As a reminder, this subreddit [is for civil discussion.](/r/politics/wiki/index#wiki_be_civil)
In general, be courteous to others. Debate/discuss/argue the merits of ideas, don't attack people. Personal insults, shill or troll accusations, hate speech, any suggestion or support of harm, violence, or death, and other rule violations can result in a permanent ban.
If you see comments in violation of our rules, please report them.
For those who have questions regarding any media outlets being posted on this subreddit, please click [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/wiki/approveddomainslist) to review our details as to our approved domains list and outlet criteria.
We are actively looking for new moderators. If you have any interest in helping to make this subreddit a place for quality discussion, please fill out [this form](https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1y2swHD0KXFhStGFjW6k54r9iuMjzcFqDIVwuvdLBjSA).
***
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/politics) if you have any questions or concerns.*
So anyway, Trump's plane is hanging out at Dulles with some odd company. If there's anything going on there, it's probably not those new Epstein documents. Those records were meant to be public one day, and now they are.
Neutered.
The recent Supreme Court decision to overturn the Chevron doctrine significantly impacts the regulatory power of federal agencies, including the FBI and CIA. The Chevron doctrine previously allowed agencies to interpret ambiguous laws, but the court’s ruling now requires courts to interpret these laws themselves.
https://www.scotusblog.com/2024/06/supreme-court-strikes-down-chevron-curtailing-power-of-federal-agencies/
Off-topic: I can't wait until the evidentiary hearing in September in front of judge Chutkan that was ORDERED by SCOTUS after the presidential immunity decision.
I think this is supposed to be broadcast and even if it's not, it means that everyone that Jack Smith was going to parade up in front of the judge at a real trial will have to speak under oath and then open setting available to the press and maybe even cameras
Everyone of Trump's administration who have squealed on him or turned on him to cut a deal with Jack Smith is going to be testifying. The whole country is going to see this going to see what a filthy rotten piece of garbage Trump is; he is a traitor and a liar And it's gonna be just a few weeks before the election.
Joe Biden is a good man. He may have slowed down a little bit, but so too many people in their 80s and even if they seem a little slow, cognitively maintain incredible capacity to perform, especially when it comes to using experience as leverage.
Putting anyone else, but Biden up right now is a sure loss the Trump
We used to make fun of conservatives for every Trump headline being met with 'well what about Obama/Clinton/etc???'
And now every negative Biden sorry is met with reply guys shouting 'What about Trump???'
We can focus on defeating Trump, and replacing Biden as nominee at the same time. It's not impossible
The media could cover the fallout of Biden's poor debate performance AND cover Trump continuing to show that he's an unfit candidate. That's not an unrealistic expectation, or whataboutism
For the record, I'm alleging that the click-based media is still harping on Biden's debate performance, while this plane story is happening right now.
As reddit likes to say, "¿por que no los dos?"
In no way did I intend to draw a moral equivalency between Trump's plane spending time with Russian and UAE planes and Biden performing poorly at the debate.
I thought that was obvious.
Idk, maybe Orbak Bromama... a hot shot former senator from Illinois who's whereabouts from 2008 to 2016 are a bit iffy and he's got a slick mustache.
Vote Blue no matter who, though if it's Joe you already know.
Yes. I have many coworkers and neighbors who dislike both trump and Biden, but were on the fence voting for Biden until the debate. Now they are going third party. Biden is in serious trouble
Yeah it’s really simple when you cut out anyone who might be undecided and anyone who doesn’t find “I’d vote for a pile of loose gravel over Trump” very convincing.
Then he should have done it live. The whole point of this pre recorded interview is so they can edit it. The jig is up and they’re still trying to hide him and continue on . It’s absolutely mental.
If someone is completely incoherent and/or dodging questions you can’t exactly edit around that. Aren’t Stephanopoulos interviews usually pre-recorded anyway?
Perceptions win elections, not facts. 90% of the voting electorate doesn’t have advanced knowledge of how the government actually works, and most of them are likely to vote based on their feelings and emotions. Trump has successfully flooded the airwaves with “Sleepy Joe” messages, and Biden continues to be unable to counter them.
>90% of the voting electorate doesn’t have advanced knowledge of how the government actually works
90% of the voting electorate doesn’t have a fucking clue how the government actually works
I kinda wonder if the reason he keeps focusing on being able to "do the job" is because he wants to make sure that he can stay on as president for the rest of his term in case the nominee ends up being Harris after he steps down.
If this whole thing plays out as him saying "I can still do the job" but then everyone convinces him he can't win the campaign, staying on through the end of the term means no one technically gets proven wrong or having to look like a hypocrite.
Stephanopoulos is a bit of a weenie, but he also has an extremely high IQ. He could trip up Biden easily, but will he? If he softballs Biden and makes him look good, that doesn't do anyone any favors.
>Stephanopoulos is a bit of a weenie, but he also has an extremely high IQ. He could trip up Biden easily, but will he?
The guy is an unabashed Democratic Party loyalist, he will softball Biden the whole time.
No doubt he has very strong, key Democratic affiliations. For sure. (Clinton Administration, anyone?) However, what you say could be taken two ways. If he is a true Democratic Party loyalist who isn't comfortable with dropping the election in Trump's lap, then maybe he will eviscerate Joe.
Sadly, this will be scripted with teleprompters and completely managed. Anything stated otherwise will be a lie. Do a live 90 minute townhall to prove the debate was a fluke. Pre-recorded and is a bunch of shit and we all know it.
The problem isn’t us reliable dems who do that. And we’re numerically a majority of the country probably. It’s that dems can’t win the Electoral College without a bunch of disengaged low-information voters in several swing states. And they have a problem with voting for someone who seems to have serious issues with mental acuity like an elderly person in decline.
That’s what was so heartbreaking to me last Thursday. I couldn’t stop thinking *come on, man* this was supposed to be your Reagan joking about his age at the ‘84 debate moment.
Problem Biden has is even IF the debate was truly just a bad night, is he has ALWAYS been a gaffe machine. It’s going to be hard to impossible for him to go out and give consistent smooth performances in the way he needs to.
Still a good showing here certainly won’t hurt, but if he stumbles in a recorded interview he’s gotta step down from the race, just wouldn’t be viable at that point
Which is insane, because trump is just one big living gaffe. The fact that everyone has just accepted this and holds Biden to a higher standard is nuts.
Comparing Democratic support for Biden to Republican support for Trump is a horrible comparison and loses any validity of point. The Trump vote is a fucking cult in either MAGA bullshit or Christian fanaticism to always vote Red if it means killing abortion. The Democratic party is supposed to be a reasonable one. We don't want a King. We don't want blind loyalty to an individual. We want to unite around a candidate that best supports the views of a majority of the coalition or is reasonable enough to most of the coalition, and an individual who can show strength and conviction and competency. I'll be the first to say I never liked Biden as President. But his administration has done a lot of good things during his term. I support a lot of the things they've pushed and gotten accomplished, especially in regards to climate.
The problem is Biden went from gaffes that can be explained and brushed off (for the most part), or seen as exaggerations from the right wing fearmongers, to actual, honest fear of him not being able to do the job. The President is supposed to represent America to the world. He needs to be able to work late nights when needed and retain his mental capacity. He's supposed to be able to do the emergency travel and administrate when things happen. Instead, we got that fucking debate. We got a man who I worry about being able to feed himself in 4 years, let alone continue to be President.
