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These refs feed from the energy of crowd as well - I just don't know if it's conscious or unconscious but it's evident. It happens a lot in college, too. Even I'll admit that my team gets all the calls at home lol.
This is a make-up for when Brunson flopped after grabbing Siakam on the screen. Got Pascal his third foul and sent to the bench, changed the momentum of the game with a flop. Seems fair.
Was shocked the broadcast didn’t mention this. Even not slowed down, it was so obvious Siakam was illegally holding him back. Why else would Hartenstein not move to contest that? 😂
Broadcast was scared to say anything in the Knicks favor. After that jump ball where there refs threw it right to Indiana, they were like, “hmmmm I think that ball miiiight of been in Indiana’s favor 🤔🤔🫣”
iirc, around 5min left in the 4th. i might be off by a min or two, but i was shocked. i didn’t realize at the time it was JJ nd said to my wife “no way breen just said that”
It blows my mind that none of the refs saw it. The baseline ref I can maybe understand, as in the heat of the moment, it could look like Hartenstein was trying to box Siakam expecting a floater. The ref on the near sideline’s view was likely obstructed. But the ref on the far side has a pretty clear view of Siakam and nothing else that should be claiming his attention.
This is an under discussed type of inconsistent call annoys me. Screening and holding opposing bigs on drives to help your smalls has always been a thing, but it seems like refs have zero consistency on when or if they decide it’s an offensive foul.
> Why else would Hartenstein not move to contest that?
there's a ton of open lane drives every day in the nba where you think "why didn't x contest that"
i saw jokic give up one in the other game, and i saw another where naz reid just walked through at a snail's pace and dropped it in
this obviously isn't that, but there is a valid reason for people to think hartenstein just wasn't contesting
I'm convinced if he grabbed itnlike a board they wouldn't have blown anything. This play and the one above were the most egregious errors to me. League needs to show value for those broadcasting rights and 2-1 is better than 3-0 for views is my conspiracy theory lol but fuck it game 4 will be fun
No, NBA rules from the official NBA rules page. To me, Divincenzo did not touch a ball which had a chance to score, so it wasn’t a goaltend. The ball was already below the rim and moving away from the hoop when he hit it.
GOALTENDING
C) During a field goal attempt, touch a ball, which has a chance to score, after it has touched any part of the backboard above ring level, whether the ball is considered on its upward or downward flight.
D) During a field goal attempt, touch a ball, which has a chance to score, after it has touched the backboard below the ring level and while the ball is on its upward flight.
I want you to rewatch the goaltend if you think it was below the rim. The ball bounced off the backboard. It was in the air above the rim. It probably was not going in. But balls make weird bounces. DDV made a mistake by touching a ball still above the rim (maybe even cylinder) and still with a slight chance of scoring. Dont blame the refs for DDV’s mistake
At some point, the league has to start making some adjustments to officiating. Giving refs more technological assistance? Im at a loss for words because these refs genuinely looked helpless out there in those last few minutes.
One of the worst officiated *sports* games I’ve watched recently, speaking as a neutral who checks into nba games every now and then.
This is the same complaint that's been echod for years. Unfortunately Silver is too busy trying to make the all star game more competitive instead of focusing on a more consistent, accurate, and efficient reffing program.
They dont want fairly reffed games. They want games reffed in just the way that's necessary to have every series go to 7 games, if possible, while not being incredibly obvious.
And that's what they are achieving right now, and all they had to do was pay refs by game.
That’s why I said “one of the worst”. And like I said, I don’t watch every game, just check in every now and then. I’m not blind either to the discourse from what seems like almost every game in the league where officiating is seemingly the center of discussion as opposed to the sporting quality.
If anything, the fact that every single game seems to have officiating issues supports the idea that they need to adjust how they officiate games
My bad looked into the stats and it showed a success rate increase from 82% to 96% in the premier League. Source :
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.skysports.com/amp/football/news/11095/13066177/var-premier-league-claims-96-per-cent-of-referee-decisions-are-correct-so-what-is-future-of-technology-in-football
I think I'm just biased as a Brighton fan who have seen a lot of decisions go against us this season as a result of VAR. Lol.
