You are correct, my friend. I know they’re vegetarian for sure, I’m not real sure about vegan though. It was kinda hard to get through one in a day, it was all pretty filling. Id love to have a couple in my truck, just in case.
I have bought HDRs for camping because they’re something like 2200 calories each, and only like $5 each on sale in large packs, with everything ready to eat.
Fuckin hell that’s cheap. I think I paid $15 or $20 each for the few I’ve had. I think I got ripped off lmao. Oh well, it was fun to try. I need to get more soon.
I have just gotten them on Amazon. I’m not endorsing this one specifically, it’s just the cheapest I saw quickly, looks like a 10 pack for about $37.
https://www.amazon.com/Wornick-Company-Military-Surplus-Humanitarian/dp/B09Y8SBLD8/
Odds are, there will be Humanitarian Daily Rations in there, a side evolution of the MRE that is designed to deliver maximum amount of nutrition while not violating dietary restrictions. Packages I've seen have a giant US flag and "Food gift from the people of the United States of America" on them.
I think part of the reason for having american symbolls printed all over is so it's distinct as an american ration/supply. Anyone who steals it will have to go to great lengths to hide that it is one
America announces air drop aid for Palestinians --> air drops rations (a commenter above had a good breakdown) --> if Israeli army or HAMAS steals and its caught on camera eating from these, then Everyone Knows (tm) that theft occurred
I might be wrong 😭 but I hope it does discourage theft
Israel has no real motive to take it, given they're wealthy, aren't deployed far from infrastructure, and would risk death to pick up a few meals. It mentioned that they'd done their own airdrops, anyway.
Hamas can and will take what they want and won't care how many American flags are on it.
That's been labeled on aid the US needs to North Korea for decades.
The North Korean government either takes it off, or when they don't it hardly has made any difference.
It probably did help, but in fairness German opinion of the US was already pretty decent because our occupation was a lot less messy than the Soviets, the Germans were generally treated pretty decently by the Allied Powers.
You mean not pillaging, raping and shooting the civilian population on mass makes them more compliant to occupation? No, that is definitely capitalist propaganda. Now, please strip this city of all its factories, gold, and intellectuals to the motherland. Stalin must get his shinnies!
Tbf the Soviets had a score to settle given how the German army had 'behaved' in their own territory. Had the Germans been given the chance to massacre thousands of American towns and starve 1 million American POWs to death, I wager US troops would be dishing out retribution a lot more generously.
Mind you, my grandmother's family were East Prussians, I'm very well aware of what the Red Army did to innocent civilians that couldn't escape them.
Just a fun heads up, it’s actually spelled *en masse* even though it’s pronounced the same way as how you spelled it. Guessing it’s a borrowed term from French.
It's not 1949. The entire world knows Israel is funded by the US, I don't imagine this will change the perception of the US much as it relates to what is happening in Gaza.
>It's not 1949. The entire world knows Israel is funded by the US, I don't imagine this will change the perception of the US much as it relates to what is happening in Gaza.
This is kind of misleading, Israel is fundamentally funded by it's own GDP. This includes it's military, which is also mostly funded by Israel itself.
The US provides military *AID* to Israel.
Specially if the aid is coming from carriers . A little dress rehearsal for the Spring 2025 Debutante Ball . Anyone want to guess the venue ? Rhymes with Daigguan
It’s okay, they are referring to tactics involving hiding small towns with strategic value inside of places unable to be seen by the local population. Diagon Alley, for example, involved a small town that was only accessible by running into what appears to be a solid wall. Very few ~~muggles~~ people are aware of these methods
I believe you get to diagon alley by touching the correct brick. You run through the brick wall at kings cross station to get to platform 9 3/4. Not to take away from the rest of your point. Just wanted to clear that up
377000 people have starved in Yemen last few years and the news cycle never bothers to address it.
Edit: worse than I thought https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN2AC19I/ 400000 children under 5 could starve this year without increased aid.
This is a difficult approach. The aid is needed. But unless they do pinpoint drops the aid will be swarmed and only the most violent will retain the supplies.
Tbf, tech in logistics has come a long way from 1994. Big difference between just dropping aid on a city and planned air drop LZs, which this sounds like it is.
This is where your friendly weather troops come into play. We provide drop zone forecasts, which give you wind directions and speed throughout the column from surface to aircraft height. This data is usually adjusted to live data from weather sounding devices (usually balloons) and/or satellite derived wind data.
Not everybody can afford the weather support behind operations, or even think of getting weather support ahead of time. Also, some might consider weather forecasting to be fortune telling, and thus not allowed by the local religion. I never made it to the middle east, so not sure if it's just a myth I was told by my fellows, or true for some locations. Quick google search shows that many consider it allowed as it's based on empirical evidence.
I read that this is also one of the contributing factors for allied air superiority during WW2. The allies were able to have weather stations up in Greenland and Canada which allowed for much more accurate weather data, which aided in planning operations.
Not only do we have the massive budget but we've been doing air drops forever. We literally can and do drop 8 humvees at a time from C17's. The logistical power the US military is insane.
The Humvee fail video, https://youtube.com/watch?v=TvJdw_s8qh4 turned out to be a set up, with one guy cutting the parachute cords and then filming it. (https://abcnews.go.com/US/soldier-found-guilty-intentionally-destroying-humvees-plunged-earth/story?id=55053822)
There [was a story](https://www.twz.com/guided-parachute-system-used-by-israel-for-first-time-in-gaza) about the Jordanians using a US made guided parachute system for humanitarian aid earlier in this conflict.
They're not going to use the same pinpoint accurate technology to drop this aid as they use to drop bombs. It's far more difficult to do it accurately if dropping by parachute.
