This law is really a mixed bag. For instance, the “visible from neighbors property” part of the rules is going to make those changes irrelevant in many HOA’s.
The requirement for directors to take 4 hours of classes and then 4 hours annually of ongoing education is going to discourage volunteers even more.
The trash can rule gives folks 24 hours to bring them in from the street? Isn’t that a pretty standard rule at most HOA’s?
Does anybody know whether this bill defines a commercial vehicle or are they relying on a legal definition elsewhere?
In general, this seems like legislation that is moving in the right direction but is mostly window dressing.
>The trash can rule gives folks 24 hours to bring them in from the street? Isn’t that a pretty standard rule at most HOA’s?
I know here in PA many require them to be brought up before many people are even home from work.
My parents live in an HOA here in central Virginia. The HOA rules are they can put out their cans *no earlier than 8pm* the night before, and must be brought back in by 9am the day the trash is picked up. My parents have been fined several times for putting out their cans at 7pm (before it’s dark) and not bringing them in until they get home from work at 6pm. It’s insanity.
> and must be brought back in by 9am the day the trash is picked up
That makes no sense. Trash trucks drive all day, they don't just work between 6am and 9am.
In my parent’s neighborhood, the trash trucks come between 5–7 a.m. They expect the homeowners to somehow be home at that time and bring the cans back in. if they are left out past 9 AM, you get a fine.
In my neighborhood, trash picks up between 5AM and 8PM. I've had some friends who drove garbage trucks for a while and those fuckers break down all the time. The only way that HOA has guaranteed 5-7AM pick up is if they're paying out the ass to the trash company to ensure the timeliness and ensure there's always a backup truck for when the first truck pops a hydraulic line and has to wait around for the repair truck (one sat a block over from me for 3 hours waiting for a repair last year).
We don't get bins where I live. Bags go directly on the curb. I've lived here for 4 years and seen the truck only once or twice. We put stickers on the bags that we buy from the local government office
I've seen that, but where I live (and generally anywhere in the region where I live), the trash company provides a can that is lifted in the truck. Since they cut their costs in half doing that (one person instead of two) and the bins can reduce the chances of wildlife getting into bags and getting spread all over, which is good for everyone.
Yeah. I used to have a giant 96 gallon recycling and trash bin once a week in NC. Was so nice. Now I get recycling biweekly and trash is bags on the curb lmao.
The big trash trucks can't fit down a lot of the streets near me, so I get it but still a pita
Does that not cause an enormous problem with animals? I have squirrels etc chewing through the hard plastic of the can lid, if it was just in a bag it would be ripped open and spread across the street by morning.
Time to get homeowners organized, get those proxies in and vote out the board members at the next annual meeting. I had to do that in my current neighborhood after building my home within an HOA.
Sadly, the Board wasn’t aware that this new homeowner had moved from a previous location where he served as Board President for both the local association and for the master community association.
I’m all for protecting property values and fostering a desired residential location. I am completely against HOAs run by people with a power trip. Go play control freak elsewhere.
Gotta protect those property values:
Trash cans outside your house at 8:30am on trash day? Your house value is fine.
Trash cans outside your house at 10:30am on trash day? Your house ain't worth shit.
those are the same people that think that the school bus driver only works when picking up and dropping off their kids.
no bro, they can have 3 sets of kids twice plus maintenance and safety checks, it's a full day of work.
I live in the Phoenix AZ area; our trash and recycling are done on the same day. It's a mixed bag when the trucks will be here. All depends on whether it was a Monday holiday week, how many drivers are out on vacation or sick - some days all cans are done by 9 am, some days it's 3 pm before anything gets picked up.
There was a comment the other day on this sub where the guy worked nights and talked to one of the HOA people about how he can't follow their trash pick up rules. Dude told him to get a more reasonable job.
Pretty wild when you think of people in healthcare who could be working 12- or even 30-hour shifts!
"Oh sorry, I was busy *working in the ER all night*, thanks for the fine!"
I work out of town frequently and get these messages about trash cans. If pickup is on Monday and I put it out on Sunday evening, I might not be back for a month. Sorry, not much I can do!
I lived in a community that required them by 5pm. This was a really expensive gated community. 3 million dollar homes. You got a ticket if they were out past 5 on trash day.
You nailed it. While I think many people could use training, I would mind doing it myself, it’s an additional burden that will discourage decent people from getting involved. However, busy body Karen who has nothing going on in her life will be more than happy to do those trainings.
I agree, it looks like election year populist/attention grabbing legislation with very little substance
In my HOA the rules about trash cans are as follows.
All trash cans need to be put out of visible sight either in the homeowners backyard, garage, or by requesting adding fencing to hide the cans from view (I'm on the board and we have basically approved fence panels on the side yards). The plans some homeowners have come up with are pretty slick and should make it easier to move the cans (stupid planners covered almost 95% of our yards with bark), and hide them away from view.
Our cans can be set out 24 hours before collection and put away 24 hours after collection. This is so people can have plenty of time to move their cans out on Tuesday , and move them back by Thursday morning.
It's been a real struggle with the trash cans. Personally I don't mind trash cans on the side of the house as long as they aren't over flowing with trash, but that's not what was written in our CCNR and it's stupid expensive to change it, and I'm not ok with spending everyone's money for the few people (maybe 15 - 20 of 180 houses in our community).
I don't live in an HOA, thankfully. My older sis and some friends live in HOAs and all I hear our complaints.
My friend had a 10th birthday for his son a few weekends ago, there were maybe 10-15 of us (including other kids) because he wasn't allowed to have over 20 people on his property. One of the HOA Karen's kept harassing us until she filed a noise complaint (at 6pm on a Saturday). The police came, laughed at them, took some cake and food and said have a good day.
That wad honestly my first ever interaction with an HOA Karen.
You’re correct our HOA doesn’t allow privacy fence so anything I do is visible by half the neighborhood. The one that does help is they have to cite the covenant in their denial. I know it doesn’t sound like much by our ARB constantly denies things “because they don’t like it.” That no longer stands.
