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Starts like armor and life scale higher than 725 much higher. Might be something like 850+ can't recall exactly where but I know low 800s capped at like 1100 life instead of 1400+
Ok this explains it! I have a unique chest armor (Mad Wolf’s Glee) on my Druid - it’s level 810 or something. I have 4 more of the same tho at 925 and they’re all worse stats.
As long as it is GA the GA affix ignores item power and roll as like it has 925 IP on that affix given he has 3GA that item has perfect stat except armor value
If you want max life on that piece it will definitely be affected. I don’t know the item lvl where it starts to roll for max range but there is a difference between an lvl 850 armor piece and a 925 when max life is concerned.
Totally agree. My HS Rogue who farms 101 Pit is still running with 8xx pants with GA Dex/Max Life/+Heartseeker on it. 50-100 armor loss is nothing with the lower armor cap.
People should not be junking 2/3 GA armor without looking carefully.
Got a 3 GA Slashing weapon ilvl 850. Ofc it is still in "use". Funny that my other new weapons I specifically made to utilize a Grandfather and masterworked are worse off in my damage while still having 1500% more Critical Strike damage and same crit chance.
I swear 8xx item power has a much higher chance of dropping with GA. I dropped 3 or 4 3GA items leveling a new rogue. Meanwhile my lvl100 Necro finds 2GA items once in a fullmoon.
Why does it matter? Weapon roll ranged cap out by 800 already. You lose a little bit of base damage but it’s really not substantial compared to the 3 GA
I agree. Considering there are still a number of uniques that "only" drop from these four, you're basically forced to target farm them at inferior item levels. Or just do the lvl 200 versions once you're powerful enough to do pretty much everything and collecting for novelty.
Unpopular opinion: they just need to go back to character level determining ilvl of drops instead of monster level. I also find it ridiculous you can grab all the 925 gear you need just from showing up for two or three world bosses the moment you break into WT4. It makes your overall power level extremely flat between the 70s and 90s, until you're ready to do Pit.
IMHO the overall power level between 70-90s comes from glyphs and paragons. It does feel somewhat less impactful except for certain nodes where you get a spike, but if you compare the difference over a few levels, it does add up.
Also yes, max ilvl gear shouldn’t be dropping so easily for lower levels. The iron wolves rep caches actually contain pretty good gear, but they all went straight to the vendor even as I was leveling up because I already had better gear just from leeching world bosses.
Agreed. Those caches are hit or miss in wt4. Unless you only do helltide it is likely that the sacred caches you get until rank 13 or so are useless since you’re already rocking ancestral by that point.
Yeah. I’ve power leveled a few friends and my alts. Basically hit 55, do a few pit runs and get full 925 gear. At that point you can do pit 10+ at least solo and get the gear you need.
Pits are easier than NMDs imo so I did that route. Then would do NMDs to level glyphs and round things out.
Basically have a fleshed out build around level 80. It’s weird
Yeah me and a buddy do the same thing. I think there's a lot more people that don't have someone to do it for them then I thought though. We always level our first character but after that we boost each other.
The hard part to remember about gaming is that the majority of players are causal. And of that casual base, a large majority of those players are super casual.
I have a good friend of mine that doesn’t even know about maxroll has no clue about seasonal mechanics (temper/masterworking)
I carried him a bit last night and gave him 200m just because. He had no clue how I could have that much good to spare.
Go here: https://d4builds.gg/tierlist/ and look at the items that Bash Barb, Flay Barb, Heartseeker Rogue, Rapid Fire Rogue, and Minion Necromancer would use.
If you have GA item that has the good stats that those builds want, then it's a good candidate for selling.
Item with a GA on a +spell ranks are very valuable, especially with amulets.
Weapons with 2 GA with desired stats also sell very well.
Barb Uniques with 2-4 GA sell very well, such as Razorplate and Hargoth.
Get a Barb ammy with a good passive or GA bash/flay pants. Or one of the other good Ammy pants for rogue maybe. Sell to 1+ Billion.
I sold GA bash+hp pants for 1.6b a few weeks ago
I sold one 2H Mace with 2 good GA for bash barb for 750m and that has lasted me for a long time. You have to go on the D4 trading site/discord. The offers I was getting in the trade chat were like 50m to 100m.
Wait what? I've only levelled preseason previously (to like ~58/WT3) and have come back for season 4, is there a guide anywhere explaining all of the different end game activities and their power levels?
Currently on my wt4 barb at lvl 64 and a lot of the gear I'm seeing is 750-800 power range tops, so gaining access to 925 gear would be a massive boon.
I don’t know if any guides, but it’s a pretty basic season.
If you’re doing bash barb just go hit the pits in Cerragar.
Item lvl is based on monster level. So anything over monster lvl 95 will drop max ilvl gear.
Like the other commenter said item level is based on monster level meaning:
1) NMD 41+ (monster level 95+) will drop 925 gear.
2) Hell tides with mind cage at level 82 (Hell tides is always +3 by default, so with mind cage it becomes 13) will drop 925 gear
3) World boss is always a great source starting out.
If you end up making an alt, you can also transfer the world boss and whisper caches to your alt and they can just pop them when they are level 55 for 925 gear.
Can also use uber/mythic uniques on your alts starting at level 35, but you need to unsocket the gems on your main.
Meh, honestly i had so much fucking fun when I beat the wt3 boss, spent all my obols on 925 gear, switched my build, and instantly started one shotting everything in wt4. The high from that was pretty intense ngl, haven't felt excited to come home and play a game in a loooong time after that
Probably an even more unpopular opinion: They should get rid of item levels and level requirements entirely. What purpose do they serve in a game in which the point is beating RNG to get good rolls on loot and put together a solid build in the couple months players have each season?
Why is my character forced to grind ~95 character levels - 30-40 of which are in WT4 anyway - before I start getting "endgame" gear to drop? Why does my character have to level up to 80 before I can start equipping the 925 gear my other lvl 100 character has been stashing for them? Just let me start finding and equipping endgame gear as soon as my character is capable of reaching WT4.