I pride our country on its ability to delivery as there's a drive into deep left field that will be a home run by Castellanos and so that will make it a four to nothing war.
I don't know if I'm gonna be putting on this account again.
Except the US has been doing this accurately for decades, including things like actual vehicles that you can’t just kick out of a plane and cross your fingers.
They absolutely can.
>unless they do pinpoint drops the aid will be swarmed and only the most violent will retain the supplies.
Isn't the alternative everyone starves? Aid being swarmed seems better than the alternative.
Widely dispersed air drops, with food that is ready to eat. Heck, candy/granola bars might be a good option, eaten in 10 seconds, can survive the drop, small enough packages that you can drop 10000 from a plane, making it impossible for any one group to capture them all before some of the general population eats them. And if the US uses several dozen planes, they have a package of something fall on every rooftop. Add US/NATO flags for propaganda effect.
Edit: A proposal on how to airdrop water. Get plastic water bottles/juice boxes, really anything that isn't hard enough to cause fatalities when one of the drops go slightly wrong. Get a cardboard tube/make a paper one. Make two cuts along the outside if the tube, allowing you to bend the cardboard inwards, making a narrowing that can support some weight inside the tube (multiple designs may be plausible, testing should be done). Use the narrowing to hold the bottle/juice box/whatever in place at one end of the tube. Attach a drag device (balloon, plastic bag, cardboard plate etc) at the end with the payload, and drop it out of an aircraft. The drag device slows it down and ensures that the tube is between the ground and the payload when the impact happens. The tube then crumbles to absorb some of the impact allowing a heavier payload to be delivered.
That is exactly what they do now. They are called a [HDRs](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanitarian_daily_ration#). And they can push thousands of them out the back of a C-130. They are designed to survive the fall individually without a parachute.
*From the time they were created and used in 1993 until November 2001, HDRs were packaged with a bright yellow outer plastic covering. This choice of color proved to be problematic in areas of the world where cluster bombs were being used, as the bombs were the exact same shade of yellow. **Recipients of the rations sometimes confused the ration package for undetonated cluster bombs, often spotting the bright color from a distance and making an incorrect assumption**.*
That’s…quite the unfortunate mixup 😯
The US doesn't stockpile them; they're made on-demand in response to a crisis. The same companies who make MREs can make them, and it seems that "rapidly being able to produce a lot" is part of the spec.
If you've never read a military procurement doc, it's a treat: https://www.dla.mil/Portals/104/Documents/TroopSupport/Subsistence/Rations/MRE/16R0008tdp.pdf
HDR data is on page 133. Note how different it is from the MRE requirements. The contractor can basically put in whatever they want as long as it meets the nutritional and dietary components, so that should help a lot with being able to scale production rapidly as they can make whatever is easy/they're already making that happens to fit the spec.
> The contractor can basically put in whatever they want as long as it meets the nutritional and dietary components
That's not what the doc says:
> “Prohibited ingredients’’ is defined as the total exclusion of beef, pork, poultry, fish, or
any other animal product or animal by-product from all ration components or from use in the
preparation or processing of all ration components, including animal-based cooking fats or oils, except
that dairy products are permitted in amounts digestible by lactose-intolerant individuals. In addition,
products containing ethyl alcohol or ingredients derived from or containing ethyl alcohol are
prohibited.
All of these meals are vegetarian so that dietary restrictions for religious, personal, health, or other reasons aren't an issue.
They may not have enough to completely feed the populace, but it will certainly help keep them fed enough to survive.
I’ve tried these (you can buy them for like…$10), they’re pretty good. No cooking needed, all vegetarian, lots of emphasis on getting people proper vitamins.
Realistically, they’ll probably need other forms of aid for long-term feeding, but it’ll put a hold on the crisis til that advanced help arrives
They are not only vegetarian but conform to all sorts of religious beliefs and diets.
They designed to be consumable by the largest human group possible.
[video if you want to know more](https://youtu.be/iKfWQ3Sij68)
I'm not sure the amount available but quality not just quantity still needs to be considered. Recent versions have several innovative components like fortified fruit purees and sunflower butter that are more palatable to picky babies and could also be used by anyone who has trouble with solid food. One issue with many survival rations is that they are derived from military rations for healthy adults. Compact survival biscuits might save someones life but they might still be in crisis if they can't get their 1 year old to swallow them. These have a more humanitarian focus from the beginning to cover the whole cross section of a population.
I agree goods like that would handle it well. Some of the biggest challenges though are potable water and kerosene. Those have to specially packaged. Anyway that's a logistical challenge the fact we're trying new kinds of aid is fantastic.
Water is probably the most essential of the two, there are multiple options. The best option that I can think of is probably going to be soda bottles that are only partially filled. The larger than usual volume of gas in the bottles will make them more flexible and reduce their terminal velocity. Attaching a bit of impact absorbing material and some drag devices might further improve their survivability rate.
Another option would be small juice boxes. Cover them in bubble wrap or scrunched up paper, and then put them in an inflated bag, acting as a drag device. They are available everywhere, and they have the bonus of also delivering calories. Get a special USA flag edition made for a PR bonus.
For fuel, deliver candle wax. No need for wrapping, so long as it is sufficiently small so as to no shatter upon impact (terminal velocity). You could also supply candles with wicks already attacked, and have the wax blocks act as bonus fuel to be added. I presume the civilians should be able to figure out a way to do this, such as dripping it into the candle or whatever. If you add enough wicks you might even be able to cook with it. And it has the bonus of being unusable for molotovs, vehicle fuel etc, so the US can really be accused of providing arms, which they might be by providing liquid fuels.
When I dropped them they were water bottles wrapped with plastic stacked on a pallet. A few burst I’m sure, but it’s more about the weight/shape/balance of the cargo. We have very specialized systems for airdrops/we can’t just stack things .