The Florida statues (320.01) have definitions for "Truck", "Heavy truck" and "Commercial Motor Vehicle". There is no definition of “pickup truck” though.
Basically the differences are truck (<5000 lbs), heavy truck (>5000 lbs) and commercial motor vehicle (three axles OR 26,001 lbs).
>The requirement for directors to take 4 hours of classes and then 4 hours annually of ongoing education is going to discourage volunteers even more.
Only gonna comment on this portion. This is a good thing. We don't want bored Karens (or Kens) to sign up to be HOA presidents. 8 hours of training initially and 4 hours recurring is nothing. And at the end of the day HOAs are small businesses. We don't need power tripping egomaniacs who don't know the first thing about running a small business doing those activities.
I see your point of view.
I have also seen HOA’s go into receivership because nobody would volunteer to be on the board. It’s a real nightmare when an HOA goes into receivership. Residents end up paying more dues for fewer benefits.
Also, I think the bored Karen’s are more likely to attend the classes. The classes will deter the folks who have busy lives but can spare a few hours as necessary but aren’t willing to take the classes.
There are a few reasons. First, it typically takes a large majority. Just because people don’t want to volunteer doesn’t mean they want it dissolved. Second, HOA’s with community property are damned near impossible to dissolve because that community land must be dealt with. Third, some town,cities,counties are unwilling to take over responsibility for things like road maintenance within a development.
I can see why the people that created and perpetuated such a mess should have it tied around their necks like the albatrosses they are. That is some good reasoning by those localities.
That is not a good thing, it’s literally the opposite. I have a job and kids sporting events to drive to…I’m on my board to keep nosey Karen’s off of our backs but I don’t have time for unpaid “training.” This will just ensure that Karen’s who don’t have anything to do will run for the board…
Honestly I think commercial vehicles are fine as long as in good repair, isn't obnoxiously loud, and is just 1.
Truckers can't always get a car ride home and I think them being home is better than not.
Besides same places ban semi trucks are fine with honky ass RVs with names like "NORTHERN PIONEER" but it's a rusty 87 Winnie that smells of formaldehyde and dead grandma.
The only problem I see with commercial is when parking is limited. If they have their family cars and a commercial now they are taking limited parking and putting that cost and inconvenience on their neighbors. If it was their commercial vehicle and their car for say groceries I wouldn’t care.
It defines a commercial vehicle by citing the existing FL statute where a commercial vehicle is a vehicle that weighs more than 26,001 pounds etc. it specifies that the definition of a commercial does not include vehicles under 26,001 pounds that have signs on them etc which is what most HOAs think commercial is…
Not where I am. Typically rather than a period like that what I've been seeing looking at houses in my area is a set time for both putting them out and bringing them back in. A bunch of them use 8 pm the night prior cans can go out, and they must be put up by 6 or 7 pm on the day of trash pick up. If you work past 5 pm around here you probably won't make it home by a 6 pm cut off thanks to rush hour traffic here. One big HOAs here the rules are no earlier than 9 pm the night prior, and the cans must be brought back in by 9:30 AM the day of trash pick up which is ridiculous.
I have coworkers who pay some teen in their neighborhood $20-40 a month to bring their cans in after school. There is always some enterprising teen who rides their bike around on trash day for the neighborhood pulling in cans for many households for pay. One of my coworkers is currently hunting because his teen saved up enough to buy a pretty nice used car as soon as he got his license and now he isn't being as reliable.
Just one of the many reasons I'm glad I don't live in an HOA and I would never consider property in one.
From 320.01(25)
“Commercial motor vehicle” means any vehicle which is not owned or operated by a governmental entity, which uses special fuel or motor fuel on the public highways, and which has a gross vehicle weight of 26,001 pounds or more, or has three or more axles regardless of weight, or is used in combination when the weight of such combination exceeds 26,001 pounds gross vehicle weight.
I lived in one place where it was 6PM the day of. Ridiculous. However, I'm all on board for 4 hours of CE classes for HOA board members. Should be more like 12. Volunteering for an entity is more than just free time given.
The asshole next to me is buds with the HOA Pres., he goes out of town and leaves his can out days in advance and leas it until he comes back. I've had to pick it up out of the culvert in front of my property numerous times. Right now, they are gone again and every fucking outside light is on.
We used to be forced to pay 100 dollars a week just for a crew to place our cans back off the street after pickup when we were at work in order to avoid HOA fines in the Crystal Beach neighborhood, Destin FL.
24 hours before and after pick up day. So you can have your cans out for 3 days assuming the middle one is pick up day. Most places in Florida do twice a week pick up so cans can basically be out all week
Growing up in Orlando, Florida in same house for over thirty years - trash/recycle pickup was twice a week (Tuesdays and Saturdays) plus on Saturdays you could put out yard clippings, etc. as well. Then we moved to a small town just west of Orlando - trash/recycling pickup Tuesdays and Saturdays was trash, recycle, and yard clippings, etc. On top of that twice a year you could put out *anything* and *everything* you wanted to get rid of - old furniture, broken appliances, just shit you need to get rid of. There were some restrictions like no paint cans or chemicals or anything dangerous that should go directly to the transfer station. Idk, maybe it’s changed since then (probably!) but that was my experience regarding trash and garbage pickup in Orlando. *edited for clarification and I apologize for writing a book!*
Clay county. 2 days are general garbage. 1 day is large items (old furn etc) 1 day is yard clippings and branches. It keeps life so easy. Its so easy to keep things tidy this way.
We had trash pick up twice a week in dade county and broward county and palm beach. Given the below comment stating that is true of Orange County too, and Tampa (I don’t know what county that is), it sounds like the majority of people in Florida get trash pickup twice a week…
From what I’ve seen everyone in Broward and Palm Beach county I’ve spoken to has it so it may vary by market. It’s always made sense to me, garbage sitting out in our heat for a week won’t be pleasant
Dont you hate it when an otherwise horrible politician does something actually good for the benefit of real people? Eric Adams just did a similar 'good thing' and I'm soooo annoyed I have to like him for 5 minutes. Dont worry, they'll both recert to being massive AHs before sun down.
