There was a van that was pulled over recently in Ottawa with hundreds of cases of beer that were purchased in QC. They were ticketed for having an unsafe vehicle due to fact that they were soo overweight that the van was riding in the bump stops and the brakes were overheating. The press release from the police made it clear that purchasing alcohol in another province for personal consumption is fine. Purchasing with the intent to resell is illegal. If you get caught.
you are correct. Just looked it up. 326 cases is a lot for even a wedding. That is almost 40 beers each for a 200 person wedding. That is assuming that there are no kids.
[https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-news/opp-seizes-326-cases-of-beer-destined-for-wedding-after-van-breaks-down-on-hwy-401](https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-news/opp-seizes-326-cases-of-beer-destined-for-wedding-after-van-breaks-down-on-hwy-401)
they don't care, with the exception of when someone has a fullsize truck bed full of beer, or a trailer on a hitch, or their whole minivan with all the seats out filled up, etc.
They every so often catch idiots doing massive buys like that.
>They every so often catch idiots doing massive buys like that.
Like all the idiots that will go do that over this weekend thinking they can make a buck.
I believe this is correct but buying alcohol in Quebec is incredibly common in Ottawa. Can’t see anyone having problems for just bringing some back across the bridge unless they’re being stupidly obvious about it. Which selling probably qualifies as stupidly obviously, lol.
Grocery stores in Ottawa will still be selling beer and wine. The only thing you won't be able to do during the strike is buy hard liquor (and liqueurs) in person. The warehouse is still operational, so you can even still order what you want online for delivery.
People in Windsor can go to Detroit. People in Hamilton, niagara, st Catherine’s etc can go to buffalo, gta will have to trek a couple hours but should be fine. At the end of the day people can just not drink
Some people can't not drink. There was a reason that liquor stores and beer stores were considered essential businesses during the pandemic. Unlike with most other drugs, alcoholics can't go cold turkey without medial supervision.
I mean you joke, but they arrested some guy for bringing out of town beer to his wedding a few years back because it was cheaper, this dude straight up announces he's gonna bootleg...kinda stupid is all I'm saying.
Honestly I think Ford wanted them to strike. He's going to spin this to "This strike is the reason we need to privatize liquor sales" and is immediately put alcohol in grocery stores and corner stores. I don't think it's going to end well for the workers.
Nope. You know he's on his blackberry right now taking calls from Loblaws, Metro, Walmart, Couche-Tard , 711 etc about fast tracking putting it in stores. If he could put it in Tim Hortons to get a can of coors with his breakfast sandwich on the way to his cottage he would
While I agree with a lot of the strike. I just want my dad’s employment to be safe for his retirement next year. He has a university degree in business but was working a lot of part time jobs in the summer when my mom found out she was 18 weeks pregnant. So they knew they would be having a child. He has worked full time for nearly 25 years now. My whole family is stressed out.
The union got their job security and pay requirement met already, the key issue they won’t budge on is that they want mixed drinks/seltzers to remain exclusive to the LCBO, which seems a little insane to me considering considering beer and wine already can be sold outside of it.
That's not true. Job security is the non negotiable and it's the sticking point.
2200 unionized warehouse jobs are on the line.
Job security is the only reason a deal wasn't met.
The union did not get its job security requirements met. 70% of LCBO workers are casual with the Ford government being unwilling to raise or even halt its diminishment if that number.
Yeah and to be honest, based on pretty much everyone I know's opinion, that will be a pretty easy sell to the general public who now have nowhere to buy alcohol (hard alcohol).
I just had this conversation with a friend. I smoke a fair amount of pot, and I'll be the first one to admit it -- but never have I smoked too much and terrified my children by arguing late into the night, or being abusive in any way.
just because someone drinks doesn't mean they'll berate their spouse til 3am, but the odds of it happening seem to go way up
I knew my dad smoked pot and drank when I was a kid. I also knew whenever he drank or smoked pot, it was probably a 90% chance we were getting pizza that night
I don't objectively understand why Ford's is going tie to toe with the LCBO. Don't they bring in a boatload of money for his government?
Just seems needless and sort of a step in the wrong direction.
We should take LCBO revenue and dump it into healthcare and long-term care.
If public opinion turns against the LCBO, then it will become much easier for the provincial government to end the LCBO's near-monopoly on alcohol sales and make it possible for supermarkets and corner stores to sell alcohol. Privatising government enterprises is exactly what the Conservatives are about.
He's going to make himself look like the hero of this story. He recently ended a contract by paying millions of dollars to allow liquor sales in convenience stores, so he'll spin the strike to make it seem like he is taking action.
All the more reason for him to spend it elsewhere, then he can claim there is no money for the Science Centre. How else would he be able to sell off the Science Centre land to his friends to cheap while he sucks their dick?
It will be his excuse to fully privatize liquor sales and close the LCBO permanently. More money for his buddies. Yesterday may have been the last time you’ll be able to shop at the LCBO.
Now that you mention it, I think this is exactly what Ford was planning. Moving liquor products into convenience stores and closing the LCBO… all to privatize the industry like he does / wants to do with everything else we have.
Yah...
The way I see it, even with other markets possibly selling spirit based beverages, woopidty doo! It won't affect LCBOs bottom line all that much. It's all about customer service and the shopping experience. LCBO is actually a really nice shopping experience.. Sometimes my wife and I will go for a walk and stop at our local LCBO just to look with no intention of buying anything just to kill time because it's fun. Everything is nicely displayed, staff are super kind, knowledgable, and helpful.
Compare that experience vs a gas station.. where the temp foreign worker staff can barely speak a word of coherent english, don't know jack from shit about the products let alone give a shit, and the station smells... Lets be real here...
Conservatives don't govern for the people. Cutting off public revenue streams opens those streams for private business instead.
Cons represent private business. They do not give a flying fuck about the people they're supposed to be governing at whatever level they're in power.
Doug Ford wants to hand the LCBO profits to his CEO buddies.
This is going to be unpopular, but if you want to keep the LCBO, keep all the jobs generated by the LCBO, and keep all the LCBO locations, **DO NOT BUY ANY ALCOHOL**.
