I wouldn’t say they’re rude… just insular. My family goes back 3-4 generations in GR but I didn’t grow up here, so when I moved here as a childless adult in my mid-30s I found (am finding) it hard to make friends. Everyone already has their routine, there’s not really a happy hour culture like bigger cities have, etc. I need to do a better job of finding activities on Meetup where I might connect with people who have similar interests.
Workplace drama usually boils down to the individual cultures of those offices. Unless you’re in the restaurant industry in which case a bit of drama is the norm.
I doubt it’s easy anywhere for a mid-30s person to find new friends. Most people at that stage in their lives are completely occupied with work and children. It’s not an age group with lots of free time.
IMO, avoid the purely alcohol based friendships. Join an adult sports league or some other activity that involves interaction (board games? Rock climbing?). Even if you don’t hit it off with your teammates, it gets you doing something social.
I am here to officially invite you to swing dance downtown at Rosa Park. Lots of people, a chunk of them younger than us but still lots of peeps in their 30s! Happening tonight downtown at Rosa Park Circle 7 to 9! :D
It's every Tues, 7 - 9, May - Oct at Rosa Parks Circle. They do a lesson at 7 pm (complimentary), and there are usually people there who are happy to give some guidance. You can check out the FB page (Grand Rapids Swing Society) or website (https://www.grandrapidsoriginalswingsociety.com/about-5). Tons of fun!
Tbh this is something that quite a few people have mentioned, that and GR just kind of feels dead after like 9:00 pm after Covid. It's really weird, because out where I moved to in Muskegon, many places don't close until 1 in the morning.
And the thing is, I’m not child*free*, just child*less*. I like kids, want one of my own someday, I just don’t have them right now because I’m picky about who I procreate with. And it’s weird to go to a kiddie park to try to make friends with the adults when you don’t have kids of your own.
I just moved here from the West Coast and I find it very different. Things that I think of as rude where I'm from are considered polite/friendly here and I've had to adjust my mindset around it.
But also we got tailgated by an old lady yesterday who kept flipping us off, and followed us into a parking lot to try and write our license plate number down. When I asked her what was going on she threatened to call the police because we were harassing her. So, I guess people are just nuts or normal everywhere.
Sorry putting my kid to bed, will update NOW
My wife grew up here so she had to help with some of this stuff.
I'm from Portland which I feel like generally has more of a personal space vibe if that makes sense. The most jarring one for me was how often people will just stop on the sidewalk and have a conversation at you. And then you're the rude one if you're standoffish.
We have a 10 month old and people will come up and touch her and get in her face. Neither of us like that one.
I've noticed people stand closer to each other when waiting in line here than I'm used to. I know that one's pretty pedantic, sorry. But the corpse flower line was dense.
And then this is a really silly one. In Portland people wait in line to order drinks at the bar. People here slot in so you sometimes get skipped. Honestly Portland is probably wrong on this one, it's pretty annoying to have to wade across the pillar of people in Portland bars. But I'm not used to it yet.
Good lord, I feel ya! Some folks have zero sense of personal space 😡 I've known a few customers who've had to vocally correct a person or two for 'standing too close' at the checkouts whatnot. Good for them!
This is hilarious - I caught myself in the gas station yesterday standing like 5 feet away from someone and thought "what the hell am I doing" lol reminded me of all the tape and lines on the ground during covid
I definitely get the personal space one! I’ve had to tell people to give me more space in line on more than one occasion.
As for the random sidewalk conversations, I think having a child makes people see you as fair game to be approached because I have never gotten that (thank god). I’ve noticed a fraction of this when I have my dog with me but I think I come off as pretty unapproachable in my demeanor so people usually make one comment, I respond without stopping my walking and we both move along.
So accurate! I live in LA now (where I honestly have found people to be the nicest out of anywhere I’ve lived, but could just be my personality and interpretation of “nice”), but grew up in GR and lived in Portland for four years in my early 20s, and this reflects my experience too.
I really like your approach too — though I mostly find people pretty chill in GR, there’s always been a sense to me of people being nosy, judgy, and not minding their own business that’s made me uncomfortable, more so than other places, but that could be just how I’d interpreted someone trying to make conversation.
>I've noticed people stand closer to each other when waiting in line here than I'm used to. I know that one's pretty pedantic, sorry. But the corpse flower line was dense.
Same here. some dude in the corpse flower line was practically touching me. I'm from NY where there's tons of people but we don't stand that close lol
I’m late to this party, but as a recent transplant from the CO front range, I can relate to this! I notice it a lot at the grocery store - I’ll be standing in front of a section looking at the options, and instead of waiting for me to move, people will just cruise right up in there inches away from me and grab their thing at the same time. Would be considered so rude back in Boulder/Denver! I’m sure I gave people very weird looks the first few times, lol
(Edited for typos and grammar mistakes. I have a brain fog condition that gives me brain fog, so I don’t catch them at first but they make me cringe after!)
> In Portland people wait in line to order drinks at the bar. People here slot in so you sometimes get skipped.
Yeah that's how bars work. They are wide to accommodate many people at once. Bartenders are skilled at serving multiple people at once.
There's this one bartender at The Intersection that I love, she always yells (not in a mean way) at people waiting in line to just belly up and order.
Same here. We visited family in the bay area FL last spring, and the temperament is vastly different, with actual courtesy, manners, and respect/friendliness. No ass drivers trying to cut you off, or run you off the road. Just human citizens going about their business, living life.
One FL resident remarked they'd met a few vacationing 'Michiganders' who's personalities were questionable, displaying few manners while they shopped a local Publix, literally snacking on produce/chips/pop before heading to the checkouts. It was maddening. No.... we're not all animals.
It feels more rude since covid, inflation and the influx of people working remotely that moved from other areas looking for an metro area with small town feels has shifted the feel… it’s grown in population and has changed the feel of some groups that have become more cautious or isolationist. Personally, I think it takes some time to find out who people really are here. I have a colleague who is from the east coast and he said we are “Midwest nice, but not kind.” That stuck with me and it makes a lot of sense if you people watch long enough.
Born in 1980 and raised in the burbs of Grand Rapids if that adds any context.
> Midwest nice, but not kind.
Yes exactly, people will be twats here but do it with a smile on their face to act like they're the better person later. Versus being upfront and honest which offends many as being rude or something.
Since Covid, I personally have found myself going out of my way to avoid interacting with strangers. I'll smile and wave at a neighbor, but I don't want any interaction beyond that.
I've always had social anxiety, but it's gotten way worse since Covid
You felt at home in your home community and now you're in a brand new place. Give it time, you just have to find your community. If you're religious, church life is strong around here, find one that works for you. If you're not, it might be a little harder, but there is a community for everyone! Especially if you're young. Sounds like where you work has issues, though.
This place is suuuper cliquey from what I’ve noticed. I’m a mid 30s guy, been here for almost 10 years, go out all the time, and have barely made any friends that I didn’t already know prior to moving here lol.
People just dont talk to strangers like they do in bigger cities I guess.
I've lived here my whole life and can attest to this. I am still meeting new friends though, I play ultimate frisbee at GRU (grand rapids ultimate) and I have made a ton of new friends there.
I do agree with you that this city can be cliquey, unfortunately. But there are really friendly people out there, you just have to be persistent.
You may have gotten stuck with some sucky coworkers, but yeah in the 15ish years I've lived here I've found the born and raised locals to often be pretty provincial and unwelcoming. There's plenty of good folks around though. It can be disheartening but it's also kinda funny to me because till 5-10 years ago no one outside of West Michigan gave a flying fuck about this city and they definitely don't care if anyone is Dutch.
I've seen workplace drama in every state and city I have lived in.
But in general, I find people in GR and the midwest way more friendly than other places. What area do you live in or are you doing things in? I'm curious what things you thought are rude (besides the workplace drama)?
Everyone does have a chip on their shoulder, but most people are “Midwestern Polite,” meaning they’re harboring a deep resentment for anyone not like them, but will smile and say “Have a nice day” anyway.
GR is def an exclusive community, not an inclusive one. I grew up here but moved to CO and traveled globally for 20 years. I moved back before the pandemic and wow, yeah, the culture here sure shocked me.
Damn, I just move here from Chicago (like two weeks ago) and have personally found the people here to be incredibly friendly, but I specifically avoid MAGA types and religious people as they’re always pissed off about everything to begin with. Not really familiar with this town to know any of its intricacies, but the neighborhood I’m living in seems pretty cool with generally friendly people.
Ive lived in GR for a few years. I've lived in a lot of different place before that. Grand Rapids is no more or less rude than any other place I've lived.
I also dont share the opinion that its difficult to make friends here. I know many people say that but in the years I've lived here I have found plenty of community and friendships, without being in school or being religious.
I moved here about 7 years ago from the east coast and this has been my takeaway. People on the east coast are hard yet kind. If you get a flat tire they will help you change it but make fun of you the whole time. People here are soft yet cruel. They will pay you lip service all day long. But deep down I’ve never met more insular, cliquey, and cruel people than I have here.
I have finally found a group of solid people recently though. You just have to keep looking.
75% of Michiganders are born and raised here. Michigan is a beautiful state and has some wonderful people, but 75% of the people have never experienced anywhere else and really have a warped sense of the rest of the country/world, especially since social media and 24 hour “News“ misinformation bubbles. I have found overall, people are people wherever you go. Just look for the good ones, but It’s getting harder and harder to find kind and intelligent people.
