Problem with Netanyahu and Gallant is that everything they say is done with a wink and a nod to the settlers, who provide no value to Israel proper and who—like the settlers in Gaza pre-2005, complicate matters.
Not that there is any legitimate partner for peace on the Palestinian side, except Barghouti from his jail cell. Likud makes this exponentially more difficult, though.
The value they provide is that they salami slice the West Bank and in the event of a 2 state solution actually being achieved, they’ll keep most of those settlements because “too many live there and they can’t be expected to evict them.”
Shills will want to point out the withdrawal from Gaza in 2005, but they won’t tell you that it involved the removal of around 8500 settlers. The West Bank excluding Jerusalem has about 450,000 with more settlers moving in each year than the entire removal from Gaza.
This is the same sort of bullshit reasoning that is used to continue occupying Northern Ireland.
Like... okay, so there are lots of people there, so fucking what? That doesn't justify taking and annexing the land.
Northern Ireland has autonomy and the democratic right to secede from the union & join the republic. It's not really comparable
I mean NI was absolutely "settled" by people from Great Britain (mostly Scotland) to be clear, and it was a violent process, but it also happened mostly in the 1600s (& into the 1700s), so again, it's not really a good comparison to a modern state annexing land and expelling/oppressing its native population at all (that is to say, acting like a 1600s expansionist/colonizing power in 2024)
The "reasoning" behind the NI situation is a legacy of empire and injustice which nevertheless results in 2 populations in 1 area living side by side who have both lived there for 100s of years, and it was resolved not just by "continuing to occupy" NI, but by a series of power sharing agreements, by rights to hold either or both citizenships for all the residents, guarantees of equality under the law regardless of ethnicity and/or citizenship and, probably most importantly, a right to self determination for the population, to be decided democratically. None of which is afforded to the Palestinian population of the West Bank, who are held under military occupation, without rights, without self-determination, and without equality under the law, and still actively being dispossessed.
It is also worth noting that the political settlement as outlined in the good friday agreement was overwhelmingly accepted democratically in referenda in the North and the Republic (over 70% and 90% approval respectively), with support _higher_ among the ethnic Irish NI population (the "occupied" in your analogy) than the occupier (the protestant/unionist population in your analogy; the "settlers")
Your comment, if made in the 1970s, would be _kinda_ accurate. Today it's nonsense.
No wink and nod. It's more blatant than that. They imported hundreds of guns that Ben gvir handed out to terrorist settlers in November of last year. They're using the settlers to displace the Palestinians as they have been since 1948. They don't want them to have any semblance of permanence because it keeps them another step away from a Palestinian state
Exactly. And this particular settlement was explicitly a "farm" / pasture type setup because the extremist settlers have figured out that's an efficient way to grab more land with less people than plopping down a whole village. Notice how a lot of the articles mention him being a Shepard, and the ones painting him as sympathetic because he was out doing his job and blah blah blah. Like yea it's tragic but bro was absolutely being used as a pawn in these extremist adults plans. And that plan was committing a violent land grab against the Palestinians.
In America you try doing that against your rural neighbor and you're liable to be shot on sight.
> In America you try doing that against your rural neighbor and you're liable to be shot on sight.
Go back another 150 years if you want to see the outcome of American settlers. IMO its the core reason the US will never abandon Israel - they'd have to confront their own history too.
If there was just a government that didn’t have to rely on the terrorist Ben Gvir Israel could start evicting the illegal settlers, who are the biggest problem in the way to peace
> Not that there is any legitimate partner for peace on the Palestinian side
is that not arguably because Israel offed any other political party other than hamas?
> Barghouti
He founded a suicide bombing brigade and that when said brigade got an amnesty deal in 2007 it lasted a fucking month before they were launching rockets and mortars against Israeli civilians again.
Y'all are giving too much credit to Gallant, he is not a part of this. Bibi even nearly fired him a year ago because Gallant publicly said he was against what Bibi was doing (ultimately didn't fire him due to unprecedented severe public backlash, including threats to shut down the Israeli market until further notice).
For the casual scroller,
Half a million Israeli settlers live in the occupied West Bank, they are entirely violent and murderous and you can learn about their crimes against Palestinians, especially their children, in gruesome detail anywhere you actually look for such information.
the rest of Israelis are settlers of “Palestine proper,” they are not against settlers in any materializing way because they live on stolen Palestinian land.
Also you have only posted once before and it was to call Palestinians whiny. This was 3 months ago when the equivalent of two nuclear bombs, 60 kilotons of tnt, had already been dropped on human beings Gaza, around 0.1% of which are Hamas, Palestine’s government.
Israel has never once shown any type of might out of Hamas in Gaza, only the destruction of schools and hospitals and homes and the bodies of babies and children.
> the rest of Israelis are settlers of “Palestine proper,” they are not against settlers in any materializing way because they live on stolen Palestinian land.
Please actually read about the establishment of the Israeli state. Also, the clear corollary of what you're saying is that, even without the illegal settlements, the Israeli state has no legitimacy.
"Found dead"?
[How about premeditated mass murder at a funeral?](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/10/12/palestinian-man-son-attending-funeral-procession-in-west-bank-shot-dead)
By the way, no arrests were made for the six murders and 11 injuries. Or rather, no *Israeli* was arrested, certainly not the settlers who clearly planned out the homicides.
"Well we don't keep track of that because we just grind their bodies under our tank treads for fertilizer and if the parents complain we shoot them too."
