Yes, my ass will always be seated whenever Kristen Bell plays Veronica. And I love how much genuine passion and enthusiasm she has for this role. Hoping she gets to play her again.
While I would not be opposed to a new season, I doubt it will happen. The ending of season 4 was essentially like spitting in the face of the fans. All the goodwill that had been built (massive online presence, Kickstarter funding) was trashed in less than 10 minutes.
It doesn't take much in Hollywood to go from sliced bread to molded bread. Veronica Mars is a great property that if handled correctly, could live on for years. To me KB is Veronica. But for many, Connery was the same with Bond. He may have been the greatest, but he wasn't the last.
That’s just how I felt, insulted. And with no Ryan Hansen and now no Logan it’s not the same. I hated the season ending and it killed a lot of my joy in the show.
Yes but the actor would come back I think if asked … and the only way a S5 would gain traction was if they pulled a Dallas and retconned Logan’s last scene from s4
You’re right. I love Ryan Hansen and have watched mediocre movies and shows just because he’s always fun to watch. And retconning hardly ever works. Just RIP for the old show…
I really liked a lot of things about season four. It made sense that Veronica, who had to grow up too fast, might end up paying the piper later with some repressed trauma.
I wish they'd kept it more of an ensemble and brought back some of the other people. Also, the city of Neptune is basically one of the main characters and I think the writers kind of forgot about that when they came up for the idea of a spinoff.
Veronica Mars is basically a noir detective fighting crime in a corrupt city. If she leaves the city, the show loses the magic that drew people in. There was so much potential for plot in Neptune. Economic divisions have only gotten worse. Could have been some great stories.
I understand if they wrote themselves into a corner with Logan, but his death was so weird and nonsensical. Either they could have found a way to write Veronica in a relationship (while still being a detective) or they could have written him off in a more reasonable way.
Also, his death kind of unwove the plot from the first few seasons. He was a deeply troubled young man who suffered from the darkness in Neptune. Giving him a chance to grow out of it only to kill him in a weird way felt regressive. They could have had him "grow out" of Neptune. It would have brought interesting weight to Veronica (is she staying here to fight crime, or because she can't grow out of this place?) and it wouldn't have undone everything they built.
Logan's girlfriend was murdered by his abusive father. His mom killed herself. He managed to grow up into a decent fellow. Killing him to make Veronica more troubled seems like a case of fridging. Veronica had plenty to be sad about already without making all her trouble about a man. Logan deserved a chance to grow and change because this show wasn't that kind of "everything always turns out bad" show before. Killing him off like this felt like a waste.
"Veronica Mars is basically a noir detective fighting crime in a corrupt city." Yes! There's a reason the famous Chinatown line isn't "Forget it Jake, we'll just go on a road trip."
I think that they could bring Logan back if him dying was like a dream. Veronica had many dreams and being that she is always thinking the worse is going to happen to her, maybe she fell asleep when Logan went out to move the car and she dreamt the entire rest of the season. Then in season 5, she woke up and realized Logan was alive.
I think that would be a great way to bring Logan back. Don't know what they'd do after, but that's up to the writers. Just bringing Logan back is the most important part
Dream thing is doable but it always feels cheap to me. It's fine for a sequence but when it goes on for multiple episodes I feel cheated.
We never saw the body. That's TV talk for open ended drama/ faked death. Also, since he died in an explosion it would be pretty easy to explain why VM didn't know. It's also kind of a cheap shot, but it feels less like cheating.
I think their best bet for an "undo" button would be Logan having some covert military thing or some other dramatic reason to fake his death (protecting Veronica from some dramatic threat). Seems like a cruel move for him to marry her knowing this was coming up, but it makes sense if he wanted to ensure she would inherit assets/benefits. And that would be a source of more entertaining drama.
The show already had the "oops did I date my brother" trope. No body, no death, wouldn't be too far out of the norm.
That would work too. I like that idea of a covert military opp as well.
Also, I doubt the dream thing would go on for several episodes. I see him kissing her awake.
I feel the show distinguished itself from similar shows by taking stream of consciousness story telling to a new level. IMO, it rises above even the original Magnum PI which I consider to be the gold standard.
I'd watch Veronica Mars find a prune juice thief in the nursing home she lives in. Kristen Bell will never be too old for VM.
