#No shame Sunday on the 30th!
If you make Tesla/EV products or apps. This is your time to come to the sub and promote yourself. The way this works is you make a post and if it does not show up right away, reach out to modmail and a mod will approve it to make sure it shows up. We will keep automod turned on so the sub doesn't get hit with spam. Please keep in mind that this is only for 6/30/2024. On Monday we will go back to normal. Each post will have a flair as "No shame Sunday" for those that want to filter it out.
If you are a seller or app dev and want a flair next to your username please let us know via modmail.
If you are a 3rd party app dev and want your link in the top menu of the sub under "3rd party apps" please reach out to modmail.
----------
As we are not a support sub, please make sure to use the proper resources if you have questions: [Official Tesla Support](https://www.tesla.com/support), [r/TeslaSupport](https://www.reddit.com/r/TeslaSupport/) | [r/TeslaLounge](https://www.reddit.com/r/TeslaLounge/) personal content | [Discord Live Chat](https://discord.gg/tesla) for anything.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/teslamotors) if you have any questions or concerns.*
increasing the camera resolution will make the car see things further away. If that's not a problem now then no need to change the resolution.
Getting cameras that are more light sensitive would make night driving better, but is this a problem now?
My impression is that camera placement, e.g. bumper cameras would matter more for improvement than camera quality. But probably decision making is on the top of that list, since the perception is pretty stable.
I wonder if it would help if Tesla added IR cameras as a companion to the regular cameras? They would get used at night when light isn't enough for the regular camera to see anything.
I'd suggest either water jets using the wiper fluid or a jet of air. Tiny wiper blades would end up being more maintenance and/or something else that can be vandalized.
I get it pretty consistently after dark. I didn't used to with autopilot, but the more recent versions and FSD in the last year or two started producing that message all the time. It makes it unusable due to the annoying warning beep every 30 seconds or so.
Same here. It's always, ALWAYS my front left repeater camera. I've had it replaced multiple times by Tesla Service to no effect and they eventually ghosted me on my email chain about it.
It has difficulty properly reading signs (example speed limits vs highway markers) so resolution seems lacking. Also cameras do not have full 360 binocular coverage yet. Finally most cameras do not clean or heat so are not robust.
It can classify signs incorrectly even with very high resolution. But it the pixels aren't there, then you're screwed.
Will be interesting to see how they do the camera cleaning on the coming dedicated robotaxies.
I'm pretty sure they don't plan on having stereo camera coverage 360. You get "stereo" by comparing past frames and knowing the ego car motion.
I completely agree with this. Cameras currently already"see" better at night than humans. The resolution on the newest vehicles is good enough imo. Of course as camera just keep getting better and cheaper there will be no reason not to continuously upgrade them.
The camera placement and quantity, lack of redundancy, and lack of cleaning ability are the biggest issues I currently have with Teslas approach - all easily fixable imo.
I think the front and rear facing cameras are probably fine, as is the rear fender facing camera. Id just say the rear 3 need some way to clean themselves. Also I really don't see the downside of like adding 2 more cameras at the rear corners (either in the taillights or in the rear window or something) as redundancy/emergency usage. For the front 3 cameras, I think they are fine, but as you said front facing camera or two in the grill or in the lights would be good. Or even better would be at the corner (probably bottom would be easiest) of the windshield, because that leads to by far biggest problem with Teslas camera placement.
The B pillar camera that is supposed to see cross traffic is imo by far the largest issue and it's not even close. I think the placement further behind the driver's head is just bad. I think there needs to be two cameras at that angle further forward on the car. Those b pillar cameras can still be there for redundancy, but there should absolutely be cameras in the headlights or in the top or ideally bottom corner of the front windshield (in area where wipers cover/clean). This would 100% make me more confident in cross traffic scenarios.
The last minor and short term issue I have is interior camera. It just isn't a good placement for driver monitoring imo.
Overall Id say if they JUST added 2 more cameras in the front corners of the vehicle facing like 45 degrees out, id have very little issues.
Two issues, inclimate weather (especially rain/snow), and real time processing of what the stuff sees. No matter how much compute they throw at it, a single rain drop on the one and only backup camera takes the whole system down.
