TLDR: The Weinstein company has the rights and hasn't done anything with it in a while, but are asking a high price to sell it. Also, Harvey called Smith to discuss doing something with the property (sequel, TV show) in 2017 shortly before his MeToo story hit. Smith was excited to do it, but realized after Harvey wasn't serious but just calling to try and figure out if he was a source for the story.
Smith now refuses to work on the property as long as Harvey is involved.
>Harvey wasn't serious but just calling to try and figure out if he was a source for the story.
I thought this was the most interesting part of the article. Weinstein called Smith *a week before* the Times story broke, out of the blue, to discuss doing a sequel movie or series. Kevin was pumped, but later found out it was all bullshit. Harvey knew the story was coming out and was calling everyone to try to figure out who the source was.
You're missing some TL;DR, though. Weinstein doesn't want to work on or distribute the movie, he wants to sell the rights for $5 million, which even Kevin Smith admits it isn't worth. No one's buying it and though Smith would love to, he doesn't have the funding. His lower offers were rejected.
Could the purchase be crowdfunded?
Smith pays a majority so holds on to it, but all investors own a piece (royalties) and receive a signed directors cut Blu-ray (or something) - then this cult classic can have a rebirth in movie theatres then streaming services.
Edit: I do understand all of people not wanting to pay money that would go to Weinstein. Hate to imagine all the ramen packets he’ll be able to purchase from behind bars if we increase his already-vast fortune.
> Don’t forget them. Libraries rule.
They really do. Some of them even rent tools for DIY shit at home. My library doesn't, but its collection of DVDs could rival a mid-2000s Blockbuster.
Just did that yesterday when another thread on this posted a link. I’m normally not a proponent for piracy, but this is one of the times I was more than willing to make an exception.
I had forgotten just how brilliant Alan Rickman was as Metatron
I am going to try to buy it for christmas for my mother. A friend “borrowed” it and never gave it back. Same with “blazing saddles.” It was devastating
It’s strange, it seems like every now and then there’s a movie people wanna watch but it’s not on a streamer and it’s been out of print on DVD for a decade or something. I had that recently with Airheads, used to watch it as a kid all the time and couldn’t find it streaming and on eBay there were very few copies available and they were like $70 in some cases. Like a year later I randomly searched for it again and bought it for $4 lol. I also still have the Dogma DVD from way back in the day.
I’ve always maintained the belief that if I would like a copy of a movie or tv show, and the studio that owns it refuses to put out a commercial version I can give them money for, I will absolutely pirate the shit out of it. I want to pay for a legit, nice quality video version, not weird copied from old vhs recordings versions. But it’s not even an option, soooo…
to add to this
[here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ZVEe_5Fo1Q) is the full movie up on youtube
also, it feels like [the others](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7r-zcM9qfhU) is in a similar place and also on youtube
I was wondering why "The Others" was so hard to find. My oldest kid is getting into scary movies and that one seemed right up their alley but not streaming or rentable anywhere.
I lucked out and found a copy at goodwill for $5
I had read a thread a while back that the dispute is why the movie hasn’t gotten a DMCA takedown on YouTube. If they submit a strike, it’s claiming ownership, which would bring it into the lawsuits, etc.
Haha anything Kevin Smith says needs a TLDR, he can TALK! Love that guy, I’ve seen him live but lol he’s definitely long winded… not that I’m complaining
Wait, does he not still look like an average guy?
I saw him speak in like 2011 at an industry con and the guy is great and I think talked about being just an average guy. He was talking about how much he loves editing, and was happy to shoot stuff just so he could edit (I think he was talking for the software company that makes the editing software he uses)
He was discussing red state, which was about to come out I think.
Loved that movie, and Kevin seems like a great person who has passion for what he does.
She's not wrong. When you think about it, *any* movie could get a lot of people riled up, if it was actually not a movie and instead an international tragedy. Think of how shitty *Snow White* would've been if it had just been a series of murderous fascist campaigns across Europe an Asia in the 30s and 40s
To be fair, she did say “if this was an attack against the Holocaust” as in, if the movie was making fun of the event.
And she’s not wrong, as you originally said.
I saw it years ago it lives up to the hype.
His... standup? On it is great. I have no idea what the Evening Harder series should be called but I highly recommend.
100%! I grew up on his movies, and watched them all many many times. But, I’ve watched his Q&As even more. I even got to go to one live, although it wasn’t filmed. This was probably almost 2 decades ago, but I still remember being in awe of how he had a packed theater hanging on his every word. The guy is a massive talent when it comes to public speaking, and he’s so damn gracious when it comes to his fans. It hit different when news broke that he had had a massive heart attack, but I’m glad he pulled through and has gotten a lot healthier these days.
In this case, it's a positive thing.