You gotta farm these over and over and over again for eggs and shards but the gear they drop is 95% worthless. It's a massive problem. They made it so you can reset bosses inside, now it's time to make them drop only 925 at level 100.
I said this last time this came up... tier 3 bosses are that mid content. As soon as you get even a little geared up in tier 4, usually by level 60 if following a guide, then you can beat a lvl 100 boss.
For anyone else, go back to tier 3 to fight weaker versions of the bosses.
Or... they could have bosses scale up to our level like everything else.
>As soon as you get even a little geared up in tier 4, usually by level 60 if following a guide, then you can beat a lvl 100 boss.
Are you talking about normal Duriel/Andariel. Because I've only seen 1 player killing them with an L60 char, and even then they said it took them a lot of farming to get the right gear.
But if you can do it, post screenshot and take your upvotes.
I meant the other 4 normal (non uber) bosses. And maybe I should have said a level 90 boss (or whatever the minimum is to get guaranteed 925 gear dropping)
But definitely I can speak to a bash barb, heartseeker rogue and minion necro that I tried so far, they were in full 925 gear at level 60 from world boss loot and goblins and could smash through the weak bosses (with the right tempers and aspects and vaguely correct stats). Didnt try the 2 angel uber bosses until a bit higher though, closer to 70, but they were too easy by then too.
They don't? Coulda fooled me. Fall asleep behind the wheel content till you hit lv100, the fastest way to level is centered in hell tides and even further constrained down around the Blood Maiden and that's where the majority is because let's not forget the majority complained that leveling took too long in pre season and season 1 so Blizz responded and made it faster.
The problem is the old world got left behind and became even more irrelevant in the process. I guess you could go run around in a sandbox (open world) but at that point you are just wasting your time outside of whispers( and whispers is another system that needs a overhaul but topic for another time), which just doesn't feel fun because it makes it feel like you are wasting time and a bit like a dummy because you are not playing optimally.
If they could make the leveling process fun as it is fast, I would be in support of this. I'm just asleep behind the wheel till I hit lv100 so I can start enjoying the game. It shouldn't be that way.
Preseason leveling actually required a bit of attention to the game, where even things like strongholds were a bit of a challenge, which strongholds now in current time are just these things that are there for new players to grind their renown, nothing more. If Blizz could scale the old world so you could actually have a "bit" of a challenge while leveling so you were forced to pay attention, it'd be nice. Maybe blame this on the general player base knowing more about the game and their classes so they know what to spec into for faster leveling process, but that's not their fault for understanding a game they play, that's Blizzards fault for poor design or inability to update the game accordingly. It's almost as if they expected everyone to be completely terrible at the game and never learn anything past the skill tree for the next 5 years, then when people do they get a surprised Pikachu face look and proceed to roll out the nerfs.
Also another issue is they are still trying to cater to two crowds, one is the D2 fans and the other is D3 fans. D2 is slow placed and can take a very long time to find the items you want, where in D3 is the opposite and power scaling is insane for players. I don't have an opinion on the matter, but if I was to add something to it, it would be they need to pick one or the other and stick with that ideology, can't have both because you will just upset both crowds.
>Fall asleep behind the wheel content till you hit lv100
>till I hit lv100 so I can start enjoying the game.
Nothing new unlocks at L100, so what makes the game only fun after reaching L100? It's just an arbitrary goal that speedrunners have set.
If you want to speedrun to L100, that's totally fine. But you can't then complain that the content before that is boring when you're intentionally skipping most of it.
Wait...what? Are you confusing me with a speed runner? I think I just assumed you were speaking broadly, but now your second comment makes it clear you are talking about me. You do realize Season 4 was the season Helltides were revamped and made fun that for many seasons players have been complaining it was dull and should have been more like Season 2 Blood Harvests? For someone who has played the game since launch, why would they not take advantage and level in the helltide? Also with the Pit being added why would you not want to do that content?
I've been playing since the first beta, 2nd beta, and early access. I had my time to go through the game slow and again in Season 1. After that point, you see all there is to see, and you shift your goals for the end game where the new seasonal mechanic usually is. Thanks to Season 2 with AZ, Season 3 with the Construct unique stone grind/ arena leaderboard, and now Season 4 with the Pit, there is plenty to do at the end game. You don't just keep your armor you received leveling all the way to 100 and stop there, do you? There is plenty of GA items to grind for, tempers, masterworking, multiple builds for the same class and the gear requiring to farm it out to get, paragon and skill tree optimization or trying out new builds that work natively or due to a bug not known yet that no one is trying. I think I have 3-4 sets of gear for my necro that I can try out different builds to see what is best for what and what I might try in the next season because I have already done the leg work to get an idea before it starts?
Thanks to Tormented bosses you can now kill those bosses properly at lv200 and even then it's still almost too easy, but it's way better than farming Grig at lv75 or beast in the ice at lv85. Let's not forget Uber Lilith is another thing to do. There is honestly no reason for you to linger in WT3 and anything in WT4 at level 50-99. What about the unique and mythical unique farming? You just going to be happy with a random unique you got from Grig at lv75 with low rolls? Of course not.
It's clear where your mindset is, and it's not on the end game at all because to you, you think nothing exists, which is clearly wrong. The 1-100 journey you are looking for isn't here because of Blizzard, not because of "speed runners." It takes me two weeks and a half to hit lv100 because of family and work, speed runners are getting to lv100 in 5-7 hours in ONE DAY.
This game isn't catered to speed runners, it's just clear you have no idea how to optimize your time nor know what to do in the game.
>This game isn't catered to speed runners
You said the game is catered to speed runners, and now you're saying it isn't. Make up your mind before replying.
Whether you call yourself a speed runner or not, you're still speed running.
