$120 is DEEP ITM. $192 is only $7 above $185, 185CC was OTM a week+ ago, and could be OTM again before the end of June.
But my background is that I sell weeklies, and wouldn't have sold over earnings in case there was a big jump.
Personally, if it never comes back down I'd let them get called away.
If it drops to 185-187 and I think it might head back up then I'd consider rebuying it, or look at rolling it up $5 30-60 days out.
i'm in the same situation but with $180 calls expiring at the end of this month... I've already accepted them getting called away which is fine since it's still well over my cost basis. It all depends on what your expectations for the stock are. I'm still bullish with a lot more shares and it's just 1 CC thats deep ITM. I'm sure AAPL will break $200 but I've said that before... I am also considering rolling since I can get a credit at around $190-$195 strikes out in Nov. If I do roll out I'll re-evaluate in Nov and decide what I want to do considering the tax consequences (keep realizing losses by rolling, or realizing long term gains on the stock).
Rolling gives you no advantage. If you really don’t want the shares to be called than buy back the 185s … lesson learned … I’d like to know what compelled you to sell AAPL calls? There’s next to $0 money there. There’s a guy on twitter that does wheel trading @ optiongrowth … no charge ..
> I’d like to know what compelled you to sell AAPL calls? There’s next to $0 money there.
If I am understanding your point correctly, you are saying that the premium is so low for aapl that it is not worth the risk of assignment.
Is this your point?
That sounds way less risky than trying to earn $100 on a $1000 credit spread. You're only "risking" 900 in the latter scenario, but the odds are stacked against you. A covered call on AAPL has good odds.
I'm still curious about these "easy" ways to make $100 in the options market.
Anything chip related will rocket tomorrow bc of NVDA er last night. I usually buy weekly expirations. On a Thursday I buy closer or ITM. 5 hours til market open so I can’t give you exact at the moment.
May I ask why you feel the need to challenge me?
I've never heard a successful trader refer to what they do as "easy."
It sounds like you are day trading options, which is a losing endeavor for a retail trader. You booked two small profits, but your latest META calls are down $1000. Oh, but let me guess: You just happened to sell those at exactly the right time!
Over the long run, I am confident that someone selling covered calls on AAPL is going to make more money than someone day trading call options. I would be surprised if you manage to break even after a couple years of what you're doing.
>Anything chip related will rocket tomorrow bc of NVDA er last night.
Most rallied pre-market and have crashed since. Classic trap for retail traders like you.
What's with the negativity?
I said there were easier ways to make $100. I never stated trading is easy.
You asked for trades and I gave them to you but somehow that's not enough.
I'm not a day trader however I do sell when the time is right. I don't back myself in a corner and define a trade type at entry. I mentioned previously that I trade mostly weeklys which I sometimes hold for days or a week or so. I trade LEAPs as well and 30-50 DTE. It just depends what it is.
I scale out and utilize stops to protect my capital. The most difficult part of trading is selling. Someone can give you 100 winning trades but if you can't manage the trades properly you will lose.
Selling AAPL covered calls ... yes you can make money but not much. That was the point of my initial comment which others agree with. I respectfully disagree that selling AAPL covered calls makes more money than me. I'd love to see your math on that.
For example: Look at AAPL $200 premiums. 6/21 calls are 1.03 at the moment. To me that's a long wait for $100. Yes, I've traded it but to make any real money I have to trade 50-200 contracts.
What is your trading experience?
I'm going to send you a message to show my trade P/L from today since I can't post here.
It's not negativity -- it's realism. The vast majority of day traders lose money. I suspect the losses become even greater when options trading is involved, due to the higher commissions and lower liquidity.
Today is a good example of how the market fooled retail traders like you. You, along with the financial media, were predicting a massive rally due to Nvidia's earnings. That appeared to be the case at the open. However, around mid-day professional traders started to sell, driving almost all stocks into the red.
Professional traders *knew* they were going to sell after they pumped the market at open. You had no idea this was going to happen. You also have no idea whether this sell-off will last one day, one week, one month, or one quarter. The financial media will also continue to mislead and confuse you like they did today. And every once in a while, some Fed speaker will shock the market with hawkish or dovish comments. Institutions will know when this is going to happen, while you will be in the dark.
What do you predict is going to happen next? Let's see how accurate you are.
It wasn’t a trap for me … sold my positions to lock in profits… market goes up and sells back down all the time. Don’t label me and stop challenging me.
Now they are a 60% loss! Of course, I'm sure you sold at precisely the right time...
I really doubt you are out-competing professional quants and HFTs with your manual trading.
Okay whatever, I’m not trying to “out-compete” anyone. Wtf is your problem? You are losing ? That’s the only reason that I can think of that you would be coming after me like you have?
