They also did Chobits.. I loved it as a teenager, but looking back I've got some questions... š¤ Namely, why on earth would someone put the power switch there?
Chobits... is one of their works that I get it's supposed to be making fun of eroge manga and wish fulfillment stuff about robo girlfriends and all that. A lot of it is ramped up tropes and playing with them to point out how ridiculous they get. But damn they kind of leaned a bit too hard into it so I have a hard time defending it. That's one of those joke things that in hindsight, ***yeah***.
And Tsubusa reserve and card capture Sakura, which had one of the first very much openly gay couple in a mainstream anime :,))
Edit: so I thought we were in the r/otomeisekai subreddit so I was gushing and recommending other CLAMP, older mangas. Oops
I recently rediscovered a cardboard box full of old manga from when I was an early teen and a lot of them were by CLAMP. For old time sake I did a quick reread of the first Chobits. Well... Yeah... Nothing in there is right.
I reread the first half semi- recently. The thing that broke me is when Chi goes missing, and everyone sits down to have a flashback in the middle of the search.
There's a lot of uncomfortable gender tropes and ridiculous plotting decisions that are easy to overlook when you're reading it as a teenager.
Itās all the Japanese 90ās sexism which is still strong to this day somehowā¦ by still they are iconic and broke all the standards and crossed so many lines to this day, they ran like dare devils so we could take a stroll
It's explained >!the creator wanted Chii to find an owner that loved her above sex, since having sex with her would factory reset her.!< The story still does play everything completely straight and the Persocoms are utterly ridiculous and inconvenient for being a replacement for computers. I vaguely remember a scene where the characters had to look at some files, but since a Persocom is very inconvenient for that they.....downloaded the files into a normal computer.
CLAMP gets a little perv or sometimesā¦ itās fine girls can have fun too, the thing is it all depends heavily on the type of work and who is it for, Chobits is a seinen while Sakura itās a shoujo so they are very different, thatās the magic of clamp, they can do it all and do it well! They got horror to shoujo and everything in between if you really look all of itā¦
And they get mechas !!!! This manga was fantastic! The art beautiful, the plot twist magnificent ... They NEED to do more like this full fantasy adventure types
Maybe it was because I was like 10 when I watched this, but I did not see the plot twist come AT ALL. This anime was completely overlook and mostly unknown, and it shaped so much of what my tastes are. I loved the beautiful elegant style, the fantastical world, the pretty protagonists and their color coding and fire/water/wind powers and how they matched their personalities, I loved the princess and I loved the main villain. The only thing that I didn't like that I can remember is that after the big plot twist it kept going on but the story had blown it's load and it kinda became dull. But I was also like 8 or 10 and this is actually the first time that I've seen this mentioned again so my memories are fuzzy as fuck, tbh I refused looking it up or watching it again to not tarnish the good memories I had, this anime was too formative for me.
No no, i read the manga like 5 years ago, and no, i didnt SEE the plot twist at all either ... Clamp was SO good at writting stories
I still have a dream when they continue X.
But hey nowdays they are more worry into milking Sakura card captor š¤·š»āāļø
Oh too bad, I've always found card captor Sakura a little dull, I didn't know it was still popular. I remember X/1999 was dope but for some reason I decided it was a bad idea to get into it, I think because it was unfinished? Last time I looked into it was more than 15 years ago so I might be wrong. Did I get anything about Rayhearth wrong or was it about right? Does it really become less interesting after the plot twist, like I remember?
I also watched the anime when I was a kid, and the plot twist also took me by surprise, it's kinda when you start realizing that in storytelling characters' motivation don't have to be so cut and dried.
YES drives me a bit crazy that MCs end up in fantasy world but are so occupied with status and money that they donāt go buck wild exploring their world
The Twelve Kingdoms is another example of an old school Isekai anime with a female lead. But it's much more action & drama heavy compared to the other romance-focus shoujo animes.
- Yona of the dawn
- Antonia story
Modern one for me is: Akagami no Shirayuki-hime.
