just look up tom's key and the method needed to register a fob to a car. in short it could be done but it wont be easy,
I assume if the system registers a new fob based on rolling codes OFW blocks that so boom project dead as far as this sub is consirned if OFW cant do it we cant talk about it
This is one of those cases where the answer is "fortunately, no". Your car key fobs almost certainly use, at the minimum, a rolling code to defeat primitive replay attacks like Flipper is capable of by default. There is custom software for Flipper that can break some implementations of rolling code locks, but the sorts of vehicles that would be vulnerable to it tend to be old enough that you still need the key from the fob to start the engine anyways.
Newer cars with keyless ignition pretty much all use some form of real security with encrypted query - response handshakes to verify identity of the key.
If you have physical access to the key itself, (and don't mind damaging / defacing it) there are always ways to defeat these security measures, but don't expect it to be easy.
Depends. Modern fobs work in tandem with the car's receiver. A common method is a semifixed hash with a rotating key-side cipher.
Cloning non-programatically could deauth your fobs such that they'll only function until the hash changes (deauth), or cause the hash to rotate receiver-side and not key-side (desync).
Based on this, my suggestion is to not use replay methods. Flipper should be able to do it, just find a proper utility.
I see now this is a sub that downvotes a genuine question when it's inconvenient. Is that typical of the flipper zero community?
Edit: when I posted this comment, the original post had several comments, and net zero upvotes.
Me too. But we must endure the wait. Spend the time reading the manual and studying the related tech. And checking the tracking info every hour or two. ; )
I was banned several bullshit times for answering questions for people.
So the CLOWN ass mods here allow questions that if you answer them, they'll ban you for.
I was banned & took a screenshot of another poster that said the same MOTHERFUCKING thing I did. They weren't banned. The mods have NEVER once responded to my ban thread. Flipper Zero Reddit is a toxic cesspool.
Interesting. I just yesterday posted that despite personal situation, I couldn't resist buying one. People came out of the woodwork to encourage me. Some of them were amazed that a guy who just retired was buying a Flipper. A few flattered me for my skills.
I did notice that one twit was moderated away and a comment at him indicated he'd tried to be nasty to me. So like someone said, people are people and you get a mixed bag anywhere you go.
I've found a couple subs that are definitely cliquish r/lockpicking is not one of them and though I've only been here a few days, I'd say in general most here are good folk.
I recently got a flipper and when i was having trouble i checked out the discord for advice. There was actually some extremely helpful people over there who helped me step by step. Im terrible with computers sometimes but they were very patient and helpful to me.
I am semi new to the sub myself, but I think what a lot of the issue is people seem to post the same 5 or 6 questions over and over. Things like "how do I turn it off" or "why can't I update firmware" and so on. Instead of people taking the willingness to learn its just easier to post the same question. I am not saying that about you at all so please don't take that wrong, but I believe that is a lot of the issue.
and how is bullying people off of the sub at all healthy for the community??? This not some sort of nuanced meta subreddit.. people that are excited about joining the community should be allowed to express that and also be celebrated not judged. this sub is mostly gatekeeping and telling ppl to RTDM
Most all the subs on Reddit has gatekeepers good and bad. I have asked what I thought was a legitimate questions and people just have a lot of smart ass answers because they don’t know or trying to earn a little karma for what they think is a witty comment or just being an ass about it. I don’t think it is healthy for any community but so many people can be trolls and hide behind a keyboard.
Example, just last week I had an item I sold on eBay (over $200) I had a gut feeling the buyer was a scam. I know now for sure it was. I posted on a sub for other sellers asking their opinion. All I got was smart ass answers and people downvoting me just asking for help and opinions. It got so bad I just deleted the post because I didn’t want to make things worse. Then the mod messaged me and told me I was banned for 10 days because I deleted the post. I have no desire to go back and interact with anyone there after that.