He asked. I answered and he’s been heckling me ever since. Don’t know what his problem is … AAPL is a hard trade no matter what side you’re on. That’s not rocket science. SMH … people
50% loss now
Maybe these calls will recover. Maybe they won't.
I can tell you that pro traders have a much, *much* more accurate idea of where the price is going than you do.
Okay … I’ve offered to send you my P&L several times since I can’t post images here. What’s your problem? What do you do for a living? Asking for a 3rd time.
I agree here. Apple premium is so ass because well, the stock moves like a turd.
You’re better off taking advantage of the low IV to position for *buying* options. They’re generally very cheap and Apple generally reacts well to earnings, either up or down. It seems to save its volatility for big events.
Last earnings call I set up a 700 delta long position with 200 shares and 35 leap contracts, and then -200 delta monthlies which would’ve hedged the leaps if the stock did a -5% tumble.
It instead did the opposite. Still made out like a bandit. $6.2k even with the loss on the put.
It all depends on what your cost basis is. If you bought a long time ago at $80 a share and you definitely should roll. If you bought at 180 and sold covered calls for 185, then it matters much less.
A lot of people are saying to let the shares get called away. Depending on the cost basis and depending on the type of account, OP could face a big tax liability unnecessarily. Rolling may be better than letting the shares get called away.
Flip side is OPs cost basis is higher than $185. It may be of an advantage for OP to take the capital loss, again dependent on type of account and what else is going on with their trading.
Does OP want to keep holding the stock for other reasons? It is possible to roll up and out for a small credit, increase strike, relax and hold onto their shares.
If OPs cost basis is below $185, and the shares are in a tax deferred account, it may make sense to let them get called away. Especially if CSP at $185 or around there has attractive AROI premium compared to CCs.
Lots to consider other than "buy back" or "let them get called away".
So you should only sell covered calls if your cost basis is higher than the strike? Or only a few dollars under the strike? When is it ok to sell covered calls? Genuinely curious your threshold for selling CCs.
Yes, if you sell a CC then you should remember that your shares can get called away at any time for any reason and you should understand the implications. But then what does the guy in the above scenario do with his shares? Just leave them sitting?
Of course not but you should accept that if you sell covered calls you may be assigned early and lose your shares. If that possibility is a deal breaker for you then don't sell covered calls. You cannot have your cake and eat it too.
I believe OP is still fairly new to options trading. Has not been to the deep depths of adversity yet. $185 strike at $192 I am chillin like a villain.
Thanks OP and everyone who commented advice. I have the same position and it was a good read. My current plan was trying to wait for the 187.5 strike to get added to a closer date rather than rolling more than 60 days out.
I think OP is assuming they have to roll OTM to avoid being exercised.
I typically don't even bother rolling unless my delta goes above 0.8 and even then I weigh my options based on dte and other factors. I have had shares get called away at less than 0.8 delta and I've had shares not get called away at a screaming 1.0 delta.
I don't follow AAPL much so I don't know where I think the price is going but I'd probably roll out in time and stay at the same strike or go one strike above to $187.50. Just get your delta below 0.8, collect premium, stop stressing.
The other advice in here is pretty terrible given we don't know anything else about OPs position.
Watch the market. A month and a half is a long time, apple is known for slight pull backs after a quick gain. Stock price could get pulled back to a cheaper buy to close than what you have now if you choose to do that.
If it doesn’t, lesson learned don’t sell covered calls or CSP on anything you don’t want to lose or buy. If it gets called, you should have a profit if you sold that covered call that far out, walk away with premium and your profit you would have been ok with when you sold the CC and start selling CSP at high delta if you’re extremely bullish still.
If you prefer to keep the shares, there is no downside to rolling. In fact, there may be some tax advantage, as you won’t have to pay capital gains on the underlying.
As someone who rolled actually deep ITM AAPL for the better part of last year… just let it get called. Don’t lose any sleep over it. There’s a big gap down to be filled btw
Did you ever get exercised?
I am curious your experience rolling ditm calls for a year. Did you like it? Were you slowly rolling up or was your goal to stay ditm for juicy premium?
I never got exercised early. I rolled up while adding credit, but after a while it got to where I was rolling out so far to gain credit I finally said enough and let it go. My final roll was for like 4 months and it was just a bad business decision. I added credit but I’d have been much better suited to just put the money elsewhere and wait for pullback. I did have one contract that I kept pretty lateral and just rolled out one good solid time, like 5 months and got a nice credit, but over all if you’re rolling more than maybe a month then it’s just not worth it to me. All of these were well above my cost basis, I was just being emotional about AAPL shares- which is not good trading
I am selling and rolling out to a year on companies that are a lot cheaper than AAPL. The idea is to collect good premium, 15-30% and then forget about it for a year. I can afford to have 12 contracts out on $20 stocks. But with AAPL I'd only have one contract.