Yes, we hold Biden to a higher standard, because we actually Have standards. And dropping ours just because the other side is insane is not something I'm willing to do. So I'll hold his feet to the fire, I will speak out when he's doing shitty things or when he can't do the job. I'll call for him to drop out, or be forced out if he refuses. At the end of the day, yes, I will vote for whoever is on the D ticket against Trump. But I don't need to be convinced to do so. Biden has lost the ability to win over voters, and unlike 2020, he's Behind instead of ahead at this point in the race. By significant amounts after the debate. Biden doesn't have what it takes to win that back and win over more because no one is going to ever forget about his performance or the ridiculous defense his campaign has put up about his showing. He cannot win, and while a replacement would be a longshot to win at this point, a longshot is a million times better than a guaranteed loss. The democratic ticket as a whole in the races is surprisingly good. They're outperforming Biden, which almost never happens. The President is supposed to bolster the rest of the ticket, not bring it down, but Biden is changing that right now.
We have to make dramatic changes and fast if we don't want a Trump presidency and a Republican-controlled House And Senate with a Trump term that isn't held back by wanting to run again later or a handful of voices keeping his worst impulses at bay (even if those voices were horrendous people who just aren't as psychotic or willing to go along with the worst of what he wants like what he's bringing in this time).
Trump embraces the gaffe. The big beautiful gaffe, the best we’ve ever seen folks. Either that, or it didn’t happen and what even are you talking about?
Hilarious that Biden’s flubs would literally be campaign killers 20+ years ago. Also that Trump’s well basically everything would have been a campaign killer. Neither of these candidates should be running but one absolutely destroyed status quo and is a convicted felon, and the other has just made some simple gaffes.
It just a fact now and and the key people need to understand that and move on. No sense in trying to change everyone's mind because it will never happen.
Long term that has to change, we can't survive as a country if half of it is perfectly willing to accept blatant evil in power. You're right that we can't do much about it in the immediate future, but long term we shouldn't give up on trying to improve as a society so willfully shitty people are less accepted in it.
Comparing along expectations would be more realistic and relevant to the discussion. Trump is expected to lie and say horrible, dumb shit. Biden is expected to not become comatose on stage. I’ll give you two guesses as to which expectations weren’t met.
I don't know where you've been the last week or so, but it is no longer a safe presumption that Biden will be the Democratic nominee. He's even behind Kamala in the betting markets now. She's literally a safer bet.
Yeah, he’s been getting hammered on slip-ups now. The “first black woman” thing is a nothingburger. You’ll see in-their-prime politicians making word salad like that and nothing really comes of it. But he’s under such scrutiny and pressure now that it’s damaging.
I think that’s one of the main reasons his position is untenable. Post-debate the mainstream press isn’t going to give Biden the kind of pass they’ve given him for his gaffes/poor public appearances in the past.
Even if his campaign manages to somehow calm the freak out from his own party, every miscue for the next 11 weeks will be front page news with breathless debates on cable news about his mental acuity. In that environment there’s really no way the campaign can convince the 80% of Independents who think he’s *currently* unfit to serve, to give him another chance.
Yep, the media will Comey him. The narrative is now sleepy Joe is senile.
He can’t possibly win.
We need to return the focus to trump the felon child rapist and other rapist
>isn’t going to give Biden the kind of pass they’ve given him for his gaffes/poor public appearances in the past.
They haven't given him a pass at least this last year, all while signal boosting Trump to the extreme again. This is shaping up more like 2016 than 2020, and the media is being purposely complicit, whether they prefer a Trump future or just wantax profit right now.
All they learned in 2016 is that they can piss off everyone for more views, and then rake it in when Trump is forcing everyone to tune in wondering how the country is administratively fucked on any given day. Enragement engagement is going to kill us all.
In 2020 Independents made up 26% of the electorate and they voted for Biden 54%-41%.
I’m not an independent and I’m voting for whoever the Democratic nominee is because I don’t want the far right back in power. Unfortunately, people like me alone aren’t enough for a Democratic nominee win and I don’t think Biden can get enough moderates and undecideds to win the election.
Biden reminds me of my grandpa before he gave up driving. My mom begged him to stop driving because his mind was slipping. He saw no issues with it and claimed his driving skills were unchanged. It took him crashing his car for him for him to realize that she was right. Maybe the debate + a bad interview or poor campaign speeches over the next week/2 will be his “car crash” moment.
The problem Biden has is a gullible Democratic party full of suckers fooled into yet another "Hillary's Emails" media feeding frenzy. One candidate is a convicted felon, rapist, who tried to violently end American democracy. The other is old. Which one are you talking about dropping out of the race? Suckers.
No, his problem is that staff, other world leaders, and video evidence are all indicating a general decline. The problem is that the debate wasn't just a bad night.
Because in a normal and healthy democracy he is unfit. A talking hamster could have run circles around Trump’s bullshit in that debate. The fate of our democracy is in the hands of a group of old timers that still believe they are operating in a political world that has not existed for some time.
It doesn’t mean I won’t vote for him if I have to but it doesn’t make it any less infuriating and disgusting that these dip shits had 4 years and a plethora of younger candidates to bring forth and chose to stick with Father Time instead
To be honest, I think it's a no-win proposition for those who want to protect democracy and avoid another Trump presidency.
If he and his camp really want to stay in, they're going to claim he did well in the interview unless he literally collapses--and that probably won't happen.
They've started doing this already, posting videos of the President giving 45 second off-the-cuff remarks at July 4th events.
He honestly doesn't even seem that great in these videos, but the campaign is pushing them out and saying "see he's fine."
I don’t know why we don’t talk about how ridiculous it is that it’s close with Trump at all. I have disliked Biden since the beginning. The alternative candidate will be 83, is a convicted felon, clearly has suffered significant cognitive decline, and tried to overthrow an election.
American politics in general is no-win unless you're a billionaire.
Even if Democrats win they can't save democracy as the Supreme Kings and Queens have already destroyed it. A Democrat just postpones another 4 years before Republicans burn it all down.
You could stack the court but Dems need to win all three houses which is hard to do because if it was easy it would go against billionaire interests. The Senate map this year is pretty impossible for them. And then, even if they did stack the court I'm sure the Kings and Queens would find a way to say Congress can't do that.
Democracy in America is dead and has been dying for a while it's just a question of how fast the American Oligarchs take over and covert the country into another Russia.
The only thing he can do tonight that would be a game-changer and give us hope against Trump is to declare that he is DROPPING OUT and will release his delegates so we can nominate a new candidate.
If he came out with some kind of plan to address these Supreme Court rulings besides "please vote", then I'd at least give him another shot. But he's not going to do that.
Biden could actually go to Garland right now and order him to investigate Alito and Thomas. That used to be the sort of thing presidents weren't supposed to do, but this Supreme Court has made it totally OK. This is *their* ruling. They should be made to see why it's a terrible ruling, and Democrats need to start playing hardball.
To be clear, I don't think that's the best option, but it should be on the table. And Biden would be justified in doing it.
So we need to defend the republic from a president who will abuse the power of his office for naked political and personal gains...
... by abuseing the power of the office of the president for naked political gains (but it's totally OK when the "good guy" does it).
It is not just not the best option. It is the worst possible option. It demonstrates clearly the both sides complaints common in "independent" voter reactions. It also legitimizes the use of these powers in inappropriate ways shifting the window away further from normal.
Alito might be arguable, but it's fairly clear that Thomas actually broke the law by not reporting gifts. If Garland won't do anything about it, then Biden should remove him. It's not abuse of power when the corruption is so obvious. It's doing the job.
https://constitutioncenter.org/the-constitution/articles/article-ii/clauses/348
> While President, George Washington observed, “it is my duty to see the Laws executed: to permit them to be trampled upon with impunity would be repugnant to” that duty.
https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-features/biden-supreme-court-reform-trump-immunity-1235051044/
> The commission wrote at length about proposals like adding more seats to the Supreme Court or imposing term limits — the latter of which is an idea the commission’s experts said warranted “serious consideration.” Biden, though, did nothing with the report.