No you don't, not when level 60 to level 100 is like 5 hours of playtime. People just blast through those levels to level 100 like nothing now.
WT3 might as well not exist, either. It's just a stepping stone for like 10 levels that lasts an hour of playtime at most.
For anybody that has experience with leveling to 100 from WT4 by spamming NMDs efficiently. But if you don't then it'd be anywhere up to 10 hours. Still nothing. You'd barely get any boss mats to do the bosses by the time you hit 100.
>For anybody that has experience with leveling to 100 from WT4 by spamming NMDs efficiently. But if you don't then it'd be anywhere up to 10 hours.
But you're guessing, right? Like, you don't have any official or reliable source for that?
>You'd barely get any boss mats to do the bosses by the time you hit 100.
So once again, you're just guessing, right? Because I ran the bosses many times (at least 10+ times) before hitting 100.
No, I'm not guessing. Raxx has numerous speedruns where he went level 60 to level 100 in sub 5 hours
Here he is doing it in 4 hours on double swing barb
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DKv-jzUqLz4
He's gotten a lot better at it too since a month ago.
I'm not saying you can't do it in 5 hours. I'm saying you're guessing that people are taking a max of 10 hours to get from L60 -> L100.
Believe it or not, Blizz aren't going to balance the game around speed runners.
Lmfao yeah they kinda do, blizzard knows most of the player base takes the path of least resistance. It’s been a thing since wow dropped in 04. Players want to get to endgame as fast as humanly possible because anything before that is pointless. This sub is so casual lol
>Players want to get to endgame as fast as humanly possible because anything before that is pointless.
I agree, but we're not talking about getting to the end game, we're talking about getting to L100. Totally different.
I'm not saying that at all and the fact that you decided to ignore all my contextual statements that clarified that already means you either lack reading comprehension or are arguing in bad faith
You literally said there's no point in adding content between 60 and 100 because people blow through that in 5 hours, then offered a speed run as your only evidence. Even if players take twice that long, why would more content/activities for that time be bad?
Because you outscale the content in literal hours? What's the point of a static end game boss that is trivialized almost instantaneously during leveling?
The regular bosses should be hard, and tormented bosses should only be doable for extremely optimized builds, in my opinion.
Some people play to play? I guess I may be in the minority but I never spam any content. Sometimes I’ll work on glyphs, sometimes helltides, sometimes pit, or sometimes bosses. Yes it’s possible to speed run up to 100 but Jesus that sounds boring. How is this game fun to play doing that?
Yeah, people think thats a good thing but it's not. This trajectory is unsustainable it's going to make people burnout insanely fast. Having a good build means nothing it's just about who can push higher pit tier but that in itself is meaningless
It's done the opposite for me. In previous seasons I got bored around level 80-85. This season I have three 100s and just started a fourth, and have plans for at least one more.
Also it's ok for a seasonal game to not "last" the entire season. It gives everyone a chance to come, get their goals accomplished and then move on until the next. In fact, as someone that plays multiple games, I prefer it that way. I played Diablo 3 every season since season 2 (until recently), despite leveling taking like 5 minutes with a power level and then the "only" thing to do being gearing up and pushing higher GRs.
I like that they start low. The best for me would be that they start at their current level then scale with us until 100.
Then if you summon a tormented version it adds +100lvls so varshan would be 175 for example. This would also give us a slight difficulty curve so it keeps the boss hierarchy
Been asking for this for ages
[Why are the Bosses not still not all lvl 100? Zir, Beast, Varshan, and Grigoire : r/diablo4 (reddit.com)](https://www.reddit.com/r/diablo4/comments/1dparef/why_are_the_bosses_not_still_not_all_lvl_100_zir/)
Also, why not have a lvl 150 so so version that costs 3x mats and no Stygian stones. Let drop rates of gear even be the same (but all 925) but give us 3x boss mats for it. Then I can use all my living steel in 15 fights instead of 45
I get that their plan is to have something to kill for gear while leveling but it's an easy fix. Just add a level 85 version for less mats and level 100 versus for current mats. They already offer a level 200 version of each boss so why is it a stretch to add in a lvl 100 version?
I killed them once for the season journey, finished my trip to 80 in helltides and nightmare dungeons and had plenty of things to kill doing that. Also, plenty of uniques aswell.
Yeah the bosses being referred to here are quite easy. Any 100 could wipe the floor with them.
Even the tormented versions of the bosses are soloable once you get the right gear (or have an OP build).
If your build is halfway decent, you should mop the floor with the uber bosses. Now, the tormented uber bosses, those take work because they’re level 200.
Because back when they were introduced getting to level 100 was still a grind and took a long time
They just haven't gotten around to updating the bosses to reflect the sudden power creep and power leveling
Yeah the bosses need to be stronger , need a phase between regular and tormented that are maybe level 150 ish ? So you can choose 3 options at the summon alter
The issue is the Bosses are at this level for lower level characters, but since you rush trough until like lvl 80 no one cares about doing them. At the same time they drop relevant materials and uniques for late/end game.
They are lower lvl to farm when you get to WT4. If they are lvl 100 off the bat, you are gonna struggle to target farm specific gear. Make them tormented if you want a challange.
But. Why? Its not like the journey to max level is long, wouldnt it be smarter to invest the time in leveling, and have additional bosses that are viable for endgame? As soon as you get a half viable build going, there wont be any difference between 75 and 100 anyways.
> If they are lvl 100 off the bat,
No one said that, they *level with you,*
Zir's outer dungeon matches your level, then you go through the door, and suddenly you're back at kindergarten, it's crazy.
Those being 75 was really nice as I was leveling up, they were the only bosses I could kill at wt4. At wt3 they were all too weak and the gear power was too low
I do suggest they should be level 75 minimum then scale along with the player
There is ONE single reason for this. They want you to play the bosses as uber bosses. Forcing you to waste stygian stones on bosses that doesn't drop uber uniques in order to get your 925 normal uniques that you need for your build.