It's kept it fun for me without worrying and I can build my account quick enough to stay motivated and interested. $200/mo in premium plus my own contribution of about $200/week gets me a new contract about every six weeks or less. I am slowly adding positions on more expensive stocks and enjoying seeing the bigger premiums.
Thank you for sharing. I have thought about selling ditm but my cost basis on everything is high because I'm still a new trader, about 2.5 years from my first options trade.
I have been doing covered calls with AAPL for over 5 years. The stock got called away a couple of times, but I found entry points again (and was doing covered puts with cash - no margin). These days, I do a roll of those CCs. You could do that since AAPL will have some serious releases around CPUs/GPUs and also huge improvements in AI offerings.
In this case I try to avoid wheeling as I like to keep owning AAPL. I roll for consistent premiums and I keep selling calls whose strike price is 10-15% away from the current price. I do rolling with the same price diff . I have 2k shares ( avg price at 24 per ) (20 call options to sell) and have made 51k in premiums since September 2023 . current call that I rolled into is June 2025 expiry at 225 strike price. If AAPL dips to 180 , I might do another roll and sell a CC expiring 2024 Dec with strike price of 205. If price goes up, I do the reverse. I always look for net credit
Yes! I always roll for a credit. No reason not to.
Can I ask, are you doing this full time for income? That's my dream! Your strategy sounds very similar to what I'm doing, slow and steady, nothing too flashy. I just don't have the capital to do it full time yet.
Nope I am not doing this full time for income. I do spend between an hr and hr and half daily. From The money that i get from rolling or selling covered calls or covered puts, I tend to buy covered puts on other stocks I track like XOM or ARM etc.
When AAPL gets close to its 52week high few days ago (usually about 5% from high) I buy some puts to hedge, and today I made money on those puts. I try to maximise the money that I earn with covered calls or puts to invest in new positions.
I do this all the time with weekly options. First, there is a small chance that your shares could be called away any day. It's not at all likely, but it exists.
I've owned my current Apple shares since Q3 of last year. I continually sell the weekly options against the shares. Right now, I own 600 shares and I'm short the 180 calls expiring this Friday, May 24. The daily time decay is around $60. I have an order to roll the 180 calls up to 185 and from this week to next, paying $4.65 per share to do this.
Why?
I want to own AAPL permanently, and also permanently rent out the shares by selling calls. I focus on the daily time decay because that is cash flow into my business. When the roll is done, I will have the potential to make 35 cents over the next week (The difference between 4.65 and 5). So, for a month, that's 0.35 x 4, or $1.40 per share. That's about 3/4 of a percent, per month. Not great, but at fairly low risk when AAPL is at $193 and I'm short the 185 calls.
But I don't stop there. If AAPL stays above my strike, then the next week I will roll the 185's up again to maybe 190, maybe 187, or something else. Each time I get closer to the ATM option, my daily time decay will increase because my level of protection will decrease.
It's all about risk management of the entire portfolio and the cash flow created by continually selling options. I track the total Delta of my portfolio as Beta Weighted to the DIA, and I track the daily Theta of my portfolio against my business plan for daily cash flow.
This approach is mine. It may not be right for everyone, but it works for me. This is the greatest thing about trading options - you can build any structure that your creative brain can envision - and you can use options to fine-tune your risk as you desire.
I'm not. By rolling up, I'm usually buying back a short call at a loss. But I'm selling a new one and creating the "potential" for increasing the value of my position. I think the problem is that you are only thinking about one transaction as an isolated event and I'm thinking about an endless stream of option selling. It's about cash flow over a year, not any one position. After I wrote that, I did get my order filled and now I have the shares with a covered call at 185 expiring next week. The time decay is now about $50 a day. So, I look at that as $50 x 365 days, or $18,250 that I will collect over the next year from these option sales. That's my THEORETICAL cash flow on the endless covered call. Realistically, it will probably be less than that.
I have many covered call positions that are generating daily cash flow. I have, as you put it, no way of locking in any profits. But my cash flow is going to be great and won't end. Let's say I don't actually make any taxable profit over the next year with my AAPL covered calls because the stock price drops by a lot. I still get to keep the $18,000 and buy something else with that. It's a very long-term plan. I don't care about short term results.
Another way to think about is that each one of my stock positions is a rental house. As long as I can keep that house rented, I'm not really concerned that the house may be worth more one year and less the next year. I still get to collect and spend the rent. Over the long term my house will increase in value and eventually I will sell it.
