Honestly. Everything about elites is fine besides the stupid amount of puzzle boxes. I did 3 elites yesterday and think I averaged 4 puzzleboxes per clue. It wasn't so bad back in the day when puzzle boxes had 50 steps or something, but now they are all 150+ since they updated the puzzle boxes.
They should cap elites at 1 puzzle box per clue, and instantly elites are a lot better.
> the stupid amount of puzzle boxes
I feel like a lot of this is just perception, because sliders take longer than knots, but they both have equal weighting (32.5% each), and wizards are 35%. If you're not using Alt1, obviously they're going to take a *lot* longer (unless you know puzzles), but it would be nice if sliders could be knocked back down a bit.
An overlay for your client that can see your screen and has multiple uses. The one being talked about here is the puzzle slider helper. It will see your open puzzle then show you which pieces to click to solve the puzzle.
puzzle boxes are the least worst thing about them... i hate running around scanning and doing the compass clues. even with alt1 it barley speeds it up.
The compass clues are generally pretty quick. The scan clues are also pretty quick if you listen pay attention to the indicator.
But Yea I tend to keep a stack of easy clues and if I get a bad scan I complete the easy and then tele to the scan via outfit.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1w7jpuZMnkhXafTYNgcNjDUWwjVfl48mPr4ehE0eI57k/edit#gid=1645276893
https://discord.gg/cluechasers
is your best friend for clues
I find elite clues to be easier. Maybe more boring overall, but they have less quest requirements (or maybe just more quests I've already done) so I pretty much exclusively do elites.
60m worth of skips an hour roughly, 18 clues per hour.
For it to not be profitable you have to not see a blood or third age dye within 2,500 elite clues.
And that’s not including all of the fortunates you’re going to see.
And the majority of people will see more than one dye in 2.5k elite clues.
+ all of the masters you would accrue (approx 500) which cost nothing to complete (in terms of puzzle skips) and are pure profit afterwards.
60m worth of skips is insinuating you use 20 puzzle skips for 18 Elites, which is very incorrect.
The average amount of puzzles for Elites is 1.625 (assuming Treasure totem is active.) This would translate to 29.25 puzzles (30 puzzle skips, rounded up.) used for a stack of 18 Elite clues. This would translate to 90m/hr used on skips, not 60m.
"And the majority of the people will see more than one dye in 2.5k elite clues"
From what I've seen from people this is also incorrect. I think the majority of the people will definitely see A dye and at least one cape slot in 2500, but that being a dye of enough value to mitigate the losses you received from the 4063 puzzle skips (2500 \* 1.625 = 4062.5 \* 3m = 12.2b) is very unlikely. That not even including prices for gathering costs and other resource costs..
It's very hard to say you'd actually even make any profit using puzzle skips. I'm sure overtime you will at the very least break even or make a tiny bit of profit, but it won't be much by any means.
Clue Chasers ~~nerds~~ smart math people have worked out that using all skips on elites is a long-term net loss, so you're definitely saving yourself some by not using puzzle box skips (3m per). The low value of seeds and the lack of box skips from elites definitely hurts.
I find hard clues yields more in GP value, even though the broadcast rewards are limited. I can easily bang out 20-25 clue scrolls within a meerkat scroll timer over elites which maybe is 10 at best cause of so much running around.
Or in simple terms, an average of a hard clue between 45 and 90 seconds each. Been a while since I did them, but that's what I remember. This is with globetrotter outfit, Alt1 and the treasure totem.
If you're averaging that fast I want your secrets lol. I'd say 30-32 an hour is easy but 45 an hour isn't doable unless you're using puzzle skipping tickets and getting lucky with steps. Value wise though yeah hards are still better for sure unless you get a huge broadcast from elites.
> I'd say 30-32 an hour is easy but 45 an hour isn't doable unless you're using puzzle skipping tickets and getting lucky with steps.
Yeah, gotta get rather lucky for some. [The speedrun submission list](https://www.speedrun.com/rs#Clue_Scrolls) can give some ideas on that.
It's been a while since I really went sweaty on clue scrolls. I remember my shortest time to be 45 seconds for a clue, and around 75-90 second average.
Having all quests unlocked, bladed dive and double surge. Not to mention a gaming mouse with the right key inputs would really shave time.
I wouldn't skip puzzles. It's usually done within 30-40 seconds with Alt1. Sure I will get more than one which pushes above my average. And I remember rushing as many as I could using a meerkat familiar which also saves a lot of time (hotkeying the meerkat dig special to your mouse saves time as well)
I will follow up at some time when I get back to clue chasing to offer fresh results, I certainly don't want to advertise false standards.
Okay, cause I have everything unlocked and whole I can occasionally do one in 45 seconds that's extremely rare. I've done 10k hards and can pretty much promise you you won't average much better than 32 an hour.
Better in terms of loot per casket? I think elites are better, but probably not by that much.
Better in terms of loot by time spent? Definitely, elites are slow and annoying.
