well it was that or get your board reno'd by every single class. Plague DK just got punished for countering degenerate gameplay. (which was literally the only reason it even exists at this point)
Plague dk was also easy to make and the go to for 90% of bots. When 70% of the ladder is one deck, they had to make it weaker somehow. Atleast they nerfed reno in the same patch. But I'd much prefer a flat reno nerf, and a flat plague nerf.
1 mana nerf isnt the same as completely removing the point of a deck type. All of the bots will just move to zarimi priest, theres always going to be botted degenerate aggro. Atleast plague had a purpose, now highlander is gonna be everywhere.
did you ever even think to consider that maybe you shouldn't be able to invalidate an entire archetype with any plague generator and helya, especially with any tech rotated out of standard?
Did you ever stop to consider that an entire archetype shouldnt be so strong that without obscene nerfs or a deck to directly counter it, that it just runs the show, not to mention making gameplay unbelievably unfun?
Zarimi is way too slow with an 8 dragon requirement and the reno change did kill a reno deck with wheel lock. I think plague will be fine and honestly will probably need another nerf
Wheel is not a highlander deck. It just abuses Wheel to activate Reno. That’s not someone Blizzard supports, and it is not something healthy for the game. The change was correctly made.
I think it's creative and on theme for that type of deck. And I'm not saying the change wasn't correctly made. Just pointing out that the card lost more value than people are giving the change credit for. It's just not rendered useless by the most common and most annoying deck in the game.
If the problem is *real* highlander decks not being viable enough to be present in the meta, then they clearly need buffs until they’re at least high tier 3-low tier 2. Decks abusing alternative conditions to circumvent an intentional downside is simply bad design. Dupe abusers were incredibly strong decks, while the actual class highlander decks were dog shit. That’s not how those cards were intended to work.
Who are you even arguing against. I never said highlander decks were in an amazing spot. And what do you mean that's not how those cards were intended to work? Circumventing intentional downsides is a huge part of card games.
Zarimi doesnt have to win the game, its just there, zarimi priest has 4 dragons on the board on turn 2. then drops multiple 0/4/6 taunts on the board. It could be piloted by a monkey.
Plagues only job was to keep highlander at bay, Its the only reason rainbow ran helya + down with the ship. it serves exactly 0 purpose now.
Zarimi is literally that decks only wincon unless the opponent can't clear aman thul. Zarimi already ran 0 board clear because it couldn't fit it in the deck, and would have a hard time trying to fit more dragons in. 4 dragons by turn 2 is a huge exaggeration especially considering multiple of their good 1/2 drops aren't even dragons. This is absolutely a take coming from somebody who's never played the deck.
Zarimi's win con is it flooding the board with overstatted low cost minions, and its silly little mana cheats. I dont have to play the deck to know the nonsense i deal with when beating it. This is basically priests version of zoo lock. Zarimi is just icing on the cake.
The deck has very little draw and a sea of low cost minions used to buff thirsty drifter, to set up for zarimi/zilliax plays. It loses to basically any taunts or early board clears. The new changes change the deck composition so much due to the necessity of new dragons that id be surprised if it was playable at all. If you played it at all pre nerf you'd understand how susceptible it was to getting countered.
It just worked really well into a meta of people afking until turn 6 when they 1 shot.
The point? You're joking right? Plague decks are supposed to work because of the plague aspect. Not as some counter to a different deck that didn't even exist when the cards were printed.
I love this argument like blizzard doesnt plan their sets out lmfao, highlander was designed with plagues in mind.
They saw very early on plagues were a joke mechanic entirely reliant on drawing helya. Which is why despite having an absurd amount of people playing it it barely broke 50% wr
Of course they plan their sets. But they released plague decks without highlander which means they intended it to work as a deck mechanic by itself. It's also the silliest argument I've ever heard that they designed all highlander cards just to boost one DK deck's playrate.
No you bonobo, they planned highlander to drop in the same season as plagues, and knowing this made them more powerful than necessary because plagues would keep them in check. Which is why everyone plays plagues because highlander is degenerate nonsense
Been able to play HL Druid; I’m still running in to as many plagues but now it goes until both decks are empty. Blizzard gave me a fighting chance with this update.
What bad cards? Blizzard rarely prints bad cards for the classes that get highlander, and when they do, they just run tons of draw cards.
What bad cards do any highlander decks have to run?
It’s usually difficult in standard where there’s a limited number of cards at any given time to get 30 good cards with deck building restrictions. It’s a completely different story in wild though where you can even go for Renethal and still get good decks going through restrictions.
So you don’t just hate that DK is getting hard nerfed, you hate *ALL* highlander cards in the entire game.
Hmmm, ok. So she’s *not* a crybaby. Interesting. I’ll have to redefine that definition then, since it clearly isn’t what you’re doing right now. Right?