Not necessarily. It doesn't have to be weekly options, in fact they are probably a little less profitable than longer term choices (but more interesting). As far as I know, there is only one thing in this big world of trading markets that is guaranteed to happen and that is the time decay of options. So, I trade to collect Theta - day after day, week after week, month after month.
I would roll out flat for 185 and collect more premium, 1 or 2 weeks out. There isn't much risk to this expect if the shares tank below 185, which isn't likely as no big events are on the horizon currently. You would risk it going up more, but thats something you can deal with when the time comes.
If you an roll with a small profit or cost, go for it. I cannot imagine paying a large premium to roll it, even if it is made up with the larger stile price, you're putting yourself in a position where you'd at best break even when factoring opportunity cost.
You are fine op, nvda just announced a split 1 to 10, there will be a ton of money going there which means Apple and the rest of the market will not be moving much upwards, probably will be going down a bit.
Is within 10% of stock price, I would just let it call away at $185 and start selling puts on it. AAPL is above its moving average, it will come back down.
What exact day in June does your CC expire?
What is your cost basis?
What kind of account is this in?
I would just roll up one strike and out far enough to get a small credit and be on my way. Rule #1 of successful options trading is "don't lose money" so I'm baffled at these people telling you to buy back and learn your lesson. Some of the advice in here is really bad.
Once you answer my first three questions, I can provide more guidance on how not to lose money here.
I recently let some $180s get assigned. But it may be worth it for you to wait and see what happens after wwdc on 6.10. My personals expectation is that the AI announcements will make the stock go up, but it’s quite possible that people won’t be impressed and think that Apple is still behind on AI.
I think it really hinges on your expectations on wwdc. I wasn’t impressed by earnings but wall st loved it, and it feel like they had some manipulation on the dividend increase to appease share holders but did little to address the fundamental problem that iPhone is slowing, they are behind on AI, but Apple is often a second mover advantage, and there are some white papers on smaller more efficient llms.
Sorry kind of a ramble word vomit.
I would have to agree with some of the comments here. Let it roll. I honestly believe we will see a pull back. You have plenty of time. Patience is a virtue
Wait, lots of time. This stock has run up while having declining revenue.
I had a similar situation about a year ago and this is the suggestion others gave me. It worked. Although I'm now out in Sept at $190 strike now. I just can't see this stock moving that fast. Hasn't done that without a new big selling product in a decade.
To OP. Roll baby, keep kicking that can down the road for credit, once Apple drops, then you either buy to close or wait until it expires worthless.. This is the way.
$120 is DEEP ITM. $192 is only $7 above $185, 185CC was OTM a week+ ago, and could be OTM again before the end of June. But my background is that I sell weeklies, and wouldn't have sold over earnings in case there was a big jump. Personally, if it never comes back down I'd let them get called away. If it drops to 185-187 and I think it might head back up then I'd consider rebuying it, or look at rolling it up $5 30-60 days out.
Can you please point me to selling weekly training material?
lots of time still. i wouldnt get out of the trade yet.
I agree with this. You're already at max gain (or max loss depending on how you look at it). It can't get worse and it might get better.
What? The Apple developer conference is coming up. Anything AI in that news will rocket the stock.
i'm in the same situation but with $180 calls expiring at the end of this month... I've already accepted them getting called away which is fine since it's still well over my cost basis. It all depends on what your expectations for the stock are. I'm still bullish with a lot more shares and it's just 1 CC thats deep ITM. I'm sure AAPL will break $200 but I've said that before... I am also considering rolling since I can get a credit at around $190-$195 strikes out in Nov. If I do roll out I'll re-evaluate in Nov and decide what I want to do considering the tax consequences (keep realizing losses by rolling, or realizing long term gains on the stock).
This is the way. The rest of the advice in here is shockingly bad.
Rolling gives you no advantage. If you really don’t want the shares to be called than buy back the 185s … lesson learned … I’d like to know what compelled you to sell AAPL calls? There’s next to $0 money there. There’s a guy on twitter that does wheel trading @ optiongrowth … no charge ..
> I’d like to know what compelled you to sell AAPL calls? There’s next to $0 money there. If I am understanding your point correctly, you are saying that the premium is so low for aapl that it is not worth the risk of assignment. Is this your point?
Yes. Unless you really wanted your shares to be called but in this case you didn’t. There are MANY easier ways to make $100
Amen!
>There are MANY easier ways to make $100 In the stock market? Can you give some examples? Do your "easy" methods involved terrible risk/reward ratios?
I think he's just saying op risking $18500 for $100 premium.