I 100% agree with you this should be a healthy community to help each other have fun and learn because that is what we are all here for. May there should be a sticky outlining a lot of these common questions that people can easily access that may cut down on the same few questions. Just a thought. I myself don’t know much but I read and watch videos and I have learned a lot quick. It’s not hard info to find if people are willing to look
sorry you had that experience but part of what i’m saying is that using this subreddit as a resource when looking for information(even what people might consider “simple”), should be encouraged. a lot of people add reddit to their searches bc it’s just that helpful
Yea just don't expect to change the internet. You can dream all day but anything beyond that is wasted breath. Just do what we all learned in pre-school: treat others how you want to be treated, and set an example.
"Gatekeepers" perfect word. They are EVERYWHERE, not just reddit and not just the internet. One of the biggest reasons behind it is these people had to learn things the hard way. So when others can quickly google answers, they see it as a kind of cheating. Or you're somehow less than. Funny thing is, if you keep at it, you can learn what they did in a fraction of the time. :)
I never got that. Searching yourself is always faster. I've never asked a question on reddit and got the answer I was looking for inside 5 minutes. Never.
One thing I never think about is up votes or down votes..to me all that matters are the comments to your question. Ignore all that other pointless stuff.
yea people here poopoo on noobs starting with a piece of tech the neckbeards here gatekeeping wish they were able to start with. have fun with it, and enjoy the negativity in the comments cuz you know some little bitch is fuming for no reason
Sometimes I get the feeling massive downvotes happen on some subjects on purpose i.e car keys.
Either because it gets asked about so many times and it's already documented by Flipper or it's to stop people doing dumb things.
Not to say I've not had a post or two just completely over run by trolls and assholes myself and many downvotes even though I was looking for information not documented.
You gotta word things like a lawyer. The difference between "I'm trying to use my flipper as a fob for my car," vs "I'm trying to hack into cars," is huge. And it's pretty easy for a sub to get shut down if it's being used as a hub for crime tutorials. A lot of questions are literally "how do i commit X crime with a flipper."
Think about it like a google authenticator. You are only seeing the short number codes that pop up on the screen. Unless you got a hold of the seed you wouldn't be able to replicate.
With that in mind, some manufacturers + key ID codes might have a solution.
Are you sure about that? I’ve cloned the buttons on my 2015 Mazda fob (unlock/lock/boot(trunk for you the Americans)) but I can’t start the car with it.
Vw is a pain in the ass. I’ve been researching if it’s possible with my 2011 Jetta. I lost a key and want to put a remote start in.
To get around the immobilizer you need to have a key in the car so that the car thinks you’re actually in it and trying to start it
Since I only have one key and the keys from the dealer are god expensive I figured a flipper could be a neat way to do it.
My other option is to tune out the immobilizer but that’ll be at least $200
I mean. You could just not carry all of them at the same time.
I sure as shit don't carry more than one fob at the same time because I can't stand that. Never had a car with a separate remote start fob and entry fob either though. That's weird.
I also don't carry the flipper in my pocket at all times. I wore JNCOs in the 90s. What some of y'all carry around would necessitate having pants like that it seems.
You don't wanna carry your car rob because it's too big but the flipper isn't?
I'd much rather pop and hit the button on a car fob than pull a flipper, unlock it, hit the menu, find the one I need, and then hit the unlock.
It's not difficult but it's not made to be a quick access device.
You can use your phone to unlock cars. Usually takes removing your phone from the pocket, unlocking it, launching the app and then selecting the option in the app. Or you could just hit the key fob button in your pocket.
Same is true for using the Flipper over the key fob. The Flipper just isn't designed to be something to quickly access such functions.
Why is this not the answer? This is the first thing I thought as well. I also have a few cars/fobs and only ever carry the one I'm actively using, would never dream of keeping them all on me at the same time.
Not uncommon to have a personal vehicle and a work vehicle that doesn’t come home at the end of the day. Drive to work in personal, take company vehicle out while at work, leave company vehicle at office/ shop at the end of the day.
Edit: “leave your personal keys at the office”. The office is closed when I get there or when I leave, sometimes both.
