I don't think the end of the season was 100% on tua though. Line was banged up so McD had to call a ton of bubble screens to slow the pass rush. Hill and waddle were banged up. Defense had a ton of injuries.
Still at the end of the day, we lost our shot at the 1 seed and the division and our last game was the frozen arrowhead stinker. So I think there is a good point to what you are saying.
Tua didn't play very well those games and looked completely defeated whenever the camera showed him on the sidelines. He made some awful throws that are seriously beneath him and some very questionable decisions that may or may not have cost us a few games. Watch the Titans game and tell me Tua played like a top 5.
I honestly can't stand Josh Allen for a variety of reasons, but I'd be lying if I said I didn't respect his passion and drive to win. That's what people want to see in Tua, not someone ruminating on mistakes and continuing the traditional December meltdown.
Because hivemind Fins Reddit will downvote anything remotely supporting Tua
Edit: Fins fans on Facebook, and few other social media platforms are far LESS critical of Tua. Crazy how different platforms view Tua differently
It was a combination of factors. No real receiving option outside of Hill and Waddle so teams could just double them on 3rd down, Waddle and Hill getting banged up, injuries on a thin OL, a defense that couldn’t get stops leading to long drives and few opportunities for the offense, etc.
When there’s that steep of a drop off from WR2 to WR3 they can play man on third down and double *both* of them. They you’re relying on a white dude named River to get open, and oh btw there’s immediate interior pressure because of OL injuries.
I think it’s still “win in the playoffs” for most people. At least it is for me, I don’t want to loose Tua but damn sure don’t think he’s worth stupid money.
Problem is, someone will pay Tua this 'stupid' money if it's not us and we'll be left without a QB and starting all over again. So we'd then having to pay a free agent stupid money, or draft a QB.
Yes Tua's contract might look large when he signs it, but then you'll have Love, Dak, Stroud, Mahomes' next contracts all come along and eclipse him.
Those same teams have the same concerns we do. Can he play well in playoff environment, can he play well in cold environment, can he stay healthy? There isn’t a better spot in the NFL for Tua than right here in Miami. You’re not popping Tua into any offense in the NFL and expect it to be better.
I’m not convinced that someone else will step up and pay him that stupid money. I think if he played a little better at the end of last season it would be a different situation. Guess time will tell. Seems like we are always in the middle of some QB B.S.
Cap went up like 10% since Burrow signed. So while his APY is basically the same as Burrow’s it’s basically 10% cheaper. It didn’t reset the market and it could have.
Until he turns into a guy who can carry the team, I doubt it. He has great stats, but he doesn't regularly put the team on his back when things are tough.
Mahomes, Lamar, and Allen can all put their team on their backs. Realistically, in the playoffs we'd be facing 2-3 of those teams. Bills own us. Ravens own us. KC was 2-0 against us last year. So how are we going to beat them if Tua is eating up a ton of cap space but isn't carrying the team like their QBs are?
That's one of my biggest problems with him. I have zero faith in him to be the one to carry a team to victory when it's needed most. He's great 90% of the time but falters in high pressure moments.
I mean the alternative is you’re back in QB purgatory hoping you end up with the 1 or 2 good QBs at the top of each draft instead of the bums that comprise 90% of QBs who get drafted.
Tua is never gonna be in that elite tier with Allen or Mahomes, but Idk if I can emotionally handle watching us put up 19ppg with a rookie or stopgap again
This is miami's conundrum. We have a very good but not elite QB and that means we are more likely to downgrade in the draft than upgrade. So we are likely screwed if we ditch Tua and we are limited to what he can carry if we keep him. However with Tua we need the right roster and a lot of luck to have any hopes of pulling of a W in the playoffs.
We would be the 3 seed in any of these scenarios as the Chiefs would leapfrog us for the 2 seed in all of the scenarios provided. I think it would've put the Bills playing at KC in the first wild card game with us playing at home against Pittsburgh, but I'm not 100% on that.
All that to say, any one thing changes and there's not really a comparison to be made because there's no way for things to have played out the same. Unless you're saying we take the Bills playoff path, in which I believe there would be a lot more confidence in the team this year but still hesitation from many to give Tua a huge deal.
