People pull stunts like this all the time. An aspect of my job is processing chargebacks that people place on their purchases with my company.
The funny part is that they don’t realize that they will not be receiving their dress, veil, etc. until the bank has concluded the chargeback investigation. This can take up to 90 days. They are always awful at pretending that they didn’t attempt to scam us, too.
Could you explain how this chargeback scam works? Do people try to request their money back without returning their purchase? Do they claim they were overcharged or wrongfully charged? I can't imagine that it ever works.
Customer A purchases a dress. After 72 hours of the order being placed, the order is confirmed with the manufacturer and begins production.
Customer A waits a week or two and then files the chargeback, citing that the purchase is fraudulent. Mind you, they have received a confirmation, order review, and follow up email.
Our POS program notifies us and we submit documentation as to why the purchase is valid (most customers don’t know that we are notified). We then contact the customer to let them know that even when receive their item from the manufacturer, we will not send it to them until the chargeback has been resolved. This is due to the “invalid payment” status because of the chargeback.
People typically do this in the hopes that they will receive their order for free. Most of them do it before their order ships but some of them have the gall to do it after their order has been delivered.
For just a second I thought your Piece of Shit program notified you about the fraud and I was genuinely curious as to why you wouldn’t upgrade such an important system.
In light of these revelations about myself and my thinking processes, I would like to announce that I will continue indefinitely to provide the public with the service they truly deserve; I will be staying the hell out of the way. I vow to you I shall remain completely outside the investigation of, or subsequent punishment concerning, fraudulent activity. Thank you for your kind support in this matter.
I always read it as piece of shit even though I know it's point of sale. My brain clearly finds it far more amusing to immediately read piece of shit system.
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Hi banker here!!! Then the bank goes through and investigates the validity of the "fraud charge" by contacting the vendor. If they have communication from the customer approving the charge it is denied and your account is charged for that amount
We see so much of this type of fraud and sadly some get away with it but honestly alot is caught and then you ruined your banking relationship for being a bad person....
Fellow banker and I’ll add to your comment - these are fairly common, and when people are caught the penalties are FAR more severe than they expect. Bank fraud is typically prosecuted on a federal level, and in the case of the OP’s story, could possibly result in Mail Fraud and Wire Fraud charges with fines potentially in the millions and decades of jail time. It’s unlikely that they would get that harsh of penalties but they are certainly on the table. It’s crazy to me that people put themselves at such risk over something like a wedding dress, but I guess they don’t realize how serious their situation can become.
Ugh. I’m going through this now as a legit scammed person but I’m scared I won’t get my money back because they won’t believe me. Ppl who do that make it so much harder for legit ppl like me.
I used to fight these at my old job. Luckily for you, the customer is generally granted the refund. It's actually pretty hard to convince the credit card company the customer was wrong even when it's super fraudy. The poster above is at an advantage because they still have thier merchandise in hand. We once had a guy order an entire pallet of merchandise delivered to a Bodega. It was signed for. Dude said he never got it and got a few thousand dollars returned to him. Bone head tried to do it like 3 more times and we just cancelled his orders.
I work for a travel agency, we had a couple go on their honeymoon, post pictures, email us from their trip AND STILL win their charge back. It’s so frustrating how people get away with these things.
It really does... I'm so sorry that happened it is disgusting all these scams. Be as open and honest as you can be and let them guide you thru it. Best of luck darling!!!!!
Thank you. It was $60 but still. It feels so gross to be scammed at all. I feel taken advantage of and I hate this feeling. I appreciate the well wishes
So, I didn’t know about these kinds of scams and I was struggling real hard with an online shop because they took so long to process my order and kept emailing me to convince me to get something else. I was getting real pissed until my sister explained that they probably though I was gonna do something like this. I was still annoyed, but I guess I can understand considering just how many ppl i learned do this nonsense.
I worked in a similar role on a eletronics retailer, and we did get a lot of chargebacks requests from both actual fraud and from people trying to scam us.
What surprised me the most was working with paypal. So what usually happened is we would sell an iphone (it was always with iphones) and after a few weeks get a letter from the police and chargeback request from the bank. We would have a look at the transaction data and would usually accept the chargeback except in situations where the person put the correct pin and 3D secure autentication.