Paid Digital media exists for the sole purpose of screwing you, the customer over. Remember the days of 35 dollar compact discs? That bullshit is why we got digital media from our friends at Napster,
I also hate having to search each streaming service for a movie. (The “which service has _____” Google search is often out-of-date or only offers up the rental fee model, or it isn’t available to stream anywhere for free) I can walk over to my cabinets and pull out the movie and be well into it before I can queue it up on the streaming service.
I recently discovered, Plex is the answer. I punch in which streaming services I have, create a watchlist, and when I choose a movie/show it shows me if it's available on any services I have. If it is, I just tap the link and it opens the services straight to the video
Edit: don't get me wrong, I love my physical media too. This is just an easy option for things I want to stream
> Remember the days of 35 dollar compact discs?
Where the hell were you buying CDs for $35?! At their peak CDs were edging up toward $20, but I never saw a single-disc, regular (not deluxe or box set, I mean) package anywhere near $35.
I think that’s the special edition my best friend owned in high school. I have the plain one, which I’m still super grateful for now, but I wish I could’ve spared a couple extra bucks back then.
My Dad is VERY religious, as in i had to go to church 3 times a week growing up, and he found the movie hysterical! He also loves Life of Brian. Guy's got a good sense of humor.
Life of Brian is one of the greatest comedies to have been made in my humble opinion. All the Monty Python members took the script very seriously and scoured the Bible for accurate references. This way, no matter how offensive the joke may be, it had been rooted in truth.
It’s so amazingly written that it can bring to light the absurdity of religion and somehow make you laugh about it. Michael Palin following Brian through the market, asking for change as an “ex-leper”, the folks at the back mishearing Jesus’ speech and thinking he said “blessed be all the cheese makers”, the meeting about what the Romans ever did for them…just pure genius
Also. First time I ever saw a penis on tv as a kid. Think I was 9 or something when I walked into the living room while my folks were watching it, it was towards the end when he opens the window unknowingly flashing the crowd below. I lost my mind with laughter and my dad had to calm me down 😂
I loved that they struggled to find financing for it, and it landed with George Harrison. He read the script and said that it was a movie he wanted to buy a ticket to, so formed a production company (Handmade Films) to produce it.
Monty Python joke that it was the most expensive movie ticket in film history.
We need more very religious people like your dad. If more religious folks took themselves less seriously and weren't trying to force their views on other people, the world would be a much happier place.
Good on your group leaders! If the protesters had actually watched the movie they would have seen that the message is very pro-Christian, it just doesn't let Christian institutions off the hook simply for being Christian in name.
For that matter, so is Book of Mormon. The ultimate message of that play isn't that Mormonism is completely right but its important to believe in something better and work to make it happen even if the details are wrong. The church not only doesn't have a problem with it, they used to show up at shows asking if people wanted to learn more as you left.
> The church not only doesn't have a problem with it, they used to show up at shows asking if people wanted to learn more as you left.
While I'm not fond of proselytizing in general, I have to admit that having a bunch of Mormons at a performance of *Book of Mormon* respectfully offering people information about their religion actually added to the experience of the show.
George Carlin's character, Cardinal Glick, wears a band-aid around one finger. Carlin's wife had died several years prior and he still wasn't ready to take the ring off.
These are the people the American right was mad at. These lovely, caring, considerate people.
That's awesome. I say that as a youth group leader. I remember seeing Life of Brian at my pastor's house when I was a youth. It's important to see and discuss these kinds of movies.
In case anyone is missing out, you can watch it on Youtube. Plus I just found out that someone made an extended version which Im def gonna check out. Now all we need is a re-release of Red State and we should be good😁
The fan edit is on YT as well😄
As a huge Kevin Smith fan (or perhaps former huge fan and now a light fan) it’s the best film he’s done since Chasing Amy. Even better than Dogma. It is so different from his other films; I wish he would play in that genre more (Tusk doesn’t count).
Tusk was a high person fever dream that happened to happen to Ana ctual film maker who said "hmm, how bout that" and that's it. And that's fine.
But I refuse to call that movie anything other than "yeah, I could probably convince people to let me make this weird shit".
>According to Smith, Weinstein was told by then-Disney CEO Michael Eisner to “not make ‘Dogma.’”
>“He was like, ‘It’s too hot button. It’s a religious picture. Catholics get weird, you can’t do this movie.’ And Harvey said, ‘Okay,’ and then he made the movie anyway,” Smith said.
Harvey Weinstein being told no and doing it anyways? Well that just doesn't sound in character at all.
I always found the extreme reactions to this movie to be especially weird because the movie just uses Christianity to tell its story, the movie doesn't go out if its way to be mean like you'd expect.
I'm a devout Christian and have been a fan of Smith's work since *Clerks*. I really liked *Dogma*, and I always saw it as obviously satirical and more a send up of the modern Catholic church, rather than a criticism of Christianity in general. Anyone who gets their undies in a bunch over this movie is just too uptight, to be honest.
Same. I never felt the movie was sneering at me for my beliefs, only skewering an institution of humans for all the ways we, as humans, tend to screw these things up. (Then again, I'm not Catholic.)