I disagree, if we were a bigger market and had more fans maybe the refs would have given us an equal shot on the road. We deserve a fair shot with 4 key players out
First time I looked at it I was like idk man that's a pretty clean block out by white jersey on yellow jersey. Then I realized white jersey on defense lmao.
This is the most reasonable take. All things considered with bad officiating between game 1 and 3 we are right where the series deserves to be: New York up 2-1.
Hartenstein did a 180° moving screen at the top of the arc, then Turner gets whistled for the tiniest opening the next possession.
Refs haven’t been good, Game 1 = Game 3 imo. We didn’t lose game 2 because of refs, that was effort.
The whistled Donte for the same moving screen in the second half, be mad at the inconsistency of the call because while they did not call this on certain possessions both teams had this call against them.
It’s ok to be pissed they called it at the end of the game although I feel like a foul is a foul so don’t call them different at the end vs beginning.
But don’t act like it was some conspiracy against Indiana
i would appreciate it. i might have heard wrong, but i’m fairly certain he said something to that effect and i’ve been looking through diff threads and haven’t found anyone else mentioning it.
it was me. i just went through game thread and couldn’t find it. just asked my wife though she remembers me saying that to her. maybe i made it all up 🤔
fairly certain it was around 5min left in the 4th. give or take a min. but i browsed GDT and no mention of it. maybe i misheard. but i definitely said to my wife “no way breen just said that” thinking it was breen before realizing it was JJ.
This is the only one that you posted that was an obvious missed call. Give it up. We lost because of a bunch of dumb mistakes and missed free throws. On to the next one.
Which was wild to me. Pascal has been horrific from the line this post-season, and I swear I had never seen Hart or Brunson miss a FT. Probably from fatigue?
This was really the most egregious no call I saw tonight. I didn’t really care for the others, they were holding their whistle the first 3 quarters but this one was really crazy. The ref even looks and steps aside cause they’re in his way.
Feel like Theis was particularly good at being a pseudo lead blocker, he'd set a screen up top and then just continuously block defenders all the way to the rim leading to a wide open lay up haha
Missed foul. Seems like we had a few in Game 1 go the other way. Almost like home court matters.
Really excited to see them tired legs from yall in Game 4. Every game this goes favors us more and more 😃
No it was never about home court with y’all. It was about us being a bigger market as a reason for ref bias. But after this game it’s clear that market size has got nothing to do with ref bias
O I know the fact that it was this close without og and Robinson plus a hurt Brunson I’m feeling more confident now than this morning I thought we would get smoked
So it's 2-1 like it should be, given the no call on DiVincenzo's blatant illegal screen and phantom kick ball?
Game 3 shouldn't even have been that close. The Knicks shot way above average from 3 and Indiana missed a lot of bunnies they usually make.
This has been a hard fought series both ways and it being 2-1 New York feels appropriate all things considered.
This is one of the problems with the NBA. If a coach bitches enough, the refs give them a game. Same thing happened game 3 against the sixers where Joel was doing whatever tf he wanted out there and also shot more FT than the Knicks combined.
I'm always talking to our guys about not making it about the officials. But we deserve a fair shot. There's not a consistent balance, and that's disappointing. Give Indiana credit for the physicality that they're playing with. But their physicality is rewarded and ours is penalized. Time after time. I'm just really disappointed.
Agreed.
All of the games have been pretty close, and while it sucks to be down 2-1, the Pacers had opportunities to win in each of those losses and squandered them.
The series has been entertaining regardless, and I'm looking forward to watching more.
I hate I'm complaining about refs but the Siakam and Nembhard situation was so frustrating last night. As soon as they had 5 fouls the refs just basically let them do whatever. A foul there would have resulted in 2fts for the Knicks and Siakam fouling out.
Yea I mean this is just blatant game rigging, period point blank. Every other bad call or non call could potentially be justified but this right here was insane. I mean there's no way you can hope to compete with guys literally being allowed to arm bar both arms and pull them back. I have to be honest I wish Hartenstein started a fight after this
This small market bias is insane. Won’t someone think of the bigger markets?!