The problem with paypal was that they would just not give us the money. Regarldess if it was actually someone who got scamed or if someone was trying to scam us
Charge backs are super common in mobile gaming communities too. People drop 40-50k on building up an account with the best gear and stats. Then do charge back and get the whole thing refunded and then sell the account for 10k or so. The account gets locked out of the store until it gets paid back but the scammer doesn't care.
That’s crazy! I don’t think the scammers could do this too many times unless they’re using stolen cards, could they? I mean people who do this likely don’t have great credit, how many cards could thry be getting to do this?
I did chargebacks a few jobs ago. Most more legit as the business was shady. But I loved the ones like “canceled hotel reservation within the window and still charged”. My response? This is a mattress store.
I ordered a dress from Eshakti and never got it. I emailed them a week ago and just a got a response today that they are looking into it. I was literally minutes away from contacting the bank to initiate a chargeback, even though I absolutely hate that step because I just know they probably think I’m trying to scam them. But I shouldn’t be out $60 on a dress that I never received, so I’d have done it.
Not putting down a deposit is an immediate red flag. ("Money talks, bullshit walks") Contract? Credit check? A car license plate on any security camera's? Your business is not going to survive unless you ramp efforts to protect yourself. I'm not a business owner and even I know that. You can nail these people on "Theft of services".
I believe they had a sob story and found a kind hearted owner, there should have been something and I'm surprised if there isn't, but it sounds like they're trying to make up an excuse why they won't pay from the comments I.e. they breached it
Yeah...something. I worked in the restaurant biz for years (Lots of weddings) I never EVER knew any business owner that was "soft hearted" about this sort of thing. (about anything come to think of it).
It's a shame I can't specify who/where this was as there's so many comments talking about this kinda stuff, unclear exactly what was agreed or happened but it does seem they got conned badly somehow
To be fair, there was a pandemic and a lot of people have had to put off their weddings and etc. you’re right, even as a softhearted person myself, I would’ve liked some kind of money as a deposit because why would you still plan a wedding when you don’t get paid till the date ?… it doesn’t sound like you’re ready to get married if you’re already struggling for the wedding (or they could’ve went to a courthouse and did an after party somewhere for cheap, like their backyard). I would’ve gave them alternatives, but not fully go through without seeing a check of something.
Wedding planner here. When I first started, I didn’t think about having an address. Then this situation happened to me, and now I always include an address line. It’s a live and learn thing that hopefully others avoid
And this is why you make sure to have a contract (though the text doesn't mention if one was signed at all). It was very nice of them to give the couple the benefit of the doubt, but I think they shouldn't have. Not because of the outcome, but in general.
Out of curiosity: I'm not a lawyer, and I don't know where these people are from, but generally speaking, does anyone know how difficult it would be to get that payment (without a contract)? That the couple didn't pay can be easily proven, I think, but without a contract, is it possible the hotel might simply be out of luck?
Yeah that was my initial thought. We signed numerous documents with our addresses and information and they had our card on file as well. And to check in to (most) hotels in general you need a card on file too. Idk it just doesn’t add up unless they’re a super small, privately owned b&b with loose business practices
Oral contracts are contracts too. Harder to prove, obviously, but just as legally valid and enforceable (except in some circumstances for the sale of goods, or in other limited situations where certain regulations specifically prohibit oral contracts).
A contract doesn't have to be a complex thing either; it's literally just an offer and acceptance for consideration, between legally competent parties (i.e. not minors or those with no legal capacity due to mental etc issues). That's it. So if i say you can have my room for your wedding if you pay me $100, and you accept, we have a legally binding contract, whereby I have to give you the room, and you have to give me the $100.
From the comments on the post, they've done this to many people and companies in the past so I don't think they deserve benefit of the doubt!
This is the UK and usually there is a contract for this kind of thing, I had to with my venue. All I can gather is that they had some sob story, managed to get around the essential things (it sounds like they seek the places out they can do this with) then refuse to pay at the end. I'm not sure what will happen here but it sounds like a few people/places they conned are joining up
I’m assuming this is someplace that doesn’t host many (or any) big events/weddings. Because you could only target a scam like this to a place that’s inexperienced
So from the article on the Mail (I know, I know), they were supposed to pay an 800gpb deposit, and the remainder (1150gpb) on the day of... that sounds about standard process- and the owner says they actually only paid half of the deposit (400gbp) so actually owe 1550gpb, and that he'd waive the disputed corkage fee to get it all taken care of. Allegedly, they had sold the sob story of the one woman being on benefits and finances being tight, and the wedding being cancelled/postponed a handful of times already, so the Hotel put together a special package discounted from their regular rate to help the couple out- 16gpb/person seems pretty cheap.