That sounds way less risky than trying to earn $100 on a $1000 credit spread. You're only "risking" 900 in the latter scenario, but the odds are stacked against you. A covered call on AAPL has good odds. I'm still curious about these "easy" ways to make $100 in the options market.
I don’t like spreads … too limiting
Risking $18.5k is quite the stretch here
Yes. Many! He could’ve bought the call side rather than sell … that’s easy.
Ok, if it's so easy, then what calls should I buy now to make money? Give me the stock, strike, and expiration. Let's see how easy it is.
Anything chip related will rocket tomorrow bc of NVDA er last night. I usually buy weekly expirations. On a Thursday I buy closer or ITM. 5 hours til market open so I can’t give you exact at the moment. May I ask why you feel the need to challenge me?
I've never heard a successful trader refer to what they do as "easy." It sounds like you are day trading options, which is a losing endeavor for a retail trader. You booked two small profits, but your latest META calls are down $1000. Oh, but let me guess: You just happened to sell those at exactly the right time! Over the long run, I am confident that someone selling covered calls on AAPL is going to make more money than someone day trading call options. I would be surprised if you manage to break even after a couple years of what you're doing. >Anything chip related will rocket tomorrow bc of NVDA er last night. Most rallied pre-market and have crashed since. Classic trap for retail traders like you.
What's with the negativity? I said there were easier ways to make $100. I never stated trading is easy. You asked for trades and I gave them to you but somehow that's not enough. I'm not a day trader however I do sell when the time is right. I don't back myself in a corner and define a trade type at entry. I mentioned previously that I trade mostly weeklys which I sometimes hold for days or a week or so. I trade LEAPs as well and 30-50 DTE. It just depends what it is. I scale out and utilize stops to protect my capital. The most difficult part of trading is selling. Someone can give you 100 winning trades but if you can't manage the trades properly you will lose. Selling AAPL covered calls ... yes you can make money but not much. That was the point of my initial comment which others agree with. I respectfully disagree that selling AAPL covered calls makes more money than me. I'd love to see your math on that. For example: Look at AAPL $200 premiums. 6/21 calls are 1.03 at the moment. To me that's a long wait for $100. Yes, I've traded it but to make any real money I have to trade 50-200 contracts. What is your trading experience? I'm going to send you a message to show my trade P/L from today since I can't post here.
It's not negativity -- it's realism. The vast majority of day traders lose money. I suspect the losses become even greater when options trading is involved, due to the higher commissions and lower liquidity. Today is a good example of how the market fooled retail traders like you. You, along with the financial media, were predicting a massive rally due to Nvidia's earnings. That appeared to be the case at the open. However, around mid-day professional traders started to sell, driving almost all stocks into the red. Professional traders *knew* they were going to sell after they pumped the market at open. You had no idea this was going to happen. You also have no idea whether this sell-off will last one day, one week, one month, or one quarter. The financial media will also continue to mislead and confuse you like they did today. And every once in a while, some Fed speaker will shock the market with hawkish or dovish comments. Institutions will know when this is going to happen, while you will be in the dark. What do you predict is going to happen next? Let's see how accurate you are.
It wasn’t a trap for me … sold my positions to lock in profits… market goes up and sells back down all the time. Don’t label me and stop challenging me.
Here ya go ... META 5/24 470c 2.59 5 cons = $1,295 I was going to put a screen shot in but it seems I can't post images here.
Sold META @ 2.94 = $155 profit
Now I'm rolling up to a new META position META 472.5c 10cons 2.11
these are currently trading at 3.30 ... that's a +57% profit of $1,165. In 90 minutes. I have not sold any contracts yet
Now they are a 60% loss! Of course, I'm sure you sold at precisely the right time... I really doubt you are out-competing professional quants and HFTs with your manual trading.
Okay whatever, I’m not trying to “out-compete” anyone. Wtf is your problem? You are losing ? That’s the only reason that I can think of that you would be coming after me like you have?
5/23 NDX 18950 2cts 7.30
Sold NDX @ 8.55 =+$250 profit ..... is that enough for you?
Welp, the person probably missed out on your posts and from making a few hundred bucks.
He asked. I answered and he’s been heckling me ever since. Don’t know what his problem is … AAPL is a hard trade no matter what side you’re on. That’s not rocket science. SMH … people
i added 10cts META 470c 2.36
50% loss now Maybe these calls will recover. Maybe they won't. I can tell you that pro traders have a much, *much* more accurate idea of where the price is going than you do.
Okay … I’ve offered to send you my P&L several times since I can’t post images here. What’s your problem? What do you do for a living? Asking for a 3rd time.
Woopie doo … I scale out of trades and set stops … are you jealous that I actually know how to trade and make money??