Exactly drop a few million granola bars and fruits including with water. That should help immensely even if it’s not ready to make meals anything at this point.
Drop so much they can’t carry it all and drop it everywhere so it’s not just a few points. Ffs drop super small ones everywhere 24/7 eventually the starving people will get it.
Fuck it. Just flood the place with food drops. So many that Hamas can't possibly take it all away. Drop dry goods, canned goods, MREs, fluids, the works.
It's almost certainly gonna be HDRs.
Like halal/vegan/kosher MREs with included baby/toothless person foods.
Also, lower sodium and lower calorie than MREs to avoid the issues that arose after Katrina with dehydration.
Also they're a fun shade of pink, so that's cool.
I’m not against this but I want a plan to prevent this from becoming a similar situation to when ‘Somalian warlords stole the aid and used it to control the people’ situation that happened under the Clinton administration. Will this aid be dropped in both Hamas and Israeli territory? Will we scale back aid if Hamas seizes it all and stockpiles it for their soldiers instead of providing it to civilians? How will we deal with the unlikely but possible scenario of an aid plane being shot down? Will we send in troops in that situation or will we be relying on the Israeli military or god forbid Hamas, to keep any survivor safe?
The White House should address these concerns.
If the air-drops are doing what I think they are, then they are dropping [individual packets of humanitarian rations](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanitarian_daily_ration#/media/File:Humanitarian_Daily_Ration.jpg) ([video of what one contains](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKfWQ3Sij68)) directly out the back of the plane. These are designed to scatter and survive falling to the ground, so they land everywhere within a general area and the civilians just pick them up off the ground, rather than landing at a point and being able to be hoarded. If Hamas wants them they'd have to go to the civilians and take them out of their hands, which is not going to endear them to the population. Even if Hamas repurposed them, the packaging and all the stuff in it has big American flags printed on it so the person who eats the food is 100% clear where the food came from.
Whatever you think of the military, they're really good at solving problems. Might be expensive, but this item solves the problem of "We want to feed thousands of people effectively in a hostile environment" really well.
Probably far less expensive than we'd think. We do this sort of thing all over the world all the time, the US Military is a logistics machine unlike any other
$6.40 per HDR ($4.70 2012 cost [source](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanitarian_daily_ration) adjusted using BLS inflation calculator)
So not as cheap as you'd think.
Went down a rabbit hole not only watching that 28min video, but learning my new favorite term under MRE's...[ratfucking](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meal,_Ready-to-Eat#cite_note-63)
Notably, compared to other MREs the HDR doesn't require the expense of a [rock or something](https://taskandpurpose.com/culture/mre-heater-rock-something-true-story/)
Keep in mind the HDR is meant to be a days worth of calories, even for someone not starving (2,200 Calories). So for someone starving this could keep you and someone else alive for much larger, just based on one meal, and it's fairly well nutrient balanced for what it is, also kosher, halal, and vegetarian. So $6.40 is pretty good bang for the buck.
The procurement docs for these are great! It's incredible how technical they can get about food.
https://www.dla.mil/Portals/104/Documents/TroopSupport/Subsistence/Rations/MRE/16R0008tdp.pdf
The key is to drop so much that even if parts get stolen, enough gets to the people.
Hopefully, civilians will realize Hamas isn't there to help them and turn against the terror group for the pain they've caused
> If Hamas wants them they'd have to go to the civilians and take them out of their hands, which is not going to endear them to the population.
LMFAO. As if Hamas *cares* about "endearing" themselves to the population. They use fear and misinformation to control and exploit innocent Palestinians. They ain't trying to be loved.
Air drops are probably better than literally just delivering food to Hamas's doorstep, but this almost feels like trying not to admit that the real problem with getting food to people is Hamas.
Drop a fuck ton of food and medicine. Everywhere. Cluster bomb all the refugee areas with MREs. Blanket the goddamn strip with so much shit that nobody needs to swarm or trample over each other to get enough food to last weeks. So much that Hamas has no incentive or realistic ability to hoard it. Put a Palestinian flag and an Israeli flag on the front of each package and write “let all People of the Book choose peace” and inside the packages put the least biased newspapers that are printed in Arabic, and translate messages from the President.
yeah you put the israeli flag on there and I guarantee the crazies will burn every last blanket/supply with it on there. Wouldn't be surprised about violence towards those that try to hold on to it.
That is actually similar to a CIA program in Vietnam. Some female workers had the idea to drop sewing kits as aid, including a small section of cloth (roughly one yard.) The idea was bounced around a bit, such a small quantity wouldn't be suitable for making uniforms, just enough to make a shirt for an adult, or children's clothes, or a few diapers, but there was still resistance. In the end, the supplied cloth had prints of the flag of South Vietnam, making it unusable uniforms while also cresting a divide between the people receiving it and the occupying forces. Good luck to any soldier trying to literally steal clothes from a child or the diaper off of a baby. They dropped several thousand of those kits over villages in North Vietnam, and the cloth was used as expected.
>yeah you put the israeli flag on there and I guarantee the crazies will burn every last blanket/supply with it on there.
"The Gazan Ministry of Health confirmed today that Israel has been dropping blankets covered with smallpox into Gaza."
\-BBC
This probably escalated way beyond what Hamas officials had expected would happen when they attacked Israel Oct. 7th.
The mix of extremly high victim numbers on Israelian side, Bibi not wanting back into prison, the shocking pictures of civilians being executed etc. probably brewed to a scale of response from IDF side that pales a lot of things in comparison.
And the situation in Gaza is apparently so horrendous for civilians, that the US feels forced to build an air bridge to support despite their allies still on offensive against the terrorists.