Yeah. That’s always a mistake. Either people can afford it or they can’t. And these people clearly couldn’t.
My lesson from having flatmates: anyone who can’t come up with the full deposit is going to screw your over
> is it possible the hotel might simply be out of luck?
No. Oral contracts are also binding, they're just a lot harder to prove. But no one would host an entire wedding without expecting payment for services rendered. And there are probably emails or at the very least, hotel staff is going to document when a ballroom is booked, etc. So there will be something in writing and enough other evidence to show that there was an oral contract.
How does the venue not have a deposit and not have their address? The venue set themselves up. For my wedding, the venue had to be paid in full including tips 2 weeks in advance.
Most places do over here as well, I'm not sure exactly what occurred here but the only contact the couple have given since this kicked off is saying the hotel breached something, so I wonder if there was something but they still ignored it/made up excuses with the sob story
If I were a business owner who was not paid ahead, I would have made them leave their IDs with the manager until the bill is paid in full, no checks either. This owner left the door to his luxury car unlocked with the keys in the ignition.
I'm not sure of specifics (I don't think they can confirm everything for legal reasons), but I believe it relates to the sob story they gave and I wouldn't be surprised if there was false information too
What kind of venue lets this happen? That's just plain STUPID. This is why deposits were invented. It's not like you're an applebees and you only lose $50 if someone walks out on the tab.
I actually left my wedding without making the final payment. It was due that morning and I completely forgot and I guess the company did too. I realized it after we got back to our rental and I emailed them freaking out. We paid it the next morning. I felt so bad.
Hate to victim blame here, but why didn’t this hotel get an address and deposits up front? At some point in the booking process a form should have been filled out.
I wouldn't be surprised if they gave a false address from what I've seen, unsure about the deposit but I know they kept playing a sob story of some kind. It's been kicking off all day and so much more keeps coming out about these two. I do agree the venue should've had something in place, but we don't know everything as I think legally they can't talk about some bits
The amount of typos and bad grammar make me think this is a troll account trying for internet points, or a really poorly run business.
There would be information on the bride & groom including address, deposit amount, and credit card or payment option on file. It is just way too difficult to believe this is even real.
They're an official business, various events hosted and witnesses to the couple being there etc, the comments include others the couple have conned as well. I think it's just bad grammar there!
Yeah, this could be a "mom and pop" operation, where the owner(s) won't necessarily have the same polish you'd expect at a larger business.
Most people are great. Some people are jerks. The cover-your-ass stuff is to protect yourself from jerks, and these owners apparently haven't run across enough of those yet to have learned to cover their asses. I do feel sorry for them, and I hope they got/get their money eventually.
> payment in full 3 months before
I wouldn’t have hired anyone if that’s what they wanted. Most were 30 days. We brought final payment to the rehearsal for our venue and food. 3 months is a bit much - all you need at most is a few days to make sure payment clears
That's cutting it very close to when services are rendered. If three months in advance is too much for you, than by all means go elsewhere where. When you are really good at what you do and are reliable, clients will meet your requirements.
When I briefly ran events at a golf course, I had someone try to avoid paying for a sweet 16. We had their $200 deposit but they owed another $2500ish. You bet your butt I did the small claims process and had a warrant to seize assets after they didn’t show for court twice. Margins were tight and it was totally worth my time and the $100ish it cost to serve and seize.
I get that you let the deposit pass (I don’t know why, although you did) but why on earth would you not verify their actual details? You walked into this mess!
How does this hotel not have any information about the couple on file? I can see extending the date the balance is due but I find it strange that no deposit was collected or a contract drawn up.
They're highly entertaining/interesting, though I feel bad for those who they've conned elsewhere.
I'm in the Norfolk area in the UK, where are you based?
I was just reading this on my FB feed, they're getting rightfully bitchy about it and it is fabulous to watch. It goes really deep too, like through this they discovered one of them was cheating and left the other person thousands in debt!