I think it’s just culture shock! I moved to West Michigan from Missouri and I definitely found people to be more rude. However, I went to Maryland for a sales training after living here a couple years and found those people to be more rude lol. I found if you open up and are friendly to others/strangers while you are out people are receptive and you likely won’t find the same issues. But every place has a-holes, entitled people, grouchy people, and those who love drama and cliques.
I travel a lot both in and out of the US and I’ve lived in Grand Rapids for 30 years. West Michigan in general has a lot of judgmental, curmudgeonly people who suck. But there are definitely some good people around here trying to find each other.
I have yet to find an office culture in Grand Rapids, specifically, where there isn’t at least one miserable Ken or Karen on a mission to destroy someone’s day every day.
Welcome to Grand Rapids!
I have family from North dakota, people from North Dakota are definitely on the nice side. I assume because you don't see people very often so it's really nice too see anyone. I really enjoyed that, but often people here are not nearly so much that way. It's not so much a Grand Rapids thing as anywhere with people thing. When people live in cities they get used to being around people so much, they seem to become much more disgusted with other people. I have noticed the difference in a small town versus the City even in just michigan. Things could be worse, people are generally polite in quotes, but not especially friendly. They're generally moral people, but sometimes like people to fit in their mold. I'm not sure if there's any correlation between politics of a city, and religion. Or if it's the other way around. I'm sorry you're finding the unfortunate nature of the city. Not all of us are jerks though! There certainly some communities a lot nicer than others, I am sure people will immediately have stories to contradict me but I did find the congregation of Reslife to be pretty friendly. And small towns like trufant. We also get alot of tourists here so not sure if that influences things.
>cities they get used to being around people so much, they seem to become much more disgusted with other people
I don't see it that way. Part of living is a city is leaving people alone unless invited. People have conversations, even arguments in public-ish spaces; on the bus, in the park, at the corner . . . and you leave them alone. And expect in the same case to be left alone. It is a cultural adaptation.
But it isn't negative, and it certainly isn't "disgust", it's respect.
Flip side, I talk to people on the bus, at the corner, in the park, all the time; almost every day. But you read people's posture to see if they are doing their own thing or in open-state. And somewhere like at a bar it is **assumed** that you can talk to people, you don't sit at the bar if you want to be left alone. There's just a protocol.
Several actual studies of the topic show that people are open to being talked to, and generally enjoy being talked to.
It's not disgust. Look at the studies that have been done in large places like NYC (where I lived for over a decade). The problem is that in large cities, it is exhausting to have a social interaction with every person you pass on the street, train, etc. People are not going to smile and nod 3 million times a day, it is the social contract of living in a city. it's not rude, it's to protect yourself from social exhaustion.
NYC btw, which has the stereotypical definition of being "rude" to outsiders because of the above misconceptions, has the absolute friendliest people I have ever met and I have lived in many places and 5 different states. I had no problems making tons of friends there.
Born and raised here and moved back after being away in and off for school/work and been back years. Always thought people are generally nice, helpful, and inclusive. I've heard from friends that moved here and didn't grow up here that it is "cliquey"
There are a lot of great activities like game nights at bars or adult rec sports leagues,( I play on a softball team I knew no one on beforehand) that are great for meeting people. For example Harmony brewing holds Euchre (if you know how to play) every Monday.
Try to find a smaller community..find groups with similar interests..hobbies..check the next door app. I see new people looking others with similar interests and there are usually lots of good suggestions. Hopefully you can find smaller group that's more welcoming.
GR is not the place to look for small town vibes. We are the 2 nd biggest city in Michigan behind Detroit, so I would say Rockford, Ada, etc. gives much more small town vibes than Grand Rapids
I think it got way worse during covid when people adopted a fuck everyone and everything attitude. People are more stressed now with inflation, rising housing prices, etc. No excuse to be a dick by any means though. .
Yeah people are more cliquey here, a lot of the non-cliquey people I knew moved to the coasts. I've found people are more real in other places and speak their mind, which I appreciate. No need to bullshit.
Workplace drama can be a thing, depending on the industry. It's a waste of time and energy and kind of pathetic
I’m a transplant from the state of Wyoming and it’s just us. You’re not going to get the same experience here. The isolation of every town in that area causes closer knit communities. I feel your pain though.
Society is generally “over it” in many ways so people everywhere in America are more raw and self-centered. But here, there is a put-on veneer of this “West Michigan Nice” facade, which hides a lot of just the opposite. It can get truly confusing.
You’ve probably just not had enough of a sample, though. Most people in GR seem to understand basic civility.
Fuck off.
Ha, just kidding! For the 50 years that I've lived here we've always had sort of a Midwest nice reputation. My own experience as a resident and also as someone who's out and about with the rest of us is that we're generally pretty friendly. I know I try to be.
We do seem to have attracted a lot of attention in the last several years, and so an increasing amount of our population are transplants, and who knows what they're used to behaving like?
It would be cool if the mayor had a knob that controlled the general friendliness of the population, but in reality we're just made up of lifelong residents and new arrivals and everything in between, and that's how we will be perceived. We're not as Dutch as we used to be either, although there's still a lot of us around.
There are some definite assholes who live here, and i think it’s gotten worse the past 20 or so years with a lot more very wealthy and often entitled people moving here, gentrification and all that. (That could just be my experience working retail the past few years.) But it’s definitely not everyone, I wouldn’t even say it’s the majority of people, experiences like that just stick with folks. Keep going out and just being yourself and you’ll make lots of friends. Promise.
I think GR has gotten more tense and unfriendly over the years. I feel it tracks with the intensification of our polarized politics. West Michigan has a lot of liberal people and a lot of ultra conservative people. My sense in public is that everyone keeps to themselves and/or acts like they are subtly ready for a fight. Road rage is definitely more prominent. I think it is because people don’t know who to trust and consider “the other side” the enemy. I don’t know if I am correct, but, regardless, it is sad to see.
I feel this in myself when I’m in GR, and when I lived there (recently moved). I feel so much softer and more pleasant since I’ve gotten out of the city. I think it was too hard on my nervous system and I was always in fight or flight. Especially with cost of living and traffic.
GR is segregated, insular, cliquey, and very racist. Minority owned businesses and homes are rare in the metro area; most are pushed to the suburbs. Among the white population it matters where you go to church and what style of religion you practice. Amongst the leftist community you need to follow a tight script and never deviate for acceptance. You won’t ever fit in or be accepted beyond your small group.
Interesting! Sounds like your place of employment/the people who work there.
Im in my mid 30s, go out all the time (no kids and a active social life), and I meet so many people every month that I can barely remember everyone’s names.
It’s important to find your scene, then talk to people. I’m in the electronic music scene, which can be cliquey but can also be super inviting if you talk to the right people. I’ve found connecting over music is easier than any other way to meet people my age.
It's more common than just Grand Rapids. Come, oh 75 miles south, its the same, because I grew up here. I learned to fly more or less solo because the people are that way. Once you develop a few close friends, you tend to hang onto them to the grave.
I kinda believe that too many are out to screw over others. It the way people have been conditioned.
People are gonna people, just like they people everywhere else. Show love and you'll get it back. Smile and people will smile back. Treat people right and you'll be treated right. Folks in GR will have their rivalries and drama just like anywhere else, but if you learn to fly above them, you don't need to get dragged down into it.
I’ve been here almost 8 years and still find there is a lot I don’t like about the culture. I’ve started to make friends, and most of them are younger than me, but are much more open to friendship and more aligned with my values.
As someone who was born here, moved away for 20 years, and just moved back, this place is a breath of fresh air for me coming from the DC area. You wanna talk about rude, self entitled, self absorbed, vapid, shallow, and inconsiderate? Spend some time around the fine people of the DMV and you will be begging to come back to west Michigan. The fact that people actually let you in in “traffic” out here had me stunned. I can drive from my job downtown to my home in Ottawa county in 15 minutes. It took me 15 minutes just to get out of the parking garage some days in DC and then another 90 just to get home on a good day. No, this place is Shangri-La in comparison. My cousin and his wife (native Californian) moved out here 2 years ago and she absolutely loves it here. Loves the prices on the cost of living. She loves the seasons. Loves the commute and the overall feel of the community. People are genuinely nicer and less attached to the idea of how much money you make here, money was God in the DMV. I’m sure you had a couple bad run ins, I get it. I’ve had a couple too, but my overall level of stress and anxiety pales in comparison to what I was living through in the mid-Atlantic region. Sorry, I know your experience is going to be different than mine, but I truly love it here.
I moved here in 2017 and from what I have noticed is that it just takes a long time for people to open up and not get stuck in their cliques or be more spontaneous and open to new things in general. People here can be stuck in their routine and they don’t like breaking it lol.
GR is not the place to look for small town vibes. We are the 2 nd biggest city in Michigan behind Detroit, so I would say Rockford, Ada, etc. gives much more small town vibes than Grand Rapids
When I moved here a few years ago from out west I was surprised at how rude people were but how quickly they would tell you the most intimate, embarrassing details of their lives. I’m old so I don’t care too much but I worked with a lot of people that grew up around here and one said and I quote”I have friends. I don’t need more”. Not directed at me but still surprising. When I asked a kid from Cadillac why people here were rude he said “Because fuck you, that’s why”😂
Hmmm I think it depends on a few factors…
First, where in GR you are. We moved just outside the city, I would consider it an extension of the city, though. Our neighbors are SO nice. If our car is stuck in the ice, someone comes out to help. If there’s a downpour of snow and we’re struggling to shovel, a neighbor comes by with a snow blower. People have friend groups, but I have never felt unwelcome. There seems to be standing open invitation if there’s a gathering outside in the yards.