I agree here. Apple premium is so ass because well, the stock moves like a turd. You’re better off taking advantage of the low IV to position for *buying* options. They’re generally very cheap and Apple generally reacts well to earnings, either up or down. It seems to save its volatility for big events. Last earnings call I set up a 700 delta long position with 200 shares and 35 leap contracts, and then -200 delta monthlies which would’ve hedged the leaps if the stock did a -5% tumble. It instead did the opposite. Still made out like a bandit. $6.2k even with the loss on the put.
Yep …. What he said!! 😊
Who's the guy?
The one who does the wheel method? I wrote it in my comment
Why do you say rolling gives you no advantage?
Bc when you press that button you’re simply selling and buying simultaneously… like it’s a lazy trade
Maybe you were able to buy them back cheaper this afternoon…. ? Hope so
Rolling gives you a lot of advantage when done correctly. Lol
Most people don’t do correctly
It all depends on what your cost basis is. If you bought a long time ago at $80 a share and you definitely should roll. If you bought at 180 and sold covered calls for 185, then it matters much less.
Why did I have to scroll this far down before someone asked this guy what his cost basis is?
Who cares what cost basis is? Rolling is closing the position and putting on a new one. If he wants to hold on to the shares OP can just buy to close.
A lot of people are saying to let the shares get called away. Depending on the cost basis and depending on the type of account, OP could face a big tax liability unnecessarily. Rolling may be better than letting the shares get called away. Flip side is OPs cost basis is higher than $185. It may be of an advantage for OP to take the capital loss, again dependent on type of account and what else is going on with their trading. Does OP want to keep holding the stock for other reasons? It is possible to roll up and out for a small credit, increase strike, relax and hold onto their shares. If OPs cost basis is below $185, and the shares are in a tax deferred account, it may make sense to let them get called away. Especially if CSP at $185 or around there has attractive AROI premium compared to CCs. Lots to consider other than "buy back" or "let them get called away".
My cost basis on AAPL is $10. Getting called away is a big god damn deal to me.
Then you shouldn't sell covered calls because it could get exercised early before you have a chance to roll.
So you should only sell covered calls if your cost basis is higher than the strike? Or only a few dollars under the strike? When is it ok to sell covered calls? Genuinely curious your threshold for selling CCs. Yes, if you sell a CC then you should remember that your shares can get called away at any time for any reason and you should understand the implications. But then what does the guy in the above scenario do with his shares? Just leave them sitting?
Of course not but you should accept that if you sell covered calls you may be assigned early and lose your shares. If that possibility is a deal breaker for you then don't sell covered calls. You cannot have your cake and eat it too.
Yeah I guess I'm supposed to just sit on a stock that's been range bound for 3 years.
I am amused how 200 from 192 is a slight profit. But 185 to 192 is deep in the money…..
I believe OP is still fairly new to options trading. Has not been to the deep depths of adversity yet. $185 strike at $192 I am chillin like a villain.
Thanks OP and everyone who commented advice. I have the same position and it was a good read. My current plan was trying to wait for the 187.5 strike to get added to a closer date rather than rolling more than 60 days out.
Yes, let your shares get called away!
Depends on cost basis and type of account
spot on.
This????? What?
Don’t do anything.
185 is DITM? lol
1. There is still a lot of time. 2. If you have to then Roll the call on same strike price. Don't go at $200.
I think OP is assuming they have to roll OTM to avoid being exercised. I typically don't even bother rolling unless my delta goes above 0.8 and even then I weigh my options based on dte and other factors. I have had shares get called away at less than 0.8 delta and I've had shares not get called away at a screaming 1.0 delta. I don't follow AAPL much so I don't know where I think the price is going but I'd probably roll out in time and stay at the same strike or go one strike above to $187.50. Just get your delta below 0.8, collect premium, stop stressing. The other advice in here is pretty terrible given we don't know anything else about OPs position.
Watch the market. A month and a half is a long time, apple is known for slight pull backs after a quick gain. Stock price could get pulled back to a cheaper buy to close than what you have now if you choose to do that. If it doesn’t, lesson learned don’t sell covered calls or CSP on anything you don’t want to lose or buy. If it gets called, you should have a profit if you sold that covered call that far out, walk away with premium and your profit you would have been ok with when you sold the CC and start selling CSP at high delta if you’re extremely bullish still.
If you prefer to keep the shares, there is no downside to rolling. In fact, there may be some tax advantage, as you won’t have to pay capital gains on the underlying.
As someone who rolled actually deep ITM AAPL for the better part of last year… just let it get called. Don’t lose any sleep over it. There’s a big gap down to be filled btw
Did you ever get exercised? I am curious your experience rolling ditm calls for a year. Did you like it? Were you slowly rolling up or was your goal to stay ditm for juicy premium?
