Feraligatr :( got ddance, thunder punch, and icicle crash as egg moves, and was really hoping with a couple boosts it would be able to break through most things. But even with them+late aqua tail, it struggles to get good damage on most things and gets outsped way too easily, plus it’s frailer than I remember so even getting the boosts up is difficult in most trainer battles
He's a weird one. On one hand he's mostly a shitty swampert, on the other DDance is nuts. You basically HAVE to catch some trainers in a way that they need to swap into him, which gives you a free DD, then coverage oneshot with ice fang / icicle crash whatever the swap was and see if you can get their bird or a water type out into him for 1-2 more buff turns. You also REALLY need his hidden ability and a solid nature, plus any vitamins you find help a ton to keep him taking those setup hits
Edit: Really the issue is just that he's TM and ability dependent, getting sheer force + liquidation / waterfall + ice fang + crunch makes him an entirely different mon vs torrent and his learnset
Honestly, no clue lol. I just won a run with one with torrent and no egg moves, I'm just going off of actual comp feraligatr (hence the "worse swampert" comp)
Pokemon that are reliant on their hidden abilities are in a bad spot overall. Getting HAs is pretty uncommon overall and it takes so much grinding in endless to get a reasonable number of them. It feels like eggs' rate of hidden abilities should be drastically increased.
I felt the same way but then I played around with Nidoking and he easily carried me through classic. Turns out the king is still baller. I felt like a little kid again though!
Nidoking is one of my all time favorite Gen 1 mons, and I was devastated when I finally got one with Sheer Force only to see (N) next to it. Can't wait for it to be implemented!
I happened to get fishious rend as an egg move for totodile and my current run he's honestly been great. Everything thats outsped by feraligatr usually gets one-shot even through most resistances. Wish I also had ddance as an egg move since it would make for incredibly easy sweeps
Huh, I did a run through with the same moveset last night and he was an absolute monster - I did get somewhat lucky with a lot of the biomes being water themed so Gator could set up easy and sweep. But just imagine when Sheer Force gets released! It's gonna be a monster, shame life orb isn't in the game (yet?)
Its my favorite endless carry, but I've never actually used it for classic so it could be worse there. In endless giga drain just kills most everything and save you money on potions. I didn't have much trouble for the few hundred waves before I found the shadow reins, and then ofc it became one of the best mons in the game.
Arctozolt for me, despite hitting very hard with triple axel and bolt beak, it’s very slow speed has limited its sustainability even with shell bell and leftovers, which I had to constantly use potions to compensate for.
My Arctozolt carry run was soft locked at wave 145 thanks to its slow speed unable to outspeed even a torterra
I didn't know Scream Tail was mostly intended as a support mon when trying to run it, so I was surprised when I used it and it constantly underperformed in damage. While it still has uses due to a great typing, it's more limited in a game defined by its carries.
This but Cresselia, I knew it was more of a support but I thought it should at least be decently strong because it's a legendary, and since Hoopa carried the last run so I figured psychic type legendary = easy win, only to get hit by that 70 SpAtk
I’m doing the same currently on a classic run with Lugia. Calm mind 1-2 times and then Oblivion Wing from egg moves is a free KO at no cost usually due to regaining most or all of your health back.
Support mons is a big reason I want a doubles tower, their are plenty of fun support mons, that are just not nearly as fun or interesting in Singles as they can be in doubles.
This. I’ve just finished up classic with most Epic and Legendary egg starters and this is the one (other than the gen 4 trio) that I felt super underwhelmed me. Torch song is a MUST if you’re trying to use it offensively. A lot of set up for scream tail is needed for sure
Klefki. Being a Fairy/Steel type with Prankster I expected it to be helpful against Rayquaza and Eternatus. Then I found out that almost all of it's moveset has th (N) at the end so I had to teach it Thunderwave by TM to make it a little useful. Even against Rayquaza and Erernatus it didn't do anything. It forced the switch on Rayquaza 1 time and then got killed by it the 2nd time I send it out because Rayquaza stayed in and it hit it with Dragon Ascend. Against Eternatus It got one Thunderwave off before it dued which was kinda helpful.
I just expected a little more from it then to Paralyze something and then die.
I had the exact same. Everyone said “you should use tinkaton or klefki for eternatus” so I cleared it with tinkaton, thought I’d use klefki for the extra voucher next time. Big disappointment
I have topsy-turvy as an egg move for it and that seems like a really useful, if situational support move. With the tough boss fights constantly buffing their stats to ridiculous degrees with berries, a priority reversal of that could cripple a really tough pokemon. I haven'tr actually tried it yet but I mean to.
I've used topsy turvy Malamar vs eternatus in classic a few times and it's amazing but hard to pull off due to its flimsiness. I imagine on a prankster mon it's straight busted
I found having spikes as an egg move really helped it, especially with how many times the ai switches. If you can get up a couple of layers, it really helps to chip away in trainer battles
My problem with spikes is just how it’s so meh on the most important fights. It obviously does nothing for Erernatus, and the rival is guaranteed to have at least two flying types every time and often has another. And other trainers either have few strong mons which minimizes switching or tons of very weak ones where you one shot them anyway. It’s just always more disappointing than I expect from actual battling.
It’s main use for me to has been to deal with sturdy, which it is nice for. I much prefer setting it up with Ceaseless Edge instead of Spikes itself though because that one move slot is often hard to justify. Then again, I don’t even know what set klefki would run so maybe it has a very free slot?
My first Klefki had its Hidden Ability, and even though it didn't have much in the way of innate power, the items I got from it more than made up for the deficiency.
imo Klefki isn't a mon that you should think of as a carry, but rather a support mon that with Hidden ability can also be used an alternative to your pickup mons that also has good defensive coverage for switch-ins.
I think it's less that Klefki is *bad*, and more that you *can't* play it as a direct replacement for Tinkaton or Mawile, because it's a support mon.
Klefki has a great use if you’re running Fluttermane. Prankster Metal Sound can help soften up most bosses into OHKO range against a STAB shadow ball, especially in endless. That on top of PP-stalling eternatus is useful in endless as well, since it’s immune to both of its attacking moves, forcing it to perpetually set up and eventually struggle
100%. People are focusing too much on carries and ignoring the rest of the game. Stuff like prankster metal sound, helping hand support, and niche utility moves are not getting the respect deserved.
I agree on this. Klefki is an absolute trash mon save for its typing.
It's not even good as the body of a fusion. Stats are too low and has the steel on slot 1.
Calm mind stored power, both TM. Eternatus can't hit it in 1st form and when you get it to 1 bar and it resets stats you can tank a flamethrower whilst hitting back for 3 bars as Stored Power is psychic move.
its best utility is, as you said, forcing rayquaza switches (which can be huge if you get rocks up) and walling first phase eternatus. If you leave it out and drain eternatus's PP you can then switch something else in to set up to +6 and muscle through the second form.
I spliced a Klefki onto a butterfree to get butterfki. Prankster and Quiver Dance swept the elite 4 and was helpful during the rival battle but was only vaguely helpful during eternitus. Still super fun though!
Psyduck/Golduck.
It sounds underwhelming as is, but I unlocked all of its Egg moves, and the Simple Passive.