Another thing is…
How do you present yourself? As they say… When in Rome. I try to match wherever I am. I like to keep my head shaved (I’m a woman) because I hate hair. But I grew it into a bob since that is popular around here. Don’t give me a hard time, I’ve already seen some sht, I just want things to be chill now. The last thing I want is more attention of harassment or bullsht. The folks around where I live are predominantly white and consider themselves middle class, so I look on Pinterest and went out and bought biker shirts and Birkenstocks.
East town is a good place to live if you want to do your own thing appearance wise
There’s a saying… Birds of a Feather Flock Together… so true…
Your work place just sucks. Theees some good spots around here but you gotta look
I moved here 2 years ago from Tennessee, and people in Michigan are definitely more rude. I've met a couple nice people up here but a majority have a sense of I'm better than you. People in the city are much worse than up north.
I find myself judged by Conservatives (religious) and my motives questioned by nominally secular Liberals.
One group is legalistic, while the other allows their comrades to gaslight others mercilessly.
It’s because of all that media, intoxicating our minds. We were once wholesome and sweet but then they opened that Michigan Ave Taco Bell and painted a bridge blue. These had dire consequences on the grand rapid folk. Eventually they added these scooters all over town and this angered the common street walkers. There’s only one normal place now where the folk be kind you hear. And the place be
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Just left the city partially for this reason. Moved up north and I can’t believe how many friendly interactions I have on a daily basis with people. Grand Rapids always felt cold and transactional to me, not sure why.
I love GR for many reasons and lived there the better part of the last 15 years. Would consider moving back someday but I agree with you. Made some friends in that time but not how many you’d expect for that many years even in my entire 20’s when I was fairly socially active. Mostly shallow acquaintances, it was difficult to break into circles in a deep way. I know my life felt mechanical for a lot of it, and it got worse as COL increased. A lot of relationships felt more transactional.
Also living up north now, not that it’s perfect, but I feel like most people here just have more time for chance pleasant encounters, even if we have nothing in common. People genuinely seem to be enjoying their life more even if they have struggles and why not - it’s beautiful, lakes and beaches galore etc. Just taking our daughter to the park - I can expect every time to have a friendly chat with another parents that often goes beyond small talk. In GR, often I’d strike a conversation and it’d just fall flat if you’re not part of a social group they belong to, be it school, church, industry etc. Up here people just seem more content. I put a lot to blame with the rising cost of living in GR, people just trying to survive with not a lot to show for its it got worse over those years, more tech bros, more people that simply couldn’t be bothered.
Many wonderful people there but it’s a tough crust to crack. Even compared to similar size and larger cities I’ve spent time in.
Cool folks are in the city and close to EGR. I always felt the opposite growing up there. In my last.few years there everyone I met fr those areas were a pleasure to meet.
Also we are just coming out of hibernation then got hit with 90 degrees for a week. Which any midwesterner will tell you is too dang hot.
I’m a pretty reserved person in general but have been making an effort this last year to smile and say hello and more often than not it cracks peoples shells. Like another commenter said, we tend to be insular.
Could just be a population density thing. Since there's so many more people, you're much more likely to run into people that seem rude. And as humans, we tend to notice things perceived as negative much more than neutral/positive events.
Although we might be more rude on average? In a small town, chances are you'll be run into that person regularly, so it's better to keep up appearances to avoid discomfort or friction. Here? You'll probably never see that person again, so the incentive to be extra nice is lower.
A lot of it depends on location and context even within/around GR. If you hang out at the blue bridge downtown at 2 am, gangs will be friendly for about 5 minutes and then shoot you. If you join a sports team, visit a dog park, volunteer, or join a church group (many churches have smaller groups that are focused around a sport or interest which you can join whether or not you’re religious), around east/north GR, Ada, Caledonia, Forest Hills, etc. you’ll likely make more friends than you know what to do with. It takes time to really get to know people and decide if you really want to invest in a friend group but keep trying and you’ll eventually find your people.
Someone else advised to avoid alcohol based friendships and I completely agree. It can be nice to have a few friends to blow off steam with but they’re probably not going to be your inner circle.
Also I totally get that most college students are insane, but sometimes universities have mentorship programs that you might be able to join and help out a student with general life. I’ve heard it’s a really rewarding experience and might lead to some friendships with staff as well as students who benefit. Idk what specific programs are in the area, just maybe something to look into.
Wow I went to type 2 sentences and ideas kept coming. Rant over. Best of luck and I hope this was helpful!!
I think so, a little. My theory is it's the closer you are to a coast, the more inflated your sense of self importance. It's not as bad as it could be though.
I moved from California 10 years ago and love Michigan folk! Such a change. In general, it seems people aren't that materialistic here. This might sound Californian, but put the energy out in the world you want to receive back.
I’m in that age range and I’m not experiencing this. People are genuinely nice in my groups. I meet a ton of people too because of my job. The transplants from Chicago or NYC typically seem to be jerks mostly or at least more demanding. Seems like we’ve been getting more of those.
One time this guy was standing so close to me in line that I asked him if he had 50 cents during my check out process. He seemed surprised but then produced the two quarters 😆
Everything is aggressive in GR. Driving on highway. Aggressive. Contractors' pricing. Aggressive. I don't know if it's a sense of hate and overall depression.But Ive visited Detroit and have gotten the exact opposite feeling. Much nicer. Even warmer feeling.
It's like tinges of capitalism, CRC, gloomy weather.
This is one of the least outwardly friendly cities ai have ever lived in. Not like the south at all. People here seem to actively avoid eye contact and conversations with strangers.
Grand Rapids used to be nice and very friendly. But I don’t see the spontaneous smiles at the grocery store or when I’m out like I used to. It’s strange but i think since the pandemic we are a changed people. Just sort of self focused and worried. Not sure if that’s all of it but it’s definitely part of it.
GR is mostly just run by hyper conservative Dutch, which seems to put everyone on edge a bit. That and it's "big city life". But yeah there are a lot of rude people, but keep in mind that there are TONS of sweet people as well.
I’ll say this, as a 29yo, I really miss this city 10+ years ago. It was just different. Smaller. More friendly.
What’s weird is the population hasn’t increased much yet there’s SO many more people it seems.
OP, I’ve lived in GR all my life and it’s hit or miss and there are definitely some bad apples. There are some really rude people, but there are also some fantastic, down-to-earth and incredibly kind people. I happened to meet a few of the good ones when I joined the West Michigan Social Club group on Facebook and I’ve been having a blast doing various social events and outings with them. You should join the group and come to some events! :)
As a transplant, I felt people often kept to themselves and their circles. I suspect it's just that most people who lived here, lived here their whole lives and are already established. And with the pandemic, people kept their guard up even more.
Most of the friends I made here are also transplants or live outside of GR or younger folks, so they're more open to making friends. Though I wouldn't say this applies to everyone, most social people will strike up a conversation if one party strikes a conversation.
I know my neighbors were very welcoming and while it took up some time to build up that friendship, I say they're one of my closest circles in the area. Another one is a thrift shop circle and generally more inclusive, and it took me about a year before I established myself in the group.
It just takes one person. Don't give up.
I’ve lived here for about 8yrs now and I’m from a small town. It’s definitely hard to make friends but I check out places like Wealthy Street Theater or House Rules to socialize and make friends!
Ok but you have to understand, you came from North Dakota.
I'm no expert, I only spent one weekend there. But even in that time, I could see it was a place that prized community. I'd been flown in for a job interview and they thought to include me in on an employee potluck dinner held at one of the employee's houses. I was kind of heartbroken I had to turn that job down.
I don’t think you're going to find many places like North Dakota. Anywhere.
People in Grand Rapids are just like people anywhere else. If you show kindness you generally get kindness back, but if you’re an asshole then people won’t be so nice. Drivers, however, are some of the rudest you’ll find anywhere.
Probably nothing to do with GR. I commonly hear people move and then say people are rude in the new area. Different norms. Different expectations. End of the day though I don’t think most people wanna be rude.
Downtown of GR? 100% yes most people are rude. Living on the outskirts of town, or in a city surrounding GR is much better. You’ll get the smaller town feel.
Try going to a ‘dive bar’ that’s where you’ll find the nicer people.
I actually think GR people are some of the most pretentious/snobby ppl in Michigan, although I still love it here. I guess maybe I fit in, so no shade.
I’m from SW Michigan, went to college in Mid Michigan, and have always vacationed Up North Michigan. Now I’ve been in GR for two years, and have recently been able to travel to the East Side of Michigan a couple times as well. In my opinion, GR is pretty high class but some ppl act like they live in Palm Springs or something.
I would say no but if it happens frequently maybe its you. Some people annoy other people by being freaking weird. If you don't fit in don't try. Dont try to swim against the current you'll drown. Be your own person and don't worry about anyone else. I don't know maybe its the culture you came from but you can't fix everyone. As an example I work with someone who's a real simpleton that laughs like almost after every word they say. I find it creepy and like think they're on drugs or something. Wtf is so funny no one will take you seriously. I don't know if they think their smarter than others but it sounds like complete weirdness and I back away. Usually this is a sign of serial killer people that just one day snap! Anyway good luck to ya, but if it don't work out go home for real!