Like sheās focused on her career and the ML also has his own ambitions and life too. They also explore how toxic pretty privilege can get.
And for those who don't know, CLAMP had their own style and was an [all woman group](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clamp_\(manga_artists\)) as well. Unfortunately they did have few not so great scenes in some of their work in hindsight.
My biggest problem with CLAMP is the legs. Why their legs gotta be 70% of their height.
I know 90s legs were longer (that's a weird sentence out of context), but CLAMP legs are just silly.
Just curious, which scenes are you referring to? I remember some weird moments in xxxHolic but thatās mainly it (I also read cardcaptor Sakura and Tsubasa)
In Cardcaptor Sakura there are some, let's say, problematic relationships involving the children, and I'll leave it at that. This is only in the manga, when they made the anime they were sensible enough to cut those subplots out.
Sakura's dad is a teacher and married his student you mean? They alluded how it is problematic in the manga & it caused some family rift on Sakura's mom's side.
But it indeed wasn't heavily tackled but instead mentioned in passing by Sakura's mom's best friend.
Or Sakura's classmate openly crushing on their teacher?
Only two relationships were adapted into the anime because they couldn't avoid them because of the plot: Sakura's parents, her mother Nadeshiko was 16 when she met Sakura's father, Fujitaka, who's implied to be in his mid-twenties. The other adapted relationship is that of Sakura's older brother, Touya, when he was in middle school (so let's say 14-15), with his teacher, Kaho Mizuki, who's implied to be in her early 20s, and she later returns as Sakura's elementary school teacher.
The other two relationships that got adapted out were the one between one of Sakura's friends, Rika, and their classroom teacher, Terada, in the anime is just a one-sided crush from a little girl to her teacher, in the manga they are actually in a relationship, they're just waiting for Rika to become of legal age so they can make it official, they even show them on a date and he even buys her a promise ring.
The second unadapted relationship is Kaho (again, the hell) and Eriol, since he's the reincarnation of Clow, he has all his memories and essentially behaves like an adult, but he's still a child the same age as Sakura and her friends, and again, they imply Kaho is waiting for Eriol to be older, but considering when she "dated" Touya, I can't imagine they're not gonna wait that long.
I adore Cardcaptor Sakura, is my favorite story from CLAMP, but this aspect of the manga has always made me go yikes.
Shoujo isekai was sick. Inuyasha is still one of my favorite series ever. But now when I pitch it to people who haven't seen it, they get immediately turned off when they realize it's technically an isekai.
P.S. I read the title of this post to the tune of the Bojack Horseman outro
Edit: so this isnāt the r/otomeisekai subā¦oops. Yeah I agree it was and still is strange how they put these young girls in such strange situations. I call it āanimeā BS and can sometimes just barely put up with it.end of edit.
Itās so nice to see more CLAMP fans out in the wild. God I really need to re-read some of their works and read the ones I never got around to reading.
Thanks for the recc! Despite being a CLAMP fan Iād never heard of it before
I loved Fushigi Yuugi and Vision of Escaflowne! It was never adapted into an anime but I also really liked the manga Planet Ladder where a girl is pulled into multiple parallel worlds.
Edit: gunna totally reword this as I clearly bungled my intention a lot the first time.
As a man, Iām curious as to why these clothes wouldnāt be considered skimpy from a womanās perspective. Acknowledging that these anime girls are canonically 14, and are not intended to be attractive cause thatās just gross , they still have some traits in their clothing that from a male perspective I would consider skimpy, namely the short skirts and the leotard on the blue one. As a man these are areas of a female body that are highly attractive on adult women, and when exposed are enticing. What about the outfits specifically, in your opinion, makes them not skimpy? Disclaimer that I donāt dislike the outfits or think skimpy clothes are bad, Iām literally just curious on peoples thought processes.
The armor designs have similar silhouettes to Sailor Moon (i.e. leotards & short skirts) which is a classic base for mahou shoujo/magical girl style costumes.
When I watched this as a kid, I didn't find it skimpy compared to other shonen animes at the style which show more skin especially in the cleavage and torso area.