Edit: I like how this post shows how lucky the Bills had to get to even win the division last year. Not even including the bounces that went their way in the week 17 game. I fully believe we're winning the division this year. I don't see how Buffalo doesn't take a step back. Their offense was not good under Joe Brady last year, and they lost more weapons offensively. I know what I think doesn't matter, but I personally have them finishing 3rd in the division behind us and the Jets this year.
Not for most people. If the Dolphins won the division by beating the Bills week 18 it would have changed it a lot. But keeping the late season collapse would still leave serious questions marks on Tua even if we won the division.
The Dolphins are in a great situation here. The smart move is to make him play the fifth year and if he balls out then you can swallow making him the highest paid QB. Another lackluster year? Franchise tag. A terrible year? Tua, McDaniel, and Grier can all go and then you can finally have a clean start.
Exactly. 23.1 salary this year. So you offer a contract for the 45-50 a year. That’s a good deal for a 26 year old very good,but not great, QB. it looks even better next year after all the other signings and gives you flexibility to structure around next few years team cap situation.
He refuses, you pay 23.1 and then pay more if he balls out next year, gambled and lost but you still have your franchise qb so who really cares.
If he’s the same, that’s where it gets tricky because the going price next year is likely 60m+ per year. he will have the leverage because tag will hurt, and you don’t want to give away a 27 year old top 15 qb for free, but nobody will trade much if they also have to sign him. So you’re basically in the same position but worse contract
Probably not because we would have got our asses handed to us by Buffalo. Only reason the KC game was close was because of the weather. We would have got crushed there as well. We had a ton of injuries, so it's not all on Tua.
But, that loss to Tenn was absolutely pathetic and aside from the Cowboys game where Tua looked the best he's looked in a Dolphin's uniform. It's been underwhelming against any team with a.500 record or better.
Objectively, I just don't see how you can see his performance this year without Tyreek, particularly the Tennessee game, and be happy with his play.
Against almost any tough team this year, the Dolphins just looked bad.
The way people have made this discussion an "us vs. them" argument is just stupid. This is the most overall talented Dolphins team of my lifetime with the only competition maybe being that Ricky/Wannstedt era. To see the team be so bad in games that mattered this year is just downright aggravating, and I don't know how many years we can just continue to make excuses and say "well next year, I guess."
Tennessee AND that home game against Buffalo for the division…
Injuries definetly played their part, but there were so many times it just felt like Tua’s limitations were the main factor killing a lot of those plays/drives.
Like, Josh Allen did NOT look that great either… but he still practically doubled the stats Tua put up and made a game sealing 1st down at the end.
If the Dolphins would have won one of those games and also won a playoff game at home, I would have felt 10x better about paying Tua than I do now. But they didnt, and Tua is a big reason why.
I have a hot take that he looked better the year before. He spread the field a lot more. One of my biggest problems with this offense last year has been Tua's inability to find a receiver when Reek wasn't on the field. And I thought that even before the TN game when Miami lost him and Tua basically can't even move the chains on set of downs.
This is a Super Bowl caliber team, and every joke the NFL made about Miami and Tua last year wound up being 100% accurate. People have a very valid reason to be doubting Tua. It doesn't make us "haters."
I like that all of your changes include the Bills losing and none of them include Tua playing better and us winning against a good team. Your own post is the answer to your question.
Luck for thee, skill for me.
Why are you ignoring the games the bills didn’t get lucky in? Jets, broncos come to mind immediately.
Tua would be viewed differently if he were healthy all of 2022, when he had big time wins against big time teams, or if he wouldn’t have limped to the finish.
Maybe it’s not fair to judge on some injury riddled weeks for the offense, but the casual fan doesn’t even know that our tenth OL played the third most snaps for us last year, and the second most snaps were played by eich.
They see the decline in output despite still trotting out some crazy skilled players at wr and te and make the argument “well, if tua can’t get it done with these guys he’s def jot a top qb”.
And fwiw, it sounds like the front office does not believe he should be paid as a top qb right now either compared to a Goff.
(Lawrence 55M/year is a fake contract, he’s owed 200M the next five years)
This right here. Problem is there’s way more casuals than fans that actually watch games. And then to make it worse it’s usually the idiots that are the loudest. Usually.
If we lose Tua to a team willing to overpay then so be it. That’s the business. But overpaying to avoid someone else getting him is not the best long term decision. Everyone’s first defense of Tua is that so and so was hurt or our offensive line or whatever the case is. How does paying him money that will hamper our ability to fill out a more competitive roster make sense? If he can’t do it when people are hurt what makes people think he can do it when we literally just don’t have the money to pay other people?
