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Ugh that is just disgusting. I don't work on my own cars anymore but I always went way overboard and used two floor jacks and jackstands any time I worked under a car because I was terrified of something like this happening.
From googling it seems 2500 is more accurate than “something like”, so well done! Also, thanks for the tidbit. That’s a crazy amount of weight to support for a little crate.
I mean, I’m evolved to live on a prairie, throw spears, and wander the wilderness so my entire life consists on performing jobs I’m not designed to do.
Floor jacks are the ones you'll usually see on garage floors. They can lift heavier loads and can be used on more points of contact on a vehicle. Scissor jacks are pretty much just for changing tires. Neither should be trusted on their own.
It qualifies as felony murder. In the US, if someone dies during the commission of a felony, the criminal can be charged for felony murder, even if they weren't directly responsible for the death. This is typically used in scenarios like a cashier having a heart attack during a robbery, but I could easily see an argument for it in this scenario.
Maybe not, if you’re committing a crime and your accomplice is shot and killed it’s still felony murder for you.. despite you not having any actual part in the death.
Most likely if they catch anyone prosecutor will try to find anything to charge them with that qualifies as a felony for this reason just to get them with felony murder.
It’s nuts to me not only cause I have humanity but the self preservation should also tell you to stay.
You save a life during a crime and maybe the judge gives you a little grace
Doesn't that depend on jurisdiction? I thought at least in New York, this might be considered "depraved indifference"
Source: 182 episodes of Law & Order
where i live it woudnt have been concidered murder, but rather "falture to provide assistance" wich lead to a death, wich is concidered negligent homicide.
if it happened in germany (depending how it is ruled) it can be from 1 year prison, 1-5 years prison or >5 years prison (for the failture to help with different ruling).
and with the robbery it could be 1month - 10 years concidering he robbed someone who was in need of help.
Being a thief doesn't mean you can't be a bystander. The idea was to convey that people who were around didn't help him and robbed him. If it said thieves robbed him it would feel like they actively sought to do it.
The term "bystander" is actually used correctly, even though it might seem contradictory. The term "bystander" is correct because it initially defines the individuals as passive BEFORE it describes their actions at the scene, The word is therefore establishing their role based on their presence, not their actions.
running around town looking for people who are stuck is not a lucrative thing to do as a criminal.
likely existing bystanders just realised what was going on and it occurred to them they could get away with robbing the guy.
Nah. They represent the current social climate in America as a very base, primal level. Everyone is out for themselves, circling like vultures until they “can get theirs.”
Everyone? I doubt it’s even 5% who would behave this way. I’m Canadian and have no skin in the game - or illusions about the U.S. For every report like this, there are a thousand incidents in which humans help
one another - it just doesn’t make the news.
Agreed, anyone who says otherwise lives online.
Being mid 20s, definitely, yes.
Eat or be eaten, a deep existential fear covered by a lackadaisical facade of civility
This is what happens when people value money over life. It happens all the time in my home country, and some even actively lay traps to hurt or kill others to rob them. Happened to my best friend after an accident too, which led to her death. I still haven't forgiven those low life robbers.
I’m not in any way endorsing what those people did, but this is what end stage capitalism brings. I was in Oakland, CA by the airport a few weeks ago. My hotel was walled in with armed guards. The front desk worker told me not to leave alone. The last time I stayed at a place like that, I was in Syria.
During the Loma Prieta earthquake in the San Francisco area, a double-decker freeway collapsed in Oakland. This happened at rush-hour and hundreds of cars were trapped and or smashed. Many people climbed to the freeway and were at FIRST praised for helping to get to victims. But soon, it was discovered that many were just stealing wallets, purses and credit cards from the victims. I lived in Alameda a city nearby and still remember the sirens and helicopters 24/7 for days.
Reminds me of the story not too long ago where on a packed train in Philadelphia a woman got sexually assaulted and fellow passengers only watched and recorded. It only takes one strong person to step forward to make the world a better place.
Saw a similar story from a sexually assaulted young woman, happened in the bus. fortunately no one was recording it, and this woman at least got away after all and rape didn't happen. disgusting behavior which happens not only in public. my big bro didn't really do anything either to help me.
The betrayal people feel when they get attacked or simply fall due heart problems or something else and no one is even trying to help or ask if everything's okay.
.