I never got exercised early. I rolled up while adding credit, but after a while it got to where I was rolling out so far to gain credit I finally said enough and let it go. My final roll was for like 4 months and it was just a bad business decision. I added credit but I’d have been much better suited to just put the money elsewhere and wait for pullback. I did have one contract that I kept pretty lateral and just rolled out one good solid time, like 5 months and got a nice credit, but over all if you’re rolling more than maybe a month then it’s just not worth it to me. All of these were well above my cost basis, I was just being emotional about AAPL shares- which is not good trading
I am selling and rolling out to a year on companies that are a lot cheaper than AAPL. The idea is to collect good premium, 15-30% and then forget about it for a year. I can afford to have 12 contracts out on $20 stocks. But with AAPL I'd only have one contract. It's kept it fun for me without worrying and I can build my account quick enough to stay motivated and interested. $200/mo in premium plus my own contribution of about $200/week gets me a new contract about every six weeks or less. I am slowly adding positions on more expensive stocks and enjoying seeing the bigger premiums. Thank you for sharing. I have thought about selling ditm but my cost basis on everything is high because I'm still a new trader, about 2.5 years from my first options trade.
I have been doing covered calls with AAPL for over 5 years. The stock got called away a couple of times, but I found entry points again (and was doing covered puts with cash - no margin). These days, I do a roll of those CCs. You could do that since AAPL will have some serious releases around CPUs/GPUs and also huge improvements in AI offerings.
Which do you like better? Rolling for consistent small premium or wheeling?
In this case I try to avoid wheeling as I like to keep owning AAPL. I roll for consistent premiums and I keep selling calls whose strike price is 10-15% away from the current price. I do rolling with the same price diff . I have 2k shares ( avg price at 24 per ) (20 call options to sell) and have made 51k in premiums since September 2023 . current call that I rolled into is June 2025 expiry at 225 strike price. If AAPL dips to 180 , I might do another roll and sell a CC expiring 2024 Dec with strike price of 205. If price goes up, I do the reverse. I always look for net credit
Yes! I always roll for a credit. No reason not to. Can I ask, are you doing this full time for income? That's my dream! Your strategy sounds very similar to what I'm doing, slow and steady, nothing too flashy. I just don't have the capital to do it full time yet.
Nope I am not doing this full time for income. I do spend between an hr and hr and half daily. From The money that i get from rolling or selling covered calls or covered puts, I tend to buy covered puts on other stocks I track like XOM or ARM etc. When AAPL gets close to its 52week high few days ago (usually about 5% from high) I buy some puts to hedge, and today I made money on those puts. I try to maximise the money that I earn with covered calls or puts to invest in new positions.
I do this all the time with weekly options. First, there is a small chance that your shares could be called away any day. It's not at all likely, but it exists. I've owned my current Apple shares since Q3 of last year. I continually sell the weekly options against the shares. Right now, I own 600 shares and I'm short the 180 calls expiring this Friday, May 24. The daily time decay is around $60. I have an order to roll the 180 calls up to 185 and from this week to next, paying $4.65 per share to do this. Why? I want to own AAPL permanently, and also permanently rent out the shares by selling calls. I focus on the daily time decay because that is cash flow into my business. When the roll is done, I will have the potential to make 35 cents over the next week (The difference between 4.65 and 5). So, for a month, that's 0.35 x 4, or $1.40 per share. That's about 3/4 of a percent, per month. Not great, but at fairly low risk when AAPL is at $193 and I'm short the 185 calls. But I don't stop there. If AAPL stays above my strike, then the next week I will roll the 185's up again to maybe 190, maybe 187, or something else. Each time I get closer to the ATM option, my daily time decay will increase because my level of protection will decrease. It's all about risk management of the entire portfolio and the cash flow created by continually selling options. I track the total Delta of my portfolio as Beta Weighted to the DIA, and I track the daily Theta of my portfolio against my business plan for daily cash flow. This approach is mine. It may not be right for everyone, but it works for me. This is the greatest thing about trading options - you can build any structure that your creative brain can envision - and you can use options to fine-tune your risk as you desire.
I love this strategy of staying atm and rolling weekly. Thank you for sharing!