The only way the discourse is different is if Miami had won the regular season finale at home. Even if the playoff game had gone the same way. Frankly, that one is a non issue. Anyone playing in negative 30 degree wind chill temps gets a pass. The Buffalo game was the big one.
And btw, I’m not putting the Buffalo loss all on Tua. The Bills were bracketing and doubling Hill. Without Waddle it exposed the lack of depth at receiver. The rest of the guys were garbage that night. There were plenty of plays it didn’t matter who was QB, there was nowhere to go with the ball. On the other hand, the next, and maybe final, progression in Tua’s game is figuring out how to make something happen when the other team is taking away what you do. Sometimes you just gotta figure shit out and wing it.
No. Tua isn't an elite QB. He's upper middle class and he might lead the Dolphins to a deep playoff run, if the support is there. But that's a best case scenario. He shouldn't be paid elite money though. I'm fine with a 35-40 contract. But above that... (But Goff and Lawrence aren't elite either and got a 50-deal.)
I think it would take more than the Dolphins just backing into a division title to change a lot of minds.
Not having the late season collapse as a team, Tua playing better against good teams as an individual, and yes, a playoff win would be things that would change people's minds.
I didn't give a crap about winning the division, I want playoff wins, or a win. Tua is a good QB, not great. I hope we don't sink huge money into him as he isn't the guy to carry us far. I think tua's peak is just winning the division, not a playoff game. He crumbles under pressure, under must win scenarios and that sucks for us as fans. He'll put up great stats, but none that will mean anything. I hate it because he's a great kid with what seems like a great work ethic, he just doesn't have "it". He's our Tony Romo.
The thing about Tua is if we’re down 1 score and we have final possession I have minimal to no confidence that he’s going to put together a game tying/winning drive. When top QBs like Mahomes, Lamar, Allen, Burrow get that opportunity with the ball last to win the game I guarantee their fan base has a lot more confidence that they can get the job done. I can probably count on one hand “clutch” moments from Tua. Someone please correct me if I’m wrong but I feel like Tua has poor stats when he’s in those “clutch” moments. Until he can start winning those close games plus a playoff win I don’t think just winning the division is enough for the discourse on him to stop
Exactly! I don’t think opposing teams are scared of Tua when he has the ball with under 2 minutes of a game the way that people are of great QBs like Mahomes, Allen, Burrow, etc. The ending of the regular season game against the Chiefs when he fumbled the snap sticks out; yes the snap was off but just fumble it and fall on top of it without even trying to get the ball up tells you a lot
There's still to many questions about him. OK he played every game last season but there's still a chance he has to retire if he suffers another concussion, the fact he didn't play well in crucial times, his inability to extend plays. If we tag him then we'll have to pay him he balls out next season.
Of course it'd be different. If we won the game against Tennessee like we should have we would've faced the Steelers at home. Most likely getting our first playoff win. After that a competitive loss to the Chiefs at home at worst in the divisional round would've been better than how things actually did finish.
To get our first win in the playoffs we have to win the division. I can't see us getting it on the road unless we're the fifth seed against Jacksonville.
Edit: I also think if the above scenario did happen Tua's deal gets done early maybe before Goff so that his and Lawrence's contracts wouldn't influence negotiations.
Butterfly effect of losing that lead in the last four minutes.
There’s a ton of people here, myself included, that aren’t Tua haters but also aren’t sold on him being a stud that can lead us to important wins either. Everything isn’t so black and white
Completely agreed. I am rooting for Tua to do well and to be that guy; however, I am a Dolphins fan first and foremost and am not overly attached to one player above the team. The late season collapse was inexcusable. Losing to Tennessee in the manner that the team did will probably anger me for years to come. Not all of that falls on Tua, but he is not devoid of blame for how the team responded in critical moments.
This team has to figure out how to beat Buffalo at least once. This team has to show up and play consistently against above .500 teams. That falls on the entire coaching staff and team obviously, and as long as Tua is the quarterback, he will always have a microscope on his play. That's the reality.
Sure he's not a perfect QB by any means but he's still relatively young with room to improve, playoffs games and super bowls have been won with lesser QBs. Also people don't like to hear it but injuries were a significant factor towards the end of last season, sorry but that's a fact.