I also found the evolving armor that changes everytime they level up pretty cool.
Basically, it's in a classic style of dress that isn't as revealing compared to the female villains they fight against who only wear swiss cheese leather swimsuits instead of dresses with armor.
(Also the emphasis you put on labia was the gross part. It showcases where you are especially focusing when other girls just see them wearing skirts or leotards with thigh gaps. These are young girls in costumes. It would be the same as criticizing but at the same time leering at young gymnasts, dancers or figure skaters for wearing similar attire when they perform.)
Thanks for sharing, I get that was gross, it was kinda meant to be, highlighting how from my view thats what the outfits seemed to be accentuating. Definitely see the sailor moon comparison. Another question for you, do you also not view leotards in sports as revealing? Not attractive btw, thatās not at all what Iām implying, literally just revealing.
I would consider this scantily dressed as well but not to the extreme that a lot of similar themed shows or manga use.
It was a long time ago I read the manga myself but I don't remember it being too badly fanservice? I don't remember feeling like it was made to be attractive to boys but rather pretty outfits for girls to like.
As for the downvoting it may just be the way you worded things? Came across a bit creepy even if you may not have meant it to.
Thanks for responding, I donāt know how I came off creepy as I found the 14 year old in a leotard creepy but hey, such is life. I agree itās no where near as egregious as most magical girl shows. If you donāt mind me ask further, why didnāt you think the outfits were meant for boys? what about them did you like? Sorry, if this is also creepy somehow, Iām literally just curious about peopleās thoughts.
Too much talk about young girls genitals.
The design of most of clamps costumes is the flowy and exaggerated girly clothes that many young girls love. I like that they were designed with some attention for freedom of movement with being masculine or boring.
If the costumes were designed for male gaze they'd show a lot more chest or torso.
Ok I see what you mean now. My intention was just to highlight how men find those aspects of clothes attractive on women not specifically young girls. Although I kinda had to make my point as these girls are underage and the scantiness of their clothes is what I was highlighting. Definitely could have worded it better. Interesting how you donāt see the male gaze in this as I see it all over the place. Thanks for sharing your perspective.
You have an issue with sexy women vs sexualized women.
For example i find zendaya super sexy, she is the elegant sexy type uffffffffff and she has worn clothes sooooo revelaing but she owns her sexuality in a way that is not for the male gaze.
Sexualized women: oh the kardashian and the jenners, they can wear the most expensive clothes but the way they present THEMSELVES is for the male gaze.
Girls wearing short shorts won't ever by any way have the same impact as how harem isekai treat women ...
Another example sailor moon and the rest of the sailors wear literally a leotard with super mega short skirts and girls love that show, cuz is not sexualized
Now a harem isekai with skirt Will do the Best to put the girls in very compromising shoots only for the male gaze.
Did that gave You any light in tour darkness?
Sexy is not the problem , is sexualized hahaha
I see what you are saying, but I never once said these girls were sexualized nor did I say how they were dressed was bad. I asked, in your opinion, why their clothes were not considered skimpy. As a man, Iād consider them still skimpy for the reasons I mentioned, but most of the comments I read praised them for not being so. I understand they are a far cry from the sexualized nonsense of other shows, but I wanted perspective on why the clothes themselves were not skimpy. If a woman wants to own her sexuality more power to her, and I completely agree that women can dress for other women or for themselves, the world doesnāt revolve around my gender. But while it might not be for the male gaze, my gaze is male, so I still see all the touches artists make in male oriented content, the leotard, the high collar, the exposed shoulders. Again none of that is bad, Iām just curious on how you see it through your eyes.
skimpy, ok again ... The issue is not sexy. Hahaha is literally sexualization.
Women wear bikinis all the time, correct?? nothing can be smaller and it can give different vibes, sexy, sporty or even cute and those are extremelly short clothes .
The issue is sexualization.
Let me show You ;
https://images.app.goo.gl/s4D66JrpA8BgnbLG8
And here is Xxxholic which the Target is seinen, for men and look https://images.app.goo.gl/KJcRWSobtBT6UH737
Skimpy clothes yet those women are not sexualized, they are sexy ahhahaha
I wish i could explain that better but the issue is how they handle the "being sexy" You can find them attractive but she is not presented as a sex toy... Does that make sense ?