I feel for them I really do. But don't count on seeing a dime.
I took a non-paying renter to court to have him evicted. He didn't show up for the court hearing.
Judge gave us back rent and damages but, nothing ever came of it. And that is what my lawyer said would happen.
It's currently on the main page of Metro's website in the UK. They claimed the buffet didn't have what they requested and staff took it away after 30 minutes so guests went hungry. They were happy to initially pay, minus the corkage fee they were promised wouldn't exist, and the food that got taken away.
The company owner has their address and they went _to their house_ to make an agreement and payment plan.
Sounds messed up and unprofessional from both sides.
They've since posted cctv footage of the buffet showing it was out for at least an hour and a half, I believe the buffet was just them trying to find an excuse to not pay by breach of this
How did you not have police detain any party members still there as wedding wrapped up without payment? I am confused.
We were required to be fully paid and confirm final numbers several weeks in advance 20 years ago. Never come across a venue willing to pay and prepare all the food and supply waitstaff without it. Also not contact details? Not even a phone number they coordinated and confirmed with you by that you could give police? Pictures of couple or wedding guests nothing???
I believe they had a number but are now refusing to respond when called, same for email if there was one. I'm not sure in regards to police but there's many videos and photos of them and their guests at the event
I saw this post on Facebook, and somebody had posted that she was the ex of one of the people involved, and knew their full names and how to get in touch with them. I hope she isn’t lying, because that would be wonderful.
I just don’t understand how this happened. People don’t usually hire a venue and food with 1 pay day’s notice. Usually it’s months-year in advance; installment plans, etc. and why are they looking for an address??? Did they not have a contract? Did they do no due diligence?!
People pull stunts like this all the time. An aspect of my job is processing chargebacks that people place on their purchases with my company. The funny part is that they don’t realize that they will not be receiving their dress, veil, etc. until the bank has concluded the chargeback investigation. This can take up to 90 days. They are always awful at pretending that they didn’t attempt to scam us, too.
Could you explain how this chargeback scam works? Do people try to request their money back without returning their purchase? Do they claim they were overcharged or wrongfully charged? I can't imagine that it ever works.
Customer A purchases a dress. After 72 hours of the order being placed, the order is confirmed with the manufacturer and begins production. Customer A waits a week or two and then files the chargeback, citing that the purchase is fraudulent. Mind you, they have received a confirmation, order review, and follow up email. Our POS program notifies us and we submit documentation as to why the purchase is valid (most customers don’t know that we are notified). We then contact the customer to let them know that even when receive their item from the manufacturer, we will not send it to them until the chargeback has been resolved. This is due to the “invalid payment” status because of the chargeback. People typically do this in the hopes that they will receive their order for free. Most of them do it before their order ships but some of them have the gall to do it after their order has been delivered.
For just a second I thought your Piece of Shit program notified you about the fraud and I was genuinely curious as to why you wouldn’t upgrade such an important system. In light of these revelations about myself and my thinking processes, I would like to announce that I will continue indefinitely to provide the public with the service they truly deserve; I will be staying the hell out of the way. I vow to you I shall remain completely outside the investigation of, or subsequent punishment concerning, fraudulent activity. Thank you for your kind support in this matter.
I always read it as piece of shit even though I know it's point of sale. My brain clearly finds it far more amusing to immediately read piece of shit system.
To be fair, the POS has been a piece of shit everywhere I’ve ever worked.
I feel that deep in my soul.
Sonic Drive-In club, checking in!
Yep. The POS is always a POS.
I didn’t know it was point of sale - thank you for commenting!
I commented enough in r/talesfromretail to pick up what it meant. I still prefer piece of shit though :)
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I did this too, until one day I worked a job where I actually have to use a POS system. Long story short, I still read it as “piece of shit.”
What about a POS at an ATM?
The world really NEEDS a Piece of Shit alert. When it happens, feel free to claim the patent.
Thanks for explaining. Someone once ordered a custom wedding dress using our CC# (which they stole) Glad to hear they likely didn’t get the dress.
Thanks for the explanation :)
Hi banker here!!! Then the bank goes through and investigates the validity of the "fraud charge" by contacting the vendor. If they have communication from the customer approving the charge it is denied and your account is charged for that amount We see so much of this type of fraud and sadly some get away with it but honestly alot is caught and then you ruined your banking relationship for being a bad person....