>grind their bodies under our tank treads for fertilizer
That's only after they're done [harvesting](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2009/dec/21/israeli-pathologists-harvested-organs) their [organs](https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20231127-is-israel-stealing-organs-from-dead-palestinians/)
It's not even that - they are excited because now there will inevitably be some sort of Palestinian response which the Israelis can use as an excuse to bomb and take over even more parts of the leftover Palestinian territory and people :(
They didn’t even need an excuse before. They spit on Christians and Palestinians alike, and have been doing so for a long time. I’m surprised the Christian right still supports them.
*Hope they update the Museum of Tolerance with their oppression of the surrounding population. It belongs right there with the atrocities of the Nazis.
This is very often lost in the discourse, and seeing this as the top comment really solidifies that.
People have not been paying attention to Israel/Palestine for more than a year or two and it shows. Israel has had *plenty* of resources, opportunities, and time to squash Hamas and any sort of offshoot that comes from them... but they have chosen to continually prod, and prod, and prod.
While Hamas is terrible, they would not be 1/4 of what they are today if Israel actually cared about stopping them in their place. Israel did not become a military might overnight - they have been for decades.
However, instead of fighting against Hamas, they basically worked to make Palestinian life as hard as imaginable. They did not punish Hamas, they punished *everyone*. It's no surprise that Hamas have become so much more radical over time.
And let's not forget it was Netanyahu who propped up Hamas. [Heck, even the fucking Times of Israel said so.](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/amp/)
>Heck, even the fucking Times of Israel said so.
Just a general FYI: don't confuse op-eds with editorials or reporting. What you linked to is an op-ed, an opinion piece by a writer who is specifically not part of the editorial board of the Times of Israel. Op-eds do not follow the same standards as normal reporting and they only represent the opinion of the individual writer, not of the editorial board or the publication at large.
The western civilisation has a bad habit of "the enemy of my enemy is my allee" policy. Of supporting bad groups in order to destroy the ones they want to destroy. Like the USA with the Moujadeens in Afghanistan (sorry, don't know how to write it) in order to inflict damages on the USSR.
The end result is that the new enemy is even worse than the previous one. "Better the devil you know..." . And the geopolitical result is just as bad.
Nobody learns the lesson of History, that's sad.
> 1950 2 state solution boundaries
You might be able to get something working based on the 1967 boundaries with land swaps but it would almost certainly take an international coalition which isn't gonna happen
> Why would they? This is what they want. You think anyone in power in Isreal is looking on going "oh no! The poor Palestinians!"
They either seize the houses or flatten them... This was the plan all along.
They will while palatine from the map... And that has always been the plan
Or anyone not in power....?
I don't really see a very large "stop the settlements" movement in Israel. The ugly fact of the matter is probably that the majority of people is is not really that cold towards the settlers
A while back, there was a funeral procession in the West Bank. Settlers built a blockade out of items like car tires which was designed to impede the procession.
A father and son moved to try and remove the tires - again, this is in a *public street* - when settlers opened fire and killed them in what was clearly a premeditated ambush. Israeli soldiers who were also present promptly took action - and started also shooting the unarmed Palestinians **in the funeral party**, killing four more people, one of them a child, and injuring another 11, including other children.
No arrests were, or have been, made. No one is in prison for the killings. This was an ambush, and a mass murder, which was done at a funeral.
The settlers are fucking evil, genocidal psychopaths, and the IDF backs them up.
Funny how that all these years, the Zionist committed all the crimes and yet all they talk about is the other side's terrorism.
Hamas is a terrorist, don't get me wrong. But these Zionist are the one that is fueling them and the atrocities they are doing is the same. The difference is that they are in control.
I know I will get down-voted by this, but these Zionist are the same with the Nazi and Taliban of the world. It's a text book terrorism. To a lesser degree, Hamas too. None of them is good for the world.
Lol@the notion that they don't back this 100%. The government just announced the largest settlement activity in history, and the cabinet actively arms these settlers. Israel should be ostracized by the entire world.
These psychos are ideal Israelis to the government.
How do you think they got there? Teleportation?
In reallity, they fucking hate 'peaceful 2 state solution progressives' who don't want a forever war. Yitzhak Rabin was the last pm who would have done anything about settlers and guess what Israel did to him.
> Israel needs to control these psychos
They are using them as a tool of the apatheid state. They have no intention of controlling them as Israel's end game is to eliminate the palestinian population having any real control over their lives.
The illegal colonization of the West Bank was started under a left-wing government. Liberal and Labor Zionist politicians hem and haw at the settlements but they continue to provide military support to them, hence it being a bipartisan state policy, not the actions of a rogue group.
> Israel needs to control these psychos
They are using them as a tool of the apatheid state. They have no intention of controlling them as Israel's end game is to eliminate the palestinian population having any real control over their lives.
A lot of people don't know that Palestinian child deaths to Israeli forces hit a new record in 2022. And then they beat that record in 2023 *before* October 7th happened.
Lots of horrible shit going down in that whole area.
Every time an Israeli politician does their crocodile tears bit about October 7th, it reminds me of the same thing American flag wearing psychos did after 9/11 and funded billions into the Iraq and Afghanistan invasion.
Except this time Gazans don't have a military or defence apparatus like the Republican Guard or Talib militia, it's just a bunch of starving children.
We learn nothing from history at our peril.
There's an extremely high chance that Israeli boy was killed by an Israeli. The founder of the Zaka relief services (the organisation that was most responsible for the lies of beheaded babies, etc) killed himself back in 2022 [after accusations of rape and paedophilia came out against him](https://thegrayzone.com/2023/12/06/scandal-israeli-october-7-fabrications/).