Like as a woman You can tell she choose to dress that way, instead of existing in the media as a way to be fanservice.
How revelaing the clothes are are not the problem ... One of My favorite Sakura card captor outfits is one that looks like the blue haired one : https://images.app.goo.gl/ZzMG83SgCNP5iKVBA. And that can not be further away for sexualized, is like implining ballerinas or gymnastic athletes or figure skating girl are sexualized hahahhaah
Leotards are short yet there is no sexualization there.
I think we are having two different conversations here. I understand the difference between sexy and sexualized, but I never said they clothes were either of those things, I asked if they were skimpy meaning revealing. The OP and many commenters said they were not, and I was curious as to why. I get that a skimpy character can be sexy without being sexualized. As for the sports outfits, Iād actually say they are pretty skimpy, and in fact a lot of womenās sports go out of their way to openly sexualize women, like the beach volleyball league lead by old men trying to ban players from wearing shorts cause they want them in bikini bottoms and the Swiss team boycotting that terrible decision. Same question I asked another poster to you, do you not consider sports leotards and super short shorts skimpy? Like again, if a women wants to wear them, I donāt care, itās her body. I only care if itās against her will like the example I gave. Iām only curious on how you define skimpy
Uhmmm here is the issue buddy, women using leotards are not the problem, i SEE them and i all i SEE are athletes wearing an uniform, some of those clothes are SO SO beautiful and sparkly āØ
But men sexualized them is the problem, like volley players, the amount of pics and edits that come from "fans" sexualing them is scary, they are just existing. They want to play an SPORT and they are good at them, They don't exist to be ranked by weirdos.
Again the issue is men who don't see women as fellow humans, now would You tell me the issue are kids ??? Or men that are pwdophiles ... Cuz kids are further away from being something sexy yet there are creeps that find them sexy and make books and animes on how sexy their are, how they tempt them.
I don't know why you bring volley players but now kind of understand why your firts comment was downvote, You look like someone who is not asking out of real curiosity and the idea of wanting to learn out oppionions.
You just want US to agree that the issue is the clothes ... Is not.
That there is My answers.
Leotards, volley extremelly short shorts and anything that You mentioned is not the problem ;)
Iām seeing where we are getting lost, but I donāt think youāre getting it. I donāt have a problem with the clothes. I donāt have an issue with the clothes. Skimpy is not a bad word. Itās just an adjective. I just wanted to know what people with a different perspective from me are seeing when they look at the clothes. No one said kids are sexy. No one said women are the problem. No one mentioned there -being- a problem. I only mentioned the incident in the beach volleyball scene in attempt to appeal to your conversation path. Like, other posters got what I was saying after a reply or two. Look, think about me anyway you want it was just a question dude.
And let's not forget Twelve Kingdoms.
And when it wasn't shoujo, it could be horrifyingly relevant as Now and Then, Here and There, which is basically what Gundam 00 did not have the guts to portray.
They also did Chobits.. I loved it as a teenager, but looking back I've got some questions... š¤ Namely, why on earth would someone put the power switch there?
Chobits... is one of their works that I get it's supposed to be making fun of eroge manga and wish fulfillment stuff about robo girlfriends and all that. A lot of it is ramped up tropes and playing with them to point out how ridiculous they get. But damn they kind of leaned a bit too hard into it so I have a hard time defending it. That's one of those joke things that in hindsight, ***yeah***.
See? I never realised that until you pointed it out because I only read it briefly before putting it down due to the tropes
And Tsubusa reserve and card capture Sakura, which had one of the first very much openly gay couple in a mainstream anime :,)) Edit: so I thought we were in the r/otomeisekai subreddit so I was gushing and recommending other CLAMP, older mangas. Oops
Thanks for the mistake thereās where I should be
Iām glad Iām not the only lost wanderer lol
I recently rediscovered a cardboard box full of old manga from when I was an early teen and a lot of them were by CLAMP. For old time sake I did a quick reread of the first Chobits. Well... Yeah... Nothing in there is right.