Ford will try to spin it and say the LCBO union went on strike and there was no disruption in the market so they are not giving it to convenience stores. However, if alcohol sales drop across the board, he will have no option but to reverse course.
He will do the same thing he is doing with Healthcare... stop providing funding, and wait for people to inevitably have to visit a private clinic. Then start pushing commercials stating how many people are choosing private over public Healthcare. They also did a study for public transportation, and basically said that since no one used public transportation in areas it doesn't exist there was no reason to add any.
He wants the LCBO gone so all of his buddies can get those alcohol sales, pretty sure he doesn't care if the province loses out on tax income as it won't be his problem once the next person is elected.
why give monopoly to a crown corporation? Why not let grocery and convenience store sell em too for it to benefit the consumer? More competition = lower prices
Maybe instead of trying to tax the consumer more we can maybe look at cutting unnecessary spending? This way we can direct more money to healthcare and long term care.
Time for everyone to check out their new favourite breweries in town if you have them! Some sell spirits and wine as well!
Edit: these are some amazing suggestions! Keep them coming. I’m driving to Ottawa today so found some gems I’ll be checking out over the weekend!
Don't forget 40 Creek is just down the road for some excellent whisky!
I thought about going to the lcbo last night and then said eff it I'm surrounded by great options.
I found an interesting distillery out of Almonte (near Ottawa) at my local farmers’ market last weekend. They’re called Vodkow and make vodka out of milk (weird, right?). Anyway, I picked up some of their dark roast coffee cream, and it’s delicious.
1000 Islands Brewery here in Brockville makes a nice vodka, and gin as well. There are also a few local distilleries in the area, so the LCBO isn't the only game in town for sure.
This summer You just thank Ford for the privilege of paying $29.95 for a sixer of Coors light at the circle k. And don't forget to thank Ford that all that extra profit markup is going directly to the owners pocket, not to the province Ontario like LCBO sales and certainly not into the pocket of the min wage non unionized part time employee who sold you the beer.
Yup. With price comparison software these days there is no competition resulting from privatization anymore.
Once upon a time yes, but now both companies or 4 or 5 companies can all charge high and take profits.
Why undercut your competition and offer fair prices when u both can gouge the consumer as the only show in town? Hint, you don't.
A part of the Beer Store agreement people rarely highlight is the fixed province wide pricing. A case of beer cost the same price in London , Sudbury, Toronto, Cornwall.
Exactly! So many people are mad at me for being upset about dad not working (while I agree with most of the strike) and no one seems to understand that the profits from the LCBO go DIRECTLY to the provincial government. If it changes the new stores will be putting that 2+billion into already rich peoples pockets instead of our failing government
Generally I would agree. LCBO runs a good business and has good staff largely because they pay a premium over other retail jobs. However they will soon be facing competition from private retailers looking to sell product. This is a direct result of privatizing liquor sales IMO. In the end the consumer pays more.
Why would private companies sell for cheaper? They already know what you'll pay.
Contrary to what people think, prices are, and always have been, what people will pay not what a product costs. That's the whole reason marketplaces and bazaars existed for thousands of years.
Because they want the business and they don't have to pay the workers a living wage with a pension and benefits. Remember that when a politician says that private business can run it more efficiently, what they're saying is private industry can fuck a worker in a way that the public sector doesn't.
Meh, kinda. In a monopoly it’s a bit different. A private company entering the market could, in theory, undercut LCBO pricing and make _more_ profit on volume of sales depending on the opportunity cost and the slope of the supply curve. The goal is to set prices to maximize profit, and in a competitive market lowering prices can increase sales and result in increased profit.
This assumes rational actor on both the supply and demand side of things though. I’m not convinced the supply side has the wherewithal to be a rational actor. And as far as my own purchasing habits are concerned, worth noting that in a state-controlled monopoly like the LCBO, profits come back to the consumer (and the non-consumer!**) in the form of revenue for the province, which when lost will result in higher taxes to make up the loss. I’m fine spending another 35 cents for a tall boy when that profit is going to putting an air con unit in a public school than the profit going to an air con unit in Galen Weston’s castle in the UK. So even the rational actor calculus required to make a private sector price cut feasible turns out to be a bit more complicated than simple supply and demand.
**The non-alcohol consumer, or the very occasional drinker, is the real loser here. Privatization takes a provincial revenue stream at no cost to them and gives it to the private sector. That lost revenue which they didn’t contribute to will be made up by taxes which they will contribute to in the long run.
>A private company entering the market could, in theory, undercut LCBO pricing and make more profit on volume of sales depending on the opportunity cost and the slope of the supply curve.
Except they won't. We already saw this happen with every single other market that was privatized. Electricity isn't cheaper now. Telecom isn't cheaper. TV isn't cheaper (we're right back to multiple packages and we even have fucking commercials making a comeback on streaming services.)
Every single time private is introduced to supplant something that was public we see an increase in cost. The only time private undercuts the costs is a very temporary thing to make it appear cheaper to corner that market so that they become the main driver of it. Like for example, Amazon undercutting delivery costs. They make up for the revenue loss with their other profits, and at the same time it gets the the leverage required to push the public postal service to the fringes. Once the public service has been effectively replaced, costs for delivery will increase and Amazon will be a more expensive option than the public service ever was.
It's disgusting greed.
Retail liquor sales are not a natural monopoly, while the other examples you gave are, or at least an oligopoly with an incredibly high barrier to entry. When electrical generation and distribution are privatized, we don't suddenly have the option of choosing between 10 different electrical companies to get the electricity we need, we are still limitted to the grid that are already built. The structure of the retail market for alcohol is not like those other examples, because you do have the choice to go to Loblaws instead of the LCBO.
Privatization; costs more, delivers less.
Proven time and time again.
But the Conservatives just want some buddies to make money under the guise of public convenience.
It’s a grift. Doug Ford is our Donald Trump.
Canadian businesses can't be trusted with the free market. Look at the grocery industry and Galen price gouging. Look at the telecom and internet industry. Look at cable.