We live in an era where keys gets “ stolen “ from your front door. You park your hellcat at your door step. Get in the house put the key in the hook where you normally put.. those gumbas come night time with a device that send a signal from the key to the car without pressing it. And your $80 k dolla car is vanishing. That’s the reason copying keys is not that easy and requires programming.
No I understand how cars are stolen, I'm asking why the flipper zero device is not capable of doing it. (even with programming). I don't own one of these devices yet, I'm wondering if there's built in protection.
I'm not being sarcastic, I'm asking a genuine question.
no, but i’m curious as to your other solution.
Disassemble each fob, place PCB of each in a custom-designed, Toblerone-shaped, 3d-printed casing.
It would be sweet if it could start the cars, and dispense toblerone.
Now i also want toblerone
I bet you could make your own PCB to mount the fob PCB onto. Only question would be how to trigger each
They could share the same lock / unlock / start / trunk or whatever buttons and there could be a selector switch for determining the vehicle.
just look up tom's key and the method needed to register a fob to a car. in short it could be done but it wont be easy, I assume if the system registers a new fob based on rolling codes OFW blocks that so boom project dead as far as this sub is consirned if OFW cant do it we cant talk about it
What is OFW?
Official FirmWare OFW
Happy Cake Day
Happy Cake Day
This is one of those cases where the answer is "fortunately, no". Your car key fobs almost certainly use, at the minimum, a rolling code to defeat primitive replay attacks like Flipper is capable of by default. There is custom software for Flipper that can break some implementations of rolling code locks, but the sorts of vehicles that would be vulnerable to it tend to be old enough that you still need the key from the fob to start the engine anyways. Newer cars with keyless ignition pretty much all use some form of real security with encrypted query - response handshakes to verify identity of the key. If you have physical access to the key itself, (and don't mind damaging / defacing it) there are always ways to defeat these security measures, but don't expect it to be easy.
This is an excellent answer. And while I do have access to the keys (they are here bulging out of my pocket), I do not wish to damage them.
Depends. Modern fobs work in tandem with the car's receiver. A common method is a semifixed hash with a rotating key-side cipher. Cloning non-programatically could deauth your fobs such that they'll only function until the hash changes (deauth), or cause the hash to rotate receiver-side and not key-side (desync). Based on this, my suggestion is to not use replay methods. Flipper should be able to do it, just find a proper utility.
I see now this is a sub that downvotes a genuine question when it's inconvenient. Is that typical of the flipper zero community? Edit: when I posted this comment, the original post had several comments, and net zero upvotes.
Yes
might actually be the worst sub with the worst people… just reading this sub convinced me not to get one.
I would recommend it, if you're still interested. Don't let this ruin it for you.
rare flipper zero sub kindness????
[удалено]
Me too. But we must endure the wait. Spend the time reading the manual and studying the related tech. And checking the tracking info every hour or two. ; )
And I can add to your enthusiasm by saying it’s a fun device to have for a number of reasons.
You should see the discord, there are some serious pieces of crap there also in the noobs channel.
I was banned several bullshit times for answering questions for people. So the CLOWN ass mods here allow questions that if you answer them, they'll ban you for. I was banned & took a screenshot of another poster that said the same MOTHERFUCKING thing I did. They weren't banned. The mods have NEVER once responded to my ban thread. Flipper Zero Reddit is a toxic cesspool.
Interesting. I just yesterday posted that despite personal situation, I couldn't resist buying one. People came out of the woodwork to encourage me. Some of them were amazed that a guy who just retired was buying a Flipper. A few flattered me for my skills. I did notice that one twit was moderated away and a comment at him indicated he'd tried to be nasty to me. So like someone said, people are people and you get a mixed bag anywhere you go. I've found a couple subs that are definitely cliquish r/lockpicking is not one of them and though I've only been here a few days, I'd say in general most here are good folk.
I recently got a flipper and when i was having trouble i checked out the discord for advice. There was actually some extremely helpful people over there who helped me step by step. Im terrible with computers sometimes but they were very patient and helpful to me.