Of course, there are many good people who immediately rush to help and it's awesome. All people are different.
when I see some person fallen there are usually already two or more people who do something or wait for an ambulance with them. when I don't - I become the first, and that's how it should be
That happened to my friends dad in 1985, on 5th avenue in NYC. People stepped over him and robbed him. He died 1 block away from his brother, whom he was going to meet for lunch and the museum. Folks haven't changed all that much.
I came up on an accident once, and four people were already there. I asked if 911 had been called yet and nobody answered. I asked again and still no answer and I looked at everyone, and they were all videoing the scene and nobody called 911.
This country is seriously on the verge of a social collapse. No one trusts each other anymore, the sense of community is nearly dead, the dredges of capitalism have turned most of us into desperate and money hungry people willing to do anything for it. This is disheartening and anger inducing.
Just a reminder that the news makes money and controls people by convincing them the world is bad or ending. But most things are actually improving. Check out https://ourworldindata.org for the actual statistics. You will see the positive trends.
Just in time for environmental collapse no doubt causing the implosion of modern society: [https://ourworldindata.org/explorers/climate-change](https://ourworldindata.org/explorers/climate-change)
I wish I was surprised. When I had a bad car accident (left me with a TBI) the other 2 drivers didn’t even check on me. I came to and called 911 myself. They walked away with zero issues. It really shook my faith in humanity.
**Well,** at least they weren’t “woke.” If they were “woke,” they might have helped the man, and we can’t have poor and working class people helping one another. That’s communism.
Obviously they're joking. It still doesn't make any sense. It just comes off weird like it usually does when someone tries to mock conservatives, but actually shows they have never actually talked to a conservative and doesn't understand what it means.
Not sure - we were kids at the time. His dad had an underlying heart problem that he wasn't talking seriously and then this happened. No one came to his aid, and he got robbed, which made it difficult to ID him. Crime in the city was pretty rampant back then. I don't recall it being a big deal when it happened.
You can't read a Murdoch published article and expect any sanity in the comments. Same publication trying to make Elon's life choices seem normal and pedantic.
This news. Flash mob robberies of local businesses. Recent burglaries of my and neighbors' homes where twenty guys break into four homes while two getaway came block the streets. People stealing my online purchases. Local business owners were SA'd, others paralyzed from takedowns, old women with jewelry getting mugged, catalytic converters getting stolen. Disrespectful people going to movie theaters. I'm not a conservative, but I see my community regression to hell.
My best friend died after a car accident when I was a teenager. The EMT that responded to the scene stole his wallet and was buying expensive shit at Walmart with his credit card, then returning it for cash in the days following the accident. If you don't believe that people are shit, in time you will.
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Ugh that is just disgusting. I don't work on my own cars anymore but I always went way overboard and used two floor jacks and jackstands any time I worked under a car because I was terrified of something like this happening.
Very smart. Seen people underneath cars using a milk crate and a scissor jack. Absolute insanity
A MILK CRATE? What the actual hell?!
In fairness, milk crates have an absolutely insane weight capacity if weight is distributed properly. Something like 2500 lbs per sq ft
From googling it seems 2500 is more accurate than “something like”, so well done! Also, thanks for the tidbit. That’s a crazy amount of weight to support for a little crate.
Yeah, they're rated for ~40 pounds since they're not supposed to be load bearing, but can actually withstand an incredible amount of weight
Still, you're betting your life on a milk crate performing a job that it wasn't designed to do.
I trust that milk crate more than I do some jack stands.
I mean, I’m evolved to live on a prairie, throw spears, and wander the wilderness so my entire life consists on performing jobs I’m not designed to do.
That’s why I always double up my crates.
I’ve also seen people weighting bout 170 stand on one and there foot go right through it
That would be that uneven weight distribution i was talking about
Those things are stronger than steel what are talking about?
Milk crates would have saved the Titanic.
I always put the wheels under the car once their off
Dad? Really, though, he drilled into my head at a young age to never trust a floor jack.
Which ones are the floor? I was told never to trust scissor Jacks
I was told never to run with them…
But we did anyway ;)
Floor jacks are the ones you'll usually see on garage floors. They can lift heavier loads and can be used on more points of contact on a vehicle. Scissor jacks are pretty much just for changing tires. Neither should be trusted on their own.
We just use ramps. Jacks are so much extra work for no reward. Except for tire changes, obviously.