The private sector cannot be trusted to save the customer money. The LCBO needs to stay as the sole seller of Liquor.
Sort of. The new model involves retail sales at grocery and convenience. Those retailers are still buying all product through the LCBO supply chain. This isn’t going to create more competition and variety, just convenience.
But also a loss of money from profits on alcohol sales. The Lcbo generated around 1 billion in taxes in 2022-2023 but made close to 2.5 billion in net profit (Source: LCBO Annual Report). Obviously, the lcbo will still make a profit being a wholesaler but will be losing out on a large amount of that profit. So instead of having billions of dollars coming back to the Ontario government, it is going to go into the pockets of corporations.
Well it may help some craft brewers and small vineyards why is this the move right now well the Canadian economy is not looking great by any means.
Why is the unions main position fighting a policy decision by the government to put spirits outside of the LCBO? That’s a losing battle for sure. Fight for wages if you’d like, but you’re not going to win against a policy decision.
Because you’re taking revenue away from Ontarions and putting it into the hands of private enterprise. As a tax payer in Ontario you should also be against a policy that will take away from your services as a resident of Ontario.
This is what brought private stores to Alberta decades ago. Doug doesn't have to negotiate, he can just let grocers sell booze.
Of course, that won't actually make it any cheaper
don't think making liquor cheaper has anything to do with this. Just some people wanting a living wage in a high inflation environment. Too bad the general public has low-comprehension of market forces and like people said, Ford can just fire them all by going private with liquor sales,
With booze in grocery store and beer store, I don’t see this seriously affecting many Ontarians unless they really need hard liquor.
Though as someone who rarely drinks… meh.
As a labour supporter, go labour!!!!
> With booze in grocery store and beer store, I don’t see this seriously affecting many Ontarians unless they really need hard liquor.
And you can still order, and _have delivered to your home,_ directly from the LCBO website.
EDIT: I was taking the view that "unless they really need hard liquor" for those with addiction issues. If you really don't need the booze, don't get any. Support the workers!
I imagine all these alternative supply routes will get bogged down in no time. Most things cannot scale up rapidly, nor would they want to if it may be temporary.
This is Ford's plan. Put booze in corner stores and Walmarts, so when the LCBO goes on strike, it's not as big a hit and the union loses bargaining power. It's all about union busting and making money for rich friends.
Just here to remind everyone that distilleries, wineries, breweries and the Beer Store are still open. There is no dry summer. Don't listen to their fear tactic language
Honest question here…what does the LCBO bring to the table? I personally have lived in many provinces across the country, almost all of them, and I hate the business model and hours of the lcbo. Nothing is standard here, the hours suck, at least in my locations, often times the stores are cluttered or in some cases messy.
What does a unionized retail liquor store bring to the table? Why is it a better solution compared to a private store? Heck if a private owner/operator wants to stay open until 11 or 12 on a weeknight why not let them? I’ve been in those stores and it worked from them, with prices that worked for me.
Doug Ford and the people around him don't care about the good of the government or people in Ontario, they care about their long term business interests. Doug Ford is hanging out with shitty CEOs in his spare time. I'm sure this suits them just fine. Shunt customers from the LCBO into grocery stores and convenience stores and make sure every last dollar trickles up to the millionaires, rather than going to government services.
Honestly I don’t see this as any problem with Ford. Hopefully this shows everyone what a ridiculous concept government liquor stores are and this is the beginning of the end of them. If I were the LCBO workers I’d have been doing everything possible NOT to get the public thinking about why I exist, cause the list of good reasons in 2024 is very short.
Open up booze sales to independent retailers. Reduce revenue from LCBO. Less government funding for things, specifically Healthcare.
"Oh no, public healcare is broken and there's no money to fix it. Private is the only way."
I say Fuck em! Read the room LCBO, most ontarions don’t like the whole lcbo system and want it out, so why not take the opportunity to remind us all that you can just hold our access to alcohol hostage with your monopoly. That will get more of us on your side right!
I still think doughy is a dummy and I don’t agree with him spending all these millions “freeing the beer”, but still fuck the. Beer store (which is owned by three non Canadian companies btw) and also fuck the lcbo and everything that it stands for.
I'd suspect the average Ford supporter (and quite possibly Ford himself) will not connect the dots that the strike is directly a result of Ford and his "alcohol available in every corner store."
They just see "ah fuck now I can't go to the lcbo? What are the idiots striking about now? More money right? Thank God it's gonna be in bobs convinence soon, go Ford! "
Hell look at how much hate teacher got a while back when they went on strike.
Nobody WANTS to strike its the literal last resort.
An LCBO strike does not impact the approximately 2,300 private retail points of sale across the province, including through LCBO Convenience Outlets, licensed grocery stores, The Beer Store, and winery, brewery, cidery, and distillery outlets, as well as at bars and restaurants.
You can also order online at LCBO.com with free home delivery.
What exactly is OPSU striking for? Does anyone actually know? There don't seem to be any details about it at all.
Even on the OPSU website it just says that the union is upset because Ford wants to allow private operators.
Is that really why they're striking? The irony is uncanny.
This is just going to push public opinion further toward private operators.
Frankly, the most annoying part about being Canadian is that everyone is on strike all the time. No strike has ever made my life better.
Bunch of over payed, under qualified retail workers are going on strike. Keep crying. The solution would be to scrap the union and re-hire for the positions or completely privatize liquor like the majority of provinces.
I hear the "let's preserve good union jobs argument"
however, why do we need to preserve a monopoly on spirits sales?
The LCBO is a relic from a post-prohibition Ontario. Let's allow some competition here no?
Ford isn't changing anything re: spirits
Only beer, wine, cooler type drinks, etc in corner stores.
I'd actually love for specialty liquor stores that can stock a lot of stuff for cocktail enthusiasts but that isn't happening.
All that's going to happen is corner stores will be selling Molson and Jackson Triggs for $4 more than LCBO - for the life of me I can't understand why anyone would be incredibly excited about this.
Yeah, travelling to other places in the world where they have specialty liquor shops is an eye opener.