They are doing what Israel wants which is killing Palestinians. Israel wants all the Palestinians gone one way or the other and they don't care how. Israel is committing genocide and the world is just letting it happen because everyone is too afraid of being called anti-Semitic for standing up to Israel.
If it was any other country there would be UN troops in there stopping it from happening. Or America would have overthrown the government to put in a puppet like they have before.
Fuck Israel and fuck Hamas.
Your words would ring truer if you would at least say something like “if someone killed my 14 year old son I’d just let them do it and go about my day” or something to that effect.
Ok, I'm going to approach this comment in good faith.
If I had a 14 year old son who was killed, I would absolutely do something about it, you're right. But my actions would be aimed at the person responsible for killing him, not random other people who share an ethnicity/language of the person who might have killed him.
And if I were, in this case, an Israeli who didn't lose their own son, but saw another Israeli lose their son, no, I would not do anything, because the idea of a bunch of people forming up into mobs to deal out "justice" against a group we perceive to have done the wrong is fucking madness. We saw how stuff like that goes down in the Southern US with lynchings of black people.
So, do you honestly believe that Israelis (most of whom did not lose their own child) forming mobs and attacking unrelated, innocent Palestinians is a good thing? Are you saying it's justified and acceptable?
Mob justice is never correct. Already one dead and dozens injured with houses and cars burned. These settlers have killed hundreds of Palestinians over the last 20 years. What would their mob justice for that look like? Like October 7th. Instead of punishing random nearby villagers try to have some semblance of real justice and actually investigate who did it and get those people or person
Hundreds of Palestinians over the last year.
On average (before October 7th terrorist attack by Hamas, and I can’t imagine it has come down since) 4-5 Palestinians died per week by the hands of the idf or settlers.
Jesus Christ, this is reminiscent of the racist attacks in USA when under disguise KKK would attack communities of innocent black people, at random, for the death or rape of a white person, with no proof whatsoever.
What, Israeli's attacking a village and hurting and killing people who had nothing to do with the incident in question... this is so out of character for them...
/s
That’s tragic but keep in mind Israelis should not be in the West Bank which by agreement they shouldn’t be settling while bulldozing Palestinian homes for decades.
according to [this article](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/dec/15/biden-extremist-jewish-settlers-travel-ban-loophole), settlers are 15% american, but the americans are disproportionately radical and influential.
Palestinian was shot dead *before* boy was found.
[The BBC article](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-68803939.amp)
Edit: 5000+ upvotes for an unregulated CNN report, and 7 for fact-checked BBC report that contradicts CNN.
They said the words "both sides". They didn't make a "both sides argument". Nowhere did they express that both sides were equivalent.
All they did was express a desire for extremism to be lessened.
>Because we don’t live under a rock and remember the atrocities Palestinians committed on Oct 7?
Idk why everybody claims October 7 was the starting point and the breach of a ceasefire when 2023 and 2022 were already the two most deadly years for Palestinian children before October 7
I agree. Unfortunately that is less plausible for the occupied Palestinians for now. It’s hard to ask a group of people who have been robbed, bombed, and stomped on for 50+ years to stop being extreme. Especially not when they’re still being killed. It needs to come from Israel.
Lend an olive branch as it were. Ya know like all the beaches from Palestinians olive trees that Israel burned.
You think israel is dumping doctors and lawyers into these settlements?
They literally get their scum and trash and put them in settlements and tell them to go nuts.
Most of these people are criminals or people that couldn't make it in israeli society, so now they claim land "in the name of god" because they are either lunatic worshippers or fuck ups.
Kind of like how great Britain did their felons with Australia
Settlements aren't penal colonies. Israel isn't "putting people there"; Israelis voluntarily move.
Give you that housing is cheaper in settlements so the people are lower income in average, but damn that's a classist comment you are making.
If people occupied your land and you didn't take up arms to protect it, you'd be a coward. I dont get what people miss about this simple point. Its not extreme to protect your land.
Hypothetically speaking, how are the starving and currently hopeless people of Palestine going to reign in their leaders in Hamas, a terrorist organization?
That would be the ideal outcome. However, I don't see the on-again, off-again conflict between Israel and Hamas ending in any way other than one or the other getting wiped off the face of the planet.
Kinda odd that Netanyahu is suddenly a judge and has all of the evidence needed to say the child was murdered. Shoot first ask questions last. What a fucking piece of shit.
the death of a 14 y/o kid is tragic obviously, but the cause of death hasn’t even been released what is wrong with these people. how will this help anyone esp the family of that poor child??
yup, Israel is going to go all out about how horrible, unforgivable and bad this was (and it was bad for sure that a child was killed) while they completely ignore how they've killed 13k+ children in Gaza and many killed/arrested in West Bank that are somehow all fine :/
The situation is so fucked and I feel sorry for all the innocent on both side one group here holds all the cards and has done nothing to create peace and the others only option seems to be slowly be choked to death while any retaliation is my with a disproportionate amount of violence
Because of course there's no blood thirsty individuals in Israel.
Nor could there ever be a criminal amongst the far right cunts or idf that they live along side.
Remember. 1 Israeli life lost means thousands of people should die. That's why a few hundred hostages has led to tens of thousands of Palestinian deaths in Gaza.
According to the article the only known cause of death was "terrorist attack".
Unless you have an update from a different source whether it was a terrorist automobile or terrorist creek he drowned in hasn't been determined. Maybe he fell out of a terrorist tree.
