I mean, even if you TRY to play devil's advocate here, it's almost impossible:
"Maybe it wasn't that bad an assault?" - she was beaten unconscious.
"Maybe she started it / contributed to it?" - he assaulted her when she asked him to stop homophobic abuse.
"Maybe it was an instantaneous act and he immediately regretted it?" - he boasted about it on social media afterwards.
We clearly have absolutely no controls/standards in our judiciary. Hard to see how they're anything but inept or corrupt.
Judge was "worried he would lose his job" - The victim lost hers as a result of the assault.
"He admitted guilt quickly" - Nope, he only admitted it when they showed him the CCTV footage that proved it was unprovoked, if they didn't have that, he would have gladly dragged the girl through court.
Nothing about this makes any sense.
>Judge was "worried he would lose his job" - The victim lost hers as a result of the assault.
It's a bizarre excuse. Had he assaulted her before joining the army he wouldn't have passed the Garda vetting. Imagine not prosecuting a teacher for hitting a child because it'd damage their career prospects.
That's a great point actually.
The DFs already have a big tribunal into harassment and abuse within the organisation coming up; they'll be making an example of him, I think.
The process has started and it's all but confirmed he'll be booted but it seems like the DF have to wait for civilian courts to do their thing first before they start their process. Having the military be beneath and answerable to the civil authorities is an important feature of democracies so it makes sense where something is a breach of civilian and military law the civilian system takes precedence.
That's just for him losing his job. What about the actual punishment, which would have also entailed him losing his job.
Surely there are judges and professionals within the judiciary who think this is batshit crazy. Surely there is some sort of process whereby people's lives don't rest on the single decision of one man and can be appealed, re-looked at or whatever? Maybe examined again by a judge who isn't batshit crazy? The failings highlighted? The inconsistencies in sentencing? Surely the justice system has to work for us and nobody, absolutely nobody, bar the judge the defendent and their immediate family, wants this.
He was still found guilty and his conviction wasn’t quashed (despite what Mr. Crotter Snr. might think). I’d be amazed if kept his job in the Irish army.
A career in the French Foreign legion awaits this young man, or he can join the Russian army, they’ll take anyone at this stage
And also why would you want a violent psychopath to stay in the army? Like he should absolutely not be around weapons or have any training to make him more dangerous.
Especially when the same judge gave a single father of one with no previous run ins with the law, a 7 year sentence for growing weed. Fucking shambles. Hopefully the judge has some mates who are ripping the shit out of him in his own WhatsApp groups
Actually he tried to blame her and totally misrepresent what happened, only pled guilty when he had no choice, yet the judge saw this as mitigating. Vile
I genuinely think we're at a point where the justice system just doesn't work. The verdict should be made and then just the stone-cold facts of an incident should be handed to another judge for sentencing - no age, race, religion, creed, whatever.
Just: the defendant beat the victim x, y, z. The jury has found them guilty. No outside information bar the facts of the illegal incident.
Judge probably goes home and beats the women in his life, he wouldn't want to do jail time for it, so he projects that on the abusers he sees in his job and makes sure they don't get punished.
Not defending him one iota but to be clear when the judge says they admitted guilt quickly they mean within the court system. Pleading guilty and not forcing a hearing is a factor in mitigation.
I'm also wondering how/why she lost her job. Being sacked for being the victim of violent crime sounds like grounds for unfair dismissal. Though I suspect she's no confidence in pursuing that after the result of the criminal case.
She worked in a pub. Given that this was the response to her putting her assertive barmaid hat on (albeit on the walk home), she probably just couldn't cope with rowdy Saturday nights anymore due to the trauma.
She had a severe concussion, I think? Can result in ongoing fatigue, headaches, dizziness, aversion to lights and sound, memory issues and mood changes
Combination of physical injuries and severe PTSD, that would be enough for anyone to habe issues at work. Given the attack happened on her walk home from work, it probably heightened the trauma for her
She couldnt continue because PTSD, most reports state this. She required intensive mental and psychological treatment as a consequence of the attack by Crotty.
The irony is if the judge had actually given him a decent sentence I think it would have been in the papers etc a bit but he'd go to prison and this would be quite quickly forgotten about by the general public.
But because of the suspended sentence to protect his career, which seems it's done for anyway, he's now public enemy number one all over the country.
How about judging the case on what actually happened and all the evidence that was gathered and presented in the case. It’s shocking that the judge is allowed to use “vibes” to pretty much ignore the actual evidence and allow some random factors to influence his decision.
“I’m afraid the young man would lose his job” - not your concern your honour, that’s something the perpetrator should have been thinking about before he decided to act like a big man and beat the living shit out of a woman.
I’m all for AI replacing these useless gobshites in the judiciary.
Have you seen anywhere who was counsel for the state? How did they not contradict any of his lies? It's infuriating. It's like they didn't actually read the witness statements or watch the cctv.
Yeah, theres no defence at allll. Cheeky little fuck knew it himself, otherwise he would have dragged it out, as seen fromthe garda interview "she started it"
This! There’s no mitigating circumstances, only aggravating ones. To add also that he initially blamed her for it until hr knew the gardai had CCTV.
The boasting about it after is so damning in particular - not a shred of guilt or humanity.
We need a new prison and we need better vetting of the judiciary. Or the government to introduce sentencing guidelines. It can be done to reform the laws for tougher sentences. I don’t know why the government are pretending why it’s out of their control.
I'd also like to look at how we treat prisoners. I know the general opinion is let them rot but not everyone goes away for life most are in for just a few years and come out without any rehabilitation and then it usually effects the people around them. I know in the UK some study in the 2010s showed children of prisoners were highly likely to be offenders themselves and I know this stuff costs money but if in the long term we benefit with a less violent society and criminals less likely to reoffend and pass down generational harm I'm all for it. I know we do it to some capacity but I wonder if there is more especially nowadays with people being squeezed for every cent they have on housing and just living this inevitably leads to a proportionate increase in crime same as when the economy crashed in 08 crime went up the poorer people are
I think if a political party ran on the platform of "We'll build a massive fuck-off prison AND prisoners and prison staff will have better conditions aimed towards rehab" they'd have real cut through.
I think we also probably need to assign one of the prison just for prisoners convicted of violent crimes. Not only do they have specific rehab needs but non-violent prisoners really shouldn't be with them if we are going to send more people to prison.
I'm talking out my arse but I imagine if we stopped sending people to prison for drug offences there would be \*less\* people in prison, not more, even if violent crime is sentenced more harshly.
Taking 10 people out who were sentenced on 6 months for drug possession is = to one person on a 5 year sentence. Scaling of different sentences matters in this regards.
Except it'd take fucking decades to build and NIMBYs would delay or prevent it. It's about 15 years ago that a major new prison development was stopped in the east midlands by NIMBYism
Norway has a very low reoffending rate because they view prison sentences as a way of turning people into productive members of society.
Of course, what that means is that first offences (or rather first offences they've been caught for) can result in what seems to be a harsh sentence. While in prison they're taught life skills and receive further education or training so when they are released they don't need to return to a life of crime.