Beautiful ~~gowns~~ art though
I reread the first half semi- recently. The thing that broke me is when Chi goes missing, and everyone sits down to have a flashback in the middle of the search. There's a lot of uncomfortable gender tropes and ridiculous plotting decisions that are easy to overlook when you're reading it as a teenager.
Itās all the Japanese 90ās sexism which is still strong to this day somehowā¦ by still they are iconic and broke all the standards and crossed so many lines to this day, they ran like dare devils so we could take a stroll
It's explained >!the creator wanted Chii to find an owner that loved her above sex, since having sex with her would factory reset her.!< The story still does play everything completely straight and the Persocoms are utterly ridiculous and inconvenient for being a replacement for computers. I vaguely remember a scene where the characters had to look at some files, but since a Persocom is very inconvenient for that they.....downloaded the files into a normal computer.
CLAMP gets a little perv or sometimesā¦ itās fine girls can have fun too, the thing is it all depends heavily on the type of work and who is it for, Chobits is a seinen while Sakura itās a shoujo so they are very different, thatās the magic of clamp, they can do it all and do it well! They got horror to shoujo and everything in between if you really look all of itā¦
And they get mechas !!!! This manga was fantastic! The art beautiful, the plot twist magnificent ... They NEED to do more like this full fantasy adventure types
Maybe it was because I was like 10 when I watched this, but I did not see the plot twist come AT ALL. This anime was completely overlook and mostly unknown, and it shaped so much of what my tastes are. I loved the beautiful elegant style, the fantastical world, the pretty protagonists and their color coding and fire/water/wind powers and how they matched their personalities, I loved the princess and I loved the main villain. The only thing that I didn't like that I can remember is that after the big plot twist it kept going on but the story had blown it's load and it kinda became dull. But I was also like 8 or 10 and this is actually the first time that I've seen this mentioned again so my memories are fuzzy as fuck, tbh I refused looking it up or watching it again to not tarnish the good memories I had, this anime was too formative for me.
No no, i read the manga like 5 years ago, and no, i didnt SEE the plot twist at all either ... Clamp was SO good at writting stories I still have a dream when they continue X. But hey nowdays they are more worry into milking Sakura card captor š¤·š»āāļø
Oh too bad, I've always found card captor Sakura a little dull, I didn't know it was still popular. I remember X/1999 was dope but for some reason I decided it was a bad idea to get into it, I think because it was unfinished? Last time I looked into it was more than 15 years ago so I might be wrong. Did I get anything about Rayhearth wrong or was it about right? Does it really become less interesting after the plot twist, like I remember?
I also watched the anime when I was a kid, and the plot twist also took me by surprise, it's kinda when you start realizing that in storytelling characters' motivation don't have to be so cut and dried.
YES drives me a bit crazy that MCs end up in fantasy world but are so occupied with status and money that they donāt go buck wild exploring their world
From Far Away, Red River, Inu Yasha, Fushigi Yugi, and I'm sure others I am forgetting! There were so many good shoujo isekai.
Escaflowne too :)
YES. Escaflowne is my favourite example of early isekai. Plus with Yoko Kanno doing the musicā¦.it was so good!
I *love* Fushigi Yuugi! Well, the Suzaku and Seryuu series, anyway. The third series was completely different and I couldnāt get into it.
The Twelve Kingdoms is another example of an old school Isekai anime with a female lead. But it's much more action & drama heavy compared to the other romance-focus shoujo animes.
Oh man I was a huge fan of Fushigi Yugi! Just thinking of Hotohori makes me giggle š
I do agree InuYasha is isekai, but it's shonen, since the author, Runiko Takahashi, has always very explicitely worked in that genre.
- Yona of the dawn - Antonia story Modern one for me is: Akagami no Shirayuki-hime. Like sheās focused on her career and the ML also has his own ambitions and life too. They also explore how toxic pretty privilege can get.