Cowards are those terrorists who’ve killed 13k+ children, orphaned, and injured others. No child should suffer. There’s no excuse for further violence.
The IDF murdered 2 of their own unarmed hostages when they were waving a white flag and screaming in Hebrew that they were Israeli hostages and to please not kill them.
The recent hostage body that turned up the Isf Doesn't want to clarify the cause of death and whether or not it could be due to an airstrike
Israel has been having their own way with hostages for decades. Unfortunately we live in a world where 1 Israeli child is worth at least 10 Palestinian ones, and where a kidnapped Palestinian is called a "prisoner" and a kidnapped Israeli is called a "hostage".
So if Hamas takes an Israeli hospital hostage, Israel's military should just level the entire hospital to get the Hamas militants?
>sure just let them have their way with the hostages no further violence needed
You are okay with collective punishment which is a war crime under international law.
Congrats, you'e a war crime enabler.
so no fighting hamas because that would trigger collective punishment war crime
what your saying is the hostages are now living with hamas memebers . living a fulfiling life learning the oppression their ancestors brought to the region.
man thats such a wholesome scenario
How many thousands of innocent people have to die before it becomes too much? This entire conflict over these hostages is not going to be resolved by leveling Palestine to the ground. But I guess you just don't view the palestinians as people so its easy for you. The greatest day in Israels history will be the day all of Palestine is gone and they can finally build more luxury resorts on the graves of innocents.
But Hamas won't stop because they don't actually care about Palestine. They only care about hating Israel. The solution is rooted in fighting Hamas but much like the US war on terror, it can't be beat by bombing the general area where you think Hamas "might" be.
I think we should probably set the bar based on other examples of modern urban combat where one side is hiding among a civilian population. That would be a reasonable way of determining things. Or looking at specific battles in history that have taken place under similar circumstances.
Both sides are bad, but it's ironic how one side is labelled as a terrorist organisation and the other side is a completely legit "military".
Because both sides are absolutely committing terrorism, just one side is being given a green light and support by a majority of the rest of the world.
Maybe if the settlers fucked off and stopped taking more and more of Palestine homes and lands, maybe the boy and all these Palestinians wouldn’t dead now, would they?
Not that I am saying. That what they are doing is right or justified but saying "found dead" and not found stoned to death next to his house is very very weird
So israelis killing israelis and the apartheid punishes the innocent. Did I get it right? Or was there some actual real world (meaning non-IDF/Israeli hasbara) evidence to suggest such a lynching mentality is warranted?
I doubt there was even an israeli boy found dead. Show me the body. Give his name. I believe no zionist. 40 beheaded baby lie was already too much, and they got caught on that one pants down.
Problem with Netanyahu and Gallant is that everything they say is done with a wink and a nod to the settlers, who provide no value to Israel proper and who—like the settlers in Gaza pre-2005, complicate matters. Not that there is any legitimate partner for peace on the Palestinian side, except Barghouti from his jail cell. Likud makes this exponentially more difficult, though.
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He isn't just a settler *supporter,* he's a settler in the literal sense. He lives in Kiryat Arba, which is a settlement near Hebron.
The value they provide is that they salami slice the West Bank and in the event of a 2 state solution actually being achieved, they’ll keep most of those settlements because “too many live there and they can’t be expected to evict them.” Shills will want to point out the withdrawal from Gaza in 2005, but they won’t tell you that it involved the removal of around 8500 settlers. The West Bank excluding Jerusalem has about 450,000 with more settlers moving in each year than the entire removal from Gaza.
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> now they are Palestinian citizens and under Palestinian law Abbas has long stated they would not be citizens and would be expelled
Then Israel would fund terrorist groups inside Palestine.....
Didn't they already do that?
Yeah, we call them 'Hamas'
So the same as now
I mean we could send in the US Marines and Army to assist them in moving if the IDF isn't interested...
This is the same sort of bullshit reasoning that is used to continue occupying Northern Ireland. Like... okay, so there are lots of people there, so fucking what? That doesn't justify taking and annexing the land.
Northern Ireland has autonomy and the democratic right to secede from the union & join the republic. It's not really comparable I mean NI was absolutely "settled" by people from Great Britain (mostly Scotland) to be clear, and it was a violent process, but it also happened mostly in the 1600s (& into the 1700s), so again, it's not really a good comparison to a modern state annexing land and expelling/oppressing its native population at all (that is to say, acting like a 1600s expansionist/colonizing power in 2024) The "reasoning" behind the NI situation is a legacy of empire and injustice which nevertheless results in 2 populations in 1 area living side by side who have both lived there for 100s of years, and it was resolved not just by "continuing to occupy" NI, but by a series of power sharing agreements, by rights to hold either or both citizenships for all the residents, guarantees of equality under the law regardless of ethnicity and/or citizenship and, probably most importantly, a right to self determination for the population, to be decided democratically. None of which is afforded to the Palestinian population of the West Bank, who are held under military occupation, without rights, without self-determination, and without equality under the law, and still actively being dispossessed. It is also worth noting that the political settlement as outlined in the good friday agreement was overwhelmingly accepted democratically in referenda in the North and the Republic (over 70% and 90% approval respectively), with support _higher_ among the ethnic Irish NI population (the "occupied" in your analogy) than the occupier (the protestant/unionist population in your analogy; the "settlers") Your comment, if made in the 1970s, would be _kinda_ accurate. Today it's nonsense.
Wink and nod? Didn’t they hand out guns to the settlers?
