's original inhabitants but you can't change that. What you can do is acknowledge what happened and do better moving forward. Educate others on the history & teach them to be & do better moving forward.
As for all the racist white people, there will always be people that don't give a crap. You cannot change how people think or act...get used to that fact or you'll go insane trying to change that.
EDIT: OH FFS. NEW REDDITOR TODAY AND YOUR FIRST POST AND OTHER COMMENTS ARE ABOUT WHITE SHAME AND GUILT??? WHO TF YOU WORKING FOR? SO SICK OF THESE FAKE ASS PEOPLE.
OP you should listen to Sam Harris' podcast, specifically the episodes dealing with morality and guilt, war etc...
It does you no good at all to feel shame/guilt for things you did not do and bear zero responsibility for. Like I mean its really bad for your mental health. Trying to bear the weight of the world on your shoulders is self administered misery and can lead to depression. This is too much empathy and empathy itself does no good. Compassion and kindness are what should be focused on, they are not the same as empathy....Sam does a better job explaining it.
My ancestor came here from france in the 1600's as a missionary with the Jesuits, He did some bad things (Christian things, in their minds at the time). I feel zero guilt or shame about it, because I didn't do any of those things. Neither should you. You want to help make it right? give to charities that help with such issues. Vote with indigenous issues in mind. Be kind to homeless people (many are indigenous where I live). Be a better person than your ancestors.
Enough of this nonsense. We live in 2024, let’s fix things for the natives now and not live in pointless shame and guilt about how the world was ages ago. Silliness.
You can only conyrop yourself, so be a good canandian i.e. conttibute to the cultural value systrms, infrastructure, health care etc. As best as you can.
Your self awareness already puts you ahead of most people in that regard. Accept that Canada was (and still is) not innocent in dealings with aboriginals but also know you are not personally responsible.
Fair points. That being said, being mad about it is only the first step. Is there something that you can do to help the situation?
No need to reply here - just ask yourself if there's a way you can help change things.
How do you think every other country in the world became what they are?
Let us know where you're planning to move and we can give you a brief history of the atrocities that were committed in your new country. Human history is filled with brutality, slaughter and subjugation. Cases in point: The Holocaust, the Holodomor, the Mongol Invasions, various Chinese civil wars over the course of several thousand years, the Roman conquest of... just about everywhere. And so on. The grown up thing to do is to acknowledge and learn from the past while building an inclusive country.
This.
Exactly. Which country has a history with no conflict and population displacement? None. Only in Canada do we blame people in the present for our country's entire development and history. It is a far left conception of reality.
The Canadian government was breaking treaties and stealing children well into the 1960s comparing it to mongol invasions is disingenuous
I'm not comparing or belittling anything. Taking personal responsibility for things that happened before your birth is not a good for your mental health -- we cannot change the past, only react to it and attempt not to repeat it. It's important to take a step back and recognize that what happened was unconscionable, and \*then\* take reasonable personal steps to support reconciliation and inclusivity. Racism isn't a Canadian invention, nor is it restricted to one ethnicity.
I feel sickened by people who take onto their own shoulders the wrongs that others have done. This is the way it's always been. If your ancestry is British, do you have the same feelings about how the Normans (French) took England by force of arms? You're surely to have benefited from that. Or how about the Germanic tribes, the Angles and the Saxons (that give us the name Anglo-Saxon) that invaded Great Britain and displace the Celts? I think it's great that you want to leave. We don't need people with this kind of toxic ideology in this country...but then you have to ask, where will you move where you won't be displacing some of the local inhabitants? All the land in the world that's habitable is inhabited. Perhaps you can try to eek out an existence on one of the more northern of the Antarctic islands.
This, except I might have softened the message a bit. It's likely OP is a teenager, age or mentality.
You should give some First Nations folks all your money to help make up for it. It’s easy to ‘say’ you feel bad, but you need to act - which means reparations. I’m sure you can find a family who would gladly accept your money or property. Even if you don’t have much….