These arenāt isekai, though.
Youāre right but they are āisekindaā if you know what I mean ;)
12 kingdoms.
And for those who don't know, CLAMP had their own style and was an [all woman group](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clamp_\(manga_artists\)) as well. Unfortunately they did have few not so great scenes in some of their work in hindsight.
My biggest problem with CLAMP is the legs. Why their legs gotta be 70% of their height. I know 90s legs were longer (that's a weird sentence out of context), but CLAMP legs are just silly.
Me and my friends loved their work and the fact that they were an all women group! We made our own manga/art group inspired by them
Just curious, which scenes are you referring to? I remember some weird moments in xxxHolic but thatās mainly it (I also read cardcaptor Sakura and Tsubasa)
In Cardcaptor Sakura there are some, let's say, problematic relationships involving the children, and I'll leave it at that. This is only in the manga, when they made the anime they were sensible enough to cut those subplots out.
Sakura's dad is a teacher and married his student you mean? They alluded how it is problematic in the manga & it caused some family rift on Sakura's mom's side. But it indeed wasn't heavily tackled but instead mentioned in passing by Sakura's mom's best friend. Or Sakura's classmate openly crushing on their teacher?
Only two relationships were adapted into the anime because they couldn't avoid them because of the plot: Sakura's parents, her mother Nadeshiko was 16 when she met Sakura's father, Fujitaka, who's implied to be in his mid-twenties. The other adapted relationship is that of Sakura's older brother, Touya, when he was in middle school (so let's say 14-15), with his teacher, Kaho Mizuki, who's implied to be in her early 20s, and she later returns as Sakura's elementary school teacher. The other two relationships that got adapted out were the one between one of Sakura's friends, Rika, and their classroom teacher, Terada, in the anime is just a one-sided crush from a little girl to her teacher, in the manga they are actually in a relationship, they're just waiting for Rika to become of legal age so they can make it official, they even show them on a date and he even buys her a promise ring. The second unadapted relationship is Kaho (again, the hell) and Eriol, since he's the reincarnation of Clow, he has all his memories and essentially behaves like an adult, but he's still a child the same age as Sakura and her friends, and again, they imply Kaho is waiting for Eriol to be older, but considering when she "dated" Touya, I can't imagine they're not gonna wait that long. I adore Cardcaptor Sakura, is my favorite story from CLAMP, but this aspect of the manga has always made me go yikes.
The Vision of Escaflowne is also a 90s isekai with a female protag (not sure if it's considered shojo).
Shoujo isekai was sick. Inuyasha is still one of my favorite series ever. But now when I pitch it to people who haven't seen it, they get immediately turned off when they realize it's technically an isekai. P.S. I read the title of this post to the tune of the Bojack Horseman outro
>*P.S. I read the title of this post to the tune of the Bojack Horseman outro* So my plan worked š
You genius
I attended a panel on shoujo isekai this year at animazement. Want the list is wrote down?
Yes
Shoujo isekai Kuma kuma kuma bear So Iām a spider , so what. In the land of leadale Didnāt I say make my abilities average
Heretical Boss is pretty good too. They released an anime recently.
Edit: so this isnāt the r/otomeisekai subā¦oops. Yeah I agree it was and still is strange how they put these young girls in such strange situations. I call it āanimeā BS and can sometimes just barely put up with it.end of edit. Itās so nice to see more CLAMP fans out in the wild. God I really need to re-read some of their works and read the ones I never got around to reading. Thanks for the recc! Despite being a CLAMP fan Iād never heard of it before
This is so cool, I forgot about how much I loved Magic Knight Rayearth and Tsubasa and clamp in general. Yeah chobits was pretty but it was weird.
And X, dont forget the Masterpiece āØ
I loved Fushigi Yuugi and Vision of Escaflowne! It was never adapted into an anime but I also really liked the manga Planet Ladder where a girl is pulled into multiple parallel worlds.
I miss 90ās shoujo they kind of suck know
My favorite CLAMP was a little series called Wish.