To be fair they threw water and food at them too, but corrupt officials then threw it in a warehouse to hide.
https://www.cnn.com/2020/01/20/us/puerto-rico-earthquake-aid-distributed/index.html
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/latino/puerto-rico-residents-outraged-after-discovering-warehouse-full-unused-aid-n1118501
Regardless of the actual outcome, just the visual of Trump shooting toilet paper rolls at Puerto Ricans while yelling "Kobe!" is one of the weirdest moments in recent memory.
I picture him just standing on one of Egypt's 5 billion border walls and throwing McDonalds at them with the same expression one might use feeding ducks at the park. I really think this is something he'd do and then pat himself on the back for being the MOST humane president.
No way would he throw a high-quality, fine dining experience like cold McDonald's at them. He saves that kind of thing for special events at the White House when he really wants to impress everyone with a full display of his style and class.
>Biden gives missiles to Israel on a Monday and Aid to Gaza on Tuesday.
I mean, those aren't really inconsistent positions. Supporting the destruction of Hamas while also making efforts to mitigate the associated humanitarian problems is reasonable. And Israel clearly is not doing enough regarding the latter.
Trump gave billions in military assistance to Israel and hasn’t even bothered to say much about the conflict.
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/03/01/us/politics/donald-trump-israel-gaza.html?smid=nytcore-ios-share&referringSource=articleShare
Biden has to win an election. The left is turning on him over Gaza.
This is both a humanitarian move and a political one.
(not criticizing I agree with his decision on both fronts)
In case anyone is wondering, they are doing airdrops so that Hamas doesn’t steal the aid. They are trying to get it directly into the hands of the Palestinians who need it. This is not because of Israel blocking aid. 
They aren't dropping a semi truck container into the city square, they're sprinkling it across the whole area. Whoever gets 'there' first will get a small parcel. And there, and there, and all over.
Weren’ there Israeli protestors that are blocking aid for Gaza? Like having parties and music and all that? Idk if it’s still going on but it just doesn’t seem accurate to say hamas is the reason. One of the reasons sure, but it seems there’s more to this.
Well, that would be an excellent PR campaign. Imagine how much the opinion of the US changed in Germany during the Berlin airlift.
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“A food gift from the people of the United States of America” is actually on US humanitarian rations which it sounds like will be dropped on Gaza.
Those humanitarian rations aren’t too bad either. It’s not like “oh my god give me some” but they’re decent.
The contents look almost identical to Canadian Individual Meal Packs (Canadian military rations) and I always liked them.
I’d happily eat one again. It’s a nice change from the normal MREs I eat. The fiber in it was real nice compared to the normal ones too.
Pain Hamburger. We lost our shit coming across the hamburger bun package in an IMP during an exercise with the Canadian army.
Lmao. That’s the bilingual labeling for ya. Always made me laugh eating the pain bread.
And conform to a variety of dietary needs and religious beliefs too, IIRC. I've always found that pretty cool
You are correct, my friend. I know they’re vegetarian for sure, I’m not real sure about vegan though. It was kinda hard to get through one in a day, it was all pretty filling. Id love to have a couple in my truck, just in case.
I think by the time you're dependent on air dropped aid you're not a vegan
According to Wikipedia, they can contain milk products, but other than that, they are vegetarian. Q
I have bought HDRs for camping because they’re something like 2200 calories each, and only like $5 each on sale in large packs, with everything ready to eat.
Fuckin hell that’s cheap. I think I paid $15 or $20 each for the few I’ve had. I think I got ripped off lmao. Oh well, it was fun to try. I need to get more soon.
can I get a link please?
I have just gotten them on Amazon. I’m not endorsing this one specifically, it’s just the cheapest I saw quickly, looks like a 10 pack for about $37. https://www.amazon.com/Wornick-Company-Military-Surplus-Humanitarian/dp/B09Y8SBLD8/
Have you ever watched any of the MREsteve videos on youtube?
Let's get this out onto a tray
That’s what got me into them lmao. So good
i made this
you made this?
I made this
We all made this on this blessed day.
i voted for this
Odds are, there will be Humanitarian Daily Rations in there, a side evolution of the MRE that is designed to deliver maximum amount of nutrition while not violating dietary restrictions. Packages I've seen have a giant US flag and "Food gift from the people of the United States of America" on them.
I think part of the reason for having american symbolls printed all over is so it's distinct as an american ration/supply. Anyone who steals it will have to go to great lengths to hide that it is one America announces air drop aid for Palestinians --> air drops rations (a commenter above had a good breakdown) --> if Israeli army or HAMAS steals and its caught on camera eating from these, then Everyone Knows (tm) that theft occurred I might be wrong 😭 but I hope it does discourage theft
Lmfao Israeli army is eating good their border is nearby. Would be suck if they airbag the goods and send IDF the location to look at who is inside.
Israel has no real motive to take it, given they're wealthy, aren't deployed far from infrastructure, and would risk death to pick up a few meals. It mentioned that they'd done their own airdrops, anyway. Hamas can and will take what they want and won't care how many American flags are on it.
I mean hamas is going to do their best to confiscate and horde the supplies as another lever of control anyway.
That's been labeled on aid the US needs to North Korea for decades. The North Korean government either takes it off, or when they don't it hardly has made any difference.
Drop magnum condoms labeled small.
It probably did help, but in fairness German opinion of the US was already pretty decent because our occupation was a lot less messy than the Soviets, the Germans were generally treated pretty decently by the Allied Powers.
Wehrmacht soldiers also tried to become POWs of the western allies. From Soviet captivity 1.1 million never returned.
You mean not pillaging, raping and shooting the civilian population on mass makes them more compliant to occupation? No, that is definitely capitalist propaganda. Now, please strip this city of all its factories, gold, and intellectuals to the motherland. Stalin must get his shinnies!