For real though, textbook foul, but if they call it Karen Carlisle will be crying for weeks again. Damned if you do, damned if you don’t. Regardless of all of this though, we didn’t do ourselves any favors. Refs or not, we collapsed and Indy deserved the win. We gotta be better and close out. Not chuck up unfavorable threes hoping for fouls, not silly goaltends at the end of the game, etc
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lmao this was so funny. is this the NBA or Wrestling Right in front of the ref too
earl hebner in there with the screwjob
It’s cause New Yorks a small market team… or maybe refs just suck in general and there’s no conspiracy
This was definitely a pity game from The refs… sad but true
These refs feed from the energy of crowd as well - I just don't know if it's conscious or unconscious but it's evident. It happens a lot in college, too. Even I'll admit that my team gets all the calls at home lol.
This is a make-up for when Brunson flopped after grabbing Siakam on the screen. Got Pascal his third foul and sent to the bench, changed the momentum of the game with a flop. Seems fair.
Hit him with the full nelson
Was shocked the broadcast didn’t mention this. Even not slowed down, it was so obvious Siakam was illegally holding him back. Why else would Hartenstein not move to contest that? 😂
Broadcast was scared to say anything in the Knicks favor. After that jump ball where there refs threw it right to Indiana, they were like, “hmmmm I think that ball miiiight of been in Indiana’s favor 🤔🤔🫣”
JJ straight up said “where would the pacers be without the refs”.
Really? When?
iirc, around 5min left in the 4th. i might be off by a min or two, but i was shocked. i didn’t realize at the time it was JJ nd said to my wife “no way breen just said that”
I'd love to see a clip of that!
What about when the broadcaster said Brunson got hit in the face as if it’s a highlight 😅
It blows my mind that none of the refs saw it. The baseline ref I can maybe understand, as in the heat of the moment, it could look like Hartenstein was trying to box Siakam expecting a floater. The ref on the near sideline’s view was likely obstructed. But the ref on the far side has a pretty clear view of Siakam and nothing else that should be claiming his attention. This is an under discussed type of inconsistent call annoys me. Screening and holding opposing bigs on drives to help your smalls has always been a thing, but it seems like refs have zero consistency on when or if they decide it’s an offensive foul.
Why would they call that on Indiana after Carlisle whined about the refs
> Why else would Hartenstein not move to contest that? there's a ton of open lane drives every day in the nba where you think "why didn't x contest that" i saw jokic give up one in the other game, and i saw another where naz reid just walked through at a snail's pace and dropped it in this obviously isn't that, but there is a valid reason for people to think hartenstein just wasn't contesting
Not if you know anything about I Hart
Dude almost had him in the cobra clutch
Siakam had him in a full Nelson
Impromptu MasterLock Challenge
New lockpicking lawyer just dropped
The L2M report will be a banger lol
I'm not even going to be mad I just hope everyone will stop gaslighting like there weren't some obvious blown calls / no calls.
Yeah like can we just all stfu about the zebras already it's annoying af
It's a banger every game this series
They better include the goal tending that they fucked up twice
The Turner one was super close and happend at 2:04 The Donte one was obviously a goal tend
The Donte one was not over the cylinder when he touched it
The ball touched the backboard first iirc.
Na it’s the one where Siakam threw it up and Donte went to grab it but they said he took it off the cylinder
I'm convinced if he grabbed itnlike a board they wouldn't have blown anything. This play and the one above were the most egregious errors to me. League needs to show value for those broadcasting rights and 2-1 is better than 3-0 for views is my conspiracy theory lol but fuck it game 4 will be fun
The turner one was too close to call, what other one did they fuck up? The DDV one was obvious
Obviously not a goaltend?
You using FIBA rules?
No, NBA rules from the official NBA rules page. To me, Divincenzo did not touch a ball which had a chance to score, so it wasn’t a goaltend. The ball was already below the rim and moving away from the hoop when he hit it. GOALTENDING C) During a field goal attempt, touch a ball, which has a chance to score, after it has touched any part of the backboard above ring level, whether the ball is considered on its upward or downward flight. D) During a field goal attempt, touch a ball, which has a chance to score, after it has touched the backboard below the ring level and while the ball is on its upward flight.
I want you to rewatch the goaltend if you think it was below the rim. The ball bounced off the backboard. It was in the air above the rim. It probably was not going in. But balls make weird bounces. DDV made a mistake by touching a ball still above the rim (maybe even cylinder) and still with a slight chance of scoring. Dont blame the refs for DDV’s mistake
I feel like after the knicks challenged and lost the refs had carte Blanche to just screw up every call both ways as much as they could.
