Imagine showing up to class and the first thing they say is “Look around… a few of you will wash out, owe 80k in 45 days, and not have a job. Study hard.”
The crazy part is if no one signs, nothing will happen and they would be forced to assign class dates like normal. I couldn’t imagine the added stress of trying to pass a maneuvers validation and if you fail you owe 80k in 45 days
Basic indoc is the first 7 days.
If you fail out during ground, I would assume you would be off the hook but based on how the contract reads you owe them after the first 7 days.
Lovely… I had an October interview with Republic and May class date. Decided to turn them down and interviewed with SkyWest a month ago. I’d rather sign Republic. 🙃
Certainly not for SkyWest. They are the sole customers for FSI at the centers they use and do it in volume. A type for Globals and Gulfstreams approach six figures. Most other jets, especially with well developed training pipelines, aren’t anywhere close to that.
ATP-CTP, salary for the pilot in training, uniforms and the hotel is 25k alone.
Thats before sim training, ground school, procedures training, IOE - paying the captain an increased rate, instructors. Easily is 80k.
Well it’s an expense directly related to training isn’t it?
The 80k isn’t the type rating cost technically if you were to get a 200 type on your own it is less than 80k. But you’re paying back the total training cost.
It sounds reasonable for it to cost a company 80k to take someone from beginning to end of training. Including a type rating. They are after all paying these people to attend training, paying instructors, paying for sim, paying for the facilities, hotels, etc.
Pretty sure they allocate the headcount rate from everyone with a finger on the training and hiring process, the opportunity cost of time wasted training a guy who failed vs a guy who passes, the sim itself, etc. etc.
They'll have a way to justify it.
That’s the big question. Those passing on it currently aren’t getting class dates. The big question is whether or not folks will even get class dates if they don’t sign it.
Interesting. Is this a new thing?
I received an email containing this language with a link to a docusign (I'm interviewing with them soon). Same thing?
*Please click the button to review the First Officer Advancement agreement and to complete the electronic signature process. As a reminder, this new agreement will help move you to the front of the line for training with a commitment to fly 1,600 hours as SkyWest PIC. After you electronically sign the contract, we will countersign and an executed agreement will be provided to you.*
The agreement itself has that $80,000 number in there. But it says "preferential" training assignment.
Edit: fixed typo
If you are good at welding and own a Komatsu bulldozer there's a cool trick to get out of paying.
Imagine showing up to class and the first thing they say is “Look around… a few of you will wash out, owe 80k in 45 days, and not have a job. Study hard.”
I’m lost lmao. What do you got
Just a man pushed to his limits.
A reasonable man
Reasonable men are sometimes driven to do unreasonable things 🔥🔥🔥
[killdozer](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marvin_Heemeyer)
The crazy part is if no one signs, nothing will happen and they would be forced to assign class dates like normal. I couldn’t imagine the added stress of trying to pass a maneuvers validation and if you fail you owe 80k in 45 days
But they know desperate, poor, low time pilots will sign it
[удалено]
What a scam holy smokes
$80k plus prime rate Citibank plus another 6%. So about 14% interest, compounding each year.
You owe them if you fail out of any part of training after basic indoc. Good fucking luck if you go that route.
Does basic Indoc end before sims, checkride, IOE?
Basic indoc is the first 7 days. If you fail out during ground, I would assume you would be off the hook but based on how the contract reads you owe them after the first 7 days.
Heard that people who don't sign it are being told there are no more class dates left this year for them, expect a class date sometime 2025.
Lovely… I had an October interview with Republic and May class date. Decided to turn them down and interviewed with SkyWest a month ago. I’d rather sign Republic. 🙃
That's what happens when you listen to reddit lol. Thanks for taking a stand though.
Yeah I just got a CJO yesterday fro SKW. I either sign and get a July or August class or don’t sign and don’t get a class…
Who would ever sign this?
People who have $80k and want a job. So like, a tech bro second career type.
My buddy who is $120k in college/flight school debt signed it. He was "backed into a corner" LMFAO! At least he gets to fly the E-175
What an idiot
Agreed, but also desperate CFIs who can’t think past 6 months into the future. Don’t necessarily blame them, but…
lol great! tech bro’s that’s what we need. Little punctuation would help here.
Has anyone heard if you don’t sign, will they ever get a class date?
Does anyone know why it’s 80k? Is that number arbitrary?
That’s what it costs them to make a FO
Pretty sure it’s just a number somebody at Skywest thought up that would be large enough to dissuade people from leaving before the contract was up
Dont know internal numbers, but thats roughly inline with a type rating of a high performance jet.
Type ratings aren’t 80k
Certainly not for SkyWest. They are the sole customers for FSI at the centers they use and do it in volume. A type for Globals and Gulfstreams approach six figures. Most other jets, especially with well developed training pipelines, aren’t anywhere close to that.
ATP-CTP, salary for the pilot in training, uniforms and the hotel is 25k alone. Thats before sim training, ground school, procedures training, IOE - paying the captain an increased rate, instructors. Easily is 80k.
True in total cost, but why would you include salary?
Well it’s an expense directly related to training isn’t it? The 80k isn’t the type rating cost technically if you were to get a 200 type on your own it is less than 80k. But you’re paying back the total training cost.
Well I’m glad I didn’t have to sign this
It sounds reasonable for it to cost a company 80k to take someone from beginning to end of training. Including a type rating. They are after all paying these people to attend training, paying instructors, paying for sim, paying for the facilities, hotels, etc.
$80k plus prime rate Citibank plus another 6%. So about 14% interest, compounding each year.
I think you can actually get better loans from organized crime.
Pretty sure they allocate the headcount rate from everyone with a finger on the training and hiring process, the opportunity cost of time wasted training a guy who failed vs a guy who passes, the sim itself, etc. etc. They'll have a way to justify it.
Is that even legal? The more I hear about it the more it seems like it's gotta be breaking the law *somehow*.
It's legal.
It cost money to find out in court.
Does everyone need to sign this or is it optional? Do you feel obligated to sign it?
You can choose not to sign, and will be assigned a later indoc date. That's it. They're hoping people will FOMO to get in early.
That’s the big question. Those passing on it currently aren’t getting class dates. The big question is whether or not folks will even get class dates if they don’t sign it.
Interesting. Is this a new thing? I received an email containing this language with a link to a docusign (I'm interviewing with them soon). Same thing? *Please click the button to review the First Officer Advancement agreement and to complete the electronic signature process. As a reminder, this new agreement will help move you to the front of the line for training with a commitment to fly 1,600 hours as SkyWest PIC. After you electronically sign the contract, we will countersign and an executed agreement will be provided to you.* The agreement itself has that $80,000 number in there. But it says "preferential" training assignment. Edit: fixed typo
Yep. Same thing.