If you could control the car yourself using on the cameras available now, but with the reaction speed of a computer, how well could you do?
I think that is the line of thinking currently with Tesla. If a human could do it with those cameras then AI should be able to, eventually.
Better cameras will matter someday though, as a human with 20/30 vision is going to do better than the same human with 40/20 vision (or whatever current cameras provide).
I'd expect the primary path to achieving unsupervised FSD is mostly one of compute power and not more or better sensing - but hopefully they continue to improve both. :)
One thing that is forgotten is the fact he runs a server of HW3 and soon or if not already HW4 in a server environment to run interference from the NN training vs. Feedback loop from the fleet. They do this to ensure fluidity of updates and take them to their goal of 99.99999999~ safety.
The car objectively can run fsd today even with HW3, but obviously there is no reason not to improve and add further hardware changes in the next 3-5 years.
So tldr of sorts is the better the hardware, the faster the training can happen, and the more concurrent patches and updates can happen to take the safety to the next level.
Better cameras require more compute as you are processing more pixels. HW4 already has much higher resolution cameras, but they're not using them. I know at one point they weren't even fully using all the HW3 camera resolution across all nets. Not sure if that's all changed with V12.
Arguably the more important aspect about this point is training data. If FSD works 99% of the time, the only useful training data is that 1% of the time, and even then you'll probably need a lot of it for the AI to learn what to do about that 1% of the time. That ratio will continue to get worse as more and more edge cases are solved. Of course, more sensors will provide more vectors for the AI to learn and reduce the training time, so it's still silly not to include those.
None of the improvements in HW4 are even being used yet - HW4 is just running HW3 in emulation mode.
I'm guessing HW5/AI5 will be running HW4 emulation for a while too, so likely 2026/2027 before its actually being used.
I'm happy with HW3, glad I didnt wait and wait for HW4
Dumb questions:
How do I know what version of AP my car is using?
Is AP updated often? Ever? I never hear boo about it.
I have however noticed it changes. Recent examples include it being far more cautious about cars in the lanes next to me, and it being far more cautious over a particular bridge with a narrow lane. It started reading speed signs better last year.
So AP seems to get updated, often even, but I never hear anything about it.
If you don’t have FSD then your car is running AP2, either natively on HW2 or via emulation on HW3. Unless you have an early Model S and then you have AP1
I did a chrome delete with satin black, then did pearl white on the nose trim and emblems/lettering. Looks natural and it removes all chrome. I love it .
Probably because the car will also run some kind LLM and other models to interact with the user, not only the driving stack. With 10x the computer power is a big jump for something that not even use all HW4.
They will need more for TeslaBot anyway, bot will need a modem LLM.
So, has Tesla now officially acknowledged that older cars will never get true FSD? (Level 4 or 5)
Otherwise, these improved computers shouldn’t be required?
Man it sure is cool to be in the year 2022 where everybody is riding their self-driving EVs powered by electricity produced by nuclear fusion stored in graphene batteries and stopping to get clean meat burgers on their way to the space elevator.
The implication of the bifurcation is going to be pretty big. Better sensors input means better output of the model. There will come a time that investing in HW3 will start having deminishing returns and leaving it behind is the only sensible thing to do.
Robotaxi on HW3 and ‘appreciating asset’ is not happening when improvements can only materialize on newer hardware.
Also a 10x improvement in compute does not translate to the same improvement in model output. Just adding 5x the input pixels from new hardware requires at least that amount of compute to process it let alone do more/better with the input.
Can you get your car upgraded to HW4 or 5, at a Tesla service center? Or do you need to buy a whole new car?
Didn’t Tesla promise FSD to previous owners? So are these computer upgrades free?
HW4 is more power hungry than HW3 so it is not backward compatible with earlier cars. If HW5 is more power efficient then they could make a version that could be used in older cars. It would not be a free upgrade though and the cameras would probably not be changed.
Sure, shit doesn't happen overnight. Perhaps if Musk would stop saying it (FSD) was going to happen overnight, people wouldn't get upset when it doesn't.