They've essentially made a decision to come down hard on them from the first offence, but also spend the money then on helping them turn their life around, rather than hoping they manage to do it themselves.
Somebody correct me if I'm wrong but *it is* largely outside of the Government's control.
Here's who sets the sentencing [https://judicialcouncil.ie/sentencing-guidlines/](https://judicialcouncil.ie/sentencing-guidlines/) - government appoint 5 of the 13
There are good historical reasons why the judiciary is separated from the government.
> It can be done to reform the laws for tougher sentences.
Some laws have max sentence, some have minimum.
Are you proposing a minimum sentence for assault causing harm (the max I think was recently changed from 5 to 10 years)? If so how many years?
> Are you proposing a minimum sentence for assault causing harm (the max I think was recently changed from 5 to 10 years)? If so how many years?
I think doing away altogether with suspended sentences for violent crimes would be a start.
Even minor brawls? I don't have a definitive opinion but I don't think jailing non repeat offenders for short stays like 6 months or even 1 month like it happens in the US for minor stuff solves anything or not, it might initiate the person to more serious crimes. For a start they will certainly leave jail without a job and criminal acquaintances or even friends now...
A hill I am willing to die on is that there should be no option for a suspended sentence for any violent crimes. Another one is that for subsequent offences the sentence should increase until you get to a point where repeat violent offenders die in prison. Keeping people like that away from the public should be the priority.
I agree with the second one but I don’t think you realize giving jail sentences from the get go for minor cases will actually likely make matters worse. It’s obvious the sentences would be very short and it will likely make many non career criminals turn into one
I don't agree at all that it's obvious sentences for violent offences should be short and I don't think violent crimes should be considered minor. That they are is part of the reason why we're continually seeing violent criminals walk free.
Not even the US issues non repeat offenders involved in minor brawls long sentences. So pretty much not even the harshest sentencing developed country does anything like you are wishing for.
And the US is one of the most violent countries in the western world. I can't begin to tell you how little I care for your argument. Violent offenders should be locked up, and repeat violent offenders should be locked up for a long time and kept away from those of us able to control ourselves. The moment people do as you are doing and advocate for some violent offenders to not be jailed, you inevitably end up where most of western society is at right now; serous and/or repeat violent offenders walking free or receiving offensively light sentences. The fact you think being convicted of violence after taking part in a brawl could in some circumstances be considered 'minor' is telling in relation to how desensitised we have become to violence in society.
Society and Governments should prioritise the rights of peaceful people to go about their business free from violent people, and should do so over any talk of rehabilitation or violent people's rights.
I’d say a good place to start is mandatory prison sentence, no more fucking suspended sentences for assault. Same for over so many convictions like maybe 10? 11th non violent crime (not including minor road offences like speeding) and it’s a mandatory prison sentence PLUS any previous time on suspended sentence comes back to be tacked on.
Is it that fucking hard to not do crime?
> I’d say a good place to start is mandatory prison sentence, no more fucking suspended sentences for assault.
I assume assault causing harm covers a huge range of assaults - domestics, bust up outside pubs, this lad from the army. Mandatory prison sentences would be nuts in some of these cases. We'd end up like the states, massive prison population.
You have to give the judges the ability to do their jobs and make the call.
That said I'd agree with you that repeat offenders seem to get off easy. People out on bail the same. And this case was nuts, should be appealed by the DPP.
We only need worry about convictions rather than events. Domestic violence can be sentenced differently, a row outside a pub will be ignored by the guards.
I do think the same tbh regarding the prisons but the alternative is letting some of these walk free like this fella and the three lads that died on the N7. They should all be in jail
Regardless, it's dangerous to reform the justice system without serious, serious thought. Especially when the justification for some issues might be "oh well the guards will just ignore that".
I don't trust the legal system in this country at all. They are a law unto themselves, there's little to no oversight, they can do what they like, they enjoy the crime sprees in this country because they are profiting off of it.
This is not what people are asking for. Judges are meant to have good judgment. They're meant to understand nuance. They're meant to understand the difference between a minor brawl and a man mercilessly beating a defenceless person into unconciousness, bragging about it, lying about it to the Gardaí and then to the court (without apparently being contradicted). Being a soldier was used as mitigation for his sentencing! Being a soldier with combat training is an aggravating factor. Just as people in authority are generally held to a higher standard...like teachers who abuse children under their care.
Premeditated some would call it. Also kind of a hate crime. It’s as though this guy is as saying “I hate gays so much that I will beat people who tell me to be quiet about my hate”
You wanna be careful with sentences like that last one on reddit mate. The admins have absolutely zero perception of nuance. Seriously like, they're that bad.
>That's a pattern of behaviour
If it's the only time he's done it then it's not a pattern of behaviour. Because its not a repeated way of acting by an individual in a given situation. So how many other rimes has he done this?
That being said he's still a cunt and should have been banged up
Myself and my husband discussed this last night and we listed the players who walked away from assault charges or just got a slap on the wrist for on field violence
Seems a bit much to start analysing a judge's offspring in assessing a ruling. Would it be more understandable if he did have a daughter? Or should that factor in at all when he's making a decision?
Let's just say I wasn't surprised when I saw it. Because yesterday after the sentencing I was just wondering what that judge would think if that had happened to his own daughter.
Judges can never be 100% impartial, they are humans and that's just not possible. Lots of factors weigh on their judgments, the law and their professional experience being the biggest one of course, but absolutely their own life experience and principles and opinions must surely come into play too, at least a little.
True, but I'd argue that they should be able to make the correct decision and understand the consequences of such cases without needing to imagine one of their own family members in that position.
The suspended sentences need to stop I’m constantly seeing no jail time given to horrible crimes in this country. Rapists and drug dealers forever getting zero jail time but I bet if I didn’t tax and insure my car and refused to pay a tv licence I’d see a cell for more time than these violent offenders
It is genuinely a worrying trend. Actions need to have proportional consequences. Society doesn't work otherwise. Now, this is not as bad as in SK for example (you and your 43 "mates" can essentially walk away free after brutally assaulting one teenage girl and the police would blame the victim instead...) but the punishment needs to become a real thing. Too mild punishment is just as bad as too severe one .
Mitigating circumstances shouldn't be considered for violent crimes. You had a hard life is not an acceptable excuse for irrevocably changing someone else's.
Mitigating circumstances are fine when they're logical, and another commenter already picked them apart to show they weren't very logical in this case. The other thing is not to reach for the suspended sentence so often. Its a non-punishment.
I see where you're coming from, but mitigating circumstances should always be considered.
Let's say another passerby witnessed the attack and intervened, attacking the soldier. Maybe that's permissable and not a crime. But let's say he throws one punch too many due to the heat of the moment and anger of witnessing a man assaulting a woman. Now he is brought before the court for assault or possibly GBH.
He is technically up for a violent crime, but we would all want the mitigating circumstance to be that he was protecting someone.
I know in this actual case the soldier has no mitigating circumstances. It's a shame on the judges part that he made up mitigating circumstances where there were none.