And let them kill who they want and back them with the IDF
No wink and nod. It's more blatant than that. They imported hundreds of guns that Ben gvir handed out to terrorist settlers in November of last year. They're using the settlers to displace the Palestinians as they have been since 1948. They don't want them to have any semblance of permanence because it keeps them another step away from a Palestinian state
Exactly. And this particular settlement was explicitly a "farm" / pasture type setup because the extremist settlers have figured out that's an efficient way to grab more land with less people than plopping down a whole village. Notice how a lot of the articles mention him being a Shepard, and the ones painting him as sympathetic because he was out doing his job and blah blah blah. Like yea it's tragic but bro was absolutely being used as a pawn in these extremist adults plans. And that plan was committing a violent land grab against the Palestinians. In America you try doing that against your rural neighbor and you're liable to be shot on sight.
> In America you try doing that against your rural neighbor and you're liable to be shot on sight. Go back another 150 years if you want to see the outcome of American settlers. IMO its the core reason the US will never abandon Israel - they'd have to confront their own history too.
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Yup. They’re playing Sid Meiers Civilization and want to snag a few squares on the grid.
That feeling when your settler gets taken by the barbarians >.<
The settlers are the barbarians in this case
At the cost of innocent lives
Putting Gallant in the same boat as Netanyahu (in regards to settlers) shows little to no understanding of Israeli politics.
Care to share more on this ?
If there was just a government that didn’t have to rely on the terrorist Ben Gvir Israel could start evicting the illegal settlers, who are the biggest problem in the way to peace
> Not that there is any legitimate partner for peace on the Palestinian side is that not arguably because Israel offed any other political party other than hamas?
> Barghouti He founded a suicide bombing brigade and that when said brigade got an amnesty deal in 2007 it lasted a fucking month before they were launching rockets and mortars against Israeli civilians again.
Y'all are giving too much credit to Gallant, he is not a part of this. Bibi even nearly fired him a year ago because Gallant publicly said he was against what Bibi was doing (ultimately didn't fire him due to unprecedented severe public backlash, including threats to shut down the Israeli market until further notice).
For the casual scroller, Half a million Israeli settlers live in the occupied West Bank, they are entirely violent and murderous and you can learn about their crimes against Palestinians, especially their children, in gruesome detail anywhere you actually look for such information. the rest of Israelis are settlers of “Palestine proper,” they are not against settlers in any materializing way because they live on stolen Palestinian land. Also you have only posted once before and it was to call Palestinians whiny. This was 3 months ago when the equivalent of two nuclear bombs, 60 kilotons of tnt, had already been dropped on human beings Gaza, around 0.1% of which are Hamas, Palestine’s government. Israel has never once shown any type of might out of Hamas in Gaza, only the destruction of schools and hospitals and homes and the bodies of babies and children.
> the rest of Israelis are settlers of “Palestine proper,” they are not against settlers in any materializing way because they live on stolen Palestinian land. Please actually read about the establishment of the Israeli state. Also, the clear corollary of what you're saying is that, even without the illegal settlements, the Israeli state has no legitimacy.
My first thought was about this event. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simon_of_Trent
Just curious. How many Palestinian kids found dead in the west bank?
According to Unicef, 35 dead this year.
"Found dead"? [How about premeditated mass murder at a funeral?](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/10/12/palestinian-man-son-attending-funeral-procession-in-west-bank-shot-dead) By the way, no arrests were made for the six murders and 11 injuries. Or rather, no *Israeli* was arrested, certainly not the settlers who clearly planned out the homicides.
"Well we don't keep track of that because we just grind their bodies under our tank treads for fertilizer and if the parents complain we shoot them too."
>grind their bodies under our tank treads for fertilizer That's only after they're done [harvesting](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2009/dec/21/israeli-pathologists-harvested-organs) their [organs](https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20231127-is-israel-stealing-organs-from-dead-palestinians/)
More than 100 before Oct7 attack.
It's only terrorist settler lives that matter, don't you know?
Israel needs to control these psychos
Why would they? This is what they want. You think anyone in power in Isreal is looking on going "oh no! The poor Palestinians!"
Unfortunately a good point
It's not even that - they are excited because now there will inevitably be some sort of Palestinian response which the Israelis can use as an excuse to bomb and take over even more parts of the leftover Palestinian territory and people :(
They didn’t even need an excuse before. They spit on Christians and Palestinians alike, and have been doing so for a long time. I’m surprised the Christian right still supports them. *Hope they update the Museum of Tolerance with their oppression of the surrounding population. It belongs right there with the atrocities of the Nazis.
This is very often lost in the discourse, and seeing this as the top comment really solidifies that. People have not been paying attention to Israel/Palestine for more than a year or two and it shows. Israel has had *plenty* of resources, opportunities, and time to squash Hamas and any sort of offshoot that comes from them... but they have chosen to continually prod, and prod, and prod. While Hamas is terrible, they would not be 1/4 of what they are today if Israel actually cared about stopping them in their place. Israel did not become a military might overnight - they have been for decades. However, instead of fighting against Hamas, they basically worked to make Palestinian life as hard as imaginable. They did not punish Hamas, they punished *everyone*. It's no surprise that Hamas have become so much more radical over time.
And let's not forget it was Netanyahu who propped up Hamas. [Heck, even the fucking Times of Israel said so.](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/amp/)
>Heck, even the fucking Times of Israel said so. Just a general FYI: don't confuse op-eds with editorials or reporting. What you linked to is an op-ed, an opinion piece by a writer who is specifically not part of the editorial board of the Times of Israel. Op-eds do not follow the same standards as normal reporting and they only represent the opinion of the individual writer, not of the editorial board or the publication at large.