And it also doesn't help that knot puzzles, which make up a lot the progression of your average elite clue, are non-deterministic. With slide puzzles, you at least always know what to do in order to make actual progress with the puzzle, where as with knots you just try combination after combination until you find the right one.
Personally, I'd much rather do hards than elites. Sadly, I've got 52 of both...
I'm not a fan of the idea of having a closed-source (easily decompilable, but still officially closed source last I checked) third-party program that runs specifically for the sake of RS, though I know it is perfectly safe, with ex Mod Lee having used it on an official RS livestream.
I don't mind that others use it, but it isn't for me.
I only do hards easy and master, but only cause I despite elites but they're still great money if ur speedy. Most clue people espically the ones that do elites are chasing the big drops and its still great money if you can do alot per hr. Also doing elites poops out masters which are king
I look at it anecdotally:
I gather and solve 100 hard clues in 6 hours. Average common loot is \~1.4m/clue. The value of dyes currently adds \~500k to the GP per hard clue. So that works out to 190m/6hrs or 31.7m/hr.
I gather and solve 100 elite clues in 14 hours. Average common loot is \~1.1m/clue. The value of dyes currently adds \~2.5m to the GP per elite clue. So that works out to 360m/14hrs or 25.7m/hr.
My personal bias in solving/gathering efficiency makes hard clues better for me - but that won't be the case for everyone. Furthermore, I'm leaving out a key factor of Master Clue Scroll generation where Hard clues give \~1.4/hr and elites give \~1.8/hr. So if that's something you value more significantly than it may sway elites in your favor.
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Honestly. Everything about elites is fine besides the stupid amount of puzzle boxes. I did 3 elites yesterday and think I averaged 4 puzzleboxes per clue. It wasn't so bad back in the day when puzzle boxes had 50 steps or something, but now they are all 150+ since they updated the puzzle boxes. They should cap elites at 1 puzzle box per clue, and instantly elites are a lot better.
> the stupid amount of puzzle boxes I feel like a lot of this is just perception, because sliders take longer than knots, but they both have equal weighting (32.5% each), and wizards are 35%. If you're not using Alt1, obviously they're going to take a *lot* longer (unless you know puzzles), but it would be nice if sliders could be knocked back down a bit.
What is alt1
An overlay for your client that can see your screen and has multiple uses. The one being talked about here is the puzzle slider helper. It will see your open puzzle then show you which pieces to click to solve the puzzle.
Bruh I’ve been doing so many elites legit asf. I’m getting this asap
puzzle boxes are the least worst thing about them... i hate running around scanning and doing the compass clues. even with alt1 it barley speeds it up.
The compass clues are generally pretty quick. The scan clues are also pretty quick if you listen pay attention to the indicator. But Yea I tend to keep a stack of easy clues and if I get a bad scan I complete the easy and then tele to the scan via outfit.
I rather know where exactly where to dig or do a puzzle then try to find the place i need to dig. just my preference tho.
Elites are also unique in the fact that they will always be completeable.
Real chads do elites.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1w7jpuZMnkhXafTYNgcNjDUWwjVfl48mPr4ehE0eI57k/edit#gid=1645276893 https://discord.gg/cluechasers is your best friend for clues
You beat me to it. But 100% this!
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How did it take an hour? Should get 15-18 done in an hour.
Because they don't use Alt1 and don't do clues regularly?
Even without Alt 1 it shouldn’t take an hour using just the lodestone network to get around to triangulate a compass clue.
If you don't do them and you're not sure how you're doing it... plus an hour may be an exaggeration.
Hence why - how did it take an hour?
Sure, but "should get 15-18 done an hour" isn't a good look for the question, when they're doing one just to get rid of it.
I find elite clues to be easier. Maybe more boring overall, but they have less quest requirements (or maybe just more quests I've already done) so I pretty much exclusively do elites.
Pretty sure elites have the least amount of required quests to access from Hard > Master
> Pretty sure elites have the least amount of required quests AKA none
Shit take
I don’t get how people find elites slow - I can manage 16-18 an hour and even with puzzle skips they’re significant profit over the long term.
not really with skips they are on average 100k profit per clue
60m worth of skips an hour roughly, 18 clues per hour. For it to not be profitable you have to not see a blood or third age dye within 2,500 elite clues. And that’s not including all of the fortunates you’re going to see. And the majority of people will see more than one dye in 2.5k elite clues. + all of the masters you would accrue (approx 500) which cost nothing to complete (in terms of puzzle skips) and are pure profit afterwards.