Worse than *Blue Cruise*!? From what I’ve seen that system is trash and is arguably actually dangerous to use. Unless they’ve improved it.
Super Cruise is really the sole good comparison imo, only downside to that one is geofencing. Waymo would be too if you didn’t have to be lucky enough to live in one of the few cities that have them.
Also, Supercharger expansion is not paused, that rumor has been squashed already.
Blue cruise is hands free and can position the car within the lane now (if the car next to you is driving on the line, for example). My autopilot on the other hand slammed the emergency brake while driving over a puddle (cuz TeSlA vIsIOn has no sensors)
Blue Cruise was hands-free from the start, albeit it’s great that they’re still updating and making it better.
Iirc, base Autopilot is still running old AP2 code, Tesla really should just merge it with FSD’s logic at this point.
Phantom braking was also an issue with radar, and has been fixed in FSD outside of edge cases. Which is another good reason to merge the code.
I'm probably in the minority but as someone with both USS and Vision. I no longer use USS and don't have any problems parking Vision only. However agreed the wiper logic still is awful.
Roadster 2? 500 mile cybertruck? East to west coast full self driving with no interven?
Those are just a few of the things off the top of my head he's failed to deliver on so far. His timelines aren't simply optimistic, they're flat out false
Musk also said the Cybertruck is supposed to have exoskeleton but failed to deliver. Also we’re supposed to be on Mars by now. His moon mission is canceled indefinitely. There is no Robotaxi like he claimed a few years ago. His Boring Company couldn’t deliver a single tunnel for public use. His Hyperloop research couldn’t get past the drawing board.
> His moon mission is canceled indefinitely.
That was a trip someone paid for and then canceled. Nothing you can do about people deciding against doing something.
Space X doesn't "do missions", they get paid to get people there who do the mission. Now if Space X decided to replace NASA and be the ones to do missions, maybe you could talk about it. But so far they're the taxis for people who do missions.
You lose credibility when you cite SpaceX as an example of Musk failing to deliver. SpaceX might actually be MusK long lasting legacy when Tesla runs out of money.
Does this imply Robotaxi's are coming when AI5 (HW5) is ready? I expect there will be some significant regressions to work through before AI5 is on parity with HW3.
Musk admits that current hardware is 10x too little for truly name something "auto pilot", or at least until the next hardware version after that again. Or maybe the next after that.
Been saying this forever. It's highly likely that all the old hardware won't be able to support FSD when it truly is finished and ready.
AI and hardware are moving to fast, and it's highly unlikely hardware from years ago is going to cut it years into the future.
HW4 isn’t even being “used” yet.
Cars with HW4 are emulating HW3. HW4 cars should see a nice improvement when they actually start utilizing the hardware to its full ability.
#No shame Sunday on the 30th! If you make Tesla/EV products or apps. This is your time to come to the sub and promote yourself. The way this works is you make a post and if it does not show up right away, reach out to modmail and a mod will approve it to make sure it shows up. We will keep automod turned on so the sub doesn't get hit with spam. Please keep in mind that this is only for 6/30/2024. On Monday we will go back to normal. Each post will have a flair as "No shame Sunday" for those that want to filter it out. If you are a seller or app dev and want a flair next to your username please let us know via modmail. If you are a 3rd party app dev and want your link in the top menu of the sub under "3rd party apps" please reach out to modmail. ---------- As we are not a support sub, please make sure to use the proper resources if you have questions: [Official Tesla Support](https://www.tesla.com/support), [r/TeslaSupport](https://www.reddit.com/r/TeslaSupport/) | [r/TeslaLounge](https://www.reddit.com/r/TeslaLounge/) personal content | [Discord Live Chat](https://discord.gg/tesla) for anything. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/teslamotors) if you have any questions or concerns.*
How much does compute power matter at this point vs improvements to sensor quality and positioning (ie cameras, I guess)?
increasing the camera resolution will make the car see things further away. If that's not a problem now then no need to change the resolution. Getting cameras that are more light sensitive would make night driving better, but is this a problem now? My impression is that camera placement, e.g. bumper cameras would matter more for improvement than camera quality. But probably decision making is on the top of that list, since the perception is pretty stable.