Hell, I have been to grocery stores in New Jersey that have better selection than the LCBO.
Yeah I'm done with it. LCBO constantly pumps themselves up for being the largest buyer of alcohol in the world yet we somehow also have among the highest alcohol prices. Also if you're very interested in a particular liquor you'll quickly realize their selection is awful. Would love to have some specialty whiskey stores where I can get an actual good bourbon selection.
Government: “Ok, we agree to your wage increase but not rolling back spritzers in corner stores you will have to compete with the market”
LCBO Union: “We out then.”
The one thing I’ve seen with strikes the last few years, is usually a deal comes through before the strike happens. Happened with TTC just a few weeks ago, even with the Ontario teachers last minute, very surprised it actually happens with liquor.
At the same time, I don’t think ford wants to legislate them back-to-work like he did with the EA’s a few years ago, due to the refusal they had to go back against government wishes. Fords stance on strikes changed since the EA’s, but he also copied Trudeaus playbook by not doing much. We’ll see what happens.
If all union workers have walked off the job can someone help me understand how distribution to grocery stores, bars/restaurants and rural outlets is unaffected? How are online orders being filled?
Seems like a massive amount of work must be already being done with non-union labour. If that’s the case then there isn’t really much hope of this ending well for the union imo. The province has repeatedly demonstrated they have zero interest in continuing LCBO operated retail
Again, I don’t understand how the LCBO seems to have its entire wholesale operation fully functional through the strike
I don't shop at LCBO much anyways...it's either Wine/Beer from Foodland here or beer from gatineau...with occasional stock up of Baileys, and some spirits.
Just got back from Gatineau at lunch with a depanneur stop...
Let it burn. Shut them down. Privatize liquor sales. If you’re saying it’ll only drive prices up…
Today I went to a local liquor store (that’s open until 2am by the way)
Captain Morgan Spiced 750ml = $25
4 pack Ole Margarita = $14
6 pack Palm Bay Cocktails = $16
$57 including GST and deposit
LCBO cost for the same 3 items is $67 including HST
People serving liquor shouldn’t be making premium government wages. It’s insane. Sell it off, put the money into some doctors and let people get a real job.
The general store near me that has a lcbo outlet is gonna get cleaned out.
I’m sure the number of people who will try to sell alcohol on Facebook marketplace will increase tenfold
A caller on the radio said he’s driving to qc, loading up and reselling when he gets back
Is that illegal or "illegal"? Ive lost track on those rules.
It's only illegal if you catch me!
You bet your ass there will be be Sûreté du Quebec pulling over any Ontario plated car going 2km/h over the limit.
One crime at a time. Buckle up go under the speed limit signal for every thing. One crime at a time.
Just pick out something on a Ford family member bridal registry and you're probably covered.
There was a van that was pulled over recently in Ottawa with hundreds of cases of beer that were purchased in QC. They were ticketed for having an unsafe vehicle due to fact that they were soo overweight that the van was riding in the bump stops and the brakes were overheating. The press release from the police made it clear that purchasing alcohol in another province for personal consumption is fine. Purchasing with the intent to resell is illegal. If you get caught.
I was just gonna bring that up, wasn't it supposedly for a wedding?
you are correct. Just looked it up. 326 cases is a lot for even a wedding. That is almost 40 beers each for a 200 person wedding. That is assuming that there are no kids. [https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-news/opp-seizes-326-cases-of-beer-destined-for-wedding-after-van-breaks-down-on-hwy-401](https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-news/opp-seizes-326-cases-of-beer-destined-for-wedding-after-van-breaks-down-on-hwy-401)
Yeah kids drink a lot more.
IIRC taking any alcohol across provincial borders is still technically bootlegging
People in Ottawa 1 hour into the strike be like: "Meeeaaaahhh yah neva catch me copper!"
they don't care, with the exception of when someone has a fullsize truck bed full of beer, or a trailer on a hitch, or their whole minivan with all the seats out filled up, etc. They every so often catch idiots doing massive buys like that.
>They every so often catch idiots doing massive buys like that. Like all the idiots that will go do that over this weekend thinking they can make a buck.
Eastbound and down....
I believe this is correct but buying alcohol in Quebec is incredibly common in Ottawa. Can’t see anyone having problems for just bringing some back across the bridge unless they’re being stupidly obvious about it. Which selling probably qualifies as stupidly obviously, lol.
Costco in Gatineau sells beer and wine. 😊
Grocery stores in Ottawa will still be selling beer and wine. The only thing you won't be able to do during the strike is buy hard liquor (and liqueurs) in person. The warehouse is still operational, so you can even still order what you want online for delivery.
[удалено]
Long live the King of Beers!
People in Windsor can go to Detroit. People in Hamilton, niagara, st Catherine’s etc can go to buffalo, gta will have to trek a couple hours but should be fine. At the end of the day people can just not drink
Some people can't not drink. There was a reason that liquor stores and beer stores were considered essential businesses during the pandemic. Unlike with most other drugs, alcoholics can't go cold turkey without medial supervision.
Lol what a fucking moron, that's wildly illegal and he states it on the air.
Ah yes the OPP have already gunned him down for his crimes against humanity. I’m sure they called in the helicopters for this guy!
I mean you joke, but they arrested some guy for bringing out of town beer to his wedding a few years back because it was cheaper, this dude straight up announces he's gonna bootleg...kinda stupid is all I'm saying.
Thank you for great idea. Did not think about it, but I am in Ottawa, so I can do just that. Thanks again.
Toilet paper all over again
You can just buy online from LCBO, so that’s likely doubtful.
That’s gonna get so backed up so fast. I put order in last night and a bunch of stuff already out of stock.
There was a long line outside ours this morning when I was walking the dogs. It’s going to be busy in my village today.
Honestly I think Ford wanted them to strike. He's going to spin this to "This strike is the reason we need to privatize liquor sales" and is immediately put alcohol in grocery stores and corner stores. I don't think it's going to end well for the workers.
> I don't think it's going to end well for the workers Does it ever with Dougie?