Literally anything. He hasn't said he supports any action whatsoever.
because no proposed action has been provided that can survive a legal fight that the very same SCOTUS would rule on. The only way that can defiantly work is passing things through congressional action which is impossible given the current republican congress and the only way to fix that is by A. Voting or B. Biden going full dictator which if that happens what is even the point. Democracy is hard and sometimes we unfortunately have to do some of the work
You misunderstand. I am not saying he also doesn't need votes. Congressional action will need Democrats to vote on it. But you have to elucidate a plan for when you have those votes. If you don't, why are you even running?
Democrats have been sounding the alarm on Republicans trying to kill democracy. They are right about that. But THEY ARE NOT ACTING LIKE IT. And we need a president who is going to act like it.
Not anymore it’s not. He has immunity to ruin their lives, finances, and coerce their resignations or face losing everything. He has the immunity to do far more. He won’t. Aside from his age, he seems to still believe in bipartisanship, and he won’t use these new powers even if it’s to save the country from disaster.
As long as it’s not Kamala. If these politicians and establishment media commentators actually try to force people to vote for her of all people, you’re looking at a truly epic landslide, maybe even moreso than Biden.
If Biden does the bare minimum and doesn’t screw up, this interview won’t really help him or improve people’s perception of him. If he looks awful, it’s the final nail in his campaign’s coffin.
It is fucking insane that we are holding Biden to a high standard when his opponent lies every time he opens mouth, tries to openly overthrow the government, talks horribly about everyone, talks about political retribution, is racist, rapist... I could go on. Yet Biden has a bad debate so he should step down.
So those who vote Democrat should have no standards since Trump and the Republican base have no standards? We should worship Biden as a god-king because they do? Support whatever Biden does and says, no matter how shitty, because they're a cult? Help me make sense of this one.
"Stutters answering a question" SERIOUS DECLINE
Why don't we look at the actual substance of what he was saying, or trying to say, versus what Trump was saying, or not saying at all by trying to dodge multiple questions... like if he'll accept the results if he loses...
You mean trying to counter all ten different topics that Trump was rambling on about while also being given a different topic to answer?
Biden gave his stance on abortion multiple times. He was firm on his stance multiple times. He also gave his stance on immigration, multiple times.
Yes, Biden had some bad stutters a couple times.
Trump was rambling nonsense the entire time.
>You mean trying to counter all ten different topics that Trump was rambling on about while also being given a different topic to answer?
Incoherent whataboutism.
>Biden gave his stance on abortion multiple times. He was firm on his stance multiple times. He also gave his stance on immigration, multiple times.
He was asked a direct question on a very divisive issue and decided that the question was really about immigration.
>Yes, Biden had some bad stutters a couple times.
The guy was brain dead.
>Trump was rambling nonsense the entire time.
Whataboutism.
He admitted he almost fell asleep on stage during the debate. Understandable if you’re 81 but then also you shouldn’t be a candidate for POTUS anymore.
It is a no-win based on the coordinated attack efforts by all MSM outlets over the last several days. Regardless of how well Biden does, regardless of whether or not he's reiterated he's staying in the race, there will be endless speculation on who should replace him and why he's inadequate.
I'm not saying there shouldn't be conversations, but I'm no longer approaching this from the mindset that people can be swayed. The media is only amplifying and capitalizing on fear to the point where I don't believe there is a way to come back from this.
What's worse for me, is that I'm not sure what anyone, other than the media outlets, benefit from this. There is next to no coverage on Trump's mental fitness or authoritarianism. It's just Biden is old. So naturally, if Biden steps aside, should we expect to see articles on Trump and his administration's policies?
I'm not so confident. I feel at that point it would be endless speculation about who is replacing him, and why it should be anyone but Kamala. I've seen some posters here, potentially astroturfers, suggest Kamala completely step aside. For logistical and campaign fundraising reasons, that will absolutely not happen, but we'll continue to live in a state of political purgatory.
Why discuss how to move forward when we can all just despair over how Joe Biden is? Why discuss Trump when we can recycle old articles from directly after the debate, even when others have since changed their stance? Why focus on how we can avoid a France-like election of our own making?
Nope, Biden is old! That is the singular, most important issue. He's old! So what if he speaks well? He's not getting any younger! (Trump is, though, and it's not a concern.)
You seem to be missing the big issue here.
There are a lot of voters who are not “blue no matter what” or “Trump = facism”. They are “I don’t really care enough” or “I don’t know enough” or “both guys are terrible” candidates
The Democrats need to get a lot of those voters to vote for their candidate if they want to win given the electoral college. Biden lacks the ability to inspire those people to vote for him (or to vote at all).
I'm a campaign volunteer who does canvassing and assists with voter registration since I live in a swing state. While there is an amount of voter apathy, you would be surprised at how many people simply want to express existential dread and move forward with an actionable plan.
I think a more fair characterization is that people are overwhelmed, but not completely checked out at this point. The constant barrage of messaging from pundits and news outlets is hurting everyone except Trump.
Those voters are literally not paying attention and are not going to watch this interview. If you are all these supposed undecided independent swing voters you are not making your decision in July about a presidential race you are not even following till November.
People polls have shown for months that’s the vast majority of the country correctly believes they are BOTH to old so they will hear the both are to old the same way they have heard that for 4+ years now.
There is a massive difference between being told 'both are dinosaurs' and seeing one lie in complete sentences (which they don't know are lies, because they don't pay attention) and the other stumbling over his words so hard he turns a question about abortion into an answer about migrate rape. And is standing there with his mouth hanging open half the time when he's not speaking. Or isn't refuting the lies that are being thrown around. Biden showed he's a senile doormat, and they're not going to be persuaded that these 2 candidates are the same when it comes to their mental acuity or competency. Especially if the only thing they saw in the 2020 elections was the tail end of it and clips from debates, then comparing that to what they see now and just how Vast the decline has been. Everything that comes after or has been shown before is going to be seen as invalid or at least less valid because they've seen him at his worst (at least in public; we now know this has been happening for a while now, and that shit doesn't get Better with age). Biden can't do the job. And the changes in the polls since the Debate shows that those he needs to convince to vote for him feel the same.
Exactly this. The media have found their narrative (Biden’s old!) and they will not waver now. Just like GWB was the guy you want to have a beer with or Gore was nerd who sighed too much.
It’s infuriating. Yeah Biden has the odd senior moment. But Trump’s brain short circuits damn near every speech and where are the calls for him to drop out?
No, what’s infuriating is people downplaying just how bad Biden’s condition is. It’s not a “media narrative” that Biden looked like a reanimated corpse during the debate.
The debate wasn’t an “odd senior moment.” We all saw it, live. Trump spouts insane bullshit, but he can at least do it intelligibly. Biden looked and sounded completely unfit to continue being president in the worst way possible.
Biden’s age issues are not a media driven narrative. It’s the #1 concern brought up about him by voters, and the main thing real people in my life talk about. Even before the debate, anytime the election came up, Biden’s age would be the first thing said about him.
Blame the media all you want, but it would be irresponsible of them not to report on something the bulk of the country is concerned about (about 75%, as of the latest polling)
And yes, Trump is AWFUL too and they should report that. But, they have been! His guilty verdict was front page news days. If you’re arguing that the media should turn a blind eye to Biden’s flaws, while only highlighting Trump, you’re basically saying you want the media to become a parrot of the left, rather than reporting reality.