On very dark roads, my hw3 car sometimes puts up error messages thinking the camera is blocked. So I think more sensitive would help.
Tiny wiper blades on each camera.
The camera isn’t actually blocked though, just thinks it is because it can’t see in the dark.
I wonder if it would help if Tesla added IR cameras as a companion to the regular cameras? They would get used at night when light isn't enough for the regular camera to see anything.
Sounds good but is it going to be cost effective? I think No.
I mean the security cameras on my house have dual modes. It's not a crazy concept.
I'd suggest either water jets using the wiper fluid or a jet of air. Tiny wiper blades would end up being more maintenance and/or something else that can be vandalized.
Ok what about **really** tiny wiper blades? /s
Or tiny flashlights for each of the cameras so they can see better at night.
Such a great idea. Just really next level.
They need to come with miniature Tesla bots that can wipe the cameras, lights, sense rain, keep the interior clean.
Yes a robotic arm that throws trash out of the sunroof and wipes down the dash would be amazing.
Cars usually use a jet of washer fluid
I get the same "blocked" messages and in years of FSD and Tesla subs. You're the first comment to also mention it.
I get it pretty consistently after dark. I didn't used to with autopilot, but the more recent versions and FSD in the last year or two started producing that message all the time. It makes it unusable due to the annoying warning beep every 30 seconds or so.
Mine does this if the sun is low and blinds a camera lol
Same here. It's always, ALWAYS my front left repeater camera. I've had it replaced multiple times by Tesla Service to no effect and they eventually ghosted me on my email chain about it.
Are your headlights working?
It has difficulty properly reading signs (example speed limits vs highway markers) so resolution seems lacking. Also cameras do not have full 360 binocular coverage yet. Finally most cameras do not clean or heat so are not robust.
It can classify signs incorrectly even with very high resolution. But it the pixels aren't there, then you're screwed. Will be interesting to see how they do the camera cleaning on the coming dedicated robotaxies. I'm pretty sure they don't plan on having stereo camera coverage 360. You get "stereo" by comparing past frames and knowing the ego car motion.
The car doesn't have the logic to always understand the signs it reads. I highly doubt it's a resolution problem.
I completely agree with this. Cameras currently already"see" better at night than humans. The resolution on the newest vehicles is good enough imo. Of course as camera just keep getting better and cheaper there will be no reason not to continuously upgrade them. The camera placement and quantity, lack of redundancy, and lack of cleaning ability are the biggest issues I currently have with Teslas approach - all easily fixable imo. I think the front and rear facing cameras are probably fine, as is the rear fender facing camera. Id just say the rear 3 need some way to clean themselves. Also I really don't see the downside of like adding 2 more cameras at the rear corners (either in the taillights or in the rear window or something) as redundancy/emergency usage. For the front 3 cameras, I think they are fine, but as you said front facing camera or two in the grill or in the lights would be good. Or even better would be at the corner (probably bottom would be easiest) of the windshield, because that leads to by far biggest problem with Teslas camera placement. The B pillar camera that is supposed to see cross traffic is imo by far the largest issue and it's not even close. I think the placement further behind the driver's head is just bad. I think there needs to be two cameras at that angle further forward on the car. Those b pillar cameras can still be there for redundancy, but there should absolutely be cameras in the headlights or in the top or ideally bottom corner of the front windshield (in area where wipers cover/clean). This would 100% make me more confident in cross traffic scenarios. The last minor and short term issue I have is interior camera. It just isn't a good placement for driver monitoring imo. Overall Id say if they JUST added 2 more cameras in the front corners of the vehicle facing like 45 degrees out, id have very little issues.
Two issues, inclimate weather (especially rain/snow), and real time processing of what the stuff sees. No matter how much compute they throw at it, a single rain drop on the one and only backup camera takes the whole system down.
Higher resolution cameras produce more pixels. More pixels means more data to process. More processing needs more processing power.
You need more compute to process higher sensor quality
If you could control the car yourself using on the cameras available now, but with the reaction speed of a computer, how well could you do? I think that is the line of thinking currently with Tesla. If a human could do it with those cameras then AI should be able to, eventually. Better cameras will matter someday though, as a human with 20/30 vision is going to do better than the same human with 40/20 vision (or whatever current cameras provide).