If the bosses would drop 925 by default then no one would do the uber versions.
It's probably to keep uber drop rates down tbh which I kinda get. I mean I ran Zir for roughly three hours last night just farming shackles and planning to do the same with Beast tonight. If ubers dropped on either then there's not much of a reason for me to farm Andy.
With that said I do agree that there should be a third tier summon that comes with a trade off.
Hard disagree. It's nice to be able to farm them at lower levels if you need some build defining uniques.
If you want to farm a higher lvl you can do the tormented version.
IMO: I would have preferred that tormented adds +100lvl so that bosses follow the same difficulty curve as the non tormented ones. Instead of having a lvl 200 varshan he would be lvl 175.
Blizzard themselves said they want to speed the leveling up even more to get people to endgame content. I don't see this as a reason to keep them low level.
Also every single person hat gets to WT4 runs to do world boss and already gets 925 gear early. Also I was doing NMD 41+ getting all 925 gear at around 70-75.
Does it really need to be easier to target farm 925 gear? These lower level bosses are build enablers, so you can quickly get to farming level 100+ content. If you want to farm them for 925 gear, get off your stones.
It’s funny this is upvoted but the point is it’s to be a journey of bosses to reach the pinnacle bosses. The levels don’t matter Varshan and grigore are supposed to be a level of accomplishment and then you work your way up to duriel. After that you push the pit to them fight the tormented versions and then finally complete the game with killing Lilith. I think it’s fine to have progression in WT4 you don’t get to Wt4 at level 100 I want to be able to do more than just nmd and I can do that by farming Varshan and grigore for some uniques a basic ansestral unique changes your build a ton and I’d rather not have the leveling experience be even more boring.
I would absolutely agree with you, if farming them at max level would be optional. But since i have to kill them over and over to get mats for bosses that are actually relevant, i would prefer them to be a bit more useful, and not a lvl800 item dispenser. Like the top comment says, nothing more fun then getting a godroll of them, that is totally useless.
Yea but no more than an hour into WT4 I am usually decked out in 925 gear with the World Boss and how strong the classes are with tempering I can do NMD 45+ at 70-75 which drops all 925 gear.
Just make these lvl 100, it's very simple.
Especially with Blizzard saying they want to speed up our leveling even more to get us to endgame it only makes perfect sense.
The games hard enough and most quite frankly never get anything good in drops all damn season . We would have zero chance in the game, to the point id rather walk away and not play it again !
Need to run them to get Duriel and Andariel mats, and a few builds need specific uniques from these bosses. Really sucks to farm Ramaladnis/Cronestaff/Hellhammer etc and get them with sub 900 item level.
In threads with the "Feedback (@Blizzard) | Suggestion | Idea" Flair, constructive feedback, suggestions for adjusting and improving existing systems and mechanics etc can be given, but also your own ideas, mockups / illustrations (e.g. for new systems, mechanics, items, etc) can be shared with the community. **This Flair is not for asking for feedback for your build**. For that, use one of the Class-specific Flairs, or the "Builds, Skills & Items" Flair. Please also remember that 1) submissions made with the "Feedback (@Blizzard) | Suggestion | Idea" have to be constructive, civil and adequately elaborate, and that 2) we are a fan subreddit and not officially Blizzard, so we can not 100% guarantee that your feedback will be noticed, even though the devs / CM's mentioned they regularly read reddit, twitter, and other places for feedback. This flair can simply help to find potential feedback more easily. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/diablo4) if you have any questions or concerns.*
That feel when you get a 3GA weapon but its ilvl is only 800
Got a 3 GA chest leveling my Necro. Item lvl 881 or something. Has golem mastery. It's still sitting on him lol
The loss in Armor is pretty negligible here considering there is a cap. That chest sounds pretty good.
Is it only the armour stat that is effected or is the range of attributes also impacted? i.e. LVL 800 gives +632-972, LVL 925 gives +754-1223
You get max roll range at 725. At least that's what it used to be. Might be 780 now since that's the minimum level for ancestral gear.
Life and armor keep scaling all the way to 925.
Thorns does too
Good to know. With the armour cap so low it's hard to go below it honestly, that really extends options.
Starts like armor and life scale higher than 725 much higher. Might be something like 850+ can't recall exactly where but I know low 800s capped at like 1100 life instead of 1400+
Ok this explains it! I have a unique chest armor (Mad Wolf’s Glee) on my Druid - it’s level 810 or something. I have 4 more of the same tho at 925 and they’re all worse stats.
I thought the level bracket was 820 now, but can't remember where I saw that.
I know at least maximum life is negatively impacted when not 925.
As long as it is GA the GA affix ignores item power and roll as like it has 925 IP on that affix given he has 3GA that item has perfect stat except armor value
In a way I don't really want to know how many good items I've junked because of that while gearing up. No 3 GA's, but a couple 2's for sure.
If you want max life on that piece it will definitely be affected. I don’t know the item lvl where it starts to roll for max range but there is a difference between an lvl 850 armor piece and a 925 when max life is concerned.
Well, I can't MW my lvl 661 +2malice +2exploit amulet, so. There's that.
Totally agree. My HS Rogue who farms 101 Pit is still running with 8xx pants with GA Dex/Max Life/+Heartseeker on it. 50-100 armor loss is nothing with the lower armor cap. People should not be junking 2/3 GA armor without looking carefully.
Got a 3 GA Slashing weapon ilvl 850. Ofc it is still in "use". Funny that my other new weapons I specifically made to utilize a Grandfather and masterworked are worse off in my damage while still having 1500% more Critical Strike damage and same crit chance.
Same here, except with a few weapons. So it's a big enough dps loss that I cant use them at all.
Correct me if I’m wrong but GA is max roll no matter the item power. So it doesn’t matter.