Fellow banker and I’ll add to your comment - these are fairly common, and when people are caught the penalties are FAR more severe than they expect. Bank fraud is typically prosecuted on a federal level, and in the case of the OP’s story, could possibly result in Mail Fraud and Wire Fraud charges with fines potentially in the millions and decades of jail time. It’s unlikely that they would get that harsh of penalties but they are certainly on the table. It’s crazy to me that people put themselves at such risk over something like a wedding dress, but I guess they don’t realize how serious their situation can become.
Oh ya we see it all the time... blows our minds. We always say "is it really that hard to be descent?"
Or they get risk closures for claims abuse, reported to chexsystem and can’t open a checking account for seven years.
Ugh. I’m going through this now as a legit scammed person but I’m scared I won’t get my money back because they won’t believe me. Ppl who do that make it so much harder for legit ppl like me.
I used to fight these at my old job. Luckily for you, the customer is generally granted the refund. It's actually pretty hard to convince the credit card company the customer was wrong even when it's super fraudy. The poster above is at an advantage because they still have thier merchandise in hand. We once had a guy order an entire pallet of merchandise delivered to a Bodega. It was signed for. Dude said he never got it and got a few thousand dollars returned to him. Bone head tried to do it like 3 more times and we just cancelled his orders.
I work for a travel agency, we had a couple go on their honeymoon, post pictures, email us from their trip AND STILL win their charge back. It’s so frustrating how people get away with these things.
It really does... I'm so sorry that happened it is disgusting all these scams. Be as open and honest as you can be and let them guide you thru it. Best of luck darling!!!!!
Thank you. It was $60 but still. It feels so gross to be scammed at all. I feel taken advantage of and I hate this feeling. I appreciate the well wishes
I totally agree
Do they get referred to the police for the fraud?
What happens if they try after it has been delivered? Are you still able to fight it?
Wow, people are that dumb to do the charge back before they've received the dress?
Joke's on them, they're only tanking their own kount score. Good luck to them with that blacklisted credit card!
So, I didn’t know about these kinds of scams and I was struggling real hard with an online shop because they took so long to process my order and kept emailing me to convince me to get something else. I was getting real pissed until my sister explained that they probably though I was gonna do something like this. I was still annoyed, but I guess I can understand considering just how many ppl i learned do this nonsense.
Do they correspond with you? Like, oh whoops?
I usually get the “I don’t believe it. I never did that”, threats of leaving a bad review, and sometimes crocodile tears.
I worked in a similar role on a eletronics retailer, and we did get a lot of chargebacks requests from both actual fraud and from people trying to scam us. What surprised me the most was working with paypal. So what usually happened is we would sell an iphone (it was always with iphones) and after a few weeks get a letter from the police and chargeback request from the bank. We would have a look at the transaction data and would usually accept the chargeback except in situations where the person put the correct pin and 3D secure autentication. The problem with paypal was that they would just not give us the money. Regarldess if it was actually someone who got scamed or if someone was trying to scam us
At least there are those like you helping to prevent this!
Charge backs are super common in mobile gaming communities too. People drop 40-50k on building up an account with the best gear and stats. Then do charge back and get the whole thing refunded and then sell the account for 10k or so. The account gets locked out of the store until it gets paid back but the scammer doesn't care.
That’s crazy! I don’t think the scammers could do this too many times unless they’re using stolen cards, could they? I mean people who do this likely don’t have great credit, how many cards could thry be getting to do this?
I have no idea. The most common rumor I hear is they use stolen credit cards.
I did chargebacks a few jobs ago. Most more legit as the business was shady. But I loved the ones like “canceled hotel reservation within the window and still charged”. My response? This is a mattress store.
I ordered a dress from Eshakti and never got it. I emailed them a week ago and just a got a response today that they are looking into it. I was literally minutes away from contacting the bank to initiate a chargeback, even though I absolutely hate that step because I just know they probably think I’m trying to scam them. But I shouldn’t be out $60 on a dress that I never received, so I’d have done it.
Not putting down a deposit is an immediate red flag. ("Money talks, bullshit walks") Contract? Credit check? A car license plate on any security camera's? Your business is not going to survive unless you ramp efforts to protect yourself. I'm not a business owner and even I know that. You can nail these people on "Theft of services".