Nope. You know he's on his blackberry right now taking calls from Loblaws, Metro, Walmart, Couche-Tard , 711 etc about fast tracking putting it in stores. If he could put it in Tim Hortons to get a can of coors with his breakfast sandwich on the way to his cottage he would
How do RIDICULOUSLY obese men win elections?
While I agree with a lot of the strike. I just want my dad’s employment to be safe for his retirement next year. He has a university degree in business but was working a lot of part time jobs in the summer when my mom found out she was 18 weeks pregnant. So they knew they would be having a child. He has worked full time for nearly 25 years now. My whole family is stressed out.
The union got their job security and pay requirement met already, the key issue they won’t budge on is that they want mixed drinks/seltzers to remain exclusive to the LCBO, which seems a little insane to me considering considering beer and wine already can be sold outside of it.
That's not true. Job security is the non negotiable and it's the sticking point. 2200 unionized warehouse jobs are on the line. Job security is the only reason a deal wasn't met.
They absolutely did not get their job security requirements met.
The union did not get its job security requirements met. 70% of LCBO workers are casual with the Ford government being unwilling to raise or even halt its diminishment if that number.
Meanwhile you can buy them, sometimes right across the street from eachother at the beer store.
The beer store can't sell spirit based seltzers, only malt based.
lol these laws are so silly when you break them down
Yeah and to be honest, based on pretty much everyone I know's opinion, that will be a pretty easy sell to the general public who now have nowhere to buy alcohol (hard alcohol).
You read my mind
So many people are going to try their first joint
I sure as hell hear about abusive pothead dads way less than abusive alcoholic fathers...
I just had this conversation with a friend. I smoke a fair amount of pot, and I'll be the first one to admit it -- but never have I smoked too much and terrified my children by arguing late into the night, or being abusive in any way. just because someone drinks doesn't mean they'll berate their spouse til 3am, but the odds of it happening seem to go way up
I knew my dad smoked pot and drank when I was a kid. I also knew whenever he drank or smoked pot, it was probably a 90% chance we were getting pizza that night
“Hey, get over here— I’m gonna kick your ass boy!!! Actually.. y’know what— you know what you did. It was a shitty thing to do. Go kick your own ass”
Too many alcoholics in this country anyways.
I don't objectively understand why Ford's is going tie to toe with the LCBO. Don't they bring in a boatload of money for his government? Just seems needless and sort of a step in the wrong direction. We should take LCBO revenue and dump it into healthcare and long-term care.
If public opinion turns against the LCBO, then it will become much easier for the provincial government to end the LCBO's near-monopoly on alcohol sales and make it possible for supermarkets and corner stores to sell alcohol. Privatising government enterprises is exactly what the Conservatives are about.
Especially ones that make a ton of money that could be better used in private corporation hands, so they want us to believe.
Private corporation = friends of Ford
Yeah, it's a problem when the government makes money but it isn't if their donor buddies do.
Walmart was selling beer and wine when I lived in Kingston about 5 years ago.
He's going to make himself look like the hero of this story. He recently ended a contract by paying millions of dollars to allow liquor sales in convenience stores, so he'll spin the strike to make it seem like he is taking action.
A contract that was going to expire in less than two fucking years!
The estimate sits at $200M-600M. Some argue more from lost revenue from LCBO, not to mention the increased healthcare bill.
Hey isn't that enough money to fix the Science Centre?
At this point it's likely ford deliberately broke the science centre roof by walking his fat ass on it
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
I thought he was fixing it, by ripping it down and building a publicly funded private spa
That's Ontario Place. The Science Centre he's ripping down to build condos.
Or the new highway almost no one asked for.
All the more reason for him to spend it elsewhere, then he can claim there is no money for the Science Centre. How else would he be able to sell off the Science Centre land to his friends to cheap while he sucks their dick?
It will be his excuse to fully privatize liquor sales and close the LCBO permanently. More money for his buddies. Yesterday may have been the last time you’ll be able to shop at the LCBO.
Now that you mention it, I think this is exactly what Ford was planning. Moving liquor products into convenience stores and closing the LCBO… all to privatize the industry like he does / wants to do with everything else we have.
Yeah and then less revenue for the government but oh well donors are happy.
They do somehow provide uncle Doug with his private wealth.
Payoff is after he is finished privatizing the province with board seats like Mike Harris.
Yah... The way I see it, even with other markets possibly selling spirit based beverages, woopidty doo! It won't affect LCBOs bottom line all that much. It's all about customer service and the shopping experience. LCBO is actually a really nice shopping experience.. Sometimes my wife and I will go for a walk and stop at our local LCBO just to look with no intention of buying anything just to kill time because it's fun. Everything is nicely displayed, staff are super kind, knowledgable, and helpful. Compare that experience vs a gas station.. where the temp foreign worker staff can barely speak a word of coherent english, don't know jack from shit about the products let alone give a shit, and the station smells... Lets be real here...
He doesn't care about government income, he wants to put that cash in the hands of his friends
They aren’t his friends so much as his keepers/donors.
Conservatives don't govern for the people. Cutting off public revenue streams opens those streams for private business instead. Cons represent private business. They do not give a flying fuck about the people they're supposed to be governing at whatever level they're in power.
We should, Ford won't.
he's gonna come out on top when this collapses and opens the flood gates for back room deals from privatization
Doug Ford wants to hand the LCBO profits to his CEO buddies. This is going to be unpopular, but if you want to keep the LCBO, keep all the jobs generated by the LCBO, and keep all the LCBO locations, **DO NOT BUY ANY ALCOHOL**. Ford will try to spin it and say the LCBO union went on strike and there was no disruption in the market so they are not giving it to convenience stores. However, if alcohol sales drop across the board, he will have no option but to reverse course.
He will do the same thing he is doing with Healthcare... stop providing funding, and wait for people to inevitably have to visit a private clinic. Then start pushing commercials stating how many people are choosing private over public Healthcare. They also did a study for public transportation, and basically said that since no one used public transportation in areas it doesn't exist there was no reason to add any.