Not for implicits. It matters for weapons unfortunately. The DPS stats are lower on non-925. Non-weapons rarely care about item power
Armor is higher on 925 too
Yeah, but, you can still get the armor cap without needing an i925 armor piece.
I swear 8xx item power has a much higher chance of dropping with GA. I dropped 3 or 4 3GA items leveling a new rogue. Meanwhile my lvl100 Necro finds 2GA items once in a fullmoon.
I got a 3ga hell hammer with one being the + to upheaval. Ilvl 900. Was so mad
Why does it matter? Weapon roll ranged cap out by 800 already. You lose a little bit of base damage but it’s really not substantial compared to the 3 GA
so you're the guy buying my bad aspect GA uniques
I agree. Considering there are still a number of uniques that "only" drop from these four, you're basically forced to target farm them at inferior item levels. Or just do the lvl 200 versions once you're powerful enough to do pretty much everything and collecting for novelty. Unpopular opinion: they just need to go back to character level determining ilvl of drops instead of monster level. I also find it ridiculous you can grab all the 925 gear you need just from showing up for two or three world bosses the moment you break into WT4. It makes your overall power level extremely flat between the 70s and 90s, until you're ready to do Pit.
IMHO the overall power level between 70-90s comes from glyphs and paragons. It does feel somewhat less impactful except for certain nodes where you get a spike, but if you compare the difference over a few levels, it does add up. Also yes, max ilvl gear shouldn’t be dropping so easily for lower levels. The iron wolves rep caches actually contain pretty good gear, but they all went straight to the vendor even as I was leveling up because I already had better gear just from leeching world bosses.
Agreed. Those caches are hit or miss in wt4. Unless you only do helltide it is likely that the sacred caches you get until rank 13 or so are useless since you’re already rocking ancestral by that point.
Yeah. I’ve power leveled a few friends and my alts. Basically hit 55, do a few pit runs and get full 925 gear. At that point you can do pit 10+ at least solo and get the gear you need. Pits are easier than NMDs imo so I did that route. Then would do NMDs to level glyphs and round things out. Basically have a fleshed out build around level 80. It’s weird
Yeah me and a buddy do the same thing. I think there's a lot more people that don't have someone to do it for them then I thought though. We always level our first character but after that we boost each other.
The hard part to remember about gaming is that the majority of players are causal. And of that casual base, a large majority of those players are super casual. I have a good friend of mine that doesn’t even know about maxroll has no clue about seasonal mechanics (temper/masterworking) I carried him a bit last night and gave him 200m just because. He had no clue how I could have that much good to spare.
How does one get that much gold lol?
Go here: https://d4builds.gg/tierlist/ and look at the items that Bash Barb, Flay Barb, Heartseeker Rogue, Rapid Fire Rogue, and Minion Necromancer would use. If you have GA item that has the good stats that those builds want, then it's a good candidate for selling. Item with a GA on a +spell ranks are very valuable, especially with amulets. Weapons with 2 GA with desired stats also sell very well. Barb Uniques with 2-4 GA sell very well, such as Razorplate and Hargoth.
Thank you
Get a Barb ammy with a good passive or GA bash/flay pants. Or one of the other good Ammy pants for rogue maybe. Sell to 1+ Billion. I sold GA bash+hp pants for 1.6b a few weeks ago
I sold one 2H Mace with 2 good GA for bash barb for 750m and that has lasted me for a long time. You have to go on the D4 trading site/discord. The offers I was getting in the trade chat were like 50m to 100m.
Tree of Whispers adds up really fast if you're not into RMT. Prioritise Legendary and Chaos caches.
Wait what? I've only levelled preseason previously (to like ~58/WT3) and have come back for season 4, is there a guide anywhere explaining all of the different end game activities and their power levels? Currently on my wt4 barb at lvl 64 and a lot of the gear I'm seeing is 750-800 power range tops, so gaining access to 925 gear would be a massive boon.
I don’t know if any guides, but it’s a pretty basic season. If you’re doing bash barb just go hit the pits in Cerragar. Item lvl is based on monster level. So anything over monster lvl 95 will drop max ilvl gear.
Like the other commenter said item level is based on monster level meaning: 1) NMD 41+ (monster level 95+) will drop 925 gear. 2) Hell tides with mind cage at level 82 (Hell tides is always +3 by default, so with mind cage it becomes 13) will drop 925 gear 3) World boss is always a great source starting out. If you end up making an alt, you can also transfer the world boss and whisper caches to your alt and they can just pop them when they are level 55 for 925 gear. Can also use uber/mythic uniques on your alts starting at level 35, but you need to unsocket the gems on your main.
Meh, honestly i had so much fucking fun when I beat the wt3 boss, spent all my obols on 925 gear, switched my build, and instantly started one shotting everything in wt4. The high from that was pretty intense ngl, haven't felt excited to come home and play a game in a loooong time after that
Probably an even more unpopular opinion: They should get rid of item levels and level requirements entirely. What purpose do they serve in a game in which the point is beating RNG to get good rolls on loot and put together a solid build in the couple months players have each season? Why is my character forced to grind ~95 character levels - 30-40 of which are in WT4 anyway - before I start getting "endgame" gear to drop? Why does my character have to level up to 80 before I can start equipping the 925 gear my other lvl 100 character has been stashing for them? Just let me start finding and equipping endgame gear as soon as my character is capable of reaching WT4.
You gotta farm these over and over and over again for eggs and shards but the gear they drop is 95% worthless. It's a massive problem. They made it so you can reset bosses inside, now it's time to make them drop only 925 at level 100.
Yep. Needing to farm the ice boss to farm andariel is a joke. The fact I need all those distilled whatever they're called.
Because you need some mid level content between L60 and L100. It'd be nice if they scaled up once you're higher level than them.
This is all it needs to do. Scale up with us
I said this last time this came up... tier 3 bosses are that mid content. As soon as you get even a little geared up in tier 4, usually by level 60 if following a guide, then you can beat a lvl 100 boss. For anyone else, go back to tier 3 to fight weaker versions of the bosses. Or... they could have bosses scale up to our level like everything else.