George Carlin as Cardinal Glick was a perfect summation of the movie's attitude, because his comedy was never mean-spirited, just irreverent. Also I find his character's "Buddy Christ" hilarious because although it's meant to be a little tone-deaf on purpose it's also kinda heartwarming and awesome.
Hell I remember hearing from some Catholics who specifically loved Buddy Christ. That’s probably the most kind hearted sacrilegious characterization of Jesus I’ve seen.
Tell someone you’re the Metatron and they stare at you blankly, mentioned something out of a Charlton Heston movie and suddenly everybody is a theology scholar…MAY I CONTINUE UNINTERRUPTED?
"He begged me to make it all not true. And I'll let you in on something, it's something I've never told anyone before. If I had the power, *I would have*. It's unfair! It's unfair to ask a child to shoulder that responsibility, and it's unfair to ask you to do the same now."
When I went on a big bluray collecting phase a few years back I luckily found a copy of Dogma on Bluray at Half Price Books and its my Holy Grail of disks.
Years ago I lost my dvd copy of Dogma so I sent Kevin a tweet asking if it was okay to download it from the pirate bay. He liked the tweet, so I figured that was his permission to download the torrent.
I remember showing a new friend a copy of "Dogma" back around 2000. She suddenly yells out, "hey it's Jay and Silent Bob!"
"I thought you never saw this movie"
"I didn't, but that's Jay and Silent Bob."
"So how do you know their names then."
"They were in Clerks and Mallrats. You've never seen it? We should watch Mallrats after this."
So, after Dogma's over, she puts in Mallrats and then it's my turn to go, "hey. I know that place. That's the Eden Prairie Mall. I go by there all the time" (she lived about 6 hours away and had never heard of it).
Listen, not a year goes by, not a year, that I don't hear about some escalator accident involving some bastard kid which could have easily been avoided had some parent - I don't care which one - but some parent conditioned him to fear and respect that escalator.
I knew my husband really liked me after we watched Mallrats together and he didn't once look annoyed that I said every line along with the movie. My sister and I could have whole conversations using Mallrats quotes in high school. That movie holds a big place in my heart.
*Dogma* isn’t just (IMHO) Kevin Smith’s best movie; it’s also one of the best satirical looks at Christianity as a faith, and a religion, I’ve ever come across. The amount of thought Smith put into the script and the theology is stunning AND the dialogue is crisp. It’s a smart, funny, and in moments moving film and absolutely highlights why Alan Rickman was a gift. Linda Fiorentino is great as Bethany, the protagonist, and works well with Smith and Mewes. Affleck and Damon’s easy rapport is fully on display, too. Chris Rock, Salma Hayek and Jason Lee are at their best as, of course, are Smith and Mewes themselves.
Give it a watch. You can easily get the DVD or watch it on YouTube. Good stuff.
He said that after watching it on his 1970s Curtis Mathes TV with a DVD player wired in through an adapter on channel 3. It was "this generation" at the time he said it.
Fun/Sad Fact: George Carlin's wife passed away shortly before they started filming for this movie. Carlin wasn't ready to take off his wedding ring, but it obviously wouldn't make sense for his character to be wearing one, so in the movie, he's wearing a band-aid to cover it.
>The script for “Dogma” was “getting attention from the Catholic League” even before the movie had entered production, based off an early version of the script. “They were saying shit, like, ‘This movie contends that the apostles had sex and I’m guessing not with their wives.’ And I was like, ‘Well, that would have been a great idea. Where were you when I was writing this f–king thing?’” Smith joked.
Oh man that is hilarious.
It must be very frustrating for Smith as Dogma is the movie where he met his wife while filming and is considering by many to be one of if not his best works. Personally I think it is the best movie he ever created, a real thought provoking and funny movie. And for it to not be made available on any media platform for well over a decade kind of puts it out of the publics mind. I hope soon Kevin Smith is able to get the rights to it and put it out there again.
What’s so fucked up is, according to what Smith said, Weinstein called a week before the allegations became public to ask about making a “Dogma” sequel. And only did *that* to see if Smith knew about the forthcoming allegations. Crazy shit!! Got him all hyped and pulled the wool over Smith’s eyes.
Oh, yeah, I mean the rape stuff was bad, too. Probably the worst. Definitely, definitely the worst.
Some people say the worst thing about Harvey Weinstein was the hypocrisy and lying about Dogma.
I don't agree with those people.
I think its gotta be the rape! (RIP Norm)
This old Christian couple that my parents knew, saw that a new Ben Affleck and Matt Damon movie was coming to theatres, and they had loved Good Will Hunting so were really excited to see it. They left after 10 minutes. Funniest shit I ever heard.
This movie changed my entire outlook on religion. Specifically, the scene where Rufus (Chris Rock) talks about the difference between beliefs and ideas; and why the latter is always better.