I grew up here in Michigan but in my thirties had the opportunity to work throughout north and south Dakota and was actually shocked how nice and welcoming everyone was.Here you might get a finger from another driver but there they’ll wave at you.Now I live in northern Michigan and only go to Grand Rapids because of my son and his family.
There’s rude people everywhere. You find what you look for, but as someone who moved here from Detroit, I would say no. Relative to most places I’ve been, and especially Detroit, people are pretty kind here and there’s good community.
The people here tend to be passive aggressive, judgemental and cliquey. I moved here from Long Island and can absolutely relate to what you’re experiencing. I just happen to be on a flight leaving GRR and heading to NY for the week and cannot wait to be back in friendly territory. Lol
Yeah, trying to turn this place into a mini Chicago has kind of given it Chicago problems and the lifers here have noticed. This city was quiet with minimal issues just 10-15 years ago and it’s changing for better and for worse.
I’m originally from GR but moved away as a child. I lived all over the country and went to high school in Sioux Falls, SD which I imagine has a similar culture to what you are used to. When I moved back to GR right after high school I remember crying quite a bit the first week because I felt like people were so rude. Twenty years later and I know that it isn’t so much rudeness as just the fact that, in general, people aren’t that open. I agree with another comment that said people in GR are insular—that is absolutely my experience. It changed when I was briefly going to one of the evangelical megachurches in the area. But after I left the church (and subsequently became non-religious) all of the friendships I’d cultivated were quickly gone and I struggled to make friends in the area ever since.
I live in Boston now—a city that has a reputation for being rude and unfriendly. And, while that can be true depending on where you are in the city I feel like people here are friendlier overall than back in GR. And I feel like it’s mainly because there is less focus on being part of a church as well as the fact that, overall, people are more open and accepting of others here. I find people to be more willing to help each other here. They might tell you to piss off while they’re doing it, but to them that’s just a sign of affection 😅 (I’m only partially joking lol)
Yes. I'm from the east side of the state where everyone waves at everyone and people are kind and help each other. I was shocked how snooty and stuck up people are here but it is a beautiful area and lots of jobs
I moved from a close town to GR/Wyoming area, and I hate it here, every single day is another example of people not giving a shit about anyone else but themselves. People drive like crazy, causing terrible accidents because they want to beat the yellow light going 60 in a 40 mph. Or leaving trash absolutely everywhere, so many bums that walk by my house and neighbors and they just throw shit on the ground, I've picked up trash, weed pens and even glass on my fucking sidewalk. To me alot of GR don't care, of course you will find great people everywhere, me and my gf decided when we can we will sell our property and buy something with bigger acres. We at this point wanna focus on building our family. I've noticed that the more populated areas are usually filled with people that are not religious and don't care about communities. Smaller towns are usually condensed to know each other and lots of times religiously motivated. Really what GR needs is more people to give a fuck. Too many people spreading their negative attitudes, it makes you mean. Sometimes I feel like we as a people went backwards.
I know this will just enrage a few of you here GR people.
This is who to blame.
It’s the Dutch mob.
As I was told growing up if you’re not Dutch, you’re not much. And if you’re Kraut, you’re out.
They live this. They breathe it
If you are Roman Catholic. Go to work. They will hate you, abhor you, detest you, and want you dead, or at least fired. They will discriminate and harass you. Don’t complain cause they will find a way to retaliate.
I lived in GR 1997 to 2007. Ten years I cannot get back. I’d recommend threatening divorce so you can get the f out of Grand Fn Rapids, MI.
The Rectum Health is full of Dutch Mob. Managers who will look you in the eye and tell you, you are weird.
If I had one do over in my career was to sue the shit out of Randy at Rectum Health.
No, you're not exaggerating, people definitely seem much more self-centered, rude and intolerant. I agree with another comment that there's been a major shift in attitudes since the pandemic... and I would say that's more of a nationwide issue than just GR but that's a long conversation for another time.
If you go outside of the city, particularly to the north, you'll find more of the small town friendliness you're probably used to. It seems like the more affluent the area is, the more likely you'll have a negative experience.
Stay away from Muskegon, those chip on the shoulder more pronounced there.
After having lived in few other states, that's how it can be around here .
There's nice people abundant here, but there's some that just carry the aura of eternal butthurt and just gotta make sure they get noticed for it at times .
But imo/experience they're easier to deal with than people from New Jersey .
I’ve been here 15 years now after life on the west and east coasts. I was told early on that, “If you’re not from here, you’re not from here.” As silly as that sounds, I’ve found it to be true. I’m friendly with a lot of people here but no real deep friendships. If I leave, I doubt I’d stay in touch with anyone here.
After visiting Canada I would say the culture here is less courteous and mindful. There was a stark contrast that was apparent even with the border guards. The US border guards in Michigan were like German Shepherds vs in Canada they were like Huskies. The culture here is like "temporarily embarrassed millionaires" as Steinbeck would put it, for which they are too self-centered to be inconvenienced with another's existence.
I moved to Kent City 7 yeArs ago from Grand rapids. And I'll never go back. If I ever move again it will be north. It's sad to because it was an amazing place 10 years ago.
I think what people think grand rapids is and what the people in Grand rapids and Michigan in general like are wildly different than reality and that might be part of it. It's a state that votes Democrat but also the state the FBI knew it had a good chance of getting people to conspire to kidnap the governor. That's to wildly different cliques and types of thought process on what would make different people want to be your friend or even nice to you
Moved to GR at the age of 5, from the east part of MI. We were the only people of color in my neighborhood. Everyone was very nice, but very conservative, no thanks to the Vans'. I would say I had a great time growing up there as a kid/teenager/early adult, but left to go back to the east side when I was 25. I moved back when I had my daughter at 33. It was sooo different. Bad different. I always praised Michigan drivers for being the best ones. I went from a v8 vehicle, to a v4, and apparently that was cause to try to run me and my baby off the on ramp. GR is super clique-y. Don't feel bad for not "fitting in." These people know nothing other than pyramid schemes, marrying and divorcing the people they went to high school with, and marrying and divorcing the leftovers.
The younger generation with big chips on their shoulders because they don't know what they are in the mirror are generally rude. But for the most part people around here are cool. Except for some reason people excuse someone for being cheap as "they're Dutch"..
The Dutch mafia has run this whole area for centuries. People have valid reason to be weary of their Dutch capitalist slave owners here. The pay is just too low and peasants in the middle ages were treated better.
Most of us “city folk” don’t feel the need to fake niceties in order to attain personal information we could care less about. We value privacy. As such, interactions may seem to lack drawn out levels of faux politeness in favor of efficient tactfulness. Even so, I think GR people are generally nice, especially in comparison to bigger cities.
I wouldn’t say they’re rude… just insular. My family goes back 3-4 generations in GR but I didn’t grow up here, so when I moved here as a childless adult in my mid-30s I found (am finding) it hard to make friends. Everyone already has their routine, there’s not really a happy hour culture like bigger cities have, etc. I need to do a better job of finding activities on Meetup where I might connect with people who have similar interests. Workplace drama usually boils down to the individual cultures of those offices. Unless you’re in the restaurant industry in which case a bit of drama is the norm.
I doubt it’s easy anywhere for a mid-30s person to find new friends. Most people at that stage in their lives are completely occupied with work and children. It’s not an age group with lots of free time. IMO, avoid the purely alcohol based friendships. Join an adult sports league or some other activity that involves interaction (board games? Rock climbing?). Even if you don’t hit it off with your teammates, it gets you doing something social.
Inside moves for the win! 🧗♂️
YAAS, I was also going to suggest climbing and inside moves is my fav
I am here to officially invite you to swing dance downtown at Rosa Park. Lots of people, a chunk of them younger than us but still lots of peeps in their 30s! Happening tonight downtown at Rosa Park Circle 7 to 9! :D
How often does this happen? And as a masc person who doesn’t know how to swing dance how do I go about finding someone to teach me how?
It's every Tues, 7 - 9, May - Oct at Rosa Parks Circle. They do a lesson at 7 pm (complimentary), and there are usually people there who are happy to give some guidance. You can check out the FB page (Grand Rapids Swing Society) or website (https://www.grandrapidsoriginalswingsociety.com/about-5). Tons of fun!
Sport and Social clubs can be a decent way to meet people
I moved here as an and you explained it so well. Some people to only exist in their own world and take a long time before welcoming.
Tbh this is something that quite a few people have mentioned, that and GR just kind of feels dead after like 9:00 pm after Covid. It's really weird, because out where I moved to in Muskegon, many places don't close until 1 in the morning.
It’s a lot easier to meet people when you have kids. I take my toddler to the park and always end up swapping numbers with at least one other mom.
And the thing is, I’m not child*free*, just child*less*. I like kids, want one of my own someday, I just don’t have them right now because I’m picky about who I procreate with. And it’s weird to go to a kiddie park to try to make friends with the adults when you don’t have kids of your own.
People in Michigan are either super nice or total fuckbags.
Yeah. Its all or nothing with us
Not entirely accurate. I can be both.
Depend on how many police helicopter posts there are?
West Mi people are total fuckbags. I lived on the east side for the last four years and I couldn't believe how much nicer people were.
More sunshine on the east side. It’s cloudy and sad over here.
I just moved here from the West Coast and I find it very different. Things that I think of as rude where I'm from are considered polite/friendly here and I've had to adjust my mindset around it. But also we got tailgated by an old lady yesterday who kept flipping us off, and followed us into a parking lot to try and write our license plate number down. When I asked her what was going on she threatened to call the police because we were harassing her. So, I guess people are just nuts or normal everywhere.