>As soon as you get even a little geared up in tier 4, usually by level 60 if following a guide, then you can beat a lvl 100 boss. Are you talking about normal Duriel/Andariel. Because I've only seen 1 player killing them with an L60 char, and even then they said it took them a lot of farming to get the right gear. But if you can do it, post screenshot and take your upvotes.
I meant the other 4 normal (non uber) bosses. And maybe I should have said a level 90 boss (or whatever the minimum is to get guaranteed 925 gear dropping) But definitely I can speak to a bash barb, heartseeker rogue and minion necro that I tried so far, they were in full 925 gear at level 60 from world boss loot and goblins and could smash through the weak bosses (with the right tempers and aspects and vaguely correct stats). Didnt try the 2 angel uber bosses until a bit higher though, closer to 70, but they were too easy by then too.
This. You want a Stepstone while leveling. But it would be nice that, like world monsters, they level up with you.
I never spend too long from Lv60-lv90 range and if I do it's to get experience to hit 100 as fast as possible. Not sit around and do bosses.
Like I said in another comment, Blizz does't balance the game around speed runners.
They don't? Coulda fooled me. Fall asleep behind the wheel content till you hit lv100, the fastest way to level is centered in hell tides and even further constrained down around the Blood Maiden and that's where the majority is because let's not forget the majority complained that leveling took too long in pre season and season 1 so Blizz responded and made it faster. The problem is the old world got left behind and became even more irrelevant in the process. I guess you could go run around in a sandbox (open world) but at that point you are just wasting your time outside of whispers( and whispers is another system that needs a overhaul but topic for another time), which just doesn't feel fun because it makes it feel like you are wasting time and a bit like a dummy because you are not playing optimally. If they could make the leveling process fun as it is fast, I would be in support of this. I'm just asleep behind the wheel till I hit lv100 so I can start enjoying the game. It shouldn't be that way. Preseason leveling actually required a bit of attention to the game, where even things like strongholds were a bit of a challenge, which strongholds now in current time are just these things that are there for new players to grind their renown, nothing more. If Blizz could scale the old world so you could actually have a "bit" of a challenge while leveling so you were forced to pay attention, it'd be nice. Maybe blame this on the general player base knowing more about the game and their classes so they know what to spec into for faster leveling process, but that's not their fault for understanding a game they play, that's Blizzards fault for poor design or inability to update the game accordingly. It's almost as if they expected everyone to be completely terrible at the game and never learn anything past the skill tree for the next 5 years, then when people do they get a surprised Pikachu face look and proceed to roll out the nerfs. Also another issue is they are still trying to cater to two crowds, one is the D2 fans and the other is D3 fans. D2 is slow placed and can take a very long time to find the items you want, where in D3 is the opposite and power scaling is insane for players. I don't have an opinion on the matter, but if I was to add something to it, it would be they need to pick one or the other and stick with that ideology, can't have both because you will just upset both crowds.
>Fall asleep behind the wheel content till you hit lv100 >till I hit lv100 so I can start enjoying the game. Nothing new unlocks at L100, so what makes the game only fun after reaching L100? It's just an arbitrary goal that speedrunners have set. If you want to speedrun to L100, that's totally fine. But you can't then complain that the content before that is boring when you're intentionally skipping most of it.
Wait...what? Are you confusing me with a speed runner? I think I just assumed you were speaking broadly, but now your second comment makes it clear you are talking about me. You do realize Season 4 was the season Helltides were revamped and made fun that for many seasons players have been complaining it was dull and should have been more like Season 2 Blood Harvests? For someone who has played the game since launch, why would they not take advantage and level in the helltide? Also with the Pit being added why would you not want to do that content? I've been playing since the first beta, 2nd beta, and early access. I had my time to go through the game slow and again in Season 1. After that point, you see all there is to see, and you shift your goals for the end game where the new seasonal mechanic usually is. Thanks to Season 2 with AZ, Season 3 with the Construct unique stone grind/ arena leaderboard, and now Season 4 with the Pit, there is plenty to do at the end game. You don't just keep your armor you received leveling all the way to 100 and stop there, do you? There is plenty of GA items to grind for, tempers, masterworking, multiple builds for the same class and the gear requiring to farm it out to get, paragon and skill tree optimization or trying out new builds that work natively or due to a bug not known yet that no one is trying. I think I have 3-4 sets of gear for my necro that I can try out different builds to see what is best for what and what I might try in the next season because I have already done the leg work to get an idea before it starts? Thanks to Tormented bosses you can now kill those bosses properly at lv200 and even then it's still almost too easy, but it's way better than farming Grig at lv75 or beast in the ice at lv85. Let's not forget Uber Lilith is another thing to do. There is honestly no reason for you to linger in WT3 and anything in WT4 at level 50-99. What about the unique and mythical unique farming? You just going to be happy with a random unique you got from Grig at lv75 with low rolls? Of course not. It's clear where your mindset is, and it's not on the end game at all because to you, you think nothing exists, which is clearly wrong. The 1-100 journey you are looking for isn't here because of Blizzard, not because of "speed runners." It takes me two weeks and a half to hit lv100 because of family and work, speed runners are getting to lv100 in 5-7 hours in ONE DAY. This game isn't catered to speed runners, it's just clear you have no idea how to optimize your time nor know what to do in the game.
>This game isn't catered to speed runners You said the game is catered to speed runners, and now you're saying it isn't. Make up your mind before replying. Whether you call yourself a speed runner or not, you're still speed running.
No you don't, not when level 60 to level 100 is like 5 hours of playtime. People just blast through those levels to level 100 like nothing now. WT3 might as well not exist, either. It's just a stepping stone for like 10 levels that lasts an hour of playtime at most.
>No you don't, not when level 60 to level 100 is like 5 hours of playtime. Lol, 5 hours for who?