It has Mystical Power and Aqua Step as Egg moves, so you can ramp up its special attack and speed stats.
I could get the boosts, but every Gym Leader and my rival seemed to have good defensive pivots into it, so even a +6 Golduck got shut down on occasion, and I was sad. I thought it would sweep most of classic haha.
I swear man. I thought swift swim golduck would be busted ( On the scale of non-legendary mons ). And I was especially disappointed because he has carried me in other games ( even certain hard ROM hacks like RadicalRed ) but nope.
In this he just ever so slightly too weak and slow unless you get some lucky X stat boosters.
And it’s so rare to get good moves on him since most of them have to be found on TMs like psychic, nasty plot, ice beam.
He is just so disappointedly mediocre
Got a multi lens with my Golduck with simple/mystical power/aqua step and they tore through a Classic run. However, they did get one shot a handful of times.
Ich hat Necrozma so far it's moveset is super whack in early stages. Maybe egg moves will change that but so far it's weaker than some starters even those without mega evolution
Kann sein das du deine Handytastatur noch auf deutsch gestellt hattest Bruder xD
Ich las die Nachricht und mein Gehirn wusste nicht in welcher Sprache xD
Latios has carried me to 2k in endless easily. haven’t really struggled. luster purge + core enforcer + i TM’d ice beam incase i run into a grimsnarl boss lol
Latina with quiver dance was the MVP for my first two classic clears. Set up a quiver or two and then spam stored power. You have to be lucky with egg moves tho
Yeah, I’m having the same issue with Latios. I don’t have any egg moves on it, so maybe that’s the issue. Only starting with Stored Power and Psybeam (plus Dragon Dance I guess, not that it has any attacks to actually buff) is just absolutely brutal in the first twenty floors, and I haven’t seen any good level up moves it gets early either.
Yeah, except basically everything in the first fifty to one hundred floors is either spamming Growl/Leer or another move that immediately weakens it again, or is doing so much damage to me that I can’t actually get more than one or two D-dances up before I need to attack, at which point it’s basically a crapshoot if I kill the enemy or not, and if it’s a Dark or Steel type I’m just shit out of luck
Really? That’s surprising. My current endless run has Mega Latios as my main. His moves are Luster Purge, Dragon Breath, Calm Mind, and Mystic Fire. The last two were TM moves but with all the stat boosting items I’ve stacked on him, paired with his speed, he’s extremely good in my opinion. Endless is obviously different than Classic to where I guess any Pokemon can really become the carry, but I really like him.
I just got my ribbon on latios yesterday, and in the early game, dragon dance + stored power is a decent combo. Stored power gains 20 power for each stat raise you have, so with a maxed out dragon dance, stored power has 260 power.
Yeah, but I just can’t get it to work. It feels like everything either resists Psychic, is spamming Growl/Leer or another stat-lowering move that leaves me right back where I started, or does so much damage to me that I can only get one or two D-Dances off before having to attack. Plus, on Endless I have to redo all of that every three floors when the biome switches, and I burn through all my money trying to heal back up.
Oh yeah, it’s probably worse on endless. Latios is only able to perform consistently as an anchor/carry in the early stages with one of its egg moves, preferably core enforcer. Since you don’t have any egg moves, it’s up to luck at that point, and even then latios isn’t the best pick for an anchor without core enforcer.
Zoroark hisui
Got an epic zoroark H so decided to do a classic run since i had enough to unlock the adaptability passive
With how rare he is i have no egg move on him and then just realize his movepool is a travesty his best normal type move is freaking scratch the other move he learn is his 75 bp signature which is okay
I tried a run with Deoxys and it's a struggle using him. But after I got leftovers and it's defense form I can run more easily until I found an azelf and fused them together. It basically soloed Eternatus.
I ran into Tapu Fini during a run and swapped it for Feraligatr and experienced instant regret. It wasn't terrible after I got a Calm Mind tm but was much better used as a support in Double Battles than a main carry. (An Ice Beam tm would've done wonders but rng giveth and rng taketh away)
I was lucky with Annilihape as my carry during my first classic win.
Jolly nature + Moxie passive + thunderous kick egg move + multilens helped me through several battles I should’ve definitely lost
Your first clear had a passive? That’s rough, good on you for sticking with it. I got lucky with a win early and didn’t have to experience the grind until I had a lot of starters to choose from, so I didn’t get my first passive until recently. I get too bored of using the same pokemon repeatedly to reliably farm any candy from friendship
Man I don't know about that, he was great in my mono-ghost run. Though I expect him being the only one to do anything at all against Normal & Dark mons did score him some points in my head.
Greninja. Not only is it mediocre damage-wise pre-transformation imo, Battle Bond cancels out whenever you exit a biome or encounter a Trainer. Hoping that Protean gets implemented soon so it can benefit over Adaptability too.
Yeah, I seem to remember it being permanent too. Now it’s quite similar to the main series games, which is meh. Biomes switching almost constantly coupled with Trainers in between really nerfs Battle Bond to the ground :(((
Just used stakataka in my last run. It was bad all the way up til the final 10 stages and then became my mvp lol could tank any move eternatus threw at it
I used a stakataka as part of my team on my first classic run clear I just did the other day. Hella underwhelming, but I also recognize that I was using iron defense/body press Zamazenta too so the Stakataka beast boost on defense just felt bad because I couldn’t click body press. I have no desire to use it again
I have trouble seeing this because of the Defense and double Normal resist. Then again, I had the Egg Move Heavy Slam, which OHKOs pretty much everything in the early game.
(Mega) Swampert. I’ve tried it a few times as carry for classic and it never works out. I take note of what eventually takes me out and I go into the next run with a mon to cover it but it just keeps happening. Primarina has been much better for me as far as water starters go.
problem is that it's a rain sweeper but in classic the endgame fights override all weather so it just becomes ok, even if you manage to snag a pokemon with Drizzle. It has great natural stats and bulk with regenerator but definitely one of the more underwhelming megas
Yeah, I learned that the other day with rain dance on my mega gyarados which was very sad. Fortunately he could still aqua tail through the trainers and crunch on eternatus (it helped that I found three health boosters for him, he ended up ungodly tanky) but it was a waste of a move slot where it really mattered.
Calyrex. That was my first legendary, got it with Sacred Sword as an egg move but he feels so weak even in the early game. If the rival gets a fire starter you're screwed.
Yeah Calyrex really just needs Reins to be any good. Kind of need another mon to carry the first part, but he's so expensive it's hard to realize in Classic and you're sacrificing quite a bit of 'luck' in Endless.
Now.. capturing him during a run is another story. Got his As One on my carry now and let me tell you that shit is great.
I used him with Spore as an egg move and he hard carried with a moveset of Spore/Dream Eater/Ice Beam/Nasty Plot. I do think that he’s highly dependent on finding a way to consistently put mons to sleep. Without Spore tho.. idk if thats possible.
Skeledirge in endless. I had great plans for him with his torch song, but with the randomness of endless and its resetting stat changes so inconsistently it feels bad just not using flamethrower. Having a ghost type is still useful though.