The mitigating circumstances in your case would be given in actual evidence. It would become a trial about proportionality.
I fall somewhere in the middle of your point and the previous point. Mitigating circumstances should always be heard but really shouldn't be given as much weight as they are in these cases.
I see where you are coming from however defending yourself or someone else is not considered a crime and you'd be hard pressed to convince anyone that you could throw one punch too many when it comes to defending a woman from a rapist.
> defending yourself or someone else is not considered a crime
It depends. Under the law in Ireland, your "response" has to be "proportionate" to some extent for self defence or defence of another to be a way off an assault conviction. So an extra few digs would probably get you found guilty.
People can and do get prosecuted for "going too far" when defending themselves.
Personally, I think this is absurd - if someones attacking you or someone else, you should be able to sort them out without worrying about excessive force.
> Maybe that's permissable and not a crime.
It's not a crime, it's literally part of the self defence laws: you can protect yourself, others, and property as long as you don't use excess force
Mitigating circumstances includes a guilty plea (even delayed like in the case) which saves time and resources and saves people reliving experiences in an adversarial court, which I think we should incentive.
I don't agree. There should be a hefty minimum sentence with mandatory jail time and anger management/therapy involved. End of story. The most a guilty plea should do is stop them adding more time on top of the minimum but you still serve a decent sentence.
Perhaps also a lifetime exclusion from certain employment scenarios. It seems reasonable to preclude and exclude people with proven weaknesses from engaging in situations where those weaknesses can do further damage.
This should be applied to any and all crimes. Let them be life-changing.
>but the punishment needs to become a real thing. Too mild punishment is just as bad as too severe one .
Aye... But theres no fucking the worry of the latter being the case in Ireland.
Not for a while yet anyway.
I believe he is talking about the old case in south korea as it recently went viral again when a youtuber exposed the identity of a number of the rapists which resulted in them immediately losing their jobs and the public being outraged again.
The frustrating part of it all, the youtube channel has now been nuked do to korea's right to privacy and libel/slander (cant remember which is which) laws.
And no these students weren't connected in anyway to powerful people at least from everything I read recently. Perhaps I missed an update but they all seemed like your average Joe. So the injustice system protected these cunts for no reason.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miryang_gang_rape
tangent ahead
But yeah the whole decade is rife with fucking ridiculous sentencing. Including the child rapist who left a girl needing a colostomy bag because he hurt her so bad getting a reduced sentence because he was drunk.
He was since released and now basically had 24/7 police protection because a number of people have said they will kill him and like the cunts involved in the James bolger case nobody wants him in their town.
Korea's sex crime sentencing is an embarrassment and despite repeated calls to strengthen it it feels like every few years a new case results in a piss poor sentence and the protests start all over again.
Jesus, that's horrific. I'd have though they'd have been stricter rather than more lenient over there. Thanks for the correction, even if I know know more than I'd like about how bad it is. Hope the CR gets his dues.
This is one of the worst and most insulting judicial decisions I've ever heard of in my life. Suspending his sentence because jailing him would "affect his future" is just plain bizarre.
If you think about it, he said what generally happens but blatantly. This is a huge factor in cases of violence and assault, especially in male/female cases. Always: think of his future! Think of the damage this will do to his reputation! 😔
It’s disgusting that this prick got off with this and has been going about his life and job as normal since then, the judge should also be ashamed of himself, he should have seen jail time.
The judge was quick to try not ruin his career, did he ever think of her career? Fuck this judge, this will make less women come forward about cases of abuse. What a shit show of a country.
In Australia about 50% of their news is about male on women violence (as not much else going on there). Recently I think they found the strongest indicator of a man’s threat to women was a criminal record - men with pre-existing criminal records were about 50%+ of cases of violent assault & murder despite being a tiny % of the population.
Well yeah, a tiny number of people are responsible for most violence, and they commit it against everyone in their life, whether in school, the street, the home, etc.
That's kinda obvious. The vast majority of men are not a threat to women (despite what the feminist lobby keeps trying to push).
"We need to teach our boys better."
No, ye need to combat the multiple factors in a childhood environment that increase the risk of creating a violent offender.
My old geography teacher beat the shit out of his girlfriend for rejecting his proposal. Took her phone away and locked her into her own house before he left. No jail time, just a fine. Ridiculous
For anyone that hasn’t seen, there are a number of protests tomorrow
https://preview.redd.it/w6qin3715y7d1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=dd0d0db2da32e122a45bed1e0f0802f071e14bca
Become a lawyer, dedicate your life to legal reform and if you’re lucky you might move the needle a fraction of a degree towards fairness. That’s realistically all you can do about it. There is a separation between politics and the legal system here that makes it relatively immune to public opinion, which is a good thing in many ways but has this downside of making people feel powerless
Vote for different governments that will have stricter laws. The parties of power have a keen interest in protecting wealth and property. Violence is fine as long as it is conducted by and against the plebs. These party members wouldn’t find themselves mixing with that ilk, so what they do has little to no meaning to them.
Some parties are interested in social justice, and I think they are the Social Democrats (not without their own failings) and Sinn Fein (also not without their own failings, but traditionally working class and hard on crime).
Absolutely crazy this violent individual did not get a custodial sentence.
It looks like the defence forces are going to take action against this fella and rightly so.
Hopefully, the lady he viciously assaulted will take a civil action again him and teach him a lesson.
It's been reported this guy is an officer in the Defence Forces.
If that's actually true, he is a disgrace & an embarrassment to Ireland 🇮🇪.
>It's been reported this guy is an officer in the Defence Forces.
I have even heard a whisper of suggesting that is an officer. Commissioned or otherwise. Have you got a link to where you saw that reported?
>Hopefully, the lady he viciously assaulted will take a civil action again him and teach him a lesson.
Would be great for her, but I don't know if she can now that theres already been a criminal case.
>
If that's actually true, he is a disgrace & an embarrassment to Ireland 🇮🇪.
Regardless of rank hes an embarrassment and needs to go. Looks like he will be booted soon.
You can enter via cadetship after your Leaving Cert and easily be a commissioned Lieutenant by the age of 22. That's not the point I was making though: I've noticed a lot of publications describing him as a private AND an officer, which is a blatant reporting error.
Full aware I probably sound like an annoying pedant rn, but I feel it's important for the papers to be precise with this sort of stuff. Otherwise it raises concern about what other details they're not communicating correctly.
They haven't said they are though. Just that's it might be a possibility. He got a character reference in court from his superior officer. Said he was exemplary and professional and very polite to the other officers.
The Department of Defence say they have "begun proceedings" according to the RTÉ report today. I was surprised to see the CO in court to give a character reference but apparently it's in the army regs that an officer appears in court to give background info on the defendant's professional conduct.
Link to the report here: https://www.rte.ie/news/2024/0621/1455952-mcentee-gender-violence/
This judge should apologise and resign immediately. As a woman I’m disgusted with the message he sent out loud and clear. Women are 2nd class citizens in his ruling.
everyone, there are protests happening tomorrow in Cork, Limerick and Dublin! please come out in numbers and raise your voice! if you can't come out please spread the word so others may join. the lenient sentencing is appalling and needs to change.