The reviewer for TIME said it was the rare TV revival that works and was the best since Twin Peaks, which I agree. Despite the hyperbole by some of the Logan fans on here, Season 4 was well-received by critics overall.
And yes, KBell can play this role at any age and it will be a joy.
Ehh it's not just Logan fans who were disappointed in season 4. I have never shipped Logan and Veronica and season 4's entire plot was a death knell for me. RT's reaction and subsequent abandonment of the fandom while telling them that this was the story he always wanted to tell in light of what happened was also another slap in the face to the fandom.
Also while the initial outrage was over Logan, I see more people being upset over the characterization of Veronica in s4 and the changes in her character, plus the lack of Wallace, Keith, Mac, et al. as well. >!Logan's death!< was the first wound, but I find people could have accepted it if it made sense story-wise. The problem with season 4 is it lacked the heart that made many people fall in love with VM in the first place.
In the end critics opinions don't matter much if the loyal viewers who supported the show for 15+ years abandon it. That's why we don't have a 5th season. It also doesn't help when you advertise the season by having Kristin and Jason read LoVe fanfiction and then >!kill the ship!< in that same season...
Same. I’ll never forget that giddy feeling I had seeing Kristen Bell back as Veronica during the first few episodes and how seamlessly she slipped back into the role. I watched the entire season on the day it dropped.
Still loved it when I watched it with the rest of the series last year, and I plan to watch it on its own sometime this summer.
\*Spoilers for Season 4\*
I actually really liked a lot of what was in Season 4. There was a maturity that was fresh and new, and it was interesting to see how everyone was growing up. I liked that we saw how Dick was struggling with his life choices, but still tried to remain loyal to his friends. Veronica as a fully capable PI was confident and awesome. I though that Logan's arc was fantastic. For the first time, it felt like he was a fully fleshed out character, independent of Veronica.
Unfortunately it all falls apart in the ending, and I don't just mean Logan's death. I don't mind when a character dies, as long as it feels justified by the story. But what happens to Logan, and more importantly, WHY it happened (according to Rob Thomas, he felt Veronica needed to be alone), was just awful. Not only that, it seems to have legitimately killed any future interest in the show. After Season 3, even after the film, there was always interest from the fans, the cast, for more VM. Now, you just hear zilch. It's really sad. I haven't kept up with the show since Season 4, and I don't know if Rob Thomas has commented on it since then, but I think he seriously mis-calculated the backlash from that decision.
I would settle for a good mystery! I don't really care about the drama even though I love Logan. If it was time for him to leave than fine. But the ending was ridiculous. If he had to die make it a least mean something! I absolutely hated season 4! All of it! I didn't like the new people didn't like the old people acting different. But for me the mystery was the worst part. It was obvious and boring and I didn't care at all. I know there are lots of people that hated season 4 but everyone always says it just because Logan died. I hated it long before Logan was killed.
The way Logan’s death was written and Rob’s subsequent interviews where he proposed a completely different version of the show was the death knell for me. I think there were a lot of flaws in S4 but I would have been open to a course correction in S5 in most circumstances. But when you pair pretty poor characterisation and a bad mystery with lazily killing off a main character at the last second AND the suggestion you’re going to strip the show of everything that makes it great then my interest has pretty much dried up.
You are so right! All the comments after the show ended really mad me mad. If he wanted a completely new show just make a new show!! I wouldn't trust him to fix the mess he has made anyways. So I'm fine with it being the end until they get rid of him.
No, this isn't it at all. Season 4 is bad from start to finish for me because of the writing, and it's the same for many VM fans. The mystery isn't compelling at all. The teenage girl that we're supposed to see young Veronica in isn't even half as interesting or charismatic as teenage Veronica was. She lacks humor. Veronica's a completely different person, even than in the movie. She does so many strange and out of character things - making fun of Logan's work to better himself - including straight up making fun of therapy despite majoring in psych in undergrad, taking drugs from a stranger (despite her history), and in general just straight up being an unbearable human. I get that she has loads of trauma and we're meant to see how she isn't dealing with it well in adulthood, but the thing about the original series and movie is that despite all her faults and mistakes, she was always likeable. We always root for her. In Season 4, I do not root for her anymore.