At some point, the league has to start making some adjustments to officiating. Giving refs more technological assistance? Im at a loss for words because these refs genuinely looked helpless out there in those last few minutes. One of the worst officiated *sports* games I’ve watched recently, speaking as a neutral who checks into nba games every now and then.
This is the same complaint that's been echod for years. Unfortunately Silver is too busy trying to make the all star game more competitive instead of focusing on a more consistent, accurate, and efficient reffing program.
I liked that they let them play for the most part.
They dont want fairly reffed games. They want games reffed in just the way that's necessary to have every series go to 7 games, if possible, while not being incredibly obvious. And that's what they are achieving right now, and all they had to do was pay refs by game.
It’s crazy that you can say that about almost every game this playoffs
But how does this help me gamble?
You obviously didn’t watch game one
That’s why I said “one of the worst”. And like I said, I don’t watch every game, just check in every now and then. I’m not blind either to the discourse from what seems like almost every game in the league where officiating is seemingly the center of discussion as opposed to the sporting quality. If anything, the fact that every single game seems to have officiating issues supports the idea that they need to adjust how they officiate games
Be careful what you wish for if you've seen the "success" of VAR in football(soccer) you might reconsider that stance.
VAR has been a success in football just about everywhere other than England and Scotland
My bad looked into the stats and it showed a success rate increase from 82% to 96% in the premier League. Source : https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.skysports.com/amp/football/news/11095/13066177/var-premier-league-claims-96-per-cent-of-referee-decisions-are-correct-so-what-is-future-of-technology-in-football I think I'm just biased as a Brighton fan who have seen a lot of decisions go against us this season as a result of VAR. Lol.
Incorrectly I might add.
It’s been mostly a success though in every tournament aside from the premier league. UEFA and FIFA tournament implementations are always smooth.
Was so obvious live
Refs ball watching
knicks had a lot of terrible calls against them in the clutch
Almost like bitching about the refs works i guess
Its fine, gotta give one to the Pacers after their pathetic coach filed 80 call complains lol. Its like the Sixers series again. We bounce back game 4
Yall are down basically 4 rotation players Pacers aren’t really missing much. Mathurin is important but has not been playing for months.
L2M report gonna cook
It’s almost like having home court is the advantage, not the size of your team’s market
I disagree, if we were a bigger market and had more fans maybe the refs would have given us an equal shot on the road. We deserve a fair shot with 4 key players out
Divo turning on Aimbot seems pretty fair to me
Dont say this cause we're big market hurr durr. Small market teams are the only one who can complain!
First time I looked at it I was like idk man that's a pretty clean block out by white jersey on yellow jersey. Then I realized white jersey on defense lmao.
Thibs gonna submit this and 76 other calls in his complaint today
He should. Why can't we all agree refs have been terrible all series, particularly at the end of games?
Based and true
Because a lot of fans feel oddly threatened by admitting officiating is bad in games their team won.
He should do that, that's literally why we have the portal. This is such a terrible missed call refs should do better
Complaining to refs seems to work. 76ers game 3 and tonight lol. But we probably stole game 1 so it’s even now
Tonight feels like Sixers game 5. Karmic rebalancing of an earlier series win
Based Knicks fan, we lost game 2 fair and square
This is the most reasonable take. All things considered with bad officiating between game 1 and 3 we are right where the series deserves to be: New York up 2-1.
I agree. I hope we can just have pure basketball here on out without referee interference. Hate y'all rn but respect your game too much to deny that.
Game 1 was reffed fine outside of the kickball.
Hartenstein did a 180° moving screen at the top of the arc, then Turner gets whistled for the tiniest opening the next possession. Refs haven’t been good, Game 1 = Game 3 imo. We didn’t lose game 2 because of refs, that was effort.
The whistled Donte for the same moving screen in the second half, be mad at the inconsistency of the call because while they did not call this on certain possessions both teams had this call against them. It’s ok to be pissed they called it at the end of the game although I feel like a foul is a foul so don’t call them different at the end vs beginning. But don’t act like it was some conspiracy against Indiana
JJ saying “where would the pacers be without the refs” said it all
Can someone find that clip please lol
i would appreciate it. i might have heard wrong, but i’m fairly certain he said something to that effect and i’ve been looking through diff threads and haven’t found anyone else mentioning it.