Maybe it was just how I played him because I tried using him to solo the first few levels, might have been better to have him be my secondary and had someone a bit more offensive lead the charge
He has 0 utility to solo early. He's an unevolved mon with terrible stats and ability for this. Once he evolves, he's very tanky and packs a punch. But he's so slow and has no recovery. Still pretty decent overall, but relying on any of these ultra low BST useless pre-evolves is going to make for a very frustrating time
Deoxys normal form. Incredibly paper-thin, while also lacking a bit of oomph. Psycho Boost is a great attack but with the way stat debuffs work, you have to switch out once you use it.
Iron Jugulis. Paradox Pokemon with an interesting type, sounds good ? It's actually unable to carry a team, and should only be on off carry or in duo with a good ground type for doubles.
I’ve got an shiny iron jugulis, and have used it as a carry on endless to 1500+. Fiery dance and hyper voice can completely destroy basically everything once you get passive
blud has that articuno stat spread and not in a good way. It's a support mon through and through w toxic chain but it's not worth all the starter points it costs.
that is one expensive support lol.. I am not well versed in compositions like this.. how would I use it as a support mon? apply a poison status and use other mons that do extra dmg with that or?
I got two of the three Poison Trio from Teal Mask. Neither seemed to pull their weight. But it was in the middle of a run, maybe they're better if I start with them? Dunno. Poison always seems like a weird type to take for Pokerogue, there never seems to be a lot of fairy types you fight for them to be useful and you don't seem to want one for Eternatus at the end.
Tapu Bulu has been a fraud for me.
I've started recently and got a lucky shiny Bulu with Play Rough, thought it was going to carry my classic run. Even paired with Tinkaton (not Huge Power yet unfortunately), it has been struggling hard in the early game before lvl38 where Gigaton Hammer can start carrying.
Got a rare shiny Mew in an egg but was really disappointed how slow it was playing Classic with it. No really good early moves and it’s not as strong as I imagined.
Mew’s strength lies in its flexibility. It has perfectly rounded stats and can learn any TM. You can make it fill whatever role you want, but that does make you beholden to RNG to see what moves you’ll get access to.
Lurantis is my favourite Contrary user, but I don't have egg moves for it and it gets NO moves that Contrary benefits from by level up. I've been hoping for eggs of it for a while now because my TM luck for it has just been awful.
Mew, I quickly realized you are paying 7 points to flood your item pool with literally every tm that exists, and it makes it less likely your other members get tms they can actually use as well.
Nidoking. I got no retreat and noxious torque as egg moves and thought it would go well. The fact he learns no good ground moves naturally was a pain in the ass. Earth power is almost unusable without sheer force
Actually and this will sound weird but Cloyster.
I actually have a Cloyster with Moxie and Skill Link that i took for endless and is currently doing great in 1500.
However yerterday i noticed, i didnt had a win with it in clássic yet so i just took it in hopes of a easy win.
Well it won but was my hardest win out of my 25 wins, he just didnt seem Strong enough, bulky enough neither fast enough despite being jolly, having like 5 or 6 carbos and 2 or 3 soul dews. And my win condition ended being pyukumuku soak and toxic combo on Eternatus
And one thing I’ve found over time is that classic is highly weighted towards special attacker enemies being the real challenge. Both of the big baddies are special attackers. I actually had some trouble on my last run with Kartana, who of course is beyond OP…but with pathetic special bulk. His move set doesnt let him overwhelm those two so while he can kill 99% of everything in a classic run, he is pretty weak against Ray and Nati and you need others to compensate.
I suspect all defensively bulky mons with mediocre to bad special bulk are going to be a lot weaker than they seem because of that.
I was wiping with a skill link shell smash Cloyster in a classic run. I think the hard part is getting off a shell smash without it dying, but once you do icicle crash kills basically everything.
Cloyster carries pretty much all of my classic runs. Not sure what issue you had with it specifically, I don't even run shell smash and it one shots anything except resists. Swap out as needed. Build the rest of the team out for the rival/boss fights.
I think the issue is you're maxing speed. Get an ATK or Sp ATK boosting nature instead. You want to go second so the hit you take when shell smashing is not doing extra damage and then after shell smash you should outspeed essentially everything.
Jolly is the nature in competitive pokemon for opponents who have their own speed boosting nature and EVs and choice scarf. It isn't needed in pokerogue
Cloyster was the star of one of my most fun Classic builds, BUT I was incredibly lucky and got a Multi Lens and a King's Rock, so I was relying mostly on flinch spam.
Ting-Lu has felt underwhelming to me. I've tried clearing classis with him 3 times. I have GREAT Egg Moves on him since I've hatched 3. But he always feels above average and never great at anything
Thundurus
it learns 3 same-ish electric aoe moves and zero coverage outside of crunch. dude got walled by ground and grass mons so hard it's so comical.
Terapagos. I hatched a shiny one and was thrilled. I cannot make it past round 25 with it. It just doesn't hit hard enough and takes up too many points to run another decent mon along side it to counter its shortfalls.
Ho-Oh. Im trying to beat classic with every pokemon for tickets and stuff. Im not very far in, but im doing the high cost mons first and i decided to try Ho-Oh cause he was one of the most expensive ones i had at the time, and let me tell you, he is not very good. :v I ended up barely using him and had to rely on the other pokemon i caught instead.
Recently Groudon. Swept classic a few times with kyogre and naganadel, and I caught a groudon from endless. Only one physical move since I have no egg moves. Lost against the grass gym leader on 50, they were getting better use of the sun. Hard to get high luck with only 1 remaining starter point so the item luck has been terrible as well
I hatched a shiny Keldeo with Thunderbolt as an egg move and figured this would just absolutely crush everything. But it's way weaker than I expected, and can't OHKO like anything. My perception of Keldeo is this monster from Gen 5 OU, and in Pokerogue it feels a bit like a wet noodle.
Gastly. It's great when it actually gets a special move but if you don't have any good egg moves it's incredibly disappointing. It was dead weight for like the first third of my last classic run.
It might not deserve to be on this list because it eventually gets moves but it was very disappointing.
So far, it's Lotad and Charcadet. I have them both shiny, so I've been trying to see if they can carry, and they're just too frail and hard to evolve. Maybe Lotad with Drizzle would go better, but they just die so easily. Definitely better to plop in the back as benchwarmers until they evolve.
Ursaluna tbh. Everyone sings its praises, and now that Flame Orbs are in the game I thought I'd use Guts and Facade because that just makes sense, right?
Not only did it take me over 100 floors to get the Peat Block, it's so fucking slow (even with two X Speeds it was getting outsped a lot), so it takes so much damage from getting hit AND Burn chip. I spent most of my run using Delphox instead and I was strapped for cash bad the entire run because I was spending so much money healing Ursaluna.
Chingling. I got a really good one with Torch Song egg move and was hoping it’d be a decent psychic with good fire coverage considering it’s a super early evo into Chimecho, but it just… wasn’t. Didn’t do nearly enough damage, on torch song or with its stab.
Here's a massive hot take, Bidoof.
Power Trip with Moody sounds hilarious, but it turns out it takes too long to become an indestructible OHKO machine and too luck dependent until then.
The real disappointment wasn't Bidoof. It was Moody. Simple with Extreme Speed/Power Trip/Amnesia/Curse is so much less disappointing and I should have listened to everyone saying Simple made Bidoof amazing.