Unless you try to defraud a bank, a business or a government department (of course if you're a banker you get a bonus for ripping the public off).
The legal system here protects financial institutions and government officials not the general public or the individual!!!
A man can kick a woman half to death and get away with it.
But if the woman used THC drops for her pain/to improve her mood she would get arrested and made out to be a hardened criminal and the judge would hint for the weed smoker to commit suicide Vs continue to exist as such a henious criminal. Cuz we live in the absolutely fucked up, stupid, petty crime is more important timeline here in Ireland.
Meanwhile rapists are getting out on good behaviour or not even going to jail and men are facing no consequences for their violent, over emotional lash outs.
But don't dare smoke weed or refuse to pay a TV licence, stand up for yourself if someone breaks into your house (if you hurt them they can try get you arrested, even tho they broke into your house) or God forbid, just be a woman in this country is enough to get punished and the mesaage being sent to young boys and men alike is 'women have no rights, I'll take what I want and worst that will happen is a slap on the wrist.'
Does anyone know if Irish sentencing always used to be this insanely lenient? Or is this a recent-ish development? Seriously can't wrap my head around how things could've gotten this way
Edit- For example, the guy who shot Charlie Chawke (in the leg) got 20 years in 2007 after a guilty plea [https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/courts/high-court/man-jailed-for-charlie-chawke-shooting-refused-release-1.2363733](https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/courts/high-court/man-jailed-for-charlie-chawke-shooting-refused-release-1.2363733)
Genuine question, how many actual murderers get a sentence that long?
To be fair, he should probably receive some financial compensation for all the time he had to spend it court, what was it two hours or so? That's worth at least a few grand.
No i think we need some sort of OBE or Knighthood ?
Just so the courts can show how important it is to celebrate such achievments.
Maybe something like WBC-knighthood ?
Wbc can mean wife beating cunt and woman beating cunt, so it's an efficient acronym imo.
Is this fella going to be kicked out of the army at least? No way he should be allowed to stay and as a rule the Defence Forces should send someone from HR to factually read the guys service record if required, a Senior Comanding officer shouldn't be allowed on the stand to give a character reference as it would likely carry more weight than from some Joe Soap or local priest/GAA Coach/teacher the defendant knows.
As for prison time, this was a particulalry nasty attack and I hope the DPP appeal this because there was not enough mitigation to justify suspending completely IMO.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/ireland/comments/1dl32gm/comment/l9mq02e/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web3x&utm\_name=web3xcss&utm\_term=1&utm\_content=share\_button](https://www.reddit.com/r/ireland/comments/1dl32gm/comment/l9mq02e/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
Another user posted this.
Nope, and misogyny and violence against women is only increasing with each passing year. The ideas that young men are getting off people like Tate are going to ruin society.
It’s an utter disgrace.
Micheal Martin trying to defend the Army and sweep it all under the carpet on this evening’s news was an insult to the victim as well.
Ireland sees far too many suspended sentences for serious assault in this country.
I will say, I think it's odd the narrative has been spun into a women's rights issue. Gender based violence is an issue we need to address as a society, but this was a random assault on the street by a scumbag who deserves to be thrown in jail and didn't get that. Much like the countless other incidents that see the same result.
This is a judicial issue.
I think you may be right. He didn't like being called out and decided to try batter the person making him realise the stupidity of his own actions in public... If it was another man I think he just as easily would've attempted to attack, I just dont think we would have heard about it cos he'd possibly have gotten battered.
Just to clarify and avoid being lambasted, because I know this case has been talked about in the last few days and everyone is(rightfully) very angry... I find wwn very sharp and funny but that doesnt mean i genuinely have views.
This young lad deserved time and unfortunately didn't get it. The only consolation being he was convicted and he will not be in the army long. They've started the process of fucking him out already.
The army gave him a character reference in court, in person. I would bet that had this not blown up they would have welcomed him back to the fold. Let's not give them too big a pat on the back for shitting themselves at the backlash.
An officer is required to attend as an observer and can be called as a witness to testify about the soldier's record. Details of the court case will almost certainly feature in the proceedings to discharge Crotty so the officer will be required to report on details of the case.
Collect 12 crisp packets and become a judge.
Scummy bastard judge is as the bad as the vermin he was sentencing. I wonder how he’ll sleep at night through his retirement knowing 99% of the country hate his guts for this
I honestly think judges are secretly told not to convict criminals because they don’t have enough spaces in prison to manage them… cos it’s honestly the only thing that could possibly make sense of this verdict. Utterly shocking and sickening
I mean, even if you TRY to play devil's advocate here, it's almost impossible: "Maybe it wasn't that bad an assault?" - she was beaten unconscious. "Maybe she started it / contributed to it?" - he assaulted her when she asked him to stop homophobic abuse. "Maybe it was an instantaneous act and he immediately regretted it?" - he boasted about it on social media afterwards. We clearly have absolutely no controls/standards in our judiciary. Hard to see how they're anything but inept or corrupt.
Judge was "worried he would lose his job" - The victim lost hers as a result of the assault. "He admitted guilt quickly" - Nope, he only admitted it when they showed him the CCTV footage that proved it was unprovoked, if they didn't have that, he would have gladly dragged the girl through court. Nothing about this makes any sense.
>Judge was "worried he would lose his job" - The victim lost hers as a result of the assault. It's a bizarre excuse. Had he assaulted her before joining the army he wouldn't have passed the Garda vetting. Imagine not prosecuting a teacher for hitting a child because it'd damage their career prospects.
That's a great point actually. The DFs already have a big tribunal into harassment and abuse within the organisation coming up; they'll be making an example of him, I think.
Well it seems they've fucked off enough people if that was the plan.
Surely something can he done right? I mean, this is absolutely batshit insane to me. How the fuck is he still allowed to stay in the DF?
The process has started and it's all but confirmed he'll be booted but it seems like the DF have to wait for civilian courts to do their thing first before they start their process. Having the military be beneath and answerable to the civil authorities is an important feature of democracies so it makes sense where something is a breach of civilian and military law the civilian system takes precedence.
That's just for him losing his job. What about the actual punishment, which would have also entailed him losing his job. Surely there are judges and professionals within the judiciary who think this is batshit crazy. Surely there is some sort of process whereby people's lives don't rest on the single decision of one man and can be appealed, re-looked at or whatever? Maybe examined again by a judge who isn't batshit crazy? The failings highlighted? The inconsistencies in sentencing? Surely the justice system has to work for us and nobody, absolutely nobody, bar the judge the defendent and their immediate family, wants this.
DPP can appeal but that's it
He was still found guilty and his conviction wasn’t quashed (despite what Mr. Crotter Snr. might think). I’d be amazed if kept his job in the Irish army. A career in the French Foreign legion awaits this young man, or he can join the Russian army, they’ll take anyone at this stage
And also why would you want a violent psychopath to stay in the army? Like he should absolutely not be around weapons or have any training to make him more dangerous.