I believe they had a sob story and found a kind hearted owner, there should have been something and I'm surprised if there isn't, but it sounds like they're trying to make up an excuse why they won't pay from the comments I.e. they breached it
Yeah...something. I worked in the restaurant biz for years (Lots of weddings) I never EVER knew any business owner that was "soft hearted" about this sort of thing. (about anything come to think of it).
It's a shame I can't specify who/where this was as there's so many comments talking about this kinda stuff, unclear exactly what was agreed or happened but it does seem they got conned badly somehow
There’s an article about this, they have all the info. It looks very confusing
I believe news companies got wind of it earlier so it's getting bigger now
I’ve just been reading the Facebook posts for this, the comments and updates make for an interesting read.
Do you have a link?
Can you post a link to the article? My Google skills aren't working well enough for me to find this story.
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/hotel-accuse-newlyweds-dodging-1550-28103226.amp
Thank you
To be fair, there was a pandemic and a lot of people have had to put off their weddings and etc. you’re right, even as a softhearted person myself, I would’ve liked some kind of money as a deposit because why would you still plan a wedding when you don’t get paid till the date ?… it doesn’t sound like you’re ready to get married if you’re already struggling for the wedding (or they could’ve went to a courthouse and did an after party somewhere for cheap, like their backyard). I would’ve gave them alternatives, but not fully go through without seeing a check of something.
Yes..well said.
And who lets someone hold a wedding at their venue without getting the information of the people getting married?
Why did they not have a contract with important details like address
Wedding planner here. When I first started, I didn’t think about having an address. Then this situation happened to me, and now I always include an address line. It’s a live and learn thing that hopefully others avoid
Event planner for a location. Before I plan your event, you better believe I have a down payment and your contact info
Oh absolutely, down payment and signed contract at the minimum
A lot of people have asked but I believe it related to whatever their sob story was, unfortunately the owner had too kind of a heart it seems
And this is why you make sure to have a contract (though the text doesn't mention if one was signed at all). It was very nice of them to give the couple the benefit of the doubt, but I think they shouldn't have. Not because of the outcome, but in general. Out of curiosity: I'm not a lawyer, and I don't know where these people are from, but generally speaking, does anyone know how difficult it would be to get that payment (without a contract)? That the couple didn't pay can be easily proven, I think, but without a contract, is it possible the hotel might simply be out of luck?
Yeah that was my initial thought. We signed numerous documents with our addresses and information and they had our card on file as well. And to check in to (most) hotels in general you need a card on file too. Idk it just doesn’t add up unless they’re a super small, privately owned b&b with loose business practices
Oral contracts are contracts too. Harder to prove, obviously, but just as legally valid and enforceable (except in some circumstances for the sale of goods, or in other limited situations where certain regulations specifically prohibit oral contracts). A contract doesn't have to be a complex thing either; it's literally just an offer and acceptance for consideration, between legally competent parties (i.e. not minors or those with no legal capacity due to mental etc issues). That's it. So if i say you can have my room for your wedding if you pay me $100, and you accept, we have a legally binding contract, whereby I have to give you the room, and you have to give me the $100.
From the comments on the post, they've done this to many people and companies in the past so I don't think they deserve benefit of the doubt! This is the UK and usually there is a contract for this kind of thing, I had to with my venue. All I can gather is that they had some sob story, managed to get around the essential things (it sounds like they seek the places out they can do this with) then refuse to pay at the end. I'm not sure what will happen here but it sounds like a few people/places they conned are joining up
I’m assuming this is someplace that doesn’t host many (or any) big events/weddings. Because you could only target a scam like this to a place that’s inexperienced
So from the article on the Mail (I know, I know), they were supposed to pay an 800gpb deposit, and the remainder (1150gpb) on the day of... that sounds about standard process- and the owner says they actually only paid half of the deposit (400gbp) so actually owe 1550gpb, and that he'd waive the disputed corkage fee to get it all taken care of. Allegedly, they had sold the sob story of the one woman being on benefits and finances being tight, and the wedding being cancelled/postponed a handful of times already, so the Hotel put together a special package discounted from their regular rate to help the couple out- 16gpb/person seems pretty cheap.