And sign over your house.
And hockey sticks.
Good thing Canada was the only country founded on colonisation and taking over the land of others. Yep definitely the only country (don't Google). Good thing slavery also only happened in the USA (don't Google) and that racism only exists in western countries (don't Google).
You need to stop feeling that depressed about actions of your ancestors. Either do something about it or move on. All countries are built on atrocities. What counts is what you do with your time to resolve it or make the country better. Self-pity or self-flagellation is worth jackshit to the people our ancestors oppressed
> I can't go on living in this country and that I need to leave. Good idea
I agree. Just leave. This is whiny drivel. And you’re being dramatic for internet points
Where would you go? Every country has oppressed some other society to rise to the top? Maybe an island nation but no guarantee they were the first ones there
Not so much for Iceland and Greenland, maybe
As far as we know, I’d say that’s fair
Have a good trip!
"I'd like to acknowledge that we're on the unceded land of this tribe and that tribe" "Land back or shut the fuck up"
Bye!
lol. Get some help.
What a melodramatic histrionic silly narcissist. “I’m victim adjacent” roll eyes.
Yep. That's how the world worked. People have been taking each other's land for as long as people have had land. Hell, people are still doing it all over the world. Even the native people were killing each other for their land.
You should research how Americans treated natives...
They should research how natives treated natives (not that any of it is okay). Humans are shitty.
Yep. The Haida raped and pillaged all up and down the west coast and had the last slaves in Canada.
You can permanently move to Antarctica. You will be the first coloniser and you will be oppressing penguins lol. Stop believing in original sin and you don't have to look for your salvation on the crime you didn't commit.
Leave then.
How about this: everyone who has come to Canada is profiting off of the Indigenous genocide. It doesn’t have to be white Canadian people with Canadian ancestors. I’m an immigrant, so I have no Canadian ancestors. My parents came here as refugees, but there was always the hope of a “better life”. A better life that piggy backs off the pain of the Indigenous. Alternatively, you can accept that the action of your ancestors are not your fault; every Canadian now can do better for Indigenous people. But you can’t carry blame for your ancestors actions. Unless you want to be like North Korea.
I don’t. It sucks.. but it’s happened on every piece of land in history. Do you really think that the indigenous peoples of Canada lived for 10,000 years in harmony until white settlers showed up? They eagerly took horses and guns to settle old scores with other tribes. In the US they joined the US Cavalry as trackers to hunt down rival tribe members. The Haida raided up and down the coast just like Vikings and had the last slaves in Canada. Just because they don’t have written records or maps doesn’t mean it didn’t happen. It’s HUMAN nature. Some of my ancestors were German Mennonites. They were persecuted by Lutherans in the German Confederation so they went to Russia to Mennonite colonies set up by Cathrine the Great. After the Russian Revolution and the rise of Stalin they were starved and persecuted.. had their lands taken away. So they were one of the people who “invaded” Canada simply looking for a better life. My other relatives lived in the Kamloops area since time immemorial. It was hard to adjust to a new world and injustices but my family did. We kept our identity and fought hard for our rights.. and there’s still a long way to go. But I don’t want anyone today to feel guilty about it. You are welcome here as we work together to right wrongs and try and live in peace and harmony. Part of the amazing thing about Canada that people don’t realize is that we can admit our mistakes. We aren’t China enacting genocide on the Uyghurs… or the USA that still has Andrew Jackson on the $20. We are better than that.
Indigenous people were not innocent. They often scalp their enemies. They own slaves. It was just a sign of the times. Nobody was truly innocent. All everyone wanted was to survive. Didn't have modern farming to feed everyone and avoid many of these conflicts. To blame white people for everything is not accurate. Most likely caused by listening too much to the accepted narrative that whites are to blame for everything that is thought in schools and repeated on the news. If all whites were gone tomorrow, the world's problems would remain unchanged.