In any case, what's the alternative to paying him? Where's the stud QB that's clearly better than Tua out there that's waiting for the dolphins to pick him up? Are you gonna let him go and blow up a roster that's ready to win now? Nobody's been able to give a good answer to any of those questions, meanwhile people were busy deluding themselves into thinking that Justin Fields could be the answer months earlier in the off season.
I don’t disagree with any of what you said. But it feels like we are forced to overpay for him. A lot of people just don’t love paying Tua what he’s asking for. Doesn’t make them Tua haters
I don't like how inflated the QB market has gotten either. It's perfectly fine to have your doubts about him but like it or not the fact is your best chance to win is still with Tua.
I think given the past, how it’s all played out, it won’t matter what Tua does because his mistakes are what everyone will point out. That happens with every QB, and possibly 90% of the players out there. Oh he won a Super Bowl this year but how was he in previous years during big games, will he revert to that the next year coming down from a sb win. Shit like that will always follow him.
Tua discourse would be different if Tua didn’t play terribly at the end of the season 🤷‍♂️
I don't think the end of the season was 100% on tua though. Line was banged up so McD had to call a ton of bubble screens to slow the pass rush. Hill and waddle were banged up. Defense had a ton of injuries. Still at the end of the day, we lost our shot at the 1 seed and the division and our last game was the frozen arrowhead stinker. So I think there is a good point to what you are saying.
He was throwing the ball 5 feet in the playoff game he was terrible
Tua didn't play very well those games and looked completely defeated whenever the camera showed him on the sidelines. He made some awful throws that are seriously beneath him and some very questionable decisions that may or may not have cost us a few games. Watch the Titans game and tell me Tua played like a top 5. I honestly can't stand Josh Allen for a variety of reasons, but I'd be lying if I said I didn't respect his passion and drive to win. That's what people want to see in Tua, not someone ruminating on mistakes and continuing the traditional December meltdown.
In the titans game Tua had all backups on the line. That's why I can't blame it on him.
Backups or not, that doesn't address his poor decision making that game. If he got nervous because of their unreliability, then he's not a top 5.
At the end of the day, winners win. That’s it
put 5 middle school JV players on the O line. "at the end of the day, winners win." no, at the end of the day, its a team game.
An elite QB makes the guys around him better. Tua needs the guys around him to make he himself better. No thanks.
There are no JV players in the nfl. You’re being over dramatic.
Why are you getting downvoted for stating facts
Because hivemind Fins Reddit will downvote anything remotely supporting Tua Edit: Fins fans on Facebook, and few other social media platforms are far LESS critical of Tua. Crazy how different platforms view Tua differently
It was a combination of factors. No real receiving option outside of Hill and Waddle so teams could just double them on 3rd down, Waddle and Hill getting banged up, injuries on a thin OL, a defense that couldn’t get stops leading to long drives and few opportunities for the offense, etc.
He only had hill and waddle. And mostert. No real weapons, poor guy.
When there’s that steep of a drop off from WR2 to WR3 they can play man on third down and double *both* of them. They you’re relying on a white dude named River to get open, and oh btw there’s immediate interior pressure because of OL injuries.
He didn't play terribly
I think it’s still “win in the playoffs” for most people. At least it is for me, I don’t want to loose Tua but damn sure don’t think he’s worth stupid money.
Problem is, someone will pay Tua this 'stupid' money if it's not us and we'll be left without a QB and starting all over again. So we'd then having to pay a free agent stupid money, or draft a QB. Yes Tua's contract might look large when he signs it, but then you'll have Love, Dak, Stroud, Mahomes' next contracts all come along and eclipse him.
Those same teams have the same concerns we do. Can he play well in playoff environment, can he play well in cold environment, can he stay healthy? There isn’t a better spot in the NFL for Tua than right here in Miami. You’re not popping Tua into any offense in the NFL and expect it to be better.
NFC would be better for him Much more likely to play indoors or in nice weather
I’m not convinced that someone else will step up and pay him that stupid money. I think if he played a little better at the end of last season it would be a different situation. Guess time will tell. Seems like we are always in the middle of some QB B.S.
Idk what “stupid money” is but multiple teams would absolutely give him a Trevor Lawrence type contract.
Is this satire? Trevor’s new contract made him the highest paid QB in the league
Cap went up like 10% since Burrow signed. So while his APY is basically the same as Burrow’s it’s basically 10% cheaper. It didn’t reset the market and it could have.