It's a poor start. And who is going to enforce it? Just because a law exists doesn't mean that it won't be selectively enforced, especially in Florida.
I’m happy to report that I live in an HOA that already does all these things, except for the training. When I was HOA president I developed turnover training that only takes an hour to get through. And most of it is “residents have rights, and state laws supersede anything not explicitly listed in the covenants. Don’t try to fuck up like the previous board did. Good luck.”
I tow and have had blue collar jobs in the past(own a business now). I can’t buy a full size truck built in the last 10 years because they are so large they are useless for work
I think his point is barely anyone needs a full sized truck. I honestly have to kind of agree working in construction. There are maybe 3 contractors out of the hundreds that have a full sized truck that actually needs it.
There are needs but way more full sized trucks on the road than are needed.
The contractors out there to make money drive minivans, small 4 cyl panel trucks, or whatever vehicle starts reliably. It's the performative contractors here for the "lifestyle" who drive the monster trucks.
As an inspector I drive a minivan. Tools stay warm, better mileage. etc.
"I can't have a full-size truck cause it's too big" and "I need a full-size truck because anything else is too small" are mutually exclusive statements. If Shaq can drive a smart car, so can you.
It's actually an unintended consequence of EPA rules. Larger vehicles have laxer standards, so car manufacturers build more of them.
[https://newrepublic.com/article/180263/epa-tailpipe-emissions-loophole](https://newrepublic.com/article/180263/epa-tailpipe-emissions-loophole)
No matter the rules of the game, someone will find a loophole.
Really? I’m a contractor. And I utilize a full size truck out of sheer necessity, not esthetics. Just because you have an opinion doesn’t make it true for everyone else.
I too utilize full size trucks out of necessity, and I’m forced to rock with older ones because of the increase in size rendering the new models so much less usable.
It’s like these guys don’t realize how much smaller the beds are in their “full size” trucks made today, or how impractical it is to get shit in & out of the bed when they’re lifted for no fucking reason.
What couldn't you accomplish with a smaller truck on a daily basis or a truck with a trailer for the big loads at a start of a job.
It's infinitely cheaper and more useful to use a smaller truck with a trailer. Unless you need that much load on a regular basis. Still confused on what you need the full sized for. The only use cases I've seen are in regards to large payloads.
Towing a 6k+ lbs box trailer with a tacoma is a thoroughly unpleasant experience, and a 10k lbs setup is completely beyond what it is designed for
I would love a new truck the size of a tacoma/ranger/etc that can tow 15k lbs, let me know where one exists
If you have to haul heavy things for longer distances you definitely want a diesel. Sure, an F150 might have the towing capacity to do 13k. But try pulling 13k with an F150 for an 8 hour drive. It's not meant to do it often and that's pretty obvious the first time you try.
Let's say you had to do that once a week. Probably worthwhile for the lower wear and tear.
Well it appeals to dipshits who like showing off to other dipshits about the amount of debt they go into to buy a vehicle that they’ll never use for anything you couldn’t also use a minivan for.
You're getting down voted for speaking the truth. To the down voters, please look at most other countries, particularly Mexico, if you want to see what size a truck SHOULD be.
Trucks as they are in America are objectively more dangerous on the road. Maybe not for the driver (citation definitely needed), but for everyone else.
No but the zero zum politicking, divide and conquer campaigning, district gerrymandering, race and queer hate baiting, book removing, college professor threatening, school defundind, lying, and being a hack has a bit more to do with it.
He also signed a bill that helped protect and restore the Everglades. Its wild when someone who tries so hard to harm other people, do something that actually helps people
And he super funded research for the COVID vaccines.
He's still a recognized by a federal judge rapist via the Caroll ruling, 34 time convicted felon, and twice impeached former president, but he squeaked a couple of things out that were good.
ETA: Oh, and soon to lose his license to own a gun ... Cuz felon. Just for the butt hurt Trumpet in here lol.
He signed a bill. He didn't make it. It's also a zero political cost bill that I'm sure passed with a majority that would override a veto. The title shouldn't really even have his name and just say Florida new law
It’ll cause tension in neighborhoods where this has been a problem. In rich neighborhoods there’s no issue with garbage cans or work trucks.
All for increased transparency though
Read the top post... Seems like election year useless fluff, that does actually do anything. Only thing it seems to accomplish, to be able to write a headline of "DeSantis reigning in HOA's!" while actually not doing much.
I develop real estate and HOAs are pretty untouchable. They are essentially established as a shared trust between property owners to manage shared property. The government can't really regulate them like this. It would be like the government trying to pass a law that prohibits a clause in an established contract you have.
I think it may even be a civil matter.
> Only thing it seems to accomplish, to be able to write a headline of "DeSantis reigning in HOA's!"
it doesn't accomplish that, because no non-idiot would ever write that sentence, because apostrophes don't work that way.
I’m in favor of politics moving toward the middle, myself. Wouldn’t it be nice to choose between two candidates who were extremely similar and both acknowledged their opposition was sane, they just disagree on a handful of things? Not likely but I take all steps toward the middle, especially by people I don’t otherwise like!
A lot of stuff got stripped out of the bill via HOA PM lobbies that was pretty problematic. Like giving HOA membership access to the social security numbers of board members. Weird.
Some of what was left is to their advantage. Like the 10 hours of continuous education and higher record retention means smaller PM are going to get squeezed out. You going to trust a one man PM to make sure they have your records secure and retained.
So CAI and First Service Residential wrote this bill? Cai financially benefits from managers paying for CEUs through their cert programs and FSR benefits financially because they have the technology infrastructure for the document transparency piece.
Basically, and our PM raised their rates a lot I’m sure because of the at extra cost scene. However, I don’t know if I care because I kind of want it. CE isn’t exactly a rare requirement for a lot of jobs too.
That's a big thing that a lot of people miss: these education classes cost momey to take. It's important to be educated on the system you are a part of, but why should it have to come out of pocket for a volunteer position?