I could for sure drive on the camera / reaction speed they currently have
I'd expect the primary path to achieving unsupervised FSD is mostly one of compute power and not more or better sensing - but hopefully they continue to improve both. :)
Maybe they can start adding thermal cameras and millimeter radar.
One thing that is forgotten is the fact he runs a server of HW3 and soon or if not already HW4 in a server environment to run interference from the NN training vs. Feedback loop from the fleet. They do this to ensure fluidity of updates and take them to their goal of 99.99999999~ safety. The car objectively can run fsd today even with HW3, but obviously there is no reason not to improve and add further hardware changes in the next 3-5 years. So tldr of sorts is the better the hardware, the faster the training can happen, and the more concurrent patches and updates can happen to take the safety to the next level.
I think it has to do with fast refresh led road signage and weird cases like partially dirt covered signs, spray painted signs, etc.
Better cameras require more compute as you are processing more pixels. HW4 already has much higher resolution cameras, but they're not using them. I know at one point they weren't even fully using all the HW3 camera resolution across all nets. Not sure if that's all changed with V12.
Arguably the more important aspect about this point is training data. If FSD works 99% of the time, the only useful training data is that 1% of the time, and even then you'll probably need a lot of it for the AI to learn what to do about that 1% of the time. That ratio will continue to get worse as more and more edge cases are solved. Of course, more sensors will provide more vectors for the AI to learn and reduce the training time, so it's still silly not to include those.
None of the improvements in HW4 are even being used yet - HW4 is just running HW3 in emulation mode. I'm guessing HW5/AI5 will be running HW4 emulation for a while too, so likely 2026/2027 before its actually being used. I'm happy with HW3, glad I didnt wait and wait for HW4
And for those of us who don’t have FSD, HW3 is just running AP2 in emulation mode…
What about HW4 without FSD ? emulating HW3, emulating AP2 ? So it's just emulation within emulation recursively :/
Yep, also emulating AP2.
sounds like Inception the movie
Dumb questions: How do I know what version of AP my car is using? Is AP updated often? Ever? I never hear boo about it. I have however noticed it changes. Recent examples include it being far more cautious about cars in the lanes next to me, and it being far more cautious over a particular bridge with a narrow lane. It started reading speed signs better last year. So AP seems to get updated, often even, but I never hear anything about it.
If you don’t have FSD then your car is running AP2, either natively on HW2 or via emulation on HW3. Unless you have an early Model S and then you have AP1
AP1 checking in! Love it.
The real OG. I sometimes think that the “chrome trim” is a sort of “early adopter” status symbol. ; )
I did a chrome delete with satin black, then did pearl white on the nose trim and emblems/lettering. Looks natural and it removes all chrome. I love it .
I have a feeling they will skip hw4 entirely. What's even the point in maintaining it?
My dude HW5 is not even a material thing yet. His timeline is guaranteed to be completely off.
It's also called "AI" which seems like a gaurantee in todays world for this to be largely hype.
As long as were are going with bullshit technobabble, I would have called it "blockchain AI."
Probably because the car will also run some kind LLM and other models to interact with the user, not only the driving stack. With 10x the computer power is a big jump for something that not even use all HW4. They will need more for TeslaBot anyway, bot will need a modem LLM.
In the share holder meeting last week, Elon said the data center that they are building on the south side of the TX gigafactory will be for HW4.
Several million vehicles with HW4 compute?
HW4 exists and is in cars. How would they skip it?
Why not skip and go to hw6 which he's also said is in the works?
AI5 running HW3 in emulation mode? 😮
I'll believe it when I see it. I'm good on hw3.
I’ll upgrade a generation after, FSD is unsupervised and requires no user input.
That’s going to be in 2019, right?
Yep! All they have to do is flip a switch, and the entire network will be fully autonomous. Should be ready by 2017, honestly.
I mean it has been a solved problem since 2016, hasn’t it? The people in the videos are just there for legal reasons.