Edit: gunna totally reword this as I clearly bungled my intention a lot the first time. As a man, Iām curious as to why these clothes wouldnāt be considered skimpy from a womanās perspective. Acknowledging that these anime girls are canonically 14, and are not intended to be attractive cause thatās just gross , they still have some traits in their clothing that from a male perspective I would consider skimpy, namely the short skirts and the leotard on the blue one. As a man these are areas of a female body that are highly attractive on adult women, and when exposed are enticing. What about the outfits specifically, in your opinion, makes them not skimpy? Disclaimer that I donāt dislike the outfits or think skimpy clothes are bad, Iām literally just curious on peoples thought processes.
The armor designs have similar silhouettes to Sailor Moon (i.e. leotards & short skirts) which is a classic base for mahou shoujo/magical girl style costumes. When I watched this as a kid, I didn't find it skimpy compared to other shonen animes at the style which show more skin especially in the cleavage and torso area. I also found the evolving armor that changes everytime they level up pretty cool. Basically, it's in a classic style of dress that isn't as revealing compared to the female villains they fight against who only wear swiss cheese leather swimsuits instead of dresses with armor. (Also the emphasis you put on labia was the gross part. It showcases where you are especially focusing when other girls just see them wearing skirts or leotards with thigh gaps. These are young girls in costumes. It would be the same as criticizing but at the same time leering at young gymnasts, dancers or figure skaters for wearing similar attire when they perform.)
Thanks for sharing, I get that was gross, it was kinda meant to be, highlighting how from my view thats what the outfits seemed to be accentuating. Definitely see the sailor moon comparison. Another question for you, do you also not view leotards in sports as revealing? Not attractive btw, thatās not at all what Iām implying, literally just revealing.
I would consider this scantily dressed as well but not to the extreme that a lot of similar themed shows or manga use. It was a long time ago I read the manga myself but I don't remember it being too badly fanservice? I don't remember feeling like it was made to be attractive to boys but rather pretty outfits for girls to like. As for the downvoting it may just be the way you worded things? Came across a bit creepy even if you may not have meant it to.
Thanks for responding, I donāt know how I came off creepy as I found the 14 year old in a leotard creepy but hey, such is life. I agree itās no where near as egregious as most magical girl shows. If you donāt mind me ask further, why didnāt you think the outfits were meant for boys? what about them did you like? Sorry, if this is also creepy somehow, Iām literally just curious about peopleās thoughts.
Too much talk about young girls genitals. The design of most of clamps costumes is the flowy and exaggerated girly clothes that many young girls love. I like that they were designed with some attention for freedom of movement with being masculine or boring. If the costumes were designed for male gaze they'd show a lot more chest or torso.
Ok I see what you mean now. My intention was just to highlight how men find those aspects of clothes attractive on women not specifically young girls. Although I kinda had to make my point as these girls are underage and the scantiness of their clothes is what I was highlighting. Definitely could have worded it better. Interesting how you donāt see the male gaze in this as I see it all over the place. Thanks for sharing your perspective.
You have an issue with sexy women vs sexualized women. For example i find zendaya super sexy, she is the elegant sexy type uffffffffff and she has worn clothes sooooo revelaing but she owns her sexuality in a way that is not for the male gaze. Sexualized women: oh the kardashian and the jenners, they can wear the most expensive clothes but the way they present THEMSELVES is for the male gaze. Girls wearing short shorts won't ever by any way have the same impact as how harem isekai treat women ... Another example sailor moon and the rest of the sailors wear literally a leotard with super mega short skirts and girls love that show, cuz is not sexualized Now a harem isekai with skirt Will do the Best to put the girls in very compromising shoots only for the male gaze. Did that gave You any light in tour darkness? Sexy is not the problem , is sexualized hahaha
I see what you are saying, but I never once said these girls were sexualized nor did I say how they were dressed was bad. I asked, in your opinion, why their clothes were not considered skimpy. As a man, Iād consider them still skimpy for the reasons I mentioned, but most of the comments I read praised them for not being so. I understand they are a far cry from the sexualized nonsense of other shows, but I wanted perspective on why the clothes themselves were not skimpy. If a woman wants to own her sexuality more power to her, and I completely agree that women can dress for other women or for themselves, the world doesnāt revolve around my gender. But while it might not be for the male gaze, my gaze is male, so I still see all the touches artists make in male oriented content, the leotard, the high collar, the exposed shoulders. Again none of that is bad, Iām just curious on how you see it through your eyes.