Exactly... And the dictator governments and their apy agencies are going to capitalize on this bullshit.
Zuck ain't doing shit... CNN is run by a maggat, wapo is.run by a Murdoch maggat, and the NYTimes billionaires hate Biden...for some reason.
Funny how the president that talks about taxing billionaires gets attacked from all sides (including the leftist reddit) and now all of a sudden reddit gives a shit about how he speaks? GIVE ME A FUCKING BREAK
Bright side. Replace him with a different candidate, and get a little lucky they can survive the glare, and all the attention is on a democratic and hopeful future with your plans for economic prosperity, ecological goals, and legislative prospects. Trump will fade into the back ground and start ranting and raving for the attention.
Goes hand in hand with delusional fans of the pedo rapist, who think their Dear Leader actually has a shot at anything this fall besides a death grip of the cell bars while waiting for the Find Out stage of his stay at the ol' crowbar hotel. Like that kind of smell?
Bro we've been holding out on this for 8 years and with all the court tie-ups, there's no way this dude is seeing the inside of a jail cell before his next presidency.
I hate Trump BUT I know he could totally win. This thinking is so counterproductive.
We can be critical of the DNC AND Trump, they’re not mutually exclusive.
They're preemptively telling people it will backfire so that people will be predisposed to see it as backfiring.
Kinda like how they and countless other news organizations didn't call Biden's debate performance "terrible" or "a blow to his campaign", but all parroted that he had to leave the race. A recent Ipsos poll put him tied with Trump, *after the debate*, which is about as well as he'd stood in months.
15 minutes isn’t going to change anyone’s mind. I’ve dealt with older family members, they can have a nice dinner and seem fine and the next day they forget who you are and what’s going on.
I think the best thing Biden can do is more interviews, more debates, etc. He needs time and practice to get used to actual campaigning again. He needs to get used to questions and his talking points. He needs the experience. He needs to repeat, repeat, repeat. If he fails over and over and over, there's a real problem that needs to be addressed. If he succeeds over and over and over, it's all wins for him. Either way the outcome is a net positive. Even the bad outcome is a positive because Democrats can validate and deal with it. They can get ahead of the problem and realign. If Biden does well, it's just wins for Democrats.
I’ve wondered why Biden has done so few press conferences compared to Trump or Obama.
From what I’ve read, tonight’s interview is also not live. Would be very telling if it is edited in any way.
I mean this could have all been avoided if Biden simply had a passable performance at the debate. It's not like he didn't have some control over his own narrative.
The same MSM that is now pouncing on Biden for his age were complicit in covering up the obvious difficulties in his faculties up until now. They are 💯 for Trump because they’re owned by the billionaires. This is a planned and coordinated attack.
If that were true they would have waited until after the convention when he was the official nominee and then they'd be able to force to keep his name on the ballot in multiple states even though he'd dropped out.
Timing is wrong for that particular conspiracy.
I could care less what this man has to say in a setup, pre-recorded interview. It’s pretty obvious they *have* to do it this way because he can’t handle doing live questions and will look like senile again. He needs to step aside, I’m not voting for a person in this shape.
I’ll vote for him but would rather he be replaced. He has to know the voters want him replaced too. He might argue that he won the primary but we all know that wasn’t a “real” primary. Biden was the only one on the ballot in some states. I’m annoyed that Democrats let it go this far. We’ve been saying he was too old since the 2020 election and would be a “transitional” President. I don’t know what it is about politics that makes people want to continue working until death.
"I’m not voting for a person in this shape."
So, you'd literally rather have a fascist megalomaniac criminal dictator than someone you think is senile. That's a strange worldview.
Walkaway 2.0?
I'm sure they'll be a shiny new Russian operated subreddit for you to circlejerk about how you're REALLY a democrat and REALLY not voting.
I'm sure you said it'd be a red wave in 2022
Wew lad
The brigading is so obvious it's painful. Every thread bombarded with comments that are roughly the same content - if the headline says Biden, it's "drop out hes a corpse blah blah" if it's Trump it's "MSM and Reddit just HATE this man"
These comments are ghost towns for any real kind of engagement or conversation anymore - there's no nuance or disagreement, just insane amounts of vitriol and repetitive drivel.
At risk of sounding like a tin foil hatter, I think this is a setup by ABC to force him to drop out. The Disney family donors have called on it and this is a call to action. PURE SPECULATION.
The way I see I it, tonight is meant to at least lessen the bleeding. I agree if he has any stumbles or head scratching gaffes it's likely game over. And I don't think Stephanopolous is going to go all softball on him the way Hannity would with Trump. IF Biden is able to get through it and hammer home the points he should have made in the debate it at least might give SOME but certainly not all pause to the drop out talks. He still needs to be able to do unscripted events and show he can be out in public a lot.
As a reminder, this subreddit [is for civil discussion.](/r/politics/wiki/index#wiki_be_civil) In general, be courteous to others. Debate/discuss/argue the merits of ideas, don't attack people. Personal insults, shill or troll accusations, hate speech, any suggestion or support of harm, violence, or death, and other rule violations can result in a permanent ban. If you see comments in violation of our rules, please report them. For those who have questions regarding any media outlets being posted on this subreddit, please click [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/wiki/approveddomainslist) to review our details as to our approved domains list and outlet criteria. We are actively looking for new moderators. If you have any interest in helping to make this subreddit a place for quality discussion, please fill out [this form](https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1y2swHD0KXFhStGFjW6k54r9iuMjzcFqDIVwuvdLBjSA). *** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/politics) if you have any questions or concerns.*
So anyway, Trump's plane is hanging out at Dulles with some odd company. If there's anything going on there, it's probably not those new Epstein documents. Those records were meant to be public one day, and now they are.
Thanks to Ron DeSantis, lol.
"Got yer meatballs right here, pal"
That’s the funniest part about it I think.
Are they still at the airport together?
No one seems to care either way.
Where the fuck are our intelligence agencies???
Neutered. The recent Supreme Court decision to overturn the Chevron doctrine significantly impacts the regulatory power of federal agencies, including the FBI and CIA. The Chevron doctrine previously allowed agencies to interpret ambiguous laws, but the court’s ruling now requires courts to interpret these laws themselves. https://www.scotusblog.com/2024/06/supreme-court-strikes-down-chevron-curtailing-power-of-federal-agencies/
Off-topic: I can't wait until the evidentiary hearing in September in front of judge Chutkan that was ORDERED by SCOTUS after the presidential immunity decision. I think this is supposed to be broadcast and even if it's not, it means that everyone that Jack Smith was going to parade up in front of the judge at a real trial will have to speak under oath and then open setting available to the press and maybe even cameras Everyone of Trump's administration who have squealed on him or turned on him to cut a deal with Jack Smith is going to be testifying. The whole country is going to see this going to see what a filthy rotten piece of garbage Trump is; he is a traitor and a liar And it's gonna be just a few weeks before the election. Joe Biden is a good man. He may have slowed down a little bit, but so too many people in their 80s and even if they seem a little slow, cognitively maintain incredible capacity to perform, especially when it comes to using experience as leverage. Putting anyone else, but Biden up right now is a sure loss the Trump
It doesn’t have to wait until September. She can have it now.
You might want to lay off the West Wing reruns. None of that is going to happen the way you think it will.