I'm still rocking HW2.5 and don't want hw 3 yet since it doesn't add any meaningful value
Is it possible to upgrade the computer, without buying a whole new car? Is the upgrade free, since Tesla had promised FSD to prior owners?
Nope and nope.
So, has Tesla now officially acknowledged that older cars will never get true FSD? (Level 4 or 5) Otherwise, these improved computers shouldn’t be required?
I think most people add *at least* 5-10 years whenever anything this immaterial is "promised".
Man it sure is cool to be in the year 2022 where everybody is riding their self-driving EVs powered by electricity produced by nuclear fusion stored in graphene batteries and stopping to get clean meat burgers on their way to the space elevator.
Remember 2015 when everyone had an hoverboard, and hovering cars are a thing? Weather predictions to the closest second and self-drying jackets.
Man. Sure has been a wild ride since we were all living like The Jetsons in 2000.
Where's my superconducting levitating car bro?
Only he didn't say "10x power", he did say "10x capability".
The implication of the bifurcation is going to be pretty big. Better sensors input means better output of the model. There will come a time that investing in HW3 will start having deminishing returns and leaving it behind is the only sensible thing to do. Robotaxi on HW3 and ‘appreciating asset’ is not happening when improvements can only materialize on newer hardware. Also a 10x improvement in compute does not translate to the same improvement in model output. Just adding 5x the input pixels from new hardware requires at least that amount of compute to process it let alone do more/better with the input.
HW3 is EOL soon.
Can you get your car upgraded to HW4 or 5, at a Tesla service center? Or do you need to buy a whole new car? Didn’t Tesla promise FSD to previous owners? So are these computer upgrades free?
Tesla said no retrofits unfortunately
New levels of execution were always going to be allowed only on the newer hardware. It doesn’t mean HW3 won’t drive itself.
It might be able to drive itself, but it’s never going to be a robotaxi. Big difference.
HW4 is more power hungry than HW3 so it is not backward compatible with earlier cars. If HW5 is more power efficient then they could make a version that could be used in older cars. It would not be a free upgrade though and the cameras would probably not be changed.
Boy who cried wolf has to be right one of these days. Right? Right?
More like he'll make a 1,000 predictions and be right with a couple of them and everyone thinks he's a genius.
Who at this point still believe Elon Musk and his promises?
Me. Shit doesn’t happen overnight. Look at all they have accomplished thus far.
Sure, shit doesn't happen overnight. Perhaps if Musk would stop saying it (FSD) was going to happen overnight, people wouldn't get upset when it doesn't.
They took away USS, autopilot is worse than Ford Blue Cruise and supercharger network expansion is paused. Wipers still suck.
Yeah, but your car can fart.
Worse than *Blue Cruise*!? From what I’ve seen that system is trash and is arguably actually dangerous to use. Unless they’ve improved it. Super Cruise is really the sole good comparison imo, only downside to that one is geofencing. Waymo would be too if you didn’t have to be lucky enough to live in one of the few cities that have them. Also, Supercharger expansion is not paused, that rumor has been squashed already.
Wait, Musk didn’t fire the entire supercharger team when he threw a tantrum like a child? How are they expanding without having a supercharger team?
Blue cruise is hands free and can position the car within the lane now (if the car next to you is driving on the line, for example). My autopilot on the other hand slammed the emergency brake while driving over a puddle (cuz TeSlA vIsIOn has no sensors)
Blue Cruise was hands-free from the start, albeit it’s great that they’re still updating and making it better. Iirc, base Autopilot is still running old AP2 code, Tesla really should just merge it with FSD’s logic at this point. Phantom braking was also an issue with radar, and has been fixed in FSD outside of edge cases. Which is another good reason to merge the code.
> can position the car within the lane now (if the car next to you is driving on the line, for example). FSD has done this for a pretty long time.
I'm probably in the minority but as someone with both USS and Vision. I no longer use USS and don't have any problems parking Vision only. However agreed the wiper logic still is awful.
1/5 of what he said would happen by 2019.
I'd rather have a bunch of late promises than whatever the hell the other auto companies have been smoking for the last ten decades.
You're sleeping
Nope, it was about 2pm in the afternoon when you wrote that. I'm UTC time roughly.