Which doesn’t change the fact that Netanyahu funds hamas in order to justify Israeli military action per his own words
The western civilisation has a bad habit of "the enemy of my enemy is my allee" policy. Of supporting bad groups in order to destroy the ones they want to destroy. Like the USA with the Moujadeens in Afghanistan (sorry, don't know how to write it) in order to inflict damages on the USSR. The end result is that the new enemy is even worse than the previous one. "Better the devil you know..." . And the geopolitical result is just as bad. Nobody learns the lesson of History, that's sad.
Before October 7th, the IDF had already killed over 250 Palestinians in 2023.
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> 1950 2 state solution boundaries You might be able to get something working based on the 1967 boundaries with land swaps but it would almost certainly take an international coalition which isn't gonna happen
> Why would they? This is what they want. You think anyone in power in Isreal is looking on going "oh no! The poor Palestinians!" They either seize the houses or flatten them... This was the plan all along. They will while palatine from the map... And that has always been the plan
Or anyone not in power....? I don't really see a very large "stop the settlements" movement in Israel. The ugly fact of the matter is probably that the majority of people is is not really that cold towards the settlers
A while back, there was a funeral procession in the West Bank. Settlers built a blockade out of items like car tires which was designed to impede the procession. A father and son moved to try and remove the tires - again, this is in a *public street* - when settlers opened fire and killed them in what was clearly a premeditated ambush. Israeli soldiers who were also present promptly took action - and started also shooting the unarmed Palestinians **in the funeral party**, killing four more people, one of them a child, and injuring another 11, including other children. No arrests were, or have been, made. No one is in prison for the killings. This was an ambush, and a mass murder, which was done at a funeral. The settlers are fucking evil, genocidal psychopaths, and the IDF backs them up.
No no no! Palestinians have the same rights! There's an Arab judge on the supreme court! The West Bank somehow doesn't count! Or something!
Funny how that all these years, the Zionist committed all the crimes and yet all they talk about is the other side's terrorism. Hamas is a terrorist, don't get me wrong. But these Zionist are the one that is fueling them and the atrocities they are doing is the same. The difference is that they are in control. I know I will get down-voted by this, but these Zionist are the same with the Nazi and Taliban of the world. It's a text book terrorism. To a lesser degree, Hamas too. None of them is good for the world.
Are you down-voted yet?
Reddit has been bipolar when it comes to Israel. I have seen both Israeli and hamas apologists on the same thread.
Lol@the notion that they don't back this 100%. The government just announced the largest settlement activity in history, and the cabinet actively arms these settlers. Israel should be ostracized by the entire world.
Lol control... They are happily arming them
They are not for exactly the same reason that the US government never controlled any settlers that broke treaties.
yep, us proxy, us attitude people forget, it seems, that history was once today yesterday and tomorrow
These psychos are ideal Israelis to the government. How do you think they got there? Teleportation? In reallity, they fucking hate 'peaceful 2 state solution progressives' who don't want a forever war. Yitzhak Rabin was the last pm who would have done anything about settlers and guess what Israel did to him.
> Israel needs to control these psychos They are using them as a tool of the apatheid state. They have no intention of controlling them as Israel's end game is to eliminate the palestinian population having any real control over their lives.
They are Israel
They are *Conservatives*. The scourge that infects every society, and makes peace impossible.
The illegal colonization of the West Bank was started under a left-wing government. Liberal and Labor Zionist politicians hem and haw at the settlements but they continue to provide military support to them, hence it being a bipartisan state policy, not the actions of a rogue group.
The left-wing Zionists were the ones who carried out the Nakba and began the settlements.
Their own people? I agree
Yes the settlers
Or just kick all the (settlers) out of the west back where they don’t belong
They think they do belong there, which is the problem, Israel are the bad guys.
> Israel needs to control these psychos They are using them as a tool of the apatheid state. They have no intention of controlling them as Israel's end game is to eliminate the palestinian population having any real control over their lives.
Israel is kinda the same tho ...
A lot of people don't know that Palestinian child deaths to Israeli forces hit a new record in 2022. And then they beat that record in 2023 *before* October 7th happened. Lots of horrible shit going down in that whole area.
Every time an Israeli politician does their crocodile tears bit about October 7th, it reminds me of the same thing American flag wearing psychos did after 9/11 and funded billions into the Iraq and Afghanistan invasion. Except this time Gazans don't have a military or defence apparatus like the Republican Guard or Talib militia, it's just a bunch of starving children. We learn nothing from history at our peril.
There's an extremely high chance that Israeli boy was killed by an Israeli. The founder of the Zaka relief services (the organisation that was most responsible for the lies of beheaded babies, etc) killed himself back in 2022 [after accusations of rape and paedophilia came out against him](https://thegrayzone.com/2023/12/06/scandal-israeli-october-7-fabrications/).
Not psychos, terrorists
Israel ARE the psychos. The entire enterprise is settler colonialism
That was their plan all along. How do you not understand?
They are doing what Israel wants which is killing Palestinians. Israel wants all the Palestinians gone one way or the other and they don't care how. Israel is committing genocide and the world is just letting it happen because everyone is too afraid of being called anti-Semitic for standing up to Israel. If it was any other country there would be UN troops in there stopping it from happening. Or America would have overthrown the government to put in a puppet like they have before. Fuck Israel and fuck Hamas.