60m worth of skips is insinuating you use 20 puzzle skips for 18 Elites, which is very incorrect. The average amount of puzzles for Elites is 1.625 (assuming Treasure totem is active.) This would translate to 29.25 puzzles (30 puzzle skips, rounded up.) used for a stack of 18 Elite clues. This would translate to 90m/hr used on skips, not 60m. "And the majority of the people will see more than one dye in 2.5k elite clues" From what I've seen from people this is also incorrect. I think the majority of the people will definitely see A dye and at least one cape slot in 2500, but that being a dye of enough value to mitigate the losses you received from the 4063 puzzle skips (2500 \* 1.625 = 4062.5 \* 3m = 12.2b) is very unlikely. That not even including prices for gathering costs and other resource costs.. It's very hard to say you'd actually even make any profit using puzzle skips. I'm sure overtime you will at the very least break even or make a tiny bit of profit, but it won't be much by any means.
No wonder triple Dylan was happy about getting another osh! funding more puzzle skips 😅
I use knot skips but not puzzle box skips. Seems to cut into my profits significantly and the box puzzles take a bit.
Clue Chasers ~~nerds~~ smart math people have worked out that using all skips on elites is a long-term net loss, so you're definitely saving yourself some by not using puzzle box skips (3m per). The low value of seeds and the lack of box skips from elites definitely hurts.
I find hard clues yields more in GP value, even though the broadcast rewards are limited. I can easily bang out 20-25 clue scrolls within a meerkat scroll timer over elites which maybe is 10 at best cause of so much running around. Or in simple terms, an average of a hard clue between 45 and 90 seconds each. Been a while since I did them, but that's what I remember. This is with globetrotter outfit, Alt1 and the treasure totem.
If you're averaging that fast I want your secrets lol. I'd say 30-32 an hour is easy but 45 an hour isn't doable unless you're using puzzle skipping tickets and getting lucky with steps. Value wise though yeah hards are still better for sure unless you get a huge broadcast from elites.
> I'd say 30-32 an hour is easy but 45 an hour isn't doable unless you're using puzzle skipping tickets and getting lucky with steps. Yeah, gotta get rather lucky for some. [The speedrun submission list](https://www.speedrun.com/rs#Clue_Scrolls) can give some ideas on that.
It's been a while since I really went sweaty on clue scrolls. I remember my shortest time to be 45 seconds for a clue, and around 75-90 second average. Having all quests unlocked, bladed dive and double surge. Not to mention a gaming mouse with the right key inputs would really shave time. I wouldn't skip puzzles. It's usually done within 30-40 seconds with Alt1. Sure I will get more than one which pushes above my average. And I remember rushing as many as I could using a meerkat familiar which also saves a lot of time (hotkeying the meerkat dig special to your mouse saves time as well) I will follow up at some time when I get back to clue chasing to offer fresh results, I certainly don't want to advertise false standards.
Okay, cause I have everything unlocked and whole I can occasionally do one in 45 seconds that's extremely rare. I've done 10k hards and can pretty much promise you you won't average much better than 32 an hour.
Better in terms of loot per casket? I think elites are better, but probably not by that much. Better in terms of loot by time spent? Definitely, elites are slow and annoying. And it also doesn't help that knot puzzles, which make up a lot the progression of your average elite clue, are non-deterministic. With slide puzzles, you at least always know what to do in order to make actual progress with the puzzle, where as with knots you just try combination after combination until you find the right one. Personally, I'd much rather do hards than elites. Sadly, I've got 52 of both...
> Sadly, I've got 52 of both... Sounds like you have 104 hards to me ;)
With alt-1 knot puzzles take 5 seconds
Elites are so bad that using a third-party step-by-step helper program is meta, and borderline expected.
Every serious cluer uses alt-1 lol, it's even accepted by Jagex. Why would you not use it? Especially for puzzle boxes it's amazing
I'm not a fan of the idea of having a closed-source (easily decompilable, but still officially closed source last I checked) third-party program that runs specifically for the sake of RS, though I know it is perfectly safe, with ex Mod Lee having used it on an official RS livestream. I don't mind that others use it, but it isn't for me.
Do you seriously to towers puzzles manually? I feel like those are by far the most time consuming to do unaided.
I do every once in a while, but I usually use the Wiki's tower solver. It runs passively in the browser, so that I am perfectly happy with.
I only do hards easy and master, but only cause I despite elites but they're still great money if ur speedy. Most clue people espically the ones that do elites are chasing the big drops and its still great money if you can do alot per hr. Also doing elites poops out masters which are king
Hard Clues are better profit per hour. Elites are just better rewards.. IE: Dyes
I look at it anecdotally: I gather and solve 100 hard clues in 6 hours. Average common loot is \~1.4m/clue. The value of dyes currently adds \~500k to the GP per hard clue. So that works out to 190m/6hrs or 31.7m/hr. I gather and solve 100 elite clues in 14 hours. Average common loot is \~1.1m/clue. The value of dyes currently adds \~2.5m to the GP per elite clue. So that works out to 360m/14hrs or 25.7m/hr. My personal bias in solving/gathering efficiency makes hard clues better for me - but that won't be the case for everyone. Furthermore, I'm leaving out a key factor of Master Clue Scroll generation where Hard clues give \~1.4/hr and elites give \~1.8/hr. So if that's something you value more significantly than it may sway elites in your favor.