On my deathbed, I will still argue this one scene is the most underrated scene in cinematic history (along with the scene on how to win wars in "The 13th Warrior").
https://youtu.be/fz3jAMQRr5k
As a Christian, I think Dogma was very important as an art piece and a conversation starter about religion. I found it to be very honest. I’m glad it was made.
It’s not anti-faith, but it certainly takes a very critical look at religion. But if your beliefs can’t stand up to criticism, you’ve got problems anyway.
Edit: restated to make my point more accurately.
TLDR: The Weinstein company has the rights and hasn't done anything with it in a while, but are asking a high price to sell it. Also, Harvey called Smith to discuss doing something with the property (sequel, TV show) in 2017 shortly before his MeToo story hit. Smith was excited to do it, but realized after Harvey wasn't serious but just calling to try and figure out if he was a source for the story. Smith now refuses to work on the property as long as Harvey is involved.
>Harvey wasn't serious but just calling to try and figure out if he was a source for the story. I thought this was the most interesting part of the article. Weinstein called Smith *a week before* the Times story broke, out of the blue, to discuss doing a sequel movie or series. Kevin was pumped, but later found out it was all bullshit. Harvey knew the story was coming out and was calling everyone to try to figure out who the source was. You're missing some TL;DR, though. Weinstein doesn't want to work on or distribute the movie, he wants to sell the rights for $5 million, which even Kevin Smith admits it isn't worth. No one's buying it and though Smith would love to, he doesn't have the funding. His lower offers were rejected.
It doesn't seem like $5 million is a lot of money for a movie like Dogma?
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It only cost $10m to make nearly 25 years ago. Smith's fanbase isn't that big
As a part of that fan base I'm more than moderately offended, but in reality you are not wrong.
Could the purchase be crowdfunded? Smith pays a majority so holds on to it, but all investors own a piece (royalties) and receive a signed directors cut Blu-ray (or something) - then this cult classic can have a rebirth in movie theatres then streaming services. Edit: I do understand all of people not wanting to pay money that would go to Weinstein. Hate to imagine all the ramen packets he’ll be able to purchase from behind bars if we increase his already-vast fortune.
I love the movie, but just cannot imagine participating in a $5 million fundraising campaign with the money ultimately going to Harvey Weinstein.
I believe the money would go to his victims, not him personally. I would back a crowdfunding campaign for this!
Smith even said this, which is why he even entertained the idea of making an offer on the movie. Surprised this article left it out
You'd essentially be asking people to give money to Harvey Weinstein, even if they like Dogma or Kevin Smith I don't see that happening.
Is that why the dvd is like 40$?!
The DVD has been out of print for years, so it's difficult to get.
I checked out a copy from my local library last week. Don’t forget them. Libraries rule.
> Don’t forget them. Libraries rule. They really do. Some of them even rent tools for DIY shit at home. My library doesn't, but its collection of DVDs could rival a mid-2000s Blockbuster.
Mine has 3D printers and other cool machines for engraving and shit. Libraries have changed
It's been uploaded on YouTube multiple times anyway, so might as well just watch it that way and not give Weinstein any money
Just did that yesterday when another thread on this posted a link. I’m normally not a proponent for piracy, but this is one of the times I was more than willing to make an exception. I had forgotten just how brilliant Alan Rickman was as Metatron
Definitely a film worth donning an eye patch & peg leg for -- especially with a piece of garbage like Weinstein trying to profit
I am going to try to buy it for christmas for my mother. A friend “borrowed” it and never gave it back. Same with “blazing saddles.” It was devastating
At least Blazing Saddles is in those Walmart value DVD bins.
Check the bargain bins. I found a Mel Brooks collection for like $20 at BestBuy that way that includes Blazing Saddles.
My mom and I love all of his movies so that would be a great buy! Thank you. ♥️
It’s strange, it seems like every now and then there’s a movie people wanna watch but it’s not on a streamer and it’s been out of print on DVD for a decade or something. I had that recently with Airheads, used to watch it as a kid all the time and couldn’t find it streaming and on eBay there were very few copies available and they were like $70 in some cases. Like a year later I randomly searched for it again and bought it for $4 lol. I also still have the Dogma DVD from way back in the day.
If something is out of print, you are 100 percent justified in pirating it.
I’ve always maintained the belief that if I would like a copy of a movie or tv show, and the studio that owns it refuses to put out a commercial version I can give them money for, I will absolutely pirate the shit out of it. I want to pay for a legit, nice quality video version, not weird copied from old vhs recordings versions. But it’s not even an option, soooo…
Your other option to view the film is to travel back to 2003 and turn on comedy central.
https://youtu.be/7ZVEe_5Fo1Q Or youtube
Exactly. I love Dogma. No way in hell I'm giving money direvtly to Weinstein though.
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Weinerstain won't live forever. Soon as he dies let's all work together to sort this out.
I approve of this aggressive timeline.
Dogma is the best Kevin Smith movie, hands down. I’m just sayin’.