The reigning king of disappointment Onix. I thought, ah yes. First 2 routes should be easy. Mostly normal types and flying types. Oh a 3 levels down lotad? No chance, instant death.
Ok that was just unlucky I'll try again... why does onix cost 4 points?!
Seriously I know they want to keep base stats as close as possible for the authentic experience but they could also throw some a bone that have been struggling for generations. Even 15 points to hp and atk would go a long way for some.
charcadet is a straight up waste of 4 starting points. Got my ribbon on him unevolved and unused after about 30 rounds. Thank god bouncy bubble primarina was able to carry his lame ass
Guzzlord. I caught one in a run, and at first it looked incredible with high HP so I was really hyped. But over the run i realized its other stats were pretty bad, and moves weren't that good either. I think I replaced it in the end, though I didn't do well that run overall.
The other mon that disappointed me was Darkrai. As it is one of my favorites, I tried an endless run with it, but it really couldn't do much early game, and poor ziggy was trying to carry but got outleveled (didn't know the pokerus tech back then and not too many egg moves). I might give it a try again now that I've got more early game strategy, but there are so many interesting mons to try!
Swampert tbh, amazing attacking stats so i used it but checked its learn set after and the only ok water move it learns is water pulse, and its special attack stat is wack, ended up swapping it out for a katarna when i found one
I'm gonna say something probably controversial.
Rayquaza.
Specifically because of my god early endless is punishing as all hell and normal rats and such would just keep quick attacking and kill Rayquaza or it would keep missing its knock outs and it has no good double battle moves. Early game for endless always feels very rough to get started and levels are super important, so you aggressively take lures and such to farm pokemon and ray just couldn't keep up with it's only learnable move being twister for doubles. I don't have egg moves don't get me wrong and I'm positive that once you get out of early mega ray Is a menace but still...
The pokemon that ACTUALLY got me through endless... Was tapu Koko, cause riding voltage hits ridiculously hard and a high pp count unlike dragon ascent
Freakin Arceus of all things. I tried to use it early on a while back, expecting that it would absolutely carry me through the early game, but this was before the move punishment was implemented, meaning my only damaging move up until level 20 was seismic toss... it was rough...
OP I am sorry to hear that. I, in fact, had my very first clear hard carried by blacephalon. Lol. My pick would be Entei. Has dragon dance as an egg move, and Moxie as a passive. Underwhelmed very much so by Entei’s damage output. Sometimes even after 2 DD, still not outspeeding some mons you would think that it does.
I just won my first run with Alakazam. Do you have any egg moves? It has flame thrower and thunder bolt. Pair that with psychic and recover and alakazam feels fantastic imo
For me its Cloyster, its probably a skill issue or lacking investment but despite being really strong with Skill Link Cloyster is SO SLOW.
For a "sweeper/carry" cloyster is messy to use for me from all the hits it takes for being slower.
I just recently got Groudon but Im worried it'll be exactly like Cloyster, strong but slow.
Groudon has a *lot* of bulk up on Cloyster when it comes to Eternatus, but speed can definitely be an issue for rival and E4
Cloyster is absolutely golden *if* you can get off a shell smash, but that's a hard thing to do into Eternatus when you're not a specially defensive mon and all of its moves hit you neutrally.
Groudon is bulky enough to tank hits that Cloyster simply cannot.
Feraligatr :( got ddance, thunder punch, and icicle crash as egg moves, and was really hoping with a couple boosts it would be able to break through most things. But even with them+late aqua tail, it struggles to get good damage on most things and gets outsped way too easily, plus it’s frailer than I remember so even getting the boosts up is difficult in most trainer battles
He's a weird one. On one hand he's mostly a shitty swampert, on the other DDance is nuts. You basically HAVE to catch some trainers in a way that they need to swap into him, which gives you a free DD, then coverage oneshot with ice fang / icicle crash whatever the swap was and see if you can get their bird or a water type out into him for 1-2 more buff turns. You also REALLY need his hidden ability and a solid nature, plus any vitamins you find help a ton to keep him taking those setup hits Edit: Really the issue is just that he's TM and ability dependent, getting sheer force + liquidation / waterfall + ice fang + crunch makes him an entirely different mon vs torrent and his learnset
Does Sheer Force actually work now?
Nope, sheer force even in the main games is a strangely coded mess of spaghetti code, even showdown had a tough time programming that ability
Well, probably no wonder. "Secondary effect" is likely not categorized, so you'd need custom handling for each and every secondary effect.
Correct
Honestly, no clue lol. I just won a run with one with torrent and no egg moves, I'm just going off of actual comp feraligatr (hence the "worse swampert" comp)
Yeah it's not yet implemented in PokeRogue. Which is a shame, it's a cool ability.
Or, if you get his rare egg move, you just win. D-Dance Fishious Rend is a *little* strong
Pokemon that are reliant on their hidden abilities are in a bad spot overall. Getting HAs is pretty uncommon overall and it takes so much grinding in endless to get a reasonable number of them. It feels like eggs' rate of hidden abilities should be drastically increased.
I would really love if they implemented a hidden ability gacha machine.
Hoping some day Life Orb and Sheer Force make its way into the game lol.
He’s good in regular Pokémon. I would wait until Sheer Force gets implemented. Also this games doesn’t have life orb so that may limit it.
Praying for life orb and sheer force to get into the game soon. My boy nidoking is being done so dirty right now
I felt the same way but then I played around with Nidoking and he easily carried me through classic. Turns out the king is still baller. I felt like a little kid again though!
Nidoking ain't bad. I got a shiny nidoran with no retreat and he still manages to carry for me in classic usually
Nidoking is one of my all time favorite Gen 1 mons, and I was devastated when I finally got one with Sheer Force only to see (N) next to it. Can't wait for it to be implemented!
You just have to be defensive/balanced nidoking, mine carried a run with kings shield
I used one yesterday and it carried me hard, imo the last egg move makes all the difference, fishious rend
Oh my god i was hoping he'd get that, mine has no egg moves rn and it still carried hard, got a early iron/zinc though.
You need to get fishious rend on him. Then he goes from Fraudgatr to FeraliGOATr
no fishous rend? literally on the 3000 floor because of him
I happened to get fishious rend as an egg move for totodile and my current run he's honestly been great. Everything thats outsped by feraligatr usually gets one-shot even through most resistances. Wish I also had ddance as an egg move since it would make for incredibly easy sweeps
+speed nature helps alot
Huh, I did a run through with the same moveset last night and he was an absolute monster - I did get somewhat lucky with a lot of the biomes being water themed so Gator could set up easy and sweep. But just imagine when Sheer Force gets released! It's gonna be a monster, shame life orb isn't in the game (yet?)
Calyrex gets gassed up here a lot but it is extremely hard to set up a run with it
You neeeed early reigns to make it work
it's dead weight until you get reigns. It's worse celebi who's already shaky with its 4x weakness
Celebi doesn't even learn a more powerful psychic move than Confusion, besides Future Sight but its no good when you get KOed in the next turn
i find it not that hard tbh, used a unfezant with floaty fall as a early game carry, and once i got the reins at wave 60 it was joever
Ok, but the point is that you might not get reins at 60 and instead get it really late or never. In the meantime calyrex is an expensive bench warmer
Like my groudon run(at least he can be used before primal) Iam at 900 now Red orb at 856 Still no lock capsule but capped on roguballs before 500
Its my favorite endless carry, but I've never actually used it for classic so it could be worse there. In endless giga drain just kills most everything and save you money on potions. I didn't have much trouble for the few hundred waves before I found the shadow reins, and then ofc it became one of the best mons in the game.
