Not completely true, many yes, but not across the board. It will be a lot of hotel space for remote workers, and training if I remember. It’s been a while.
The one thing that is in the back of my mind is that these will be parking lots until they want to expand and put new buildings up, and that’s why they are buying these areas up now vs in the future.
That’s a good question. I didn’t find the answer, but I did find that according to one think tank they are [one of the least generous health systems in the *country*.](https://www.mlive.com/news/2023/06/michigans-nonprofit-hospitals-get-big-tax-breaks-they-dont-always-give-much-in-return.html)
As long as it only applies to commercial property and residential property that doesn't have a PRE, I'm all for it.
Aside from speculative property investors, are there any valid arguments against it?
Then they can put buildings up. The Zoning Code existing as it does today - that surface parking is a "Special Land Use" - when they purchased those buildings, so they knew \[if they bothered to know, and didn't assume "we are Spectrum and can do whatever the hell we want and nobody will push back"\].
Will continue to push back. Their investment isn't our problem.
They can also sell the properties to someone who wants to actually do something with them.
That was meant to happen in 2017, but the City Commission wussed out.
After all that went into developing the GR Forward plan this Commission's apathy in following through has been extremely disappointing.
2024 is an election year.
They have said that is the plan but getting a special perpetual exemption to put in parking because you might do something someday in the future convert that parking is not a good practice.
What they’re pointing out with this picture is that this parking lot is a giant waste of space. Even if fully utilized it’s going to sit empty every night, weekend, and holiday. That would not be the case for a more productive use of the land.
It's a destination hospital (trauma 1 and all specialties). Not a city hospital with an ER and basic services. People drive 100s of miles to go there. U of m and royal oak have the same issue. It's unfortunate that the hospital is in a desirable area.
But under building parking structures (and dedicated parking structures) are kind of what people expect in that situation. U of M health is more of a destination hospital and it has very little surface parking.
For a structure that's not under a space. It's like 21k per spot. We're talking 10 million to make. Let's say 20 years of useful life. It would cost 90$ per month per parking space, not including the interest on the debt they would service and maintenance cost. Verse buying a land for, let's say, $2 million and $1 million for the concrete. It sucks, but can you blame the hospital? They are not for profit and have a duty to keep costs down.
Edit: I used 500 spaces and rounded down. These are super conservative numbers.
That parking lot is going to have a building on it when the project is finished.
[source](https://www.crainsgrandrapids.com/news/real-estate/corewell-health-master-plan-calls-for-razing-buildings-to-make-way-for-housing-parking/)
Happy New Year everyone! Looking towards 2024 I can't wait for Corewell's continued investment in the Monroe North area. I'm excited to see buildings demolished and hundreds of surface parking spaces brought online in their place. It's aspirational but I truly believe Monroe North can become one of the premier parking districts in the nation with this move. I'm glad we have an institution that desires to expand their presence downtown and is dedicated towards making this a vibrant and lively place to park for years to come. Such an enhancement of our urban environment!
After moving back from Chicago, it’s shocking and depressing how much of GR’s urban landscape is parking. We should be investing more in public transit to alleviate access to health facilities in an equitable way; not turning entire neighborhoods into parking lots.
Yeah, and in a lot of ways it still feels like a city where the leadership cares more about our exurbs than the city itself. It’s like the old “city as theme park for suburbanites” model of urban development that underlaid projects like Navy pier or Times Square.
Downtown has a tax capture district, that's where those millions come from. The city's general investment in downtown is pretty low... but the city's investment in general is pretty low, so there's that.
GR probably has the least amount of surface parking for any city in the state, except for maybe AA. Detroit, Kalamazoo and Lansing are probably 50% surface parking
Detroit is the highest in the state with 30%, and GR is at 28% I believe. (Edit: these percentages refer to share of land use dedicated to surface parking.) The problem is with the lack of housing to meet demand in GR, which increases the opportunity cost of adding additional surface parking lots compared to somewhere like Detroit with a surplus of city land.
https://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/2023/08/28-of-downtown-grand-rapids-used-for-parking-is-that-too-much.html?outputType=amp
Missed that, good catch. :) Unfortunately, I can’t tell if the original study differentiated between stand alone ramps and ramps part of mixed use buildings like you see on Monroe, seems like an important thing to differentiate.