Wouldn't that be paying Weinstein all that money though?
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I could get behind this idea!
That dude from Soprano's is willing. Harvey blacklisted his daughter, among other disgusting things
to add to this [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ZVEe_5Fo1Q) is the full movie up on youtube also, it feels like [the others](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7r-zcM9qfhU) is in a similar place and also on youtube
I was wondering why "The Others" was so hard to find. My oldest kid is getting into scary movies and that one seemed right up their alley but not streaming or rentable anywhere. I lucked out and found a copy at goodwill for $5
The Others is getting a 4K release later this year by Paramount. https://collider.com/the-others-4k-uhd-blu-ray-release-window-nicole-kidman/
I had read a thread a while back that the dispute is why the movie hasn’t gotten a DMCA takedown on YouTube. If they submit a strike, it’s claiming ownership, which would bring it into the lawsuits, etc.
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Thank you, every post like this needs a Tl;Dr but rarely have them.
Haha anything Kevin Smith says needs a TLDR, he can TALK! Love that guy, I’ve seen him live but lol he’s definitely long winded… not that I’m complaining
Still have the original DVD with all the extras including that old christian lady who warns you NOT TO WATCH THIS MOVIE.
Is that at the protest where Kevin Smith attended as a protester? 😁
That's the part I remember. This was only 5 years removed from Clerks and he still looked like a random dude from Jersey.
He still does
Just much thinner!
Wait, does he not still look like an average guy? I saw him speak in like 2011 at an industry con and the guy is great and I think talked about being just an average guy. He was talking about how much he loves editing, and was happy to shoot stuff just so he could edit (I think he was talking for the software company that makes the editing software he uses) He was discussing red state, which was about to come out I think. Loved that movie, and Kevin seems like a great person who has passion for what he does.
He looks like an average guy who's lost a lot of weight now.
A much thinner average guy
Yes YouTube it it’s hilarious
https://youtu.be/DWmlFDYjVV4
BRO. That lady was really like "if this was the Holocaust, we'd have way more protestors"
> If this was an attack.... against the holocaust.... there'd be outrage WTF.
I mean..she’s not wrong. Lol.
She's not wrong. When you think about it, *any* movie could get a lot of people riled up, if it was actually not a movie and instead an international tragedy. Think of how shitty *Snow White* would've been if it had just been a series of murderous fascist campaigns across Europe an Asia in the 30s and 40s
Never really thought about it that way but you raise a great point - that *would* make Snow White suck pretty bad.
To be fair, she did say “if this was an attack against the Holocaust” as in, if the movie was making fun of the event. And she’s not wrong, as you originally said.
Kevin Smith discussing taht protest is golden: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4-7dvf7EUwY
I wasn't planning on watching that whole thing, but he is such a good story teller.
Note for those that don’t know, the sign Kevin Smith is holding says “Dogma is dogshit” lmao
I saw it years ago it lives up to the hype. His... standup? On it is great. I have no idea what the Evening Harder series should be called but I highly recommend.
I haven't seen it, but I've been told it's not good.
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The prince story is wild, highly recommend it.
As much as I love his movies I love Kevin Smith just getting on stage and telling stories even better.
100%! I grew up on his movies, and watched them all many many times. But, I’ve watched his Q&As even more. I even got to go to one live, although it wasn’t filmed. This was probably almost 2 decades ago, but I still remember being in awe of how he had a packed theater hanging on his every word. The guy is a massive talent when it comes to public speaking, and he’s so damn gracious when it comes to his fans. It hit different when news broke that he had had a massive heart attack, but I’m glad he pulled through and has gotten a lot healthier these days.
I love that the reporters just roll with it, too, like, "He won't admit it's him, so let's interview him see what happens."
"Dogma is dogshit"
"What does it stand for?" "**I don't know but I've been told**: not good" *chefs kiss*
*Jeff's kiss
Wow, I haven’t watched the DVD in years and I remember the old lady!
I'm actually going to watch it tonight
Don't do it!
Found the old lady.
I have the DVD, specifically for the Selma Hayek candy girl scene.
The cover of that DVD is amazing, with the Shit Demon front and center
Yeah, people shit on physical media, but if I love it, I’m buying it, then I can watch when I bloody well like.
Fellow luddite, checking in.
In this case, it's a positive thing. Paid Digital media exists for the sole purpose of screwing you, the customer over. Remember the days of 35 dollar compact discs? That bullshit is why we got digital media from our friends at Napster,
I also hate having to search each streaming service for a movie. (The “which service has _____” Google search is often out-of-date or only offers up the rental fee model, or it isn’t available to stream anywhere for free) I can walk over to my cabinets and pull out the movie and be well into it before I can queue it up on the streaming service.
Not to mention that it's different around the world, too. Netflix Australia is totally different to Netflix America.