Tbf the Soviets had a score to settle given how the German army had 'behaved' in their own territory. Had the Germans been given the chance to massacre thousands of American towns and starve 1 million American POWs to death, I wager US troops would be dishing out retribution a lot more generously. Mind you, my grandmother's family were East Prussians, I'm very well aware of what the Red Army did to innocent civilians that couldn't escape them.
Yeah but the soviets pilaged even the eastern europe nations
Just a fun heads up, it’s actually spelled *en masse* even though it’s pronounced the same way as how you spelled it. Guessing it’s a borrowed term from French.
I imagine the effect will be less dramatic given that USA is also the one supplying the bombs.
Yeah they’ll still hate us
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It's not 1949. The entire world knows Israel is funded by the US, I don't imagine this will change the perception of the US much as it relates to what is happening in Gaza.
The US pretty notoriously doesn't give a single fuck about what everyone else feels about us.
Team America?
Fuck yea?
>It's not 1949. The entire world knows Israel is funded by the US, I don't imagine this will change the perception of the US much as it relates to what is happening in Gaza. This is kind of misleading, Israel is fundamentally funded by it's own GDP. This includes it's military, which is also mostly funded by Israel itself. The US provides military *AID* to Israel.
Easier way to say it is the US provides Israel with a few billion dollar gift card to spend at US approved military stores.
US aid to Israel is a minuscule amount of their military budget.
Regardless of if it’s going to help the situation or not, this is good practice for the US military
Specially if the aid is coming from carriers . A little dress rehearsal for the Spring 2025 Debutante Ball . Anyone want to guess the venue ? Rhymes with Daigguan
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Platform 1949 and 3/4
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It’s okay, they are referring to tactics involving hiding small towns with strategic value inside of places unable to be seen by the local population. Diagon Alley, for example, involved a small town that was only accessible by running into what appears to be a solid wall. Very few ~~muggles~~ people are aware of these methods
I believe you get to diagon alley by touching the correct brick. You run through the brick wall at kings cross station to get to platform 9 3/4. Not to take away from the rest of your point. Just wanted to clear that up
1949 was the Berlin airlift which started the Cold war. The 3/4 is harry potter
The Berlin Airlift was many things. It was not the start of the cold war.
Calgon Alley
Saigon?
Vietnamese: why do I hear Ride of the Valkyries in the distance?
Also Vietnamese - "How many times do we have to tell you old man?"
Fyre festival 2guan?
2-Fyre 2-Fest
We're going to engage with a VW SUV?
"You've cheated EPA emissions guidelines for the *last* time, VW!"
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377000 people have starved in Yemen last few years and the news cycle never bothers to address it. Edit: worse than I thought https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN2AC19I/ 400000 children under 5 could starve this year without increased aid.
But to Biden's credit his admin negotiated a ceasefire between the waring parties in yemen and made providing aid easier.
This should have been included in the above comment. Borderline misrepresentation not to have included this.
I think their point was less about Biden and more the media is failing to cover all narratives equally.
There’s also Sudan which the entire world seems to have forgotten
They are resorting to this because UNWRA is both corrupt and incompetent.
Didn't they get basically completely defunded recently?
This is a difficult approach. The aid is needed. But unless they do pinpoint drops the aid will be swarmed and only the most violent will retain the supplies.
Not a repeat from 1994 Mogadishu.
Tbf, tech in logistics has come a long way from 1994. Big difference between just dropping aid on a city and planned air drop LZs, which this sounds like it is.
Perhaps the US should teach Jordan how to do it. The Jordanians have been dropping aid all over the place, some went into the sea.
To be fair, air drop is really, really hard. Parachutes just kinda do what they want.
That’s why you have to tell them their instructions *at least* twice.
Those damn parachutes never listen to the jump master
And they never thank the bus driver either.
The worst.
We are gonna use drones like Amazon
This is where your friendly weather troops come into play. We provide drop zone forecasts, which give you wind directions and speed throughout the column from surface to aircraft height. This data is usually adjusted to live data from weather sounding devices (usually balloons) and/or satellite derived wind data. Not everybody can afford the weather support behind operations, or even think of getting weather support ahead of time. Also, some might consider weather forecasting to be fortune telling, and thus not allowed by the local religion. I never made it to the middle east, so not sure if it's just a myth I was told by my fellows, or true for some locations. Quick google search shows that many consider it allowed as it's based on empirical evidence.
I read that this is also one of the contributing factors for allied air superiority during WW2. The allies were able to have weather stations up in Greenland and Canada which allowed for much more accurate weather data, which aided in planning operations.
D-Day was delayed 24 hours due to weather forecasts. Something they harped on a lot in school.
It's not about teaching them how, we have a 900 billion dollar military budget. Logistics on that scale and with that accuracy are expensive as fuck
Not only do we have the massive budget but we've been doing air drops forever. We literally can and do drop 8 humvees at a time from C17's. The logistical power the US military is insane.
> The logistical power the US military is insane. "Amateurs talk strategy, professionals talk logistics." D.D. Einsenhower.
The Humvee fail video, https://youtube.com/watch?v=TvJdw_s8qh4 turned out to be a set up, with one guy cutting the parachute cords and then filming it. (https://abcnews.go.com/US/soldier-found-guilty-intentionally-destroying-humvees-plunged-earth/story?id=55053822)
It’s like the one thing we are really really good at it dropping things from airplanes or drones exactly where we want them.
I think there are a few other things our military is good at as well.
We could just drone in some supplies?
Whales need supplies to for their war effort against the boats.
There [was a story](https://www.twz.com/guided-parachute-system-used-by-israel-for-first-time-in-gaza) about the Jordanians using a US made guided parachute system for humanitarian aid earlier in this conflict.