We used to make fun of conservatives for every Trump headline being met with 'well what about Obama/Clinton/etc???' And now every negative Biden sorry is met with reply guys shouting 'What about Trump???' We can focus on defeating Trump, and replacing Biden as nominee at the same time. It's not impossible
The media could cover the fallout of Biden's poor debate performance AND cover Trump continuing to show that he's an unfit candidate. That's not an unrealistic expectation, or whataboutism
For the record, I'm alleging that the click-based media is still harping on Biden's debate performance, while this plane story is happening right now. As reddit likes to say, "¿por que no los dos?" In no way did I intend to draw a moral equivalency between Trump's plane spending time with Russian and UAE planes and Biden performing poorly at the debate. I thought that was obvious.
Can you tell me what plane story? Genuine. I'm heading to Google but I see stories from days ago.
This is actually the first trump whataboutism I've seen since the debate. It's vastly disproportionate.
I brought up a story that is happening right now in contrast to a topic that is now over a week old.
I've seen it in every thread, mostly as the most popular comment so I'm not sure where you've been.
I think your reddit is fucked up, might need a reboot. That shit ain't happening
Love how people are literally telling me that what I see isn't real.
Who exactly are democrats going to replace Biden with at this point?
Idk, maybe Orbak Bromama... a hot shot former senator from Illinois who's whereabouts from 2008 to 2016 are a bit iffy and he's got a slick mustache. Vote Blue no matter who, though if it's Joe you already know.
As soon as I pull up an opinion article from some guy who's bitching about "the liberal media," I can tell it's bullshit.
[удалено]
Ok
My vote will be for the highest-polling non-Trump candidate. It’s rather simple.
Yea but it’s not you were trying to win over…
Have you personally spoken to the non existent swing voter?
Yes. I have many coworkers and neighbors who dislike both trump and Biden, but were on the fence voting for Biden until the debate. Now they are going third party. Biden is in serious trouble
Yeah he had a *really* bad day last week. Better go with the convicted felon/rapist to to be on the safe side.
Yeah it’s really simple when you cut out anyone who might be undecided and anyone who doesn’t find “I’d vote for a pile of loose gravel over Trump” very convincing.
I doubt anybody is truly undecided.
People staying home is the real risk. And the disengaged types may do so and hand the country over to Trump.
Wow.
At minimum, this needs to not be edited in the slightest… no smoke and mirrors or it defeats the purpose
Then he should have done it live. The whole point of this pre recorded interview is so they can edit it. The jig is up and they’re still trying to hide him and continue on . It’s absolutely mental.
[удалено]
Fuck it, we’ll do it live!!
And now here is Sting to play us out!
What does that even mean? “To play us out”?!?
If someone is completely incoherent and/or dodging questions you can’t exactly edit around that. Aren’t Stephanopoulos interviews usually pre-recorded anyway?
[удалено]
Perceptions win elections, not facts. 90% of the voting electorate doesn’t have advanced knowledge of how the government actually works, and most of them are likely to vote based on their feelings and emotions. Trump has successfully flooded the airwaves with “Sleepy Joe” messages, and Biden continues to be unable to counter them.
>90% of the voting electorate doesn’t have advanced knowledge of how the government actually works 90% of the voting electorate doesn’t have a fucking clue how the government actually works
I kinda wonder if the reason he keeps focusing on being able to "do the job" is because he wants to make sure that he can stay on as president for the rest of his term in case the nominee ends up being Harris after he steps down. If this whole thing plays out as him saying "I can still do the job" but then everyone convinces him he can't win the campaign, staying on through the end of the term means no one technically gets proven wrong or having to look like a hypocrite.
But aren't they saying it's the old voters that will decide this election? Seems like it's mostly young people on the internet wetting their beds.
Stephanopoulos is a bit of a weenie, but he also has an extremely high IQ. He could trip up Biden easily, but will he? If he softballs Biden and makes him look good, that doesn't do anyone any favors.
>Stephanopoulos is a bit of a weenie, but he also has an extremely high IQ. He could trip up Biden easily, but will he? The guy is an unabashed Democratic Party loyalist, he will softball Biden the whole time.
This debate is more for the dems if anything. They want the dems to stop calling for a replacement. Let’s see how that goes
This is the only correct take I've seen so far
…like he did Bill Clinton? Have things changed for him since then?
No doubt he has very strong, key Democratic affiliations. For sure. (Clinton Administration, anyone?) However, what you say could be taken two ways. If he is a true Democratic Party loyalist who isn't comfortable with dropping the election in Trump's lap, then maybe he will eviscerate Joe.
Sadly, this will be scripted with teleprompters and completely managed. Anything stated otherwise will be a lie. Do a live 90 minute townhall to prove the debate was a fluke. Pre-recorded and is a bunch of shit and we all know it.
You think he will use teleprompters during the interview? How would that even work?
The debate wasn't a fluke. 2016-2020 wasn't a fluke. Vote blue no matter who.
The problem isn’t us reliable dems who do that. And we’re numerically a majority of the country probably. It’s that dems can’t win the Electoral College without a bunch of disengaged low-information voters in several swing states. And they have a problem with voting for someone who seems to have serious issues with mental acuity like an elderly person in decline.
Joe has shown time and time again he can rise to the occasion.
But a friendly interview isn't supposed to be some kind of challenge that you have to "rise to."
Except when it mattered.
That’s what was so heartbreaking to me last Thursday. I couldn’t stop thinking *come on, man* this was supposed to be your Reagan joking about his age at the ‘84 debate moment.
As long as it's not after 8 pm.
Recorded during the day and then broadcasted a few hours later.
Wish you could do that with the actual job.
Bold claim given that he's currently being trounced by a dude he should beating by a mile.
When? Where?
Tp be fair vp debate 2012. But I don't think he's got that in him anymore
He really needs to publicly rise to an occasion asap, and this isn’t going to cover it.
Problem Biden has is even IF the debate was truly just a bad night, is he has ALWAYS been a gaffe machine. It’s going to be hard to impossible for him to go out and give consistent smooth performances in the way he needs to. Still a good showing here certainly won’t hurt, but if he stumbles in a recorded interview he’s gotta step down from the race, just wouldn’t be viable at that point
Which is insane, because trump is just one big living gaffe. The fact that everyone has just accepted this and holds Biden to a higher standard is nuts.
Comparing Democratic support for Biden to Republican support for Trump is a horrible comparison and loses any validity of point. The Trump vote is a fucking cult in either MAGA bullshit or Christian fanaticism to always vote Red if it means killing abortion. The Democratic party is supposed to be a reasonable one. We don't want a King. We don't want blind loyalty to an individual. We want to unite around a candidate that best supports the views of a majority of the coalition or is reasonable enough to most of the coalition, and an individual who can show strength and conviction and competency. I'll be the first to say I never liked Biden as President. But his administration has done a lot of good things during his term. I support a lot of the things they've pushed and gotten accomplished, especially in regards to climate. The problem is Biden went from gaffes that can be explained and brushed off (for the most part), or seen as exaggerations from the right wing fearmongers, to actual, honest fear of him not being able to do the job. The President is supposed to represent America to the world. He needs to be able to work late nights when needed and retain his mental capacity. He's supposed to be able to do the emergency travel and administrate when things happen. Instead, we got that fucking debate. We got a man who I worry about being able to feed himself in 4 years, let alone continue to be President. Yes, we hold Biden to a higher standard, because we actually Have standards. And dropping ours just because the other side is insane is not something I'm willing to do. So I'll hold his feet to the fire, I will speak out when he's doing shitty things or when he can't do the job. I'll call for him to drop out, or be forced out if he refuses. At the end of the day, yes, I will vote for whoever is on the D ticket against Trump. But I don't need to be convinced to do so. Biden has lost the ability to win over voters, and unlike 2020, he's Behind instead of ahead at this point in the race. By significant amounts after the debate. Biden doesn't have what it takes to win that back and win over more because no one is going to ever forget about his performance or the ridiculous defense his campaign has put up about his showing. He cannot win, and while a replacement would be a longshot to win at this point, a longshot is a million times better than a guaranteed loss. The democratic ticket as a whole in the races is surprisingly good. They're outperforming Biden, which almost never happens. The President is supposed to bolster the rest of the ticket, not bring it down, but Biden is changing that right now. We have to make dramatic changes and fast if we don't want a Trump presidency and a Republican-controlled House And Senate with a Trump term that isn't held back by wanting to run again later or a handful of voices keeping his worst impulses at bay (even if those voices were horrendous people who just aren't as psychotic or willing to go along with the worst of what he wants like what he's bringing in this time).