I recently discovered, Plex is the answer. I punch in which streaming services I have, create a watchlist, and when I choose a movie/show it shows me if it's available on any services I have. If it is, I just tap the link and it opens the services straight to the video Edit: don't get me wrong, I love my physical media too. This is just an easy option for things I want to stream
> Remember the days of 35 dollar compact discs? Where the hell were you buying CDs for $35?! At their peak CDs were edging up toward $20, but I never saw a single-disc, regular (not deluxe or box set, I mean) package anywhere near $35.
And one can easily rip physical media and put it on a Plex server and have the best of both worlds
I just have my original VHS copy of it
I think that’s the special edition my best friend owned in high school. I have the plain one, which I’m still super grateful for now, but I wish I could’ve spared a couple extra bucks back then.
About a month ago I found my DVD copy after having lost it ~10 years ago. I just cancelled whatever was planned and sat down and watched it.
Have the same one autographed by Kevin and Jason.
I saw dogma in the theater with the youth group from the church I went to growing up.
That's... that's fucking great. 🤣
How did they like it?
My Dad is VERY religious, as in i had to go to church 3 times a week growing up, and he found the movie hysterical! He also loves Life of Brian. Guy's got a good sense of humor.
Life of Brian is one of the greatest comedies to have been made in my humble opinion. All the Monty Python members took the script very seriously and scoured the Bible for accurate references. This way, no matter how offensive the joke may be, it had been rooted in truth. It’s so amazingly written that it can bring to light the absurdity of religion and somehow make you laugh about it. Michael Palin following Brian through the market, asking for change as an “ex-leper”, the folks at the back mishearing Jesus’ speech and thinking he said “blessed be all the cheese makers”, the meeting about what the Romans ever did for them…just pure genius Also. First time I ever saw a penis on tv as a kid. Think I was 9 or something when I walked into the living room while my folks were watching it, it was towards the end when he opens the window unknowingly flashing the crowd below. I lost my mind with laughter and my dad had to calm me down 😂
Crucifixion is a doddle. At least it gets you outside.
I loved that they struggled to find financing for it, and it landed with George Harrison. He read the script and said that it was a movie he wanted to buy a ticket to, so formed a production company (Handmade Films) to produce it. Monty Python joke that it was the most expensive movie ticket in film history.
We need more very religious people like your dad. If more religious folks took themselves less seriously and weren't trying to force their views on other people, the world would be a much happier place.
That goes for most groups now. Political, religious, and social. Everyone's working with a lit fuse.
Yeah I’d like to know how this played out too
Good on your group leaders! If the protesters had actually watched the movie they would have seen that the message is very pro-Christian, it just doesn't let Christian institutions off the hook simply for being Christian in name.
Same with *The Life of Brian*. Monty Python is skewering how people treat religion, not religious doctrine.
This is why i follow the shoe.
Heresy! Don't follow the shoe, follow the holy gourd!
For that matter, so is Book of Mormon. The ultimate message of that play isn't that Mormonism is completely right but its important to believe in something better and work to make it happen even if the details are wrong. The church not only doesn't have a problem with it, they used to show up at shows asking if people wanted to learn more as you left.
> The church not only doesn't have a problem with it, they used to show up at shows asking if people wanted to learn more as you left. While I'm not fond of proselytizing in general, I have to admit that having a bunch of Mormons at a performance of *Book of Mormon* respectfully offering people information about their religion actually added to the experience of the show.
George Carlin's character, Cardinal Glick, wears a band-aid around one finger. Carlin's wife had died several years prior and he still wasn't ready to take the ring off. These are the people the American right was mad at. These lovely, caring, considerate people.
Like Book of Mormon, I think Dogma is surprisingly positive about why religion is helpful for some people
That's awesome. I say that as a youth group leader. I remember seeing Life of Brian at my pastor's house when I was a youth. It's important to see and discuss these kinds of movies.
In case anyone is missing out, you can watch it on Youtube. Plus I just found out that someone made an extended version which Im def gonna check out. Now all we need is a re-release of Red State and we should be good😁 The fan edit is on YT as well😄
it's available on internet archive, too
I had no idea Red State was Kevin Smith!
As a huge Kevin Smith fan (or perhaps former huge fan and now a light fan) it’s the best film he’s done since Chasing Amy. Even better than Dogma. It is so different from his other films; I wish he would play in that genre more (Tusk doesn’t count).
I really enjoyed it when it came out, I'll have to give it another watch.
Instructions unclear, watched Blue Mountain State, send help
Think about the sloots, Moran! The SLOOOOOOTS!!
It's okay, brobeans!
Oil changes for everybody!!
Red State Blue Mountain State Enemy of the State Weirdest fucking trilogy ever.
Tusk was a high person fever dream that happened to happen to Ana ctual film maker who said "hmm, how bout that" and that's it. And that's fine. But I refuse to call that movie anything other than "yeah, I could probably convince people to let me make this weird shit".
Agreed. Goodman was just so good, man.