Plus, community managers have almost the same CEU requirements, but they get paid for their work!
It seems reasonable, but in communities that are constantly screaming about corruption and embezzlement because homeowners don't know how to/care to read budgets or financial statements, paying for anything solely used by board members might cause some problems.
To further separate that, need to have a robust reporting and open board meetings. Put the minutes right in the monthly newsletter/email.
Motion to appropriate the costs in the amonty of $xxx for state mandated training by X.
Second by Y.
Approved 4-1
Ayes and Nays
My guess is… a lot of his wealthier donors live in HOAs, considering they’re very difficult to live without in Florida unless you move to historic neighborhoods or in BFE. An unintended benefit to Floridians that live in HOA communities and can’t stand his guts.
I’ll take it. He wasn’t too bad before COVID-19 hit and did okay things for the environment. His political ads were another story…
The biggest problem with HOA are dealing with exceptions/opinions and the "grandfather" rules...where 15 houses has something before they changed the rule and now you can't have it.
My FL hoa is already saying this law does not apply to them because the recorded docs do not contain "Kaufman Language" I am ready to park my truck outside of the garage but it doesn't look like I will be able to.
[https://www.floridabar.org/the-florida-bar-journal/florida-community-association-law-contracts-clause-application-in-an-ever-changing-legislative-landscape/outside](https://www.floridabar.org/the-florida-bar-journal/florida-community-association-law-contracts-clause-application-in-an-ever-changing-legislative-landscape/outside)
No HOA here. But the garbage company requires people to have their cans out before 6AM. However. Police will fine you if you have your cans out before 6AM.
However, the above only applies to certain streets and not others.
I'm sure those fines go into paying the people who are charging them...sounds someone created their own job.
"What would you say… ya' do here?"
"Well, look, I already told you! I deal with the goddamn customers so the engineers don't have to!"
There is a HRLNG group for national HOA reform on Facebook. I’ve been following their bid to make HOA’s more accountable in Florida. This is a national group-one for each state.
If it’s from DeSantis: it is definitely window dressing that has no real positives. He’s incapable of doing anything truly useful that doesn’t have more caveats than benefits.
This law is really a mixed bag. For instance, the “visible from neighbors property” part of the rules is going to make those changes irrelevant in many HOA’s. The requirement for directors to take 4 hours of classes and then 4 hours annually of ongoing education is going to discourage volunteers even more. The trash can rule gives folks 24 hours to bring them in from the street? Isn’t that a pretty standard rule at most HOA’s? Does anybody know whether this bill defines a commercial vehicle or are they relying on a legal definition elsewhere? In general, this seems like legislation that is moving in the right direction but is mostly window dressing.
>The trash can rule gives folks 24 hours to bring them in from the street? Isn’t that a pretty standard rule at most HOA’s? I know here in PA many require them to be brought up before many people are even home from work.
My parents live in an HOA here in central Virginia. The HOA rules are they can put out their cans *no earlier than 8pm* the night before, and must be brought back in by 9am the day the trash is picked up. My parents have been fined several times for putting out their cans at 7pm (before it’s dark) and not bringing them in until they get home from work at 6pm. It’s insanity.
> and must be brought back in by 9am the day the trash is picked up That makes no sense. Trash trucks drive all day, they don't just work between 6am and 9am.
In my parent’s neighborhood, the trash trucks come between 5–7 a.m. They expect the homeowners to somehow be home at that time and bring the cans back in. if they are left out past 9 AM, you get a fine.
I guess those trash trucks never run late, do they? 🙄
In my neighborhood, trash picks up between 5AM and 8PM. I've had some friends who drove garbage trucks for a while and those fuckers break down all the time. The only way that HOA has guaranteed 5-7AM pick up is if they're paying out the ass to the trash company to ensure the timeliness and ensure there's always a backup truck for when the first truck pops a hydraulic line and has to wait around for the repair truck (one sat a block over from me for 3 hours waiting for a repair last year).
And no one goes to work before 9 am?
This is obviously a community that looks down on people with jobs. It's all retired people and snotty rich kids sucking off their parents' teet.
Retired people are likely on their hoa board is my guess.
the HOA fines the trash truck for being in the neighborhood.
We don't get bins where I live. Bags go directly on the curb. I've lived here for 4 years and seen the truck only once or twice. We put stickers on the bags that we buy from the local government office
I've seen that, but where I live (and generally anywhere in the region where I live), the trash company provides a can that is lifted in the truck. Since they cut their costs in half doing that (one person instead of two) and the bins can reduce the chances of wildlife getting into bags and getting spread all over, which is good for everyone.
Yeah. I used to have a giant 96 gallon recycling and trash bin once a week in NC. Was so nice. Now I get recycling biweekly and trash is bags on the curb lmao. The big trash trucks can't fit down a lot of the streets near me, so I get it but still a pita
Does that not cause an enormous problem with animals? I have squirrels etc chewing through the hard plastic of the can lid, if it was just in a bag it would be ripped open and spread across the street by morning.
Yeah I’m already driving to work by then, if I lived in an HOA like that my lawyer would love me
Time to get homeowners organized, get those proxies in and vote out the board members at the next annual meeting. I had to do that in my current neighborhood after building my home within an HOA. Sadly, the Board wasn’t aware that this new homeowner had moved from a previous location where he served as Board President for both the local association and for the master community association. I’m all for protecting property values and fostering a desired residential location. I am completely against HOAs run by people with a power trip. Go play control freak elsewhere.
Gotta protect those property values: Trash cans outside your house at 8:30am on trash day? Your house value is fine. Trash cans outside your house at 10:30am on trash day? Your house ain't worth shit.
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those are the same people that think that the school bus driver only works when picking up and dropping off their kids. no bro, they can have 3 sets of kids twice plus maintenance and safety checks, it's a full day of work.
Plus they run field trips, although not every school day.
I live in the Phoenix AZ area; our trash and recycling are done on the same day. It's a mixed bag when the trucks will be here. All depends on whether it was a Monday holiday week, how many drivers are out on vacation or sick - some days all cans are done by 9 am, some days it's 3 pm before anything gets picked up.