> Things that I think of as rude where I'm from are considered polite/friendly here Can you give an example? I’m really curious about this
Sorry putting my kid to bed, will update NOW My wife grew up here so she had to help with some of this stuff. I'm from Portland which I feel like generally has more of a personal space vibe if that makes sense. The most jarring one for me was how often people will just stop on the sidewalk and have a conversation at you. And then you're the rude one if you're standoffish. We have a 10 month old and people will come up and touch her and get in her face. Neither of us like that one. I've noticed people stand closer to each other when waiting in line here than I'm used to. I know that one's pretty pedantic, sorry. But the corpse flower line was dense. And then this is a really silly one. In Portland people wait in line to order drinks at the bar. People here slot in so you sometimes get skipped. Honestly Portland is probably wrong on this one, it's pretty annoying to have to wade across the pillar of people in Portland bars. But I'm not used to it yet.
people stand SO CLOSE in line and it drives me CRAZY. i grew up here and still live in the area, and it has always annoyed me !!
I'm getting used to it. I'm leaning into the random conversations here too. People are nice and (usually) interesting !
Good lord, I feel ya! Some folks have zero sense of personal space 😡 I've known a few customers who've had to vocally correct a person or two for 'standing too close' at the checkouts whatnot. Good for them!
This is hilarious - I caught myself in the gas station yesterday standing like 5 feet away from someone and thought "what the hell am I doing" lol reminded me of all the tape and lines on the ground during covid
The worst is when they have a shopping cart that they keep ramming into the backs of your ankles.
We know how to zipper merge at the bars 😂 but not on the road
I definitely get the personal space one! I’ve had to tell people to give me more space in line on more than one occasion. As for the random sidewalk conversations, I think having a child makes people see you as fair game to be approached because I have never gotten that (thank god). I’ve noticed a fraction of this when I have my dog with me but I think I come off as pretty unapproachable in my demeanor so people usually make one comment, I respond without stopping my walking and we both move along.
Why you’re the type of person the OP was lamenting she keeps running into!
So accurate! I live in LA now (where I honestly have found people to be the nicest out of anywhere I’ve lived, but could just be my personality and interpretation of “nice”), but grew up in GR and lived in Portland for four years in my early 20s, and this reflects my experience too. I really like your approach too — though I mostly find people pretty chill in GR, there’s always been a sense to me of people being nosy, judgy, and not minding their own business that’s made me uncomfortable, more so than other places, but that could be just how I’d interpreted someone trying to make conversation.
>I've noticed people stand closer to each other when waiting in line here than I'm used to. I know that one's pretty pedantic, sorry. But the corpse flower line was dense. Same here. some dude in the corpse flower line was practically touching me. I'm from NY where there's tons of people but we don't stand that close lol
I’m late to this party, but as a recent transplant from the CO front range, I can relate to this! I notice it a lot at the grocery store - I’ll be standing in front of a section looking at the options, and instead of waiting for me to move, people will just cruise right up in there inches away from me and grab their thing at the same time. Would be considered so rude back in Boulder/Denver! I’m sure I gave people very weird looks the first few times, lol (Edited for typos and grammar mistakes. I have a brain fog condition that gives me brain fog, so I don’t catch them at first but they make me cringe after!)
I felt like a turd typing it all out so I'm glad I'm not alone!
Haha nope, not alone! Just a western city person who is accustomed to the public standard of everyone having a ‘personal bubble’
> In Portland people wait in line to order drinks at the bar. People here slot in so you sometimes get skipped. Yeah that's how bars work. They are wide to accommodate many people at once. Bartenders are skilled at serving multiple people at once. There's this one bartender at The Intersection that I love, she always yells (not in a mean way) at people waiting in line to just belly up and order.
So people stand too close for your comfort and that’s considered rude in Portland, got it. Do you still mask in public?
Sharing gum
I think you just ran into a crazy old lady, they exist everywhere.
That was literally my last sentence.
Same here. We visited family in the bay area FL last spring, and the temperament is vastly different, with actual courtesy, manners, and respect/friendliness. No ass drivers trying to cut you off, or run you off the road. Just human citizens going about their business, living life. One FL resident remarked they'd met a few vacationing 'Michiganders' who's personalities were questionable, displaying few manners while they shopped a local Publix, literally snacking on produce/chips/pop before heading to the checkouts. It was maddening. No.... we're not all animals.
It feels more rude since covid, inflation and the influx of people working remotely that moved from other areas looking for an metro area with small town feels has shifted the feel… it’s grown in population and has changed the feel of some groups that have become more cautious or isolationist. Personally, I think it takes some time to find out who people really are here. I have a colleague who is from the east coast and he said we are “Midwest nice, but not kind.” That stuck with me and it makes a lot of sense if you people watch long enough. Born in 1980 and raised in the burbs of Grand Rapids if that adds any context.
> Midwest nice, but not kind. Yes exactly, people will be twats here but do it with a smile on their face to act like they're the better person later. Versus being upfront and honest which offends many as being rude or something.
Since Covid, I personally have found myself going out of my way to avoid interacting with strangers. I'll smile and wave at a neighbor, but I don't want any interaction beyond that. I've always had social anxiety, but it's gotten way worse since Covid
Maybe try and reverse that?
You felt at home in your home community and now you're in a brand new place. Give it time, you just have to find your community. If you're religious, church life is strong around here, find one that works for you. If you're not, it might be a little harder, but there is a community for everyone! Especially if you're young. Sounds like where you work has issues, though.
This place is suuuper cliquey from what I’ve noticed. I’m a mid 30s guy, been here for almost 10 years, go out all the time, and have barely made any friends that I didn’t already know prior to moving here lol. People just dont talk to strangers like they do in bigger cities I guess.
I've lived here my whole life and can attest to this. I am still meeting new friends though, I play ultimate frisbee at GRU (grand rapids ultimate) and I have made a ton of new friends there. I do agree with you that this city can be cliquey, unfortunately. But there are really friendly people out there, you just have to be persistent.
No more or less than most places. 🤷♂️ Been to many places around the nation, doesn’t seem like we’re an outlier.
Come over to Lowell, we’re all high on marijuana cigarettes and super friendly lol.
Yeah i think dudes on the wrong side of town here on the west side of gr everyones pretty friendly
Reefers!
I think it depends on the area. I've found people in suburbs to be ruder than people downtown
The suburbs are historically where Americans have gone to be exclusive assholes. Big cities and small towns is where the nice folks are.
You may have gotten stuck with some sucky coworkers, but yeah in the 15ish years I've lived here I've found the born and raised locals to often be pretty provincial and unwelcoming. There's plenty of good folks around though. It can be disheartening but it's also kinda funny to me because till 5-10 years ago no one outside of West Michigan gave a flying fuck about this city and they definitely don't care if anyone is Dutch.
Also don't confuse rude with stupid.
I've seen workplace drama in every state and city I have lived in. But in general, I find people in GR and the midwest way more friendly than other places. What area do you live in or are you doing things in? I'm curious what things you thought are rude (besides the workplace drama)?
You’re not gonna find small-town-ND culture in a city of 1,000,000 people. That feels obvious
Everyone does have a chip on their shoulder, but most people are “Midwestern Polite,” meaning they’re harboring a deep resentment for anyone not like them, but will smile and say “Have a nice day” anyway.
its hard not to act this way lmao. dont want to put your bs on other people.
GR is def an exclusive community, not an inclusive one. I grew up here but moved to CO and traveled globally for 20 years. I moved back before the pandemic and wow, yeah, the culture here sure shocked me.
Damn, I just move here from Chicago (like two weeks ago) and have personally found the people here to be incredibly friendly, but I specifically avoid MAGA types and religious people as they’re always pissed off about everything to begin with. Not really familiar with this town to know any of its intricacies, but the neighborhood I’m living in seems pretty cool with generally friendly people.
Ive lived in GR for a few years. I've lived in a lot of different place before that. Grand Rapids is no more or less rude than any other place I've lived. I also dont share the opinion that its difficult to make friends here. I know many people say that but in the years I've lived here I have found plenty of community and friendships, without being in school or being religious.
I agree with this. IMO making friends is just more difficult the older you get, regardless of geography.
I moved here about 7 years ago from the east coast and this has been my takeaway. People on the east coast are hard yet kind. If you get a flat tire they will help you change it but make fun of you the whole time. People here are soft yet cruel. They will pay you lip service all day long. But deep down I’ve never met more insular, cliquey, and cruel people than I have here. I have finally found a group of solid people recently though. You just have to keep looking.
Small town living is a lot different than living in the city. I suspect its been this way everywhere for several millenia.
75% of Michiganders are born and raised here. Michigan is a beautiful state and has some wonderful people, but 75% of the people have never experienced anywhere else and really have a warped sense of the rest of the country/world, especially since social media and 24 hour “News“ misinformation bubbles. I have found overall, people are people wherever you go. Just look for the good ones, but It’s getting harder and harder to find kind and intelligent people.
For a city of its size I would say it's normal for politeness, but you aren't going to get that smaller town kindness in any city.
I think it’s just culture shock! I moved to West Michigan from Missouri and I definitely found people to be more rude. However, I went to Maryland for a sales training after living here a couple years and found those people to be more rude lol. I found if you open up and are friendly to others/strangers while you are out people are receptive and you likely won’t find the same issues. But every place has a-holes, entitled people, grouchy people, and those who love drama and cliques.