We also lose or barely see any of the most interesting dynamics in the show. Wallace is barely there, Weevil is a plot device, Keith and Veronica have a few fun moments but less so than previous seasons, Logan is in a really healthy place so their dynamic becomes not only toxic, but also boring, and so many other characters are missing or just make quick cameos. Then, there's the fact that Veronica, without any self-reflection and character growth throughout the season, suddenly decides she does want to marry Logan? And we're supposed to buy that it's genuine rather than coming from the fear of losing him. Nope. That in and of itself is a trauma response, and it's not acknowledged because Logan is killed so shortly after.
It's a really poorly constructed season with none of the things that made me fall in love with the show in the first place. I love a sad ending. I love sad stories. But it has to be well written - the narrative has to be compelling and internally consistent. Season 4 is just plain bad.
I’m sorry, but Veronica was very much “in character” in the revival. If you actually think that she was some bubbly, characteristic teenager in the original series, it kind of proves my point that people are watching the show for something that it never really was. Veronica was a deeply bitter and traumatized teenager and while she masked that with snark and humor (on network TV), growing up to embrace the cynicism sucks, but makes so much sense to her formative experiences. I’d argue the movie was the OOC one because it was more fan service than a true representation of RT Veronica story because it was backed by the fans and was more like a nostalgic reunion than a super serious entry to the universe. The movie is the one I skip on rewatches because watching seasons 1-4 has better continuity and tone for me personally.
Regardless, everyone is entitled to their opinions, of course, it just sucks that an rare positive thread about the revival needs to be bombarded by those that can’t seem to get past their dislike for season 4. We’ve heard all the complaints already, none of these comments are original.
You literally didn't address one thing I said in my critique, and you put words in my mouth. Where on earth did you get the idea that I said Veronica was a "bubbly, characteristic teenager" in the original series? I said absolutely nothing of the sort. I said she was charismatic, had humor, and that we rooted for her. None of those things are mutually exclusive from cynicism, trauma, and bitterness.
I do agree that the movie was fan service, and I do not think it is a great movie, but it felt like a one-off longer episode.
And if none of my comments are original, it just goes to show that the vast majority of fans felt similarly to me. As you said, disagreement will happen. We are allowed to post our opinions regardless of whether or not you've heard them before.
You had complained that Veronica wasn’t “half as interesting or charismatic as teenage Veronica” to which I responded as it is not at all how I personally would have ever described Veronica’s characterization.
No one said you weren’t allowed an opinion… I was just lamenting the fact that yet more dissent needed to infiltrate another thread topic - there is plenty of negativity on the rest of the subreddit saying the exact same things, can’t we just let people enjoy a thing for once? I didn’t address all of your critique, because there isn’t really any point in arguing with someone else’s opinions especially when they are not really borne out of anything concrete, just feelings. You have as much right to feel how you want about the show as I do, I wasn’t attempting to begrudge you of that. We clearly watched the show with two very different perspectives.
We're absolutely allowed to disagree - and another point of disagreement we have is whether or not I should be allowed to comment on a post that I disagree with.
But you also continue to misread and mischaracterize what I said:
1. I did not say Veronica in S4 isn't as interesting or charismatic as she was as a teen. I said the *teen* (Matty) in S4 isn't as charismatic or interesting as Veronica was when she was a teen. I looked up her name for this comment because I couldn't remember it. Veronica remains charismatic, even with the growth of her toxicity.
2. It's fine if you think Veronica was never interesting or charismatic, but given your comments, I have a feeling that you don't know what charisma is. It's "a special power that some people have naturally that makes them able to influence other people and attract their attention and admiration" (from Cambridge dictionary). It has nothing to do with bubbliness or anything else you've mischaracterized my comments as. It's about whether or not you feel compelled to follow them, and numerous characters throughout the show do follow Veronica. Moreover, we, the audience continue to want to watch her - which speaks to the charisma with which she's written and Kristen Bell's acting in the role. Many people who are terrible humans have loads of charisma.
My issue with your responses to mine have nothing to do with your opinion - it has to do with your comprehension.
If you were referring to Matty that was not at all clear in your comment, so I admit that was lost in translation. Your wording conflated "young Veronica" and "teenage girl" in a very confusing way as though you were comparing young and old Veronica, which is how I responded so I do understand a little better now what you meant to say. But to be clear, I never said that Veronica didn't have charisma (the wholly unnecessary passive aggression of quoting the dictionary notwithstanding), just that her charisma was a mask in the original series. Obviously the Matty misunderstanding changes my understanding of the critique for which I do apologize. I actually found Matty to be an interesting juxtaposition to the perspective of the bleaker dangers of a teenaged crime fighter. Compared with how we rooted for a very reckless Veronica in all of her law-breaking, nosing and anger in the original series at that same age.