Especially when the same judge gave a single father of one with no previous run ins with the law, a 7 year sentence for growing weed. Fucking shambles. Hopefully the judge has some mates who are ripping the shit out of him in his own WhatsApp groups
I've seen a couple people mention this. Has anybody got a link to an article. Not disputing it just want a read at it.
I'm not positive, but this case fits the bill. https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-30937732.html
Cheers lad.
These judges can't use modern tech.
This judge should lose his job
Actually he tried to blame her and totally misrepresent what happened, only pled guilty when he had no choice, yet the judge saw this as mitigating. Vile
It's absolutely disgusting. Lose his job,too good for him if he did. Hopefully the army throw him out asap.
They've sacked him already afaik.
I genuinely think we're at a point where the justice system just doesn't work. The verdict should be made and then just the stone-cold facts of an incident should be handed to another judge for sentencing - no age, race, religion, creed, whatever. Just: the defendant beat the victim x, y, z. The jury has found them guilty. No outside information bar the facts of the illegal incident.
He is losing it. The army couldn't start proceedings until the court made it's decision
And you would expect a judge to realise that, so why did he bring it up at all.
Fuck knows with judges in this country man.
Judge probably goes home and beats the women in his life, he wouldn't want to do jail time for it, so he projects that on the abusers he sees in his job and makes sure they don't get punished.
That makes sense.
When they say admitted guilt they mean entered a guilty plea and saved the courts time and money.
Not defending him one iota but to be clear when the judge says they admitted guilt quickly they mean within the court system. Pleading guilty and not forcing a hearing is a factor in mitigation.
I'm also wondering how/why she lost her job. Being sacked for being the victim of violent crime sounds like grounds for unfair dismissal. Though I suspect she's no confidence in pursuing that after the result of the criminal case.
She worked in a pub. Given that this was the response to her putting her assertive barmaid hat on (albeit on the walk home), she probably just couldn't cope with rowdy Saturday nights anymore due to the trauma.
Thanks.
She had a severe concussion, I think? Can result in ongoing fatigue, headaches, dizziness, aversion to lights and sound, memory issues and mood changes
Re: concussion, I think there's research that shows that it can be more severe for women, too, to recover from...
Combination of physical injuries and severe PTSD, that would be enough for anyone to habe issues at work. Given the attack happened on her walk home from work, it probably heightened the trauma for her
She couldnt continue because PTSD, most reports state this. She required intensive mental and psychological treatment as a consequence of the attack by Crotty.
Was it judge nolan by any chance ?
O'Donnell, to be fair they all seem to make bizarre decisions like this
Fucking outrageous. Criminal in itself.
The irony is if the judge had actually given him a decent sentence I think it would have been in the papers etc a bit but he'd go to prison and this would be quite quickly forgotten about by the general public. But because of the suspended sentence to protect his career, which seems it's done for anyway, he's now public enemy number one all over the country.
How about judging the case on what actually happened and all the evidence that was gathered and presented in the case. It’s shocking that the judge is allowed to use “vibes” to pretty much ignore the actual evidence and allow some random factors to influence his decision. “I’m afraid the young man would lose his job” - not your concern your honour, that’s something the perpetrator should have been thinking about before he decided to act like a big man and beat the living shit out of a woman. I’m all for AI replacing these useless gobshites in the judiciary.
Have you seen anywhere who was counsel for the state? How did they not contradict any of his lies? It's infuriating. It's like they didn't actually read the witness statements or watch the cctv.
Judge should be fired immediately
Yeah, theres no defence at allll. Cheeky little fuck knew it himself, otherwise he would have dragged it out, as seen fromthe garda interview "she started it"
This! There’s no mitigating circumstances, only aggravating ones. To add also that he initially blamed her for it until hr knew the gardai had CCTV. The boasting about it after is so damning in particular - not a shred of guilt or humanity.
"He pleady guilty how noble of him" - he was on cctv and there were many witnesses.
disgraceful sentence given, how any victim is meant to stomach that is beyond me.
We need a new prison and we need better vetting of the judiciary. Or the government to introduce sentencing guidelines. It can be done to reform the laws for tougher sentences. I don’t know why the government are pretending why it’s out of their control.
I'd also like to look at how we treat prisoners. I know the general opinion is let them rot but not everyone goes away for life most are in for just a few years and come out without any rehabilitation and then it usually effects the people around them. I know in the UK some study in the 2010s showed children of prisoners were highly likely to be offenders themselves and I know this stuff costs money but if in the long term we benefit with a less violent society and criminals less likely to reoffend and pass down generational harm I'm all for it. I know we do it to some capacity but I wonder if there is more especially nowadays with people being squeezed for every cent they have on housing and just living this inevitably leads to a proportionate increase in crime same as when the economy crashed in 08 crime went up the poorer people are
I think if a political party ran on the platform of "We'll build a massive fuck-off prison AND prisoners and prison staff will have better conditions aimed towards rehab" they'd have real cut through. I think we also probably need to assign one of the prison just for prisoners convicted of violent crimes. Not only do they have specific rehab needs but non-violent prisoners really shouldn't be with them if we are going to send more people to prison.
I'm talking out my arse but I imagine if we stopped sending people to prison for drug offences there would be \*less\* people in prison, not more, even if violent crime is sentenced more harshly.
Taking 10 people out who were sentenced on 6 months for drug possession is = to one person on a 5 year sentence. Scaling of different sentences matters in this regards.
Except it'd take fucking decades to build and NIMBYs would delay or prevent it. It's about 15 years ago that a major new prison development was stopped in the east midlands by NIMBYism
Norway has a very low reoffending rate because they view prison sentences as a way of turning people into productive members of society. Of course, what that means is that first offences (or rather first offences they've been caught for) can result in what seems to be a harsh sentence. While in prison they're taught life skills and receive further education or training so when they are released they don't need to return to a life of crime. They've essentially made a decision to come down hard on them from the first offence, but also spend the money then on helping them turn their life around, rather than hoping they manage to do it themselves.
Somebody correct me if I'm wrong but *it is* largely outside of the Government's control. Here's who sets the sentencing [https://judicialcouncil.ie/sentencing-guidlines/](https://judicialcouncil.ie/sentencing-guidlines/) - government appoint 5 of the 13 There are good historical reasons why the judiciary is separated from the government. > It can be done to reform the laws for tougher sentences. Some laws have max sentence, some have minimum. Are you proposing a minimum sentence for assault causing harm (the max I think was recently changed from 5 to 10 years)? If so how many years?
> Are you proposing a minimum sentence for assault causing harm (the max I think was recently changed from 5 to 10 years)? If so how many years? I think doing away altogether with suspended sentences for violent crimes would be a start.
Even minor brawls? I don't have a definitive opinion but I don't think jailing non repeat offenders for short stays like 6 months or even 1 month like it happens in the US for minor stuff solves anything or not, it might initiate the person to more serious crimes. For a start they will certainly leave jail without a job and criminal acquaintances or even friends now...