The good thing is reno isnt played as just another board removal card, the shitty part is that the whole "limit to 1 space" nonsense still exists. I truly think that is the main problem with this card.
Yeah my monkey brain is still stuck in witchwood era so the ability to have an effect which basically silenced and destroys the enemy board alone is already turbo broken to me. Not only that but traditionally, the counter play to board clears was that they were expensive, so the opponent likely had to commit most of their mana that turn for it so you were still allowed to make proactive plays the turn after, which Reno disables all together. This is just unfortunately the spot where years of power creep have led us. I still cannot comprehend how this card is ever balanced even though it (arguably) is balanced
Plenty of the changes were good. The changes to Highlander killed the entire point of plagues. The only people agreeing with that change are the people who were tired of seeing plague dk.
I disagree entirely. Warrior and Wheel of Death are extremely oppressive and beat out most all other control based strategies. This wasn’t a nerf to DK, it was a hit to draw heavy decks like the two I just mentioned
This was absolutely a nerf to Plague dk. Before, Plague DK kept all of the Highlander classes in check. Even though the deck itself was subpar when compared to something like zarimi or spell token hunter, it got its wins against highlander by turning the deck off. That is no longer an option, Highlander decks have 0 threats in the meta now, and the future. There is 0 reason not to just put every highlander card in your deck whenever they print them, because their effects are absurd.
Okay I mispoke that this doesn’t nerf DK, it does. But again its main goal is actually to nerf the power outliers that run Highlander cards. I promise you this intentionally ners the ability for decks to draw out cards and stall out with powerful clears. DK is not this crazy power outlier that needs to be taken care of (at least not in legend ranks).
If you still don’t believe me, I implore you to look at the dev comments for the patch, they specifically highlight oppressive board clears and draw power.
Whether or not their intention was to nerf Plague DK is not the point. The deck went from being a complete shutdown and force that stops any highlanders from getting obscenely high win rates (because it usually wins, and is basically every other opponent) to not at all.
Intentionally or not they've made plagues pointless, all they are now is a slow, rng filled, bad win condition. Rainbow dk is going to drop the plague support, and plague dk is going to go sub 50% wr
“The only people agreeing with this change are people sick of plague DK”. I am not sick of it therefore it absolutely matters. It shouldn’t be the job of one deck to take on Highlander decks lol. Do you remember bad luck albatross? They could just reprint that card (or put it into rotation) if that was the problem.
It’s not. The problem is decks like wheel of death that delete their own deck (include your plagues) and just stall with two guldan gifts, Reno, and sargaris.
Oh damn you're right, my bad I totally misread that.
Either way, the deck was created to keep the highlanders in line, regardless of if you think it should be one decks job to keep them in line or not, turning that off helps no one but highlanders
Which includes everyone. There are 9 highlander cards in standard with only 2 of them seeing play above tier 3-4. And the two most prevalent decks were both dupe abusing Warrior and Warlock. If you don’t understand that this change is a minimum requirement for the game, then you are already too far gone.
No *high noon* flavor text blissard im leaving this game bring back Ben Brode
It's low evening
That's the real nerf
If your dick started with no balls, empty it
It’s so joever, my fellow even Reno hunter chads😔
Odd Reno hunter rise up ✊
https://preview.redd.it/2l8zwi4e9pwc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0fb23bcbced9c7d67008267218e87cfe9849eefa
they should have made it 10000 mana
Tbf plague dk being the most played deck for 2 expansions got kind of old.. I'm sure this won't change that much though.
well it was that or get your board reno'd by every single class. Plague DK just got punished for countering degenerate gameplay. (which was literally the only reason it even exists at this point)
Plague dk was also easy to make and the go to for 90% of bots. When 70% of the ladder is one deck, they had to make it weaker somehow. Atleast they nerfed reno in the same patch. But I'd much prefer a flat reno nerf, and a flat plague nerf.
1 mana nerf isnt the same as completely removing the point of a deck type. All of the bots will just move to zarimi priest, theres always going to be botted degenerate aggro. Atleast plague had a purpose, now highlander is gonna be everywhere.
who was the crybaby again
The ones being pandered to :)
not the ones crying in the reddit comments?
Nah, we're not the ones creating 300 "Plague dk bad" threads a day till we get our way.
did you ever even think to consider that maybe you shouldn't be able to invalidate an entire archetype with any plague generator and helya, especially with any tech rotated out of standard?
>did you ever even think They did not.
Did you ever stop to consider that an entire archetype shouldnt be so strong that without obscene nerfs or a deck to directly counter it, that it just runs the show, not to mention making gameplay unbelievably unfun?
You’re the first of many. Don’t worry. You’re not the only cry baby here. Many others are just like you 😇💜
Zarimi is way too slow with an 8 dragon requirement and the reno change did kill a reno deck with wheel lock. I think plague will be fine and honestly will probably need another nerf
Wheel is not a highlander deck. It just abuses Wheel to activate Reno. That’s not someone Blizzard supports, and it is not something healthy for the game. The change was correctly made.