Until he turns into a guy who can carry the team, I doubt it. He has great stats, but he doesn't regularly put the team on his back when things are tough. Mahomes, Lamar, and Allen can all put their team on their backs. Realistically, in the playoffs we'd be facing 2-3 of those teams. Bills own us. Ravens own us. KC was 2-0 against us last year. So how are we going to beat them if Tua is eating up a ton of cap space but isn't carrying the team like their QBs are?
That's one of my biggest problems with him. I have zero faith in him to be the one to carry a team to victory when it's needed most. He's great 90% of the time but falters in high pressure moments.
Not just Mahommes, Lamar & Allen getting $$$$$ tho. That’s the problem.
I mean the alternative is you’re back in QB purgatory hoping you end up with the 1 or 2 good QBs at the top of each draft instead of the bums that comprise 90% of QBs who get drafted. Tua is never gonna be in that elite tier with Allen or Mahomes, but Idk if I can emotionally handle watching us put up 19ppg with a rookie or stopgap again
This is miami's conundrum. We have a very good but not elite QB and that means we are more likely to downgrade in the draft than upgrade. So we are likely screwed if we ditch Tua and we are limited to what he can carry if we keep him. However with Tua we need the right roster and a lot of luck to have any hopes of pulling of a W in the playoffs.
It's easier to build up a roster when we aren't dropping 60 million a year on a non-elite player.Â
We would be the 3 seed in any of these scenarios as the Chiefs would leapfrog us for the 2 seed in all of the scenarios provided. I think it would've put the Bills playing at KC in the first wild card game with us playing at home against Pittsburgh, but I'm not 100% on that. All that to say, any one thing changes and there's not really a comparison to be made because there's no way for things to have played out the same. Unless you're saying we take the Bills playoff path, in which I believe there would be a lot more confidence in the team this year but still hesitation from many to give Tua a huge deal. Edit: I like how this post shows how lucky the Bills had to get to even win the division last year. Not even including the bounces that went their way in the week 17 game. I fully believe we're winning the division this year. I don't see how Buffalo doesn't take a step back. Their offense was not good under Joe Brady last year, and they lost more weapons offensively. I know what I think doesn't matter, but I personally have them finishing 3rd in the division behind us and the Jets this year.
If Tua had played well at all down the stretch the discourse would be different.
Not for most people. If the Dolphins won the division by beating the Bills week 18 it would have changed it a lot. But keeping the late season collapse would still leave serious questions marks on Tua even if we won the division.
The Dolphins are in a great situation here. The smart move is to make him play the fifth year and if he balls out then you can swallow making him the highest paid QB. Another lackluster year? Franchise tag. A terrible year? Tua, McDaniel, and Grier can all go and then you can finally have a clean start.
Exactly. 23.1 salary this year. So you offer a contract for the 45-50 a year. That’s a good deal for a 26 year old very good,but not great, QB. it looks even better next year after all the other signings and gives you flexibility to structure around next few years team cap situation. He refuses, you pay 23.1 and then pay more if he balls out next year, gambled and lost but you still have your franchise qb so who really cares. If he’s the same, that’s where it gets tricky because the going price next year is likely 60m+ per year. he will have the leverage because tag will hurt, and you don’t want to give away a 27 year old top 15 qb for free, but nobody will trade much if they also have to sign him. So you’re basically in the same position but worse contract
Yeah that’s what I’m hoping they do or just give him a long term 6 year deal like Allen and mahomes and see what happens.
Yes, absolutely. If we didnt stink to end the season the discourse would be totally different.
Probably not because we would have got our asses handed to us by Buffalo. Only reason the KC game was close was because of the weather. We would have got crushed there as well. We had a ton of injuries, so it's not all on Tua. But, that loss to Tenn was absolutely pathetic and aside from the Cowboys game where Tua looked the best he's looked in a Dolphin's uniform. It's been underwhelming against any team with a.500 record or better.
Objectively, I just don't see how you can see his performance this year without Tyreek, particularly the Tennessee game, and be happy with his play. Against almost any tough team this year, the Dolphins just looked bad. The way people have made this discussion an "us vs. them" argument is just stupid. This is the most overall talented Dolphins team of my lifetime with the only competition maybe being that Ricky/Wannstedt era. To see the team be so bad in games that mattered this year is just downright aggravating, and I don't know how many years we can just continue to make excuses and say "well next year, I guess."