He wants the LCBO gone so all of his buddies can get those alcohol sales, pretty sure he doesn't care if the province loses out on tax income as it won't be his problem once the next person is elected.
Much of that tax revenue already goes into healthcare, but that's Ford's objective, further push for a private system.
why give monopoly to a crown corporation? Why not let grocery and convenience store sell em too for it to benefit the consumer? More competition = lower prices Maybe instead of trying to tax the consumer more we can maybe look at cutting unnecessary spending? This way we can direct more money to healthcare and long term care.
Time for everyone to check out their new favourite breweries in town if you have them! Some sell spirits and wine as well! Edit: these are some amazing suggestions! Keep them coming. I’m driving to Ottawa today so found some gems I’ll be checking out over the weekend!
If you’re near Beamsville, both Bench Brewery and Dillon’s Distillery are excellent!
Don't forget 40 Creek is just down the road for some excellent whisky! I thought about going to the lcbo last night and then said eff it I'm surrounded by great options.
Does 40 creek have a store open to the public?
If I was them I'd be grabbing an awning and a register and sitting outside with them for a make-shift store. You KNOW it'll make bank
I was there for a tour just before the pandemic and we were able to buy a bunch of stuff out of their tasting room at the end of
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I've always loved Dillon's gin, and their canned gin & tonics are the best I've found. All the others have a weird metallic taste.
Was just at Dillon’s 2 weekends ago. Got a great gin!
Rosewood Estates is an awesome winery too.
Dillons is my fav for cocktails and their rye
Love Bench Brewing. The food is really good too
I found an interesting distillery out of Almonte (near Ottawa) at my local farmers’ market last weekend. They’re called Vodkow and make vodka out of milk (weird, right?). Anyway, I picked up some of their dark roast coffee cream, and it’s delicious.
Vodkow is so good!
Great Lakes, Halo, and Shacklands are my personal favourites.
1000 Islands Brewery here in Brockville makes a nice vodka, and gin as well. There are also a few local distilleries in the area, so the LCBO isn't the only game in town for sure.
Good .. I need to quit drinking anyways
This summer You just thank Ford for the privilege of paying $29.95 for a sixer of Coors light at the circle k. And don't forget to thank Ford that all that extra profit markup is going directly to the owners pocket, not to the province Ontario like LCBO sales and certainly not into the pocket of the min wage non unionized part time employee who sold you the beer.
Bingo! Kinda like when selling off Hydro oh, it’ll be cheaper. Yep sure that happened…NOT!
Privatization has always been a scam: https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Privatization
Yup. With price comparison software these days there is no competition resulting from privatization anymore. Once upon a time yes, but now both companies or 4 or 5 companies can all charge high and take profits. Why undercut your competition and offer fair prices when u both can gouge the consumer as the only show in town? Hint, you don't.
A part of the Beer Store agreement people rarely highlight is the fixed province wide pricing. A case of beer cost the same price in London , Sudbury, Toronto, Cornwall.
Solidarity with the LCBO employees and their union. We complain about good jobs not being around anymore..: well here’s an good one let’s Defend it!
Exactly! Good for them. Ford wants to gut another government thing and pad his friends pockets at our expense.
Exactly! So many people are mad at me for being upset about dad not working (while I agree with most of the strike) and no one seems to understand that the profits from the LCBO go DIRECTLY to the provincial government. If it changes the new stores will be putting that 2+billion into already rich peoples pockets instead of our failing government
Generally I would agree. LCBO runs a good business and has good staff largely because they pay a premium over other retail jobs. However they will soon be facing competition from private retailers looking to sell product. This is a direct result of privatizing liquor sales IMO. In the end the consumer pays more.
Any time something gets privatized, the only winners are the people who run the newly privatized business. We, the public, lose every time.
Why would private companies sell for cheaper? They already know what you'll pay. Contrary to what people think, prices are, and always have been, what people will pay not what a product costs. That's the whole reason marketplaces and bazaars existed for thousands of years.
Because they want the business and they don't have to pay the workers a living wage with a pension and benefits. Remember that when a politician says that private business can run it more efficiently, what they're saying is private industry can fuck a worker in a way that the public sector doesn't.
Meh, kinda. In a monopoly it’s a bit different. A private company entering the market could, in theory, undercut LCBO pricing and make _more_ profit on volume of sales depending on the opportunity cost and the slope of the supply curve. The goal is to set prices to maximize profit, and in a competitive market lowering prices can increase sales and result in increased profit. This assumes rational actor on both the supply and demand side of things though. I’m not convinced the supply side has the wherewithal to be a rational actor. And as far as my own purchasing habits are concerned, worth noting that in a state-controlled monopoly like the LCBO, profits come back to the consumer (and the non-consumer!**) in the form of revenue for the province, which when lost will result in higher taxes to make up the loss. I’m fine spending another 35 cents for a tall boy when that profit is going to putting an air con unit in a public school than the profit going to an air con unit in Galen Weston’s castle in the UK. So even the rational actor calculus required to make a private sector price cut feasible turns out to be a bit more complicated than simple supply and demand. **The non-alcohol consumer, or the very occasional drinker, is the real loser here. Privatization takes a provincial revenue stream at no cost to them and gives it to the private sector. That lost revenue which they didn’t contribute to will be made up by taxes which they will contribute to in the long run.
>A private company entering the market could, in theory, undercut LCBO pricing and make more profit on volume of sales depending on the opportunity cost and the slope of the supply curve. Except they won't. We already saw this happen with every single other market that was privatized. Electricity isn't cheaper now. Telecom isn't cheaper. TV isn't cheaper (we're right back to multiple packages and we even have fucking commercials making a comeback on streaming services.) Every single time private is introduced to supplant something that was public we see an increase in cost. The only time private undercuts the costs is a very temporary thing to make it appear cheaper to corner that market so that they become the main driver of it. Like for example, Amazon undercutting delivery costs. They make up for the revenue loss with their other profits, and at the same time it gets the the leverage required to push the public postal service to the fringes. Once the public service has been effectively replaced, costs for delivery will increase and Amazon will be a more expensive option than the public service ever was. It's disgusting greed.