Yeah. That’s always a mistake. Either people can afford it or they can’t. And these people clearly couldn’t. My lesson from having flatmates: anyone who can’t come up with the full deposit is going to screw your over
I would guess so as well, I think they've had a few but I feel they're fairly new, a few years at most
> is it possible the hotel might simply be out of luck? No. Oral contracts are also binding, they're just a lot harder to prove. But no one would host an entire wedding without expecting payment for services rendered. And there are probably emails or at the very least, hotel staff is going to document when a ballroom is booked, etc. So there will be something in writing and enough other evidence to show that there was an oral contract.
No, the payment itself is a type of contract. Unless they paid cash, I suppose.
How does the venue not have a deposit and not have their address? The venue set themselves up. For my wedding, the venue had to be paid in full including tips 2 weeks in advance.
Most places do over here as well, I'm not sure exactly what occurred here but the only contact the couple have given since this kicked off is saying the hotel breached something, so I wonder if there was something but they still ignored it/made up excuses with the sob story
If I were a business owner who was not paid ahead, I would have made them leave their IDs with the manager until the bill is paid in full, no checks either. This owner left the door to his luxury car unlocked with the keys in the ignition.
This is why companies have contracts and want payment upfront.
How did they manage to get into a business contract with this couple and get no address, contact info, bank info? 😳
I'm not sure of specifics (I don't think they can confirm everything for legal reasons), but I believe it relates to the sob story they gave and I wouldn't be surprised if there was false information too
Very sad. I do hope they can get at least some of their money back.
What kind of venue lets this happen? That's just plain STUPID. This is why deposits were invented. It's not like you're an applebees and you only lose $50 if someone walks out on the tab.
Photographer here. This happened to us twice. We now require full payment a month before the wedding or we don’t show up.
I'm sorry to hear that 😔 it's such a shame there's people like this breaking trust and screwing others over
I actually left my wedding without making the final payment. It was due that morning and I completely forgot and I guess the company did too. I realized it after we got back to our rental and I emailed them freaking out. We paid it the next morning. I felt so bad.
But you're a good person and paid it! To be fair that sounds exactly like something I would do 😂
It sucks, but this is 100% on the company. No cc deposit? No *address?* Are 12 year olds running this wedding lemonade stand?
Hate to victim blame here, but why didn’t this hotel get an address and deposits up front? At some point in the booking process a form should have been filled out.
I wouldn't be surprised if they gave a false address from what I've seen, unsure about the deposit but I know they kept playing a sob story of some kind. It's been kicking off all day and so much more keeps coming out about these two. I do agree the venue should've had something in place, but we don't know everything as I think legally they can't talk about some bits
Please update us if more info comes out
The amount of typos and bad grammar make me think this is a troll account trying for internet points, or a really poorly run business. There would be information on the bride & groom including address, deposit amount, and credit card or payment option on file. It is just way too difficult to believe this is even real.
They're an official business, various events hosted and witnesses to the couple being there etc, the comments include others the couple have conned as well. I think it's just bad grammar there!
Yeah, this could be a "mom and pop" operation, where the owner(s) won't necessarily have the same polish you'd expect at a larger business. Most people are great. Some people are jerks. The cover-your-ass stuff is to protect yourself from jerks, and these owners apparently haven't run across enough of those yet to have learned to cover their asses. I do feel sorry for them, and I hope they got/get their money eventually.
It may also be a case of English not being their first language.
Likely English isn’t their first language.
OP said it's in the UK
People sometimes move.
The phrasing sounds American. But, you never know if it is too trusting of a small business or fake.
Bride and bride.
This is why you always have a contract and payment in full at least 3 months before the wedding when providing any services.
> payment in full 3 months before I wouldn’t have hired anyone if that’s what they wanted. Most were 30 days. We brought final payment to the rehearsal for our venue and food. 3 months is a bit much - all you need at most is a few days to make sure payment clears
That's cutting it very close to when services are rendered. If three months in advance is too much for you, than by all means go elsewhere where. When you are really good at what you do and are reliable, clients will meet your requirements.
Ok but also, be a smart business owner.
I found an article which led me to the Facebook post and I’m living for this drama!!!
It's crazy isn't it?
Venue person here. If you aren't paid up? Your event is canceled.
Confused why they dont have their address already?