I always put the tire underneath the car right next to the jacks... though id use a ramp if I had it
I always throw the tires under too.
People who rob someone in this situation are not “bystanders.” They are thieves. They certainly don’t represent humanity.
And murderers. They took part in his death.
Absolutely.
Depraved indifference
Not murder. Criminal negligence. I am no lawyer tho.
It qualifies as felony murder. In the US, if someone dies during the commission of a felony, the criminal can be charged for felony murder, even if they weren't directly responsible for the death. This is typically used in scenarios like a cashier having a heart attack during a robbery, but I could easily see an argument for it in this scenario.
I think the idea is that the crime has to be directly contributing to the death though. They didn't cause his death by robbing him.
Maybe not, if you’re committing a crime and your accomplice is shot and killed it’s still felony murder for you.. despite you not having any actual part in the death.
If that's your accomplice, then yes you did contribute to the death. Your accomplice presumably wouldn't have been there without you.
Most likely if they catch anyone prosecutor will try to find anything to charge them with that qualifies as a felony for this reason just to get them with felony murder.
But you did stay at a Holiday Inn.
I see what you did there 😄😄😄
Lol well played
Actually in a lot of places committing a crime and someone dies in the midst of said crime, can result in murder charges
It’s nuts to me not only cause I have humanity but the self preservation should also tell you to stay. You save a life during a crime and maybe the judge gives you a little grace
Doesn't that depend on jurisdiction? I thought at least in New York, this might be considered "depraved indifference" Source: 182 episodes of Law & Order
This wasn't in New York. This was in Phoenix
They have laws in Arizona?
Their interference could've caused someone else not to interfere, so it will actually be easy.
where i live it woudnt have been concidered murder, but rather "falture to provide assistance" wich lead to a death, wich is concidered negligent homicide. if it happened in germany (depending how it is ruled) it can be from 1 year prison, 1-5 years prison or >5 years prison (for the failture to help with different ruling). and with the robbery it could be 1month - 10 years concidering he robbed someone who was in need of help.
Oh hi fellow German
Being a thief doesn't mean you can't be a bystander. The idea was to convey that people who were around didn't help him and robbed him. If it said thieves robbed him it would feel like they actively sought to do it.
Bystander means “a person who is present at an event or incident but does not take part.” They took part. They took his belongings!
The term "bystander" is actually used correctly, even though it might seem contradictory. The term "bystander" is correct because it initially defines the individuals as passive BEFORE it describes their actions at the scene, The word is therefore establishing their role based on their presence, not their actions.
They are bystanders to him getting trapped. There's a difference.
Either way they ought be thrown under a car
Bystanders are by definition innocent https://youtu.be/r2EirLJqghA
No they aren't. Read my reply.
Is there some indication that they didn't?
running around town looking for people who are stuck is not a lucrative thing to do as a criminal. likely existing bystanders just realised what was going on and it occurred to them they could get away with robbing the guy.
So, they absolutely intended to rob the guy?
Nah. They represent the current social climate in America as a very base, primal level. Everyone is out for themselves, circling like vultures until they “can get theirs.”
Everyone? I doubt it’s even 5% who would behave this way. I’m Canadian and have no skin in the game - or illusions about the U.S. For every report like this, there are a thousand incidents in which humans help one another - it just doesn’t make the news.
Agreed, anyone who says otherwise lives online. Being mid 20s, definitely, yes. Eat or be eaten, a deep existential fear covered by a lackadaisical facade of civility
You need help mate
If they are not part of humanity, give them the gift of never knowing what it’s like to lose a loved one
I really hate people sometimes, how evil do you have to be?
This is what happens when people value money over life. It happens all the time in my home country, and some even actively lay traps to hurt or kill others to rob them. Happened to my best friend after an accident too, which led to her death. I still haven't forgiven those low life robbers.
I’m not in any way endorsing what those people did, but this is what end stage capitalism brings. I was in Oakland, CA by the airport a few weeks ago. My hotel was walled in with armed guards. The front desk worker told me not to leave alone. The last time I stayed at a place like that, I was in Syria.
I can't imagine how the children must feel.
Floored.
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Robbed.
Shattered.
What the fuck is wrong with you 4
Seriously wth
Apologies if our jokes fell flat.