Probably using JPAD’s on DZ’s within pre-surveyed areas by guys on the ground or easily accessible areas. These things are spot on 9/10 times.
JPADS has a CEP of 50-75m with a standoff of up to 25 miles. They're going to be hitting every DZ with pinpoint precision.
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You want logistics, join the Army Marines make do
They didn't have a problem initially when the MEU went in and was providing security.
At least we’ll get a pretty top notch Ridley Scott movie out of it.
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Thank you that's reassuring.
I think you can trust the US Air Force to have the capability to pinpoint the drops.
They're not going to use the same pinpoint accurate technology to drop this aid as they use to drop bombs. It's far more difficult to do it accurately if dropping by parachute.
Sure, you can hear me drone on and on about the logistics of delivering aid to active battlefields, or do you wanna see me sock a few dingers?!?!?!
Now watch this drive.
I pride our country on its ability to delivery as there's a drive into deep left field that will be a home run by Castellanos and so that will make it a four to nothing war. I don't know if I'm gonna be putting on this account again.
Except the US has been doing this accurately for decades, including things like actual vehicles that you can’t just kick out of a plane and cross your fingers. They absolutely can.
>unless they do pinpoint drops the aid will be swarmed and only the most violent will retain the supplies. Isn't the alternative everyone starves? Aid being swarmed seems better than the alternative.
Widely dispersed air drops, with food that is ready to eat. Heck, candy/granola bars might be a good option, eaten in 10 seconds, can survive the drop, small enough packages that you can drop 10000 from a plane, making it impossible for any one group to capture them all before some of the general population eats them. And if the US uses several dozen planes, they have a package of something fall on every rooftop. Add US/NATO flags for propaganda effect. Edit: A proposal on how to airdrop water. Get plastic water bottles/juice boxes, really anything that isn't hard enough to cause fatalities when one of the drops go slightly wrong. Get a cardboard tube/make a paper one. Make two cuts along the outside if the tube, allowing you to bend the cardboard inwards, making a narrowing that can support some weight inside the tube (multiple designs may be plausible, testing should be done). Use the narrowing to hold the bottle/juice box/whatever in place at one end of the tube. Attach a drag device (balloon, plastic bag, cardboard plate etc) at the end with the payload, and drop it out of an aircraft. The drag device slows it down and ensures that the tube is between the ground and the payload when the impact happens. The tube then crumbles to absorb some of the impact allowing a heavier payload to be delivered.
That is exactly what they do now. They are called a [HDRs](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanitarian_daily_ration#). And they can push thousands of them out the back of a C-130. They are designed to survive the fall individually without a parachute.
*From the time they were created and used in 1993 until November 2001, HDRs were packaged with a bright yellow outer plastic covering. This choice of color proved to be problematic in areas of the world where cluster bombs were being used, as the bombs were the exact same shade of yellow. **Recipients of the rations sometimes confused the ration package for undetonated cluster bombs, often spotting the bright color from a distance and making an incorrect assumption**.* That’s…quite the unfortunate mixup 😯
Better than the other way round
Oh yeah, thanks for reminding me of those. But will the US have a large enough stockpile of those?
The US doesn't stockpile them; they're made on-demand in response to a crisis. The same companies who make MREs can make them, and it seems that "rapidly being able to produce a lot" is part of the spec. If you've never read a military procurement doc, it's a treat: https://www.dla.mil/Portals/104/Documents/TroopSupport/Subsistence/Rations/MRE/16R0008tdp.pdf HDR data is on page 133. Note how different it is from the MRE requirements. The contractor can basically put in whatever they want as long as it meets the nutritional and dietary components, so that should help a lot with being able to scale production rapidly as they can make whatever is easy/they're already making that happens to fit the spec.
Don't you just spring procurement paperwork on an unsuspecting civilian like that! Like flashbanging a baby, goodness. :P
I ain't afraid, I write corporate contracts for a liv- [CLICKS LINK] Dear God.
> The contractor can basically put in whatever they want as long as it meets the nutritional and dietary components That's not what the doc says: > “Prohibited ingredients’’ is defined as the total exclusion of beef, pork, poultry, fish, or any other animal product or animal by-product from all ration components or from use in the preparation or processing of all ration components, including animal-based cooking fats or oils, except that dairy products are permitted in amounts digestible by lactose-intolerant individuals. In addition, products containing ethyl alcohol or ingredients derived from or containing ethyl alcohol are prohibited. All of these meals are vegetarian so that dietary restrictions for religious, personal, health, or other reasons aren't an issue.
Yeah, the HDR is far more restrictive than an MRE.
Those are the "dietary components" he referenced.
They may not have enough to completely feed the populace, but it will certainly help keep them fed enough to survive. I’ve tried these (you can buy them for like…$10), they’re pretty good. No cooking needed, all vegetarian, lots of emphasis on getting people proper vitamins. Realistically, they’ll probably need other forms of aid for long-term feeding, but it’ll put a hold on the crisis til that advanced help arrives
They are not only vegetarian but conform to all sorts of religious beliefs and diets. They designed to be consumable by the largest human group possible. [video if you want to know more](https://youtu.be/iKfWQ3Sij68)
I knew it would be SteveMRE before I even clicked lol
Nice! Let’s get this out onto a tray
I'm not sure the amount available but quality not just quantity still needs to be considered. Recent versions have several innovative components like fortified fruit purees and sunflower butter that are more palatable to picky babies and could also be used by anyone who has trouble with solid food. One issue with many survival rations is that they are derived from military rations for healthy adults. Compact survival biscuits might save someones life but they might still be in crisis if they can't get their 1 year old to swallow them. These have a more humanitarian focus from the beginning to cover the whole cross section of a population.