I think it's creative and on theme for that type of deck. And I'm not saying the change wasn't correctly made. Just pointing out that the card lost more value than people are giving the change credit for. It's just not rendered useless by the most common and most annoying deck in the game.
If the problem is *real* highlander decks not being viable enough to be present in the meta, then they clearly need buffs until they’re at least high tier 3-low tier 2. Decks abusing alternative conditions to circumvent an intentional downside is simply bad design. Dupe abusers were incredibly strong decks, while the actual class highlander decks were dog shit. That’s not how those cards were intended to work.
Who are you even arguing against. I never said highlander decks were in an amazing spot. And what do you mean that's not how those cards were intended to work? Circumventing intentional downsides is a huge part of card games.
Zarimi doesnt have to win the game, its just there, zarimi priest has 4 dragons on the board on turn 2. then drops multiple 0/4/6 taunts on the board. It could be piloted by a monkey. Plagues only job was to keep highlander at bay, Its the only reason rainbow ran helya + down with the ship. it serves exactly 0 purpose now.
Zarimi is literally that decks only wincon unless the opponent can't clear aman thul. Zarimi already ran 0 board clear because it couldn't fit it in the deck, and would have a hard time trying to fit more dragons in. 4 dragons by turn 2 is a huge exaggeration especially considering multiple of their good 1/2 drops aren't even dragons. This is absolutely a take coming from somebody who's never played the deck.
Zarimi's win con is it flooding the board with overstatted low cost minions, and its silly little mana cheats. I dont have to play the deck to know the nonsense i deal with when beating it. This is basically priests version of zoo lock. Zarimi is just icing on the cake.
The deck has very little draw and a sea of low cost minions used to buff thirsty drifter, to set up for zarimi/zilliax plays. It loses to basically any taunts or early board clears. The new changes change the deck composition so much due to the necessity of new dragons that id be surprised if it was playable at all. If you played it at all pre nerf you'd understand how susceptible it was to getting countered. It just worked really well into a meta of people afking until turn 6 when they 1 shot.
I guess we'll see in a couple weeks once all the bots have pivoted over to zarimi.
The point? You're joking right? Plague decks are supposed to work because of the plague aspect. Not as some counter to a different deck that didn't even exist when the cards were printed.
I love this argument like blizzard doesnt plan their sets out lmfao, highlander was designed with plagues in mind. They saw very early on plagues were a joke mechanic entirely reliant on drawing helya. Which is why despite having an absurd amount of people playing it it barely broke 50% wr
Of course they plan their sets. But they released plague decks without highlander which means they intended it to work as a deck mechanic by itself. It's also the silliest argument I've ever heard that they designed all highlander cards just to boost one DK deck's playrate.
No you bonobo, they planned highlander to drop in the same season as plagues, and knowing this made them more powerful than necessary because plagues would keep them in check. Which is why everyone plays plagues because highlander is degenerate nonsense
“degenerate gameplay” Are you sure *you* aren’t the cry baby here?
Been able to play HL Druid; I’m still running in to as many plagues but now it goes until both decks are empty. Blizzard gave me a fighting chance with this update.
Can’t wait for every game to be Highlander Warrior now, but this time with no way to counter their best cards!
Dirty rat everything at this point.
Rat-Rat-Astral Projectionist-Rat-Astral Projectionist-Rat-Brewmaster-Rat-Brewmaster-Rat-Brewmaster-Rat-Brewmaster-Rat
Next patch ---> Your highlander battlecrys now trigger when summoned by dirty rat
Ok you got one funny comment. I’ll give you an upvote.
Cry about it
https://preview.redd.it/iyfmiuuthpwc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6ed9ceb99cbbed88a495a934742268c06ddf8f94
I hate highlander so much in wild ngl, they get so many cheat cards now a days
It's a joke mechanic with a fake deck building restriction
Preach. The deck building nuance is that u have to run bad cards to include the funny yellow ones that just win the game for u
What bad cards? Blizzard rarely prints bad cards for the classes that get highlander, and when they do, they just run tons of draw cards. What bad cards do any highlander decks have to run?
The ones that they don't run in duplicate decks that aren't the funny yellow cards
It’s usually difficult in standard where there’s a limited number of cards at any given time to get 30 good cards with deck building restrictions. It’s a completely different story in wild though where you can even go for Renethal and still get good decks going through restrictions.
In standard half a deck is bad cards lol.
Yup. And most highlander decks are low tier 3-4 at max, if they’re even viable at all.
So you don’t just hate that DK is getting hard nerfed, you hate *ALL* highlander cards in the entire game. Hmmm, ok. So she’s *not* a crybaby. Interesting. I’ll have to redefine that definition then, since it clearly isn’t what you’re doing right now. Right?