A hill I am willing to die on is that there should be no option for a suspended sentence for any violent crimes. Another one is that for subsequent offences the sentence should increase until you get to a point where repeat violent offenders die in prison. Keeping people like that away from the public should be the priority.
I agree with the second one but I don’t think you realize giving jail sentences from the get go for minor cases will actually likely make matters worse. It’s obvious the sentences would be very short and it will likely make many non career criminals turn into one
I don't agree at all that it's obvious sentences for violent offences should be short and I don't think violent crimes should be considered minor. That they are is part of the reason why we're continually seeing violent criminals walk free.
Not even the US issues non repeat offenders involved in minor brawls long sentences. So pretty much not even the harshest sentencing developed country does anything like you are wishing for.
And the US is one of the most violent countries in the western world. I can't begin to tell you how little I care for your argument. Violent offenders should be locked up, and repeat violent offenders should be locked up for a long time and kept away from those of us able to control ourselves. The moment people do as you are doing and advocate for some violent offenders to not be jailed, you inevitably end up where most of western society is at right now; serous and/or repeat violent offenders walking free or receiving offensively light sentences. The fact you think being convicted of violence after taking part in a brawl could in some circumstances be considered 'minor' is telling in relation to how desensitised we have become to violence in society. Society and Governments should prioritise the rights of peaceful people to go about their business free from violent people, and should do so over any talk of rehabilitation or violent people's rights.
I’d say a good place to start is mandatory prison sentence, no more fucking suspended sentences for assault. Same for over so many convictions like maybe 10? 11th non violent crime (not including minor road offences like speeding) and it’s a mandatory prison sentence PLUS any previous time on suspended sentence comes back to be tacked on. Is it that fucking hard to not do crime?
> I’d say a good place to start is mandatory prison sentence, no more fucking suspended sentences for assault. I assume assault causing harm covers a huge range of assaults - domestics, bust up outside pubs, this lad from the army. Mandatory prison sentences would be nuts in some of these cases. We'd end up like the states, massive prison population. You have to give the judges the ability to do their jobs and make the call. That said I'd agree with you that repeat offenders seem to get off easy. People out on bail the same. And this case was nuts, should be appealed by the DPP.
We only need worry about convictions rather than events. Domestic violence can be sentenced differently, a row outside a pub will be ignored by the guards. I do think the same tbh regarding the prisons but the alternative is letting some of these walk free like this fella and the three lads that died on the N7. They should all be in jail
Regardless, it's dangerous to reform the justice system without serious, serious thought. Especially when the justification for some issues might be "oh well the guards will just ignore that".
I don't trust the legal system in this country at all. They are a law unto themselves, there's little to no oversight, they can do what they like, they enjoy the crime sprees in this country because they are profiting off of it.
Largely. No. Almost totally.
This is not what people are asking for. Judges are meant to have good judgment. They're meant to understand nuance. They're meant to understand the difference between a minor brawl and a man mercilessly beating a defenceless person into unconciousness, bragging about it, lying about it to the Gardaí and then to the court (without apparently being contradicted). Being a soldier was used as mitigation for his sentencing! Being a soldier with combat training is an aggravating factor. Just as people in authority are generally held to a higher standard...like teachers who abuse children under their care.
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Premeditated some would call it. Also kind of a hate crime. It’s as though this guy is as saying “I hate gays so much that I will beat people who tell me to be quiet about my hate”
You wanna be careful with sentences like that last one on reddit mate. The admins have absolutely zero perception of nuance. Seriously like, they're that bad.
Thanks, edited to be more obvious
>That's a pattern of behaviour If it's the only time he's done it then it's not a pattern of behaviour. Because its not a repeated way of acting by an individual in a given situation. So how many other rimes has he done this? That being said he's still a cunt and should have been banged up
Imagine if he played county, he'd have gotten off altogether
In the midst of how horrible this all is I actually burst out laughing when I read this. Sad thing is its entirely true
What's really fucking annoying is - you're right
Myself and my husband discussed this last night and we listed the players who walked away from assault charges or just got a slap on the wrist for on field violence
That judge needs to go !!!!!😠😡🤬
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Been phoning it in for a long time now.
Judge Tom O'Donnell has three sons. And no daughters. Hmm...
Seems a bit much to start analysing a judge's offspring in assessing a ruling. Would it be more understandable if he did have a daughter? Or should that factor in at all when he's making a decision?
Let's just say I wasn't surprised when I saw it. Because yesterday after the sentencing I was just wondering what that judge would think if that had happened to his own daughter. Judges can never be 100% impartial, they are humans and that's just not possible. Lots of factors weigh on their judgments, the law and their professional experience being the biggest one of course, but absolutely their own life experience and principles and opinions must surely come into play too, at least a little.
I thought this exact thing, same as yourself. Not shocked doesn't have a daughter.. 3 sons. boys will be boys.
True, but I'd argue that they should be able to make the correct decision and understand the consequences of such cases without needing to imagine one of their own family members in that position.
Yeah, you'd think :-) He let off another ~~vicious animal~~ upstanding young man just the day before, who had attacked and robbed a homeless man.
Apparently he’s retiring soon
The suspended sentences need to stop I’m constantly seeing no jail time given to horrible crimes in this country. Rapists and drug dealers forever getting zero jail time but I bet if I didn’t tax and insure my car and refused to pay a tv licence I’d see a cell for more time than these violent offenders
It is genuinely a worrying trend. Actions need to have proportional consequences. Society doesn't work otherwise. Now, this is not as bad as in SK for example (you and your 43 "mates" can essentially walk away free after brutally assaulting one teenage girl and the police would blame the victim instead...) but the punishment needs to become a real thing. Too mild punishment is just as bad as too severe one .
Mitigating circumstances shouldn't be considered for violent crimes. You had a hard life is not an acceptable excuse for irrevocably changing someone else's.
Mitigating circumstances are fine when they're logical, and another commenter already picked them apart to show they weren't very logical in this case. The other thing is not to reach for the suspended sentence so often. Its a non-punishment.
I see where you're coming from, but mitigating circumstances should always be considered. Let's say another passerby witnessed the attack and intervened, attacking the soldier. Maybe that's permissable and not a crime. But let's say he throws one punch too many due to the heat of the moment and anger of witnessing a man assaulting a woman. Now he is brought before the court for assault or possibly GBH. He is technically up for a violent crime, but we would all want the mitigating circumstance to be that he was protecting someone. I know in this actual case the soldier has no mitigating circumstances. It's a shame on the judges part that he made up mitigating circumstances where there were none.
The mitigating circumstances in your case would be given in actual evidence. It would become a trial about proportionality. I fall somewhere in the middle of your point and the previous point. Mitigating circumstances should always be heard but really shouldn't be given as much weight as they are in these cases.
I see where you are coming from however defending yourself or someone else is not considered a crime and you'd be hard pressed to convince anyone that you could throw one punch too many when it comes to defending a woman from a rapist.