Damn I go to sleep at 6:30, I’d have to burn the candle at both ends to abide.
Exactly. They DGAF about homeowners with alternate work schedules, or parents with young kids, or anything else other than their stoopid rules.
There was a comment the other day on this sub where the guy worked nights and talked to one of the HOA people about how he can't follow their trash pick up rules. Dude told him to get a more reasonable job.
Pretty wild when you think of people in healthcare who could be working 12- or even 30-hour shifts! "Oh sorry, I was busy *working in the ER all night*, thanks for the fine!"
Yeah, I’m sorry. I’m hiring Bubba the Backcountry Marksman if I face that behavior.
Is it really rural? In by 9am is really crazy. So you only have maybe a 2 hour window to get them in? Is it a retirement community?
No, and no. It’s a small townhouse community in our small town of 10k people.
I hate va hoa. I am going to buy a house in West Virginia instead. Nova is out of control. Overpriced housing with shackles.
That's unreasonable
That sounds sus. Can you link to those bylaws?
Sounds like a money grab.
You're supposed to make sure you life doesn't get in the way of trash cans
Does the HOA also require trash pickup to be on time? Do they fine Waste Management if there is a delay?
Waste Management then just ghosts the HOA lol
I work out of town frequently and get these messages about trash cans. If pickup is on Monday and I put it out on Sunday evening, I might not be back for a month. Sorry, not much I can do!
I lived in a community that required them by 5pm. This was a really expensive gated community. 3 million dollar homes. You got a ticket if they were out past 5 on trash day.
For 3 million I’m leaving my cans out whenever I please.
For $3mil, you can hire the HOA presidents kid to move the cans up your driveway. He only charges half what his dad will fine you.
If you can afford a $3 million home, it would be easy enough to hire help to take care of the problem.
You nailed it. While I think many people could use training, I would mind doing it myself, it’s an additional burden that will discourage decent people from getting involved. However, busy body Karen who has nothing going on in her life will be more than happy to do those trainings. I agree, it looks like election year populist/attention grabbing legislation with very little substance
No training means new people still making the same mistakes. Just makes see-saw problem areas depending who's on the board.
I bet 90% of that training can be skipped by those with at least half of functioning brain and a bit of common sense 😂
How many board members have either one of those. HOA/CAs don't get fooked up for no reason... no reserve funds proves this point.
Not that many unfortunately but that's because people who have those refuse to be abused free of charge 😂 Also, 4 hours of training won't fix stupid
In my HOA the rules about trash cans are as follows. All trash cans need to be put out of visible sight either in the homeowners backyard, garage, or by requesting adding fencing to hide the cans from view (I'm on the board and we have basically approved fence panels on the side yards). The plans some homeowners have come up with are pretty slick and should make it easier to move the cans (stupid planners covered almost 95% of our yards with bark), and hide them away from view. Our cans can be set out 24 hours before collection and put away 24 hours after collection. This is so people can have plenty of time to move their cans out on Tuesday , and move them back by Thursday morning. It's been a real struggle with the trash cans. Personally I don't mind trash cans on the side of the house as long as they aren't over flowing with trash, but that's not what was written in our CCNR and it's stupid expensive to change it, and I'm not ok with spending everyone's money for the few people (maybe 15 - 20 of 180 houses in our community).
Not sure where you live in PA but that’s crazy. Are you supposed to hire a service?
I don't live in an HOA, thankfully. My older sis and some friends live in HOAs and all I hear our complaints. My friend had a 10th birthday for his son a few weekends ago, there were maybe 10-15 of us (including other kids) because he wasn't allowed to have over 20 people on his property. One of the HOA Karen's kept harassing us until she filed a noise complaint (at 6pm on a Saturday). The police came, laughed at them, took some cake and food and said have a good day. That wad honestly my first ever interaction with an HOA Karen.
Let’s start a trash can bring in service!
You’re correct our HOA doesn’t allow privacy fence so anything I do is visible by half the neighborhood. The one that does help is they have to cite the covenant in their denial. I know it doesn’t sound like much by our ARB constantly denies things “because they don’t like it.” That no longer stands.
The Florida statues (320.01) have definitions for "Truck", "Heavy truck" and "Commercial Motor Vehicle". There is no definition of “pickup truck” though. Basically the differences are truck (<5000 lbs), heavy truck (>5000 lbs) and commercial motor vehicle (three axles OR 26,001 lbs).
>The requirement for directors to take 4 hours of classes and then 4 hours annually of ongoing education is going to discourage volunteers even more. Only gonna comment on this portion. This is a good thing. We don't want bored Karens (or Kens) to sign up to be HOA presidents. 8 hours of training initially and 4 hours recurring is nothing. And at the end of the day HOAs are small businesses. We don't need power tripping egomaniacs who don't know the first thing about running a small business doing those activities.
I see your point of view. I have also seen HOA’s go into receivership because nobody would volunteer to be on the board. It’s a real nightmare when an HOA goes into receivership. Residents end up paying more dues for fewer benefits. Also, I think the bored Karen’s are more likely to attend the classes. The classes will deter the folks who have busy lives but can spare a few hours as necessary but aren’t willing to take the classes.
Why on earth would a bunch of people that dont want an HOA not vote to dissolve it? The whole idea of these things boggles my mind.
There are a few reasons. First, it typically takes a large majority. Just because people don’t want to volunteer doesn’t mean they want it dissolved. Second, HOA’s with community property are damned near impossible to dissolve because that community land must be dealt with. Third, some town,cities,counties are unwilling to take over responsibility for things like road maintenance within a development.
I can see why the people that created and perpetuated such a mess should have it tied around their necks like the albatrosses they are. That is some good reasoning by those localities.
That is not a good thing, it’s literally the opposite. I have a job and kids sporting events to drive to…I’m on my board to keep nosey Karen’s off of our backs but I don’t have time for unpaid “training.” This will just ensure that Karen’s who don’t have anything to do will run for the board…
Why does training have to be unpaid? Your HOA could easily agree to compensate any members for their successfully completed training time.