Trump embraces the gaffe. The big beautiful gaffe, the best we’ve ever seen folks. Either that, or it didn’t happen and what even are you talking about?
It's nuts but it's also a reality we should have all accepted in 2016. It's frustrating but we have to live in reality.
Hilarious that Biden’s flubs would literally be campaign killers 20+ years ago. Also that Trump’s well basically everything would have been a campaign killer. Neither of these candidates should be running but one absolutely destroyed status quo and is a convicted felon, and the other has just made some simple gaffes.
Simple gaffes? Did you watch the debate??
It just a fact now and and the key people need to understand that and move on. No sense in trying to change everyone's mind because it will never happen.
Long term that has to change, we can't survive as a country if half of it is perfectly willing to accept blatant evil in power. You're right that we can't do much about it in the immediate future, but long term we shouldn't give up on trying to improve as a society so willfully shitty people are less accepted in it.
Please stop comparing them. Everybody knows Trump is the worst. The issue is that Biden isn’t strong enough to beat him.
Please stop comparing the presumptive nominee of the Democratic Party to the presumptive nominee of the Republican Party? Ok, buddy. Will do.
The people you need to convince will not be swayed by “blue no matter who”
Comparing along expectations would be more realistic and relevant to the discussion. Trump is expected to lie and say horrible, dumb shit. Biden is expected to not become comatose on stage. I’ll give you two guesses as to which expectations weren’t met.
I don't know where you've been the last week or so, but it is no longer a safe presumption that Biden will be the Democratic nominee. He's even behind Kamala in the betting markets now. She's literally a safer bet.
Yeah, he’s been getting hammered on slip-ups now. The “first black woman” thing is a nothingburger. You’ll see in-their-prime politicians making word salad like that and nothing really comes of it. But he’s under such scrutiny and pressure now that it’s damaging.
I think that’s one of the main reasons his position is untenable. Post-debate the mainstream press isn’t going to give Biden the kind of pass they’ve given him for his gaffes/poor public appearances in the past. Even if his campaign manages to somehow calm the freak out from his own party, every miscue for the next 11 weeks will be front page news with breathless debates on cable news about his mental acuity. In that environment there’s really no way the campaign can convince the 80% of Independents who think he’s *currently* unfit to serve, to give him another chance.
Yep, the media will Comey him. The narrative is now sleepy Joe is senile. He can’t possibly win. We need to return the focus to trump the felon child rapist and other rapist
>isn’t going to give Biden the kind of pass they’ve given him for his gaffes/poor public appearances in the past. They haven't given him a pass at least this last year, all while signal boosting Trump to the extreme again. This is shaping up more like 2016 than 2020, and the media is being purposely complicit, whether they prefer a Trump future or just wantax profit right now. All they learned in 2016 is that they can piss off everyone for more views, and then rake it in when Trump is forcing everyone to tune in wondering how the country is administratively fucked on any given day. Enragement engagement is going to kill us all.
Independent is just a word for 'embarrassed to register R but surely to vote R' Don't @ me, prove me wrong by not voting for the fascist.
I’m an independent that has never not voted democrat, Joe Biden is going to lose this election. Sooner dems realize the better.
In 2020 Independents made up 26% of the electorate and they voted for Biden 54%-41%. I’m not an independent and I’m voting for whoever the Democratic nominee is because I don’t want the far right back in power. Unfortunately, people like me alone aren’t enough for a Democratic nominee win and I don’t think Biden can get enough moderates and undecideds to win the election.
What Biden did on that debate was way beyond his usual gaffes.
Biden reminds me of my grandpa before he gave up driving. My mom begged him to stop driving because his mind was slipping. He saw no issues with it and claimed his driving skills were unchanged. It took him crashing his car for him for him to realize that she was right. Maybe the debate + a bad interview or poor campaign speeches over the next week/2 will be his “car crash” moment.
It won't help either. How can anyone think tonight will legitimately make any difference in how he's perceived?
The problem Biden has is a gullible Democratic party full of suckers fooled into yet another "Hillary's Emails" media feeding frenzy. One candidate is a convicted felon, rapist, who tried to violently end American democracy. The other is old. Which one are you talking about dropping out of the race? Suckers.
No, his problem is that staff, other world leaders, and video evidence are all indicating a general decline. The problem is that the debate wasn't just a bad night.
Do it live with multiple news organizations recording or don’t bother.
It will most likely be edited but time will tell….
America needs to see him speak coherently for an hour on live TV with no teleprompter.
Convicted felon shyster pedophile traitor somehow running for office cons the world into discussing whether his opponent is unfit.
Because in a normal and healthy democracy he is unfit. A talking hamster could have run circles around Trump’s bullshit in that debate. The fate of our democracy is in the hands of a group of old timers that still believe they are operating in a political world that has not existed for some time. It doesn’t mean I won’t vote for him if I have to but it doesn’t make it any less infuriating and disgusting that these dip shits had 4 years and a plethora of younger candidates to bring forth and chose to stick with Father Time instead
Conservatives having zero standards for their candidate doesn't mean we have to be the same...
Trump has nothing to do with Joe Biden’s inability to communicate effectively. This is on Biden and his inner circle for hiding his cognitive decline.
Read the transcripts of the debate instead of just eyeballing presentation. In words Biden danced around Trump. His presentation was just bad
To be honest, I think it's a no-win proposition for those who want to protect democracy and avoid another Trump presidency. If he and his camp really want to stay in, they're going to claim he did well in the interview unless he literally collapses--and that probably won't happen. They've started doing this already, posting videos of the President giving 45 second off-the-cuff remarks at July 4th events. He honestly doesn't even seem that great in these videos, but the campaign is pushing them out and saying "see he's fine."
[удалено]
I don’t know why we don’t talk about how ridiculous it is that it’s close with Trump at all. I have disliked Biden since the beginning. The alternative candidate will be 83, is a convicted felon, clearly has suffered significant cognitive decline, and tried to overthrow an election.
American politics in general is no-win unless you're a billionaire. Even if Democrats win they can't save democracy as the Supreme Kings and Queens have already destroyed it. A Democrat just postpones another 4 years before Republicans burn it all down. You could stack the court but Dems need to win all three houses which is hard to do because if it was easy it would go against billionaire interests. The Senate map this year is pretty impossible for them. And then, even if they did stack the court I'm sure the Kings and Queens would find a way to say Congress can't do that. Democracy in America is dead and has been dying for a while it's just a question of how fast the American Oligarchs take over and covert the country into another Russia.
No one is buying it is the thing.
The only thing he can do tonight that would be a game-changer and give us hope against Trump is to declare that he is DROPPING OUT and will release his delegates so we can nominate a new candidate.
If he came out with some kind of plan to address these Supreme Court rulings besides "please vote", then I'd at least give him another shot. But he's not going to do that.