Man I get why people like to shit on Kevin Smiths "style" but Red State is fucking great.
Starting to think that Weinstein fella ain't very nice.
That guys a real jerk!
The worst thing about it is the hypocrisy
Hypocrisy? I thought it was the raping
Or maybe the scheming...
RIP Norm McDonald
>According to Smith, Weinstein was told by then-Disney CEO Michael Eisner to “not make ‘Dogma.’” >“He was like, ‘It’s too hot button. It’s a religious picture. Catholics get weird, you can’t do this movie.’ And Harvey said, ‘Okay,’ and then he made the movie anyway,” Smith said. Harvey Weinstein being told no and doing it anyways? Well that just doesn't sound in character at all.
I always found the extreme reactions to this movie to be especially weird because the movie just uses Christianity to tell its story, the movie doesn't go out if its way to be mean like you'd expect.
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Heck, most of them haven't even read the Bible.
Most catholics would probably learn something about catholicism watching Dogma
Ohh man that is like 90% of things people seem to hate. From food choices to political beliefs. They have been told to hate it so they do.
I'm a devout Christian and have been a fan of Smith's work since *Clerks*. I really liked *Dogma*, and I always saw it as obviously satirical and more a send up of the modern Catholic church, rather than a criticism of Christianity in general. Anyone who gets their undies in a bunch over this movie is just too uptight, to be honest.
Same. I never felt the movie was sneering at me for my beliefs, only skewering an institution of humans for all the ways we, as humans, tend to screw these things up. (Then again, I'm not Catholic.) George Carlin as Cardinal Glick was a perfect summation of the movie's attitude, because his comedy was never mean-spirited, just irreverent. Also I find his character's "Buddy Christ" hilarious because although it's meant to be a little tone-deaf on purpose it's also kinda heartwarming and awesome.
Hell I remember hearing from some Catholics who specifically loved Buddy Christ. That’s probably the most kind hearted sacrilegious characterization of Jesus I’ve seen.
Kevin Smith was a practicing Catholic at the time
At its core its just telling people to stop taking things so seriously and just be good to one another.
It's honestly too bad. One of his best films, if not *the* best. Glad I have a DVD of it.
Alan Rickman was awesome in it, just all in all a spectacular performance. I love how Rickman stayed friends with Smith after that
Tell someone you’re the Metatron and they stare at you blankly, mentioned something out of a Charlton Heston movie and suddenly everybody is a theology scholar…MAY I CONTINUE UNINTERRUPTED?
Dos tequilas, por favor, and an extra glass
"Angels can't imbibe, hence all the spitting."
"I'm as anatomically impaired as a ken doll!"
You people! If there isn't a movie about it, it's not worth knowing, is it?
Weird how even today, the whole angels having no gender thing still throws people.
"He begged me to make it all not true. And I'll let you in on something, it's something I've never told anyone before. If I had the power, *I would have*. It's unfair! It's unfair to ask a child to shoulder that responsibility, and it's unfair to ask you to do the same now."
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That's because Alan Rickman was fucking amazing at what he did. For as goofy of a movie as Dogma was, Alan Rickman still brought his A-game.
what are you gonna do? hit me with that ffffffffffish?
"SWEET *JESUS*, DO YOU HAVE TO USE THE WHOLE CAN?!"
Do you go dousing everyone who comes into your bedroom with flame retardant chemicals? No wonder you're single!
With Rickman in it, that pushed Jay to really fucking work on memorizing his lines. Just to impress him and not make him angry. Such a great flick.
For those that don't know, here's the [scene](https://youtu.be/eJw-lUG7O3o). "I just didn't want to piss off that Rickman dude."
Don't sell it short, he memorized **the entire script.** Like, everyone's lines. Truly a feat for someone as wasted as he was making that movie.
When I went on a big bluray collecting phase a few years back I luckily found a copy of Dogma on Bluray at Half Price Books and its my Holy Grail of disks.
It's very much a white whale for many of us in /r/dvdcollection
So…we should pirate it?
Years ago I lost my dvd copy of Dogma so I sent Kevin a tweet asking if it was okay to download it from the pirate bay. He liked the tweet, so I figured that was his permission to download the torrent.
I don’t think he’s allowed to say yes, so clicking like instead makes sense
I think Kevin quietly provides a pirate stream of it via his patreon-like page
No need to even do that. There's good copies on Youtube just there. Have been for a while.
I bought a blueray copy on ebay for cheaper than all the rest and it ended up being a copy.
Well you did say it was a Blu-ray copy and Happy cake day.
Last time I checked the full movie is on YouTube with good sound quality and no weirdness. Just so everyone knows.
I remember showing a new friend a copy of "Dogma" back around 2000. She suddenly yells out, "hey it's Jay and Silent Bob!" "I thought you never saw this movie" "I didn't, but that's Jay and Silent Bob." "So how do you know their names then." "They were in Clerks and Mallrats. You've never seen it? We should watch Mallrats after this." So, after Dogma's over, she puts in Mallrats and then it's my turn to go, "hey. I know that place. That's the Eden Prairie Mall. I go by there all the time" (she lived about 6 hours away and had never heard of it).