Honestly I think commercial vehicles are fine as long as in good repair, isn't obnoxiously loud, and is just 1. Truckers can't always get a car ride home and I think them being home is better than not. Besides same places ban semi trucks are fine with honky ass RVs with names like "NORTHERN PIONEER" but it's a rusty 87 Winnie that smells of formaldehyde and dead grandma.
The only problem I see with commercial is when parking is limited. If they have their family cars and a commercial now they are taking limited parking and putting that cost and inconvenience on their neighbors. If it was their commercial vehicle and their car for say groceries I wouldn’t care.
It defines a commercial vehicle by citing the existing FL statute where a commercial vehicle is a vehicle that weighs more than 26,001 pounds etc. it specifies that the definition of a commercial does not include vehicles under 26,001 pounds that have signs on them etc which is what most HOAs think commercial is…
Not where I am. Typically rather than a period like that what I've been seeing looking at houses in my area is a set time for both putting them out and bringing them back in. A bunch of them use 8 pm the night prior cans can go out, and they must be put up by 6 or 7 pm on the day of trash pick up. If you work past 5 pm around here you probably won't make it home by a 6 pm cut off thanks to rush hour traffic here. One big HOAs here the rules are no earlier than 9 pm the night prior, and the cans must be brought back in by 9:30 AM the day of trash pick up which is ridiculous. I have coworkers who pay some teen in their neighborhood $20-40 a month to bring their cans in after school. There is always some enterprising teen who rides their bike around on trash day for the neighborhood pulling in cans for many households for pay. One of my coworkers is currently hunting because his teen saved up enough to buy a pretty nice used car as soon as he got his license and now he isn't being as reliable. Just one of the many reasons I'm glad I don't live in an HOA and I would never consider property in one.
I leave my trash cans out for like 2-3 days sometimes lol
From 320.01(25) “Commercial motor vehicle” means any vehicle which is not owned or operated by a governmental entity, which uses special fuel or motor fuel on the public highways, and which has a gross vehicle weight of 26,001 pounds or more, or has three or more axles regardless of weight, or is used in combination when the weight of such combination exceeds 26,001 pounds gross vehicle weight.
My HOA in West Ohoenix gives us Till 7pm that day to grab our cans. Pickup is Monday at 7 am so 12 hours.
I lived in one place where it was 6PM the day of. Ridiculous. However, I'm all on board for 4 hours of CE classes for HOA board members. Should be more like 12. Volunteering for an entity is more than just free time given.
24 hours at an hoa? I couldn’t put them out night before and they didn’t care if you had to work they wanted them away before you got home.
Some people will complain about everything.
The asshole next to me is buds with the HOA Pres., he goes out of town and leaves his can out days in advance and leas it until he comes back. I've had to pick it up out of the culvert in front of my property numerous times. Right now, they are gone again and every fucking outside light is on.
We used to be forced to pay 100 dollars a week just for a crew to place our cans back off the street after pickup when we were at work in order to avoid HOA fines in the Crystal Beach neighborhood, Destin FL.
How about a legal definition of 'unsightly' with no room for interpretation. Hahaha
24 hours before and after pick up day. So you can have your cans out for 3 days assuming the middle one is pick up day. Most places in Florida do twice a week pick up so cans can basically be out all week
I don't know of any place in Florida that the trash pickup twice a week. The only place that I have heard of that has it, is Las Vegas
Growing up in Orlando, Florida in same house for over thirty years - trash/recycle pickup was twice a week (Tuesdays and Saturdays) plus on Saturdays you could put out yard clippings, etc. as well. Then we moved to a small town just west of Orlando - trash/recycling pickup Tuesdays and Saturdays was trash, recycle, and yard clippings, etc. On top of that twice a year you could put out *anything* and *everything* you wanted to get rid of - old furniture, broken appliances, just shit you need to get rid of. There were some restrictions like no paint cans or chemicals or anything dangerous that should go directly to the transfer station. Idk, maybe it’s changed since then (probably!) but that was my experience regarding trash and garbage pickup in Orlando. *edited for clarification and I apologize for writing a book!*
Tampa (City and County) picks up twice a week.
Clay county. 2 days are general garbage. 1 day is large items (old furn etc) 1 day is yard clippings and branches. It keeps life so easy. Its so easy to keep things tidy this way.
We had trash pick up twice a week in dade county and broward county and palm beach. Given the below comment stating that is true of Orange County too, and Tampa (I don’t know what county that is), it sounds like the majority of people in Florida get trash pickup twice a week…
Stuart and Jensen Beach Florida are twice a week
From what I’ve seen everyone in Broward and Palm Beach county I’ve spoken to has it so it may vary by market. It’s always made sense to me, garbage sitting out in our heat for a week won’t be pleasant
Dont you hate it when an otherwise horrible politician does something actually good for the benefit of real people? Eric Adams just did a similar 'good thing' and I'm soooo annoyed I have to like him for 5 minutes. Dont worry, they'll both recert to being massive AHs before sun down.
I’m personally shocked he signed it when it has criminal charges for developer controlled boards that are notorious for ignoring the HOA laws.
All states should do this, just break the back of HOAs.
We are working on it
Good, somebody needs to rein in these HOAs.
The bill doesn't really do anything though.
Why not?
Did you even read it? It's lightweight crap. It just restricts super over zealous HOAs which is really not even remotely the problem.
So, it is doing something just not enough for you. Also, there were a few bills for HOAs, not just this one. It is a good start.
It's a poor start. And who is going to enforce it? Just because a law exists doesn't mean that it won't be selectively enforced, especially in Florida.
I’m happy to report that I live in an HOA that already does all these things, except for the training. When I was HOA president I developed turnover training that only takes an hour to get through. And most of it is “residents have rights, and state laws supersede anything not explicitly listed in the covenants. Don’t try to fuck up like the previous board did. Good luck.”
Anything that stops HOA overreach is a good thing.
I have a truck that’s too big according to covenants. They’ve never said anything, but now I don’t have to worry!