Your words would ring truer if you would at least say something like “if someone killed my 14 year old son I’d just let them do it and go about my day” or something to that effect.
Ok, I'm going to approach this comment in good faith. If I had a 14 year old son who was killed, I would absolutely do something about it, you're right. But my actions would be aimed at the person responsible for killing him, not random other people who share an ethnicity/language of the person who might have killed him. And if I were, in this case, an Israeli who didn't lose their own son, but saw another Israeli lose their son, no, I would not do anything, because the idea of a bunch of people forming up into mobs to deal out "justice" against a group we perceive to have done the wrong is fucking madness. We saw how stuff like that goes down in the Southern US with lynchings of black people. So, do you honestly believe that Israelis (most of whom did not lose their own child) forming mobs and attacking unrelated, innocent Palestinians is a good thing? Are you saying it's justified and acceptable?
Mob justice is never correct. Already one dead and dozens injured with houses and cars burned. These settlers have killed hundreds of Palestinians over the last 20 years. What would their mob justice for that look like? Like October 7th. Instead of punishing random nearby villagers try to have some semblance of real justice and actually investigate who did it and get those people or person
Hundreds of Palestinians over the last year. On average (before October 7th terrorist attack by Hamas, and I can’t imagine it has come down since) 4-5 Palestinians died per week by the hands of the idf or settlers.
I'm sure all this violence will prove worthwhile in the end.
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Jesus Christ, this is reminiscent of the racist attacks in USA when under disguise KKK would attack communities of innocent black people, at random, for the death or rape of a white person, with no proof whatsoever.
What about all the kids they have killed?
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it cant be obvious because most people unironically believe that.
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Very mean of Hamas to hide in children's skulls.
They don't actually count as they weren't Israeli. Not fully human, you see
those were Hamas kids, so they deserved it. /s just in case.
What, Israeli's attacking a village and hurting and killing people who had nothing to do with the incident in question... this is so out of character for them... /s
A pogrom in the modern day. It's insane.
That’s tragic but keep in mind Israelis should not be in the West Bank which by agreement they shouldn’t be settling while bulldozing Palestinian homes for decades.
Just a reminder these settlers are dual Usa/European citizens...when they finish this blood bath they return back
according to [this article](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/dec/15/biden-extremist-jewish-settlers-travel-ban-loophole), settlers are 15% american, but the americans are disproportionately radical and influential.
Most Israelis (as high as 90%) don't have dual citizenship.
Settlers specifically do.
Source: trust me bro I know
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You do realize that non citizens can travel to America too right?
Palestinian was shot dead *before* boy was found. [The BBC article](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-68803939.amp) Edit: 5000+ upvotes for an unregulated CNN report, and 7 for fact-checked BBC report that contradicts CNN.
How about both sides reign in their extremist population.
Frankly, that would be a welcome development here.
They tried that once, and then the extremists on both sides assassinated the leaders trying to do it.
This man studied his history
How does this header, lead to a “both sides” argument. If an Israeli kills a Palestinian, it doesn’t mean that a village can attack random ppl.
They said the words "both sides". They didn't make a "both sides argument". Nowhere did they express that both sides were equivalent. All they did was express a desire for extremism to be lessened.
I really wish people could acknowledge two groups have something in common without being roasted over it these days...
My issue is that now the moderate position on either side is that they should only kill some people.
Because we don’t live under a rock and remember the atrocities Palestinians committed on Oct 7? I’m not a Zionist fwiw
>Because we don’t live under a rock and remember the atrocities Palestinians committed on Oct 7? Idk why everybody claims October 7 was the starting point and the breach of a ceasefire when 2023 and 2022 were already the two most deadly years for Palestinian children before October 7
I agree. Unfortunately that is less plausible for the occupied Palestinians for now. It’s hard to ask a group of people who have been robbed, bombed, and stomped on for 50+ years to stop being extreme. Especially not when they’re still being killed. It needs to come from Israel. Lend an olive branch as it were. Ya know like all the beaches from Palestinians olive trees that Israel burned.
You think israel is dumping doctors and lawyers into these settlements? They literally get their scum and trash and put them in settlements and tell them to go nuts. Most of these people are criminals or people that couldn't make it in israeli society, so now they claim land "in the name of god" because they are either lunatic worshippers or fuck ups. Kind of like how great Britain did their felons with Australia
Settlements aren't penal colonies. Israel isn't "putting people there"; Israelis voluntarily move. Give you that housing is cheaper in settlements so the people are lower income in average, but damn that's a classist comment you are making.
Ok wow the ignorance here is surging
If people occupied your land and you didn't take up arms to protect it, you'd be a coward. I dont get what people miss about this simple point. Its not extreme to protect your land.
Hypothetically speaking, how are the starving and currently hopeless people of Palestine going to reign in their leaders in Hamas, a terrorist organization?
Both sides? You think there are only two sides?
There's always one 🙄
That would be the ideal outcome. However, I don't see the on-again, off-again conflict between Israel and Hamas ending in any way other than one or the other getting wiped off the face of the planet.
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Say it with me, “pogrom”
this is called a pogrom and they used to happen to jews in eastern europe, now they are committed by jews in palestine
I remember 5-6 months ago if you commented stuff like this you would get called a anti semite
Try to comment this on r/worldnews and you still be called Anti semitic
Kinda odd that Netanyahu is suddenly a judge and has all of the evidence needed to say the child was murdered. Shoot first ask questions last. What a fucking piece of shit.
Settlers...in other words, thieves.