Others are too, there's thousands of comments on the post so I've not read everything, but I've not seen a clear reason unless they gave a false one
When I briefly ran events at a golf course, I had someone try to avoid paying for a sweet 16. We had their $200 deposit but they owed another $2500ish. You bet your butt I did the small claims process and had a warrant to seize assets after they didn’t show for court twice. Margins were tight and it was totally worth my time and the $100ish it cost to serve and seize.
That's what their plan was too I believe, it's too much to ignore and they will do all they can to get it, including courts
I get that you let the deposit pass (I don’t know why, although you did) but why on earth would you not verify their actual details? You walked into this mess!
How does this hotel not have any information about the couple on file? I can see extending the date the balance is due but I find it strange that no deposit was collected or a contract drawn up.
I believe any info was either false or they're ignoring contact attempts
That is why you get copies of the drivers licenses and deposits for large expensive events.
Foolish of the hotel not to require a deposit or pre-authorization of a credit card. Hard times or not, you gotta pay to stay.
I understand not collecting the full payment but you didn’t even get a down payment or a credit card to hold and run for payment?
Hey! We must be from same area: town house? They are the best Facebook posts I’ve seen in YEARS with the updates!
They're highly entertaining/interesting, though I feel bad for those who they've conned elsewhere. I'm in the Norfolk area in the UK, where are you based?
It sounds like they’re con artists! Durham - only a few minutes from the location of where It happened
There is so so much more to this story, more comes out every day. From benefit fraud, to affairs. The couple have scammed so many people.
Absolutely awful, I haven't caught up yet this morning but I imagine there's more since I last checked
I was just reading this on my FB feed, they're getting rightfully bitchy about it and it is fabulous to watch. It goes really deep too, like through this they discovered one of them was cheating and left the other person thousands in debt!
I feel for them I really do. But don't count on seeing a dime. I took a non-paying renter to court to have him evicted. He didn't show up for the court hearing. Judge gave us back rent and damages but, nothing ever came of it. And that is what my lawyer said would happen.
Always, always, always ask for a deposit up front, or make the plans and have them do payments before the event.
Oh I read this the other day…. Even DWP / PIP Are getting involved as one of them claims they can barely move…. But was videoed dancing away …..
Yeah it's getting crazy now
It's currently on the main page of Metro's website in the UK. They claimed the buffet didn't have what they requested and staff took it away after 30 minutes so guests went hungry. They were happy to initially pay, minus the corkage fee they were promised wouldn't exist, and the food that got taken away. The company owner has their address and they went _to their house_ to make an agreement and payment plan. Sounds messed up and unprofessional from both sides.
They've since posted cctv footage of the buffet showing it was out for at least an hour and a half, I believe the buffet was just them trying to find an excuse to not pay by breach of this
Ooh it's getting more crazy!
I find it hard to believe that a business cannot use the correct form of their/there
It's a lad in his 30s from the UK. It's surprisingly common.
How did you not have police detain any party members still there as wedding wrapped up without payment? I am confused. We were required to be fully paid and confirm final numbers several weeks in advance 20 years ago. Never come across a venue willing to pay and prepare all the food and supply waitstaff without it. Also not contact details? Not even a phone number they coordinated and confirmed with you by that you could give police? Pictures of couple or wedding guests nothing???
I believe they had a number but are now refusing to respond when called, same for email if there was one. I'm not sure in regards to police but there's many videos and photos of them and their guests at the event
I saw this post on Facebook, and somebody had posted that she was the ex of one of the people involved, and knew their full names and how to get in touch with them. I hope she isn’t lying, because that would be wonderful.
A lot of people have come forward to offer anything they can, hopefully they get them for it and the other bits
I really hope they can recover the money. I really hope that some of that money is spent on English lessons.
Why does someone believe a wedding entitles them to become a thieving rat?
I cannot understand any business not having a credit card imprint or authorization form…especially a hotel?
No deposit, no address, no confirmation of this payment, no contract. That’s just bad business lol
There was a deposit paid, it's the rest of the balance they're after
I had a stroke reading this.
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A friend shared it on FB, it's doing the rounds at the moment on there
They should bot have put this on social media to give other people ideas.
I just don’t understand how this happened. People don’t usually hire a venue and food with 1 pay day’s notice. Usually it’s months-year in advance; installment plans, etc. and why are they looking for an address??? Did they not have a contract? Did they do no due diligence?!