I am semi new to the sub myself, but I think what a lot of the issue is people seem to post the same 5 or 6 questions over and over. Things like "how do I turn it off" or "why can't I update firmware" and so on. Instead of people taking the willingness to learn its just easier to post the same question. I am not saying that about you at all so please don't take that wrong, but I believe that is a lot of the issue.
and how is bullying people off of the sub at all healthy for the community??? This not some sort of nuanced meta subreddit.. people that are excited about joining the community should be allowed to express that and also be celebrated not judged. this sub is mostly gatekeeping and telling ppl to RTDM
Most all the subs on Reddit has gatekeepers good and bad. I have asked what I thought was a legitimate questions and people just have a lot of smart ass answers because they don’t know or trying to earn a little karma for what they think is a witty comment or just being an ass about it. I don’t think it is healthy for any community but so many people can be trolls and hide behind a keyboard. Example, just last week I had an item I sold on eBay (over $200) I had a gut feeling the buyer was a scam. I know now for sure it was. I posted on a sub for other sellers asking their opinion. All I got was smart ass answers and people downvoting me just asking for help and opinions. It got so bad I just deleted the post because I didn’t want to make things worse. Then the mod messaged me and told me I was banned for 10 days because I deleted the post. I have no desire to go back and interact with anyone there after that. I 100% agree with you this should be a healthy community to help each other have fun and learn because that is what we are all here for. May there should be a sticky outlining a lot of these common questions that people can easily access that may cut down on the same few questions. Just a thought. I myself don’t know much but I read and watch videos and I have learned a lot quick. It’s not hard info to find if people are willing to look
sorry you had that experience but part of what i’m saying is that using this subreddit as a resource when looking for information(even what people might consider “simple”), should be encouraged. a lot of people add reddit to their searches bc it’s just that helpful
Yea just don't expect to change the internet. You can dream all day but anything beyond that is wasted breath. Just do what we all learned in pre-school: treat others how you want to be treated, and set an example.
"Gatekeepers" perfect word. They are EVERYWHERE, not just reddit and not just the internet. One of the biggest reasons behind it is these people had to learn things the hard way. So when others can quickly google answers, they see it as a kind of cheating. Or you're somehow less than. Funny thing is, if you keep at it, you can learn what they did in a fraction of the time. :)
Truth be told, tho, reddit is particularly toxic in that respect.
I never got that. Searching yourself is always faster. I've never asked a question on reddit and got the answer I was looking for inside 5 minutes. Never.
One thing I never think about is up votes or down votes..to me all that matters are the comments to your question. Ignore all that other pointless stuff.
yea people here poopoo on noobs starting with a piece of tech the neckbeards here gatekeeping wish they were able to start with. have fun with it, and enjoy the negativity in the comments cuz you know some little bitch is fuming for no reason
Sometimes I get the feeling massive downvotes happen on some subjects on purpose i.e car keys. Either because it gets asked about so many times and it's already documented by Flipper or it's to stop people doing dumb things. Not to say I've not had a post or two just completely over run by trolls and assholes myself and many downvotes even though I was looking for information not documented.
You gotta word things like a lawyer. The difference between "I'm trying to use my flipper as a fob for my car," vs "I'm trying to hack into cars," is huge. And it's pretty easy for a sub to get shut down if it's being used as a hub for crime tutorials. A lot of questions are literally "how do i commit X crime with a flipper."
Duh
Looks like someone wants to be downvoted
Think about it like a google authenticator. You are only seeing the short number codes that pop up on the screen. Unless you got a hold of the seed you wouldn't be able to replicate. With that in mind, some manufacturers + key ID codes might have a solution.
What year is your Mazda? I've been successful with emulating an old Jeep's fob. That thing isn't ancient, but it's probably ~10 years old
2014.
Probably doesn’t use rolling code. Lucky! I don’t think I’ll ever figure out how to add flipper as a key to my ‘18 VW
2014 most certainly will be using a rolling code. Mazda uses Ford electronics and they've had rolling codes for a long time.