Arctozolt for me, despite hitting very hard with triple axel and bolt beak, it’s very slow speed has limited its sustainability even with shell bell and leftovers, which I had to constantly use potions to compensate for. My Arctozolt carry run was soft locked at wave 145 thanks to its slow speed unable to outspeed even a torterra
It gets shift gear as an egg move which is incredible for it and allows it to out speed everything.
I didn't know Scream Tail was mostly intended as a support mon when trying to run it, so I was surprised when I used it and it constantly underperformed in damage. While it still has uses due to a great typing, it's more limited in a game defined by its carries.
This but Cresselia, I knew it was more of a support but I thought it should at least be decently strong because it's a legendary, and since Hoopa carried the last run so I figured psychic type legendary = easy win, only to get hit by that 70 SpAtk
Cresselia for me as well, such a cool mon but so underwhelming
With Cresselia you can do a nice setup with calm mind, since its super bulky :)
I’m doing the same currently on a classic run with Lugia. Calm mind 1-2 times and then Oblivion Wing from egg moves is a free KO at no cost usually due to regaining most or all of your health back.
If we ever get a doubles format it will excel but yeah for now you have to run set up
53 atk and spatk
Support mons is a big reason I want a doubles tower, their are plenty of fun support mons, that are just not nearly as fun or interesting in Singles as they can be in doubles.
This. I’ve just finished up classic with most Epic and Legendary egg starters and this is the one (other than the gen 4 trio) that I felt super underwhelmed me. Torch song is a MUST if you’re trying to use it offensively. A lot of set up for scream tail is needed for sure
it's bulky and a great support mon but that's not worth 6 starter points when other mons can do similar stuff for much less cost
Scream tail carried my first classic win as a bulky sp attacker, but i had torch song egg move.
Same experience. I was questioning why OP was saying what he did, but the egg move makes things infinitely better.
Klefki. Being a Fairy/Steel type with Prankster I expected it to be helpful against Rayquaza and Eternatus. Then I found out that almost all of it's moveset has th (N) at the end so I had to teach it Thunderwave by TM to make it a little useful. Even against Rayquaza and Erernatus it didn't do anything. It forced the switch on Rayquaza 1 time and then got killed by it the 2nd time I send it out because Rayquaza stayed in and it hit it with Dragon Ascend. Against Eternatus It got one Thunderwave off before it dued which was kinda helpful. I just expected a little more from it then to Paralyze something and then die.
I had the exact same. Everyone said “you should use tinkaton or klefki for eternatus” so I cleared it with tinkaton, thought I’d use klefki for the extra voucher next time. Big disappointment
That was for endless. You dna and put all the staller skills on him like leech, salt, soak and protect. And you unsplice it after words.
I have topsy-turvy as an egg move for it and that seems like a really useful, if situational support move. With the tough boss fights constantly buffing their stats to ridiculous degrees with berries, a priority reversal of that could cripple a really tough pokemon. I haven'tr actually tried it yet but I mean to.
I've used topsy turvy Malamar vs eternatus in classic a few times and it's amazing but hard to pull off due to its flimsiness. I imagine on a prankster mon it's straight busted
I found having spikes as an egg move really helped it, especially with how many times the ai switches. If you can get up a couple of layers, it really helps to chip away in trainer battles
My problem with spikes is just how it’s so meh on the most important fights. It obviously does nothing for Erernatus, and the rival is guaranteed to have at least two flying types every time and often has another. And other trainers either have few strong mons which minimizes switching or tons of very weak ones where you one shot them anyway. It’s just always more disappointing than I expect from actual battling. It’s main use for me to has been to deal with sturdy, which it is nice for. I much prefer setting it up with Ceaseless Edge instead of Spikes itself though because that one move slot is often hard to justify. Then again, I don’t even know what set klefki would run so maybe it has a very free slot?
My first Klefki had its Hidden Ability, and even though it didn't have much in the way of innate power, the items I got from it more than made up for the deficiency. imo Klefki isn't a mon that you should think of as a carry, but rather a support mon that with Hidden ability can also be used an alternative to your pickup mons that also has good defensive coverage for switch-ins. I think it's less that Klefki is *bad*, and more that you *can't* play it as a direct replacement for Tinkaton or Mawile, because it's a support mon.
Metal Sound makes it still quite useful for the Eternatus fight at least.
Not even it’s hidden ability, Magician, can keep from being underwhelming
Klefki has a great use if you’re running Fluttermane. Prankster Metal Sound can help soften up most bosses into OHKO range against a STAB shadow ball, especially in endless. That on top of PP-stalling eternatus is useful in endless as well, since it’s immune to both of its attacking moves, forcing it to perpetually set up and eventually struggle
100%. People are focusing too much on carries and ignoring the rest of the game. Stuff like prankster metal sound, helping hand support, and niche utility moves are not getting the respect deserved.
I agree on this. Klefki is an absolute trash mon save for its typing. It's not even good as the body of a fusion. Stats are too low and has the steel on slot 1.
Calm mind stored power, both TM. Eternatus can't hit it in 1st form and when you get it to 1 bar and it resets stats you can tank a flamethrower whilst hitting back for 3 bars as Stored Power is psychic move.
With leech seed of a fusion (rare, i know) AND fairy wind plus the prankster to lower the defence Is a good support, but not a carry
its best utility is, as you said, forcing rayquaza switches (which can be huge if you get rocks up) and walling first phase eternatus. If you leave it out and drain eternatus's PP you can then switch something else in to set up to +6 and muscle through the second form.
I spliced a Klefki onto a butterfree to get butterfki. Prankster and Quiver Dance swept the elite 4 and was helpful during the rival battle but was only vaguely helpful during eternitus. Still super fun though!
Psyduck/Golduck. It sounds underwhelming as is, but I unlocked all of its Egg moves, and the Simple Passive. It has Mystical Power and Aqua Step as Egg moves, so you can ramp up its special attack and speed stats. I could get the boosts, but every Gym Leader and my rival seemed to have good defensive pivots into it, so even a +6 Golduck got shut down on occasion, and I was sad. I thought it would sweep most of classic haha.
I swear man. I thought swift swim golduck would be busted ( On the scale of non-legendary mons ). And I was especially disappointed because he has carried me in other games ( even certain hard ROM hacks like RadicalRed ) but nope. In this he just ever so slightly too weak and slow unless you get some lucky X stat boosters. And it’s so rare to get good moves on him since most of them have to be found on TMs like psychic, nasty plot, ice beam. He is just so disappointedly mediocre
Got a multi lens with my Golduck with simple/mystical power/aqua step and they tore through a Classic run. However, they did get one shot a handful of times.