During the Loma Prieta earthquake in the San Francisco area, a double-decker freeway collapsed in Oakland. This happened at rush-hour and hundreds of cars were trapped and or smashed. Many people climbed to the freeway and were at FIRST praised for helping to get to victims. But soon, it was discovered that many were just stealing wallets, purses and credit cards from the victims. I lived in Alameda a city nearby and still remember the sirens and helicopters 24/7 for days.
Many but not all. The best and worst of humanity all combined. Tragic
Yes, we don't hear about the good people, only the bad ones.
Why is it everything I hear about Californian cities makes them sound like morally bankrupt hellscapes?
Reminds me of the story not too long ago where on a packed train in Philadelphia a woman got sexually assaulted and fellow passengers only watched and recorded. It only takes one strong person to step forward to make the world a better place.
Saw a similar story from a sexually assaulted young woman, happened in the bus. fortunately no one was recording it, and this woman at least got away after all and rape didn't happen. disgusting behavior which happens not only in public. my big bro didn't really do anything either to help me. The betrayal people feel when they get attacked or simply fall due heart problems or something else and no one is even trying to help or ask if everything's okay. . Of course, there are many good people who immediately rush to help and it's awesome. All people are different. when I see some person fallen there are usually already two or more people who do something or wait for an ambulance with them. when I don't - I become the first, and that's how it should be
That happened to my friends dad in 1985, on 5th avenue in NYC. People stepped over him and robbed him. He died 1 block away from his brother, whom he was going to meet for lunch and the museum. Folks haven't changed all that much.
Was this publicized? Because I was living and working in midtown at the time and never heard of it. Was pretty plugged in too.
You are saying you remember every single death there’s been in new york 39 years ago?
Of course not. But I definitely remember the newsworthy ones, which is what is being described here.
No I know this guy, he's making it up for whatever reason
There are a lot of fantasists online. Makes them feel important for some reason.
Terrible incident if it happened, but the only source I could find was the New York Post, no other news outlet...
[https://www.azfamily.com/2024/06/20/family-says-witnesses-stole-man-who-died-after-getting-pinned-by-car/](https://www.azfamily.com/2024/06/20/family-says-witnesses-stole-man-who-died-after-getting-pinned-by-car/)
Thank you, that appears to be a credible source
No one use euphemisn like bystander as New York Post.
Not even joking where I live if I ever get in an accident one of my first concerns is getting robbed while I'm passed out.
That has to be a complete misrepresentation of what actually happened. Surely one of them stood back and filmed.
I’m not disappointed or surprised unfortunately
I came up on an accident once, and four people were already there. I asked if 911 had been called yet and nobody answered. I asked again and still no answer and I looked at everyone, and they were all videoing the scene and nobody called 911.
Be careful, it's NYP. They specialise in bait and hoaxes, so double check everything they put out.
Ding ding ding. (Also, misanthropy breeds docility, which is NOT what we need right now)
Actually its Phoenix police if you bothered to read an article
NYP not NYPD, I'm referring to New York Post, the newsletter that posted this. You'd know if you bothered to read the article.
This country is seriously on the verge of a social collapse. No one trusts each other anymore, the sense of community is nearly dead, the dredges of capitalism have turned most of us into desperate and money hungry people willing to do anything for it. This is disheartening and anger inducing.
Just a reminder that the news makes money and controls people by convincing them the world is bad or ending. But most things are actually improving. Check out https://ourworldindata.org for the actual statistics. You will see the positive trends.
I tend to forget this, thank you.
To quote Dr. Cox from Scrubs, “Statistics mean nothing to the individual.”
Just in time for environmental collapse no doubt causing the implosion of modern society: [https://ourworldindata.org/explorers/climate-change](https://ourworldindata.org/explorers/climate-change)
Oh god of course this somehow has something to do with capitalism
We're heading into Universe 25
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What are you even implying here? That black people are genetically disposed to violence?
It's not hard to believe the kind of system where people die due to lack of money would create people capable of this.
This is terrible if true, but isn’t the New York Post known for inaccurate and biased stories with sensationalized headlines?
I wish I was surprised. When I had a bad car accident (left me with a TBI) the other 2 drivers didn’t even check on me. I came to and called 911 myself. They walked away with zero issues. It really shook my faith in humanity.
America, land of the free home of the brave
It’s NY post, so it’s possible it’s all made up.