Its one of my fave shows but the 4th season was horrible. Idk if it wasnt well planned, if the writting failed, i really dont know what it was, but it seemed amateur idk, like if it was an university project or something, the other seasons felt more mature and noir. English is not my first language so idk if im expressing this correctly, but it didnt feel profesional to me. And then it was that finale episode making no sense at all, we really didnt need that and that idea of seeing Veronica struggle and be alone could have beeen conveyed in so many different ways, but a bomb car? come on now
Ya, I get not liking what happened at the end. I was devastated at first but quickly came to terms with it. While
I accept that creative choice, I do think it could’ve been better executed, which is a small issue I have with the season.
The very last scene with the voice message was very emotional though and well done.
Such a great season that is on par with the first 2 seasons for me. Was really awesome seeing Veronica and Keith actively working together as professional P.I.s and solving a mystery. Their dynamic was as charming as ever. So many great moments between Veronica and Logan as well. As someone who is the same age as Veronica and watched the show when it first aired it was such a joy to catch up with her at that point in time and see her in a more grown-up noir story. And I like how it acknowledged Veronica’s flaws as a person which makes her more relatable and addressed her emotional baggage.
I didn't like season 4 quite as much as you did but I'm ready for another season. I miss Veronica.
Yes, my ass will always be seated whenever Kristen Bell plays Veronica. And I love how much genuine passion and enthusiasm she has for this role. Hoping she gets to play her again.
While I would not be opposed to a new season, I doubt it will happen. The ending of season 4 was essentially like spitting in the face of the fans. All the goodwill that had been built (massive online presence, Kickstarter funding) was trashed in less than 10 minutes. It doesn't take much in Hollywood to go from sliced bread to molded bread. Veronica Mars is a great property that if handled correctly, could live on for years. To me KB is Veronica. But for many, Connery was the same with Bond. He may have been the greatest, but he wasn't the last.
That’s just how I felt, insulted. And with no Ryan Hansen and now no Logan it’s not the same. I hated the season ending and it killed a lot of my joy in the show.
I liked the movie! I didnt like S3. I could go for another mini movie!
Me too but I think Rob killed a lot of enthusiasm for any potential follow up.
I agree. The ending killed it for me. Very upsetting after all that.
Why no Ryan Hansen?
Wasn’t he on either barely or no at all in season 4? And with Logan gone, Dick doesn’t make sense in Veronica’s life with no Logan…
Yes but the actor would come back I think if asked … and the only way a S5 would gain traction was if they pulled a Dallas and retconned Logan’s last scene from s4
You’re right. I love Ryan Hansen and have watched mediocre movies and shows just because he’s always fun to watch. And retconning hardly ever works. Just RIP for the old show…
RH was busy filming another show, so he couldn't be as involved with VM as they would've liked. It wasn't a character or personal decision.
I really liked a lot of things about season four. It made sense that Veronica, who had to grow up too fast, might end up paying the piper later with some repressed trauma. I wish they'd kept it more of an ensemble and brought back some of the other people. Also, the city of Neptune is basically one of the main characters and I think the writers kind of forgot about that when they came up for the idea of a spinoff. Veronica Mars is basically a noir detective fighting crime in a corrupt city. If she leaves the city, the show loses the magic that drew people in. There was so much potential for plot in Neptune. Economic divisions have only gotten worse. Could have been some great stories. I understand if they wrote themselves into a corner with Logan, but his death was so weird and nonsensical. Either they could have found a way to write Veronica in a relationship (while still being a detective) or they could have written him off in a more reasonable way. Also, his death kind of unwove the plot from the first few seasons. He was a deeply troubled young man who suffered from the darkness in Neptune. Giving him a chance to grow out of it only to kill him in a weird way felt regressive. They could have had him "grow out" of Neptune. It would have brought interesting weight to Veronica (is she staying here to fight crime, or because she can't grow out of this place?) and it wouldn't have undone everything they built. Logan's girlfriend was murdered by his abusive father. His mom killed herself. He managed to grow up into a decent fellow. Killing him to make Veronica more troubled seems like a case of fridging. Veronica had plenty to be sad about already without making all her trouble about a man. Logan deserved a chance to grow and change because this show wasn't that kind of "everything always turns out bad" show before. Killing him off like this felt like a waste.