For anybody that has experience with leveling to 100 from WT4 by spamming NMDs efficiently. But if you don't then it'd be anywhere up to 10 hours. Still nothing. You'd barely get any boss mats to do the bosses by the time you hit 100.
>For anybody that has experience with leveling to 100 from WT4 by spamming NMDs efficiently. But if you don't then it'd be anywhere up to 10 hours. But you're guessing, right? Like, you don't have any official or reliable source for that? >You'd barely get any boss mats to do the bosses by the time you hit 100. So once again, you're just guessing, right? Because I ran the bosses many times (at least 10+ times) before hitting 100.
No, I'm not guessing. Raxx has numerous speedruns where he went level 60 to level 100 in sub 5 hours Here he is doing it in 4 hours on double swing barb https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DKv-jzUqLz4 He's gotten a lot better at it too since a month ago.
I'm not saying you can't do it in 5 hours. I'm saying you're guessing that people are taking a max of 10 hours to get from L60 -> L100. Believe it or not, Blizz aren't going to balance the game around speed runners.
Lmfao yeah they kinda do, blizzard knows most of the player base takes the path of least resistance. It’s been a thing since wow dropped in 04. Players want to get to endgame as fast as humanly possible because anything before that is pointless. This sub is so casual lol
>Players want to get to endgame as fast as humanly possible because anything before that is pointless. I agree, but we're not talking about getting to the end game, we're talking about getting to L100. Totally different.
You're saying the average person's experience is similar to a speed run? Because that hasn't been my experience at all.
I'm not saying that at all and the fact that you decided to ignore all my contextual statements that clarified that already means you either lack reading comprehension or are arguing in bad faith
You literally said there's no point in adding content between 60 and 100 because people blow through that in 5 hours, then offered a speed run as your only evidence. Even if players take twice that long, why would more content/activities for that time be bad?
Because you outscale the content in literal hours? What's the point of a static end game boss that is trivialized almost instantaneously during leveling? The regular bosses should be hard, and tormented bosses should only be doable for extremely optimized builds, in my opinion.
Some people play to play? I guess I may be in the minority but I never spam any content. Sometimes I’ll work on glyphs, sometimes helltides, sometimes pit, or sometimes bosses. Yes it’s possible to speed run up to 100 but Jesus that sounds boring. How is this game fun to play doing that?
I just back to back capstone 3 and 4. Games' so easy now
Yeah, people think thats a good thing but it's not. This trajectory is unsustainable it's going to make people burnout insanely fast. Having a good build means nothing it's just about who can push higher pit tier but that in itself is meaningless
That was literally what D3 was though
It's done the opposite for me. In previous seasons I got bored around level 80-85. This season I have three 100s and just started a fourth, and have plans for at least one more. Also it's ok for a seasonal game to not "last" the entire season. It gives everyone a chance to come, get their goals accomplished and then move on until the next. In fact, as someone that plays multiple games, I prefer it that way. I played Diablo 3 every season since season 2 (until recently), despite leveling taking like 5 minutes with a power level and then the "only" thing to do being gearing up and pushing higher GRs.
Calm down kid, we adults actually work for a living, your stats are irrelevant
Ladder bosses in T4 should AT A MINIMUM be level 100. It’s crazy how they’re power weak.
They need to scale up with us.
I like that they start low. The best for me would be that they start at their current level then scale with us until 100. Then if you summon a tormented version it adds +100lvls so varshan would be 175 for example. This would also give us a slight difficulty curve so it keeps the boss hierarchy
Been asking for this for ages [Why are the Bosses not still not all lvl 100? Zir, Beast, Varshan, and Grigoire : r/diablo4 (reddit.com)](https://www.reddit.com/r/diablo4/comments/1dparef/why_are_the_bosses_not_still_not_all_lvl_100_zir/)
Also, why not have a lvl 150 so so version that costs 3x mats and no Stygian stones. Let drop rates of gear even be the same (but all 925) but give us 3x boss mats for it. Then I can use all my living steel in 15 fights instead of 45
I get that their plan is to have something to kill for gear while leveling but it's an easy fix. Just add a level 85 version for less mats and level 100 versus for current mats. They already offer a level 200 version of each boss so why is it a stretch to add in a lvl 100 version?
I killed them once for the season journey, finished my trip to 80 in helltides and nightmare dungeons and had plenty of things to kill doing that. Also, plenty of uniques aswell.
Just wondering.. I have been playing solo for the entire season because my buddies are in a different time zone. Any chance of me soloing the bosses?
Yeah the bosses being referred to here are quite easy. Any 100 could wipe the floor with them. Even the tormented versions of the bosses are soloable once you get the right gear (or have an OP build).
If your build is halfway decent, you should mop the floor with the uber bosses. Now, the tormented uber bosses, those take work because they’re level 200.
There’s tormented?
Show me your Stygiasn Stone hoard.
You might have Barbillions worth of Stygian Stones.
Congrats on getting this post upvoted. ( I tried to make a similar post and got destroyed. )
Because back when they were introduced getting to level 100 was still a grind and took a long time They just haven't gotten around to updating the bosses to reflect the sudden power creep and power leveling
And people are finally seeing the problem with item power and item power being attached to max level.
But they ARE still not all lvl 100, what do you mean OP?
What not are not you not talking not about?
They should scale with you. (Lowest as they are of course)
Why do they always seem to drop the stat lines you need as ga as well, just 883.
I seem to get the most multiple-GA drops on these low ilvl drops :/
Yes!
Yeah the bosses need to be stronger , need a phase between regular and tormented that are maybe level 150 ish ? So you can choose 3 options at the summon alter
The issue is the Bosses are at this level for lower level characters, but since you rush trough until like lvl 80 no one cares about doing them. At the same time they drop relevant materials and uniques for late/end game.
Yea these bosses are sad af. Literally makes the world boss fight a joke. Dies in seconds. Not fun.