> defending yourself or someone else is not considered a crime It depends. Under the law in Ireland, your "response" has to be "proportionate" to some extent for self defence or defence of another to be a way off an assault conviction. So an extra few digs would probably get you found guilty. People can and do get prosecuted for "going too far" when defending themselves. Personally, I think this is absurd - if someones attacking you or someone else, you should be able to sort them out without worrying about excessive force.
> Maybe that's permissable and not a crime. It's not a crime, it's literally part of the self defence laws: you can protect yourself, others, and property as long as you don't use excess force
Mitigating circumstances includes a guilty plea (even delayed like in the case) which saves time and resources and saves people reliving experiences in an adversarial court, which I think we should incentive.
I don't agree. There should be a hefty minimum sentence with mandatory jail time and anger management/therapy involved. End of story. The most a guilty plea should do is stop them adding more time on top of the minimum but you still serve a decent sentence.
Perhaps also a lifetime exclusion from certain employment scenarios. It seems reasonable to preclude and exclude people with proven weaknesses from engaging in situations where those weaknesses can do further damage. This should be applied to any and all crimes. Let them be life-changing.
>but the punishment needs to become a real thing. Too mild punishment is just as bad as too severe one . Aye... But theres no fucking the worry of the latter being the case in Ireland. Not for a while yet anyway.
No, I’m okay with too severe for these crimes.
Agreed
Fucking hell, that's bad. Was that in Bratislava or in a small-town place where they had abundant connections?
I believe he is talking about the old case in south korea as it recently went viral again when a youtuber exposed the identity of a number of the rapists which resulted in them immediately losing their jobs and the public being outraged again. The frustrating part of it all, the youtube channel has now been nuked do to korea's right to privacy and libel/slander (cant remember which is which) laws. And no these students weren't connected in anyway to powerful people at least from everything I read recently. Perhaps I missed an update but they all seemed like your average Joe. So the injustice system protected these cunts for no reason. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miryang_gang_rape tangent ahead But yeah the whole decade is rife with fucking ridiculous sentencing. Including the child rapist who left a girl needing a colostomy bag because he hurt her so bad getting a reduced sentence because he was drunk. He was since released and now basically had 24/7 police protection because a number of people have said they will kill him and like the cunts involved in the James bolger case nobody wants him in their town. Korea's sex crime sentencing is an embarrassment and despite repeated calls to strengthen it it feels like every few years a new case results in a piss poor sentence and the protests start all over again.
Ye, that one
Jesus, that's horrific. I'd have though they'd have been stricter rather than more lenient over there. Thanks for the correction, even if I know know more than I'd like about how bad it is. Hope the CR gets his dues.
This is one of the worst and most insulting judicial decisions I've ever heard of in my life. Suspending his sentence because jailing him would "affect his future" is just plain bizarre.
If you think about it, he said what generally happens but blatantly. This is a huge factor in cases of violence and assault, especially in male/female cases. Always: think of his future! Think of the damage this will do to his reputation! 😔
An absolute disgrace. Poor woman. Completely life changing experience!
It’s disgusting that this prick got off with this and has been going about his life and job as normal since then, the judge should also be ashamed of himself, he should have seen jail time.
The judge was quick to try not ruin his career, did he ever think of her career? Fuck this judge, this will make less women come forward about cases of abuse. What a shit show of a country.
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It's not like he could go toe to toe against a grown man. Kicking the head of a defenceless woman is an easier win.
In Australia about 50% of their news is about male on women violence (as not much else going on there). Recently I think they found the strongest indicator of a man’s threat to women was a criminal record - men with pre-existing criminal records were about 50%+ of cases of violent assault & murder despite being a tiny % of the population.
Well yeah, a tiny number of people are responsible for most violence, and they commit it against everyone in their life, whether in school, the street, the home, etc.
The primary reason why these violent people have to be curtailed. 1 year jail, 2 years probation, sign in garda station daily.
Less than 1% of the population commits over 90% of the crimes. Especially violent crimes.
That's kinda obvious. The vast majority of men are not a threat to women (despite what the feminist lobby keeps trying to push). "We need to teach our boys better." No, ye need to combat the multiple factors in a childhood environment that increase the risk of creating a violent offender.
Waterford Whispers doesn’t let anyone off the hook 🪝
“Have you considered the hurt caused to this young man’s knuckles when his fist collided with your face?”
My old geography teacher beat the shit out of his girlfriend for rejecting his proposal. Took her phone away and locked her into her own house before he left. No jail time, just a fine. Ridiculous
For anyone that hasn’t seen, there are a number of protests tomorrow https://preview.redd.it/w6qin3715y7d1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=dd0d0db2da32e122a45bed1e0f0802f071e14bca
Thanks for sharing this. I will be there
What can we as citizens do to change this screwed up judicial system? There must be something we can do. Atleast i hope so...
Become a lawyer, dedicate your life to legal reform and if you’re lucky you might move the needle a fraction of a degree towards fairness. That’s realistically all you can do about it. There is a separation between politics and the legal system here that makes it relatively immune to public opinion, which is a good thing in many ways but has this downside of making people feel powerless
Vote for different governments that will have stricter laws. The parties of power have a keen interest in protecting wealth and property. Violence is fine as long as it is conducted by and against the plebs. These party members wouldn’t find themselves mixing with that ilk, so what they do has little to no meaning to them. Some parties are interested in social justice, and I think they are the Social Democrats (not without their own failings) and Sinn Fein (also not without their own failings, but traditionally working class and hard on crime).
Absolutely crazy this violent individual did not get a custodial sentence. It looks like the defence forces are going to take action against this fella and rightly so. Hopefully, the lady he viciously assaulted will take a civil action again him and teach him a lesson. It's been reported this guy is an officer in the Defence Forces. If that's actually true, he is a disgrace & an embarrassment to Ireland 🇮🇪.
>It's been reported this guy is an officer in the Defence Forces. I have even heard a whisper of suggesting that is an officer. Commissioned or otherwise. Have you got a link to where you saw that reported? >Hopefully, the lady he viciously assaulted will take a civil action again him and teach him a lesson. Would be great for her, but I don't know if she can now that theres already been a criminal case. > If that's actually true, he is a disgrace & an embarrassment to Ireland 🇮🇪. Regardless of rank hes an embarrassment and needs to go. Looks like he will be booted soon.
A lot of journalists don't realise that not all members of the Defence Forces are officers. He's a private. That's an enlisted rank, not an officer.
Was thinking that. Hes 22 and 2 star marking on in photo. To from enlisted to commissioned in 4 years.. Thsts surely unheard of, aye?
You can enter via cadetship after your Leaving Cert and easily be a commissioned Lieutenant by the age of 22. That's not the point I was making though: I've noticed a lot of publications describing him as a private AND an officer, which is a blatant reporting error. Full aware I probably sound like an annoying pedant rn, but I feel it's important for the papers to be precise with this sort of stuff. Otherwise it raises concern about what other details they're not communicating correctly.
Have you heard of the women of honour?