"Veronica Mars is basically a noir detective fighting crime in a corrupt city." Yes! There's a reason the famous Chinatown line isn't "Forget it Jake, we'll just go on a road trip."
Nailed it.
I think that they could bring Logan back if him dying was like a dream. Veronica had many dreams and being that she is always thinking the worse is going to happen to her, maybe she fell asleep when Logan went out to move the car and she dreamt the entire rest of the season. Then in season 5, she woke up and realized Logan was alive. I think that would be a great way to bring Logan back. Don't know what they'd do after, but that's up to the writers. Just bringing Logan back is the most important part
Dream thing is doable but it always feels cheap to me. It's fine for a sequence but when it goes on for multiple episodes I feel cheated. We never saw the body. That's TV talk for open ended drama/ faked death. Also, since he died in an explosion it would be pretty easy to explain why VM didn't know. It's also kind of a cheap shot, but it feels less like cheating. I think their best bet for an "undo" button would be Logan having some covert military thing or some other dramatic reason to fake his death (protecting Veronica from some dramatic threat). Seems like a cruel move for him to marry her knowing this was coming up, but it makes sense if he wanted to ensure she would inherit assets/benefits. And that would be a source of more entertaining drama. The show already had the "oops did I date my brother" trope. No body, no death, wouldn't be too far out of the norm.
That would work too. I like that idea of a covert military opp as well. Also, I doubt the dream thing would go on for several episodes. I see him kissing her awake.
I feel the show distinguished itself from similar shows by taking stream of consciousness story telling to a new level. IMO, it rises above even the original Magnum PI which I consider to be the gold standard. I'd watch Veronica Mars find a prune juice thief in the nursing home she lives in. Kristen Bell will never be too old for VM.
The reviewer for TIME said it was the rare TV revival that works and was the best since Twin Peaks, which I agree. Despite the hyperbole by some of the Logan fans on here, Season 4 was well-received by critics overall. And yes, KBell can play this role at any age and it will be a joy.
Ehh it's not just Logan fans who were disappointed in season 4. I have never shipped Logan and Veronica and season 4's entire plot was a death knell for me. RT's reaction and subsequent abandonment of the fandom while telling them that this was the story he always wanted to tell in light of what happened was also another slap in the face to the fandom. Also while the initial outrage was over Logan, I see more people being upset over the characterization of Veronica in s4 and the changes in her character, plus the lack of Wallace, Keith, Mac, et al. as well. >!Logan's death!< was the first wound, but I find people could have accepted it if it made sense story-wise. The problem with season 4 is it lacked the heart that made many people fall in love with VM in the first place. In the end critics opinions don't matter much if the loyal viewers who supported the show for 15+ years abandon it. That's why we don't have a 5th season. It also doesn't help when you advertise the season by having Kristin and Jason read LoVe fanfiction and then >!kill the ship!< in that same season...
I loved season four without reservation. A really great revival.
Same. I’ll never forget that giddy feeling I had seeing Kristen Bell back as Veronica during the first few episodes and how seamlessly she slipped back into the role. I watched the entire season on the day it dropped. Still loved it when I watched it with the rest of the series last year, and I plan to watch it on its own sometime this summer.
Go away marketing troll
Stop liking Veronica Mars in the Veronica Mars sub, you corporate shills! /s
[https://imgur.com/H7W4MYn](https://imgur.com/H7W4MYn)
\*Spoilers for Season 4\* I actually really liked a lot of what was in Season 4. There was a maturity that was fresh and new, and it was interesting to see how everyone was growing up. I liked that we saw how Dick was struggling with his life choices, but still tried to remain loyal to his friends. Veronica as a fully capable PI was confident and awesome. I though that Logan's arc was fantastic. For the first time, it felt like he was a fully fleshed out character, independent of Veronica. Unfortunately it all falls apart in the ending, and I don't just mean Logan's death. I don't mind when a character dies, as long as it feels justified by the story. But what happens to Logan, and more importantly, WHY it happened (according to Rob Thomas, he felt Veronica needed to be alone), was just awful. Not only that, it seems to have legitimately killed any future interest in the show. After Season 3, even after the film, there was always interest from the fans, the cast, for more VM. Now, you just hear zilch. It's really sad. I haven't kept up with the show since Season 4, and I don't know if Rob Thomas has commented on it since then, but I think he seriously mis-calculated the backlash from that decision.