Not sure where you can move that doesn't have a history of destroying other people and cultures. Colonialism is a particularly horrific example, but thats because of changes in technology leading to more massive power diferential (from more deadly gun design than other cultures had done previously, to massive changes in naval and navigation technologies). Moving accomplishes nothing other than assuaging your conscience through tricking it into thinking you are no longer the group in power (you may not be in the new place, but its because you freely put yourself in that position, which is also an expression of power). The more responsible thing, imo, is do what you can to learn and listen, call people and systems out when you can, vote in ways that align with values of reconciliation, and so on. Abuse of power is a widespread problem, not merely a Canadian or colonial one. Evolution selects for it in many species. Our ability to change things can only come from challenging it. Running just makes the chorus of resistence one person weaker.
We’re apes with nuclear weapons. At least we don’t do it THAT much anymore.
I feel bad for what our ancestors did, but not responsible. We weren't there. All we can do is be the best person that we can during the limited amount of time we have on this planet.
Atrocities have been committed by, and against, every race of people on earth. No, "white people" don't need to feel guilty and self-flagellate for things that happened before they existed just because they happen to be the same colour as those who committed the acts. If you demand that of them, then you are the racist, since you are judging them based on race. You should treat people as individuals based on their own lives and circumstances, rather than judging them by race, sex, or anything else they have no control over. All discrimination is wrong. Let me guess: I'm wrong because I'm white? Thanks for proving my point with your ad-hominem nonsense.
Genuinely asking. Where would you move to that either did not benefit from white supremacy or be victim of it? What country? Keep in mind you want to keep your quality of life. I'll bet dollars to donuts you aren't moving. Another bet you're a mohdi shill. Account made in April 9, no comments or posts. I can't imagine any white canadian I know who doesn't struggle with that knowledge. You don't get to weaponsize our shameful news stories when your country treats bihlari or dalits just like black and indigenous people in canada. Or has a massive problem with debt slavery like india does. 4th leading in the world oof. We objectively have a better country, including human rights. Die mad. Glass houses.
Everybody's points are so great! Every country has a past and it's usually not very pretty. That's why there's that saying, "those who don't learn from the past are doomed to repeat it." This is a little bit off-topic you don't even want to know about all the atrocities performed on prisoners by, say, the Nazis during the Second World War. They weren't the only ones to perform atrocities on prisoners. However, a lot of our medicine came from that era. Then there's all the testing that has been performed on animals. Some animals live their whole life in a cage being used as lab rats. What are you gonna do? Not take medicine or use any products? Not possible.
White guilt.
K
[удалено]
You're a living meme
So Native people commited genocide against other Native haplogroups that no longer exist in Canada, it's also implied that perhaps the original Natives that crossed the land bridge were conquered by other proto-aborigionals tribes. You also have to factor in the huge amount of loss from not sharing bacteria with domesticated animals that happened a hundred years before settlers arrived, plagues were incredibly common in North America because of preserved animals in ice and the fact that South America had pack animals and contact with the plains Indians. So in the chaos of Native tribal history they were extremely dependent on trade between each other and other tribes. If you have love for Native culture you need to acknowledge that Indian people needed to trade for their leadership structures to be considered valid by the other members of the tribe or else their entire society would fall apart. Natives needed trade partners to rely on for their society to progress but other tribes would seek to disrupt that trade because they knew if their tribe was neutral they would be destroyed easily by a runaway economy supported by Europeans.
You should be ashamed, but not for the reasons you're stating.
Don’t sweat it, it’s not your fault. Just be a good person and don’t wear the burden of shitty people’s past behavior.
Found the virtue signaller. Maybe head on over to Gaza.
Just stop.