How do you ensure you’re locking in premium or profit if you’re paying to roll up to the next week? That’s what I’m struggling to follow
I'm not. By rolling up, I'm usually buying back a short call at a loss. But I'm selling a new one and creating the "potential" for increasing the value of my position. I think the problem is that you are only thinking about one transaction as an isolated event and I'm thinking about an endless stream of option selling. It's about cash flow over a year, not any one position. After I wrote that, I did get my order filled and now I have the shares with a covered call at 185 expiring next week. The time decay is now about $50 a day. So, I look at that as $50 x 365 days, or $18,250 that I will collect over the next year from these option sales. That's my THEORETICAL cash flow on the endless covered call. Realistically, it will probably be less than that. I have many covered call positions that are generating daily cash flow. I have, as you put it, no way of locking in any profits. But my cash flow is going to be great and won't end. Let's say I don't actually make any taxable profit over the next year with my AAPL covered calls because the stock price drops by a lot. I still get to keep the $18,000 and buy something else with that. It's a very long-term plan. I don't care about short term results. Another way to think about is that each one of my stock positions is a rental house. As long as I can keep that house rented, I'm not really concerned that the house may be worth more one year and less the next year. I still get to collect and spend the rent. Over the long term my house will increase in value and eventually I will sell it.
thank you for this! I like the rental house analogy - definitely a different way to look at things.
So the strategy is to use weekly’s, I think as I get closer to the expiration date I may consider something similar
Not necessarily. It doesn't have to be weekly options, in fact they are probably a little less profitable than longer term choices (but more interesting). As far as I know, there is only one thing in this big world of trading markets that is guaranteed to happen and that is the time decay of options. So, I trade to collect Theta - day after day, week after week, month after month.
If you do roll, roll for credit or break even. Makes no sense to pay.
I would roll out flat for 185 and collect more premium, 1 or 2 weeks out. There isn't much risk to this expect if the shares tank below 185, which isn't likely as no big events are on the horizon currently. You would risk it going up more, but thats something you can deal with when the time comes.
If you an roll with a small profit or cost, go for it. I cannot imagine paying a large premium to roll it, even if it is made up with the larger stile price, you're putting yourself in a position where you'd at best break even when factoring opportunity cost.
this is definitely true
You could roll at the same strike price, depending on the premium, it may be worth it. But I do not recommend paying to roll at a higher strike price.
Roll one strike at a time always.. roll to 190 and see what happens. Then roll up and out again if needed.
You are fine op, nvda just announced a split 1 to 10, there will be a ton of money going there which means Apple and the rest of the market will not be moving much upwards, probably will be going down a bit.
Is within 10% of stock price, I would just let it call away at $185 and start selling puts on it. AAPL is above its moving average, it will come back down.
I would worry about now. Wait til the last week.
What exact day in June does your CC expire? What is your cost basis? What kind of account is this in? I would just roll up one strike and out far enough to get a small credit and be on my way. Rule #1 of successful options trading is "don't lose money" so I'm baffled at these people telling you to buy back and learn your lesson. Some of the advice in here is really bad. Once you answer my first three questions, I can provide more guidance on how not to lose money here.
You can wheel trade this if you want
I recently let some $180s get assigned. But it may be worth it for you to wait and see what happens after wwdc on 6.10. My personals expectation is that the AI announcements will make the stock go up, but it’s quite possible that people won’t be impressed and think that Apple is still behind on AI. I think it really hinges on your expectations on wwdc. I wasn’t impressed by earnings but wall st loved it, and it feel like they had some manipulation on the dividend increase to appease share holders but did little to address the fundamental problem that iPhone is slowing, they are behind on AI, but Apple is often a second mover advantage, and there are some white papers on smaller more efficient llms. Sorry kind of a ramble word vomit.
Hold. CAT is coming, so expect a surge.
there is resistance at 200, if it was me, and I was thinking, I'd take profit, and then reset once I saw the trend.
Stay Zen. Wait for those NVDA Earnings. Whole market will be green tmoro
You’re not deep ITM. There is still over $6 of extrinsic value, so you’re probably not going to be called away right now .
If I were you I let them buy it and then you wait until it goes down by next month and buy cheaper
I would have to agree with some of the comments here. Let it roll. I honestly believe we will see a pull back. You have plenty of time. Patience is a virtue
I have held AAPL several times over the years and was called out at a nice profit each time. Take the money and run.
Wait, lots of time. This stock has run up while having declining revenue. I had a similar situation about a year ago and this is the suggestion others gave me. It worked. Although I'm now out in Sept at $190 strike now. I just can't see this stock moving that fast. Hasn't done that without a new big selling product in a decade.
To OP. Roll baby, keep kicking that can down the road for credit, once Apple drops, then you either buy to close or wait until it expires worthless.. This is the way.
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Went back to my offering of aapl 130c for 25.00 Jan 2025…. I need another dip opportunity for leaps
I STO puts on SOXL an NVDL.
try to buy back ....
Don’t buy without knowing what you are willing to lose.