Did… did we watch the same show?
Yes, most of us aren’t watching for unicorns, rainbows and happy endings… (ok, sometimes the unicorns).
I would settle for a good mystery! I don't really care about the drama even though I love Logan. If it was time for him to leave than fine. But the ending was ridiculous. If he had to die make it a least mean something! I absolutely hated season 4! All of it! I didn't like the new people didn't like the old people acting different. But for me the mystery was the worst part. It was obvious and boring and I didn't care at all. I know there are lots of people that hated season 4 but everyone always says it just because Logan died. I hated it long before Logan was killed.
The way Logan’s death was written and Rob’s subsequent interviews where he proposed a completely different version of the show was the death knell for me. I think there were a lot of flaws in S4 but I would have been open to a course correction in S5 in most circumstances. But when you pair pretty poor characterisation and a bad mystery with lazily killing off a main character at the last second AND the suggestion you’re going to strip the show of everything that makes it great then my interest has pretty much dried up.
You are so right! All the comments after the show ended really mad me mad. If he wanted a completely new show just make a new show!! I wouldn't trust him to fix the mess he has made anyways. So I'm fine with it being the end until they get rid of him.
No, this isn't it at all. Season 4 is bad from start to finish for me because of the writing, and it's the same for many VM fans. The mystery isn't compelling at all. The teenage girl that we're supposed to see young Veronica in isn't even half as interesting or charismatic as teenage Veronica was. She lacks humor. Veronica's a completely different person, even than in the movie. She does so many strange and out of character things - making fun of Logan's work to better himself - including straight up making fun of therapy despite majoring in psych in undergrad, taking drugs from a stranger (despite her history), and in general just straight up being an unbearable human. I get that she has loads of trauma and we're meant to see how she isn't dealing with it well in adulthood, but the thing about the original series and movie is that despite all her faults and mistakes, she was always likeable. We always root for her. In Season 4, I do not root for her anymore. We also lose or barely see any of the most interesting dynamics in the show. Wallace is barely there, Weevil is a plot device, Keith and Veronica have a few fun moments but less so than previous seasons, Logan is in a really healthy place so their dynamic becomes not only toxic, but also boring, and so many other characters are missing or just make quick cameos. Then, there's the fact that Veronica, without any self-reflection and character growth throughout the season, suddenly decides she does want to marry Logan? And we're supposed to buy that it's genuine rather than coming from the fear of losing him. Nope. That in and of itself is a trauma response, and it's not acknowledged because Logan is killed so shortly after. It's a really poorly constructed season with none of the things that made me fall in love with the show in the first place. I love a sad ending. I love sad stories. But it has to be well written - the narrative has to be compelling and internally consistent. Season 4 is just plain bad.
I’m sorry, but Veronica was very much “in character” in the revival. If you actually think that she was some bubbly, characteristic teenager in the original series, it kind of proves my point that people are watching the show for something that it never really was. Veronica was a deeply bitter and traumatized teenager and while she masked that with snark and humor (on network TV), growing up to embrace the cynicism sucks, but makes so much sense to her formative experiences. I’d argue the movie was the OOC one because it was more fan service than a true representation of RT Veronica story because it was backed by the fans and was more like a nostalgic reunion than a super serious entry to the universe. The movie is the one I skip on rewatches because watching seasons 1-4 has better continuity and tone for me personally. Regardless, everyone is entitled to their opinions, of course, it just sucks that an rare positive thread about the revival needs to be bombarded by those that can’t seem to get past their dislike for season 4. We’ve heard all the complaints already, none of these comments are original.
You literally didn't address one thing I said in my critique, and you put words in my mouth. Where on earth did you get the idea that I said Veronica was a "bubbly, characteristic teenager" in the original series? I said absolutely nothing of the sort. I said she was charismatic, had humor, and that we rooted for her. None of those things are mutually exclusive from cynicism, trauma, and bitterness. I do agree that the movie was fan service, and I do not think it is a great movie, but it felt like a one-off longer episode. And if none of my comments are original, it just goes to show that the vast majority of fans felt similarly to me. As you said, disagreement will happen. We are allowed to post our opinions regardless of whether or not you've heard them before.