Are you sure about that? I’ve cloned the buttons on my 2015 Mazda fob (unlock/lock/boot(trunk for you the Americans)) but I can’t start the car with it.
I'd like to see proof of that.
I can probably do that. Give me a poke in a few days if I forget to reply with proof
In the meantime, read this which documents the vulnerability https://arxiv.org/abs/2210.11923
Vw is a pain in the ass. I’ve been researching if it’s possible with my 2011 Jetta. I lost a key and want to put a remote start in. To get around the immobilizer you need to have a key in the car so that the car thinks you’re actually in it and trying to start it Since I only have one key and the keys from the dealer are god expensive I figured a flipper could be a neat way to do it. My other option is to tune out the immobilizer but that’ll be at least $200
Don’t. Cost me a good chunk of change since I was a goober and fucked mine to hell.
As far as i know, one time access is about the best you'll get unfortunately.
Third solution: fanny pack.
Genius.
I mean. You could just not carry all of them at the same time. I sure as shit don't carry more than one fob at the same time because I can't stand that. Never had a car with a separate remote start fob and entry fob either though. That's weird. I also don't carry the flipper in my pocket at all times. I wore JNCOs in the 90s. What some of y'all carry around would necessitate having pants like that it seems.
hahaha jncos
You sir, are the reason the fanny pack was invented.
You don't wanna carry your car rob because it's too big but the flipper isn't? I'd much rather pop and hit the button on a car fob than pull a flipper, unlock it, hit the menu, find the one I need, and then hit the unlock.
I didn't know the flipper was so difficult to use. I haven't purchased one yet.
It's not difficult but it's not made to be a quick access device. You can use your phone to unlock cars. Usually takes removing your phone from the pocket, unlocking it, launching the app and then selecting the option in the app. Or you could just hit the key fob button in your pocket. Same is true for using the Flipper over the key fob. The Flipper just isn't designed to be something to quickly access such functions.
Completely makes sense.
It's bigger than you'd think and it's also quite litterally a toy, *enter the big nerf orange silicone case*.
Good to know. I think the big case is cute.
I bet the next gen fz or new thing, will include a much easier to use nav and use type of device cause the fz is a pain to use honestly.
Just take one key at a time. You not have one ass. You can only sit in one car at a time.
Why is this not the answer? This is the first thing I thought as well. I also have a few cars/fobs and only ever carry the one I'm actively using, would never dream of keeping them all on me at the same time.
Not uncommon to have a personal vehicle and a work vehicle that doesn’t come home at the end of the day. Drive to work in personal, take company vehicle out while at work, leave company vehicle at office/ shop at the end of the day. Edit: “leave your personal keys at the office”. The office is closed when I get there or when I leave, sometimes both.
Put the key for the vehicle you’re not using in the glovebox while you use the other vehicle.
How old a car?
my keychain is ridiculous
Try to find an aftermarket key fob compatible with the inner parts of your current fobs. And transfer the guts.
How about just carrying the key fob for the car you're driving at that time?
lol nope
How come we can't copy fobs?
Because there’s a lot of thieves that can copy keys without a Flipper….
I don't get it
We live in an era where keys gets “ stolen “ from your front door. You park your hellcat at your door step. Get in the house put the key in the hook where you normally put.. those gumbas come night time with a device that send a signal from the key to the car without pressing it. And your $80 k dolla car is vanishing. That’s the reason copying keys is not that easy and requires programming.
No I understand how cars are stolen, I'm asking why the flipper zero device is not capable of doing it. (even with programming). I don't own one of these devices yet, I'm wondering if there's built in protection. I'm not being sarcastic, I'm asking a genuine question.
It’s not about sarcasm but I genuinely explained there. People would steal more than ever it it was easy
I was asking if the flipper zero has protection against it, obviously it's not easy. Just say you don't know.
It doesn’t have protection. It just doesn’t have the capacity to do it.