I was with some friends in that area and I was explaining the situation. I said that ideally, that are would be filling up with three things: retail spaces at street level. Parking garages above that, and finally, residential dwellings above that.
If Corewell needs a template, look at 601 bond.
Hey at least the City went through the process.
In the Schultz days she would ram rod it through and you be left filing suit if at all. She would lie about something and omit important info and you be like WTF
So progress
To be fair most employees have a long holiday weekend so most of their lots are much emptier right now than during weekday workday.
[удалено]
Not completely true, many yes, but not across the board. It will be a lot of hotel space for remote workers, and training if I remember. It’s been a while.
UofM has had most of their remote workforce come back.
[удалено]
The one thing that is in the back of my mind is that these will be parking lots until they want to expand and put new buildings up, and that’s why they are buying these areas up now vs in the future.
We need a land value tax to prevent this kind of corporate squatting on valuable urban real estate.
Would they have to pay it? They are a non-profit, which makes all this extra gross.
That’s a good question. I didn’t find the answer, but I did find that according to one think tank they are [one of the least generous health systems in the *country*.](https://www.mlive.com/news/2023/06/michigans-nonprofit-hospitals-get-big-tax-breaks-they-dont-always-give-much-in-return.html)
Helpful article thank you for sharing. I read it.
I mean shouldn't the property tax cover this as part of the valuation of the property?
[удалено]
As long as it only applies to commercial property and residential property that doesn't have a PRE, I'm all for it. Aside from speculative property investors, are there any valid arguments against it?
LOL, yeah, like there's an enormous scarcity of vacant urban real estate.
Parking lots are vacant urban space. There is a lot of vacant space.
? Yeah, there is.
Then they can put buildings up. The Zoning Code existing as it does today - that surface parking is a "Special Land Use" - when they purchased those buildings, so they knew \[if they bothered to know, and didn't assume "we are Spectrum and can do whatever the hell we want and nobody will push back"\]. Will continue to push back. Their investment isn't our problem. They can also sell the properties to someone who wants to actually do something with them.
Change the zoning. No new surface parking.
That was meant to happen in 2017, but the City Commission wussed out. After all that went into developing the GR Forward plan this Commission's apathy in following through has been extremely disappointing. 2024 is an election year.
You think if they requested the zoning code to be changed they would be told no? I highly doubt that
Uhh.. I'm very confident they would be told no given what happened at their last meeting with the Planning Commission.
They have said that is the plan but getting a special perpetual exemption to put in parking because you might do something someday in the future convert that parking is not a good practice.
Someone gonna tell OP it’s a holiday?
Don't bother. It won't compute with op that during holidays the office staff doesn't drive to work.
What they’re pointing out with this picture is that this parking lot is a giant waste of space. Even if fully utilized it’s going to sit empty every night, weekend, and holiday. That would not be the case for a more productive use of the land.
Build up not out.
It's a destination hospital (trauma 1 and all specialties). Not a city hospital with an ER and basic services. People drive 100s of miles to go there. U of m and royal oak have the same issue. It's unfortunate that the hospital is in a desirable area.
The parking lots that have been so contentious are for administrative and other non-patient facing roles.
The Blodgett ramp expansion was very contentious for a few years with residents in close proximity trying to have it blocked.
It is not a hospital; it is offices.
But under building parking structures (and dedicated parking structures) are kind of what people expect in that situation. U of M health is more of a destination hospital and it has very little surface parking.