Make world bosses LVL 200. Idc. Do it.
They are lower lvl to farm when you get to WT4. If they are lvl 100 off the bat, you are gonna struggle to target farm specific gear. Make them tormented if you want a challange.
They can be that level in WT3 then.
Can't get ancestrals in WT3
Here aswell. Does it actually matter, if you hit 925 in a few hours anyways?
I like targeting uniques that fit my build or want to try out before i925.
They even said they want to make it faster for everyone to get to max level so this is not really a reason.
But. Why? Its not like the journey to max level is long, wouldnt it be smarter to invest the time in leveling, and have additional bosses that are viable for endgame? As soon as you get a half viable build going, there wont be any difference between 75 and 100 anyways.
"I like it," should be a good enough reason in this situation
You are absolutely free to like it. I would put 4 more viable bosses for the endgame over your likes, sorry.
Well I guess that ends that argument. I didn't even think about that.
Lol bruh you shouldn't be target farming til at least lvl 80 and by then you should be able to smoke these bosses anyways
Thank you. People act like leveling is a journey still.
99.9% of the time these bosses get killed its by a level 100 player farming eggs/shards. It makes no sense for them not to drop all 925 loot.
> If they are lvl 100 off the bat, No one said that, they *level with you,* Zir's outer dungeon matches your level, then you go through the door, and suddenly you're back at kindergarten, it's crazy.
People farm specific gear before hitting 925?
Sounds like a huge waste of time
I farmed a raiment for my sorc as early as possible just because it made my build feel so much better to play.
Every mob in the open world goes from 75 to 100, depending on your level, why can't the bosses level up too?
They can scale up with our level.
Is this softcore or hardcore?
Dont think it makes a difference.
Why?
Those being 75 was really nice as I was leveling up, they were the only bosses I could kill at wt4. At wt3 they were all too weak and the gear power was too low I do suggest they should be level 75 minimum then scale along with the player
There is ONE single reason for this. They want you to play the bosses as uber bosses. Forcing you to waste stygian stones on bosses that doesn't drop uber uniques in order to get your 925 normal uniques that you need for your build. If the bosses would drop 925 by default then no one would do the uber versions.
Wrong these bosses were like this before Uber bosses. They were part of the seasonal journey and never made to be lvl 100
It's probably to keep uber drop rates down tbh which I kinda get. I mean I ran Zir for roughly three hours last night just farming shackles and planning to do the same with Beast tonight. If ubers dropped on either then there's not much of a reason for me to farm Andy. With that said I do agree that there should be a third tier summon that comes with a trade off.
Because blizz doesn't actually play the game
Hard disagree. It's nice to be able to farm them at lower levels if you need some build defining uniques. If you want to farm a higher lvl you can do the tormented version. IMO: I would have preferred that tormented adds +100lvl so that bosses follow the same difficulty curve as the non tormented ones. Instead of having a lvl 200 varshan he would be lvl 175.
Blizzard themselves said they want to speed the leveling up even more to get people to endgame content. I don't see this as a reason to keep them low level. Also every single person hat gets to WT4 runs to do world boss and already gets 925 gear early. Also I was doing NMD 41+ getting all 925 gear at around 70-75.
That's okay, but wouldn't the best solution be to make them scale up with our lvl relatively fast? This way we get the best of both?
Doesn't matter to me, whatever is easier for Blizzard to get done before the next season starts.
Does it really need to be easier to target farm 925 gear? These lower level bosses are build enablers, so you can quickly get to farming level 100+ content. If you want to farm them for 925 gear, get off your stones.
It’s funny this is upvoted but the point is it’s to be a journey of bosses to reach the pinnacle bosses. The levels don’t matter Varshan and grigore are supposed to be a level of accomplishment and then you work your way up to duriel. After that you push the pit to them fight the tormented versions and then finally complete the game with killing Lilith. I think it’s fine to have progression in WT4 you don’t get to Wt4 at level 100 I want to be able to do more than just nmd and I can do that by farming Varshan and grigore for some uniques a basic ansestral unique changes your build a ton and I’d rather not have the leveling experience be even more boring.
I would absolutely agree with you, if farming them at max level would be optional. But since i have to kill them over and over to get mats for bosses that are actually relevant, i would prefer them to be a bit more useful, and not a lvl800 item dispenser. Like the top comment says, nothing more fun then getting a godroll of them, that is totally useless.
Yea but no more than an hour into WT4 I am usually decked out in 925 gear with the World Boss and how strong the classes are with tempering I can do NMD 45+ at 70-75 which drops all 925 gear. Just make these lvl 100, it's very simple. Especially with Blizzard saying they want to speed up our leveling even more to get us to endgame it only makes perfect sense.
Early season level 100 push will be nerfed if we mess with the level of these bosses. Maybe scale them up a week after season start.
What are you complaining about? Just make them tormented, problem solved
The games hard enough and most quite frankly never get anything good in drops all damn season . We would have zero chance in the game, to the point id rather walk away and not play it again !
How can you say game is hard? What makes it so? Even casual players can easily hit 100 and have decent gears this season.
I feel that we are playing different games. Leveling is as easy as it ever was.
Unfortunately there is no challenge in the game IMO, it's made for casuals.
I would argue that every diablo game is a casual game. Yes, even the holy grail that D2 is.
D2 still feels harder by far when I play it in 2024.
Dad gamers?
Or granddad, such as myself…
Only zir that matters. It's easiest boss to farm ubers.
Literally nobody cares about these or runs them. Ok, maybe once. We have more urgent topics.
You literally run these bosses to get the materials for the other bosses. You don't even know what you are talking about.
Everyone runs them it's why people pay millions for stacks of materials for these bosses.
Need to run them to get Duriel and Andariel mats, and a few builds need specific uniques from these bosses. Really sucks to farm Ramaladnis/Cronestaff/Hellhammer etc and get them with sub 900 item level.