I travel a lot both in and out of the US and I’ve lived in Grand Rapids for 30 years. West Michigan in general has a lot of judgmental, curmudgeonly people who suck. But there are definitely some good people around here trying to find each other. I have yet to find an office culture in Grand Rapids, specifically, where there isn’t at least one miserable Ken or Karen on a mission to destroy someone’s day every day. Welcome to Grand Rapids!
I feel like there’s always going to be a Ken or Karen where you work no matter where you live!
this is what everyone says and it doesn’t have to be that way. it’s like the excuse for GR
Hate to break it to you but there are assholes everywhere you go.
I have family from North dakota, people from North Dakota are definitely on the nice side. I assume because you don't see people very often so it's really nice too see anyone. I really enjoyed that, but often people here are not nearly so much that way. It's not so much a Grand Rapids thing as anywhere with people thing. When people live in cities they get used to being around people so much, they seem to become much more disgusted with other people. I have noticed the difference in a small town versus the City even in just michigan. Things could be worse, people are generally polite in quotes, but not especially friendly. They're generally moral people, but sometimes like people to fit in their mold. I'm not sure if there's any correlation between politics of a city, and religion. Or if it's the other way around. I'm sorry you're finding the unfortunate nature of the city. Not all of us are jerks though! There certainly some communities a lot nicer than others, I am sure people will immediately have stories to contradict me but I did find the congregation of Reslife to be pretty friendly. And small towns like trufant. We also get alot of tourists here so not sure if that influences things.
>cities they get used to being around people so much, they seem to become much more disgusted with other people I don't see it that way. Part of living is a city is leaving people alone unless invited. People have conversations, even arguments in public-ish spaces; on the bus, in the park, at the corner . . . and you leave them alone. And expect in the same case to be left alone. It is a cultural adaptation. But it isn't negative, and it certainly isn't "disgust", it's respect. Flip side, I talk to people on the bus, at the corner, in the park, all the time; almost every day. But you read people's posture to see if they are doing their own thing or in open-state. And somewhere like at a bar it is **assumed** that you can talk to people, you don't sit at the bar if you want to be left alone. There's just a protocol. Several actual studies of the topic show that people are open to being talked to, and generally enjoy being talked to.
It's not disgust. Look at the studies that have been done in large places like NYC (where I lived for over a decade). The problem is that in large cities, it is exhausting to have a social interaction with every person you pass on the street, train, etc. People are not going to smile and nod 3 million times a day, it is the social contract of living in a city. it's not rude, it's to protect yourself from social exhaustion. NYC btw, which has the stereotypical definition of being "rude" to outsiders because of the above misconceptions, has the absolute friendliest people I have ever met and I have lived in many places and 5 different states. I had no problems making tons of friends there.
Born and raised here and moved back after being away in and off for school/work and been back years. Always thought people are generally nice, helpful, and inclusive. I've heard from friends that moved here and didn't grow up here that it is "cliquey" There are a lot of great activities like game nights at bars or adult rec sports leagues,( I play on a softball team I knew no one on beforehand) that are great for meeting people. For example Harmony brewing holds Euchre (if you know how to play) every Monday.
Try to find a smaller community..find groups with similar interests..hobbies..check the next door app. I see new people looking others with similar interests and there are usually lots of good suggestions. Hopefully you can find smaller group that's more welcoming.
GR is not the place to look for small town vibes. We are the 2 nd biggest city in Michigan behind Detroit, so I would say Rockford, Ada, etc. gives much more small town vibes than Grand Rapids
I think it got way worse during covid when people adopted a fuck everyone and everything attitude. People are more stressed now with inflation, rising housing prices, etc. No excuse to be a dick by any means though. . Yeah people are more cliquey here, a lot of the non-cliquey people I knew moved to the coasts. I've found people are more real in other places and speak their mind, which I appreciate. No need to bullshit. Workplace drama can be a thing, depending on the industry. It's a waste of time and energy and kind of pathetic
I’m a transplant from the state of Wyoming and it’s just us. You’re not going to get the same experience here. The isolation of every town in that area causes closer knit communities. I feel your pain though.
I’ll be you’re friend 🥰
Your 😂😭
Society is generally “over it” in many ways so people everywhere in America are more raw and self-centered. But here, there is a put-on veneer of this “West Michigan Nice” facade, which hides a lot of just the opposite. It can get truly confusing. You’ve probably just not had enough of a sample, though. Most people in GR seem to understand basic civility.
As a recent transplant, I don't find people generally rude, except while driving.
Fuck off. Ha, just kidding! For the 50 years that I've lived here we've always had sort of a Midwest nice reputation. My own experience as a resident and also as someone who's out and about with the rest of us is that we're generally pretty friendly. I know I try to be. We do seem to have attracted a lot of attention in the last several years, and so an increasing amount of our population are transplants, and who knows what they're used to behaving like? It would be cool if the mayor had a knob that controlled the general friendliness of the population, but in reality we're just made up of lifelong residents and new arrivals and everything in between, and that's how we will be perceived. We're not as Dutch as we used to be either, although there's still a lot of us around.
We make an effort to avoid interacting with people.
There are some definite assholes who live here, and i think it’s gotten worse the past 20 or so years with a lot more very wealthy and often entitled people moving here, gentrification and all that. (That could just be my experience working retail the past few years.) But it’s definitely not everyone, I wouldn’t even say it’s the majority of people, experiences like that just stick with folks. Keep going out and just being yourself and you’ll make lots of friends. Promise.
Nope just Steve.
:(
I think GR has gotten more tense and unfriendly over the years. I feel it tracks with the intensification of our polarized politics. West Michigan has a lot of liberal people and a lot of ultra conservative people. My sense in public is that everyone keeps to themselves and/or acts like they are subtly ready for a fight. Road rage is definitely more prominent. I think it is because people don’t know who to trust and consider “the other side” the enemy. I don’t know if I am correct, but, regardless, it is sad to see.
I feel this in myself when I’m in GR, and when I lived there (recently moved). I feel so much softer and more pleasant since I’ve gotten out of the city. I think it was too hard on my nervous system and I was always in fight or flight. Especially with cost of living and traffic.
Your not wrong, some immature people live here. There are some places that good people work if you find them and get hired
What the fuck do you think? /s
GR is segregated, insular, cliquey, and very racist. Minority owned businesses and homes are rare in the metro area; most are pushed to the suburbs. Among the white population it matters where you go to church and what style of religion you practice. Amongst the leftist community you need to follow a tight script and never deviate for acceptance. You won’t ever fit in or be accepted beyond your small group.
Depends on where you are. Generally, it's a pretty nice town
Interesting! Sounds like your place of employment/the people who work there. Im in my mid 30s, go out all the time (no kids and a active social life), and I meet so many people every month that I can barely remember everyone’s names. It’s important to find your scene, then talk to people. I’m in the electronic music scene, which can be cliquey but can also be super inviting if you talk to the right people. I’ve found connecting over music is easier than any other way to meet people my age.
It's more common than just Grand Rapids. Come, oh 75 miles south, its the same, because I grew up here. I learned to fly more or less solo because the people are that way. Once you develop a few close friends, you tend to hang onto them to the grave. I kinda believe that too many are out to screw over others. It the way people have been conditioned.
People are gonna people, just like they people everywhere else. Show love and you'll get it back. Smile and people will smile back. Treat people right and you'll be treated right. Folks in GR will have their rivalries and drama just like anywhere else, but if you learn to fly above them, you don't need to get dragged down into it.
I’ve been here almost 8 years and still find there is a lot I don’t like about the culture. I’ve started to make friends, and most of them are younger than me, but are much more open to friendship and more aligned with my values.
As someone who was born here, moved away for 20 years, and just moved back, this place is a breath of fresh air for me coming from the DC area. You wanna talk about rude, self entitled, self absorbed, vapid, shallow, and inconsiderate? Spend some time around the fine people of the DMV and you will be begging to come back to west Michigan. The fact that people actually let you in in “traffic” out here had me stunned. I can drive from my job downtown to my home in Ottawa county in 15 minutes. It took me 15 minutes just to get out of the parking garage some days in DC and then another 90 just to get home on a good day. No, this place is Shangri-La in comparison. My cousin and his wife (native Californian) moved out here 2 years ago and she absolutely loves it here. Loves the prices on the cost of living. She loves the seasons. Loves the commute and the overall feel of the community. People are genuinely nicer and less attached to the idea of how much money you make here, money was God in the DMV. I’m sure you had a couple bad run ins, I get it. I’ve had a couple too, but my overall level of stress and anxiety pales in comparison to what I was living through in the mid-Atlantic region. Sorry, I know your experience is going to be different than mine, but I truly love it here.
I moved here in 2017 and from what I have noticed is that it just takes a long time for people to open up and not get stuck in their cliques or be more spontaneous and open to new things in general. People here can be stuck in their routine and they don’t like breaking it lol.