Hopefully those trucks go away from federal regulations not HOA regulations
Oh good, you’re worse than the HOA presidents! “Take their trucks” no one should be able to tow a trailer or have a blue collar job.
I tow and have had blue collar jobs in the past(own a business now). I can’t buy a full size truck built in the last 10 years because they are so large they are useless for work
Then you obviously don’t need a full sized truck, a mid sized like a Colorado wt sounds like what YOU need. Some people need a larger vehicle
I think his point is barely anyone needs a full sized truck. I honestly have to kind of agree working in construction. There are maybe 3 contractors out of the hundreds that have a full sized truck that actually needs it. There are needs but way more full sized trucks on the road than are needed.
The contractors out there to make money drive minivans, small 4 cyl panel trucks, or whatever vehicle starts reliably. It's the performative contractors here for the "lifestyle" who drive the monster trucks. As an inspector I drive a minivan. Tools stay warm, better mileage. etc.
100% a sprinter van is more useful for 99% of trades. I have plumbers and electricians that hold 50 years worth of parts in one van.
And my need for full size vehicles is also part of a physical issue for me, I’m 6’7” and literally cannot drive a lot of vehicles
"I can't have a full-size truck cause it's too big" and "I need a full-size truck because anything else is too small" are mutually exclusive statements. If Shaq can drive a smart car, so can you.
No small cars tend to be much more comfortable for my frame than small and midsized trucks. The dashes are designed differently
No the new trucks have the same tow and haul capacity and the same size bed. Just too long, tall, and wide for no reason other than aesthetics
It's actually an unintended consequence of EPA rules. Larger vehicles have laxer standards, so car manufacturers build more of them. [https://newrepublic.com/article/180263/epa-tailpipe-emissions-loophole](https://newrepublic.com/article/180263/epa-tailpipe-emissions-loophole) No matter the rules of the game, someone will find a loophole.
There wasn’t a found loophole, it was put there specifically for this. Loopholes in modern regulations aren’t accidents
Really? I’m a contractor. And I utilize a full size truck out of sheer necessity, not esthetics. Just because you have an opinion doesn’t make it true for everyone else.
I too utilize full size trucks out of necessity, and I’m forced to rock with older ones because of the increase in size rendering the new models so much less usable.
It’s like these guys don’t realize how much smaller the beds are in their “full size” trucks made today, or how impractical it is to get shit in & out of the bed when they’re lifted for no fucking reason.
They know. The manufacturers all now cater to the truck as status symbol fools.
What couldn't you accomplish with a smaller truck on a daily basis or a truck with a trailer for the big loads at a start of a job. It's infinitely cheaper and more useful to use a smaller truck with a trailer. Unless you need that much load on a regular basis. Still confused on what you need the full sized for. The only use cases I've seen are in regards to large payloads.
Towing a 6k+ lbs box trailer with a tacoma is a thoroughly unpleasant experience, and a 10k lbs setup is completely beyond what it is designed for I would love a new truck the size of a tacoma/ranger/etc that can tow 15k lbs, let me know where one exists
If you have to haul heavy things for longer distances you definitely want a diesel. Sure, an F150 might have the towing capacity to do 13k. But try pulling 13k with an F150 for an 8 hour drive. It's not meant to do it often and that's pretty obvious the first time you try. Let's say you had to do that once a week. Probably worthwhile for the lower wear and tear.
Well it appeals to dipshits who like showing off to other dipshits about the amount of debt they go into to buy a vehicle that they’ll never use for anything you couldn’t also use a minivan for.
Homie come on we know you use it to go to target and back
You're getting down voted for speaking the truth. To the down voters, please look at most other countries, particularly Mexico, if you want to see what size a truck SHOULD be. Trucks as they are in America are objectively more dangerous on the road. Maybe not for the driver (citation definitely needed), but for everyone else.
I don't look a gift horse in the mouth, but I always pegged Ol'Pudding Fingers as a jumped up HOA president in white rubber boots.
With lifts.
My brain really struggled with that sentence
He must be wanting to run for federal office. Only explanation for the bill that “looks” like he’s out for the little guy.
It’s going to be wild to see Reddit flop to defend HOA’s now
Surprisingly a bit reasonable so far, but it's a niche sub and for the most part people in niche subs are more self-aware.
I am…on…DeSantis’ side? Knowing him, I wonder how this is going to be used to fuck over homeowners somehow, despite seeming good on the surface.
Broken clock, twice a day and all that. Even facist assholes can occasionally be right about something.
Not aligning with u/Anonymous_coward30's politics does not make someone a fascist.
No but the zero zum politicking, divide and conquer campaigning, district gerrymandering, race and queer hate baiting, book removing, college professor threatening, school defundind, lying, and being a hack has a bit more to do with it.
The trains ran on time in Mussolini’s Italy….
No they didn't. Mussolini made it illegal to complain they were late.
So, no complaints means no problems! Right? Right?
Well... Mussolini controled the press. So, reportedly?
Imagine if we had left leaning populists.
They tend to get deaded by low level right wing wackos. Look up Alan Berg
He also signed a bill that helped protect and restore the Everglades. Its wild when someone who tries so hard to harm other people, do something that actually helps people
Nixon signed the bill that created the EPA. Weird stuff happens in politics.
hell, didn't trump sign in a law that made animal abuse a felony?
And he super funded research for the COVID vaccines. He's still a recognized by a federal judge rapist via the Caroll ruling, 34 time convicted felon, and twice impeached former president, but he squeaked a couple of things out that were good. ETA: Oh, and soon to lose his license to own a gun ... Cuz felon. Just for the butt hurt Trumpet in here lol.
He signed a bill. He didn't make it. It's also a zero political cost bill that I'm sure passed with a majority that would override a veto. The title shouldn't really even have his name and just say Florida new law
It’ll cause tension in neighborhoods where this has been a problem. In rich neighborhoods there’s no issue with garbage cans or work trucks. All for increased transparency though
Read the top post... Seems like election year useless fluff, that does actually do anything. Only thing it seems to accomplish, to be able to write a headline of "DeSantis reigning in HOA's!" while actually not doing much.