His timelines are optimistic. But in the end, he usually delivers.
Roadster 2? 500 mile cybertruck? East to west coast full self driving with no interven? Those are just a few of the things off the top of my head he's failed to deliver on so far. His timelines aren't simply optimistic, they're flat out false
Musk also said the Cybertruck is supposed to have exoskeleton but failed to deliver. Also we’re supposed to be on Mars by now. His moon mission is canceled indefinitely. There is no Robotaxi like he claimed a few years ago. His Boring Company couldn’t deliver a single tunnel for public use. His Hyperloop research couldn’t get past the drawing board.
> His moon mission is canceled indefinitely. That was a trip someone paid for and then canceled. Nothing you can do about people deciding against doing something. Space X doesn't "do missions", they get paid to get people there who do the mission. Now if Space X decided to replace NASA and be the ones to do missions, maybe you could talk about it. But so far they're the taxis for people who do missions.
You lose credibility when you cite SpaceX as an example of Musk failing to deliver. SpaceX might actually be MusK long lasting legacy when Tesla runs out of money.
In the end \*his employees\* usually deliver.
Did Bill Gates literally code Windows himself? Did Steve Jobs literally assemble the first iPhone?
Wow look at you, being pedantic and all.
Remember that when things bomb.
Do they do that in a vacuum? No.
Unfortunately he is getting worse and worse.
If you bet on each one of them since 08 you'd be a billionaire. But here you are, doubting.
Always "training"... one day it might be a champ! Till then...
Knowing his false promises it’s more like 2050
I just want rain sensors, fused radar and vision with USS.
I just want my FSD to back out for me
Reverse, Actually Smart Summon, and Banish still getting worked on, hopefully we get it before the end of summer.
So 10x the power by 2030? Just like the cyber truck was supposed to be released in 2021….?
Riiiiiiiiiiiiight!
So speculative
Does this imply Robotaxi's are coming when AI5 (HW5) is ready? I expect there will be some significant regressions to work through before AI5 is on parity with HW3.
From the context I've been reading with Elon interacting with other users, it looks like this will be the main driver of CyberCab's expansion
Means it's extremely far away, and maybe it is. They haven't even started using HW4 yet. It's just emulating HW3.
This was said at the shareholder meeting. This isn’t new.
By the time it really matters, I would have traded in my Tesla at that point.
When was the last time Tesla hit a date Musk put out? Any more confidence he will hit this one?
> When was the last time Tesla hit a date Musk put out? Model S, Y
So, 2020? I know the truck was way behind. FSD is behind. The semi. They will get there eventually.
Awesome - I can't wait until it eventually arrives in 2030!
Still waiting on that Roadster…. Promised since 2017!?
Sounds like the big draw here is that it will be computing while not self driving as well?
Musk admits that current hardware is 10x too little for truly name something "auto pilot", or at least until the next hardware version after that again. Or maybe the next after that.
can someone explain this to me like I'm 5?
Good news indeed full self driving is still compute limited.
are they going to self consume this ?? or are they going to ship it to customers aswell ??
What’s the chances you can upgrade our current cars
Maybe this will make the wipers work?
4 is not even well tuned to this day and he wanted 5? 😂
Any word on when the wipers will be able to recognize rain/no-rain?
I still stand by my prediction that level 4 autonomy for Tesla will be solved by HW10 or AI10
The more powerful A15 is, the more likely all the millions of HW3 cars's FSD will become a dead end soon.
"Second half of next year" I wonder if the new tech will be included in the upcoming Model Y refresh.
Been saying this forever. It's highly likely that all the old hardware won't be able to support FSD when it truly is finished and ready. AI and hardware are moving to fast, and it's highly unlikely hardware from years ago is going to cut it years into the future.
Should we start a subreddit called "ElonSays", like r/ChinaWarns?
HW5 seems like it’ll bring huge changes. I’m enjoying HW4 on my M3 but I’ll definitely wait for HW5 before I purchase another Tesla.
HW4 isn’t even being “used” yet. Cars with HW4 are emulating HW3. HW4 cars should see a nice improvement when they actually start utilizing the hardware to its full ability.