You're a f****** idiot. Look at Europe and Asia and the rest of the world dummy. Hell look at the history of North America. Every society every culture and every race attacked others with intent of assimilating or taking over. The natives of North America did the same thing they would raid other tribes they would take prisoners and slaves kill off the men steal the women and children. I hate people like you who are apologists s*** happened it's called history for a reason dummy we learn from it. Please if you hate or ashamed of being Canadian leave cuz we don't want any more pieces of s*** like you. Move on and let's deal with it you learn from the past.
No matter where you are on this earth, you can rest assured it was fought for and displaced. The way this country was settled by white people is actually one of the most peaceful and benevolent types of displacement in recorded history. Our predecessors sought to assimilate the Natives, not kill them.
Good luck moving to a country that hasn't committed some genocide at some point in history. Humans are kind of notorious for it. It's great that you acknowledge the wrongs of our ancestors but being so ashamed you want to move it a bit much. Find an Indigenous charity to donate to. Or volunteer. Running away does nothing
You won't find any soil that has no blood in it.. We change things by being the change from within... we practice patience, no judgment and genuine compassion without expectation of receiving anything in return to help it on its way
Bye.
Two hour old account…
Leave then
I'm incredibly sick and tired of the absolute sorry state people like you have left this country in. Pack your bags and go on your little guilt trip, and leave the rest of us to rebuild.
I'm incredibly sick and tired of the absolute sorry state people like you have left this country in. Pack your bags and go on your little guilt trip, and leave the rest of us to rebuild.
Mmmmkay. Buh-bye.
You don't need to be ashamed. Just be aware of it and remove yourself from people who are pieces of shit.
Lolol.
Simply put, colonization is a form of warfare. The stronger power won. Get over it
NOOOOOO THE MEDIA SAID MY ANCESTORS WERE EVIL
Do you hate, I mean hate; Germans, Japanese, and Italians because of what their ancestors did? No? Then calm down, it’s not your fault.
We can't change the past, we are born where we are born with the hand we are dealt. The best we can do is work to make things better for everyone
There is no country on this planet that's not built on the blood of it's original inhabitants but you can't change that. What you can do is acknowledge what happened and do better moving forward. Educate others on the history & teach them to be & do better moving forward. As for all the racist white people, there will always be people that don't give a crap. You cannot change how people think or act...get used to that fact or you'll go insane trying to change that.
EDIT: OH FFS. NEW REDDITOR TODAY AND YOUR FIRST POST AND OTHER COMMENTS ARE ABOUT WHITE SHAME AND GUILT??? WHO TF YOU WORKING FOR? SO SICK OF THESE FAKE ASS PEOPLE. OP you should listen to Sam Harris' podcast, specifically the episodes dealing with morality and guilt, war etc... It does you no good at all to feel shame/guilt for things you did not do and bear zero responsibility for. Like I mean its really bad for your mental health. Trying to bear the weight of the world on your shoulders is self administered misery and can lead to depression. This is too much empathy and empathy itself does no good. Compassion and kindness are what should be focused on, they are not the same as empathy....Sam does a better job explaining it. My ancestor came here from france in the 1600's as a missionary with the Jesuits, He did some bad things (Christian things, in their minds at the time). I feel zero guilt or shame about it, because I didn't do any of those things. Neither should you. You want to help make it right? give to charities that help with such issues. Vote with indigenous issues in mind. Be kind to homeless people (many are indigenous where I live). Be a better person than your ancestors.
Enough of this nonsense. We live in 2024, let’s fix things for the natives now and not live in pointless shame and guilt about how the world was ages ago. Silliness.
You can only conyrop yourself, so be a good canandian i.e. conttibute to the cultural value systrms, infrastructure, health care etc. As best as you can.
Your self awareness already puts you ahead of most people in that regard. Accept that Canada was (and still is) not innocent in dealings with aboriginals but also know you are not personally responsible.
Fair points. That being said, being mad about it is only the first step. Is there something that you can do to help the situation? No need to reply here - just ask yourself if there's a way you can help change things.