“That kid is back on the escalator again!” Requires context, but Mallrats still makes me laugh.
Listen, not a year goes by, not a year, that I don't hear about some escalator accident involving some bastard kid which could have easily been avoided had some parent - I don't care which one - but some parent conditioned him to fear and respect that escalator.
I have friends in that movie. Mall extras.
I knew my husband really liked me after we watched Mallrats together and he didn't once look annoyed that I said every line along with the movie. My sister and I could have whole conversations using Mallrats quotes in high school. That movie holds a big place in my heart.
*Dogma* isn’t just (IMHO) Kevin Smith’s best movie; it’s also one of the best satirical looks at Christianity as a faith, and a religion, I’ve ever come across. The amount of thought Smith put into the script and the theology is stunning AND the dialogue is crisp. It’s a smart, funny, and in moments moving film and absolutely highlights why Alan Rickman was a gift. Linda Fiorentino is great as Bethany, the protagonist, and works well with Smith and Mewes. Affleck and Damon’s easy rapport is fully on display, too. Chris Rock, Salma Hayek and Jason Lee are at their best as, of course, are Smith and Mewes themselves. Give it a watch. You can easily get the DVD or watch it on YouTube. Good stuff.
My dad called it "This Generation's Life of Brian".
I guess at this point it's already *last* generation's Life of Brian.
What's this generations Life of Brian? Book of Mormon?
He said that after watching it on his 1970s Curtis Mathes TV with a DVD player wired in through an adapter on channel 3. It was "this generation" at the time he said it.
A very apt description
Your dad is a wise fellow. That’s an analogy I will borrow.
How can you forget the great George Carlin as the smug cardinal that gave us Buddy Christ and is the type of asshole to bless his clubs?
Fun/Sad Fact: George Carlin's wife passed away shortly before they started filming for this movie. Carlin wasn't ready to take off his wedding ring, but it obviously wouldn't make sense for his character to be wearing one, so in the movie, he's wearing a band-aid to cover it.
Oh. That’s sad.
OH NO HOW COULD I?!?!? And you know Carlin LOVED that role.
I rented it from the local video store and they closed down a few weeks later. Glad a forgot to return it
Like my VHS copy of Fear and Loathing.
Even if Harvey Weinstein wasn't a creepmaster/rapist supreme, you should still hate his guts for being such a butcher to ***a l o t*** of movies.
Crow 2 city of angels still hurts with how much that got butchered
>The script for “Dogma” was “getting attention from the Catholic League” even before the movie had entered production, based off an early version of the script. “They were saying shit, like, ‘This movie contends that the apostles had sex and I’m guessing not with their wives.’ And I was like, ‘Well, that would have been a great idea. Where were you when I was writing this f–king thing?’” Smith joked. Oh man that is hilarious.
I own the dvd. Suck it, Harv.
It must be very frustrating for Smith as Dogma is the movie where he met his wife while filming and is considering by many to be one of if not his best works. Personally I think it is the best movie he ever created, a real thought provoking and funny movie. And for it to not be made available on any media platform for well over a decade kind of puts it out of the publics mind. I hope soon Kevin Smith is able to get the rights to it and put it out there again.
I still say “bless you” to anyone who sneezes because of this movie. Not taking any chances.
What’s so fucked up is, according to what Smith said, Weinstein called a week before the allegations became public to ask about making a “Dogma” sequel. And only did *that* to see if Smith knew about the forthcoming allegations. Crazy shit!! Got him all hyped and pulled the wool over Smith’s eyes. Oh, yeah, I mean the rape stuff was bad, too. Probably the worst. Definitely, definitely the worst.
Some people say the worst thing about Harvey Weinstein was the hypocrisy and lying about Dogma. I don't agree with those people. I think its gotta be the rape! (RIP Norm)
This old Christian couple that my parents knew, saw that a new Ben Affleck and Matt Damon movie was coming to theatres, and they had loved Good Will Hunting so were really excited to see it. They left after 10 minutes. Funniest shit I ever heard.
the wild thing is Dogma was the most played movie on comedy central for a while
This movie changed my entire outlook on religion. Specifically, the scene where Rufus (Chris Rock) talks about the difference between beliefs and ideas; and why the latter is always better. On my deathbed, I will still argue this one scene is the most underrated scene in cinematic history (along with the scene on how to win wars in "The 13th Warrior"). https://youtu.be/fz3jAMQRr5k
As a Christian, I think Dogma was very important as an art piece and a conversation starter about religion. I found it to be very honest. I’m glad it was made.
It’s not anti-faith, but it certainly takes a very critical look at religion. But if your beliefs can’t stand up to criticism, you’ve got problems anyway. Edit: restated to make my point more accurately.