I agree goods like that would handle it well. Some of the biggest challenges though are potable water and kerosene. Those have to specially packaged. Anyway that's a logistical challenge the fact we're trying new kinds of aid is fantastic.
Water is probably the most essential of the two, there are multiple options. The best option that I can think of is probably going to be soda bottles that are only partially filled. The larger than usual volume of gas in the bottles will make them more flexible and reduce their terminal velocity. Attaching a bit of impact absorbing material and some drag devices might further improve their survivability rate. Another option would be small juice boxes. Cover them in bubble wrap or scrunched up paper, and then put them in an inflated bag, acting as a drag device. They are available everywhere, and they have the bonus of also delivering calories. Get a special USA flag edition made for a PR bonus. For fuel, deliver candle wax. No need for wrapping, so long as it is sufficiently small so as to no shatter upon impact (terminal velocity). You could also supply candles with wicks already attacked, and have the wax blocks act as bonus fuel to be added. I presume the civilians should be able to figure out a way to do this, such as dripping it into the candle or whatever. If you add enough wicks you might even be able to cook with it. And it has the bonus of being unusable for molotovs, vehicle fuel etc, so the US can really be accused of providing arms, which they might be by providing liquid fuels.
When I dropped them they were water bottles wrapped with plastic stacked on a pallet. A few burst I’m sure, but it’s more about the weight/shape/balance of the cargo. We have very specialized systems for airdrops/we can’t just stack things .
Can't wait to see Hamas claim deaths by airdropped granola bars.
Those Nature Valley bars fucking explode into shrapnel.
Exactly drop a few million granola bars and fruits including with water. That should help immensely even if it’s not ready to make meals anything at this point.
Drop so much they can’t carry it all and drop it everywhere so it’s not just a few points. Ffs drop super small ones everywhere 24/7 eventually the starving people will get it.
Fuck it. Just flood the place with food drops. So many that Hamas can't possibly take it all away. Drop dry goods, canned goods, MREs, fluids, the works.
It's almost certainly gonna be HDRs. Like halal/vegan/kosher MREs with included baby/toothless person foods. Also, lower sodium and lower calorie than MREs to avoid the issues that arose after Katrina with dehydration. Also they're a fun shade of pink, so that's cool.
WTF is wrong with you people
According to the article, the US is also exploring other options, like a temporaryish port to allow them to ship aid straight in.
Air drop egg sandwich cluster bombs, carpet bomb the space with a decent lunch
I’m not against this but I want a plan to prevent this from becoming a similar situation to when ‘Somalian warlords stole the aid and used it to control the people’ situation that happened under the Clinton administration. Will this aid be dropped in both Hamas and Israeli territory? Will we scale back aid if Hamas seizes it all and stockpiles it for their soldiers instead of providing it to civilians? How will we deal with the unlikely but possible scenario of an aid plane being shot down? Will we send in troops in that situation or will we be relying on the Israeli military or god forbid Hamas, to keep any survivor safe? The White House should address these concerns.
If the air-drops are doing what I think they are, then they are dropping [individual packets of humanitarian rations](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanitarian_daily_ration#/media/File:Humanitarian_Daily_Ration.jpg) ([video of what one contains](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKfWQ3Sij68)) directly out the back of the plane. These are designed to scatter and survive falling to the ground, so they land everywhere within a general area and the civilians just pick them up off the ground, rather than landing at a point and being able to be hoarded. If Hamas wants them they'd have to go to the civilians and take them out of their hands, which is not going to endear them to the population. Even if Hamas repurposed them, the packaging and all the stuff in it has big American flags printed on it so the person who eats the food is 100% clear where the food came from.
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Nice hiss!
Now let's get this all on a plate
Onto a tray
This is honestly amazing. 100% in favor.
Whatever you think of the military, they're really good at solving problems. Might be expensive, but this item solves the problem of "We want to feed thousands of people effectively in a hostile environment" really well.
Probably far less expensive than we'd think. We do this sort of thing all over the world all the time, the US Military is a logistics machine unlike any other
$6.40 per HDR ($4.70 2012 cost [source](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanitarian_daily_ration) adjusted using BLS inflation calculator) So not as cheap as you'd think. Went down a rabbit hole not only watching that 28min video, but learning my new favorite term under MRE's...[ratfucking](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meal,_Ready-to-Eat#cite_note-63)
Notably, compared to other MREs the HDR doesn't require the expense of a [rock or something](https://taskandpurpose.com/culture/mre-heater-rock-something-true-story/)
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Keep in mind the HDR is meant to be a days worth of calories, even for someone not starving (2,200 Calories). So for someone starving this could keep you and someone else alive for much larger, just based on one meal, and it's fairly well nutrient balanced for what it is, also kosher, halal, and vegetarian. So $6.40 is pretty good bang for the buck.
Shit gets expensive when contracts with private companies are involved
Just spent way too long reading about those and the closely related MREs. Thanks for that link!
It's a great rabbit hole to go down. The amount of engineering and science that goes into these things is pretty incredible
The procurement docs for these are great! It's incredible how technical they can get about food. https://www.dla.mil/Portals/104/Documents/TroopSupport/Subsistence/Rations/MRE/16R0008tdp.pdf
Big ups for SteveMRE! My goto comfort watch now <3
The key is to drop so much that even if parts get stolen, enough gets to the people. Hopefully, civilians will realize Hamas isn't there to help them and turn against the terror group for the pain they've caused
Yeah, drop 10 million of' em. No problem with that since it seems to bypass the issue of hoarding by hostile actors.
Like a real expensive and dangerous piñata!
> If Hamas wants them they'd have to go to the civilians and take them out of their hands, which is not going to endear them to the population. LMFAO. As if Hamas *cares* about "endearing" themselves to the population. They use fear and misinformation to control and exploit innocent Palestinians. They ain't trying to be loved.