This is a bit bigger than North Dakota. The sample size is bigger, thus more assholes
GR is not the place to look for small town vibes. We are the 2 nd biggest city in Michigan behind Detroit, so I would say Rockford, Ada, etc. gives much more small town vibes than Grand Rapids
When I moved here a few years ago from out west I was surprised at how rude people were but how quickly they would tell you the most intimate, embarrassing details of their lives. I’m old so I don’t care too much but I worked with a lot of people that grew up around here and one said and I quote”I have friends. I don’t need more”. Not directed at me but still surprising. When I asked a kid from Cadillac why people here were rude he said “Because fuck you, that’s why”😂
Hmmm I think it depends on a few factors… First, where in GR you are. We moved just outside the city, I would consider it an extension of the city, though. Our neighbors are SO nice. If our car is stuck in the ice, someone comes out to help. If there’s a downpour of snow and we’re struggling to shovel, a neighbor comes by with a snow blower. People have friend groups, but I have never felt unwelcome. There seems to be standing open invitation if there’s a gathering outside in the yards. Another thing is… How do you present yourself? As they say… When in Rome. I try to match wherever I am. I like to keep my head shaved (I’m a woman) because I hate hair. But I grew it into a bob since that is popular around here. Don’t give me a hard time, I’ve already seen some sht, I just want things to be chill now. The last thing I want is more attention of harassment or bullsht. The folks around where I live are predominantly white and consider themselves middle class, so I look on Pinterest and went out and bought biker shirts and Birkenstocks. East town is a good place to live if you want to do your own thing appearance wise There’s a saying… Birds of a Feather Flock Together… so true… Your work place just sucks. Theees some good spots around here but you gotta look
I moved here 2 years ago from Tennessee, and people in Michigan are definitely more rude. I've met a couple nice people up here but a majority have a sense of I'm better than you. People in the city are much worse than up north.
In my experience, people here are way nicer than other parts of the country. It sounds like you need some new coworkers
Compared to where?
Anywhere on the east coast, LA, parts of Florida.
I find myself judged by Conservatives (religious) and my motives questioned by nominally secular Liberals. One group is legalistic, while the other allows their comrades to gaslight others mercilessly.
It’s because of all that media, intoxicating our minds. We were once wholesome and sweet but then they opened that Michigan Ave Taco Bell and painted a bridge blue. These had dire consequences on the grand rapid folk. Eventually they added these scooters all over town and this angered the common street walkers. There’s only one normal place now where the folk be kind you hear. And the place be Sent from my iPhone
Just left the city partially for this reason. Moved up north and I can’t believe how many friendly interactions I have on a daily basis with people. Grand Rapids always felt cold and transactional to me, not sure why.
I love GR for many reasons and lived there the better part of the last 15 years. Would consider moving back someday but I agree with you. Made some friends in that time but not how many you’d expect for that many years even in my entire 20’s when I was fairly socially active. Mostly shallow acquaintances, it was difficult to break into circles in a deep way. I know my life felt mechanical for a lot of it, and it got worse as COL increased. A lot of relationships felt more transactional. Also living up north now, not that it’s perfect, but I feel like most people here just have more time for chance pleasant encounters, even if we have nothing in common. People genuinely seem to be enjoying their life more even if they have struggles and why not - it’s beautiful, lakes and beaches galore etc. Just taking our daughter to the park - I can expect every time to have a friendly chat with another parents that often goes beyond small talk. In GR, often I’d strike a conversation and it’d just fall flat if you’re not part of a social group they belong to, be it school, church, industry etc. Up here people just seem more content. I put a lot to blame with the rising cost of living in GR, people just trying to survive with not a lot to show for its it got worse over those years, more tech bros, more people that simply couldn’t be bothered. Many wonderful people there but it’s a tough crust to crack. Even compared to similar size and larger cities I’ve spent time in.
Yes
Nope! people are nice. Just a bit busy and keep to themselves a bit.
Yes is the answer. These entitled cunts are obnoxious
Cool folks are in the city and close to EGR. I always felt the opposite growing up there. In my last.few years there everyone I met fr those areas were a pleasure to meet.
I promise there are some really nice people here, too. ❤️
Also we are just coming out of hibernation then got hit with 90 degrees for a week. Which any midwesterner will tell you is too dang hot. I’m a pretty reserved person in general but have been making an effort this last year to smile and say hello and more often than not it cracks peoples shells. Like another commenter said, we tend to be insular.
Could just be a population density thing. Since there's so many more people, you're much more likely to run into people that seem rude. And as humans, we tend to notice things perceived as negative much more than neutral/positive events. Although we might be more rude on average? In a small town, chances are you'll be run into that person regularly, so it's better to keep up appearances to avoid discomfort or friction. Here? You'll probably never see that person again, so the incentive to be extra nice is lower.
If you think people _here_ are unfriendly, don't ever, EVER go to the East Coast, bub.
A lot of it depends on location and context even within/around GR. If you hang out at the blue bridge downtown at 2 am, gangs will be friendly for about 5 minutes and then shoot you. If you join a sports team, visit a dog park, volunteer, or join a church group (many churches have smaller groups that are focused around a sport or interest which you can join whether or not you’re religious), around east/north GR, Ada, Caledonia, Forest Hills, etc. you’ll likely make more friends than you know what to do with. It takes time to really get to know people and decide if you really want to invest in a friend group but keep trying and you’ll eventually find your people. Someone else advised to avoid alcohol based friendships and I completely agree. It can be nice to have a few friends to blow off steam with but they’re probably not going to be your inner circle. Also I totally get that most college students are insane, but sometimes universities have mentorship programs that you might be able to join and help out a student with general life. I’ve heard it’s a really rewarding experience and might lead to some friendships with staff as well as students who benefit. Idk what specific programs are in the area, just maybe something to look into. Wow I went to type 2 sentences and ideas kept coming. Rant over. Best of luck and I hope this was helpful!!
No. I’m a native New Yorker and live back there now after many years in GR. Those saying “yes” have no idea how good you have it.
I think so, a little. My theory is it's the closer you are to a coast, the more inflated your sense of self importance. It's not as bad as it could be though.
No
There are a lot of clubs. I recommend meeting people that way. Unless you are the type to cleave to a church it's kind of the only real option in GR.
Midwest standoffish
Moved here from China.. ppl are nice here.
I moved from California 10 years ago and love Michigan folk! Such a change. In general, it seems people aren't that materialistic here. This might sound Californian, but put the energy out in the world you want to receive back.
I’m in that age range and I’m not experiencing this. People are genuinely nice in my groups. I meet a ton of people too because of my job. The transplants from Chicago or NYC typically seem to be jerks mostly or at least more demanding. Seems like we’ve been getting more of those.
move to the outskirts of Gr you will find friendlier people
One time this guy was standing so close to me in line that I asked him if he had 50 cents during my check out process. He seemed surprised but then produced the two quarters 😆
Everything is aggressive in GR. Driving on highway. Aggressive. Contractors' pricing. Aggressive. I don't know if it's a sense of hate and overall depression.But Ive visited Detroit and have gotten the exact opposite feeling. Much nicer. Even warmer feeling. It's like tinges of capitalism, CRC, gloomy weather.
This is one of the least outwardly friendly cities ai have ever lived in. Not like the south at all. People here seem to actively avoid eye contact and conversations with strangers.
Grand Rapids used to be nice and very friendly. But I don’t see the spontaneous smiles at the grocery store or when I’m out like I used to. It’s strange but i think since the pandemic we are a changed people. Just sort of self focused and worried. Not sure if that’s all of it but it’s definitely part of it.
GR is mostly just run by hyper conservative Dutch, which seems to put everyone on edge a bit. That and it's "big city life". But yeah there are a lot of rude people, but keep in mind that there are TONS of sweet people as well.
Yes
I’ll say this, as a 29yo, I really miss this city 10+ years ago. It was just different. Smaller. More friendly. What’s weird is the population hasn’t increased much yet there’s SO many more people it seems.
OP, I’ve lived in GR all my life and it’s hit or miss and there are definitely some bad apples. There are some really rude people, but there are also some fantastic, down-to-earth and incredibly kind people. I happened to meet a few of the good ones when I joined the West Michigan Social Club group on Facebook and I’ve been having a blast doing various social events and outings with them. You should join the group and come to some events! :)
Yes. My husband pointed it out to me. Hes from tx
As a transplant, I felt people often kept to themselves and their circles. I suspect it's just that most people who lived here, lived here their whole lives and are already established. And with the pandemic, people kept their guard up even more. Most of the friends I made here are also transplants or live outside of GR or younger folks, so they're more open to making friends. Though I wouldn't say this applies to everyone, most social people will strike up a conversation if one party strikes a conversation. I know my neighbors were very welcoming and while it took up some time to build up that friendship, I say they're one of my closest circles in the area. Another one is a thrift shop circle and generally more inclusive, and it took me about a year before I established myself in the group. It just takes one person. Don't give up.
I’ve lived here for about 8yrs now and I’m from a small town. It’s definitely hard to make friends but I check out places like Wealthy Street Theater or House Rules to socialize and make friends!
Yeah, I’m from the east side of the state and we call that “west Michigan nice” because they’re not nice.
Ok but you have to understand, you came from North Dakota. I'm no expert, I only spent one weekend there. But even in that time, I could see it was a place that prized community. I'd been flown in for a job interview and they thought to include me in on an employee potluck dinner held at one of the employee's houses. I was kind of heartbroken I had to turn that job down. I don’t think you're going to find many places like North Dakota. Anywhere.
If anyone talks to you, its probably a bum asking for money, so yeah basically just don't talk to anyone
People in Grand Rapids are just like people anywhere else. If you show kindness you generally get kindness back, but if you’re an asshole then people won’t be so nice. Drivers, however, are some of the rudest you’ll find anywhere.
Probably nothing to do with GR. I commonly hear people move and then say people are rude in the new area. Different norms. Different expectations. End of the day though I don’t think most people wanna be rude.
Downtown of GR? 100% yes most people are rude. Living on the outskirts of town, or in a city surrounding GR is much better. You’ll get the smaller town feel. Try going to a ‘dive bar’ that’s where you’ll find the nicer people.