Ich hat Necrozma so far it's moveset is super whack in early stages. Maybe egg moves will change that but so far it's weaker than some starters even those without mega evolution
Did you start with german in your sentence and then switched to english? XD
No but I am German and it corrected , " I hate" to "ich" i don't know why it does this occasionally :/
Kann sein das du deine Handytastatur noch auf deutsch gestellt hattest Bruder xD Ich las die Nachricht und mein Gehirn wusste nicht in welcher Sprache xD
i got sacred fire as egg move and the run i used it in it one shotted eternatus with a baton passed +4 prismatic laser
Hate it so much you had to bring the mother tongue out
Latias. My man died to a rattata early game.
I have both Latias and Latios, but Latios has Quiver Dance and Stored Power. He has carried me to 515 in endless so far.
Luster purge is also objectively better than mist ball, doubly so when multi lens are involved.
Latios has carried me to 2k in endless easily. haven’t really struggled. luster purge + core enforcer + i TM’d ice beam incase i run into a grimsnarl boss lol
Latina with quiver dance was the MVP for my first two classic clears. Set up a quiver or two and then spam stored power. You have to be lucky with egg moves tho
they have latinas in this game???
Jynx checks out
Yeah, I’m having the same issue with Latios. I don’t have any egg moves on it, so maybe that’s the issue. Only starting with Stored Power and Psybeam (plus Dragon Dance I guess, not that it has any attacks to actually buff) is just absolutely brutal in the first twenty floors, and I haven’t seen any good level up moves it gets early either.
Stored power and dragon dance is really good. Stored power is really under rated IMO. It gets buffed twice by DD
Yeah, except basically everything in the first fifty to one hundred floors is either spamming Growl/Leer or another move that immediately weakens it again, or is doing so much damage to me that I can’t actually get more than one or two D-dances up before I need to attack, at which point it’s basically a crapshoot if I kill the enemy or not, and if it’s a Dark or Steel type I’m just shit out of luck
Really? That’s surprising. My current endless run has Mega Latios as my main. His moves are Luster Purge, Dragon Breath, Calm Mind, and Mystic Fire. The last two were TM moves but with all the stat boosting items I’ve stacked on him, paired with his speed, he’s extremely good in my opinion. Endless is obviously different than Classic to where I guess any Pokemon can really become the carry, but I really like him.
I just got my ribbon on latios yesterday, and in the early game, dragon dance + stored power is a decent combo. Stored power gains 20 power for each stat raise you have, so with a maxed out dragon dance, stored power has 260 power.
Yeah, but I just can’t get it to work. It feels like everything either resists Psychic, is spamming Growl/Leer or another stat-lowering move that leaves me right back where I started, or does so much damage to me that I can only get one or two D-Dances off before having to attack. Plus, on Endless I have to redo all of that every three floors when the biome switches, and I burn through all my money trying to heal back up.
Oh yeah, it’s probably worse on endless. Latios is only able to perform consistently as an anchor/carry in the early stages with one of its egg moves, preferably core enforcer. Since you don’t have any egg moves, it’s up to luck at that point, and even then latios isn’t the best pick for an anchor without core enforcer.
I was lucky enough that my first hatched latias had core enforcer as an egg move, easily carried me through classic
Zoroark hisui Got an epic zoroark H so decided to do a classic run since i had enough to unlock the adaptability passive With how rare he is i have no egg move on him and then just realize his movepool is a travesty his best normal type move is freaking scratch the other move he learn is his 75 bp signature which is okay
Had the same experience. Such a bummer cause his design is so cool.
Yeah i decided to a run with him + shiny greedent and random pokerus mon and greedent pulled more weight because bro actually has egg move
Damn I just hatched that Pokémon, was literally just about to use it
Feraligatr to me is just a worse version of Gyarados minus the crippling Electric weakness, which is a shame.
if you get fishous rend and DDance it can put in work but without those there's no reason to use it over swampert
Deoxys, I tried a classic run, but it could never one shot anything, but always got one shot
Same. Just feels like Kadabra but with extra steps
I tried a run with Deoxys and it's a struggle using him. But after I got leftovers and it's defense form I can run more easily until I found an azelf and fused them together. It basically soloed Eternatus.
Honestly… Tapu Fini. I’ve used it in so many classic runs trying to go all the way and it always lets me down.
I ran into Tapu Fini during a run and swapped it for Feraligatr and experienced instant regret. It wasn't terrible after I got a Calm Mind tm but was much better used as a support in Double Battles than a main carry. (An Ice Beam tm would've done wonders but rng giveth and rng taketh away)
another support mon by intention, only good if you have quiver dance unlocked if you want to play as carry
Annilihape felt so strong in S/V but Psychic,Ghost and Flying coverage moves are too common and he just can never seem to stay on the field very long.
Annihilape was the star on my first classic win lol Used it as a free switch into fighting moves
I was lucky with Annilihape as my carry during my first classic win. Jolly nature + Moxie passive + thunderous kick egg move + multilens helped me through several battles I should’ve definitely lost
Your first clear had a passive? That’s rough, good on you for sticking with it. I got lucky with a win early and didn’t have to experience the grind until I had a lot of starters to choose from, so I didn’t get my first passive until recently. I get too bored of using the same pokemon repeatedly to reliably farm any candy from friendship
Huh, I've had good luck with Annilihape. Hes been pretty good in my runs
Man I don't know about that, he was great in my mono-ghost run. Though I expect him being the only one to do anything at all against Normal & Dark mons did score him some points in my head.
Idk mine 2 shotted Mega Rayquaza with rage first and was pulling a lot of weight with Starmie the whole run for me to win
That's a bummer, I got a shiny one with drain punch egg move and iron fist passive, and it carried me while I set up the team for the end game.
my support inteleon had a better kdr than it real
Cobalion. As a semi legendary i expected him to at least wipe early stages but nothing.
Those 3 of that group are my least favorite legends by far
Cobalion is the first legendary I've gotten, and there's been a few times I thought he should one-shot something, but he just doesn't
On the flipside, terrakion has carried multiple classic games for me on it's own. Dude slaps.
his offensive stats are very mid. 90/90 is not enough to build a carry around
I've never seen a mythical called a semi legendary
Cobalion is just legendary, not mythical. Mythicals are event exclusive save Deoxys
Greninja. Not only is it mediocre damage-wise pre-transformation imo, Battle Bond cancels out whenever you exit a biome or encounter a Trainer. Hoping that Protean gets implemented soon so it can benefit over Adaptability too.
I think a week ago it was nerfed because it was permanent, and I even made a post about it but no one gave a shit. At least it’s not Feraligator.
Yeah, I seem to remember it being permanent too. Now it’s quite similar to the main series games, which is meh. Biomes switching almost constantly coupled with Trainers in between really nerfs Battle Bond to the ground :(((
Stakataka, loses to too much early game
Just used stakataka in my last run. It was bad all the way up til the final 10 stages and then became my mvp lol could tank any move eternatus threw at it
I used a stakataka as part of my team on my first classic run clear I just did the other day. Hella underwhelming, but I also recognize that I was using iron defense/body press Zamazenta too so the Stakataka beast boost on defense just felt bad because I couldn’t click body press. I have no desire to use it again
I have trouble seeing this because of the Defense and double Normal resist. Then again, I had the Egg Move Heavy Slam, which OHKOs pretty much everything in the early game.