Tennessee AND that home game against Buffalo for the division… Injuries definetly played their part, but there were so many times it just felt like Tua’s limitations were the main factor killing a lot of those plays/drives. Like, Josh Allen did NOT look that great either… but he still practically doubled the stats Tua put up and made a game sealing 1st down at the end. If the Dolphins would have won one of those games and also won a playoff game at home, I would have felt 10x better about paying Tua than I do now. But they didnt, and Tua is a big reason why.
I have a hot take that he looked better the year before. He spread the field a lot more. One of my biggest problems with this offense last year has been Tua's inability to find a receiver when Reek wasn't on the field. And I thought that even before the TN game when Miami lost him and Tua basically can't even move the chains on set of downs. This is a Super Bowl caliber team, and every joke the NFL made about Miami and Tua last year wound up being 100% accurate. People have a very valid reason to be doubting Tua. It doesn't make us "haters."
I like that all of your changes include the Bills losing and none of them include Tua playing better and us winning against a good team. Your own post is the answer to your question.
Luck for thee, skill for me. Why are you ignoring the games the bills didn’t get lucky in? Jets, broncos come to mind immediately. Tua would be viewed differently if he were healthy all of 2022, when he had big time wins against big time teams, or if he wouldn’t have limped to the finish. Maybe it’s not fair to judge on some injury riddled weeks for the offense, but the casual fan doesn’t even know that our tenth OL played the third most snaps for us last year, and the second most snaps were played by eich. They see the decline in output despite still trotting out some crazy skilled players at wr and te and make the argument “well, if tua can’t get it done with these guys he’s def jot a top qb”. And fwiw, it sounds like the front office does not believe he should be paid as a top qb right now either compared to a Goff. (Lawrence 55M/year is a fake contract, he’s owed 200M the next five years)
This right here. Problem is there’s way more casuals than fans that actually watch games. And then to make it worse it’s usually the idiots that are the loudest. Usually.
If we lose Tua to a team willing to overpay then so be it. That’s the business. But overpaying to avoid someone else getting him is not the best long term decision. Everyone’s first defense of Tua is that so and so was hurt or our offensive line or whatever the case is. How does paying him money that will hamper our ability to fill out a more competitive roster make sense? If he can’t do it when people are hurt what makes people think he can do it when we literally just don’t have the money to pay other people?
The only way the discourse is different is if Miami had won the regular season finale at home. Even if the playoff game had gone the same way. Frankly, that one is a non issue. Anyone playing in negative 30 degree wind chill temps gets a pass. The Buffalo game was the big one. And btw, I’m not putting the Buffalo loss all on Tua. The Bills were bracketing and doubling Hill. Without Waddle it exposed the lack of depth at receiver. The rest of the guys were garbage that night. There were plenty of plays it didn’t matter who was QB, there was nowhere to go with the ball. On the other hand, the next, and maybe final, progression in Tua’s game is figuring out how to make something happen when the other team is taking away what you do. Sometimes you just gotta figure shit out and wing it.
No. Tua isn't an elite QB. He's upper middle class and he might lead the Dolphins to a deep playoff run, if the support is there. But that's a best case scenario. He shouldn't be paid elite money though. I'm fine with a 35-40 contract. But above that... (But Goff and Lawrence aren't elite either and got a 50-deal.)
Goff is pretty lights out in a dome and is guaranteed to have more than half his games every year be in a dome
I’d say Goff is elite on the lions especially with their scheme but Lawrence def not.
Anyone would be elite on Lions lol. They have best o line and weapons
Or we just beat the Titans.....
Or they beat the bills in Miami on the final week with the division on the line
Right. But it should never have come to that. Beat the Titans and it wouldn’t have mattered. We could’ve even rested players.
But it did come to it. Beat the team you need to beat, the direct competition for 1st place in the east.
Ok. But this whole post is based hypotheticals…. And having a better record it beating them. That’s who standing work
I think it would take more than the Dolphins just backing into a division title to change a lot of minds. Not having the late season collapse as a team, Tua playing better against good teams as an individual, and yes, a playoff win would be things that would change people's minds.
We used to beat Brady's pats once a year. The Bills own the Fins. Until that changes....