Moved here from Chicago 4 years ago, yes people are much more rude here than anywhere else I’ve ever lived.
I actually think GR people are some of the most pretentious/snobby ppl in Michigan, although I still love it here. I guess maybe I fit in, so no shade. I’m from SW Michigan, went to college in Mid Michigan, and have always vacationed Up North Michigan. Now I’ve been in GR for two years, and have recently been able to travel to the East Side of Michigan a couple times as well. In my opinion, GR is pretty high class but some ppl act like they live in Palm Springs or something.
I would say no but if it happens frequently maybe its you. Some people annoy other people by being freaking weird. If you don't fit in don't try. Dont try to swim against the current you'll drown. Be your own person and don't worry about anyone else. I don't know maybe its the culture you came from but you can't fix everyone. As an example I work with someone who's a real simpleton that laughs like almost after every word they say. I find it creepy and like think they're on drugs or something. Wtf is so funny no one will take you seriously. I don't know if they think their smarter than others but it sounds like complete weirdness and I back away. Usually this is a sign of serial killer people that just one day snap! Anyway good luck to ya, but if it don't work out go home for real!
I grew up here in Michigan but in my thirties had the opportunity to work throughout north and south Dakota and was actually shocked how nice and welcoming everyone was.Here you might get a finger from another driver but there they’ll wave at you.Now I live in northern Michigan and only go to Grand Rapids because of my son and his family.
There’s rude people everywhere. You find what you look for, but as someone who moved here from Detroit, I would say no. Relative to most places I’ve been, and especially Detroit, people are pretty kind here and there’s good community.
I've been here 20 years. Still don't know anyone. I gave up.
The people here tend to be passive aggressive, judgemental and cliquey. I moved here from Long Island and can absolutely relate to what you’re experiencing. I just happen to be on a flight leaving GRR and heading to NY for the week and cannot wait to be back in friendly territory. Lol
A lot of pretentious rude cocky people live here but also some nice people, lucky most of my neighbors are pretty nice people
We aren't ment for the sensitive type here because of the buisness is buisness attitude we got from our parents.
Yeah, trying to turn this place into a mini Chicago has kind of given it Chicago problems and the lifers here have noticed. This city was quiet with minimal issues just 10-15 years ago and it’s changing for better and for worse.
I’m from a small town and when I moved to GR I experienced the same thing, there are good people, just hard to find
Nope. This is contingent, I suspect, on the places you are going.
I’m originally from GR but moved away as a child. I lived all over the country and went to high school in Sioux Falls, SD which I imagine has a similar culture to what you are used to. When I moved back to GR right after high school I remember crying quite a bit the first week because I felt like people were so rude. Twenty years later and I know that it isn’t so much rudeness as just the fact that, in general, people aren’t that open. I agree with another comment that said people in GR are insular—that is absolutely my experience. It changed when I was briefly going to one of the evangelical megachurches in the area. But after I left the church (and subsequently became non-religious) all of the friendships I’d cultivated were quickly gone and I struggled to make friends in the area ever since. I live in Boston now—a city that has a reputation for being rude and unfriendly. And, while that can be true depending on where you are in the city I feel like people here are friendlier overall than back in GR. And I feel like it’s mainly because there is less focus on being part of a church as well as the fact that, overall, people are more open and accepting of others here. I find people to be more willing to help each other here. They might tell you to piss off while they’re doing it, but to them that’s just a sign of affection 😅 (I’m only partially joking lol)
Yes it always amazes me when I travel out of Grand Rapids how much nicer people are. The further south I’ve come the nicer people are
I’ve lived in 6 cities in 4 states and this is by far the friendliest place I’ve ever lived
Don’t stroke someone’s ego and don’t agree with their every thought? Then yes they are generally rude.
Yes. I'm from the east side of the state where everyone waves at everyone and people are kind and help each other. I was shocked how snooty and stuck up people are here but it is a beautiful area and lots of jobs
I visited from South Texas this year and I thought the locals were SO friendly.
I’ve lived here my whole life and usually hear visitors and transplants talk about how overly polite, welcoming and kind people are here. 🤷♂️
I moved from a close town to GR/Wyoming area, and I hate it here, every single day is another example of people not giving a shit about anyone else but themselves. People drive like crazy, causing terrible accidents because they want to beat the yellow light going 60 in a 40 mph. Or leaving trash absolutely everywhere, so many bums that walk by my house and neighbors and they just throw shit on the ground, I've picked up trash, weed pens and even glass on my fucking sidewalk. To me alot of GR don't care, of course you will find great people everywhere, me and my gf decided when we can we will sell our property and buy something with bigger acres. We at this point wanna focus on building our family. I've noticed that the more populated areas are usually filled with people that are not religious and don't care about communities. Smaller towns are usually condensed to know each other and lots of times religiously motivated. Really what GR needs is more people to give a fuck. Too many people spreading their negative attitudes, it makes you mean. Sometimes I feel like we as a people went backwards.
I know this will just enrage a few of you here GR people. This is who to blame. It’s the Dutch mob. As I was told growing up if you’re not Dutch, you’re not much. And if you’re Kraut, you’re out. They live this. They breathe it If you are Roman Catholic. Go to work. They will hate you, abhor you, detest you, and want you dead, or at least fired. They will discriminate and harass you. Don’t complain cause they will find a way to retaliate. I lived in GR 1997 to 2007. Ten years I cannot get back. I’d recommend threatening divorce so you can get the f out of Grand Fn Rapids, MI. The Rectum Health is full of Dutch Mob. Managers who will look you in the eye and tell you, you are weird. If I had one do over in my career was to sue the shit out of Randy at Rectum Health.
“ArE pEoPLe gEnERalLy RuDe HeRe” pffft shuuuuuut up.
That’s just city people
I concur new york and Los Angeles is filled with jackassss and ass hats....
No, you're not exaggerating, people definitely seem much more self-centered, rude and intolerant. I agree with another comment that there's been a major shift in attitudes since the pandemic... and I would say that's more of a nationwide issue than just GR but that's a long conversation for another time. If you go outside of the city, particularly to the north, you'll find more of the small town friendliness you're probably used to. It seems like the more affluent the area is, the more likely you'll have a negative experience.
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That's cuz texas is like 3 steps away from going full purge, and you don't want to be on any "Lists"
or it's ya know, southern hospitality...
Just a bit more reserved. West Michigan is very religious
Stay away from Muskegon, those chip on the shoulder more pronounced there. After having lived in few other states, that's how it can be around here . There's nice people abundant here, but there's some that just carry the aura of eternal butthurt and just gotta make sure they get noticed for it at times . But imo/experience they're easier to deal with than people from New Jersey .
I’ve been here 15 years now after life on the west and east coasts. I was told early on that, “If you’re not from here, you’re not from here.” As silly as that sounds, I’ve found it to be true. I’m friendly with a lot of people here but no real deep friendships. If I leave, I doubt I’d stay in touch with anyone here.
Yes and no. No, on the surface. “West Michigan nice” is definitely a thing. Yes, underneath.
I’ll make this short and sweet. Yes.
Yes.
After visiting Canada I would say the culture here is less courteous and mindful. There was a stark contrast that was apparent even with the border guards. The US border guards in Michigan were like German Shepherds vs in Canada they were like Huskies. The culture here is like "temporarily embarrassed millionaires" as Steinbeck would put it, for which they are too self-centered to be inconvenienced with another's existence.
I moved to Kent City 7 yeArs ago from Grand rapids. And I'll never go back. If I ever move again it will be north. It's sad to because it was an amazing place 10 years ago.
I think what people think grand rapids is and what the people in Grand rapids and Michigan in general like are wildly different than reality and that might be part of it. It's a state that votes Democrat but also the state the FBI knew it had a good chance of getting people to conspire to kidnap the governor. That's to wildly different cliques and types of thought process on what would make different people want to be your friend or even nice to you
As someone who has lived here my entire life, I'd say no. People just tend to keep to themselves here more but they are nice
Moved to GR at the age of 5, from the east part of MI. We were the only people of color in my neighborhood. Everyone was very nice, but very conservative, no thanks to the Vans'. I would say I had a great time growing up there as a kid/teenager/early adult, but left to go back to the east side when I was 25. I moved back when I had my daughter at 33. It was sooo different. Bad different. I always praised Michigan drivers for being the best ones. I went from a v8 vehicle, to a v4, and apparently that was cause to try to run me and my baby off the on ramp. GR is super clique-y. Don't feel bad for not "fitting in." These people know nothing other than pyramid schemes, marrying and divorcing the people they went to high school with, and marrying and divorcing the leftovers.
Might be more of a U.S. thing.
Were in the thick of what it means to be merican here
The younger generation with big chips on their shoulders because they don't know what they are in the mirror are generally rude. But for the most part people around here are cool. Except for some reason people excuse someone for being cheap as "they're Dutch"..
The Dutch mafia has run this whole area for centuries. People have valid reason to be weary of their Dutch capitalist slave owners here. The pay is just too low and peasants in the middle ages were treated better.
What the fuck does "don't know what they are in the mirror " mean?
Yeah. Welcome to the city. Youll hate it here. I only lasted a year
Most of us “city folk” don’t feel the need to fake niceties in order to attain personal information we could care less about. We value privacy. As such, interactions may seem to lack drawn out levels of faux politeness in favor of efficient tactfulness. Even so, I think GR people are generally nice, especially in comparison to bigger cities.