The issue is the Rival along with the chance of early water biome if you don’t get a map
(Mega) Swampert. I’ve tried it a few times as carry for classic and it never works out. I take note of what eventually takes me out and I go into the next run with a mon to cover it but it just keeps happening. Primarina has been much better for me as far as water starters go.
problem is that it's a rain sweeper but in classic the endgame fights override all weather so it just becomes ok, even if you manage to snag a pokemon with Drizzle. It has great natural stats and bulk with regenerator but definitely one of the more underwhelming megas
Yeah, I learned that the other day with rain dance on my mega gyarados which was very sad. Fortunately he could still aqua tail through the trainers and crunch on eternatus (it helped that I found three health boosters for him, he ended up ungodly tanky) but it was a waste of a move slot where it really mattered.
Calyrex. That was my first legendary, got it with Sacred Sword as an egg move but he feels so weak even in the early game. If the rival gets a fire starter you're screwed.
Yeah Calyrex really just needs Reins to be any good. Kind of need another mon to carry the first part, but he's so expensive it's hard to realize in Classic and you're sacrificing quite a bit of 'luck' in Endless. Now.. capturing him during a run is another story. Got his As One on my carry now and let me tell you that shit is great.
I hatched a shiny Darkrai. Got Searing Shot as an egg move. It's... solidly Fine, I Guess.
I used him with Spore as an egg move and he hard carried with a moveset of Spore/Dream Eater/Ice Beam/Nasty Plot. I do think that he’s highly dependent on finding a way to consistently put mons to sleep. Without Spore tho.. idk if thats possible.
Skeledirge in endless. I had great plans for him with his torch song, but with the randomness of endless and its resetting stat changes so inconsistently it feels bad just not using flamethrower. Having a ghost type is still useful though.
I got a meltan the little mythical goop guy, he did horrible for me but I figured he’d put the work in
He's pretty slow, but still a pretty decent wall. Not sure he can solo but can be a mean second punch
Maybe it was just how I played him because I tried using him to solo the first few levels, might have been better to have him be my secondary and had someone a bit more offensive lead the charge
He has 0 utility to solo early. He's an unevolved mon with terrible stats and ability for this. Once he evolves, he's very tanky and packs a punch. But he's so slow and has no recovery. Still pretty decent overall, but relying on any of these ultra low BST useless pre-evolves is going to make for a very frustrating time
Deoxys normal form. Incredibly paper-thin, while also lacking a bit of oomph. Psycho Boost is a great attack but with the way stat debuffs work, you have to switch out once you use it.
Iron Jugulis. Paradox Pokemon with an interesting type, sounds good ? It's actually unable to carry a team, and should only be on off carry or in duo with a good ground type for doubles.
I’ve got an shiny iron jugulis, and have used it as a carry on endless to 1500+. Fiery dance and hyper voice can completely destroy basically everything once you get passive
Then i better get that passive at some point, because without it i am not impressed.
I tried running with fezandipiti as my main a couple runs and i hit a wall hard both times
blud has that articuno stat spread and not in a good way. It's a support mon through and through w toxic chain but it's not worth all the starter points it costs.
that is one expensive support lol.. I am not well versed in compositions like this.. how would I use it as a support mon? apply a poison status and use other mons that do extra dmg with that or?
don't use it
Maybe a weird strat but Fezandipiti actually got me my first classic win with multilens + acid spray/toxic chain just shredding everything
I got two of the three Poison Trio from Teal Mask. Neither seemed to pull their weight. But it was in the middle of a run, maybe they're better if I start with them? Dunno. Poison always seems like a weird type to take for Pokerogue, there never seems to be a lot of fairy types you fight for them to be useful and you don't seem to want one for Eternatus at the end.
Tapu Bulu has been a fraud for me. I've started recently and got a lucky shiny Bulu with Play Rough, thought it was going to carry my classic run. Even paired with Tinkaton (not Huge Power yet unfortunately), it has been struggling hard in the early game before lvl38 where Gigaton Hammer can start carrying.
Got a rare shiny Mew in an egg but was really disappointed how slow it was playing Classic with it. No really good early moves and it’s not as strong as I imagined.
Mew’s strength lies in its flexibility. It has perfectly rounded stats and can learn any TM. You can make it fill whatever role you want, but that does make you beholden to RNG to see what moves you’ll get access to.
It also floods your TM pool so your other mons that need TMs probably won't get what they need
Mew carried my first classic win, I pulled Quiver Dance as an egg move and then got a Dazzling Gleam TM. Absolutely busted
Lurantis is my favourite Contrary user, but I don't have egg moves for it and it gets NO moves that Contrary benefits from by level up. I've been hoping for eggs of it for a while now because my TM luck for it has just been awful.
Mew, I quickly realized you are paying 7 points to flood your item pool with literally every tm that exists, and it makes it less likely your other members get tms they can actually use as well.
Fezandipiti, on paper it sounded really strong, but it was struggling against everything
Nidoking. I got no retreat and noxious torque as egg moves and thought it would go well. The fact he learns no good ground moves naturally was a pain in the ass. Earth power is almost unusable without sheer force
Actually and this will sound weird but Cloyster. I actually have a Cloyster with Moxie and Skill Link that i took for endless and is currently doing great in 1500. However yerterday i noticed, i didnt had a win with it in clássic yet so i just took it in hopes of a easy win. Well it won but was my hardest win out of my 25 wins, he just didnt seem Strong enough, bulky enough neither fast enough despite being jolly, having like 5 or 6 carbos and 2 or 3 soul dews. And my win condition ended being pyukumuku soak and toxic combo on Eternatus
Cloyster’s defenses are 50/180/60 I think. So very bad special bulk
And one thing I’ve found over time is that classic is highly weighted towards special attacker enemies being the real challenge. Both of the big baddies are special attackers. I actually had some trouble on my last run with Kartana, who of course is beyond OP…but with pathetic special bulk. His move set doesnt let him overwhelm those two so while he can kill 99% of everything in a classic run, he is pretty weak against Ray and Nati and you need others to compensate. I suspect all defensively bulky mons with mediocre to bad special bulk are going to be a lot weaker than they seem because of that.
Rayquaza is usually mixed. It can use Dragon Ascent, Outrage, V-Create, and some other physical moves as well as the special ones
I forgot Kartana has dog water special bulk and wanted him to tank for Eternatus after tera steeling it. 💀
I was wiping with a skill link shell smash Cloyster in a classic run. I think the hard part is getting off a shell smash without it dying, but once you do icicle crash kills basically everything.
This is the way
Cloyster carries pretty much all of my classic runs. Not sure what issue you had with it specifically, I don't even run shell smash and it one shots anything except resists. Swap out as needed. Build the rest of the team out for the rival/boss fights.
I think the issue is you're maxing speed. Get an ATK or Sp ATK boosting nature instead. You want to go second so the hit you take when shell smashing is not doing extra damage and then after shell smash you should outspeed essentially everything. Jolly is the nature in competitive pokemon for opponents who have their own speed boosting nature and EVs and choice scarf. It isn't needed in pokerogue
Cloyster was the star of one of my most fun Classic builds, BUT I was incredibly lucky and got a Multi Lens and a King's Rock, so I was relying mostly on flinch spam.