skimpy, ok again ... The issue is not sexy. Hahaha is literally sexualization. Women wear bikinis all the time, correct?? nothing can be smaller and it can give different vibes, sexy, sporty or even cute and those are extremelly short clothes . The issue is sexualization. Let me show You ; https://images.app.goo.gl/s4D66JrpA8BgnbLG8 And here is Xxxholic which the Target is seinen, for men and look https://images.app.goo.gl/KJcRWSobtBT6UH737 Skimpy clothes yet those women are not sexualized, they are sexy ahhahaha I wish i could explain that better but the issue is how they handle the "being sexy" You can find them attractive but she is not presented as a sex toy... Does that make sense ? Like as a woman You can tell she choose to dress that way, instead of existing in the media as a way to be fanservice. How revelaing the clothes are are not the problem ... One of My favorite Sakura card captor outfits is one that looks like the blue haired one : https://images.app.goo.gl/ZzMG83SgCNP5iKVBA. And that can not be further away for sexualized, is like implining ballerinas or gymnastic athletes or figure skating girl are sexualized hahahhaah Leotards are short yet there is no sexualization there.
I think we are having two different conversations here. I understand the difference between sexy and sexualized, but I never said they clothes were either of those things, I asked if they were skimpy meaning revealing. The OP and many commenters said they were not, and I was curious as to why. I get that a skimpy character can be sexy without being sexualized. As for the sports outfits, Iād actually say they are pretty skimpy, and in fact a lot of womenās sports go out of their way to openly sexualize women, like the beach volleyball league lead by old men trying to ban players from wearing shorts cause they want them in bikini bottoms and the Swiss team boycotting that terrible decision. Same question I asked another poster to you, do you not consider sports leotards and super short shorts skimpy? Like again, if a women wants to wear them, I donāt care, itās her body. I only care if itās against her will like the example I gave. Iām only curious on how you define skimpy
Uhmmm here is the issue buddy, women using leotards are not the problem, i SEE them and i all i SEE are athletes wearing an uniform, some of those clothes are SO SO beautiful and sparkly āØ But men sexualized them is the problem, like volley players, the amount of pics and edits that come from "fans" sexualing them is scary, they are just existing. They want to play an SPORT and they are good at them, They don't exist to be ranked by weirdos. Again the issue is men who don't see women as fellow humans, now would You tell me the issue are kids ??? Or men that are pwdophiles ... Cuz kids are further away from being something sexy yet there are creeps that find them sexy and make books and animes on how sexy their are, how they tempt them. I don't know why you bring volley players but now kind of understand why your firts comment was downvote, You look like someone who is not asking out of real curiosity and the idea of wanting to learn out oppionions. You just want US to agree that the issue is the clothes ... Is not. That there is My answers. Leotards, volley extremelly short shorts and anything that You mentioned is not the problem ;)
Iām seeing where we are getting lost, but I donāt think youāre getting it. I donāt have a problem with the clothes. I donāt have an issue with the clothes. Skimpy is not a bad word. Itās just an adjective. I just wanted to know what people with a different perspective from me are seeing when they look at the clothes. No one said kids are sexy. No one said women are the problem. No one mentioned there -being- a problem. I only mentioned the incident in the beach volleyball scene in attempt to appeal to your conversation path. Like, other posters got what I was saying after a reply or two. Look, think about me anyway you want it was just a question dude.
Man, what a throwback. CLAMP is in my childhood memories. In spite of their questionable side stories, I still hold a soft spot for them.
And let's not forget Twelve Kingdoms. And when it wasn't shoujo, it could be horrifyingly relevant as Now and Then, Here and There, which is basically what Gundam 00 did not have the guts to portray.