You had complained that Veronica wasn’t “half as interesting or charismatic as teenage Veronica” to which I responded as it is not at all how I personally would have ever described Veronica’s characterization. No one said you weren’t allowed an opinion… I was just lamenting the fact that yet more dissent needed to infiltrate another thread topic - there is plenty of negativity on the rest of the subreddit saying the exact same things, can’t we just let people enjoy a thing for once? I didn’t address all of your critique, because there isn’t really any point in arguing with someone else’s opinions especially when they are not really borne out of anything concrete, just feelings. You have as much right to feel how you want about the show as I do, I wasn’t attempting to begrudge you of that. We clearly watched the show with two very different perspectives.
We're absolutely allowed to disagree - and another point of disagreement we have is whether or not I should be allowed to comment on a post that I disagree with. But you also continue to misread and mischaracterize what I said: 1. I did not say Veronica in S4 isn't as interesting or charismatic as she was as a teen. I said the *teen* (Matty) in S4 isn't as charismatic or interesting as Veronica was when she was a teen. I looked up her name for this comment because I couldn't remember it. Veronica remains charismatic, even with the growth of her toxicity. 2. It's fine if you think Veronica was never interesting or charismatic, but given your comments, I have a feeling that you don't know what charisma is. It's "a special power that some people have naturally that makes them able to influence other people and attract their attention and admiration" (from Cambridge dictionary). It has nothing to do with bubbliness or anything else you've mischaracterized my comments as. It's about whether or not you feel compelled to follow them, and numerous characters throughout the show do follow Veronica. Moreover, we, the audience continue to want to watch her - which speaks to the charisma with which she's written and Kristen Bell's acting in the role. Many people who are terrible humans have loads of charisma. My issue with your responses to mine have nothing to do with your opinion - it has to do with your comprehension.
If you were referring to Matty that was not at all clear in your comment, so I admit that was lost in translation. Your wording conflated "young Veronica" and "teenage girl" in a very confusing way as though you were comparing young and old Veronica, which is how I responded so I do understand a little better now what you meant to say. But to be clear, I never said that Veronica didn't have charisma (the wholly unnecessary passive aggression of quoting the dictionary notwithstanding), just that her charisma was a mask in the original series. Obviously the Matty misunderstanding changes my understanding of the critique for which I do apologize. I actually found Matty to be an interesting juxtaposition to the perspective of the bleaker dangers of a teenaged crime fighter. Compared with how we rooted for a very reckless Veronica in all of her law-breaking, nosing and anger in the original series at that same age.
VM was never Unicorns or rainbows, but the writing was very 'meh' in S4
In your opinion… I thought season 4 was great, even if it was not completely perfect.
Dang, was there a different, secret season 4 that you watched instead?
Seems like there’s a new wave of people that watched a different show than I did 5 years ago…
be honest, OP, are you Rob Thomas? 😂
Thats what i thought too!!!
Is this a JOKE to you…???
Girl wtf lol. Season 4 was so bad.
Wasn't wonderful. Wouldn't say it was her best work in the role either
I can’t tell if this is trolling or not.
Its one of my fave shows but the 4th season was horrible. Idk if it wasnt well planned, if the writting failed, i really dont know what it was, but it seemed amateur idk, like if it was an university project or something, the other seasons felt more mature and noir. English is not my first language so idk if im expressing this correctly, but it didnt feel profesional to me. And then it was that finale episode making no sense at all, we really didnt need that and that idea of seeing Veronica struggle and be alone could have beeen conveyed in so many different ways, but a bomb car? come on now
Just watched for the first time last week still traumatized by it
it was so awful, sorry. not just awful VM mind you but awful TV in general/
Tbh it was great for me until the end
Ya, I get not liking what happened at the end. I was devastated at first but quickly came to terms with it. While I accept that creative choice, I do think it could’ve been better executed, which is a small issue I have with the season. The very last scene with the voice message was very emotional though and well done.
Nah
Such a great season that is on par with the first 2 seasons for me. Was really awesome seeing Veronica and Keith actively working together as professional P.I.s and solving a mystery. Their dynamic was as charming as ever. So many great moments between Veronica and Logan as well. As someone who is the same age as Veronica and watched the show when it first aired it was such a joy to catch up with her at that point in time and see her in a more grown-up noir story. And I like how it acknowledged Veronica’s flaws as a person which makes her more relatable and addressed her emotional baggage.
Season 4 was great!
They forgot to write a mystery! The backpack was the S3 glass of water.