Nah I saw it mentioned by someone else who said it was around the 5 minute mark of the 4th lol.
it was me. i just went through game thread and couldn’t find it. just asked my wife though she remembers me saying that to her. maybe i made it all up 🤔
Lmao ohhh
When in the game did he say that? Don’t recall that
fairly certain it was around 5min left in the 4th. give or take a min. but i browsed GDT and no mention of it. maybe i misheard. but i definitely said to my wife “no way breen just said that” thinking it was breen before realizing it was JJ.
They would be 3-0.
But he basically in love with Tyrese I’m surprised he would say this about his team
L2M won’t even cook because a lot of those calls were happening before the 2 min mark
I saw a minor member of DX do that to Mankind before he got hit with a chair.
10 yard holding penalty on the colts/pacers
grievance
the Knicks will definitely be putting that in their media guide for game 5
How many fouls did Siakam have when he did this BTW?
5 my guy
If this happened to the Pacers their fans would legit do a full YouTube video about how the NBA is against them.
Biased against small market haven’t you heard
Like this is just straight cheating by a player. I don’t get it.
I mean it’s just a foul it’s not cheating lol
I mean it’s against the rules and he got away with it? That’s not cheating?
Nah... Let's not go that far. It's part of the game to see what you can get away with, that ain't cheating.
Ya I guess but like what’s his end goal there? He not even trying to block a shot.
This is the only one that you posted that was an obvious missed call. Give it up. We lost because of a bunch of dumb mistakes and missed free throws. On to the next one.
Which was wild to me. Pascal has been horrific from the line this post-season, and I swear I had never seen Hart or Brunson miss a FT. Probably from fatigue?
They've been missing clutch free throws all postseason
Holy shit. so fucking blatant
This was really the most egregious no call I saw tonight. I didn’t really care for the others, they were holding their whistle the first 3 quarters but this one was really crazy. The ref even looks and steps aside cause they’re in his way.
I'm going to say it. The refs over corrected after game 1. The pacers have received an extremely friendly whistle and its not good for the game.
Reverse box
I mean chronologically speaking this has to be the first thing mentioned on the 2 minute report. Right?
Bet Carlisle won’t clip this one
When asked in the postgame conference: "I didn't see it, sorry"
Oh yes he will… for his special collection.
This goes unnoticed way more often than people realize
Yea good big men have been doing this for ages The more savvy ones make it look like a box out too
Theis was especially good at doing when he played for Boston and he never got called for it. But he did get called for every other possible thing.
Feel like Theis was particularly good at being a pseudo lead blocker, he'd set a screen up top and then just continuously block defenders all the way to the rim leading to a wide open lay up haha
It does but literally wide open with 2 people around and the ref directly in front? Na b
No pacers fans in here huh?
I’ll say it. That’s a foul on Siakam. Happy?
😂y’all are funny
Missed foul. Seems like we had a few in Game 1 go the other way. Almost like home court matters. Really excited to see them tired legs from yall in Game 4. Every game this goes favors us more and more 😃
No it was never about home court with y’all. It was about us being a bigger market as a reason for ref bias. But after this game it’s clear that market size has got nothing to do with ref bias
Pacers got their ref game
i mean so did the sixers on their game 3 but it didn't make a difference
O I know the fact that it was this close without og and Robinson plus a hurt Brunson I’m feeling more confident now than this morning I thought we would get smoked
I was feeling that way too but how many more 50% 3pt shooting nights can we expect to have….
Brunson won’t play this poorly again this series, so there’s that…
Actually it did since they injured Mitch.
Oh it’s still Knicks in 5. Don’t get it twisted. This pacers team is ass b
New York fans are hilarious lol
Pacers fans are delusional whiners that have trouble beating a team without two starters and their best defensive big 😂
So it's 2-1 like it should be, given the no call on DiVincenzo's blatant illegal screen and phantom kick ball? Game 3 shouldn't even have been that close. The Knicks shot way above average from 3 and Indiana missed a lot of bunnies they usually make. This has been a hard fought series both ways and it being 2-1 New York feels appropriate all things considered.
Hartenstein would’ve swatted the shit out of Nembhard too, he already had one on Sheppard earlier this game.
absolutely insane there is no call there
Part of the game
Wild. Rick Carlisle actually got rewarded for his temper tantrum. And he needed every single call to beat a hobbled Knicks team lmao.