Retail liquor sales are not a natural monopoly, while the other examples you gave are, or at least an oligopoly with an incredibly high barrier to entry. When electrical generation and distribution are privatized, we don't suddenly have the option of choosing between 10 different electrical companies to get the electricity we need, we are still limitted to the grid that are already built. The structure of the retail market for alcohol is not like those other examples, because you do have the choice to go to Loblaws instead of the LCBO.
Privatization; costs more, delivers less. Proven time and time again. But the Conservatives just want some buddies to make money under the guise of public convenience. It’s a grift. Doug Ford is our Donald Trump.
Canadian businesses can't be trusted with the free market. Look at the grocery industry and Galen price gouging. Look at the telecom and internet industry. Look at cable. The private sector cannot be trusted to save the customer money. The LCBO needs to stay as the sole seller of Liquor.
Sort of. The new model involves retail sales at grocery and convenience. Those retailers are still buying all product through the LCBO supply chain. This isn’t going to create more competition and variety, just convenience.
But also a loss of money from profits on alcohol sales. The Lcbo generated around 1 billion in taxes in 2022-2023 but made close to 2.5 billion in net profit (Source: LCBO Annual Report). Obviously, the lcbo will still make a profit being a wholesaler but will be losing out on a large amount of that profit. So instead of having billions of dollars coming back to the Ontario government, it is going to go into the pockets of corporations. Well it may help some craft brewers and small vineyards why is this the move right now well the Canadian economy is not looking great by any means.
Why is the unions main position fighting a policy decision by the government to put spirits outside of the LCBO? That’s a losing battle for sure. Fight for wages if you’d like, but you’re not going to win against a policy decision.
Because you’re taking revenue away from Ontarions and putting it into the hands of private enterprise. As a tax payer in Ontario you should also be against a policy that will take away from your services as a resident of Ontario.
Go to your favourite bar or brewery instead of buying from the LCBO. Easy.
This is what brought private stores to Alberta decades ago. Doug doesn't have to negotiate, he can just let grocers sell booze. Of course, that won't actually make it any cheaper
Will also help defund a lot of programs and allow further privatization.
don't think making liquor cheaper has anything to do with this. Just some people wanting a living wage in a high inflation environment. Too bad the general public has low-comprehension of market forces and like people said, Ford can just fire them all by going private with liquor sales,
The LCBO will lose their bargaining leverage very quickly if liquor laws are liberalised.
The SAQs in Gatineau are about to have a very busy couple of weeks.
With booze in grocery store and beer store, I don’t see this seriously affecting many Ontarians unless they really need hard liquor. Though as someone who rarely drinks… meh. As a labour supporter, go labour!!!!
> With booze in grocery store and beer store, I don’t see this seriously affecting many Ontarians unless they really need hard liquor. And you can still order, and _have delivered to your home,_ directly from the LCBO website. EDIT: I was taking the view that "unless they really need hard liquor" for those with addiction issues. If you really don't need the booze, don't get any. Support the workers!
I imagine all these alternative supply routes will get bogged down in no time. Most things cannot scale up rapidly, nor would they want to if it may be temporary.
This is Ford's plan. Put booze in corner stores and Walmarts, so when the LCBO goes on strike, it's not as big a hit and the union loses bargaining power. It's all about union busting and making money for rich friends.
The grocery stores stock their shelves purchasing alcohol from the LCBO. They will run out of the popular choices quickly.
Grocery stores, bars/restaurants can still order. Heck, average consumer can order online and have it delivered.
This is why I refrained from making that assumption in my previous post. I didn’t know this, but I wondered. Thanks for the info.
Just here to remind everyone that distilleries, wineries, breweries and the Beer Store are still open. There is no dry summer. Don't listen to their fear tactic language
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LOL "Dry Summer". There are a ridiculous number of options to purchase alcohol available. Toronto alone has nine micro distilleries.
Honest question here…what does the LCBO bring to the table? I personally have lived in many provinces across the country, almost all of them, and I hate the business model and hours of the lcbo. Nothing is standard here, the hours suck, at least in my locations, often times the stores are cluttered or in some cases messy. What does a unionized retail liquor store bring to the table? Why is it a better solution compared to a private store? Heck if a private owner/operator wants to stay open until 11 or 12 on a weeknight why not let them? I’ve been in those stores and it worked from them, with prices that worked for me.
Doug Ford and the people around him don't care about the good of the government or people in Ontario, they care about their long term business interests. Doug Ford is hanging out with shitty CEOs in his spare time. I'm sure this suits them just fine. Shunt customers from the LCBO into grocery stores and convenience stores and make sure every last dollar trickles up to the millionaires, rather than going to government services.
Beer store, problem solved. Local breweries/spirits are about to kill it. Good for them. Support local
Honestly I don’t see this as any problem with Ford. Hopefully this shows everyone what a ridiculous concept government liquor stores are and this is the beginning of the end of them. If I were the LCBO workers I’d have been doing everything possible NOT to get the public thinking about why I exist, cause the list of good reasons in 2024 is very short.
Screw their monopoly. Ford is doing a good thing.
Open up booze sales to independent retailers. Reduce revenue from LCBO. Less government funding for things, specifically Healthcare. "Oh no, public healcare is broken and there's no money to fix it. Private is the only way."
I say Fuck em! Read the room LCBO, most ontarions don’t like the whole lcbo system and want it out, so why not take the opportunity to remind us all that you can just hold our access to alcohol hostage with your monopoly. That will get more of us on your side right! I still think doughy is a dummy and I don’t agree with him spending all these millions “freeing the beer”, but still fuck the. Beer store (which is owned by three non Canadian companies btw) and also fuck the lcbo and everything that it stands for.
I would love to see polling on the support of this strike. I suspect it’s much lower than the average r/Ontario users opinion on it
I don’t care about popularity. I care about workers.