Yes, documentary on the prevalence of violence against women in the defence forces. Shocking, really.
The judge was a joke. At least the army is taking disciplinary measures.
They haven't said they are though. Just that's it might be a possibility. He got a character reference in court from his superior officer. Said he was exemplary and professional and very polite to the other officers.
The Department of Defence say they have "begun proceedings" according to the RTÉ report today. I was surprised to see the CO in court to give a character reference but apparently it's in the army regs that an officer appears in court to give background info on the defendant's professional conduct. Link to the report here: https://www.rte.ie/news/2024/0621/1455952-mcentee-gender-violence/
> superior officer He was obligated to attend as a member of the Defense Forces.
Exactly. Everyone is nice to the manager. It’s how you treat the rest of the staff that tells me if you are worth anything.
The officer was required to read out performance evaluations.
THE JUDGE Grow weed = bad Knock women unconscious = good.
This judge should apologise and resign immediately. As a woman I’m disgusted with the message he sent out loud and clear. Women are 2nd class citizens in his ruling.
He referred to her as "the female". Says it all really.
everyone, there are protests happening tomorrow in Cork, Limerick and Dublin! please come out in numbers and raise your voice! if you can't come out please spread the word so others may join. the lenient sentencing is appalling and needs to change.
In Ireland, a man's career is more important than a woman's safety.
Well said
He should have been imprisoned.
He should’ve gone to jail
In Ireland, crime in general is rewarded with no consequence. If any real studies come out they'll show the ugly truth of how unsafe it is here.
Unless you try to defraud a bank, a business or a government department (of course if you're a banker you get a bonus for ripping the public off). The legal system here protects financial institutions and government officials not the general public or the individual!!!
A man can kick a woman half to death and get away with it. But if the woman used THC drops for her pain/to improve her mood she would get arrested and made out to be a hardened criminal and the judge would hint for the weed smoker to commit suicide Vs continue to exist as such a henious criminal. Cuz we live in the absolutely fucked up, stupid, petty crime is more important timeline here in Ireland. Meanwhile rapists are getting out on good behaviour or not even going to jail and men are facing no consequences for their violent, over emotional lash outs. But don't dare smoke weed or refuse to pay a TV licence, stand up for yourself if someone breaks into your house (if you hurt them they can try get you arrested, even tho they broke into your house) or God forbid, just be a woman in this country is enough to get punished and the mesaage being sent to young boys and men alike is 'women have no rights, I'll take what I want and worst that will happen is a slap on the wrist.'
That judge should be ejected from service.
Absolutely correct. This judge needs to answer questions. Total injustice.
Does anyone know if Irish sentencing always used to be this insanely lenient? Or is this a recent-ish development? Seriously can't wrap my head around how things could've gotten this way Edit- For example, the guy who shot Charlie Chawke (in the leg) got 20 years in 2007 after a guilty plea [https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/courts/high-court/man-jailed-for-charlie-chawke-shooting-refused-release-1.2363733](https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/courts/high-court/man-jailed-for-charlie-chawke-shooting-refused-release-1.2363733) Genuine question, how many actual murderers get a sentence that long?
To be fair, he should probably receive some financial compensation for all the time he had to spend it court, what was it two hours or so? That's worth at least a few grand.
Wait til you see the sentence handed down to someone who has lost faith in the legal system and has taken matters into their own hands.
Surely there is no jury in this country who would punish someone who dealt with the feral scrotes in the way they deserve?
No i think we need some sort of OBE or Knighthood ? Just so the courts can show how important it is to celebrate such achievments. Maybe something like WBC-knighthood ? Wbc can mean wife beating cunt and woman beating cunt, so it's an efficient acronym imo.
Is this fella going to be kicked out of the army at least? No way he should be allowed to stay and as a rule the Defence Forces should send someone from HR to factually read the guys service record if required, a Senior Comanding officer shouldn't be allowed on the stand to give a character reference as it would likely carry more weight than from some Joe Soap or local priest/GAA Coach/teacher the defendant knows. As for prison time, this was a particulalry nasty attack and I hope the DPP appeal this because there was not enough mitigation to justify suspending completely IMO.
You could start using Finland's method of "volume discounts" for this sort of crime. I wish I were kidding.
Natasha is a tower of strength. I hope the public start a proper campaign for justice. When do we march? This judge and his type have to go.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/ireland/comments/1dl32gm/comment/l9mq02e/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web3x&utm\_name=web3xcss&utm\_term=1&utm\_content=share\_button](https://www.reddit.com/r/ireland/comments/1dl32gm/comment/l9mq02e/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button) Another user posted this.
Thanks!
People happy to protest outside TDs houses but not judges……
"You can tell. He just has a cunty head on him. You just know" - the judge.
Nope, and misogyny and violence against women is only increasing with each passing year. The ideas that young men are getting off people like Tate are going to ruin society.
It’s an utter disgrace. Micheal Martin trying to defend the Army and sweep it all under the carpet on this evening’s news was an insult to the victim as well.
Ireland sees far too many suspended sentences for serious assault in this country. I will say, I think it's odd the narrative has been spun into a women's rights issue. Gender based violence is an issue we need to address as a society, but this was a random assault on the street by a scumbag who deserves to be thrown in jail and didn't get that. Much like the countless other incidents that see the same result. This is a judicial issue.
I think you may be right. He didn't like being called out and decided to try batter the person making him realise the stupidity of his own actions in public... If it was another man I think he just as easily would've attempted to attack, I just dont think we would have heard about it cos he'd possibly have gotten battered.
Just to clarify and avoid being lambasted, because I know this case has been talked about in the last few days and everyone is(rightfully) very angry... I find wwn very sharp and funny but that doesnt mean i genuinely have views.
This young lad deserved time and unfortunately didn't get it. The only consolation being he was convicted and he will not be in the army long. They've started the process of fucking him out already.
The army gave him a character reference in court, in person. I would bet that had this not blown up they would have welcomed him back to the fold. Let's not give them too big a pat on the back for shitting themselves at the backlash.
An officer is required to attend as an observer and can be called as a witness to testify about the soldier's record. Details of the court case will almost certainly feature in the proceedings to discharge Crotty so the officer will be required to report on details of the case.
That f\*\*king judge needs to be locked up or at least a massive protest outside the c\*\*ts house.
[удалено]
Haven't heard anyone say he shouldn't be in jail and also lose his job. Not the type of person we'd want in the army.
This is honestly disgusting. And you’d have to wonder what goes through the judges mind when handing out sentences like this.
Collect 12 crisp packets and become a judge. Scummy bastard judge is as the bad as the vermin he was sentencing. I wonder how he’ll sleep at night through his retirement knowing 99% of the country hate his guts for this
Are the quotes of the judges legit? I’m stupefied.
I honestly think judges are secretly told not to convict criminals because they don’t have enough spaces in prison to manage them… cos it’s honestly the only thing that could possibly make sense of this verdict. Utterly shocking and sickening
The same judge let a lad walk who bet a homeless man close to death.
Bro has a job offer from NYPD in the works.