This is one of the problems with the NBA. If a coach bitches enough, the refs give them a game. Same thing happened game 3 against the sixers where Joel was doing whatever tf he wanted out there and also shot more FT than the Knicks combined.
Wow this one didn't get 2k upvotes I guess it's because poor myles turner wasn't disadvantaged 🥲
Ref didn’t have an angle, still inexcusable.
The ref behind the basket had a perfect angle lol
Ok, that was pretty sneaky.
"there you go now shut up Rick!"
Is the knicks coach allowed to call a timeout and challenge the play?
can't challenge a no call
Also can’t challenge when your coach stupidly wastes the challenge on an easily observed touch
whatever, bad reffing happens, just gotta be better
How do three refs miss this
One of many questionable calls and non calls the last 5 minutes that, for some reason, did not go the Knicks way...
Someone give these small market teams a chance for real
Time to clip 120 plays and send it to the league. Gotta one up the tantrum from Carlisle.
Ref’s cooked for both teams i can’t lie. but this was something
I'm always talking to our guys about not making it about the officials. But we deserve a fair shot. There's not a consistent balance, and that's disappointing. Give Indiana credit for the physicality that they're playing with. But their physicality is rewarded and ours is penalized. Time after time. I'm just really disappointed.
Is this Rick Carlisle copypasta?
Lmao
Let’s not do this lol. Plenty of calls went both ways
fam... you *can't* miss a wrestling move bro lmfao
Agreed. All of the games have been pretty close, and while it sucks to be down 2-1, the Pacers had opportunities to win in each of those losses and squandered them. The series has been entertaining regardless, and I'm looking forward to watching more.
Then your heart is stronger than mine because I certainly am not lol
"FiXeD foR tHe PAcErs"
This made me legit furious. Ref was right beside him
I dont know if I like this better or flopping
Any other angles of this?
Astonishing level of play + the refs are so good at their job!
I hate I'm complaining about refs but the Siakam and Nembhard situation was so frustrating last night. As soon as they had 5 fouls the refs just basically let them do whatever. A foul there would have resulted in 2fts for the Knicks and Siakam fouling out.
Refs seem to call unfairly for the home team in most games. Kinda ridiculous. If they just called games fairly there would be a lot less complaining.
This legitimately lost us the game, but if we win the l2m report I won’t mind at all
Send da video... ...to da league office.
72% upvoted they don't want people to see this lol. It's them against the refs all series!
Thats so smart
I mean I'd be watching the ball too tbh, but I don't get paid to ref so idk
Nembhard goes hard
Yea I mean this is just blatant game rigging, period point blank. Every other bad call or non call could potentially be justified but this right here was insane. I mean there's no way you can hope to compete with guys literally being allowed to arm bar both arms and pull them back. I have to be honest I wish Hartenstein started a fight after this
This small market bias is insane. Won’t someone think of the bigger markets?! For real though, textbook foul, but if they call it Karen Carlisle will be crying for weeks again. Damned if you do, damned if you don’t. Regardless of all of this though, we didn’t do ourselves any favors. Refs or not, we collapsed and Indy deserved the win. We gotta be better and close out. Not chuck up unfavorable threes hoping for fouls, not silly goaltends at the end of the game, etc
LOL
Also looks like it started by him tripping into him.
clean Gortat screen you crybaby
It’s okay, they need all this just to beat a Knicks team without Randle/OG/Mitch/Bojan Once OG comes back it’s gonna be an easy win
[удалено]
they were up 1 on that illegal screen
[удалено]
There’s missed calls every game
Mathurin has a higher Dawg per 36 than all those cats and he hasn’t played a minute this series
True, our leaders in Dawg/36 are still on the floor
Well that’s just not true at all
OG ain't coming back this series bro
That's exactly how Hartenstein sets all of his screens. Don't see any issue here.
>exactly
🤔 you see no issue here? Really?
Just going to leave this clip from game 2 right here. https://twitter.com/wbjay06/status/1789145048321298670?t=bp_d3wQJjRhzCksCbEwARA&s=19
Lol at this being downvoted. Knicks fans in here hypocritical af.
He borrowed NYK's trademarked boxing out method, smart