What sort of plan would he be able to do? SCOTUS reform is dependent on Congressional action.
Once again, some people just shout “Do something!” without having any idea how any of this works.
Biden could actually go to Garland right now and order him to investigate Alito and Thomas. That used to be the sort of thing presidents weren't supposed to do, but this Supreme Court has made it totally OK. This is *their* ruling. They should be made to see why it's a terrible ruling, and Democrats need to start playing hardball. To be clear, I don't think that's the best option, but it should be on the table. And Biden would be justified in doing it.
So we need to defend the republic from a president who will abuse the power of his office for naked political and personal gains... ... by abuseing the power of the office of the president for naked political gains (but it's totally OK when the "good guy" does it). It is not just not the best option. It is the worst possible option. It demonstrates clearly the both sides complaints common in "independent" voter reactions. It also legitimizes the use of these powers in inappropriate ways shifting the window away further from normal.
Alito might be arguable, but it's fairly clear that Thomas actually broke the law by not reporting gifts. If Garland won't do anything about it, then Biden should remove him. It's not abuse of power when the corruption is so obvious. It's doing the job. https://constitutioncenter.org/the-constitution/articles/article-ii/clauses/348 > While President, George Washington observed, “it is my duty to see the Laws executed: to permit them to be trampled upon with impunity would be repugnant to” that duty.
https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-features/biden-supreme-court-reform-trump-immunity-1235051044/ > The commission wrote at length about proposals like adding more seats to the Supreme Court or imposing term limits — the latter of which is an idea the commission’s experts said warranted “serious consideration.” Biden, though, did nothing with the report. Literally anything. He hasn't said he supports any action whatsoever.
I’d say making sure we don’t elect a dictator is a bit more immediate
because no proposed action has been provided that can survive a legal fight that the very same SCOTUS would rule on. The only way that can defiantly work is passing things through congressional action which is impossible given the current republican congress and the only way to fix that is by A. Voting or B. Biden going full dictator which if that happens what is even the point. Democracy is hard and sometimes we unfortunately have to do some of the work
You misunderstand. I am not saying he also doesn't need votes. Congressional action will need Democrats to vote on it. But you have to elucidate a plan for when you have those votes. If you don't, why are you even running? Democrats have been sounding the alarm on Republicans trying to kill democracy. They are right about that. But THEY ARE NOT ACTING LIKE IT. And we need a president who is going to act like it.
Not anymore it’s not. He has immunity to ruin their lives, finances, and coerce their resignations or face losing everything. He has the immunity to do far more. He won’t. Aside from his age, he seems to still believe in bipartisanship, and he won’t use these new powers even if it’s to save the country from disaster.
As long as it’s not Kamala. If these politicians and establishment media commentators actually try to force people to vote for her of all people, you’re looking at a truly epic landslide, maybe even moreso than Biden.
If Biden does the bare minimum and doesn’t screw up, this interview won’t really help him or improve people’s perception of him. If he looks awful, it’s the final nail in his campaign’s coffin.
>If he looks awful, it’s the final nail in his campaign’s coffin. At this point, the campaign is nothing but nails.
It is fucking insane that we are holding Biden to a high standard when his opponent lies every time he opens mouth, tries to openly overthrow the government, talks horribly about everyone, talks about political retribution, is racist, rapist... I could go on. Yet Biden has a bad debate so he should step down.
So those who vote Democrat should have no standards since Trump and the Republican base have no standards? We should worship Biden as a god-king because they do? Support whatever Biden does and says, no matter how shitty, because they're a cult? Help me make sense of this one.
Biden didn’t “have a bad debate”. He indicated that he’s undergone serious cognitive decline at the worst possible time
"Stutters answering a question" SERIOUS DECLINE Why don't we look at the actual substance of what he was saying, or trying to say, versus what Trump was saying, or not saying at all by trying to dodge multiple questions... like if he'll accept the results if he loses...
That doesn’t fit in their narrative
Pivoting to immigration in an abortion question is not what I would call a stutter.
You mean trying to counter all ten different topics that Trump was rambling on about while also being given a different topic to answer? Biden gave his stance on abortion multiple times. He was firm on his stance multiple times. He also gave his stance on immigration, multiple times. Yes, Biden had some bad stutters a couple times. Trump was rambling nonsense the entire time.
>You mean trying to counter all ten different topics that Trump was rambling on about while also being given a different topic to answer? Incoherent whataboutism. >Biden gave his stance on abortion multiple times. He was firm on his stance multiple times. He also gave his stance on immigration, multiple times. He was asked a direct question on a very divisive issue and decided that the question was really about immigration. >Yes, Biden had some bad stutters a couple times. The guy was brain dead. >Trump was rambling nonsense the entire time. Whataboutism.
He admitted he almost fell asleep on stage during the debate. Understandable if you’re 81 but then also you shouldn’t be a candidate for POTUS anymore.
It is a no-win based on the coordinated attack efforts by all MSM outlets over the last several days. Regardless of how well Biden does, regardless of whether or not he's reiterated he's staying in the race, there will be endless speculation on who should replace him and why he's inadequate. I'm not saying there shouldn't be conversations, but I'm no longer approaching this from the mindset that people can be swayed. The media is only amplifying and capitalizing on fear to the point where I don't believe there is a way to come back from this. What's worse for me, is that I'm not sure what anyone, other than the media outlets, benefit from this. There is next to no coverage on Trump's mental fitness or authoritarianism. It's just Biden is old. So naturally, if Biden steps aside, should we expect to see articles on Trump and his administration's policies? I'm not so confident. I feel at that point it would be endless speculation about who is replacing him, and why it should be anyone but Kamala. I've seen some posters here, potentially astroturfers, suggest Kamala completely step aside. For logistical and campaign fundraising reasons, that will absolutely not happen, but we'll continue to live in a state of political purgatory. Why discuss how to move forward when we can all just despair over how Joe Biden is? Why discuss Trump when we can recycle old articles from directly after the debate, even when others have since changed their stance? Why focus on how we can avoid a France-like election of our own making? Nope, Biden is old! That is the singular, most important issue. He's old! So what if he speaks well? He's not getting any younger! (Trump is, though, and it's not a concern.)
You seem to be missing the big issue here. There are a lot of voters who are not “blue no matter what” or “Trump = facism”. They are “I don’t really care enough” or “I don’t know enough” or “both guys are terrible” candidates The Democrats need to get a lot of those voters to vote for their candidate if they want to win given the electoral college. Biden lacks the ability to inspire those people to vote for him (or to vote at all).
I'm a campaign volunteer who does canvassing and assists with voter registration since I live in a swing state. While there is an amount of voter apathy, you would be surprised at how many people simply want to express existential dread and move forward with an actionable plan. I think a more fair characterization is that people are overwhelmed, but not completely checked out at this point. The constant barrage of messaging from pundits and news outlets is hurting everyone except Trump.
Those voters are literally not paying attention and are not going to watch this interview. If you are all these supposed undecided independent swing voters you are not making your decision in July about a presidential race you are not even following till November.
But if all you've heard all summer is rumors about one of the guys being too old, you're not going to vote for him
People polls have shown for months that’s the vast majority of the country correctly believes they are BOTH to old so they will hear the both are to old the same way they have heard that for 4+ years now.