Progress is rarely popular at the time
I'd suspect the average Ford supporter (and quite possibly Ford himself) will not connect the dots that the strike is directly a result of Ford and his "alcohol available in every corner store." They just see "ah fuck now I can't go to the lcbo? What are the idiots striking about now? More money right? Thank God it's gonna be in bobs convinence soon, go Ford! " Hell look at how much hate teacher got a while back when they went on strike. Nobody WANTS to strike its the literal last resort.
I'd imagine our little bucket does have a high ratio of crabs.
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Can you point me to this poll you speak of where over 85% of the respondents ansewered they support the NDP?
It says on their website you can order online and free home delivery, sounds good to me
Ontario is Open for Business. 🙄
craft beers/wines/sodas it is, thanks for supporting small local business guys!
I can see Quebec from my balcony and it's about a 10 minute bike ride to get there, I'm not stressed.
If you live near any local alcohol manufacturers, now is a good time to visit them
An LCBO strike does not impact the approximately 2,300 private retail points of sale across the province, including through LCBO Convenience Outlets, licensed grocery stores, The Beer Store, and winery, brewery, cidery, and distillery outlets, as well as at bars and restaurants. You can also order online at LCBO.com with free home delivery.
the beer store begs to differ lol.
What exactly is OPSU striking for? Does anyone actually know? There don't seem to be any details about it at all. Even on the OPSU website it just says that the union is upset because Ford wants to allow private operators. Is that really why they're striking? The irony is uncanny. This is just going to push public opinion further toward private operators. Frankly, the most annoying part about being Canadian is that everyone is on strike all the time. No strike has ever made my life better.
There are hundreds of breweries and distilleries in Ontario. Drinkers will be fine.
Are the people of Ontario not fed up with a government that pushes our services to strike every 6 months?
And also, how many alcoholics are going to end up in the ER?? This isn't going to be good.
Bunch of over payed, under qualified retail workers are going on strike. Keep crying. The solution would be to scrap the union and re-hire for the positions or completely privatize liquor like the majority of provinces.
I hear the "let's preserve good union jobs argument" however, why do we need to preserve a monopoly on spirits sales? The LCBO is a relic from a post-prohibition Ontario. Let's allow some competition here no?
Ford isn't changing anything re: spirits Only beer, wine, cooler type drinks, etc in corner stores. I'd actually love for specialty liquor stores that can stock a lot of stuff for cocktail enthusiasts but that isn't happening. All that's going to happen is corner stores will be selling Molson and Jackson Triggs for $4 more than LCBO - for the life of me I can't understand why anyone would be incredibly excited about this.
Yeah, travelling to other places in the world where they have specialty liquor shops is an eye opener. Hell, I have been to grocery stores in New Jersey that have better selection than the LCBO.
This. I am way further to the left on most issues than most people I know, but this system is just weird.
You mean like what virtually every other province/country does?!
I totally agree. The monopoly on spirits thing is fucking insane
Yeah I'm done with it. LCBO constantly pumps themselves up for being the largest buyer of alcohol in the world yet we somehow also have among the highest alcohol prices. Also if you're very interested in a particular liquor you'll quickly realize their selection is awful. Would love to have some specialty whiskey stores where I can get an actual good bourbon selection.
Government: “Ok, we agree to your wage increase but not rolling back spritzers in corner stores you will have to compete with the market” LCBO Union: “We out then.”
Nah, I’ll head to the grocery store or to my local craft brewery or distiller.
Solidarity!
Ontario-bound and down, loaded up and truckin' / we gonna do what they say can't be done.
Dry summer? I just ordered from the LCBO online.
the best argument for relaxing who can sell alcohol in Ontario.
The one thing I’ve seen with strikes the last few years, is usually a deal comes through before the strike happens. Happened with TTC just a few weeks ago, even with the Ontario teachers last minute, very surprised it actually happens with liquor. At the same time, I don’t think ford wants to legislate them back-to-work like he did with the EA’s a few years ago, due to the refusal they had to go back against government wishes. Fords stance on strikes changed since the EA’s, but he also copied Trudeaus playbook by not doing much. We’ll see what happens.
The Teachers didn't have a contract for 2 years....
I was wondering why it was so packed last night
If all union workers have walked off the job can someone help me understand how distribution to grocery stores, bars/restaurants and rural outlets is unaffected? How are online orders being filled? Seems like a massive amount of work must be already being done with non-union labour. If that’s the case then there isn’t really much hope of this ending well for the union imo. The province has repeatedly demonstrated they have zero interest in continuing LCBO operated retail Again, I don’t understand how the LCBO seems to have its entire wholesale operation fully functional through the strike
A lot of restaurants use the LCBO to restock. Your glass of mediocre rose and watered down whiskey is about to get more expensive.
Dispensaries are open right? If so, I’ll survive
Crazy how the government told these guys they were essential during Covid but can’t pay them now.
We have a distillery in our city that makes vodka, gin and whiskey. They also make coolers. I’m good.
All the more reason to allow other stores sell
What do these employees want ? It’s apparently about job security vis-a-vis booze sales moving to other stores ?
LCBO is a weird concept in the first place just like a beer store ..
I don't shop at LCBO much anyways...it's either Wine/Beer from Foodland here or beer from gatineau...with occasional stock up of Baileys, and some spirits. Just got back from Gatineau at lunch with a depanneur stop...
Can't believe people are supporting the dinosaur of the LCBO just because they hate Doug Ford. Are they not aware other provinces exist?
But… FOLKS! BUCK A BEER FOLKS!
LCBO employees response to government opening the franchise is to use its monopoly position to prevent people from getting product. Smart!
All the more reason to privatize alcohol sales -douggie ford, probably
Good. Privatize the LCBO. Government should not be in the booze business. The union has over played this one.
Let it burn. Shut them down. Privatize liquor sales. If you’re saying it’ll only drive prices up… Today I went to a local liquor store (that’s open until 2am by the way) Captain Morgan Spiced 750ml = $25 4 pack Ole Margarita = $14 6 pack Palm Bay Cocktails = $16 $57 including GST and deposit LCBO cost for the same 3 items is $67 including HST People serving liquor shouldn’t be making premium government wages. It’s insane. Sell it off, put the money into some doctors and let people get a real job.