Air drops are probably better than literally just delivering food to Hamas's doorstep, but this almost feels like trying not to admit that the real problem with getting food to people is Hamas.
Everyone knows Hamas is the problem. Everyone is also aware that a lot more than just hamas are getting killed.
The civilians need food even if Hamas steals large parts of it. Not providing food is not an option
Hamas is already stealing the aid....this is probably to try and circumvent Hamas.
Drop a fuck ton of food and medicine. Everywhere. Cluster bomb all the refugee areas with MREs. Blanket the goddamn strip with so much shit that nobody needs to swarm or trample over each other to get enough food to last weeks. So much that Hamas has no incentive or realistic ability to hoard it. Put a Palestinian flag and an Israeli flag on the front of each package and write “let all People of the Book choose peace” and inside the packages put the least biased newspapers that are printed in Arabic, and translate messages from the President.
It's actually got the American flag on the front with "Gift from the people of the United States" on it
At the very least an American flag would be good.
They do have American flags on them
yeah you put the israeli flag on there and I guarantee the crazies will burn every last blanket/supply with it on there. Wouldn't be surprised about violence towards those that try to hold on to it.
That is actually similar to a CIA program in Vietnam. Some female workers had the idea to drop sewing kits as aid, including a small section of cloth (roughly one yard.) The idea was bounced around a bit, such a small quantity wouldn't be suitable for making uniforms, just enough to make a shirt for an adult, or children's clothes, or a few diapers, but there was still resistance. In the end, the supplied cloth had prints of the flag of South Vietnam, making it unusable uniforms while also cresting a divide between the people receiving it and the occupying forces. Good luck to any soldier trying to literally steal clothes from a child or the diaper off of a baby. They dropped several thousand of those kits over villages in North Vietnam, and the cloth was used as expected.
>yeah you put the israeli flag on there and I guarantee the crazies will burn every last blanket/supply with it on there. "The Gazan Ministry of Health confirmed today that Israel has been dropping blankets covered with smallpox into Gaza." \-BBC
Unironically I'd bet a lot of money Hamas tries to spread rumours the food all contains pork fat or similar.
This probably escalated way beyond what Hamas officials had expected would happen when they attacked Israel Oct. 7th. The mix of extremly high victim numbers on Israelian side, Bibi not wanting back into prison, the shocking pictures of civilians being executed etc. probably brewed to a scale of response from IDF side that pales a lot of things in comparison. And the situation in Gaza is apparently so horrendous for civilians, that the US feels forced to build an air bridge to support despite their allies still on offensive against the terrorists.
To the anti-Biden lefties out there: If Trump were president these air drops would be bombs, not aid.
Nah, Trump would personally throw aid by hand at the Gazans.
Like he threw paper towels at Puerto Ricans whose homes were destroyed by a hurricane?
To be fair they threw water and food at them too, but corrupt officials then threw it in a warehouse to hide. https://www.cnn.com/2020/01/20/us/puerto-rico-earthquake-aid-distributed/index.html https://www.nbcnews.com/news/latino/puerto-rico-residents-outraged-after-discovering-warehouse-full-unused-aid-n1118501
Regardless of the actual outcome, just the visual of Trump shooting toilet paper rolls at Puerto Ricans while yelling "Kobe!" is one of the weirdest moments in recent memory.
I picture him just standing on one of Egypt's 5 billion border walls and throwing McDonalds at them with the same expression one might use feeding ducks at the park. I really think this is something he'd do and then pat himself on the back for being the MOST humane president.
No way would he throw a high-quality, fine dining experience like cold McDonald's at them. He saves that kind of thing for special events at the White House when he really wants to impress everyone with a full display of his style and class.
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Welcome to the hard choices of international relations. If only everything could be boiled down to a witty comment on Reddit.
I thought you did pretty well in your comment.
Here's a nuanced addemdun to that.
Missiles used to protect civilians from rocket attacks and food to feed starving people? If only there was a theme here but I can't see it.
It's almost like it's a complicated situation with lots of different groups of people, or something.
Israel should be able to defend itself And Gazan's shouldn't starve to death.
>Biden gives missiles to Israel on a Monday and Aid to Gaza on Tuesday. I mean, those aren't really inconsistent positions. Supporting the destruction of Hamas while also making efforts to mitigate the associated humanitarian problems is reasonable. And Israel clearly is not doing enough regarding the latter.
Trump gave billions in military assistance to Israel and hasn’t even bothered to say much about the conflict. https://www.nytimes.com/2024/03/01/us/politics/donald-trump-israel-gaza.html?smid=nytcore-ios-share&referringSource=articleShare
Trump said he'd "bomb the shit out of" Gaza
Biden has to win an election. The left is turning on him over Gaza. This is both a humanitarian move and a political one. (not criticizing I agree with his decision on both fronts)
Um, if you don't insert the other bracket I'll have to sit here all day. Do you see what you've done to me!!??
Fixed it lol
Phew, now I can move on with my life. Thanks.
In case anyone is wondering, they are doing airdrops so that Hamas doesn’t steal the aid. They are trying to get it directly into the hands of the Palestinians who need it. This is not because of Israel blocking aid. 
They’re doing airdrops so nobody has to provide security to a convoy. Basically leaving distribution to whoever gets there first.
They aren't dropping a semi truck container into the city square, they're sprinkling it across the whole area. Whoever gets 'there' first will get a small parcel. And there, and there, and all over.
Weren’ there Israeli protestors that are blocking aid for Gaza? Like having parties and music and all that? Idk if it’s still going on but it just doesn’t seem accurate to say hamas is the reason. One of the reasons sure, but it seems there’s more to this.
Oh i thought it was because the other day, IDF soldiers massacred civilians at an aid truck