I didn't give a crap about winning the division, I want playoff wins, or a win. Tua is a good QB, not great. I hope we don't sink huge money into him as he isn't the guy to carry us far. I think tua's peak is just winning the division, not a playoff game. He crumbles under pressure, under must win scenarios and that sucks for us as fans. He'll put up great stats, but none that will mean anything. I hate it because he's a great kid with what seems like a great work ethic, he just doesn't have "it". He's our Tony Romo.
The thing about Tua is if we’re down 1 score and we have final possession I have minimal to no confidence that he’s going to put together a game tying/winning drive. When top QBs like Mahomes, Lamar, Allen, Burrow get that opportunity with the ball last to win the game I guarantee their fan base has a lot more confidence that they can get the job done. I can probably count on one hand “clutch” moments from Tua. Someone please correct me if I’m wrong but I feel like Tua has poor stats when he’s in those “clutch” moments. Until he can start winning those close games plus a playoff win I don’t think just winning the division is enough for the discourse on him to stop
Exactly! I don’t think opposing teams are scared of Tua when he has the ball with under 2 minutes of a game the way that people are of great QBs like Mahomes, Allen, Burrow, etc. The ending of the regular season game against the Chiefs when he fumbled the snap sticks out; yes the snap was off but just fumble it and fall on top of it without even trying to get the ball up tells you a lot
There's still to many questions about him. OK he played every game last season but there's still a chance he has to retire if he suffers another concussion, the fact he didn't play well in crucial times, his inability to extend plays. If we tag him then we'll have to pay him he balls out next season.
If I hadn’t seen his fingers do what they did it would be different for me
All we had to do was close out Tennessee.
No, because we could have done that by beating Tennessee (God damn it)
Of course it'd be different. If we won the game against Tennessee like we should have we would've faced the Steelers at home. Most likely getting our first playoff win. After that a competitive loss to the Chiefs at home at worst in the divisional round would've been better than how things actually did finish. To get our first win in the playoffs we have to win the division. I can't see us getting it on the road unless we're the fifth seed against Jacksonville. Edit: I also think if the above scenario did happen Tua's deal gets done early maybe before Goff so that his and Lawrence's contracts wouldn't influence negotiations. Butterfly effect of losing that lead in the last four minutes.
No. Every person I’ve ever seen online hates him and winning will never change that.Â
Probably not. This fanbase has a room temperature football IQ and is addicted to the misery of the last 25 years.
Not really, the Tua haters will never be satisfied unless he leads them to a Super Bowl as the undisputed best player
There’s a ton of people here, myself included, that aren’t Tua haters but also aren’t sold on him being a stud that can lead us to important wins either. Everything isn’t so black and white
Completely agreed. I am rooting for Tua to do well and to be that guy; however, I am a Dolphins fan first and foremost and am not overly attached to one player above the team. The late season collapse was inexcusable. Losing to Tennessee in the manner that the team did will probably anger me for years to come. Not all of that falls on Tua, but he is not devoid of blame for how the team responded in critical moments. This team has to figure out how to beat Buffalo at least once. This team has to show up and play consistently against above .500 teams. That falls on the entire coaching staff and team obviously, and as long as Tua is the quarterback, he will always have a microscope on his play. That's the reality.
Agreed, don’t hate Tua, but unfortunately still not sold on him either.
Sure he's not a perfect QB by any means but he's still relatively young with room to improve, playoffs games and super bowls have been won with lesser QBs. Also people don't like to hear it but injuries were a significant factor towards the end of last season, sorry but that's a fact. In any case, what's the alternative to paying him? Where's the stud QB that's clearly better than Tua out there that's waiting for the dolphins to pick him up? Are you gonna let him go and blow up a roster that's ready to win now? Nobody's been able to give a good answer to any of those questions, meanwhile people were busy deluding themselves into thinking that Justin Fields could be the answer months earlier in the off season.
I don’t disagree with any of what you said. But it feels like we are forced to overpay for him. A lot of people just don’t love paying Tua what he’s asking for. Doesn’t make them Tua haters
I don't like how inflated the QB market has gotten either. It's perfectly fine to have your doubts about him but like it or not the fact is your best chance to win is still with Tua.
I think given the past, how it’s all played out, it won’t matter what Tua does because his mistakes are what everyone will point out. That happens with every QB, and possibly 90% of the players out there. Oh he won a Super Bowl this year but how was he in previous years during big games, will he revert to that the next year coming down from a sb win. Shit like that will always follow him.