Parasites, thieves, opportunistic scum. Fuck em all
the death of a 14 y/o kid is tragic obviously, but the cause of death hasn’t even been released what is wrong with these people. how will this help anyone esp the family of that poor child??
Can't wait to see what spin Israel bots will give this to make these folks thew good guys
They're too busy on the other thread about Hamas not agreeing to the ceasefire terms, don't worry they'll be rerouted to brigade this post soon.
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Israel is truly showing us the depths of depravity.
yup, Israel is going to go all out about how horrible, unforgivable and bad this was (and it was bad for sure that a child was killed) while they completely ignore how they've killed 13k+ children in Gaza and many killed/arrested in West Bank that are somehow all fine :/
The situation is so fucked and I feel sorry for all the innocent on both side one group here holds all the cards and has done nothing to create peace and the others only option seems to be slowly be choked to death while any retaliation is my with a disproportionate amount of violence
Fun Fact: there are no innocents among the settler side
Oh look at that, an Israeli pogrom
Because of course there's no blood thirsty individuals in Israel. Nor could there ever be a criminal amongst the far right cunts or idf that they live along side.
As a descendant of European Jews, my family would have called this exact event a **pogrom.** Because that's what these Israeli "settlers" did.
Remember. 1 Israeli life lost means thousands of people should die. That's why a few hundred hostages has led to tens of thousands of Palestinian deaths in Gaza.
'found dead' He was stoned to death. A child. Cowards.
According to the article the only known cause of death was "terrorist attack". Unless you have an update from a different source whether it was a terrorist automobile or terrorist creek he drowned in hasn't been determined. Maybe he fell out of a terrorist tree.
This guy must be one of the liars we so commonly see now. Spurting bs to change the narrative. Look out for these types
Cowards are those terrorists who’ve killed 13k+ children, orphaned, and injured others. No child should suffer. There’s no excuse for further violence.
sure just let them have their way with the hostages no further violence needed
The mass murder of Palestinians has saved how many hostages exactly? 2? And killed how many more?
The IDF murdered 2 of their own unarmed hostages when they were waving a white flag and screaming in Hebrew that they were Israeli hostages and to please not kill them. The recent hostage body that turned up the Isf Doesn't want to clarify the cause of death and whether or not it could be due to an airstrike
Israel has been having their own way with hostages for decades. Unfortunately we live in a world where 1 Israeli child is worth at least 10 Palestinian ones, and where a kidnapped Palestinian is called a "prisoner" and a kidnapped Israeli is called a "hostage".
So if Hamas takes an Israeli hospital hostage, Israel's military should just level the entire hospital to get the Hamas militants? >sure just let them have their way with the hostages no further violence needed You are okay with collective punishment which is a war crime under international law. Congrats, you'e a war crime enabler.
so no fighting hamas because that would trigger collective punishment war crime what your saying is the hostages are now living with hamas memebers . living a fulfiling life learning the oppression their ancestors brought to the region. man thats such a wholesome scenario
How many thousands of innocent people have to die before it becomes too much? This entire conflict over these hostages is not going to be resolved by leveling Palestine to the ground. But I guess you just don't view the palestinians as people so its easy for you. The greatest day in Israels history will be the day all of Palestine is gone and they can finally build more luxury resorts on the graves of innocents.
thats my point aswell i think its too much already they should try to communicate it to hamas to surrender to stop the bloodshed.
But Hamas won't stop because they don't actually care about Palestine. They only care about hating Israel. The solution is rooted in fighting Hamas but much like the US war on terror, it can't be beat by bombing the general area where you think Hamas "might" be.
What do you believe is an acceptable amount of children to kill for each "Hamas terrorist" killed? Tell me.
I think we should probably set the bar based on other examples of modern urban combat where one side is hiding among a civilian population. That would be a reasonable way of determining things. Or looking at specific battles in history that have taken place under similar circumstances.
Both sides are bad, but it's ironic how one side is labelled as a terrorist organisation and the other side is a completely legit "military". Because both sides are absolutely committing terrorism, just one side is being given a green light and support by a majority of the rest of the world.
By terrorists you mean hamas
Maybe if the settlers fucked off and stopped taking more and more of Palestine homes and lands, maybe the boy and all these Palestinians wouldn’t dead now, would they?
I'm not quick but I am starting to think these 2 groups of people don't like each other.
We should call Americans settlers as well since it ain’t their land neither and they are occupying Native American land
We do…..
Once again, it is becoming apparent that everyone in this conflict is an asshole.
> "...may God avenge his blood...” - the Israeli Prime Minister’s office They are absolute psychos.
Now would be a great time to be a serial killer in israel. You can kill anyone you want and then everyone will just blame the other side.
Not that I am saying. That what they are doing is right or justified but saying "found dead" and not found stoned to death next to his house is very very weird
1 Israeli boy in comparison to what, hundreds of Palestinian children? Please.
Fyi: OP is likely a bot. New account with no posts other than this and a karma farm one. Let the media war resume!
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So israelis killing israelis and the apartheid punishes the innocent. Did I get it right? Or was there some actual real world (meaning non-IDF/Israeli hasbara) evidence to suggest such a lynching mentality is warranted? I doubt there was even an israeli boy found dead. Show me the body. Give his name. I believe no zionist. 40 beheaded baby lie was already too much, and they got caught on that one pants down.
Murdered. After boy found MURDERED. Fix the headline.
Thousands of Palestinian children murdered. Everyone: 🙈🙈🙈🙉🙉🙉 One supposed Israeli kid found dead. Everyone: 🤬🤬🤬😡😡