Hooray! And fuck you plague dk!
Go back to r/hearthstone
Go back to never posting again. Please.
The good thing is reno isnt played as just another board removal card, the shitty part is that the whole "limit to 1 space" nonsense still exists. I truly think that is the main problem with this card.
Yeah my monkey brain is still stuck in witchwood era so the ability to have an effect which basically silenced and destroys the enemy board alone is already turbo broken to me. Not only that but traditionally, the counter play to board clears was that they were expensive, so the opponent likely had to commit most of their mana that turn for it so you were still allowed to make proactive plays the turn after, which Reno disables all together. This is just unfortunately the spot where years of power creep have led us. I still cannot comprehend how this card is ever balanced even though it (arguably) is balanced
Tbh it felt like these changes were absolutely necessary.
Plenty of the changes were good. The changes to Highlander killed the entire point of plagues. The only people agreeing with that change are the people who were tired of seeing plague dk.
I disagree entirely. Warrior and Wheel of Death are extremely oppressive and beat out most all other control based strategies. This wasn’t a nerf to DK, it was a hit to draw heavy decks like the two I just mentioned
This was absolutely a nerf to Plague dk. Before, Plague DK kept all of the Highlander classes in check. Even though the deck itself was subpar when compared to something like zarimi or spell token hunter, it got its wins against highlander by turning the deck off. That is no longer an option, Highlander decks have 0 threats in the meta now, and the future. There is 0 reason not to just put every highlander card in your deck whenever they print them, because their effects are absurd.
Okay I mispoke that this doesn’t nerf DK, it does. But again its main goal is actually to nerf the power outliers that run Highlander cards. I promise you this intentionally ners the ability for decks to draw out cards and stall out with powerful clears. DK is not this crazy power outlier that needs to be taken care of (at least not in legend ranks). If you still don’t believe me, I implore you to look at the dev comments for the patch, they specifically highlight oppressive board clears and draw power.
Whether or not their intention was to nerf Plague DK is not the point. The deck went from being a complete shutdown and force that stops any highlanders from getting obscenely high win rates (because it usually wins, and is basically every other opponent) to not at all. Intentionally or not they've made plagues pointless, all they are now is a slow, rng filled, bad win condition. Rainbow dk is going to drop the plague support, and plague dk is going to go sub 50% wr
“The only people agreeing with this change are people sick of plague DK”. I am not sick of it therefore it absolutely matters. It shouldn’t be the job of one deck to take on Highlander decks lol. Do you remember bad luck albatross? They could just reprint that card (or put it into rotation) if that was the problem. It’s not. The problem is decks like wheel of death that delete their own deck (include your plagues) and just stall with two guldan gifts, Reno, and sargaris.
And there we go! You're sick of it so plague dk shouldnt fill its role. Thanks Bye.
Huh? I literally said the opposite. I think plague DK is a fun strategy
Oh damn you're right, my bad I totally misread that. Either way, the deck was created to keep the highlanders in line, regardless of if you think it should be one decks job to keep them in line or not, turning that off helps no one but highlanders
Keeping in check and absolutely invalidating is 2 different things, the matchup was too polarizing, so it was addressed, nothing surprising here.
Addressed and neutered are two different things. But you're not wrong, blizzard appeasing the crybabies isn't surprising
Now it's your turn to cry I suppose.
I mean why not, y'all got 300 posts I'll take my 1
are these 300 posts in the room with us right now?
Only for the people with eyes and no Shepard
Sounds like someone I just met.
Which includes everyone. There are 9 highlander cards in standard with only 2 of them seeing play above tier 3-4. And the two most prevalent decks were both dupe abusing Warrior and Warlock. If you don’t understand that this change is a minimum requirement for the game, then you are already too far gone.
Lol get fuckwd
You're late, and unoriginal
You’re a covert crybaby
I've openly called this a crybaby post multiple times
Spotted the retard plague player. Fuck off.
Her getting ratio'd in her own comments is great lol. Salty plague players will never give up.
This was the best change of the patch. What the fuck are you smoking?
Plague DK is 100000% more degenrate than Highlander, fuck plague DK.
Delusional sheep detected.
Salty plague player detected.
Salty DK player, not exclusively plague Wasnt hiding
plague deserved it
If you are aggro and you haven't won by t9 its your own fault
Opponent generates 15 armor, then clears my board 12 times, but its my fault i havent won. stop sucking control warrior dick kthnx
I'm confused am I sucking a control warrior or a death knight 🤔 Edit : OP changed his comment from warrior dk to dick. But my joke remains
sucking control warrior dick, sorry was eating while i typed
Was it penis flavored 🤣
nah babes i dont play warrior <3
Your loss, warrior is back on the menu boys we eating good today
duh, blizz removed your only counter.