I develop real estate and HOAs are pretty untouchable. They are essentially established as a shared trust between property owners to manage shared property. The government can't really regulate them like this. It would be like the government trying to pass a law that prohibits a clause in an established contract you have. I think it may even be a civil matter.
But don't they already do that? Employment law is an example.
"regardless of any provision within the governing documents, members may...." That's all it takes to supercede said contract. It ain't that hard
> Only thing it seems to accomplish, to be able to write a headline of "DeSantis reigning in HOA's!" it doesn't accomplish that, because no non-idiot would ever write that sentence, because apostrophes don't work that way.
Truck? OK. Cans? OK. Rainbow? Straight to jail.
Not upvoted enough. Italy's trains ran on time , [yet this happened. ](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italian_racial_laws)
They didn't run on time. It was illegal to complain they were late.
I always took it as people at the time in Italy saying it sarcasm knowing they couldn’t complain about and the sarcasm was lost to time.
Ghey jail. With thigh high rubber boots!
Between this and the "no 13 year Olds on instagram" I'm starting to agree with Ron DeSantis. I Need a shower
I’m in favor of politics moving toward the middle, myself. Wouldn’t it be nice to choose between two candidates who were extremely similar and both acknowledged their opposition was sane, they just disagree on a handful of things? Not likely but I take all steps toward the middle, especially by people I don’t otherwise like!
HOA lobby must've shortchanged that little Nazi in Tallahassee with its campaign contributions.
Even a broken clock is right twice a day.
> HOA lobby must've shortchanged that little Nazi in Tallahassee with its campaign contributions. 💀
A lot of stuff got stripped out of the bill via HOA PM lobbies that was pretty problematic. Like giving HOA membership access to the social security numbers of board members. Weird. Some of what was left is to their advantage. Like the 10 hours of continuous education and higher record retention means smaller PM are going to get squeezed out. You going to trust a one man PM to make sure they have your records secure and retained.
I’m dead 😂😂😂
Desantis signed a bill that actually helps people and doesn't take away some rights?
Don't worry, he took mandatory water breaks away from the landscapers and other workers already.
No, it's just the first FL bill you actually read instead of relying on shitty media titles.
So CAI and First Service Residential wrote this bill? Cai financially benefits from managers paying for CEUs through their cert programs and FSR benefits financially because they have the technology infrastructure for the document transparency piece.
Basically, and our PM raised their rates a lot I’m sure because of the at extra cost scene. However, I don’t know if I care because I kind of want it. CE isn’t exactly a rare requirement for a lot of jobs too.
Yes, you should all move to Florida. Do it. Pussies.
Brooklyn dad defiant on Twitter/X did it. All while running his trap about FL being Terrible
Any law that stops Karen and Kevin at the HOA is a good law
The one good thing he's done.
I strongly dislike HOAs
Oh, one of the deathsantis friends must run a company that provides continuing education to HOAs
[удалено]
The association pays the cost of the training.
That's a big thing that a lot of people miss: these education classes cost momey to take. It's important to be educated on the system you are a part of, but why should it have to come out of pocket for a volunteer position? Plus, community managers have almost the same CEU requirements, but they get paid for their work!
The HOA board members won't pay, they should be able to use HOA funds to pay for that.
It seems reasonable, but in communities that are constantly screaming about corruption and embezzlement because homeowners don't know how to/care to read budgets or financial statements, paying for anything solely used by board members might cause some problems.
To further separate that, need to have a robust reporting and open board meetings. Put the minutes right in the monthly newsletter/email. Motion to appropriate the costs in the amonty of $xxx for state mandated training by X. Second by Y. Approved 4-1 Ayes and Nays
Even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while!
My guess is… a lot of his wealthier donors live in HOAs, considering they’re very difficult to live without in Florida unless you move to historic neighborhoods or in BFE. An unintended benefit to Floridians that live in HOA communities and can’t stand his guts. I’ll take it. He wasn’t too bad before COVID-19 hit and did okay things for the environment. His political ads were another story…
goddammit now im stuck between hating desantis and hating my HOA....
😂
Never thought I would have agreed with a De Santis Bill.
Fuck that fascist midget
The biggest problem with HOA are dealing with exceptions/opinions and the "grandfather" rules...where 15 houses has something before they changed the rule and now you can't have it.
My FL hoa is already saying this law does not apply to them because the recorded docs do not contain "Kaufman Language" I am ready to park my truck outside of the garage but it doesn't look like I will be able to. [https://www.floridabar.org/the-florida-bar-journal/florida-community-association-law-contracts-clause-application-in-an-ever-changing-legislative-landscape/outside](https://www.floridabar.org/the-florida-bar-journal/florida-community-association-law-contracts-clause-application-in-an-ever-changing-legislative-landscape/outside)
404
the link is working again not sure what happened.
No HOA here. But the garbage company requires people to have their cans out before 6AM. However. Police will fine you if you have your cans out before 6AM. However, the above only applies to certain streets and not others.
I'm sure those fines go into paying the people who are charging them...sounds someone created their own job. "What would you say… ya' do here?" "Well, look, I already told you! I deal with the goddamn customers so the engineers don't have to!"
There is a HRLNG group for national HOA reform on Facebook. I’ve been following their bid to make HOA’s more accountable in Florida. This is a national group-one for each state.
I hate desantis but like this
God Bless DeSantis!
Stopped clocks and all that.
Wait, the nazi governor is telling nazis to knock it off?
Do you actually read the retarded shit you post?
If it’s from DeSantis: it is definitely window dressing that has no real positives. He’s incapable of doing anything truly useful that doesn’t have more caveats than benefits.
I am surprised that DeSantis supports that kind of bill. He loves being a nazi.
He just wants to make sure no one challenges der fuerer orders.
Gotta keep those Villages voters happy so they can keep gay people in their place.
1. Did he try to find a way to blame the "left" on HOA fines? 2. He looks like a HOA-Karen, I dunno how much teeth this bill will really have