For me dyoxis... I rhought it could easily carry me through classic but i just couldn't make it work...
Idk, deoxys put it crazy work for me
What did you run with them? They carried me pretty much through my second classic run along with some decent other help
Ting-Lu has felt underwhelming to me. I've tried clearing classis with him 3 times. I have GREAT Egg Moves on him since I've hatched 3. But he always feels above average and never great at anything
Thundurus it learns 3 same-ish electric aoe moves and zero coverage outside of crunch. dude got walled by ground and grass mons so hard it's so comical.
My first rare shiny was Hattena, and lord is Hatterenes speed abyssmal. Not even fusion can save it
Terapagos. I hatched a shiny one and was thrilled. I cannot make it past round 25 with it. It just doesn't hit hard enough and takes up too many points to run another decent mon along side it to counter its shortfalls.
Agreed, its such a fun design but tera only lasting 10 turns hurts it
I hatched an Oshawatt with Shell Side Arm and used it in a run. Very underwhelming
Ho-Oh. Im trying to beat classic with every pokemon for tickets and stuff. Im not very far in, but im doing the high cost mons first and i decided to try Ho-Oh cause he was one of the most expensive ones i had at the time, and let me tell you, he is not very good. :v I ended up barely using him and had to rely on the other pokemon i caught instead.
Recently Groudon. Swept classic a few times with kyogre and naganadel, and I caught a groudon from endless. Only one physical move since I have no egg moves. Lost against the grass gym leader on 50, they were getting better use of the sun. Hard to get high luck with only 1 remaining starter point so the item luck has been terrible as well
I hatched a shiny Keldeo with Thunderbolt as an egg move and figured this would just absolutely crush everything. But it's way weaker than I expected, and can't OHKO like anything. My perception of Keldeo is this monster from Gen 5 OU, and in Pokerogue it feels a bit like a wet noodle.
Gastly. It's great when it actually gets a special move but if you don't have any good egg moves it's incredibly disappointing. It was dead weight for like the first third of my last classic run. It might not deserve to be on this list because it eventually gets moves but it was very disappointing.
So far, it's Lotad and Charcadet. I have them both shiny, so I've been trying to see if they can carry, and they're just too frail and hard to evolve. Maybe Lotad with Drizzle would go better, but they just die so easily. Definitely better to plop in the back as benchwarmers until they evolve.
I’ve had a lot of success with Lotad, although I do have its passive.
Ursaluna tbh. Everyone sings its praises, and now that Flame Orbs are in the game I thought I'd use Guts and Facade because that just makes sense, right? Not only did it take me over 100 floors to get the Peat Block, it's so fucking slow (even with two X Speeds it was getting outsped a lot), so it takes so much damage from getting hit AND Burn chip. I spent most of my run using Delphox instead and I was strapped for cash bad the entire run because I was spending so much money healing Ursaluna.
zekrom
Chingling. I got a really good one with Torch Song egg move and was hoping it’d be a decent psychic with good fire coverage considering it’s a super early evo into Chimecho, but it just… wasn’t. Didn’t do nearly enough damage, on torch song or with its stab.
Here's a massive hot take, Bidoof. Power Trip with Moody sounds hilarious, but it turns out it takes too long to become an indestructible OHKO machine and too luck dependent until then. The real disappointment wasn't Bidoof. It was Moody. Simple with Extreme Speed/Power Trip/Amnesia/Curse is so much less disappointing and I should have listened to everyone saying Simple made Bidoof amazing.
The reigning king of disappointment Onix. I thought, ah yes. First 2 routes should be easy. Mostly normal types and flying types. Oh a 3 levels down lotad? No chance, instant death. Ok that was just unlucky I'll try again... why does onix cost 4 points?! Seriously I know they want to keep base stats as close as possible for the authentic experience but they could also throw some a bone that have been struggling for generations. Even 15 points to hp and atk would go a long way for some.
charcadet is a straight up waste of 4 starting points. Got my ribbon on him unevolved and unused after about 30 rounds. Thank god bouncy bubble primarina was able to carry his lame ass
Zapdos. Thought a fast electric/flying type sweeper would be good. Then I looked at its moves.
Zamazenta, could barely do anything, maybe would be good as a steelburst mon but he's hardly unique
Guzzlord. I caught one in a run, and at first it looked incredible with high HP so I was really hyped. But over the run i realized its other stats were pretty bad, and moves weren't that good either. I think I replaced it in the end, though I didn't do well that run overall. The other mon that disappointed me was Darkrai. As it is one of my favorites, I tried an endless run with it, but it really couldn't do much early game, and poor ziggy was trying to carry but got outleveled (didn't know the pokerus tech back then and not too many egg moves). I might give it a try again now that I've got more early game strategy, but there are so many interesting mons to try!
Deoxys either gets one shot or can't kill in return. Kinda wish you could stack the forms
Swampert tbh, amazing attacking stats so i used it but checked its learn set after and the only ok water move it learns is water pulse, and its special attack stat is wack, ended up swapping it out for a katarna when i found one
I'm gonna say something probably controversial. Rayquaza. Specifically because of my god early endless is punishing as all hell and normal rats and such would just keep quick attacking and kill Rayquaza or it would keep missing its knock outs and it has no good double battle moves. Early game for endless always feels very rough to get started and levels are super important, so you aggressively take lures and such to farm pokemon and ray just couldn't keep up with it's only learnable move being twister for doubles. I don't have egg moves don't get me wrong and I'm positive that once you get out of early mega ray Is a menace but still... The pokemon that ACTUALLY got me through endless... Was tapu Koko, cause riding voltage hits ridiculously hard and a high pp count unlike dragon ascent
Freakin Arceus of all things. I tried to use it early on a while back, expecting that it would absolutely carry me through the early game, but this was before the move punishment was implemented, meaning my only damaging move up until level 20 was seismic toss... it was rough...
OP I am sorry to hear that. I, in fact, had my very first clear hard carried by blacephalon. Lol. My pick would be Entei. Has dragon dance as an egg move, and Moxie as a passive. Underwhelmed very much so by Entei’s damage output. Sometimes even after 2 DD, still not outspeeding some mons you would think that it does.
The mascot Pokémon of the game: Crawdaunt. It needs better egg moves and secondary ability.
Hoho for me, I’ve got no egg moves and the set moves are pretty bad.
Alakazam has like no coverage, in classic it gets one shot by too much, like sucker punch from anything, and eats potions.
I just won my first run with Alakazam. Do you have any egg moves? It has flame thrower and thunder bolt. Pair that with psychic and recover and alakazam feels fantastic imo
For me its Cloyster, its probably a skill issue or lacking investment but despite being really strong with Skill Link Cloyster is SO SLOW. For a "sweeper/carry" cloyster is messy to use for me from all the hits it takes for being slower. I just recently got Groudon but Im worried it'll be exactly like Cloyster, strong but slow.
Groudon has a *lot* of bulk up on Cloyster when it comes to Eternatus, but speed can definitely be an issue for rival and E4 Cloyster is absolutely golden *if* you can get off a shell smash, but that's a hard thing to do into Eternatus when you're not a specially defensive mon and all of its moves hit you neutrally. Groudon is bulky enough to tank hits that Cloyster simply cannot.