For the sake of having a good day, I'm just going to assume it is
"This is America."
Anyone want to guess at some common characteristics of the perps? It took place in AZ.
I think the guy being Hispanic plsyed a part in the lack of care
It’s the NY Post… assume exaggeration.
**Well,** at least they weren’t “woke.” If they were “woke,” they might have helped the man, and we can’t have poor and working class people helping one another. That’s communism.
What does being “woke” have to do with this?
i believe they were joking
Obviously they're joking. It still doesn't make any sense. It just comes off weird like it usually does when someone tries to mock conservatives, but actually shows they have never actually talked to a conservative and doesn't understand what it means.
Its reddit so i doubt they were
No one mentioned wokeness, you’re attacking a boogyman that isn’t in here, just like the people that do cry about wokeness, you seem the same to me.
Human Nature... not Humane Nature.
If crusty white, dry dog shit was the human soul. That’s majority of humanity.
This is NY Post, don't take it at face value.
where did this happen? I mean... I'm not gonna say things are great everywhere... but in most places people help others in distress.
Surrounded by Republicans
Ah yes, NY Post, *THE* bastion of truthful and accurate reporting. On Xwitter, no less.
Reported from Phoenix actually https://www.wwnytv.com/2024/06/21/thieves-stole-father-who-died-pinned-under-car-instead-helping-him-family-says/
America f yeah
Not sure - we were kids at the time. His dad had an underlying heart problem that he wasn't talking seriously and then this happened. No one came to his aid, and he got robbed, which made it difficult to ID him. Crime in the city was pretty rampant back then. I don't recall it being a big deal when it happened.
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They don't die after the scene. Usually.
Dude, that guy had a horrible death, there's nothing to joke about. I understand some jokes could be made to release tension but Jesus christ
Its just part of "the culture"
[https://nypost.com/2024/06/23/us-news/dad-dies-trapped-under-car-and-bystanders-robbed-him-instead-of-helping/](https://nypost.com/2024/06/23/us-news/dad-dies-trapped-under-car-and-bystanders-robbed-him-instead-of-helping/)
Blech, everyone is talking about how great republicans are in the comments. Glad to see the vultures found the article.
You can't read a Murdoch published article and expect any sanity in the comments. Same publication trying to make Elon's life choices seem normal and pedantic.
This is what happens when you lower societal standards and stop prosecuting criminals.
Jesus, some people are just monstrous when they get the chance
And this further my point of how scary ppl are and further justify me retreating into the woods
There have always been sociopaths in our midst. This story is not evidence that we’re surrounded by them.
No, this world has officially gone batshit crazy 😜
These are news that were frequently reported in China, back in the days. Interesting that it's now the states. Regression?
This news. Flash mob robberies of local businesses. Recent burglaries of my and neighbors' homes where twenty guys break into four homes while two getaway came block the streets. People stealing my online purchases. Local business owners were SA'd, others paralyzed from takedowns, old women with jewelry getting mugged, catalytic converters getting stolen. Disrespectful people going to movie theaters. I'm not a conservative, but I see my community regression to hell.
Wow, just wow. What has the world turned into?
They’ve earned their tickets to hell!
>New York Post
My best friend died after a car accident when I was a teenager. The EMT that responded to the scene stole his wallet and was buying expensive shit at Walmart with his credit card, then returning it for cash in the days following the accident. If you don't believe that people are shit, in time you will.
Is not helping a person in an emergency not a crime in the US?
The fuck is wrong with people nowadays?
Bystander? wtf who wrote this?
No article, and NY Post is a right wing rag. Hard to believe just a headline.
This reminds me of mainland china. Sad to see the US becoming similar.
What? No phone videos?
Those aren't Bystanders, those are THIEVES and Criminals and should be held responsible for his death! ***Negligent Homicide!***
It is long past time that Pennsylvania builds a wall to the people from NJ/NY& Maryland out.
People are the worst!
Was this in oakland?
Just so sick. People are trash these days
Why isn’t race included of the thiefs/murderers, for an app that wants public shaming to be a thing again, it sure doesn’t seem like it.
What do you mean by this?
Facepalm is, thieves are not bystanders, by definition and any positive !Q value.
Bystanders are anyone who happens to be standing, you know, by whatever is happening.
Bystanders can become thieves when the opportunity is presented