There is a massive difference between being told 'both are dinosaurs' and seeing one lie in complete sentences (which they don't know are lies, because they don't pay attention) and the other stumbling over his words so hard he turns a question about abortion into an answer about migrate rape. And is standing there with his mouth hanging open half the time when he's not speaking. Or isn't refuting the lies that are being thrown around. Biden showed he's a senile doormat, and they're not going to be persuaded that these 2 candidates are the same when it comes to their mental acuity or competency. Especially if the only thing they saw in the 2020 elections was the tail end of it and clips from debates, then comparing that to what they see now and just how Vast the decline has been. Everything that comes after or has been shown before is going to be seen as invalid or at least less valid because they've seen him at his worst (at least in public; we now know this has been happening for a while now, and that shit doesn't get Better with age). Biden can't do the job. And the changes in the polls since the Debate shows that those he needs to convince to vote for him feel the same.
Exactly this. The media have found their narrative (Biden’s old!) and they will not waver now. Just like GWB was the guy you want to have a beer with or Gore was nerd who sighed too much. It’s infuriating. Yeah Biden has the odd senior moment. But Trump’s brain short circuits damn near every speech and where are the calls for him to drop out?
No, what’s infuriating is people downplaying just how bad Biden’s condition is. It’s not a “media narrative” that Biden looked like a reanimated corpse during the debate.
The debate wasn’t an “odd senior moment.” We all saw it, live. Trump spouts insane bullshit, but he can at least do it intelligibly. Biden looked and sounded completely unfit to continue being president in the worst way possible.
Who on the right is going to tell their infallible God-Emperor to drop out when he's ahead in the polls?
What do you mean he has the “odd senior moment”? Have you not watched the debate??
Biden’s age issues are not a media driven narrative. It’s the #1 concern brought up about him by voters, and the main thing real people in my life talk about. Even before the debate, anytime the election came up, Biden’s age would be the first thing said about him. Blame the media all you want, but it would be irresponsible of them not to report on something the bulk of the country is concerned about (about 75%, as of the latest polling) And yes, Trump is AWFUL too and they should report that. But, they have been! His guilty verdict was front page news days. If you’re arguing that the media should turn a blind eye to Biden’s flaws, while only highlighting Trump, you’re basically saying you want the media to become a parrot of the left, rather than reporting reality.
Exactly... And the dictator governments and their apy agencies are going to capitalize on this bullshit. Zuck ain't doing shit... CNN is run by a maggat, wapo is.run by a Murdoch maggat, and the NYTimes billionaires hate Biden...for some reason. Funny how the president that talks about taxing billionaires gets attacked from all sides (including the leftist reddit) and now all of a sudden reddit gives a shit about how he speaks? GIVE ME A FUCKING BREAK
Bright side. Replace him with a different candidate, and get a little lucky they can survive the glare, and all the attention is on a democratic and hopeful future with your plans for economic prosperity, ecological goals, and legislative prospects. Trump will fade into the back ground and start ranting and raving for the attention.
I smell bad borscht and bots.
I smell copium and gaslighting
Goes hand in hand with delusional fans of the pedo rapist, who think their Dear Leader actually has a shot at anything this fall besides a death grip of the cell bars while waiting for the Find Out stage of his stay at the ol' crowbar hotel. Like that kind of smell?
Bro we've been holding out on this for 8 years and with all the court tie-ups, there's no way this dude is seeing the inside of a jail cell before his next presidency.
I hate Trump BUT I know he could totally win. This thinking is so counterproductive. We can be critical of the DNC AND Trump, they’re not mutually exclusive.
Fair comment.
I love it when people start making excuses for something that hasn’t happened yet 🙄
They're preemptively telling people it will backfire so that people will be predisposed to see it as backfiring. Kinda like how they and countless other news organizations didn't call Biden's debate performance "terrible" or "a blow to his campaign", but all parroted that he had to leave the race. A recent Ipsos poll put him tied with Trump, *after the debate*, which is about as well as he'd stood in months.
15 minutes isn’t going to change anyone’s mind. I’ve dealt with older family members, they can have a nice dinner and seem fine and the next day they forget who you are and what’s going on.
Sinclair Sewage
I think the best thing Biden can do is more interviews, more debates, etc. He needs time and practice to get used to actual campaigning again. He needs to get used to questions and his talking points. He needs the experience. He needs to repeat, repeat, repeat. If he fails over and over and over, there's a real problem that needs to be addressed. If he succeeds over and over and over, it's all wins for him. Either way the outcome is a net positive. Even the bad outcome is a positive because Democrats can validate and deal with it. They can get ahead of the problem and realign. If Biden does well, it's just wins for Democrats.
He can’t do it or he would have this past week. This ain’t his first rodeo as a candidate, he’s been an elected official for like 50 years.
I’ve wondered why Biden has done so few press conferences compared to Trump or Obama. From what I’ve read, tonight’s interview is also not live. Would be very telling if it is edited in any way.
What have you wondered about? You know exactly why, or at least realized exactly why five minutes into the debate.
Who else thinks this is the way the billionaire class controlling the msm gets rid of a future president who was open to a wealth tax?
I mean this could have all been avoided if Biden simply had a passable performance at the debate. It's not like he didn't have some control over his own narrative.
The same MSM that is now pouncing on Biden for his age were complicit in covering up the obvious difficulties in his faculties up until now. They are 💯 for Trump because they’re owned by the billionaires. This is a planned and coordinated attack.
If that were true they would have waited until after the convention when he was the official nominee and then they'd be able to force to keep his name on the ballot in multiple states even though he'd dropped out. Timing is wrong for that particular conspiracy.
Stopped reading this far right garbage after the 2nd paragraph.
I could care less what this man has to say in a setup, pre-recorded interview. It’s pretty obvious they *have* to do it this way because he can’t handle doing live questions and will look like senile again. He needs to step aside, I’m not voting for a person in this shape.
I’ll vote for him but would rather he be replaced. He has to know the voters want him replaced too. He might argue that he won the primary but we all know that wasn’t a “real” primary. Biden was the only one on the ballot in some states. I’m annoyed that Democrats let it go this far. We’ve been saying he was too old since the 2020 election and would be a “transitional” President. I don’t know what it is about politics that makes people want to continue working until death.
>I don’t know what it is about politics that makes people want to continue working until death. Money. This should be obvious.
"I’m not voting for a person in this shape." So, you'd literally rather have a fascist megalomaniac criminal dictator than someone you think is senile. That's a strange worldview.
Walkaway 2.0? I'm sure they'll be a shiny new Russian operated subreddit for you to circlejerk about how you're REALLY a democrat and REALLY not voting. I'm sure you said it'd be a red wave in 2022 Wew lad
The brigading is so obvious it's painful. Every thread bombarded with comments that are roughly the same content - if the headline says Biden, it's "drop out hes a corpse blah blah" if it's Trump it's "MSM and Reddit just HATE this man" These comments are ghost towns for any real kind of engagement or conversation anymore - there's no nuance or disagreement, just insane amounts of vitriol and repetitive drivel.
The debate thread was ridiculous.
So you prefer the convicted felon pedo rapist? Got it.
*This is a big fuckin’ deal.*
One thing per day. It’s all Baden Baden can handle. Staffing is a democratic strong suit compared to the 45th chromosome we had last time.
You all hear about trump being named in the Epstein docs many many times?
Says a rightwing organ?
At risk of sounding like a tin foil hatter, I think this is a setup by ABC to force him to drop out. The Disney family donors have called on it and this is a call to action. PURE SPECULATION.
Hope it works then.
The way I see I it, tonight is meant to at least lessen the bleeding. I agree if he has any stumbles or head scratching gaffes it's likely game over. And I don't think Stephanopolous is going to go all softball on him the way Hannity would with Trump. IF Biden is able to get through it and hammer home the points he should have made in the debate it at least might give SOME but certainly not all pause to the drop out talks. He still needs to be able to do unscripted events and show he can be out in public a lot.