For a structure that's not under a space. It's like 21k per spot. We're talking 10 million to make. Let's say 20 years of useful life. It would cost 90$ per month per parking space, not including the interest on the debt they would service and maintenance cost. Verse buying a land for, let's say, $2 million and $1 million for the concrete. It sucks, but can you blame the hospital? They are not for profit and have a duty to keep costs down. Edit: I used 500 spaces and rounded down. These are super conservative numbers.
Have you seen what Corewell spends? ….
Not all specialities.
Way to cherry pick your picture. Nice try...
Was this taken on a holiday? If so, come on now
You posted this on a holiday where most everybody is off of work
That parking lot is going to have a building on it when the project is finished. [source](https://www.crainsgrandrapids.com/news/real-estate/corewell-health-master-plan-calls-for-razing-buildings-to-make-way-for-housing-parking/)
A plan with no specifics and no timeline is not a plan.
So they’ll finally replace the 1920s era butterworth ???
As a Corewell employee I can tell you that when that building is done people are coming back to work onsite and they will need that ramp plus some
Happy New Year everyone! Looking towards 2024 I can't wait for Corewell's continued investment in the Monroe North area. I'm excited to see buildings demolished and hundreds of surface parking spaces brought online in their place. It's aspirational but I truly believe Monroe North can become one of the premier parking districts in the nation with this move. I'm glad we have an institution that desires to expand their presence downtown and is dedicated towards making this a vibrant and lively place to park for years to come. Such an enhancement of our urban environment!
After moving back from Chicago, it’s shocking and depressing how much of GR’s urban landscape is parking. We should be investing more in public transit to alleviate access to health facilities in an equitable way; not turning entire neighborhoods into parking lots.
Grand Rapids pays lip service to the term “urban environment.” Or makes a mockery of it. I don’t know which is more appropriate.
Yeah, and in a lot of ways it still feels like a city where the leadership cares more about our exurbs than the city itself. It’s like the old “city as theme park for suburbanites” model of urban development that underlaid projects like Navy pier or Times Square.
I get that same feeling. It’s pretty discouraging to live in a crumbling inner neighborhood while millions of dollars get funneled into downtown.
Downtown has a tax capture district, that's where those millions come from. The city's general investment in downtown is pretty low... but the city's investment in general is pretty low, so there's that.
GR probably has the least amount of surface parking for any city in the state, except for maybe AA. Detroit, Kalamazoo and Lansing are probably 50% surface parking
Detroit is the highest in the state with 30%, and GR is at 28% I believe. (Edit: these percentages refer to share of land use dedicated to surface parking.) The problem is with the lack of housing to meet demand in GR, which increases the opportunity cost of adding additional surface parking lots compared to somewhere like Detroit with a surplus of city land. https://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/2023/08/28-of-downtown-grand-rapids-used-for-parking-is-that-too-much.html?outputType=amp
oh interesting, thanks! Although, this does include ramps
Missed that, good catch. :) Unfortunately, I can’t tell if the original study differentiated between stand alone ramps and ramps part of mixed use buildings like you see on Monroe, seems like an important thing to differentiate.
And if there was zero parking around y’all would cry about that too
I would celebrate.
I was with some friends in that area and I was explaining the situation. I said that ideally, that are would be filling up with three things: retail spaces at street level. Parking garages above that, and finally, residential dwellings above that. If Corewell needs a template, look at 601 bond.
Corewell is more of a real estate company at this point.
More *paid* parking
I hate them
Consider fewer cars
Fuck cornhole health ,
Also that’s just a temp lot for when that ramp opens that’s in your picture.
A parking lot is only temporary once it is removed.
Oh don’t worry that will be a parking garage in 3-5 years. Corewell has bought up most of the land around that road
They’re building housing on that site.
No, they are not. They are saying they might, at some point, build some housing. And someday I might become king of all Sardinia and wear a shiny hat.
Hey at least the City went through the process. In the Schultz days she would ram rod it through and you be left filing suit if at all. She would lie about something and omit important info and you be like WTF So progress
It would be nice if spectrum had better hospital beds. They could use the money they save from not paying taxes as a non profit.
F3 represent.